# How to test a vent?



## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I'm doing an estimate for someone but I haven't been on site and all the walls and ceilings are finished. The owner says there is a pipe protruding the basement ceiling with an orange cap.(Probably a test cap)

I need to find a way to see if that pipe is a vent. Since I never did this what is recommended to see if it leads all the way to the roof? Some type of smoke or incense from the basement preferably without having to buy a 24 foot ladder to go to the roof.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

i would use smoke...not liquid or you may damage the house..if you dont have a smoke machine you can get colored smoke bombs and a shop vac to force the smoke into the pipe..


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I saw smoke bombs at the supply house and remember once a friend of mine unrelated to the plumbing business had a few of the same(well they looked similar) and we lit it up outside. It produced a huge cloud for several minutes. 

So are there tiny smoke bombs? 

I guess I would have the existing 1 1/2" coming from the ceiling to a 4" pipe piece with a side hole and slap the smoking bomb inside and use the shop vac to push the smoke out?


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Well the supply house only have them for ducts, 60 delay and 60 second gray smoke burn time. I bet that's going to be way to much.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Tango said:


> I saw smoke bombs at the supply house and remember once a friend of mine unrelated to the plumbing business had a few of the same(well they looked similar) and we lit it up outside. It produced a huge cloud for several minutes.
> 
> So are there tiny smoke bombs?
> 
> I guess I would have the existing 1 1/2" coming from the ceiling to a 4" pipe piece with a side hole and slap the smoking bomb inside and use the shop vac to push the smoke out?



set up with shop vac hose on the push side of vac connected to vent pipe in question, have shop vac outside of hose and use long hose( garden hose will do if you dont have long enough vac hose..light smoke bomb in small metal can so you dont burn hand and hold it up to suction port on vac, vac sucks in smoke and pushes it through hose into vent line, by you , vac and smoke source outside, no stray smoke goes into house, then see if smoke comes out roof vent, or where ever that pipe terminates..


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Good idea! I'll try it if the guy isn't a cheap skate (which I suspect) and accepts my estimate.


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

Tango said:


> Good idea! I'll try it if the guy isn't a cheap skate (which I suspect) and accepts my estimate.


Tango here is a smoke machine cobbled together by Randy Hilton.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> Tango here is a smoke machine cobbled together by Randy Hilton.



looks pretty good, only problem is i would have some metal plate to protect pvc from burning or replace pvc cleanout with a cast one as burning pvc is HIGHLY toxic and now your blowing toxic fumes into a house or building..


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Awesome idea! A bathroom fan with an extension cord and a dryer vent.
How about replacing the the 4" tee and coupling with a galvanized duct tee? If the bomb gets two hot maybe b-vent tee or just and extra patch layer of tin on the side where the toolbox sides are.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Tango said:


> Awesome idea! A bathroom fan with an extension cord and a dryer vent.
> How about replacing the the 4" tee and coupling with a galvanized duct tee? If the bomb gets two hot maybe b-vent tee or just and extra patch layer of tin on the side where the toolbox sides are.


you can use anything that will give you a sealable chamber for the smoke bomb to go...


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> Why don't you get or make a smoke test machine? I get those calls all the time and make money off the test plus the repair.
> The one I made is compact, the size of a toolbox. Because I made it out of a toolbox, haha.





Ours is just a shop vac with a metal pan in the bottom on some legs. Been using it for decades.
















.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Seriously I need a crash course in smoke testing. I don't even know if anyone in the city does it.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Seriously I need a crash course in smoke testing. I don't even know if anyone in the city does it.





It's really simple. Ever do a water test? Ever do an air test? It's the same thing but with smoke.


You plug all the holes except one where you blow the smoke in. While the smoke blows in someone checks inside for where it leaks out/smells like it's coming from.






















.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Tango said:
> 
> 
> > Seriously I need a crash course in smoke testing. I don't even know if anyone in the city does it.
> ...


