# How different can it actually be?



## Mr-Green (Apr 29, 2013)

I've applied for a couple jobs but have been turned away due to a lack of residential experience. How different and what are the major differences between commercial/ industrial work and residential?


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

New construction or service? Those are night and day difference.

New residential vs new commercial mainly seems like the differences are size of jobs and the types of materials used or allowed.

Doing new residential, I've never encountered the stuff flyout deals with, or used to deal with, as far as sheer size of pipe and all the cast iron due to being commercial.

Doing service work introduced me to some things i would have never used, like propress or the freeze machine. I wouldn't think there is that big of a difference in residential service to commercial service except the size of pipe and type. And a lot of the equipment that is only commercially related, like grease traps, etc. I can only assume that cleaning a 3"CI line in a commercial setting would not be much different than a 3" CI line in a house.

Just my opinions based on my new residential construction experience, little service experience and what I've read and seen on here about commercial.


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

I was wondering how hard is it to cross over into service and new residential , from being industrial? I have only done one bathroom rough in, we primarily do gas pipe, air, chillers etc.. We don't do bathrooms and a lot of the things you guys talk about , so sometimes I honestly read your posts and have to look up what you guys are talking about lol. If you need something piped from one side of a plant to another I can do it and make it look good.

I have talked to my boss about getting me a few rough ins a year and maybe some service just so I have a clue, he just told me as long as I know the code I will be ok.
Maybe I could figure my way through a residential rough in, but service is totally different. I fixed military vehicles for 8 years, and spent 2 building them.. Not even close.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

Ace... If you have 0 plumbing experience (sounds like you do mostly fitting work) don't jump into service, You will get buried. It's not like commercial/industrial construction. 

I went from heavy commercial construction to commercial service, and I'm finding myself struggling at times, put me in a residential service situation and I'm worthless.


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

Thanks Flyout.. Should I get into more commercial construction first? We pretty much just fit pipe where I work. I was originally offered a job at a small service company, 2 weeks before I was set to start they decided they couldn't afford an apprentice. 
Eventually I want to do construction , and service, but that won't happen where I am at now.


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## Gunnar (Jan 5, 2014)

I started my apprenticeship in a small mom and pop shop that did a fair bit of new construction, and a fair bit of service, both residential and commercial. I switched to the shop I'm at now which is a mechanical company that does very little actual plumbing. We do a lot of cooling towers, boilers ,chillers things like that. There's a lot of guys at this shop that are great at what this company does but would struggle to rough in a 3 piece washroom. I would switch companies while your and apprentice and learn somthing completely different , only gonna make you a better plumber. Just my 2 cents gl


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

I have done both but prefer just plain old residential service work..

I have done some of the commercial work, every job I ever bid I ended up working my ass off and eventually having to file liens on the properties...

it seems commercial guys are like fish out of water and they just dont seem to have the ability to jump into the residential........ they can lay out a hotel by just looking at the plans and can probably order the fittings down to almost the perfect amount.... 

but tell them to change a faucet or a ballcock and they take all day to accomplish this simple task..and they look all bruised up from the struggle..:blink::blink:


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

I actually tried to switch my apprenticeship about 6 months ago. I spent most of my time at a cheese factory everyday pretty much doing nothing. That unfortunately closed down but, now my boss puts me on jobs, and I have shown I can handle it. I talked to the JAC about it, basically they told me if I want to switch I can, but have to find another company to take me on , and cut my contract with the company I am at. I was told by a few guys in the Union if I do that, it will not look good for my career going forward, and to just suck it up until I'm a journeyman. I normally wouldn't complain, but what happens when I want to go somewhere else? Yeah I have a license to plumb, but no knowledge.


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## cjtheplumber (Mar 9, 2012)

commercial = orange
industrial = apple
residential service = banana

So there you have it not apples to apples or oranges to oranges. Comparing elephants to dogs. Not the same at all:no::no: All plumbing but not the same plumbing.

To do service work you got to work at a service company and learn the ins and outs of it.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

Master Mark said:


> I have done both but prefer just plain old residential service work..
> 
> I have done some of the commercial work, every job I ever bid I ended up working my ass off and eventually having to file liens on the properties...
> 
> ...


.... I have no comment. 

Except to say in my experience, in terms of construction, residential plumbers show up to commercial jobs clueless, and can't follow a blueprint... Commercial guys show up on residential jobs, and sure, they're slower, but the work gets done, and gets done right.


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## Qplumb (Dec 19, 2015)

I don't think anyone is strong in all aspects of plumbing everyone has there strengths & weakness. The main difference in my opinion between new construction residential or commercial & service plumbing is being able to diagnose a problem. I think you have to use your brain a lot more in service. I've done new construction residential from age 16 to 20 & hated it by year 4. It became monotonous, I was able to plumb any house without thinking. In service everyday there's a new challenge & a sense of accomplishment when you solve a problem. I have very limited experience in commercial, maybe it's not as monotonous as residential, but for me service is the most rewarding.


