# Rheem replacment water heaters



## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

I have a friend with 2 40 gallon Rheem wtr/htrs in her attic that she is worried about leaking they are fvir htrs 
dated 01/2000 what would you recommend as a replacement, ?
she is thinking of a tankless style the heaters are plumbed in with CPVC pipe and in series, her two sons
will be doing the labor I will be there to supervise and make sure ever thing is to code. :thumbup:
this is in Houston, Texas


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Thought you are a 35 years master plumber?


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

Why not stay with the same set up , but have both tanks in a pan and drained to exterior of the house ?


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

rjbphd said:


> Thought you are a 35 years master plumber?


He's retired, doesn't keep up with changing products.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Jerry

They didn't start making fvir heaters till 2003.


You've got you dates wrong.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

rinnai if she wants tankless


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

now that sounds like a good time had by all..

2 sons of the owner and a supervisor......:laughing:

and which one of you 3 fellas will put their foot through the ceiling first??

I can guarantee that doing a tankless is gonna be nothing but trouble...

you really ought to make it easy on yourselves
and just change them out with the same brand 

be sure to stay out of the path of the heaters when them helpers bring those old heaters down out of the attic....:laughing::yes:


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## sjaquay (Jan 13, 2013)

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> Why not stay with the same set up , but have both tanks in a pan and drained to exterior of the house ?


YEAH, what he said....although they changed the hieghts a little bit, shouldn be an issue, stay with what works, add the drain pans and id add an alarm, just in case.

i also agree to stay away from the tankless, i talk every customer i can out of using them, nothing but a pain in the asssss....:thumbup:


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> He's retired, doesn't keep up with changing products.


I am retired because the V.A. and S.S. rate me as 120% permanently disabled *,
 but I do keep up *on the new products,
I have the tools and the know how but I can not do 
the labor parts anymore and since this is for my girlfriend I want to help out I am not going out to 
make money :laughing:


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

JERRYMAC said:


> I am retired because the V.A. and S.S. rate me as 120% permanently disabled *,*
> *but I do keep up *on the new products,
> I have the tools and the know how but I can not do
> the labor parts anymore and since this is for my girlfriend I want to help out I am not going out to
> make money :laughing:


We need pictures or its not true. :laughing:


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

The beginning code on the water heaters is 1006,
so to me that means Mfg. date Jan of 2000 unless i am missing something
and yes I know about the 2003 requirement but American was making fvir wtr/htrs in 1999


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

JERRYMAC said:


> I am retired because the V.A. and S.S. rate me as *1**20%* permanently disabled *,*
> *but I do keep up *on the new products,
> I have the tools and the know how but I can not do
> the labor parts anymore and since this is for my girlfriend I want to help out I am not going out to
> make money :laughing:


 







*120%? Is that gov't math??*



*Sorry, I know I'm.....fftopic:*


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

Have a sheet metal company make a pan to accommodate each heater. This way you can make the pans higher, have a better drain and put the copper drain where you want it. While doing this is good an alarm would be a great addition should the pan get water in them. As far as tankless vs tank, they both hold water so....is one really any better than the other when it leaks? The tankless heaters do have their own pans.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

JERRYMAC said:


> The beginning code on the water heaters is 1006,
> so to me that means Mfg. date Jan of 2000 unless i am missing something
> and yes I know about the 2003 requirement but American was making fvir wtr/htrs in 1999


 Oct. 2006


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

you all really need to keep up.nothing wrong with tankless.flush them once a yr the keep up and a pan under the heater works ,providing it is properly installed.but it can get ugly fast.
all this negative on tankless.there easy to in stall in or out they work residental or commercial. join us in 2013


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

heeterman1 said:


> you all really need to keep up.nothing wrong with tankless.flush them once a yr the keep up and a pan under the heater works ,providing it is properly installed.but it can get ugly fast.
> all this negative on tankless.there easy to in stall in or out they work residental or commercial. join us in 2013


Let us see....why do you like them vs a tank? I would like to know. Maybe you would want to start a separate thread?


