# Drip leg before the gas cock?



## Jklsr55

Hey,
Is other anywhere in the UPC or the Uniform Mechanical Code that states the gas cock must be inline before the drip leg? On a typical single appliance install I run the pipe to the fixture, bullhead a tee with the drip leg coming out the bottom, continuing out the top with the gas cock and union before the appliance. I've never failed an inspection due to piping this way. Thoughts?


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## mccmech

W,Wh,What the F are you saying?!!!! First off, if yer running the pipe to the fixture and you "bull nose" the drip leg down, then the run through of your tee is in a horizontal position. How the HELL do you continue off the "top" with the valve & union?!!!!! I ain't the brightest guy but please explain what the tees you use look like. That said, drip legs shall be at the base of risers and at the bottom of drops that feed fixtures. Also, what if you had to empty or replace the drip leg? What good is the valve after the drip leg, unless you enjoy changing stuff out on the fly or don't mind re-lighting other appliances, as the need may arise.


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## 504Plumber

mccmech said:


> W,Wh,What the F are you saying?!!!! First off, if yer running the pipe to the fixture and you "bull nose" the drip leg down, then the run through of your tee is in a horizontal position. How the HELL do you continue off the "top" with the valve & union?!!!!! I ain't the brightest guy but please explain what the tees you use look like. That said, drip legs shall be at the base of risers and at the bottom of drops that feed fixtures. Also, what if you had to empty or replace the drip leg? What good is the valve after the drip leg, unless you enjoy changing stuff out on the fly or don't mind re-lighting other appliances, as the need may arise.


 .... Doesn't seem that difficult to me unless you've never heard of bull heading a tee. No use in putting a drip if the gas cock is after IMO. 

Quick ISO: -----|


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## Tommy plumber

I install the gas shut-off first, then the dirt leg next before anything else. In that order, any trash won't enter the regulator or appliance. And the gas cock is always first, that's just common sense to be able to shut the equipment down to service it.


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## Jklsr55

mccmech said:


> W,Wh,What the F are you saying?!!!! First off, if yer running the pipe to the fixture and you "bull nose" the drip leg down, then the run through of your tee is in a horizontal position. How the HELL do you continue off the "top" with the valve & union?!!!!! I ain't the brightest guy but please explain what the tees you use look like. That said, drip legs shall be at the base of risers and at the bottom of drops that feed fixtures. Also, what if you had to empty or replace the drip leg? What good is the valve after the drip leg, unless you enjoy changing stuff out on the fly or don't mind re-lighting other appliances, as the need may arise.



I swear to God... You know, I get that your a senior member. But why not give someone the benefit of the doubt and an opportunity to at least reword things a little so everyone is on the same page before responding like a jerk. If my question is so beneath your contempt why waste you valuable time responding? 

Is the piping in this picture illegal in either the UPC or the Uniform Mechanical Code?


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## Jklsr55

*Another picture...*

Here is a better illustration. Let's assume instead of the bell reducer after the valve and the 90 there is a union and then a nipple to some fixture. Is this UPC compliant?


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## Jklsr55

504Plumber said:


> .... Doesn't seem that difficult to me unless you've never heard of bull heading a tee. No use in putting a drip if the gas cock is after IMO.
> 
> Quick ISO: -----|


Thanks for your response. I think it's a geographic thing. Where you are if you will. Some places have very dirty natural gas and propane suppliers from my understanding. Making the servicing of the drip leg a much needed task. I live in Montana. And in the 20 plus years I have been in the trade never once have I found even a speck of dirt in a drip leg. I agree that in any event piping the valve in line first is always best. I do a ton of RTU's where the gas is being supplied along the roof to the unit in the horizontal. It's nice to just Bullhead a tee at the end of the horizontal run and continue out the top with the valve, union etc. And of course install the drip leg out the bottom. We are not allowed while running horizontally to install a tee along the run and have the drip leg extending down from the branch.


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## mpot

It is my understanding that the drip leg must be serviceable by the appliance shut off valve.


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## 504Plumber

Jklsr55 said:


> Thanks for your response. I think it's a geographic thing. Where you are if you will. Some places have very dirty natural gas and propane suppliers from my understanding. Making the servicing of the drip leg a much needed task. I live in Montana. And in the 20 plus years I have been in the trade never once have I found even a speck of dirt in a drip leg. I agree that in any event piping the valve in line first is always best. I do a ton of RTU's where the gas is being supplied along the roof to the unit in the horizontal. It's nice to just Bullhead a tee at the end of the horizontal run and continue out the top with the valve, union etc. And of course install the drip leg out the bottom. We are not allowed while running horizontally to install a tee along the run and have the drip leg extending down from the branch.