I never plug anything. My equipment puts out enough smoke that I don't need to plug the vents. That's probably the problem with using a shop vac, it probably blows too hard and pushes the smoke out of them too fast. 
Mine took a bit of fine tuning to get enough flow that it fills the line but not so much that it forces the smoke straight out of the vents.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I never plug anything. My equipment puts out enough smoke that I don't need to plug the vents. That's probably the problem with using a shop vac, it probably blows too hard and pushes the smoke out of them too fast.
> Mine took a bit of fine tuning to get enough flow that it fills the line but not so much that it forces the smoke straight out of the vents.





We usually blow into the vent and most homes have septic systems so if we didn't plug every thing it would blow through the traps.


Sometimes if we think the leak is big we will blow from one fixture and leave everything else unplugged but for the few times we do a leak test because we can't find it any other way plugging everything and blowing into the vent for a high pressure smoke test really helps find the small leaks. Most of the time when we do a smoke test it's a last ditch effort to prove the smell isn't the drains leaking and that it is prolly just dead animals.












.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> We usually blow into the vent and most homes have septic systems so if we didn't plug every thing it would blow through the traps.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if we think the leak is big we will blow from one fixture and leave everything else unplugged but for the few times we do a leak test because we can't find it any other way plugging everything and blowing into the vent for a high pressure smoke test really helps find the small leaks. Most of the time when we do a smoke test it's a last ditch effort to prove the smell isn't the drains leaking and that it is prolly just dead animals.
> ...


Looks complicated, I don't have a ladder to go plug the vent on the roof, and you plug all the traps???


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I never plug anything. My equipment puts out enough smoke that I don't need to plug the vents. That's probably the problem with using a shop vac, it probably blows too hard and pushes the smoke out of them too fast.
> Mine took a bit of fine tuning to get enough flow that it fills the line but not so much that it forces the smoke straight out of the vents.


Oh I want to know how you do that! Thanks for the PM replies!


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Oh I want to know how you do that! Thanks for the PM replies!





Can we just move this to the lounge so we can have a real discussion?


Like I said, often we don't plug everything but we also don't do many smoke tests. Funny enough I do have a customer I went to see earlier this week with a smell who had a broken vent pipe before and it's looking like they have another and we may be doing a smoke test soon.


Even without smoke you can plug everything and blow air in the vent and then listen inside for air leaks. When smoking I have found some that way even before seeing smoke.










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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Looks complicated, I don't have a ladder to go plug the vent on the roof, and you plug all the traps???



It's not hard to plug everything depending on the house. Access to the vent can often be had in the attic instead of going on the roof.


The sinks and tubs can be plugged with the stopper and some putty in the over flow hole. Of course you have to pull the toilet or shove a ton of wet toilet paper in.


But I repeat, this is only to increase the pressure for the smallest of leaks and at this point you may as well do a water test. Most of the time we don't plug everything.

















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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Can we just move this to the lounge so we can have a real discussion?
> 
> 
> Like I said, often we don't plug everything but we also don't do many smoke tests. Funny enough I do have a customer I went to see earlier this week with a smell who had a broken vent pipe before and it's looking like they have another and we may be doing a smoke test soon.
> ...


It was in the lounge and I brought it on the ground floor for V.A Hydro-ooter to reply as he has experience too but his post count is too low. Once it's reached it's course I can put it back to the lounge unless you have a better idea? I'm signing off now.


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

This is how I learned how to find a air-leak or sewer gas smell in a vent system: 

I usually don’t plug/cover anything. 

Get 2 tin cans, put one inside of the other, and attach a soft or ridged wire, so you can retrieve the cans.

Open the C/O on the stack, 
then lowered the can(s) with the lit SB in it, into the stack, You have to work quickly, cover the c/o with pre-prepared square of duct tape.

OR

You can pop a W/C, or use a FD with the water in the trap removed.
A test plug can be used in the W/C flange or FD. 

Then, walk around with a flashlight and look for blue smoke..

This method is slower then forcing the smoke into the system, but it’s pretty simple, and it usually works for me.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Logtec said:


> This is how I learned how to find a air-leak or sewer gas smell in a vent system:
> 
> I usually don’t plug/cover anything.
> 
> ...


Oh that's awesome. I'll be looking for blue smoke, do you have the brand name? I think wolseley only has the gray one and it might be hard to see.