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Basically it's all pretty much the same, yet very different. How you handle any of the transitions and how quick you adapt and learn depends on the type of person you are.


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

Qplumb- so far I like industrial work, when I'm put on a big project. To me it's pretty cool using chain falls to lift large sections of pipe into place, and how some of these big jobs come together .. I wouldn't mind staying on the industrial side, but eventually would like to get into the service end. My dad was a mechanic, I grew up fixing things, and was a mechanic myself for 8 years. The one thing I do know is to be good at service you need to really know how and why things work. That's why I love this forum.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

Flyout95 said:


> .... I have no comment.
> 
> Except to say in my experience, in terms of construction, residential plumbers show up to commercial jobs clueless, and can't follow a blueprint... Commercial guys show up on residential jobs, and sure, they're slower, but the work gets done, and gets done right.



you are basically correct.... most residential plumbers would not know where to start on a huge job....because they never have had to deal with lifting huge sections of pipe into the air...Reading large plans and laying out the system........ect..ect..... 


One thing I have noticed in my travels and have seen in people I know.....
if you work on a commercial or industrial job too long , it seems you know how to do stuff and do it right,
but Over time you begin to lose your people skills .and you can get extremely rude and rough around the collar ..... this can easily offend your service plumbing customers because you lack diplomacy and salesmanship which you never needed while running cast iron all day long with a bunch of other grunts ..

I have a relative that worked on commercial jobs for the last 20 years and was actually afraid to accept a good service job because he was uncomfortable dealing and communicating with people doing residential work... 

He had been hideing in a hole
running pipe too long and basically lost or never used
most those skills..

He took the job and seems to be getting better ....


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## paultheplumber1 (May 1, 2014)

My shop does 99.9% residential service and new construction. A few years ago I had a friend from the union who was out of work jump on my crew to help out for a few weeks. Now he had been doing commercial for 10 plus years. I sent him out with one of my guys to start a new res 2 1/2 bath rough. Hard worker but had no clue. He was basically a high priced apprentice in my world. He was a hell of a worker but the knowledge just wasn't there and I couldn't afford to teach him for the amount of money he wanted. I ended up getting him a job with a friend of mine who does mostly light commercial work ( subways, Burger Kings ect) and it worked out alot better for him. He's been there ever since.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

I had a 130 local guy 22 yes old 2nd year kick my arse up and down when it came to copper work-and I must have roughed 1000 homes by now. I'd hate to see what the pace is on a commercial site. 
Being 34 and owning your own small business is better than the best feeling-but it takes a lot of pita jobs to get there. It's true communication is the key-you have to sell yourself. Most customers don't know a good job from a not so good. Just do it while your young.


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

The pace really depends on the boss you have and the job... When we do a shut down at a factory it's 12 hrs a day non stop, sometimes it's 16+hrs a day. Usually if we are doing a big steam job or water heaters my journeyman will tell me how many hours the job was bid for, and we pace ourselves accordingly ... The other journeyman doesn't work hard, but wants everything done fast no matter what. I prefer slow and steady. Someday I hope to get into the light commercial side and do bathrooms at fast food places, supermarkets etc.. Then maybe transition to service..


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## Fatpat (Nov 1, 2015)

It all can be learned and developed.

My dad taught me residential service growing up and when I was 20 I joined the union and took a 5 year apprenticeship. Throughout my apprenticeship I did mostly industrial and commercial new construction Anything from high schools to a bio medical lab, hospitals and Hyperion plants

These days I crossed into commercial and industrial service. And residential service on the side.

It all can be learned.
Just stay busy at work and do as much service side work you can. Even help buddies out for close to nothing and learn as much as possible


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## Mr-Green (Apr 29, 2013)

chonkie said:


> New construction or service? Those are night and day difference. New residential vs new commercial mainly seems like the differences are size of jobs and the types of materials used or allowed. Doing new residential, I've never encountered the stuff flyout deals with, or used to deal with, as far as sheer size of pipe and all the cast iron due to being commercial. Doing service work introduced me to some things i would have never used, like propress or the freeze machine. I wouldn't think there is that big of a difference in residential service to commercial service except the size of pipe and type. And a lot of the equipment that is only commercially related, like grease traps, etc. I can only assume that cleaning a 3"CI line in a commercial setting would not be much different than a 3" CI line in a house. Just my opinions based on my new residential construction experience, little service experience and what I've read and seen on here about commercial.


It was actually for a sales manager position but they wanted someone with residential service experience. All I've done is commercial and heavy industrial work.


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## Mr-Green (Apr 29, 2013)

KoleckeINC said:


> I had a 130 local guy 22 yes old 2nd year kick my arse up and down when it came to copper work-and I must have roughed 1000 homes by now. I'd hate to see what the pace is on a commercial site. Being 34 and owning your own small business is better than the best feeling-but it takes a lot of pita jobs to get there. It's true communication is the key-you have to sell yourself. Most customers don't know a good job from a not so good. Just do it while your young.



Most of the commercial jobs I've been on the pace is kind of like; "welcome to the job. We're 3 weeks behind. Here's your drawings you have this floor and the one above it. Inspections on Friday and if you don't have it done I'll fire you."


