# Stainless Steel Water Flexes



## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Does any experienced plumber prefer to use the SS braided water heater flex hoses for residential use? I do not understand how these are code approved in Texas being they are just SS braid with a PVC liner flex hose. It has always been my understanding that a WH shall have at least 18" of metal tubing on the inlet and outlet of the water heater according to UPC and just because the outside is SS braid it is still plastic on the inside. I have seen many SS braided faucet supply lines blister and rupture and the SS braid did no better than not having any braid. The SS braid seems to be mostly a gimmick and there for just appearance. I only use these flexes as handles to help move the WH easier. In my opinion they are garbage and I have seen many leaks occur on them, when used on water heaters, at the factory connection and the problem seems to be either cheap construction or over tightening, or both. Any thoughts?


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## JK949 (Mar 18, 2009)

No, because thy sell them at HD.

Who cares what other people do?


What is in your client's best interest?


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Hard pipe


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I use flexible stainless water heater risers but not the braided ones. I don't like them for new work because they look cheap. They are nice for service work because its quick.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

JK949 said:


> No, because thy sell them at HD.
> 
> Who cares what other people do?
> 
> ...


Haha. Fair enough.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

I love them... keep me busy replacing them ..


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## JoshJ (May 10, 2012)

Never have, never will.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I use the ss corrugated flexes. Code to put them in. No issues with them.


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## Pipe Rat (Apr 5, 2009)

dclarke said:


> I use flexible stainless water heater risers but not the braided ones. I don't like them for new work because they look cheap. They are nice for service work because its quick.


 
So :whistling2::whistling2: it's OK to look cheap with your service work????


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

The stainless steel are junk hard pipe or copper flex always


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## BigDave (Mar 24, 2012)

I prefer hard pipe. When local code wants unions. the copper flex
connectors are what I use. The flex lines are easier than ground joint
brass unions.

I've seen the rubber liners of those cheap braided DIY POS break down
and the customer ends up with a black ring in bathtubs.

I hate the braiding that only LOOKS like stainless :furious:

Buy one and take a sharp knife to the fibers, peel it all away
and you have a plastic or rubber hose.


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

Soldered copper on everyone. 

I think I remember someone saying that flex lines are code in earthquake zones.


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

I have a customer we used the black nylon braded for a while. They have black plastic come out their whirlpool and lav. Two hwt sit behind it. I went back to copper flex connectors


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Pipe Rat said:


> So :whistling2::whistling2: it's OK to look cheap with your service work????


I know. I use them mostly for speed. I dont have issue with them leaking ever. It makes any future change out easier. I guess cheap wasn't necessarily the best word choice. I don't feel the ones I use are a bad product or in wouldn't use them. They are not quite as nice appearing as hard pipe but for me and what i typically run into its usually the best solution.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

In earthquake country hard pipe isn't a good idea. The building (and pipe suspended from it) moves one way and the water heater, which is anchored to the wall behind it, moves another. Even copper flex lines failed, at their connection to the water heater, by the hundreds after the '89 Loma Prieta quake. Now, the biggest problem I see with any connectors that use a rubber washer as a seal is disintegration caused by Chloramine.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*flex lines are safer than hard pipeing*

flex lines are best .... we use the black braided 
brass craft ones... never had a failure since 1998 

I Probably have installed 4 thousand of
them over the past 10 years... I never have had an issue....

I have seen the copper flex lines spring leaks in the bends due to the electralsis in the pipes, but on average they still extend the life of the heater....and they never corrode shut like the dialectirc
unions do

the FLEX lines are super DIALECTRIC in nature, 
they are also earth quake and foundation movement freindly....
depending on where you live in the usa...they might be mandatory


we also use the yellow flex lines to the gas on the water heaters..... 

I have seen too many water heaters jump up or settle 
down a few inches once the water and gas lines are taken off the old units.
which has always concerned me....


of course.....to each their own....


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Master Mark said:


> flex lines are best .... we use the black braided
> brass craft ones... never had a failure since 1998
> 
> I Probably have installed 4 thousand of
> ...


I won't use the black braided ones and have seen way too many leak or blister from a heater being set too high by HO.

I think you have been lucky or maybe the water where you live is better than the heavily chemical laden water we have in Houston. I prefer either hard pipe or copper flex lines. If you always use brass nipples or non galvanized ones and you don't over-tighten them than you should rarely, if ever have issues. 