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

I get mine from Noble. I’m not sure if the brand name..
They usually have to order them, cuz apparently very few companies use them now.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Can we just move this to the lounge so we can have a real discussion?
> 
> 
> .


Would you prefer to post in the lounge in a new thread and eventually I'll merge everything in there?


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Anyone want to share pictures of their setup? I asked my supply house for smoke bombs, they didn't know what the purpose it served other than for ducts.

Another service If I provide it I would be on my own and have to get stuff online.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Would you prefer to post in the lounge in a new thread and eventually I'll merge everything in there?



I just want us all to be able to discuss this. If it being public means some people start sending pms than wtf is the point of a forum?


If we can discuss this freely in the lounge than move it there. If this being private means that some of us are excluded than keep it out here in public view and just live with the fact that some diy will see this.


Having a site like this which makes money from the diy traffic means we can't discuss everything we want to with each other. This is why we need a plumbers only site ran by plumbers for plumbers. Or at least a private section that admins can give access to those who qualify regardless of post count.















Want privacy from the diy/hacks? Too bad, the motherland has fallen, freedom is dead.






.


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## Venomthirst (Jun 20, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Tango said:
> 
> 
> > Would you prefer to post in the lounge in a new thread and eventually I'll merge everything in there?
> ...


We will get there eventually.... just have to get engaging conversations to get the post count up lol

I've been commenting on everything intentionally.. I'm more of a reader and only comment if I feel I have a real valid contribution... in all honestly I've only done a smoke test once but would like to really learn more about it because I'm the stink sniffer lol.. always get the bad smell calls

We had one we had to smash apart everything in the unit to find the one vent where the galv threads had rotted off... 

Another was small hair line cracks on top of sewer couldn't see...

Others you dont smell anything and the sewer has a 1" wide crack for 100'...

Today I change a 40 gal hot water tank in ceiling...
2" vent completely disconnected I said didn't you guys smell anything ?
Nope but maybe that's why I'm sick all the time....

That or the oil interceptor under your desk that's wide open lol


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Logtec and Hydro to do a post blitz to reach 500. :smile:


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

It takes 500 posts to reach lounge level?!? I thought it was only 300. Thought I was over halfway there, haha.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

I can post pictures of my setup if you guys want. I'm not one of those who won't share knowledge. If it helps a diy guy oh well I say. Just let me know and I'll post some tonight.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Venomthirst said:


> We will get there eventually.... just have to get engaging conversations to get the post count up lol
> 
> I've been commenting on everything intentionally.. I'm more of a reader and only comment if I feel I have a real valid contribution... in all honestly I've only done a smoke test once but would like to really learn more about it because I'm the stink sniffer lol.. always get the bad smell calls
> 
> ...



You are getting there quite nicely.

I'm the same sometimes people tell me do smell that sewer stench? I'm like no I probably got used to it or it may be because of health condition. If I eat a hamburger I usually can't taste the bacon, tomatoes etc unless I eat them separately.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> It takes 500 posts to reach lounge level?!? I thought it was only 300. Thought I was over halfway there, haha.





V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I can post pictures of my setup if you guys want. I'm not one of those who won't share knowledge. If it helps a diy guy oh well I say. Just let me know and I'll post some tonight.


Yes please, I'd like pictures! Some diy and handy hacks will see this thread but once the thread dies down it'll be sent in the lounge. It isn't a perfect situation but it's the best I can come up with for now.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Let the critiquing commence.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Upping my post count.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

And another.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> Let the critiquing commence.


What's in the box? :smile:


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

This one shows the inside of the pipe. I had to notch a knockout plug to restrict the airflow. The pipe used to be white inside...


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Tango said:


> V.A Hydro-ooter said:
> 
> 
> > Let the critiquing commence.
> ...


I told you in the pm how I made it so we can leave it at that if you don't want to make it too easy for the diy crowd, haha.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I told you in the pm how I made it so we can leave it at that if you don't want to make it too easy for the diy crowd, haha.


The bomb doesn't melt the inside of the pipe where the clean out is?