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

heeterman1 said:


> you all really need to keep up.nothing wrong with tankless.flush them once a yr the keep up and a pan under the heater works ,providing it is properly installed.but it can get ugly fast.
> all this negative on tankless.there easy to in stall in or out they work residental or commercial. join us in 2013


My only beef with tankless , is people think they are going to save a bunch of money in power bills.
By the time I up grade their gas service and install the tankless , they could have paid for 3 or 4 50 gallon tanks.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> My only beef with tankless , is people think they are going to save a bunch of money in power bills.
> By the time I up grade their gas service and install the tankless , they could have paid for 3 or 4 50 gallon tanks.


and then...:detective:


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

JERRYMAC said:


> The beginning code on the water heaters is 1006,
> so to me that means Mfg. date Jan of 2000 unless i am missing something
> and yes I know about the 2003 requirement but American was making fvir wtr/htrs in 1999


The first # 10 is the month 06 the yr


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

Gettinit said:


> Have a sheet metal company make a pan to accommodate each heater. This way you can make the pans higher, have a better drain and put the copper drain where you want it. While doing this is good an alarm would be a great addition should the pan get water in them. As far as tankless vs tank, they both hold water so....is one really any better than the other when it leaks? The tankless heaters do have their own pans.


good point


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

*tankless*



AlbacoreShuffle said:


> My only beef with tankless , is people think they are going to save a bunch of money in power bills.
> By the time I up grade their gas service and install the tankless , they could have paid for 3 or 4 50 gallon tanks.


if you have a gas tank heater not much upgrade.i will admit it does cost more to first install.especially if you dont use a condensing type the stainless venting is high dollar i go exterior. no venting.
customers love the space they gain


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

heeterman1 said:


> if you have a gas tank heater not much upgrade.i will admit it does cost more to first install.especially if you dont use a condensing type the stainless venting is high dollar i go exterior. no venting.
> customers love the space they gain


 
and the fact that they will never run out of hot water


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

heeterman1 said:


> if you have a gas tank heater not much upgrade.i will admit it does cost more to first install.especially if you dont use a condensing type the stainless venting is high dollar i go exterior. no venting.
> customers love the space they gain


Maybe not on the gas if it were a 2# setup. Otherwise... There is still the issue with getting power up there for most tankless heaters. Tanks should be checked once a year. If water is hard you almost have to do the maintenance on tankless. Tankless has an AFUE up to .XX but that is at low fire.


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

Tommy plumber said:


> *120%? Is that gov't math??*
> 
> 
> 
> *Sorry, I know I'm.....fftopic:*


Yes I know it is Gov. math when you add up the different percentages for different disability's
that is what you come out with 120% :thumbsup:


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

This attic is build like a mechanical room their is 
hard wood planking across all the ceiling joists 
all the HVAC equipment is set up here,
The water heaters are in drain safety pans with drains run to the outside of the house,
The t&p's drain though 3/4" CPVC to the drain pans
there is a 3/4" gas feed that is split with a 
1/2"x1/2"x3/4" bullhead tee, 
But if we put a tankless style in it will go on the outside of the house close as possible to where the gas meter is,
she likes the ideal of unlimited hot water,
she had one in her previous house,
And with the heater on the outside no worry about water damages from one of the tanks giving way and over flooding the drain pans


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

heeterman1 said:


> The first # 10 is the month 06 the yr


Thanks I am rusted on s/n dating I knew it did not seem right !
This are very clean looking wtr/htrs like they were just put in last week,
so with a Oct 06, date 3 adults living in the house
taking up to 4.5 showers a day plus laundry, and the 
dish washer twice week moderate hard water how
long would you give on the life of the heaters
remember they are in series so the first heater is doing most of the work


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Ship me UPS down there for a few cables and I'll do it all. 


New heaters for new cables. Ain't got no money! I'm po po.


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

JERRYMAC said:


> This attic is build like a mechanical room their is
> hard wood planking across all the ceiling joists
> all the HVAC equipment is set up here,
> The water heaters are in drain safety pans with drains run to the outside of the house,
> ...


I like installing thrm outside thr only thing you need to keep in mind.thou are dealing with a small heat exchanger sp you need tp set your temp tp 130 f or you will get a cold water sandwich,dp to pressure drop


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

heeterman1 said:


> I like installing thrm outside thr only thing you need to keep in mind.thou are dealing with a small heat exchanger sp you need tp set your temp tp 130 f or you will get a cold water sandwich,dp to pressure drop


:no:


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

Even if you move the location outside and install a tankless there might not be enough BTU's. lets say you install a 9.8 gpm unit that requires a load up to 199,900 BTU's. if the home has 2 HVAC units there is almost no way it will have enough gas to still power the HVAC units during the winter. You have to do a Gas line drawing of the whole house and don't forget to add up and down lengths and yard. 

My concern is you have the "sons" doing the work. Do you really trust them with gas work??


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

johntheplumber said:


> Even if you move the location outside and install a tankless there might not be enough BTU's. lets say you install a 9.8 gpm unit that requires a load up to 199,900 BTU's. if the home has 2 HVAC units there is almost no way it will have enough gas to still power the HVAC units during the winter. You have to do a Gas line drawing of the whole house and don't forget to add up and down lengths and yard.
> 
> My concern is you have the "sons" doing the work. Do you really trust them with gas work??


