# rusted heater element



## Bayside500

i have been working on a hotel remdoel here, kin da a tight budget job.

one of the buildings has a 120gal electric heater that i am supposed to install new elements and thermostats in, only problem is the upper element seems to have been leaking for a while and and the lower element is rusted where you put the 1 1/2" socket on.

so the only option that i can see is to drill out the lower element and wedge a cold chisel in there to put a wrench on to break it loose.

or maybe heat it with a torch first, but was afraid of causing a fire in the heater fiberglass insulation.

being as i rarely do service work, what are my best options ?

i am pretty sure they do not want to replace the heater, i brought this issue up to my shop owner and he said to try a 2' pipe wrench on it.


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## service guy

If the socket slips off, you can try a cold chisel and a hammer to get it started. I remember one time back in 1998 or so, there was a water heater that I couldn't get the element out. Boss figured I was green, so he sent a more experienced guy over there to "chisel it out". Well, in this case it wasn't budging, so we ended up replacing the entire heater. But apparently a chisel is the last resort, after you try the socket with a 2 foot wrench on it.


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## RealLivePlumber

Ya, but use a "real" socket, not one of those stamped sheet metal p.o.s. from the supply house. I use a Snap On 6 point, 1 1/2". Snap on is more expensive, but they fit way better than craftsman. I once pulled a snap on guy over on the highway.:yes: They'll sell it to ya. 

Cut some of the jacket away. remove the insulation. Heat that baby up. It will melt the rubber gasket out of the way. Then, touch a beeswax (works better than parrafin) candle to the threads. It will suck in, and help lubricate it on the way out. If you can get the element red, it will try to expand in the bung, and then shrink a little when it cools. Watch the wax doesent flare up on you. as it cools, give it a few raps with a 20 oz. hammer, the shock may loosen er up a bit. 

Repair the jacket with some galv sheet metal and rivets,( looks pro,) or zip in's.


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## Bayside500

there is nothing for a socket to grab on to, a pipe wrench may, but i doubt it LOL

guess i will try my turbo torch on the element to melt the gasket, and then the hammer trick to see if it budges.

i will report my results


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## greenscoutII

Buy a cheap impact gun and a GOOD socket. Works pretty dang well.


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## Bayside500

greenscoutII said:


> Buy a cheap impact gun and a GOOD socket. Works pretty dang well.


dang man, there is nothing for socket to grab on to


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## Bill

We had one once, could not remove it. Wound up replacing the water heater. Carried the old one back to the shop and we tried everything. Damn thing never budged.


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## greenscoutII

Bayside500 said:


> dang man, there is nothing for socket to grab on to


 
Sorry! I should have read a little more slowly, I was just in a hurry to throw in my two cents!

I'd say if you can leave it set over night, Kroil the crap out of it and try the cold chisel the next morning.

I think the people you're working for should be aware that this tank just might be a goner......

Good luck!


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## Bill

I wonder if a "Nut Cracker" would work?

For those who think I am trying to be funny, here is a picture:


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## Protech

Drill out center of element. Insert sazall blade into hole. Cut down through the male threads but stop before you damage the female threads. Lift blade out of the cut and rotate 22 degrease then cut again. Chisel that slice out of the pizzapie with a throw away flathead screw driver.

Remove the rest by tapping and turning.


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## rocksteady

I'd slather it with PB Blaster while the heater was draining and you're swapping the top element. I've had luck removing buggered elements with my basin wrench and a big crescent wrench. If that fails, go directly to Protec's suggestion. 

I've found wasting time with creative attempts on problems like this just end up costing you time and you still end up doing it the "hard" way that's really not that hard. Of course, a new w/h is a last resort.







Paul


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## Nevada Plumber

I've had to do that a few times on Reliance water heaters made by State. No other brand of water heater has ever required more then a socket on the end of my 2 foot ratchet to get the element out.



Protech said:


> Drill out center of element. Insert sazall blade into hole. Cut down through the male threads but stop before you damage the female threads. Lift blade out of the cut and rotate 22 degrease then cut again. Chisel that slice out of the pizzapie with a throw away flathead screw driver.
> 
> Remove the rest by tapping and turning.


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## Bayside500

update, well i got the old rusty element out, at first i tried drilling a 1/2" hole in it and hammered a cold chisel in to it, put a wrench on the chisel and tried to turn it out, no such luck.

so i took the chisel and had just enough of an edge on the element to hammer slightly and the element came out fine.

so i sucked out what sediment i could and reinstalled new elements, started filling the heater up with water.

as i was filling the heater, all seemed good, i had the new top thermostat installed, and was sitting on a bucket working on the new lower thermostat, had my reading glasses on so i could see well, and next thing i know is i hear a loud pop and a splash, seems as though there was just too much rust on the old heater tank and it decided to blow a 1/2" hole about 4" up from lower element, soaking my leg and my tool tray that was near by.

scared the hell out of me but i sure had a good laugh, just wish i had video of my reaction LOL

so they are buying a new 120 gallon heater after all.

thanks everyone for the advice.

pic and small video from my flip phone.............. 


http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg203/tommy2fingers/Hotel WH 2011/0114111341-1.jpg


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## Plumbdog

nobody can say you didn't try:thumbsup:


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## Redwood

Sometimes it's just not worth it to try...

Maybe they shoulda just ben told right off the bat... "Are You Effin Nutz?" :laughing:

Really if its not coming out with a good quality 6-point socket I'm not interested in playing....