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Tango said:


> V.A Hydro-ooter said:
> 
> 
> > I told you in the pm how I made it so we can leave it at that if you don't want to make it too easy for the diy crowd, haha.
> ...


It hasn't yet. I've run over 200 bombs through it and still have the original pipe. It's schedule 40 solid core PVC.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Awesome, I think it's pretty cool! :thumbup::thumbup:


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

I'm able to carry everything I need in the box, except for an extension cord.


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## Venomthirst (Jun 20, 2018)

That's awesome... thanks for the post.. wifes gotta hate me for ripping out the bathroom fan lol


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Tango said:


> Awesome, I think it's pretty cool! <img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/forums/smilies/thumbup.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Thumbup" class="inlineimg" /><img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/forums/smilies/thumbup.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Thumbup" class="inlineimg" />


Thanks. I don't think it's too bad for under $100 and part of an afternoon to make. It probably took me longer to fine tune the airflow than making the rest of the machine.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Venomthirst said:


> That's awesome... thanks for the post.. wifes gotta hate me for ripping out the bathroom fan lol


Shh. You're giving away all the trade secrets, haha. Mine is black so it can't be a bathroom fan. 🤣


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> It hasn't yet. I've run over 200 bombs through it and still have the original pipe. It's schedule 40 solid core PVC.



pvc is HIGHLY TOXIC when it burns, so each time the bomb is burning and also burning a thin layer of pvc you are getting poisoned...I guess a good way to get ride of pesky customers..:vs_laugh:


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> V.A Hydro-ooter said:
> 
> 
> > It hasn't yet. I've run over 200 bombs through it and still have the original pipe. It's schedule 40 solid core PVC.
> ...


 I don't think it's burning it. Last time I cleaned out the grime that builds up the pipe was still intact. Most of the burning goes on inside the smoke bomb. It doesn't completely disintegrate the bomb, just the area where the fuse is.

I'm guessing there might be some toxic gases being released but mostly from the smoke. That's why I make sure the area I'm working in is well ventilated.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I don't think it's burning it. Last time I cleaned out the grime that builds up the pipe was still intact. Most of the burning goes on inside the smoke bomb. It doesn't completely disintegrate the bomb, just the area where the fuse is.
> 
> I'm guessing there might be some toxic gases being released but mostly from the smoke. That's why I make sure the area I'm working in is well ventilated.



ok if the fire is in a sleeve it should be good, but the smoke bomb made for this is non toxic, that doesnt mean you couldnt have used toxic smoke bombs...


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> V.A Hydro-ooter said:
> 
> 
> > I don't think it's burning it. Last time I cleaned out the grime that builds up the pipe was still intact. Most of the burning goes on inside the smoke bomb. It doesn't completely disintegrate the bomb, just the area where the fuse is.
> ...


 These are the only bombs I use. I've probably only had 2 or 3 duds. Probably my fault since I don't store them as they recommend.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

I forgot to mention my pickup had a bed cap so all the smell and humidity was trapped in the back with all my tools and fittings. Probably wouldn't have been as bad if it were open.


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## canuck92 (Apr 1, 2016)

Well even if its an old drain its connected to a vent at somepoint an thus youll have smoke comming out of the roof, 
Come across the same situation befour, i dropped a camera from the roof.
What is the purpose of this capped pipe ?
Are you trying to tie a vent into it ? Connect a drain to it ?
Is it abs ? How old is the house.
Usually theres a reason why things are capped or eliminated.
Pop the capp off put a bucket under it ...most likly has water in it from rain in the vent...if it is connected.
Run some fixture an listen if you can hear the fixture runnin in the pipe then it is connected an not dead ended. 
My guess at that point is it was a vent an somthing got moved during a reno.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> I never plug anything. My equipment puts out enough smoke that I don't need to plug the vents. That's probably the problem with using a shop vac, it probably blows too hard and pushes the smoke out of them too fast.
> Mine took a bit of fine tuning to get enough flow that it fills the line but not so much that it forces the smoke straight out of the vents.


