# Grid Stainers, Drainage Problems?



## mdaniels (Jul 13, 2009)

I'm stumped and wonder if anyone else has had this happen to them? And if so, what the solution was to fix it. A employee installed a vessel sink with a grid drain at a customers house. When put back into service and ran with cold water, the sink drains fine. When hot water is ran, the bowl backs up and drains slowly?! I am completely stumped! Can anyone shed any light on this phenomenom?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Welcome!
Grid drains are problematic in this area. The total area of the holes does not even come close to the diameter of the drain tubing and becoming air bound between the water in the bowl and the water in the trap is part of it..
I'm not sure why the hot has a bigger problem than the cold could be flow rates or, maybe just the addition of steam into the equation.

Frequently when a customer complains about drainage from a grid drain I drill out the holes slightly larger and it does seem to help.

Given a choice I would go with a lift and turn drain on a vessel sink...
This tends to avoid the problematic grid drain.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

mdaniels said:


> I'm stumped and wonder if anyone else has had this happen to them? And if so, what the solution was to fix it. A employee installed a vessel sink with a grid drain at a customers house. When put back into service and ran with cold water, the sink drains fine. When hot water is ran, the bowl backs up and drains slowly?! I am completely stumped! Can anyone shed any light on this phenomenom?


 Unless the hots flowing at a higher rate it shouldn't make a difference on the temp. The drain should be able to drain 2.5 gpm. I'd clean the drain and adjust to 2.5 max gpm when both Hot and cold are used and see what happens. Hot vs cold shouldn't make a difference.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

I think with the sink not having an overflow maybe part of the problem too.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> I think with the sink not having an overflow maybe part of the problem too.


 I hooked up a lav today with an overlow and it had a 1.5" pvc sch 40 trap and when I filled it and dumped the water,you could here it sucking air through the overflow. So i for sure agree with you on that as today was a prime example. I bet the water hits the drain dead center! The original post isn't logical based on the water temp alone.:no:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Grid strainers are problemmatic, I have encountered this problem also. :yes:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Grid strainers are problemmatic, I have encountered this problem also. :yes:


 Overflow wouldn't work well with the drain pictured above would it?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

That one above is for vessel sinks only, I'd use that one over a grid any day, try this next time, cover the grid and allow sink to fill up, remove cover and see how fast the water leaves the bowl.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> That one above is for vessel sinks only, I'd use that one over a grid any day, try this next time, cover the grid and allow sink to fill up, remove cover and see how fast the water leaves the bowl.


ok will do but wouldn't that be the samething as a bathtub strainer wilth all the holes in it?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

No the bathtub has an overflow. Vessels don't.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

So why do plumbing codes allow grid drains if they are problematic?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

I have seen grid strainers in a commercial setting in there lav sinks, they are there to keep the garbage out of the trap, I have seen commercial lavs have a problem with water leaving the sinks, but that was only causes of the grimes that had collected within the strainers tailpiece, solved these by cleaning them out, you can almost bet it is the overflow that plays a role in how it drains.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

cuz your not supposed to have a stopper on a lav without an overflow. but some inspectors allow it.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

I will do the test but I wanna do one with my grid drain ok.....heres a picture of it 
http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww175/Waxsealer/kohlergriddrain002.jpg


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> cuz your not supposed to have a stopper on a lav without an overflow. but some inspectors allow it.


 I was getting to that!:laughing:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Is it an overflow type? The picture is dark.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Is it an overflow type? The picture is dark.


doesnt look like it is


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

put a .5 gpm aerator on there. That'll take care of it.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Is it an overflow type? The picture is dark.


 Yes it has arrangements for the overflow but if thats not allowed for the test i can tape those off! let me know what you want.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

oh, I can see the overflow now.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

You can try it for the test, not sure how it will do, I'm saying try it on a connected sink that is connected to the trap as well.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> You can try it for the test, not sure how it will do, I'm saying try it on a connected sink that is connected to the trap as well.


 Thats what i plan to do! Should i close off the overflow ports in the grid drain or not for the test? The lavatory will have an overflow. but I can close off those holes for the test.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Sure try it, with them closed off, but you should do it with a grid strainer that does not have an overflow option, this way there is no what if situations, which could cause the test to not work as planned.....


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

I would cover the holes on the grid drain and or cover the overflow on the lav with putty or something. But i'm sure that's the problem. We install tons of vessels with grid drains and they all do it.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> I would cover the holes on the grid drain and or cover the overflow on the lav with putty or something. But i'm sure that's the problem. We install tons of vessels with grid drains and they all do it.


 I'll use this one for the test
http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww175/Waxsealer/decolavgriddrain.jpg
No overflow ports and its made for a vessel sink....or thats what the package said.....I need to learn how to post a video!


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

not that it would matter but i would still putty over the overflow on the lav. just for extra security


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> not that it would matter but i would still putty over the overflow on the lav. just for extra security


 I just decided to go all out and use a lav without an overflow......feeling frisky i guess!
http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww175/Waxsealer/delafronteralavatory.jpg


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

IMHO Vessel Sinks....

Some of the worst ideas in plumbing survive by being fashionable...:whistling2:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Redwood said:


> IMHO Vessel Sinks....
> 
> Some of the worst ideas in plumbing survive by being fashionable...:whistling2:


I agree they are just another fad. the one in the pic I posted is made out of marble...I thought it was travertime but found out different. It can be installed as a vessel or as a drop in lav.....its standard 19" round. Ever see a totally pyrex type glass pedestal lavatory...including the leg???? i will post a pic in a few minutes of it. very cool........Ok here it is
http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww175/Waxsealer/BluePedestallav.jpg


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Geez, how long does it take to build a lav? It's not like you have to put a faucet on it.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> Geez, how long does it take to build a lav? It's not like you have to put a faucet on it.


 I'm not doin the test tonight:no: nacy grace just came on


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## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

Did the original poster say if his vessal had an overflow or not? if it did and he used a grid strainer i would see if the over flow was clogged with something like putty. I have seen commerical sinks with gris strainers drain slow from plugged overflows. So i would agree with you guys on the thought that If it has no overflow that is whats going on.


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## A Good Plumber (Jun 18, 2008)

If you remove the trap, put a bucket under it, fill the sink and let it out. It will flow like any other drain. 

The back pressure from the trap cannot be relieved through the holes fast enough when it's connectec to the trap.

The first time you ran the water through the grid, it probably drained quickly until the trap filled.

The overflow in a lavy definitly allows the air the vent and the grid drain to work properly.

I would suggest a twist and turn or a tip-toe type drain.


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## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

I had a vessel sink with one of the click open click closed like on the tubs. When you filled the vessel then opened it the water racing down would close the stopper hehe.


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