# Setting Toilet with Putty



## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Pulled this toilet and it was set with putty, not a wax ring. Probably original to the home (built in early 70's). The toilet was solid and not rocking, and the flange is still in good working order. Even though almost all the putty is gone, and it is rock hard, I wonder if a wax would still be there after 40 years. I use wax, and only wax, anyone use putty?


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

To me thats way too much time and material to set it like that.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

In Chicago thats all we used..


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Putty works. Wax works better.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Putty all the way.


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## HOMER (Jun 5, 2011)

how much putty would you guesstimate to set a builder's grade toilet correctly ?


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## saysflushable (Jun 15, 2009)

I think it is a shame we still set toilets with wax or putty or foam or whatever it is out dated and shows how backeards our industry is.

If I invented a new plumbing fixture and told you plumbers we will connect it to our pipes by a flange 2 bolts and best yet a wax gasket you guys would laugh me out of the industry.

It is crap and needs to be updated. to much property damage is done by this garbage way of connecting a fixture to pipes.

I forgot, it is all the other plumbers who don't know how to set a toilet.


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## 130 PLUMBER (Oct 22, 2009)

thats the way i do it!!!!


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

saysflushable said:


> I think it is a shame we still set toilets with wax or putty or foam or whatever it is out dated and shows how backeards our industry is.
> 
> If I invented a new plumbing fixture and told you plumbers we will connect it to our pipes by a flange 2 bolts and best yet a wax gasket you guys would laugh me out of the industry.
> 
> ...


 Not all progress is good...give me a thermocouple and not a circuit board, and when the new toilet installation design is ready it will get value engineered by those who dont care about property damage...they will have already divested the companies who supply the raw materials from the manufacturer from the distributor and the warranty will be worth zip...and the plumber's insurance can pick up the tab...no thanks....its not the flange..its the floor....


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

saysflushable said:


> I think it is a shame we still set toilets with wax or putty or foam or whatever it is out dated and shows how backeards our industry is.
> 
> If I invented a new plumbing fixture and told you plumbers we will connect it to our pipes by a flange 2 bolts and best yet a wax gasket you guys would laugh me out of the industry.
> 
> ...


 
Taken from Bill Parr's blog...











http://parrsplumbing.blogspot.com/2008/11/plumbing-antiques.html


I doubt were headed back this direction any time soon. 









Paul


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

rocksteady said:


> Taken from Bill Parr's blog...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 I sincerely hope not.

One more huff of lead and I'll likely kill the last few primeval brain cells reflexively telling my lungs to draw the next breath.


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I have used putty when I discovered my truck was out of the 4" wax rings needed to set a toilet on a cast iron collar.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

saysflushable said:


> I think it is a shame we still set toilets with wax or putty or foam or whatever it is out dated and shows how backeards our industry is.
> 
> If I invented a new plumbing fixture and told you plumbers we will connect it to our pipes by a flange 2 bolts and best yet a wax gasket you guys would laugh me out of the industry.
> 
> ...


Actually they have a new seal that's a rubber ring like a wax one but has a stub that fits in the pipe that has fin like ribs around it .... I've never used one tho If it ain't broke don't fix it


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Here it is..... any body use these ????


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Here it is..... any body use these ????


Bought one once, carried it around for a while and looked at it, but could never bring myself to actually use it. It's a nice idea, but IMHO toilet bottoms aren't always perfect enough for that sticky side to seal to, plus centering could be a problem. Toilets are mostly very poorly made. I never trusted the thing and finally threw it away. Until they invent a really good new way, the old ways are the best ways.

I know it still uses a wax seal, but I really like the way Toto's higher end crappers set, with that odd plastic thing you set first and then just drop the toilet into. Refine something like that and I think you might really have something. Toilet can wobble all it wants and the seal is still good (NOTE: My toilets DO NOT wobble. But I repair lots of other "plumbers'" wobbly WC's).


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## PrecisePlumbing (Jan 31, 2011)

We only ONLY use rubber gaskets to set toilets. Things like wax rings and putty would be laughed out of the room here. Not approved and I can't see how it is a better idea than a rubber pan collar.


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## 100 Watt (Aug 11, 2011)

My buddy at the supply house gave me a few of the rubber seals a few years back. We used them and had no issues. I think they're really only only good for new installs. The toilet needs to be clean to allow the seal to stick to it. We didn't use them on anything getting a final air test though. Not sure how they'd do with that. Heck, we don't use the Kan't Leak seals with the horn because of them not holding their final air tests.

Around here all commercial work gets final air test but residential depends on the area you're in.


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

100 Watt said:


> ... Heck, we don't use the Kan't Leak seals with the horn because of them not holding their final air tests.
> 
> Around here all commercial work gets final air test but residential depends on the area you're in.


Wow!  Tough inspectors! Sounds like stories I heard about Saskatchewan - or was it Manitoba? - being ultra tough on final inspections. A final air test here would be DIFFICULT. All that roof climbing... So many roofs these days are WAY too steep for plumbers. 