You can install an inline dimmer switch to control the amount of airflow in your shop vac or fan


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

Tango said:


> Logtec and Hydro to do a post blitz to reach 500. <img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/smile.png" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" class="inlineimg" />


As much as I like to access this secret lounge, I’m not going to go “post-al” to get to a set limit. 
I read more then I post, usually by the time I’ve read thru a thread, my point or info has already been shared. 
I and found a unique way to advertise, for a small business, but I don’t want to post/share it on a public forum. So I guess I’ll have to wait for the lounge..


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> These are the only bombs I use. I've probably only had 2 or 3 duds. Probably my fault since I don't store them as they recommend.


....


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Gargalaxy said:


> ....





That's exactly what we use. They are a little short lived but they work.













.


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## Venomthirst (Jun 20, 2018)

Just redid seal on sewage pit at a school horrid stink since 95... some arse cut huge hole lid to replace pump.. found 4 open pipes and other open.drain... 

Went this morning caretaker is happy so far I said to her please let us know if theres anymore issues... will do a smoke test if needed she was happy with service and will let me know...

Apprently the old Scotsmen has been building his own smokers for years... using power flue motors from hot water tanks... ol fart has been holding out on me lol


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Venomthirst said:


> Just redid seal on sewage pit at a school horrid stink since 95... some arse cut huge hole lid to replace pump.. found 4 open pipes and other open.drain...
> 
> Went this morning caretaker is happy so far I said to her please let us know if theres anymore issues... will do a smoke test if needed she was happy with service and will let me know...
> 
> Apprently the old Scotsmen has been building his own smokers for years... using power flue motors from hot water tanks... ol fart has been holding out on me lol


 I almost kept the fan off the last power vent water heater just for that, haha. I was going to make another smoke machine but I think one is enough for now. Maybe I should start recycling those fans and selling my homemade contraptions.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Ok here is the beginning of a mock up. I'll be placing some sheet metal in the bottom of the tee. I also need to find a flexible 4" duct. Only one I could find are on ali express from china.
@Logtec Can you send me some blue smoke or anyone know where I can get some shipped to Canada? Nothing in stock here and they only can get gray smoke. 13$ each for 30 seconds or 25$ for a minute.


.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

Tango said:


> Ok here is the beginning of a mock up. I'll be placing some sheet metal in the bottom of the tee. I also need to find a flexible 4" duct. Only one I could find are on ali express from china.
> 
> @Logtec Can you send me some blue smoke or anyone know where I can get some shipped to Canada? Nothing in stock here and they only can get gray smoke. 13$ each for 30 seconds or 25$ for a minute.
> 
> ...


Why does it need to be blue? The superior smoke signal bombs I use put out a light gray smoke and works perfectly fine. They definitely aren't cheap though. I would try contacting them directly to see if they'll ship to you. I've also seen them on Amazon before.


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## V.A Hydro-ooter (Oct 14, 2018)

https://www.acklandsgrainger.com/en/product/SMOKE-CANDLE-1-MIN-8,000-CU-FT-DZ/p/SSG2B


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> Why does it need to be blue? The superior smoke signal bombs I use put out a light gray smoke and works perfectly fine. They definitely aren't cheap though. I would try contacting them directly to see if they'll ship to you. I've also seen them on Amazon before.


I think blue would be easier to see.

Not sure if you can buy from grainger online, at least not from actual stores. They don't sell to the public.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

V.A Hydro-ooter said:


> https://www.acklandsgrainger.com/en/product/SMOKE-CANDLE-1-MIN-8,000-CU-FT-DZ/p/SSG2B


Looks like I can order online and the price and shipping are reasonable. If I can't find blue ones then these will do.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Does this look like it's tear resistant. Looking at the compressed bag at the bottom of the listing do you think it's 3 meters stretched out or 3M when its compressed?

Is 3 meters fully stretched long enough?

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32889070780.html


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Ok here is the beginning of a mock up. I'll be placing some sheet metal in the bottom of the tee. I also need to find a flexible 4" duct. Only one I could find are on ali express from china.
> 
> @*Logtec* Can you send me some blue smoke or anyone know where I can get some shipped to Canada? Nothing in stock here and they only can get gray smoke. 13$ each for 30 seconds or 25$ for a minute.
> 
> ...