 The only time I've had to open drips was after Katrina when water had made its way into gas mains and we had to drain them. But it seems silly to me to install a drip and not have it serviceable by the gas cock for that fixture. Almost like putting the union and gas cock next. 

I know it's easier to take a measurement to a bullheaded tee but you could always get close nipples and do the takeoff on a gascock with a close nipple...


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## Plumber

I know it's code, but I've seen plenty of new construction getting passed without drip legs. We're house hunting today, so I'll spot check some installations.

And yeah, JKL, install the shut-off before the drip leg.


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## budders

Tommy plumber said:


> I install the gas shut-off first, then the dirt leg next before anything else. In that order, any trash won't enter the regulator or appliance. And the gas cock is always first, that's just common sense to be able to shut the equipment down to service it.


 thats a nice looking job. Was it a pool heater?


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## nhmaster3015

Well, actually th mech code only says you have to have one and nothing about its relationship to the shutoff so, I suppose you can install it that way but it does make servicing the drip leg a bit of a bear.


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## jeffreyplumber

Thanks for the picture makes it more clear what your talkin about. I find very few drip legs here and install them never unless its according to detail.
It looks a little hokey but I see your point. Why bother putting it in if it doesent get used? Its allways good to know why your doing something a certain way. So I never put them on and if someone told me to put them on on I would want  to see it in writing too. that way at least you know whether its legal work or not


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## Hillside

Tommy plumber said:


> I install the gas shut-off first, then the dirt leg next before anything else. In that order, any trash won't enter the regulator or appliance. And the gas cock is always first, that's just common sense to be able to shut the equipment down to service it.


 Illegal installation here, would get called on the street fitting


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## plbgbiz

Hillside said:


> Illegal installation here, would get called on the street fitting


Why?


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## nhmaster3015

Neither the streets or the galvy would make it here.


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## plumbdrum

nhmaster3015 said:


> Neither the streets or the galvy would make it here.


We all know why no Galvy, but I've never heard anything about street fittings. Please explain, what code do you use in NH?

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## Hillside

plbgbiz said:


> Why?


Galvy because gas reacts with the zinc and flakes off, streets because it reduces inner pipe diameter, they split sometimes and are prone to loosen and leak, gas co can get away with using them here though


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## Tommy plumber

budders said:


> thats a nice looking job. Was it a pool heater?












Yes. A pool heater. Pool companies will happily install the pool heater on the pad and attach all the pool piping to it, but they tell customer to have a licensed plumber install the gas piping.


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## nhmaster3015

No bushings or close spac nipples either. And thanks hillside.


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## plbgbiz

Streets are allowed here. No bushings. No galv.


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## Stptog

Jklsr55 said:


> Here is a better illustration. Let's assume instead of the bell reducer after the valve and the 90 there is a union and then a nipple to some fixture. Is this UPC compliant?


I just dont see why anyone would pipe this way? I know this is just example for clarification, but why not put that gas cock on the horizontal with 3" nipple into the tee and a 4" nipple from tee to 90? And whats with a 10" drip leg anyways?

The only way to justify this is to say that horizontal was 24" and therefor I didnt have to thread anything but that's not justifying thats lazy :thumbsup:

(then again I havent seen anyone selling 10" nipples lately so go figure):laughing:


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## BC73RS

We had that street fitting debate at tech school, it was a gray area, the "Gas Company" could do it but we couldn't. It was considered bad piping practice in the end, if you can believe it.
Up here in B.C. we have a gas safety code as well as a gas code, one says no streets and the other says streets are bad practice, go figure.
Confided with an inspector one day and he said " I let you do it because I know your work is tested and won't leak, but not for most anybody else. Go figure.


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## Will

plbgbiz said:


> Streets are allowed here. No bushings. No galv.



I've never tried, but who is saying no to galvanized on gas in oklahoma?


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## plbgbiz

Will said:


> I've never tried, but who is saying no to galvanized on gas in Oklahoma?


Bill Jackson for OKC. As far as I know, it is the same for all other municipalities as well.

It has to do with the properties of the NG we receive. Not all NG is the same. Ours will cause the galvanized coating to flake off.


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## Will

Are they requireing outside black steel to be painted like they do in Norman? I do quite a few pool heaters and running galvanized steel would remove the painting process .