I climbed up on one the other day and laid there on my belly for 30 seconds or so, decided, "Nope. Not going up there. Me afraid!", and climbed back down. I made the owner, a framer, climb up and cap the pipe, and he was none too comfortable. His shoes were slipping downhill on the shingles on this stupid-steep roof as he squatted to tighten the cap on my vent.

EDIT: Just now noticed the word "commercial" in that sentence. It wouldn't be so tough on most flat commercial roofs. But still a real PITA.


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

futz said:


> Wow!  Tough inspectors! Sounds like stories I heard about Saskatchewan - or was it Manitoba? - being ultra tough on final inspections. A final air test here would be DIFFICULT. All that roof climbing... So many roofs these days are WAY too steep for plumbers.
> 
> I climbed up on one the other day and laid there on my belly for 30 seconds or so, decided, "Nope. Not going up there. Me afraid!", and climbed back down. I made the owner, a framer, climb up and cap the pipe, and he was none too comfortable. His shoes were slipping downhill on the shingles on this stupid-steep roof as he squatted to tighten the cap on my vent.


 That would be right about the time I glued a test cap into the vent before it exited the attic and dry-fit a coupling on the last few feet or so to be glued after the final sign off.

I don't get up on roofs for nobody, and neither do my guys.


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## ap plumbing (Nov 9, 2010)

When you install your toilets do you put wax ring on toilet? or on the flange when you set toilet? just wondering


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

ap plumbing said:


> When you install your toilets do you put wax ring on toilet? or on the flange when you set toilet? just wondering


Always on the toilet. Otherwise if you slip or accidentally don't set the toilet exactly centered the toilet horn could cut (squish) grooves in the seal and cause a leak. It works better for me anyway.


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## plumber666 (Sep 19, 2010)

Always on the flange. Just because I've always done it that way. Musta been shown that when I was a suck up apprentice.


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

Always on the flange.










Paul


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Flange


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Flange unless it a wall hung


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

A simple solution would be if toilet horns extended down a couple inches instead of being flush with the base. This would eliminate 99% of toilet leaks at the base. 

Wait nevermind bad idea.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Wax on flange.


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

On da flange


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## cityplumbing (Jun 12, 2010)

I put my wax on the flange...


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Bottom of my shoe.


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## Miguel (Aug 10, 2009)

Almost always on the flange. It helps hold the bolts where you want and makes centering easy. I absolutly hate kant-leaks (extra thick wax w/ the plastic horn). OK in a pinch but I'd rather use a flange extension ring and a regular wax ring. Not so much wax squishes down the hole when you can control the anular difference.

Haven't pulled many WC's lately that were set with putty. Ran across it alot until the mid '80's; most were very sound, some were awful with rotting floorboards, etc. But I see that nowadays with poorly set WC's on wax. meh. Wax is fine and it's cheap. You can even call it "eco-friendly because they'e made by bees. :laughing:


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

A lot of times when using a flange spacer/extension we use putty between the flange and the spacer.

Wax on the flange.


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## Ansel (Sep 14, 2008)

Flange.


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## suzie (Sep 1, 2010)

Da Flange, have used the fluidmaster with double seal and o ring never a problem and now other brands like sioux chief more available and better price points, but i have never used putty.


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

plumber666 said:


> Always on the flange. Just because I've always done it that way. Musta been shown that when I was a suck up apprentice.





cityplumbing said:


> I put my wax on the flange...





suzie said:


> Da Flange, have used the fluidmaster with double seal and o ring never a problem and now other brands like sioux chief more available and better price points, but i have never used putty.


Flange, flange, flange, flange, flange... Bah! You're all doing it wrong! :laughing:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

futz said:


> Flange, flange, flange, flange, flange... Bah! You're all doing it wrong! :laughing:


Real Men throw away the instructions... :laughing:


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## Plumb Bob (Mar 9, 2011)

I found a tub waste sealed with bowl wax, oh wait maybe I should say "not sealed"...


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

I set all toilets in putty unless they are wall outlet.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

I just set toilets without any sealant.. No putty, caulk or grout....:laughing:






Seriously, I grout them. If it's a commercial W/C, I'll use more grout than a residential W/C.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I learned on putty in Chicago....many leaks in multi story blgs due to wax rings...you can make a nice mound and feel the squish...also in Wilmette, Winnetka, Highland Park, Lake Forest...a lot of toilets 35 years without needing a reset.....I concede wax is a superior substance but do putty right and you wont have a problem


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## Miguel (Aug 10, 2009)

I still like the wax. hmmm... Did I actually say I _like_ the wax? :blink:

AT any rate, the only time I'll use putty is on WC's that the HO has run his own in-floor heat and the wax just melts away. :laughing:

But I'd choose putty over the neo-foam rings. Those things are just time bombs waiting for the next poor guy to disturb. The black stains worse than the "toilet bloo".


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Just pulled a water closet that was set with putty 30 years ago. Looked good still and the putty was still pretty much soft. Put the new Mansfield water closet in with putty as well.