You guys are way overthinking this, just use a shop vac and put a stainless bowl inside of another of the same size in the bottom of the shop vac.


















.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> You guys are way overthinking this, just use a shop vac and put a stainless bowl inside of another of the same size in the bottom of the shop vac.
> 
> 
> .


Oh come on, I went to 4 stores this afternoon to gather all this stuff including a new tool box and now my buckethead shop vac will do the trick? I was happy to make it look nice. :sad2:

So you are saying all I need is a reducer from 1 1/2" vaccum hose to a 3" or 4"?


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> Oh come on, I went to 4 stores this afternoon to gather all this stuff including a new tool box and now my buckethead shop vac will do the trick? I was happy to make it look nice. :sad2:
> 
> So you are saying all I need is a reducer from 1 1/2" vaccum hose to a 3" or 4"?





You mean a fernco cap with a hole cut in it? :vs_laugh:










.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> You mean a fernco cap with a hole cut in it? :vs_laugh:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls... 

Which one would you say to be better, a vacuum with the 1 1/4" hose or a bathroom fan in a tool box with a 4" duct?


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Tango said:


> I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls...
> 
> Which one would you say to be better, a vacuum with the 1 1/4" hose or a bathroom fan in a tool box with a 4" duct?





when you answer how long this string is........................:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> when you answer how long this string is........................:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


pfff easy, a string is as long as a segment. :glasses:


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls...
> 
> Which one would you say to be better, a vacuum with the 1 1/4" hose or a bathroom fan in a tool box with a 4" duct?



I have always carried an 8 gallon shop vac on the van as that is the smallest you can get with it still having the same motor as the larger units. Also, an 8 gallon shop vac holds just shy of 5 gallons of liquid. It's perfect when working with 5 gallon buckets as I do.


The shop vac can move much more air and will be useful all the time so it stays on my van. I use the shop vac almost daily. You just spent like 35$ usd on a sweet toolbox to make it into a tool you will use maybe once a year. If the shop vac is using too much air you can obstruct the suction hole and vary the amount of air. 



The shop vac alone can be used to test. When blowing air into a sealed system you can often hear the air pissing out of bigger cracks in the pipe. We renovated an old hotel and found like 15 cracks in the 2" and 3" pvc pipe this way. Just set the shop vac up far away from where you want to listen.


You don't have to use two bowls, that's just the slacker way I do it. Put the smokeys in, light them, and close the vac quick. I usually light two smokes at a time because those little smokeys are short.


Another cool idea would be a steel nipple that fits in the inlet. Put a tee on the other end with a plug in the bottom. Put a ball valve on top. Put a smokey on the ball while the valve is shut. light the smokey and open the valve letting it drop into the tee. Then you can close the valve more or less to adjust air.





I am sure his toolbox works great for him but I can't justify taking up that much space on my van or trying to look after a special tool I will rarely use. Some bowls or a coffee can or a tee assembly can be stuck somewhere in the van.


This one guy we had for a while kept a coffee can in his van for peeing in. Use your pee can and it will pull double duty. :biggrin:












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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

The easiest way to cut nice holes in fernco caps is to take a short piece of copper and ream the inside good so the edge is sharp. Use it like a punch. 



I do this for making tight seals with washing machine discharge hoses. This will even hold when the sewer backs up just from the tight fit and most of those hard corrugated washer hoses have tall ridges. I use 3/4" copper to punch holes for those.












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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls...





For finding stainless bowls, go to your local dollar store/grocery store. They prolly have the small pet food bowls. They even have kitty paw prints!!! :biggrin:




I went to feed my cats and thought of you.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Tango said:


> pfff easy, a string is as long as a segment. :glasses:





and how long is a segment??? let me guess.....as long as the string...:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> The easiest way to cut nice holes in fernco caps is to take a short piece of copper and ream the inside good so the edge is sharp. Use it like a punch.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





what do polar bears and Tupperware have in common?????




they both like tight seals.....:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


the only problem with your way of doing a washing machine hose connect is you now cause a siphon effect..if you look at store bought fernco connectors for a washing machine they have air slots cut in the cap along with the hole for the hose....


