# advise



## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

for those of you who do jetting, how do you charge? flat rate? hourly? by the job? what kind of prices are folks willing to pay in your market to do this? maintenance contracts?
all help will be greatly appreciated


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Plumb26 said:


> for those of you who do jetting, how do you charge? flat rate? hourly? by the job? what kind of prices are folks willing to pay in your market to do this? maintenance contracts?
> all help will be greatly appreciated


We charge $1k for the 1st 2 hours then hourly after that...
But that is in Connecticut and is what our company charges...

It has no bearing on what you should charge or, what your market area will bear...


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Redwood said:


> We charge $1k for the 1st 2 hours then hourly after that...
> But that is in Connecticut and is what our company charges...
> 
> It has no bearing on what you should charge or, what your market area will bear...


yeah, central nc would laugh me out of their homes and businesses. lol. i spoke with a guy in boston area and he said they got $1200 to cable a sewer.... i was amazed!


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

We charge a flat rate of $425 to bring the Jetter out for a clogged line. My machine is a old school trailer mounted beast not some hopped up pressure washer like a lot of guys use and I am yet to meet a drain it didn't open in one hour or less on the job site. Granted we have to fill at our local bulk water sales (600 gallon tank) for big jobs, multiple lines, or Maint contracts I bid each one individually based on time it would take to complete. My advice for anyone getting into jetting is invest your profits into specialized jet heads. I'm not talking about the 4 heads for 800 bucks sets I'm talking 1200 root rat and warthog nozzles that will do the job correctly. Jetting like anything else is an investment but brings in the big bucks. We run a 1984 Myers ram jet 35 GPM @ 2000psi and located in central Illinois. In our city of approx 150k we can be anywhere in less than half an hour. Filling the Jetter and transporting it to a job need to be factored into your pricing. Every area is different, if you can get your municipality to rent you a meter to fill of hydrants you will save tons of time. If you are running a set up that hooks up to a garden hose than you should simply charge roughly what you charge to auger a sewer because it's not much better

Red I want to add that I think anyone with a Jetter who knows what they are doing is worth what you guys charge but I simply couldn't compete with that price around here, the only other company around here with a trailer jet charges 500 for a 2 hour minimum


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Unclog1776 said:


> We charge a flat rate of $425 to bring the Jetter out for a clogged line. My machine is a old school trailer mounted beast not some hopped up pressure washer like a lot of guys use and I am yet to meet a drain it didn't open in one hour or less on the job site. Granted we have to fill at our local bulk water sales (600 gallon tank) for big jobs, multiple lines, or Maint contracts I bid each one individually based on time it would take to complete. My advice for anyone getting into jetting is invest your profits into specialized jet heads. I'm not talking about the 4 heads for 800 bucks sets I'm talking 1200 root rat and warthog nozzles that will do the job correctly. Jetting like anything else is an investment but brings in the big bucks. We run a 1984 Myers ram jet 35 GPM @ 2000psi and located in central Illinois. In our city of approx 150k we can be anywhere in less than half an hour. Filling the Jetter and transporting it to a job need to be factored into your pricing. Every area is different, if you can get your municipality to rent you a meter to fill of hydrants you will save tons of time. If you are running a set up that hooks up to a garden hose than you should simply charge roughly what you charge to auger a sewer because it's not much better
> 
> Red I want to add that I think anyone with a Jetter who knows what they are doing is worth what you guys charge but I simply couldn't compete with that price around here, the only other company around here with a trailer jet charges 500 for a 2 hour minimum


when only dealing with lines up to 4'', is 35gpm needed? i was looking strongly at ridgid 3100 (4gpm @ 3000psi) general 3055 (5.5 gpm @ 4000 psi), or general 3080 (8gpm @ 4000 psi) to start out with. maybe we should start with a skid mount? suggestions? keep in mind, it's not my money i'm spending. the owner will probably spend 11k tops to get a feel for the return on his investment....


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Really what you have to look at is what your costs are of doing the jetting and the level of profit you want to make...

You also have to consider what the market will bear...

If it won't support your overhead and your profit then some trimming is needed... Or you won't be doing any work...


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

35 GPM would defiantly be overkill for soley 4" work but I am a firm believer that GPM is just as important if not more imporant that PSI. Personally I would never hit a main line with anything less than 12 GPM


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

We're running a bunch of US Jetting 4018's for 2 shifts

They work quite well for the mains we see...