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## PeckPlumbing (Mar 19, 2011)

Ive pulled a lot of american standard, briggs, and kohler toilets that were in putty! They were not leaking either! 
\
Although, a lot of those old toilets had more of a flat underside, where the putty would sit well.. new toilets have a small area around the horn and thats it!


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## Plantificus (Sep 17, 2009)

I always thought they should make a toilet with 3 in pvc stub on the bottom that sets into a special flange with a push gasket


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

Plantificus said:



> I always thought they should make a toilet with 3 in pvc stub on the bottom that sets into a special flange with a push gasket


Like a tie seal gasket? If so that would be a pain in the arse..


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Set my first toilet with putty today. It had an old 5" CI flange. Too big for wax. I suppose I could have made one out of wax but decided to give putty a try. Seemed to work fine, if I get a callback you putty guys are gonna hear it! If not thanks for giving me the confidence to use it.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Some people use it for everything....just run a big bead of silicone and forget the wax or putty...


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Wax and only wax lol!!!!


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## saysflushable (Jun 15, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> Set my first toilet with putty today. It had an old 5" CI flange. Too big for wax. I suppose I could have made one out of wax but decided to give putty a try. Seemed to work fine, if I get a callback you putty guys are gonna hear it! If not thanks for giving me the confidence to use it.


 Funny I just did the same thing for the same reason for the 1st time.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

pauliplumber said:


> Set my first toilet with putty today. It had an old 5" CI flange. Too big for wax. I suppose I could have made one out of wax but decided to give putty a try. Seemed to work fine, if I get a callback you putty guys are gonna hear it! If not thanks for giving me the confidence to use it.


 As far as I know they don't make closet flanges for 5" soil pipe, at least I have never seen one and I have worked in buildings well over a hundred years old.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Killertoiletspider said:


> As far as I know they don't make closet flanges for 5" soil pipe, at least I have never seen one and I have worked in buildings well over a hundred years old.


The verticle pipe leading up to the CI flange is 4". The ID of the flange measured 5". It stayed 5" for a few inches down to the lead joint.It looked bigger than most 4" CI flanges I see. Not sure what size its actually considered.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

pauliplumber said:


> The verticle pipe leading up to the CI flange is 4". The ID of the flange measured 5". It stayed 5" for a few inches down to the lead joint.It looked bigger than most 4" CI flanges I see. Not sure what size its actually considered.


It's a 4" flange, but they taper slightly with depth, a 4" X 4" high closet flange will be slightly larger than a 4" X 2" high closet flange. A 4" X 12" closet flange really pushes the limits on the slots in the water closet, and they are a pain the the ass to yarn and pack, they're easy to pour though.


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## the drain man (Sep 8, 2011)

matter of fact the black rubber gaskets take the place of wax now and they really work


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

the drain man said:


> matter of fact the black rubber gaskets take the place of wax now and they really work


Your facts will only have weight after you post an intro


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## the drain man (Sep 8, 2011)

BROOKLYN\PLUMB said:


> Your facts will only have weight after you post an intro


 sorry i didnt do it on purpose i dont know what you mean by "intro" ive never talked on a chat room but i know my service plumbing


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## U666A (Dec 11, 2010)

the drain man said:


> sorry i didnt do it on purpose i dont know what you mean by "intro" ive never talked on a chat room but i know my service plumbing


... Or at least you think you do..

Until you run the gauntlet with some of our residents, you don't even know your own name as far as I'm concerned!

Were not asking alot here. 

1) Stop by the "introduction section" and start a new thread.

2) tell us where you're from, years experience, area(s) of discipline, licenses held, etc

3) receive a warm welcome for respecting our traditions

4) realize why you shouldn't have scoffed at all of our service gurus when prompted for a simple courtesy.

5) post to your little heart's content!!!

You too CAN BE a PZ member in good standing in just 5 easy steps!

:laughing:


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## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Here it is..... any body use these ????


Problem with those is if you ever have to run you r auger in the toilet it catches on the edge of the rubber and you can't get your auger out. It has happened to me twice.


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

the drain man said:


> matter of fact the black rubber gaskets take the place of wax now and they really work


I've used them for elongated toilets set on vinyl flooring. Case involved a family of large people. Had to go back after installing the elongated toilets, (right up against 12 month warranty period to boot). But to take a page from Richard's book, the proper thing to do was to advise the family of cause & make arepair that would assure happy customers referring other customers. Anyhow, the things do work, and rather well. :thumbup:


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

Titan Plumbing said:


> A lot of times when using a flange spacer/extension we use putty between the flange and the spacer.
> 
> Wax on the flange.


I always use silicone between the flange extenders. Just like previous post, I guess 'cause that's how I was taught. Never had a problem though. Wax always gets set on flange however. Again, it holds closet bolts steady(unless ya use extra nuts & washers to hold bolts to flange).


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## PeckPlumbing (Mar 19, 2011)

Can you buy putty by the 5 gallon bucket?


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