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

skoronesa said:


> The easiest way to cut nice holes in fernco caps is to take a short piece of copper and ream the inside good so the edge is sharp. Use it like a punch.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I take a piece of copper and get it red hot and it will melt right thru the rubber or pvc cap,makes a perfect fit


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> and how long is a segment??? let me guess.....as long as the string...:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


Nope, since we don't know the length of the string or the segment it's the price given to a price shopper. :vs_laugh:


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> what do polar bears and Tupperware have in common?????
> they both like tight seals.....:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:
> 
> 
> the only problem with your way of doing a washing machine hose connect is you now cause a siphon effect..if you look at store bought fernco connectors for a washing machine they have air slots cut in the cap along with the hole for the hose....





I've always heard that joke as "Why did the walrus go to the tupperware party? He was looking for a tight seal.".




Siphon what out of where? Siphon more water from the washing machine?












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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> I've always heard that joke as "Why did the walrus go to the tupperware party? He was looking for a tight seal.".
> 
> 
> 
> ...



no the other way around...if the sewer backs up the hose could siphon that crap back into the machine....there must be a reason they cut vent slots in the caps.....


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> no the other way around...if the sewer backs up the hose could siphon that crap back into the machine....there must be a reason they cut vent slots in the caps.....





They cut vent slots in the cap so the washer wont push sewage into other appliances if the line is clogged further down.


If the sewage siphons into the washer than the washer check valve is broken, it won't fully empty under normal conditions, and mold will grow. So if sewage siphons back into your washer you needed a new washer to begin with.
















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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> Tango said:
> 
> 
> > I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls...
> ...




Hahahahahahaahhaah
A piece of string...

The dollar store has stainless steel bowls. If not in the kitchen section, look in the pet section(dog food bowls)


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Tango said:
> 
> 
> > I'm going to the thrift store this afternoon to look at stainless steel bowls...
> ...


Dollar store, pet food bowls..
You beat me to it..

No SS bowls for my girls..


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

Tango said:


> ShtRnsdownhill said:
> 
> 
> > and how long is a segment??? let me guess.....as long as the string...<img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/vs_laugh.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Vs Laugh" class="inlineimg" /><img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/vs_laugh.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Vs Laugh" class="inlineimg" />
> ...


Hahahahaahahahahahaha.....


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I saw a bowl yesterday I should of picked it up but'll go back. Now for the vacuum, should I assemble a dimmer switch from parts to reduce the speed of it or try to baffle the hose end?

The dimmer sold online don't have the ground prong.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

if you use stainless steel bowls , put some fiberglass insulation between 2 stacked bowls to prevent any heat from the burning smoke device from melting the plastic of the shop vac bottom...


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I made a few adapters for the vacuum to hook onto clean outs. I also have these expansion joints for pipes from my water ram kit. They have a hole in the middle, Will it be sufficient for the smoke from the vacuum to go through the small orifice as the size are 1/2" and one of them is 3/8" or will it cause too much restriction?

I also bought some electrical components to build a dimmer to slow the vac speed.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Tango said:


> I made a few adapters for the vacuum to hook onto clean outs. I also have these expansion joints for pipes from my water ram kit. They have a hole in the middle, Will it be sufficient for the smoke from the vacuum to go through the small orifice as the size are 1/2" and one of them is 3/8" or will it cause too much restriction?
> 
> I also bought some electrical components to build a dimmer to slow the vac speed.
> 
> ...



now you can really blow smoke up someones a$$...:vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> I saw a bowl yesterday I should of picked it up but'll go back. Now for the vacuum, should I assemble a dimmer switch from parts to reduce the speed of it or try to baffle the hose end?
> 
> The dimmer sold online don't have the ground prong.





Do a baffle. Using a dimmer switch for a motor is iffy as it is and some shop vacs draw a lot of juice.










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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> if you use stainless steel bowls , put some fiberglass insulation between 2 stacked bowls to prevent any heat from the burning smoke device from melting the plastic of the shop vac bottom...





If he gets the right pair of bowls there should be a pretty good air gap between the two which is why I suggested it. But yeah, fiberglass or even better some roxul would be good.












