# Gas problems



## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Ok went to a job with a tankless (Noritz) with a 11 code checked gas pressure at unit was at 7.6 IWC at static test 
with unit on it drops to 1.25 IWC in about 45 seconds







































Line is 2" from meter aprox. 70' to units house is 1 year old no problems till now
Even tested it at the meter with same results 
Figured its city gas related. They came out today and I have to go back but don't know where to start looking now.. City said not their problem...


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

How many CFH's is your meter rated to?


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Also calculated supply is 1064k btu's demand is 737k for whole house 400k for both heaters alone.


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Plumbus said:


> How many CFH's is your meter rated to?


I will let you know in about 20 min.. On my way!


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Old meter was 300 CFH

But gas comp swapped out meter and regulator 
New is 1/4" ori. On regulator and meter is 425 CFH


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

Looks like 1 1/2" black pipe.. So it's running from meter to only the tankless? Or is it the trunk line for the rest of the fixtures? If its 1 1/2" it's can carry 552 CFH at 70'.


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

I think with that demand they need to upgrade to 2 psi. 

That meter is still undersized.


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

Make sure the furnaces and your tankless units are running while your checking your gas pressure.

I'd also get rid of those flex lines.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

antiCon said:


> Ok went to a job with a tankless (Noritz) with a 11 code checked gas pressure at unit was at 7.6 IWC at static test
> with unit on it drops to 1.25 IWC in about 45 seconds
> 
> View attachment 24052
> ...


Your saying the pressure drops at the meter also?


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Well that didn't go well lol

HO said he's gonna go back to the builders.. 
Found out some more history on the house 
On final a year or so ago inspector said gas line was under sized was 1" to attic so it was ripped out and 2" was put in and plumber was pissed he had to do free work I'm thinking a rag or object may be in line as even the stove alone causes pressure to drop below 4 IWC
Anyways.. Owner don't want to pay a dime more till he talks to contractor


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

If the problems just started it is more than likely the spring in the regulator.


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

justme said:


> Your saying the pressure drops at the meter also?


Yes with the old 300 CFH meter.. As u can see last photo 
The new meter 425 CFH I did not test but still acting the same at stove


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

justme said:


> If the problems just started it is more than likely the spring in the regulator.


New regulator and meter 
Problem still exist..


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

425cfh = 425,000 btu's . Your saying the whole house demand is over 700,000 btu's ?


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Yes over 700k total which I see is a problem but even with the stove top only... running at 80k btu it still drops


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

I think you are on the right track with some kind of restriction and probably happened when the meter was swapped. Or a defective bladder in the meter.


Could also be a bad diaphragm in the regulator of the cities.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Time to get a fish tape and a large wet/vac and start sucking on the line outside while someone else is pushing the fish tape down the line from the inside


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Gettinit said:


> I think you are on the right track with some kind of restriction and probably happened when the meter was swapped. Or a defective bladder in the meter.
> 
> Could also be a bad diaphragm in the regulator of the cities.


I think it would be extremely rare for it to be the meter or regulator as the old ones did the same.. But that would be just my luck
I'm starting to think maybe the plumber that had to redo the line for free might have sabotaged the system.
I might just need that tape and shop vac 
Or pressure the line to 75 psi and get some ear plugs


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

antiCon said:


> I think it would be extremely rare for it to be the meter or regulator as the old ones did the same.. But that would be just my luck
> I'm starting to think maybe the plumber that had to redo the line for free might have sabotaged the system.
> I might just need that tape and shop vac
> Or pressure the line to 75 psi and get some ear plugs


I bet its the same regulator before the meter.


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

Gettinit said:


> I bet its the same regulator before the meter.


Nope old was 3/16th orfice new is 1/4
It was changed as well


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

antiCon said:


> Nope old was 3/16th orfice new is 1/4
> It was changed as well


That's nice and odd. Usually they just change the orifice.


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

Could be water-logged poly feed


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## PrecisionPlumb (Feb 17, 2011)

I'm having the same problem on a boiler. New meter and regulator. Worked on medium pressure but not with High pressure meter and new reg. at 10wc


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

PrecisionPlumb said:


> I'm having the same problem on a boiler. New meter and regulator. Worked on medium pressure but not with High pressure meter and new reg. at 10wc


New thread and elaborate a bit more.:thumbsup: Not trying to be rude.


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## Pipe Rat (Apr 5, 2009)

I dont think that comment necessarily warrants a new thread, might be some common clues that turns the light bulb on. Just Sayin'


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

Pipe Rat said:


> I dont think that comment necessarily warrants a new thread, might be some common clues that turns the light bulb on. Just Sayin'


Fair enough but he needs to fork out more info.


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

johnlewismcleod said:


> Could be water-logged poly feed


If its happening at the meter as well, this is most likely the cause.


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

johnlewismcleod said:


> Could be water-logged poly feed



It does sound like water in the line. I've never seen issues with a fused poly line though.


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

RW Plumbing said:


> If its happening at the meter as well, this is most likely the cause.


That would be city issue then but to try to get out there with them at the same time is insane (24 hr response time) they said not their problem.. But all tests I've done tell me it's b4 meter issue.. Or restriction in line. 
Thx for the help.. If I ever find out what the problem is ill let u know( as the HO is gonna go back to contractor that built the house)


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

Some may or may not apply to either but here goes.

There is a city here that installs valves on each side of their meter. Found one that was not fully open.

Found trash in the meter orifice.

Found a multi appliance reg on a boiler they barely met the boiler input but the Max for a single appliance for the reg was about half the total. It was starving the boiler and constantly locking the regulator up.

If the vents of the regs are plugged they will not stop increasing in pressure.

If a vent is spewing gas somewhere that would kill volume on low pressure systems. In a house, no big deal, make sure nothing will fire and check the meters leak dial.

If you get a gauge and if there is a place to put it before the meter, it may rule out the meter.

Poly line kinked, doubtful but possible. 

Oh, just because a meter says it has a particular size orifice does not make it so. 

You can disconnect the house side and install a test tee and a valve to atmosphere (if higher than 1/4# add a moderately sized reg) and start cracking it open to simulate usage while reading your manometer. This is kinda crude for 1/4# since you don't know much you can really expect to open the valve before you exceed the meters capabilities but with 2# or more the reg can be your pressure and volume control.


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## gassyplumber (May 1, 2011)

I was told by the utility up here in Ottawa that the extreme cold can cause some of the Chinese manufactured regs to malfunction. They keep busy during cold snaps swapping them out.


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

gassyplumber said:


> I was told by the utility up here in Ottawa that the extreme cold can cause some of the Chinese manufactured regs to malfunction. They keep busy during cold snaps swapping them out.


Houston, Texas:

Extreme cold: No :no:
Extreme humidity: You betcha! :laughing:


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## gassyplumber (May 1, 2011)

Sorry chums forgot where you are located my bad


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## Piper34 (Oct 10, 2011)

Keep going I want to here the end of this I say gas co prob. I doubt sabotage but you never know could definetly be debris ,let us know


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## PrecisionPlumb (Feb 17, 2011)

On ours Atmos messed up. Put wrong regulator twice


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## alberteh (Feb 26, 2012)

gassyplumber said:


> I was told by the utility up here in Ottawa that the extreme cold can cause some of the Chinese manufactured regs to malfunction. They keep busy during cold snaps swapping them out.


Here in alberta we need to size all regs at +50% size to account for extreme cold. 

Havent heard of any problems with this way of doing things.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

alberteh said:


> Here in alberta we need to size all regs at +50% size to account for extreme cold.
> 
> Havent heard of any problems with this way of doing things.


Here they want to get away with as little as possible.


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