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

What are the specs on your units? And how long are you on each job?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

4K psi, 18 gpm and typically about an hour sometimes more...

It depends on what we are doing...

A single line...
Multiple lines...

Descaling...


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

Damn bro. I wish we got paid like that here. Reds advise to me in my short time, regarding jetting, on here was about the root rat nozzle and it turned out to be one of the best things I have ever purchased. If you jet main lines and you don't have one you simply can't compete. IMO it blows the warthog out of the water when it comes to roots. Get something that has enough balls to get the job done. All too often I hear of outfits spending several hours on a clog with their low flow unit and still not get it open then we show up and they are flowing as well as a camera down the line in 1.5 hrs or so and all roots are gone.

Less than 12 GPM for mainline work sub par IMO


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Unclog1776 said:


> Reds advise to me in my short time, regarding jetting, on here was about the *root rat nozzle* and it turned out to be one of the best things I have ever purchased. *If you jet main lines and you don't have one you simply can't compete.* IMO it blows the warthog out of the water when it comes to roots.


Shhhh We'll keep this as our secret.... :whistling2:

Everytime I've mentioned it before they started talking about the Root Ranger... 

IDKY... It's some sort of strange thing that you have to twist the hose to make it work and it gets stuck easy...:laughing:


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## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

I have Jetters Northwest “Big Brute” Cart Jetter 9 GPM at 4000 PSI. I don't see anything bigger than 6" and have only had 2 drains that I couldn't open with it. I'm fairly new at jetting also, less than a year. I think anything more than 12 gpm would be overkill for residential. I have the warthog, root ranger and root rat. With these nozzles I am clearing drains in 60 to 90 minutes with my limited experience. When I first started it was taking me a lot longer. $712 covers first two hours. A lot of guys out here charge $250 for 1st two hours; DUMB! And that's with their big trailer jetters. I've heard of a particular company here getting $1700. I will admit I don't use the root ranger as often as some guys on these forums do, it's just too much work twisting that damn hose for me. Spartan has a few jetters with specs at 12 gpm 4000 psi also. Just came across this 12 gpm. 
http://www.jettersnorthwest.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Skid-Series-Brochure.pdf


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I made my own jetter and have pretty darn good success with it. I use a root ranger and at 4gpm 3500 psi, it's all I ever needed for 4" pipe. I'm in a financial situation to buy a bigger jetter but can't justify it because I keep the jetter on the van, any hose bibb can supply enough water, don't jet everyday and my jetter has never been stopped....not even close. Gone through 10' of solid roots in about 15 mins and then cleaned it out nice with the root ranger. Plus I made it for about 300. I paid it off after the first job. 

My average jetting job takes about 1-2 hours and the camera goes in with the jetter. 2 year warranty against root stoppages. I charge by the hour and equipment fees.

Here's the link to the root ranger in action....it's the reason why I never needed a bigger jetter.


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## Mpc_mhayes (Nov 27, 2012)

Plum26

What I would do is call around and ask plumbers that are doing jetting what they charge. I was thinking of getting a jetter. But I have had one yet that I couldn't get with my k-60. We have a lot of PVC mains around here. The case iron is so bad that its falling apart and I wouldn't want to jet it. We just replace. I don't just do drain cleaning I do everything.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

I work in Houston and surrounding area and the company I work for has 2 gas powered Spartan cart jetters and 3 Spartan electric jetters. Our kitchen cleanouts are typically on the outside wall of the kitchen sink and we get $425 for up to 2 hours to jet from there and clean the kitchen/washer line.

We also have 2 trailer mounted jetters from US Jetting and we get $725 for the first 2 hours of using them which is mostly going to be for cleaning commercial drains. Those things are beasts and will pump up to 20 GPMs at 4000 psi. We have a Root Rat and many flushing nozzles.

To jet from an inside kitchen cleanout with electric jetter runs $489 for 2 hours but typically I try to jet island sinks from the main cleanout by running the gas jetter hose and camera up the line all from the outside. We charge $533 for that.

We charge $225 for each additional hour after first 2 for any jetting service. I give one year warranty on all jetted lines except for commercial drains. Those come with a 90 day warranty. I always run a camera down the drain after I jet it. 

