# Tankless install



## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Did this yesterday. We dont do many of these. Another case of the boss not wanting to spend the time to figure this stuff out at rough in. Now as you can see the cold and return lines are only about 1" below the connection point. His solution is 18" flex supplies upstream from the valves to meet the requirement for pex. I dont like the idea of flex lines before the valve and it probably isnt legal. Thats ok, I wont be here long enough to fix it.

The last one I did I roughed in with 30" of copper in the wall before I stubbed out. That one has yet to be installed, but I have a feeling it will look a lot cleaner than this crap.


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

Alan said:


> Did this yesterday. We dont do many of these. Another case of the boss not wanting to spend the time to figure this stuff out at rough in. Now as you can see the cold and return lines are only about 1" below the connection point. His solution is 18" flex supplies upstream from the valves to meet the requirement for pex. I dont like the idea of flex lines before the valve and it probably isnt legal. Thats ok, I wont be here long enough to fix it.
> 
> The last one I did I roughed in with 30" of copper in the wall before I stubbed out. That one has yet to be installed, but I have a feeling it will look a lot cleaner than this crap.


No drip leg on the gas line?

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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Blocking not high enough to mount the unit higher? Next time 2x6 blocking in the wall and plan on the unit to mount in the center. If needs be, you can move the unit up or down a little.

I feel your pain with the boss not taking time to get things right so the next step is easier and having a better end result.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

All new housing developments have tankless heaters like that. Do they break down often?

I'm wondering if its a waste of time to get my master's gas licence (I have 2 journeyman gas certificate (tech 2 and gas pipe fitter)) since all these heaters are rented. The gas company is raking money by the truck load. No one seems to want to save money and purchase it.

I tell them after 8 years if you'd buy it you'd have enough money left over to buy 2 more and pay a service plumber once or twice.

I think I just answered my own question!



Here's how they're done here. NOT MY INSTALLATION.


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

chonkie said:


> Blocking not high enough to mount the unit higher? Next time 2x6 blocking in the wall and plan on the unit to mount in the center. If needs be, you can move the unit up or down a little.
> 
> I feel your pain with the boss not taking time to get things right so the next step is easier and having a better end result.


It's actually in a decent spot in terms of the blocking. The top of it sits at 6' which is good for servicing the unit someday.

I think the lines are at 36" now which means there's a good 12" of valves and piping on the bottom of the unit.

I think from now on I will never stub pex out of the wall for one of these. 

Drip leg for the gas? Never installed one before and never been called for it. It's probably a good idea and i'd probably figure on putting them in if it was my business.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Alan said:


> It's actually in a decent spot in terms of the blocking. The top of it sits at 6' which is good for servicing the unit someday.
> 
> I think the lines are at 36" now which means there's a good 12" of valves and piping on the bottom of the unit.
> 
> ...


A drip leg is mandatory for each unit to prevent debris. Do you need to be certified where you are?

(On the Ontario side) it's jail time or heavy fines for lack of trade certificate or licence gas infractions.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

In Ontario the truck driver is not allowed to unload black pipe, he would need a gas pipe fitter licence. On the other hand in my province they do not care one bit. Anyone does gas as long as someone has a trade certificate in the company, they use his name...


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

Alan said:


> Drip leg for the gas? Never installed one before and never been called for it. It's probably a good idea and i'd probably figure on putting them in if it was my business.


It's code here to have drip legs at gas appliances.

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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Tango said:


> A drip leg is mandatory for each unit to prevent debris. Do you need to be certified where you are?
> 
> (On the Ontario side) it's jail time or heavy fines for lack of trade certificate or licence gas infractions.


AFAIK the only certification I need in Oregon is my JP License. If more than that is needed, I'd say it's on him for not researching the classifications that the business needs.

I've put in tons of gas pipe over the last 11 years and none of it with a drip leg at appliances. :vs_OMG:

Let me ask a question : I understand the purpose of the drip leg, but does it still apply if the gas is fed from below the house? What if there is no connection to a municipal gas supply?

I like learning. Even if it takes some research to figure things out. My boss on the other hand is the kind of person where if you ask him something that he doesn't know, he'll just make up an answer to save himself from looking like he doesn't know something. (worse I know)


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I would suggest getting a gas code book that applies in your area because codes vary in each location. What is code for me may not be code for you. Just like plumbing automatic vents are allowed in some places, some are not. Then there are various rules...

There may be books with diagrams. I have one that matches my code because it was done by the association specifically for our gas code. It is awesome because its easier to understand with pictures. It is only in French.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Alan said:


> Let me ask a question : I understand the purpose of the drip leg, but does it still apply if the gas is fed from below the house? What if there is no connection to a municipal gas supply?



My code has more rules than the link below but it gives you an idea

Check this out as an example:

https://structuretech1.com/sediment-traps-what-and-why/


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Tango said:


> Alan said:
> 
> 
> > Let me ask a question : I understand the purpose of the drip leg, but does it still apply if the gas is fed from below the house? What if there is no connection to a municipal gas supply?
> ...


Yeah it makes sense I guess, Although the guy in the article seemed unimpressed with them (not that it makes them unnecessary). I am unsure if gas code here requires it. We dont even have a gas code book in the office. We used to have one from like the 80's but a lot of good that does us in 2018.

I'll definitely be buying one for my office.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

All I'm saying is make sure you are careful, know what the rules are because it may fall back on you. The first thing they told us in the military is "Ignorance is not an excuse"

If a house burns down there will be an investigation. If they see the gas line were improperly done you as the gas fitter are responsible as much as the employer. Depending on your location it might be a lengthy prison sentence.

The first line in Ontario gas code is that you are 100% responsible and liable for the gas installation. To use due diligence...

We have to pay for that certificate every year if not we have to go to school again and pass the exam again.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

My neighbor is selling his house and the buyers home inspector flagged that there was no sediment trap/drip leg on the water heater and furnace. My neighbor installed one on his furnace himself. I let him know it was a fail.


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

Here you go 

The 2015 INTERNATIONAL FUEL GAS CODE SOFT COVER
or you can get the 2018 Version which costs more,
the 2015 Issue is more likely what is being used at this time
it takes a while for the Jurisdiction to pass the current code


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

Here's some other Books that you will need 

2015 International Mechanical Code 2015 International Mechanical Code

2015 Uniform Plumbing Code Soft Cover

Uniform Plumbing Code Tables/Equations Quick-Card Based on 2015 UPC


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

MACPLUMB777 said:


> Here's some other Books that you will need
> 
> 2015 International Mechanical Code 2015 International Mechanical Code
> 
> ...


Thank you!


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

No drip leg on the gas line?

On the West Coast they do not normally use a drip leg because it is a Dryer
Gas then used back East or up North, the reason for the drip leg is because
of moisture in the pipe causing rust that flakes off and flows downstream
and can clog up a Gas valve to stick open, leading to a possible 
EXPLOSION or over HEAT, which why the gas cock is supposed to be one
a home owner can turn off without tools !


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

MACPLUMB777 said:


> No drip leg on the gas line?
> 
> On the West Coast they do not normally use a drip leg because it is a Dryer
> Gas then used back East or up North, the reason for the drip leg is because
> ...


They're called sediment traps here and are code for water heaters and furnaces. They started enforcing them about 6-8 years ago.


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