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## Mr-Green (Apr 29, 2013)

ace4548 said:


> The pace really depends on the boss you have and the job... When we do a shut down at a factory it's 12 hrs a day non stop, sometimes it's 16+hrs a day. Usually if we are doing a big steam job or water heaters my journeyman will tell me how many hours the job was bid for, and we pace ourselves accordingly ... The other journeyman doesn't work hard, but wants everything done fast no matter what. I prefer slow and steady. Someday I hope to get into the light commercial side and do bathrooms at fast food places, supermarkets etc.. Then maybe transition to service..


That's industrial though and the pace is a little slower due to all the safety measures you have to take.


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

Lol the always 3 weeks behind is so true.. There hasn't been a job I have worked on yet, that has been completed on time... And every one of them my boss lost money lol... The pace can be slowed by saftey precautions , and also the size of pipe you are hanging.. There has been days we only got 20 ft up, had to use a chain fall to lift up the sections.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Mr-Green said:


> I've applied for a couple jobs but have been turned away due to a lack of residential experience. How different and what are the major differences between commercial/ industrial work and residential?


 










With residential, there will definitely be nitpicky snippy customers who are angry at you when you give them the price. You have to be able to handle that. I have known some crusty old plumbers who prefer new construction because they are not good communicators. So they don't want to deal with customers.

Also, in residential service, since you will be going into people's homes, you may have to remove your boots, or put shoe coverings on; you have to lay down drop cloths {I use a small red carpet that I roll out to lay down on} to protect floors and cabinets; you may have pets or children to deal with. It can be different then just going to a bank's restroom and augering a toilet. 

I work clean and neat. Another thing, clean up all your trash and take it with you. One time, I replaced a food waste grinder {garbage disposal} for a customer. While leaving, I noticed the re-cycle bins outside at the curb. It was trash day. So I dumped the disposal in the blue re-cycle bin. Don't you know halfway back to the shop, dispatch calls me and says I need to head back to the customer's house and get the old disposal. I felt like saying to the customer "What's the big deal if I dropped it in the re-cycle bin?"....but you can't say anything. Can you deal with that kind of stuff? Some guys don't want to deal with that.


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## Mr-Green (Apr 29, 2013)

Tommy plumber said:


> With residential, there will definitely be nitpicky snippy customers who are angry at you when you give them the price. You have to be able to handle that. I have known some crusty old plumbers who prefer new construction because they are not good communicators. So they don't want to deal with customers. Also, in residential service, since you will be going into people's homes, you may have to remove your boots, or put shoe coverings on; you have to lay down drop cloths {I use a small red carpet that I roll out to lay down on} to protect floors and cabinets; you may have pets or children to deal with. It can be different then just going to a bank's restroom and augering a toilet. I work clean and neat. Another thing, clean up all your trash and take it with you. One time, I replaced a food waste grinder {garbage disposal} for a customer. While leaving, I noticed the re-cycle bins outside at the curb. It was trash day. So I dumped the disposal in the blue re-cycle bin. Don't you know halfway back to the shop, dispatch calls me and says I need to head back to the customer's house and get the old disposal. I felt like saying to the customer "What's the big deal if I dropped it in the re-cycle bin?"....but you can't say anything. Can you deal with that kind of stuff? Some guys don't want to deal with that.


You deal with most of that in commercial service and tenant work as well.


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## Jessedog11 (Feb 6, 2016)

In NYC repair/jobbing service has become a horror show. lead paint laws put us at risk for Huge federal fines. New work does not have this problem. I do everything, and can say that Jobbing/repair work can be more profitable for the business owner however. as well as Boiler repair/replacements. Their are no estimates like larger scaled New construction. They may have 10 estimates or more to contend with. However. the flip side is. knowledge and experience is important.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Mr-Green said:


> I've applied for a couple jobs but have been turned away due to a lack of residential experience. How different and what are the major differences between commercial/ industrial work and residential?


How do you show up at the job interviews? appearance both clothing and attitude...how do you come across the person your talking to for the job? the I know it all and can do everything? or the I have experience in this, and give examples, with the finish of Im eager to learn and do more..will a boss figure , this guy is going to be tough to have him do things OUR way...I have worked for many plumbers and still am learning new stuff now, with all the advancements in technology..A boss doesnt want to think it will be a fight to get an employee to conform to the shop your working in..people skills are the hardest to learn and master and are the ones that will take you further than knowledge of the work, but you still need to know those skills too...


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## rwh (Dec 17, 2014)

ace4548 said:


> Lol the always 3 weeks behind is so true.. There hasn't been a job I have worked on yet, that has been completed on time... And every one of them my boss lost money lol... The pace can be slowed by saftey precautions , and also the size of pipe you are hanging.. There has been days we only got 20 ft up, had to use a chain fall to lift up the sections.



Every commercial contractor I ever worked for never made any money on a job. "Just hoping to make enough on this one to keep the doors open.". Bahaha


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