Good point you do need to add sll btu


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

heeterman1 said:


> Good point you do need to add sll btu


I would not let jusy anyone touch gas


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

Yes I know gas work and the sizing tables,
that is one reason if I do a Tankless it will be on the outside of house close to the "GAS" meter,
with enough BTU'S to handle their hot water loads :thumbsup:


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

JERRYMAC said:


> Yes I know gas work and the sizing tables,
> that is one reason if I do a Tankless it will be on the outside of house close to the "GAS" meter,
> with enough BTU'S to handle their hot water loads :thumbsup:


You will still be adding 200k btu to the load whether its inside or closer to the meter. If it is not upgraded to a 2lb system it can still have probs a couple years down the road.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

johntheplumber said:


> You will still be adding 200k btu to the load whether its inside or closer to the meter. If it is not upgraded to a 2lb system it can still have probs a couple years down the road.


And what makes you think his meter or a larger meter wouldn't handle the load?


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

johntheplumber said:


> Even if you move the location outside and install a tankless there might not be enough BTU's. lets say you install a 9.8 gpm unit that requires a load up to 199,900 BTU's. if the home has 2 HVAC units there is almost no way it will have enough gas to still power the HVAC units during the winter. You have to do a Gas line drawing of the whole house and don't forget to add up and down lengths and yard.
> 
> My concern is you have the "sons" doing the work. Do you really trust them with gas work??



If he ties into the meter like he wants and the meter is large enough he only needs to maybe, maybe up the size until his tee for the tankless. Where are you guys coming up with thus stuff?


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

Gettinit said:


> If he ties into the meter like he wants and the meter is large enough he only needs to maybe, maybe up the size until his tee for the tankless. Where are you guys coming up with thus stuff?


Yes, if the meter is large enough and the perfect storm hits then he might not need to do a thing. If you have a standard meter with 4 oz of pressure than adding 200k BTU to the system, no mater where it is installed could drain the load. Most gas meters in DFW are not at the house anyway. They are at the end of the drive way.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

johntheplumber said:


> Yes, if the meter is large enough and the perfect storm hits then he might not need to do a thing. If you have a standard meter with 4 oz of pressure than adding 200k BTU to the system, no mater where it is installed could drain the load. Most gas meters in DFW are not at the house anyway. They are at the end of the drive way.


Never heard of them being at the road. Never heard of the gas being less than a 1/4 # either. Many manifolds need 3.5"-4.0" so...OK. I see where you are coming from then but its still ridiculous to be that low.


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

johntheplumber said:


> Yes, if the meter is large enough and the perfect storm hits then he might not need to do a thing. If you have a standard meter with 4 oz of pressure than adding 200k BTU to the system, no mater where it is installed could drain the load. Most gas meters in DFW are not at the house anyway. They are at the end of the drive way.


*Yes that is what I loved about SO. CAL. so many main gas lines to replace, as while as water service, and sewer main lines :thumbup:*


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

Gettinit said:


> Never heard of them being at the road. Never heard of the gas being less than a 1/4 # either. Many manifolds need 3.5"-4.0" so...OK. I see where you are coming from then but its still ridiculous to be that low.


In north Texas standard residential gas pressure is 4 ounces or 1/4 pound. Most meters in homes built before the mid 90's are at the end of the driveway or in the back alley 30-100 feet away.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

johntheplumber said:


> In north Texas standard residential gas pressure is 4 ounces or 1/4 pound. Most meters in homes built before the mid 90's are at the end of the driveway or in the back alley 30-100 feet away.


1/4 pound of gas is 7"


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## Catlin987987 (Nov 12, 2010)

we run 5-9 in Alberta, gas company aims for 7"WC


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

johntheplumber said:


> You will still be adding 200k btu to the load whether its inside or closer to the meter. If it is not upgraded to a 2lb system it can still have probs a couple years down the road.


i agree


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

florida 1/2 psi never at the road.you still need to size the line and need to know total btus.if you have 2 psi you need regulators


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## heeterman1 (Feb 12, 2013)

*lochinvar sheild*

had a sheild 200 100 had a loud rattle sounded like soething was in the burner.the fan was fine,the pump was fine. i cleaned the burner and heatexchanger,it needed it not done been in 4 yrs.it was the T and P probe ready to fall off.


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## sjaquay (Jan 13, 2013)

johntheplumber said:


> In north Texas standard residential gas pressure is 4 ounces or 1/4 pound. Most meters in homes built before the mid 90's are at the end of the driveway or in the back alley 30-100 feet away.


here, there are some remote meters near the road, but most of them are on the outside of the home, gas co are making ppl move them from inside the home, or near the street, to the outside of the home. weve gotten our share of those, sometimes can be a real pia...


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