I can't believe how many "plumbers" use them for tankless connectors. I only hard pipe them. I have seen those melt CPVC from a flow switch sticking in the open position. I can post pics tomorrow.


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## 504Plumber (Jan 26, 2011)

Not supposed to use any flex lines around here, might as well pipe them with M.


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## JK949 (Mar 18, 2009)

I do use corrugated stainless flexes. If you take a sec before installing to check that the washers are properly seated the chances of leaks are small.

Also every home gets a Chlorine test and findings are shared with the client and on the invoice.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

JK949 said:


> I do use corrugated stainless flexes. If you take a sec before installing to check that the washers are properly seated the chances of leaks are small.
> 
> Also every home gets a Chlorine test and findings are shared with the client and on the invoice.


thats what i use. no chlorine test but thats the type of riser i use.


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## plumberpro (Jan 1, 2013)

those are not allowed in my area and gas to wh is to be hard piped


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## love2surf927 (Dec 22, 2011)

JK949 said:


> I do use corrugated stainless flexes. If you take a sec before installing to check that the washers are properly seated the chances of leaks are small.
> 
> Also every home gets a Chlorine test and findings are shared with the client and on the invoice.


What are you using to test the chlorine, this is an issue in my area. Does it give you levels?


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## plumbing ninja (Jan 15, 2012)

I prefer reputable branded corrugated stainless with ss braid or teflon lined ss braid! (Bilok,Swagelok,Letlok, Parker etc) I've found it best to install these the way hydraulic hoses are fitted (bends with hose dooping) See hydraulic hose manual for correct layout! Again care with aligning the washers/gaskets!


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## Kevan (Jul 5, 2010)

The water in Memphis is very mild. I did some work for relatives in Lufkin, Texas, and was appalled at the condition of their faucets. I'd _never_ seen anything like it in Memphis.

I tried the silver-braided rubber lines on water heaters for a few months, including my own, and the rubber flecks showed up in every home. I replaced as many as I could remember with hard copper, free to the customer. Absolutely worthless.

Copper flex lines aren't allowed here by code, but you see them pretty regularly anyway--often kinked and twisted like a dying snake and leaking to the point of rusting the exterior of the water heater, soaking the insulation, and frying the electric wires.

When they're installed carefully and not overtightened, they seem to work perfectly.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Kevan said:


> The water in Memphis is very mild. I did some work for relatives in Lufkin, Texas, and was appalled at the condition of their faucets. I'd never seen anything like it in Memphis.
> 
> I tried the silver-braided rubber lines on water heaters for a few months, including my own, and the rubber flecks showed up in every home. I replaced as many as I could remember with hard copper, free to the customer. Absolutely worthless.
> 
> ...


Like many things in plumbing, if you follow manufacturers recommendations and take some pride in what you do, it ends up working out well. Our water in Houston is terrible and allows for lots of repairs.


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## Kevan (Jul 5, 2010)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> Our water in Houston is terrible and allows for lots of repairs.


I was born in Houston in 1955 and reared in the Airline - Tidwell area (23 DeBoll) until I left in 1973. It was the space age: the oil boom was on, construction was incessant, NASA got built, the Astrodome arose. I was taught that I had been born a natural citizen of the greatest city in the greatest state in the greatest country in the world -- I was practically royalty!

And of course, I thought our water just couldn't be beat! Maybe back then it was better, especially when drinking out of a garden hose.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Kevan said:


> I was born in Houston in 1955 and reared in the Airline - Tidwell area (23 DeBoll) until I left in 1973. It was the space age: the oil boom was on, construction was incessant, NASA got built, the Astrodome arose. I was taught that I had been born a natural citizen of the greatest city in the greatest state in the greatest country in the world -- I was practically royalty!
> 
> And of course, I thought our water just couldn't be beat! Maybe back then it was better, especially when drinking out of a garden hose.


Was told that water in, Clear Lake is better than the rest of Harris County, why is that?


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## suzie (Sep 1, 2010)

Hard piped all the way!


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

rjbphd said:


> Was told that water in, Clear Lake is better than the rest of Harris County, why is that?