My preferred method of jetting any kitchen line is from the main 4" cleanout. I run the camera and jetter up the line and guide it towards the kitchen/washer line. That way I can pull all the build-up back to the main cleanout and then flush it to the city main. To do this with our gas powered Spartan cart jetter we charge $533 for the first 2 hours. With this service I will also warranty all their drains to be free from clogs for a year, assuming they aren't broken. Even if they have a belly in the line I will warranty it if I can clear it. 

Currently I am making promotional videos with my Ridgid CS10 camera to promote jetting. I am making before and after videos of jetted drains. I showed one to my wife, who has zero plumbing knowledge, and she was able to easily see the benefits. I am going to upload it to YouTube and then I can show my customers the vids on a tablet or iPad...whenever I get one. 

I love jetting and see the profits in it. Its fun, too. By far it is the absolute best way to clean any drain if you have the right nozzles and jetter.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Redwood said:


> Shhhh We'll keep this as our secret.... :whistling2:
> 
> Everytime I've mentioned it before they started talking about the Root Ranger...
> 
> IDKY... It's some sort of strange thing that you have to twist the hose to make it work and it gets stuck easy...:laughing:


That's interesting to hear. I have looked at the root rat and root ranger and I thought the Ranger looked more effective and quicker. The guy who runs the trailer jetter at my company said that with the root rat you first break all the roots up with it and then switch to a flushing nozzle to get all the now shredded roots out of the line. It looked like the root ranger shredded and removed all the roots. So what's the deal here? 

And I thought you were joking when you said you charge $1K for jetting service. That's insane but I think its awesome you can get it. Obviously, that is a completely different market. I knew Connecticut was expensive but, Dayum!


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> That's interesting to hear. I have looked at the root rat and root ranger and I thought the Ranger looked more effective and quicker. The guy who runs the trailer jetter at my company said that with the root rat you first break all the roots up with it and then switch to a flushing nozzle to get all the now shredded roots out of the line. It looked like the root ranger shredded and removed all the roots. So what's the deal here?
> 
> And I thought you were joking when you said you charge $1K for jetting service. That's insane but I think its awesome you can get it. Obviously, that is a completely different market. I knew Connecticut was expensive but, Dayum!


The downside to the Ranger is visible in the video. Most (if not all) of that movement inside the pipe is being done by the operator twisting the hose. Left on its own, that Ranger doesn't move a whole lot in the pipe. It kinda lays there. Getting that agility through a couple of bends or on a long run seems like it would be tough.

Don't get me wrong. It is likely the most aggressive water-only nozzle on the market. That said, accuracy in its placement is the key. The videos are very impressive but you almost have to have the camera right there to see if you have the nozzle pointed to the correct spot in the pipe.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

plbgbiz said:


> The downside to the Ranger is visible in the video. Most (if not all) of that movement inside the pipe is being done by the operator twisting the hose. Left on its own, that Ranger doesn't move a whole lot in the pipe. It kinda lays there. Getting that agility through a couple of bends or on a long run seems like it would be tough.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. It is likely the most aggressive water-only nozzle on the market. That said, accuracy in its placement is the key. The videos are very impressive but you almost have to have the camera right there to see if you have the nozzle pointed to the correct spot in the pipe.


Oooh. I gotcha. I had wondered about all that spinning inside the pipe. I watched a lot of root ranger videos but wasn't sure how it all worked. I was just very impressed by the destruction of the roots but, like anything, there is a down side to its awesome performance.Thank you, Biz.


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## Cuda (Mar 16, 2009)

The root ranger gets 50% of the pipe then you flip it 180 and get the rest of the pipe, if there is a straggler you then have to point it directly at the spot. This is with the 1/2" ranger but I got similar results with the 3/8". I just did a root infested pipe the other day for a builder that I gave a 50/50 chance of success. I got it all but the roots where the size of my thumb. On these nozzles there are certain names that come up a lot that people have success with Root Ranger, Warthog, Root Rat,Then the common flushing nozzles. As one builds up there jetter clientele it would be wise to purchase all the main ones to handle every different type of situation. Figure a grand each.


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

I haven't had any issues with my root rat flushing the chopped up roots out. Then again I have only it for a lee months now


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> The downside to the Ranger is visible in the video. Most (if not all) of that movement inside the pipe is being done by the operator twisting the hose. Left on its own, that Ranger doesn't move a whole lot in the pipe. It kinda lays there. Getting that agility through a couple of bends or on a long run seems like it would be tough.
> 
> Don't get me wrong. It is likely the most aggressive water-only nozzle on the market. That said, accuracy in its placement is the key. The videos are very impressive but you almost have to have the camera right there to see if you have the nozzle pointed to the correct spot in the pipe.


