# sump pump installs



## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

Ok plumbing gurus i need some advice!
I have a contract for 150 sump pump installs in a basement setting. We have to break the floor, carry out the debris, backfill with stone, re-cement, and roughly pipe out the wall 15 to 20 feet. Im not looking for a price estimate but a rough install time estimate. There will be 2 guys on the install.
Thank you in advance.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Are you placing drain tiles leading to the sump or, just stone around a sump?


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## Plumbducky (Jun 12, 2010)

What type of soil, lots of ground water?


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

We have to tie one footer drain in. So we will have to tunnel the footer for that.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

Medium hard clay .floors are usually 2 inches thick.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

I'd say you could do one a day avg. maybe take a little more then a day at first but by the time 2 guys reach 20 they should be out of there an hour early


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

For 150, I'd say at the minimum $1100 a pop. Material included


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

Michaelcookplum said:


> For 150, I'd say at the minimum $1100 a pop. Material included


That sounds ridiculously low to me. I charge $400 just to swap out a sump. I've jack hammered a lot of basement floors here and have encountered some over pour where the concrete is over 12" thick. 

I would do 5 @ $1800 each and renegotiate from there.


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## PPRI (Aug 27, 2013)

I think bulldozer already has a contract in place. He's looking for some feedback on best methods I believe


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

We already have a contract to do them. Im just trying to see if i bid them fair. There really not my forte but part of a bigger contract. Im hoping to get 2 a day. Is that out of the question?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

It probably is for a 2 man crew...
I'd call it a day for a 2 man crew, a long day on the first few and slightly less than a day once they get a system down...

I'm not calling out numbers because we know the value of my numbers vs yours...


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I'm with Red, two men one day. Possibly an early day each one. More than two guys would be a crowd on one crock. Bust up sounds not too bad. Digging and hauling is where the time goes. Clay can suck, but so can sand, if not more when digging a sump. Have a hilti with a shovel blade. If you don't have one, buy one. At 150 crocks it will pay for itself.

Sounds like a good job. If you have enough guys, rotate. I actually like this kind of job, but every day more than three or four in a row would get old quick.


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## PPRI (Aug 27, 2013)

I agree that 2 a day might be pushing it. You'll want everything pre-installed in the pit so the boys just have to set it and run. A few tidbit tips from me. 

I'd core drill the hole in the floor at least a heavy score so it breaks clean.

I'd urethane the pit to the floor to save patching concrete.

A right angle drill with a 5" dirt auger will bore under the footing way faster than you can dig.

That same drill can help dig the hole with the aid of a heavy duty shopvac. 

The floor thickness and footing depth are the unknowns that can bite you right in the balls


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## Ncplumber84 (Dec 30, 2014)

I would figure two a day would be good as well with two guys but I would play it safe and figure 1 or 1.5 a day so you don't shoot yourself in the foot and if it goes better that's money in the bank not losing it.


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## Blackhawk (Jul 23, 2014)

What size basins? Standard 24" ones or deeper / wider pits?

Sounds like you will be fighting water on each one, clay retains water very well and there is a reason they are investing in sump pits. Fighting water is worse then thick concrete, or hard ground. I would prepare for the worst.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

bulldozer said:


> We already have a contract to do them. Im just trying to see if i bid them fair. There really not my forte but part of a bigger contract. Im hoping to get 2 a day. Is that out of the question?




you are not gonna do 2 a day,,,, even if you bring in a jack hammer and have tunnelling spades, their will be water constantly coming into the hole that will have to be pumped out....

someone has to lug out the debris up the stairs... bags of concrete and gravel have to be lugged in , mixed and poured........ clean up can be a bear too.

also,,, you dont know it yet but *you WILL run into a boulder* or something larger than a basketball, or a foundation that will throw everything off.....

I did one this summer with it being only in a walk out basement with my truck less than 15 feet away and a easy walk to throw away the mud and concrete and it still took me basically all day long.... I tangled with a rock that was about the size of a volleyball and that made it into a manhood contest.......