*THAT IS WHY IT IS CALLED
"CLEAR" LAKE :thumbup:
*


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

rjbphd said:


> Was told that water in, Clear Lake is better than the rest of Harris County, why is that?


Because their water doesn't come primarily from lake Houston.


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## damnplumber (Jan 22, 2012)

Because I live major earthquake country I use corrugated stainless lines but I really like the classy look of a hard-piped pro-press type L installation. I use hard pipe on tankless though.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

damnplumber said:


> Because I live major earthquake country I use corrugated stainless lines but I really like the classy look of a hard-piped pro-press type L installation. I use hard pipe on tankless though.


Totally agree. For Tankless I think it looks sloppy to use flexes. I used to pipe the gas in rigid until they came out with the full ¾" gas flex.


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## MindLost (May 25, 2013)

Master Mark said:


> flex lines are best .... we use the black braided
> brass craft ones... never had a failure since 1998
> 
> I Probably have installed 4 thousand of
> ...



Then they start leaving black residue eveywhere, and hopefully youre not using them with recirc pumps.. You make me


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

MindLost said:


> Then they start leaving black residue eveywhere, and hopefully youre not using them with recirc pumps.. You make me


Have ya lost ur mind about not posting a full intro as request on this site??


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## Plumbersteve (Jan 25, 2011)

I'm surprised with these comments. I get it where earthquakes are common, but y'all go on and on in other threads about pride in the trade and here , by endorsing the use of SS flex or corrugated CU, you're perpetuation this notion that anyone can do plumbing. Have you ever stumbled across a neatly piped WH with clean sweats and thought "geez, what stooge put this in?" No because a professional job is evident in its appearance. On the other hand, whenever I walk into a mech room and see a heater with SS or CU flex and a flex gas connector, I assume it was a weekend warrior or Allencat. 

BTW, same goes for PEX. That shiot never looks good. I stand behind my copper work. Sweat or PP. it looks professional. It looks as though a day laborer didnt put it in. That's a HUGE part of maintaining or improving the public opinion of 'plumbing'


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Plumbersteve said:


> I'm surprised with these comments. I get it where earthquakes are common, but y'all go on and on in other threads about pride in the trade and here , by endorsing the use of SS flex or corrugated CU, you're perpetuation this notion that anyone can do plumbing. Have you ever stumbled across a neatly piped WH with clean sweats and thought "geez, what stooge put this in?" No because a professional job is evident in its appearance. On the other hand, whenever I walk into a mech room and see a heater with SS or CU flex and a flex gas connector, I assume it was a weekend warrior or Allencat.
> 
> BTW, same goes for PEX. That shiot never looks good. I stand behind my copper work. Sweat or PP. it looks professional. It looks as though a day laborer didnt put it in. That's a HUGE part of maintaining or improving the public opinion of 'plumbing'


Different strokes for different folks. In repair plumbing the option of hard piping a WH in copper isn't always the best solution and sometimes using flexes is not the best solution. Both are approved methods and I have seen plenty of both methods that look like a handy man did the job. The job and circumstances deem the method. If you are always able to hard pipe in gas lines and water lines then great, but don't be so quick to put down others who live in completely different regions for doing their job differently than you. 

I have seen plenty of flexed in WHs that have been in place for 20+ years and had no leaks on the lines and look professionally installed so how would have hard piping been an improvement? Anyhow, just saying try to be a little open minded when it comes to those of us who do their job a little different.


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## Olemissplumber (Dec 7, 2012)

I pipe all my work up with copper and either propress or solder.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*thanks for your comment*



Best Darn Sewer said:


> Different strokes for different folks.
> 
> I have seen plenty of flexed in WHs that have been in place for 20+ years and had no leaks on the lines and look professionally installed so how would have hard piping been an improvement? Anyhow, just saying try to be a little open minded when it comes to those of us who do their job a little different.


 
Thanks for your comment....you can do the work any way you want to and to any level you think is best....basically its all in your own mind...

....Their are areas of country that flex connectors are used due to movement in the soil... I feel that is a safer way to install lines to a unit that can settle or over time.... 

I have disconnected gas lines and water lines off heaters before and seen them sink about 5 inches into rotten floor or lean or fall to the left or right..
The only thing supporting them full of water was the gas and water lines....