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## 3KP

*Bradford White*

I was removing a lower element once out of a 8 year old heater with my 1 1/2 socket and breaker bar. I got the element out plus the female weld threads. The weld broke  never seen it happen before. Ever since I always let the customer know things could go bad and might have to buy a new heater. :yes:


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## Epox

Protech said:


> Drill out center of element. Insert sazall blade into hole. Cut down through the male threads but stop before you damage the female threads. Lift blade out of the cut and rotate 22 degrease then cut again. Chisel that slice out of the pizzapie with a throw away flathead screw driver.
> 
> Remove the rest by tapping and turning.


What he said


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## Epox

Problem with all the tapping and banging is you might eventually get the element out but you can be assured on a WH you have damaged the glass lining and it will end up leaking before you can barley get the truck back to shop and locked up. Seriously you may buy 6 months but it's trashed.


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## Redwood

mpsllc said:


> Problem with all the tapping and banging is you might eventually get the element out but you can be assured on a WH you have damaged the glass lining and it will end up leaking before you can barley get the truck back to shop and locked up. Seriously you may buy 6 months but it's trashed.


Zackly! Why put your name on it?:whistling2:

This is a case of you letting a customer tell you how to do your job.:yes:

Despite the fact that it goes against your knowledge and better judgement.


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## plbgbiz

Bayside500 said:


> i have been working on a hotel remdoel here, kin da a tight budget job....


Of course this is all easy for us from a keyboard but....WOW! It seems that heater was pretty rough before you ever started. I have let customers back me into "Can't you at least try?" corner before. It NEVER works, it always costs them more money, I feel I lose credibility, and I regret it.

I think you got lucky on this one. After seeing the photo, I hope you had a disclaimer on the repair. Even if that hole hadn't popped immediately, I doubt that tank could have withstood the hammering.

It's cool the leak was above or they might have tried to blame you.


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## Richard Hilliard

mpsllc said:


> Problem with all the tapping and banging is you might eventually get the element out but you can be assured on a WH you have damaged the glass lining and it will end up leaking before you can barley get the truck back to shop and locked up. Seriously you may buy 6 months but it's trashed.


 
This is the most logical and best advice here in this thread. I just saw this thread and my first question is how old is the heater? I cannot believe yall would hammer an element. If the element is rusted so are the three threads that hold the element and that element can blow out.


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## stillaround

I spent the time once on a Kenmore or Sears heater and got the element out only to find it was a special size. Had to put a new heater in anyway...drill and saw can be time consuming.


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## t&kplumbing

*nut cracker*



Bill said:


> I wonder if a "Nut Cracker" would work?
> 
> For those who think I am trying to be funny, here is a picture:


where do you get a nut cracker?? that would come in handy.


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## SlickRick

t&kplumbing said:


> where do you get a nut cracker?? that would come in handy.


 

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The PZ is for Plumbing Professionals ( those engaged in the plumbing profession)

Post an intro and tell our members where you are from, yrs in the trade, and your area(s) of expertise in the plumbing field.

This info helps members who are waiting to welcome you to the best plumbing site there is.

We look forward to your valuable input.


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## RealLivePlumber

mpsllc said:


> Problem with all the tapping and banging is you might eventually get the element out but you can be assured on a WH you have damaged the glass lining and it will end up leaking before you can barley get the truck back to shop and locked up. Seriously you may buy 6 months but it's trashed.


The glass lining is already damaged. 

In fact, it is damaged the day the unit is made. 

The welds on the bungs, and the threads, are not glass lined, and start to oxidize immediately. This corrosion will continue to creep under the glass lining. The glass only buys you a little more time.


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## Bayside500

Redwood said:


> Zackly! Why put your name on it?:whistling2:
> 
> This is a case of you letting a customer tell you how to do your job.:yes:
> 
> Despite the fact that it goes against your knowledge and better judgement.


i'm pretty sure the owner of my company suggested installing a new a WH, but like i said, the hotel owners are trying to keep to a tight budget, works out for us though, as we make money either way.

i just do what i am told to, i'm not the shop owner :thumbsup:


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## Epox

Bayside500 said:


> i'm pretty sure the owner of my company suggested installing a new a WH, but like i said, the hotel owners are trying to keep to a tight budget, works out for us though, as we make money either way.
> 
> i just do what i am told to, i'm not the shop owner :thumbsup:


Your shops making more money repairing that dinosaur than replacing it.
When the tank shells out replace lol.


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## After Hour plum

plbgbiz said:


> Of course this is all easy for us from a keyboard but....WOW! It seems that heater was pretty rough before you ever started. I have let customers back me into "Can't you at least try?" corner before. It NEVER works, it always costs them more money, I feel I lose credibility, and I regret it.
> 
> I think you got lucky on this one. After seeing the photo, I hope you had a disclaimer on the repair. Even if that hole hadn't popped immediately, I doubt that tank could have withstood the hammering.
> 
> It's cool the leak was above or they might have tried to blame you.


i Concur 
I often tell clients that the fixtures or old piping doesn't owe them a dime and to replace them . it has served its time n need to be replaced if not find another plumber to put their name on the job 
in my early days starting out i had a client who polish the old p'traps , angle valves & nipples i had taken off on a bathroom reno . SOB had me reinstall them of course a few leaked causing me time n headaches. the client tells me what they would like than i tell them how it will be done end of story


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