You're right on this. I think a root ranger is similar to using a sectional. Very effective but you gotta handle the hose more and the success really depends on the operator. But once the operator knows how to use it, there's nothing better. I use the camera in conjunction with the jetter. Once I position the RR in the right spot I flip the hose over a few times, maybe 20 seconds, listen for the sound change(really helps) and reinspect.


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

How far back from the nozzle do you guys set your camera when running pressure? Or do you remove it from the line completley


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I push the nozzle ahead.The spray doesn't hurt the wand. If worried about it, put some christy tape on the wand


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

Not the wand that worries me. I cracked a lense once with a flying rock off the Jetter


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

My new rat is on the way. **wrings hands with anxious grin**


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

First one or replacing a worn one?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Unclog1776 said:


> First one or replacing a worn one?


First timer.


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

You won't regret it. What size did you get? I got the 1/2" which is said be capable of doing 4" lines but I don't use it on anything less than 6. All residential sewers here are 6" though


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

3/8"

We have been using the Warthog successfully on 6". I am hoping the Rat will cut down the time on those calls.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Unclog1776 said:


> I haven't had any issues with my root rat flushing the chopped up roots out. Then again I have only it for a lee months now


Yea kinda like grass clippings they flow out nicely...:laughing:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> 3/8"
> 
> We have been using the Warthog successfully on 6". I am hoping the Rat will cut down the time on those calls.


Does it come with a roller chain or, straight link chain?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Does it come with a roller chain or, straight link chain?


Straight links.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Unclog1776 said:


> I haven't had any issues with my root rat flushing the chopped up roots out. Then again I have only it for a lee months now


Well, that was from a coworker who said that was his experience when he used the root rat to clear a 6" sewer line at a concrete plant that had concrete mix build-up. He said that he was having to go thru w/ the root rat to break it up and then use the flusher nozzle to get the now broken up build up out. I was the one who assumed that you had to do the same with roots but now that I think about it, concrete mix or buildup would be a lot harder to flush out than shredded roots.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> Straight links.


Good that would be my preference, some of the smaller ones have roller chain, which I think would be likely to hang in situations like going out of a lateral into the city main...


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> Well that was from a coworker who said that when he used the root rat to clear a 6" sewer line at a concrete plant that had concrete mix build-up. He said that he was having to go thru w/ the root rat to break it up and then the flusher nozzle to get the build up out. I was the one who assumed that you had to do the same with roots but now that I think about it, concrete mix or buildup would be a lot harder to flush out than shredded roots.


Yea I think cement would be a lot harder to flush from the pipe but would probably not be too bad if you were jetting from downstream...

Roots flow out nicely...


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

Good to know it will break cement


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

The chain flail jetting nozzles will take out anything protruding into the ID of the pipe. Roots, grease, cement, rust scale.... Anything!

All it has to do is be able to hit against it and it is gone...
Leaving nothing but a smooth round pipe surface because it is not being struck...

Yes if you let it sit in one place in a plastic pipe for an extended period of time it will eventually wear through, don't take lunch and leave it going in one place... :laughing:

There has also been mention of using chain knockers on cables, these have nowhere near the same effectiveness as a chain flail jetter nozzle as the rpm is insufficient for effective results.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Now Mr. Root...shall we dance? :brows:


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

Nice. The wire attachments are nice for stirring up gravel and letting the jets blow it out


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> Now Mr. Root...shall we dance? :brows:


Now all you have to do is learn to listen to Mr Root when he is talking to you while he's working....

He tells you when he's slacking...
He tells you when he's working...
And he tells you when he's working too hard...

All you have to do is learn to listen to him....
You might own the biz...
But Mr Root is the boss...
All you have to do is what he wants and you'll be very happy...


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

Dude I busted asphalt out of a 8" storm line with mine. Parking lot had just been refinished and they didn't cover the storm lids


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## MTDUNN (Oct 9, 2011)

plbgbiz said:


> Now Mr. Root...shall we dance? :brows:


Grateful Dead Terrapin Station!!

Was I right????


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

MTDUNN said:


> Grateful Dead Terrapin Station!! Was I right????


 Yep.

My favorite headphone album of all time. Terrapin Station and my late 60's Sennheiser HD414 cans. :turned:

Sure wish I had not lost the cans but I still listen to TS from time to time.


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