I bid the job at 2200 with a sump pump piped out the side of the house...and it about did me and the helper in

.I got to bid another one that was down in a basement at
2800 and they took me up on it.... I never got back to them because I think it would have killed me.....


good luck...


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## Toli (Nov 7, 2015)

Based on my experience around here I would figure one a day. 

Are these occupied homes? Can you roll from one to next door? you might pick it up to 1.25 -1.5 if you can do that.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

There all occupied homes. Were lining the sanitarys from the curb to inside of the house. Thank you everyone for your advice. I will keep you posted on how it goes!


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

Yes its house to house.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

plumberkc said:


> That sounds ridiculously low to me. I charge $400 just to swap out a sump. I've jack hammered a lot of basement floors here and have encountered some over pour where the concrete is over 12" thick.
> 
> I would do 5 @ $1800 each and renegotiate from there.



Id do 5 at 1800 as well, but 150, i'd do cheaper. 30x more maybe 33%off? =1200. Idk, just a thought. 1100 not bad


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Just a thought, if water becomes a major issue... While digging I've used one of those pumps you connect to a garden hose. I had one once where we needed a trash pump. That was the worst one. Once we set the crock in place we held it down with a T made out of 2X4's, installed the pump to keep up while the cement set. That was a two day job that we underbid.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

I use a Husqvarna k3000 wet electric Wet cut concrete saw and I don't want to jackhammer ever again. 
But you need a 20 amp dedicated breaker and a regular outlet. I would figure 6-11 hrs each one with water/soil conditions. There's gonna be up and down but I'll wager a healthy profit no matter what. I've stopped using dwv for pumps and gone to sched 40 after a coupling blew out. Not much more$.


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## rwh (Dec 17, 2014)

KoleckeINC said:


> I use a Husqvarna k3000 wet electric Wet cut concrete saw and I don't want to jackhammer ever again.
> But you need a 20 amp dedicated breaker and a regular outlet. I would figure 6-11 hrs each one with water/soil conditions. There's gonna be up and down but I'll wager a healthy profit no matter what. I've stopped using dwv for pumps and gone to sched 40 after a coupling blew out. Not much more$.



By dwv you mean cell core?


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

And by sched 40 do you mean solid core?


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

We bid at 1 per 8 hr. Day start to finish. 1900 each. Were starting in one neighborhood with 150 but there ramping up to 12-14000 over 7 years. Its a city job were we are also replacing all the sanitary laterals. I just dont want the lining crew to overwhelm the pump crew. The theory behind this whole circus is to catch storm water that is infiltrating into the sanitary inside the basement floor.


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## PPRI (Aug 27, 2013)

When did they add this to the contract? It doesn't make much sense really but nothing they have pulled on you thus far has made much sense.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

bulldozer said:


> We bid at 1 per 8 hr. Day start to finish. 1900 each. Were starting in one neighborhood with 150 but there ramping up to 12-14000 over 7 years. Its a city job were we are also replacing all the sanitary laterals. I just dont want the lining crew to overwhelm the pump crew. The theory behind this whole circus is to catch storm water that is infiltrating into the sanitary inside the basement floor.


We have a similar project going on around here called the CSO (Combined Sewer Overflow) project. When we get a heavy rain/thaw the plants can't handle it all and they dump the overflow into the rivers. $176 million (in 1992) and 30 years. Homeowners have to pay the first $500 up to $1k and 25% above the first $1k... or something stupid for inside their own homes. installing crocks, pumps and deleting the old school floor drains. 

So far so good, but I still don't recommend eating the fish.... 