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## plbgbiz

We usually paint exterior gas on commercial. Risers that is.

I have never painted anything on a roof.


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## Will

You do a job in Norman outside, it has to be painted


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## GrtLksPlbr

Around here-

Valve before the drip leg, black pipe on gas - no galv. Street fittings are typically fine, bushings used to be a no-no, but that changed about 10 years ago. Black pipe must be painted if used outdoors. I've seen lots of inspections failed for not painting it and sealing the penetration into the building.


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## supakingDFW

Hey guys, there's a difference between a drip leg and a sediment trap. A drip leg is used where "wet" gas exists, and would be installed where condensate could collect. Most modern gas supplies and distribution systems are typically dry...Sediment traps are used to protect appliance gas controls from dirt, pipe chips, pipe joint tapes and compounds and other debris that could enter the system during storage, handling, installation or repairs. Sediment traps are designed to be installed vertically with the supply coming in from the top and causing the gas flow to change 90 degrees to the appliance and debris to drop out of the gas flow to the nipple below...And the guys above are right, it must be installed downstream of the appliance shutoff. Hope this helps


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## plumbdrum

supakingDFW said:


> Hey guys, there's a difference between a drip leg and a sediment trap. A drip leg is used where "wet" gas exists, and would be installed where condensate could collect. Most modern gas supplies and distribution systems are typically dry...Sediment traps are used to protect appliance gas controls from dirt, pipe chips, pipe joint tapes and compounds and other debris that could enter the system during storage, handling, installation or repairs. Sediment traps are designed to be installed vertically with the supply coming in from the top and causing the gas flow to change 90 degrees to the appliance and debris to drop out of the gas flow to the nipple below...And the guys above are right, it must be installed downstream of the appliance shutoff. Hope this helps


You are correct about drip/sediment traps, but according to NFPA 54 (if that's what you use) it does not say that sediment trap has to be installed downstream of valve, although good practice, it just says installed as close to the inlet of equipment as practical.

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## NH Rob

NFPA 54 2009 
section 9.6.7
"where a sediment trap is not incorporated as a part of the appliance, a sediment trap SHALL be installed downstream of the appliance shutoff valve as close to the inlet of the appliance as practical..."


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## plumbdrum

Ma is working off 2005 until the end of the year, wording is differnt

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## mpot

plbgbiz said:


> Why?


In my parts st fittings are illegal on gas. As are plugs and close nipples. It's because you could technically bury the threads. No stops. 

I'm also not allowed to have a drip leg outside. The moisture could freeze... All appliances inside minus the stove typically get one by me. The gas isn't moisture rich any longer but some guys LOVE the cutting oil !


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## Redwood

Drip Leg before the Gas Cock... Fail! :yes:

NFPA 54 Fuel Gas Code.... 2012


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## Tommy plumber

mpot said:


> *In my parts st fittings are illegal on gas. *As are *plugs* and *close nipples*. It's because you could technically bury the threads. No stops.
> 
> I'm also not allowed to have a drip leg outside. The moisture could freeze... All appliances inside minus the stove typically get one by me. The gas isn't moisture rich any longer but some guys LOVE the cutting oil !












Interesting idea that close nipples are prohibited. I suppose that an over-zealous plumber could bugger up the threads on a close nipple while tightening it without another fitting on it. In other words, if he is careless enough to tighten the close nipple by putting his wrench jaws directly on the threads instead of putting a fitting on the threads and then his wrench on the fitting.


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## jmc12185

Tommy plumber said:


> Interesting idea that close nipples are prohibited. I suppose that an over-zealous plumber could bugger up the threads on a close nipple while tightening it without another fitting on it. In other words, if he is careless enough to tighten the close nipple by putting his wrench jaws directly on the threads instead of putting a fitting on the threads and then his wrench on the fitting.


 I think it has more to do with the close nipple being entire threads the whole way. Meaning the entire length is thinned out because of it being all thread and no pipe.

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## jmc12185

We are not allowed to use close nipples on meter sets for 600 btu meters and above.

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## BC73RS

We have never been allowed to use close nipples on gas and probably never will be.


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## jeffreyplumber

Ive been taught not to use streets, or close nipples. I too have been given the reason so not to mess up threads, and so you dont bottom 2 fittings against each other. Of course a shoulder nipple is just fine to use! Also been told you cant use bushings or gal. I think you can use both bushings must be exposed and galvonized fittings or pipe can be used extensively in gas piping. Ive been told the galvie will flake and plug oriffices and that its illegal, but seen it used a lot in 30years


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