Wether anyone likes it or not... they are approved for plumbing and have been for probably 35 years or more....:yes::yes:

*Yes the Diyers can buy them at Lowes..* and they DO make the job a lot easier and save me about an hour of work... and maybe you think that they are cutting you out of a job cause they make it too easy.... 
*I say to get over it* cause those DIYers who go to lowes are not going to call you even on a cold day in hell anyway so why should you care....???..

If you need to prove that you are a legend in your own plumbing mind ,,,, bring in a lazer level on your next installation and level those pipes up in that nasty basement cellar you are working in,, that will certainly impress the customer....:laughing:.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

I have used flex lines off and on since the first ones Watts had in the early 90's. that first generation was just a rubber hose that started breaking down on the hot side immediately. When that happened I hard-piped for years before trying it again.

Currently we use the black braided, SS corrugated, or hard-pipe. It makes no mechanical difference because they last longer than the heaters anyway. 

Looks? 
Meh...gas-pex, Uponor, and CPVC yet we're worried that WH flexes look cheap? :laughing:

Won't sell it because it's on the shelf for DIY'ers at HD?
That's the real joke. For those of you drawing that line in the sand are you also boycotting Kohler, American Standard, Price Phister, Moen, Delta, Nibco, Charlotte, Ward, Brasscraft, Watts, Dearborn Brass, Oaty, Rectorseal, Bridget, Ridgid, and Woverine Tube? :laughing:

Concerned about our trade's image?
I could not agree more that our trade has image issues. in the course of being so-called Professional Plumbers, we are chock full of liars, cheats, thieves, drug users, guys that take a bath once a week, don't have combs or razors and if they do...they refuse to use them. Flexible piping has NOTHING to do with our image problems or whether or not a WH was professionally installed.

Too easy?
Fine, let's go back to XH soil pipe, lead pots, blow torch heated soldering irons, and wiped lead joints. There...problem solved. :whistling2:


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## Plumbersteve (Jan 25, 2011)

You're missing my point. First of all, I already said that I understand that they are used out of necessity in certain areas. I'm not a "legend in my own mind". I'm a licensed professional and I take that seriously. IMPO, flex lines look hokey. That's not a closed minded thing to say. And whether that HO would have called me or not is beside the point. The point is that a HO who sees flex lines and snap together plumbing supplies in the aisles at lowes is empowered to think he can do it. If we use them just because they're convenient, we kick that can down the road.


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## Plumbersteve (Jan 25, 2011)

plbgbiz said:


> Looks?
> Meh...gas-pex, Uponor, and CPVC yet we're worried that WH flexes look cheap? :laughing:


Yep. All that stuff makes it look like anyone can do plumbing.

I'm not talking about the people in the trade. I'm talking about the work. Dirty stinky plumbers do some of the cleanest work while the cleanest cut guys are the ones who are savvy enough to think of the short cuts. 

Have you ever seen a PVC stack that was out in by a homeowner with purple primer? You can tell that's not a pro job. 

This isn't about boycotting anything sold at lowes. It's about choosing, when able, to do things the best way, the most professional way. That may be an opinion, but its my opinion that that opinion needs to have higher standards across the trade. 

When your water service is on one corner and all of your fixtures are on the other corner, do you run the pipe in right angles or do you just shoot it at whatever angle is necessary to get it there? Do you wipe your solders?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Plumbersteve said:


> Yep. All that stuff makes it look like anyone can do plumbing.
> 
> I'm not talking about the people in the trade. I'm talking about the work. Dirty stinky plumbers do some of the cleanest work while the cleanest cut guys are the ones who are savvy enough to think of the short cuts.
> 
> ...


I get it and you and I agree on most points.

But in the plumbing business world there has to be a balance. A balance between quality, aesthetics, and profitability.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> I get it and you and I agree on most points.
> 
> But in the plumbing business world there has to be a balance. A balance between quality, aesthetics, and profitability.


Yes it is about balance, dishwasher flex connection are a sweet way of connecting to the water supply fast and hidden. A wall hung lav may not be a place for flex for the fact of looks. They all have there place a lot of faucets are now coming out with flex connections its hard to tell how that will end. Over the last 30 years there has been a lot of different things that have been out there as new and improved or a game changer for the plumbing trade and a lot of them failed. We will see how this turns out in time but it does have promise.


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