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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> If he gets the right pair of bowls there should be a pretty good air gap between the two which is why I suggested it. But yeah, fiberglass or even better some roxul would be good.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 I'll just set it on the can, take a look at the picture. So what kind of baffle and what do you think of those expansion joints with a hole in the middle? It would be ideal to plug it in a 3" floor drain in the basement? Clean outs are very rare and most pipes are in finished walls.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> I'll just set it on the can, take a look at the picture. So what kind of baffle and what do you think of those expansion joints with a hole in the middle? It would be ideal to plug it in a 3" floor drain in the basement? Clean outs are very rare and most pipes are in finished walls.





Take the trap off a sink. Or stick the hose through the trap of a toilet and use wet rags around it with a bunch of water.
















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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

skoronesa said:


> Take the trap off a sink. Or stick the hose through the trap of a toilet and use wet rags around it with a bunch of water.
> 
> 
> .






I hadn't thought of that, nice! I'll have to check with the fire department if I have to let them know before hand, I don't want a bill from them to show up when smoke pours out the roof vent.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Tango said:


> I hadn't thought of that, nice! I'll have to check with the fire department if I have to let them know before hand, I don't want a bill from them to show up when smoke pours out the roof vent.


I would either just call them when you're going to do a smoke test or just post a sign out front.

Here it's common practice to notify the fire department when doing drills, doing fire/smoke prone work, or when testing an alarm system.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Tango said:


> Looks complicated, I don't have a ladder to go plug the vent on the roof, and you plug all the traps???


No you do not plug all the traps,as long as there is no illegal plumbing and the plumbing has been installed correctly then smoke will not blow thru the traps


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

sparky said:


> No you do not plug all the traps,as long as there is no illegal plumbing and the plumbing has been installed correctly then smoke will not blow thru the traps


Anyways I've had really bad experiences with people saying there was a smell so I turn them all down. People demand 100% guarantee if not I've seen them totally go ape $hit. No more.

I had started to make myself some plugs and bought smoke bombs then I dropped the idea.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Tango said:


> Anyways I've had really bad experiences with people saying there was a smell so I turn them all down. People demand 100% guarantee if not I've seen them totally go ape $hit. No more.
> 
> I had started to make myself some plugs and bought smoke bombs then I dropped the idea.


I want them to smell smoke let’s them know something is wrong and you found it


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

sparky said:


> I want them to smell smoke let’s them know something is wrong and you found it


Problem is most houses here have been reno'd by diy and hacks. You put your hand in the cookie jar all happy to get chocolate chips and "SNAP" a rat trap hack.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Tango said:


> Problem is most houses here have been reno'd by diy and hacks. You put your hand in the cookie jar all happy to get chocolate chips and "SNAP" a rat trap hack.


 Well if they let diys and hacks do their plumbing they need to choke on some good sulfur smoke so they know what a crappy job they got stuck with


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## Dontbitenails (Oct 16, 2020)

Let neighbors know you are preforming a smoke test . Nothing better that a firetruck showing up .


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## Michael Young (May 12, 2021)

Tango said:


> I'm doing an estimate for someone but I haven't been on site and all the walls and ceilings are finished. The owner says there is a pipe protruding the basement ceiling with an orange cap.(Probably a test cap)
> 
> I need to find a way to see if that pipe is a vent. Since I never did this what is recommended to see if it leads all the way to the roof? Some type of smoke or incense from the basement preferably without having to buy a 24 foot ladder to go to the roof.


smoke bombs work. But we use the 90-second smoke grenades. Those little toy smoke bombs don't put out enough smoke. You want LOTS AND LOTS OF SMOKE. The red with the 90-second burn does a pretty good job; and really easy to see. LINK DELETE


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

skoronesa said:


> Take the trap off a sink. Or stick the hose through the trap of a toilet and use wet rags around it with a bunch of water.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Michael Young (May 12, 2021)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> i would use smoke...not liquid or you may damage the house..if you dont have a smoke machine you can get colored smoke bombs and a shop vac to force the smoke into the pipe..


I've never done that. But yeah. putting a smoke bomb inside a shop vac and blowing the smoke sounds like a great technique.


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