Good money to be made, and after the first five it becomes just another day instead of a hard day.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

bulldozer said:


> We bid at 1 per 8 hr. Day start to finish. 1900 each. Were starting in one neighborhood with 150 but there ramping up to 12-14000 over 7 years. Its a city job were we are also replacing all the sanitary laterals. I just dont want the lining crew to overwhelm the pump crew. The theory behind this whole circus is to catch storm water that is infiltrating into the sanitary inside the basement floor.



that is not too bad on your bid.. I think you will do great.. :thumbsup:

Remember that You can always hire a couple of extra low wage dummies to do all the lugging if you have to... 

I probably would do that just to keep your good workers you have from getting all worn out....:yes:.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

bulldozer said:


> We bid at 1 per 8 hr. Day start to finish. I just don't want the lining crew to overwhelm the pump crew.


You should do fine with those numbers....

If the lining crew does start to get too far ahead you can always have them spend some time breaking out concrete to let the sump pump installation guys have a few gravy days...

Are you air curing the liners with a pancake compressor left behind while they go to the next one?


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

None of this project makes any sense but goverment jobs are like that. We have actually been hot water curing doing 2-3per day. As soon as it warms up we will ambient cure in the morning liners. PPRI i still have your seat down here for you on the excavator. I will even let you run the one with heat! Lol. I actually recruited some amish back busters for the sumps. This is a prevailing wage job so everyone is making some decent coin.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

These CSO projects are popping up everywhere. This one the homeowner pays 10% city pays the rest! New sump, lined sanitary, new tees, gutter drains re-routed to storm.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

bulldozer said:


> These CSO projects are popping up everywhere. This one the homeowner pays 10% city pays the rest! New sump, lined sanitary, new tees, gutter drains re-routed to storm.


There is some big time Federal Grant money on cleaning up those old combined systems...

We've got one near here where a city closed their old plant and pulled a damn big green pipe to a district plant in the next town over...

A distance of about 2.5 miles...
There were a few obstacles, I believe they are still pumping a bypass line...

I've been saying to myself I have to stop there one day and take some pics...


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## Blackhawk (Jul 23, 2014)

rwh said:


> By dwv you mean cell core?


I assume he was referring to pressure rated fittings versus not using DWV fittings.

I keep a small stock of 1.5" and 2" pressure rated pvc fittings for pumps (both sump and sanitary). I never have had an issue but some of the pumps we install move 120+ gpm and I prefer to be safe.


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## PPRI (Aug 27, 2013)

bulldozer said:


> None of this project makes any sense but goverment jobs are like that. We have actually been hot water curing doing 2-3per day. As soon as it warms up we will ambient cure in the morning liners. PPRI i still have your seat down here for you on the excavator. I will even let you run the one with heat! Lol. I actually recruited some amish back busters for the sumps. This is a prevailing wage job so everyone is making some decent coin.


 You are getting desperate for help if you're offering me a hoe instead of rolling HDPE all day long. I'm seriously trying to open up a week this spring to come out. I might wait till the sump pits are done now. If the Amish boys are doing the pits you'll probably be riding the gravy train at the bid price. You'll have a system down pat in about the first ten. 

It's just like any other task. You'll dominate it.


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## Leaky Lou (Jan 1, 2016)

I'm confused about the 1' under dig. Do you tunnel under footing and lay perforated tile in the tunnel, then back fill with 1" clean rock? I am curious because I am doing a pit at the father-in-laws tomorrow and he has no existing drain tile or pit. Thank you.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Leaky Lou said:


> I'm confused about the 1' under dig. Do you tunnel under footing and lay perforated tile in the tunnel, then back fill with 1" clean rock? I am curious because I am doing a pit at the father-in-laws tomorrow and he has no existing drain tile or pit. Thank you.


He's tying into existing footing drains that used to tie into a combined sewer system...

The object being to separate the storm/groundwater away from the sanitary sewers so the treatment plant doesn't discharge sewage when it rains...

Storm water goes to the river without treatment...

Sewage gets treated...


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## Leaky Lou (Jan 1, 2016)

Gotcha! Now I am straightened out. Thank you.


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