# Residential sewage pump system



## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

I had a job today, to try to find out why a "sump pump" (customers words) was not working. In a basement. In Bakersfield, which is very rare. The system is handling two toilets and lav sinks, bar sink, and condensate from a/c. Something that doesn't look right to me is the outlet for the pump is 2", and is plumbed into a union, then a check valve, then a 90, runs horizontal for a couple feet, then another 90 and is bushed into a 4" line going vertical almost 8' up to the main for the upstairs portion of the house. Seems to me this thing should be 2" all the way up, as there will always be stuff standing in the pipe. I was looking on Grainger's site, and there are similar systems that say 1/2hp motor can push up to 18'. I have the pump out now, and am going to take it to the shop in the am and clean it and test it. I'm pretty sure its toast. Am I right about the 2" line? It has been working for 2 years.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Hi Mike how long have you been a service plumber? Just wondering.


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

SewerRatz said:


> Hi Mike how long have you been a service plumber? Just wondering.


20 years. Never dealt with this type of stuff before. I understand the concept, but, you just don't see it out here that much, mostly large commercial buildings have lifting stations, and I don't do large commercial. So excuse my ignorance about this. Houses here generally are built on a cement slab or raised foundation. You do see an occasional root cellar. But this house is built kind of on a bluff, so part of the house is lower than the street. Hence the sewage pump.

edit:
I clicked on your links and saw the diagram for the sewage pump system. Yup, this one is all wrong. It doesn't have any manual valve either, and I was suggesting to the ho it wouldn't be a bad idea to have one upstream of the check valve to prevent all the nastiness from falling back down if you have to service it. Also, there are two holes in the lid of the tank. One hole is the outlet, the other is 2" pipe just dropping in slightly and has bar sink, condensate, etc tied into it. So much for sealed and odorless. It stunk to high heaven anyway when I took the lid off to get the pump out. How this all passed an inspection (house is 2-4 years old) is beyond me. It was a model home for a tract.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

From the lid up should be a a swing check and shut off valve and pump up above the sewer 8-10" and the drop down in to the sewer, assuming it's a hung sewer. Should be all 2" pipe. Swing check and valve should be anywhere from 24-48" above the lid. If you have problems with sewer gas smell, silicone around the lid. Also you may want to install a higher hp pump, zoller 1hp is what I use


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

I don't have a picture of the final but this is how my 2" discharge line drops into the hung sewer


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

I'm doing the job tomorrow. I have a Zoeller 267 pump coming in. According to tech support, this is a step up from the 266 that was in there. Speaking of tech support, they were awesome. Answered every question I had. I'm getting the Zoeller check valve as well. I'm looking at the diagram on SewerRatz website links, and I might have an issue getting the 4" wye in. Think it'll be ok if I roll it in instead of straight on top? I think the main is hugging the floor joists right now. As for the gas tite seals, I even got a part number for that, its coming in a couple days, so I'll go back later and pop it in. Thanks for all your comments and help. I'll be glad when this is done. 
Oh, I forgot to mention, the check valve in there now is a standard pvc poppet type valve. (like this, but 2" http://www.bing.com/shopping/1-in-pvc-check-valve/p/E1EFC13CC56A9BD6A858?q=pvc+check+valve&lpq=pvc%20check%20valve&FORM=HURE) 
Homeowner told me Ben F. put it in 2 years ago. How much you want to bet they took a poopie shower when they pulled the old one out?


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

Michaelcookplum said:


> From the lid up should be a a swing check and shut off valve and pump up above the sewer 8-10" and the drop down in to the sewer, assuming it's a hung sewer. Should be all 2" pipe. Swing check and valve should be anywhere from 24-48" above the lid. If you have problems with sewer gas smell, silicone around the lid. Also you may want to install a higher hp pump, zoller 1hp is what I use


 I notice in your pics. looks like 4x4x2 wye where you drop in. Can I use 4x4x2 on a horizontal instead of the diagram that shows 4x4x4 bushed down? I need the space, I think.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

MikeS said:


> I notice in your pics. looks like 4x4x2 wye where you drop in. Can I use 4x4x2 on a horizontal instead of the diagram that shows 4x4x4 bushed down? I need the space, I think.


Absolutely, as long as you have it on it's back. And yes, use 4x2 wye


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## 100 Watt (Aug 11, 2011)

Code requires us (if connecting horizontally) to install a 4"x2" wye on it's back. We normally use a st. 90 out of the wye, and a combo 2" ball / check valve above the pit. 

FYI, if you use the gasket you ordered you should still apply lots of silicone. Most of the time we toss the gasket and use only slicone. 

Good luck brown arm!!:laughing:


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

100 Watt said:


> Code requires us (if connecting horizontally) to install a 4"x2" wye on it's back. We normally use a st. 90 out of the wye, and a combo 2" ball / check valve above the pit.
> 
> FYI, if you use the gasket you ordered you should still apply lots of silicone. Most of the time we toss the gasket and use only slicone.
> 
> Good luck brown arm!!:laughing:


I agree with your installation 100%


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

it is done. just got done. went in at 7:30, did a water heater install, then got an emergency call to fix a copper line some insulation guys drilled a screw thru, then finally started getting parts for the sewage job at 2 pm. On site by 3. I estimated 6 hours, I finished at 9:30, so I went over 1 1/2 hours. (picking up parts is included in the bid). Oh well, I was close. Pics are coming, charging the phone back up.
I am dog tired, and I already have 5 or 6 jobs already scheduled for tomorrow!
oh, I made a mistake too. It was 3" line, not 4. I should have took a pic when I first went out. 
edit:
oh, and the worst part.....I locked my keys in the truck again. But I did it when I got home, so, I'll deal with it in the am.


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

more pics. After I got the 3x2 tied in, I used my submersible pump to pump out the remaining liquid using my garden hose shoved in as far as it would go. It worked great, but there was still 2" of sludge at the bottom. I used my shop vac and dumped the contents into a 5 gallon Lowe's bucket. I'll spare you the pics of that nastiness. Once I got it all cleaned up, I dropped in the new pump, which I failed to take a pic of for some reason, but trust me, its a brand new Zoeller 267. I came out of the lid into a Zoeller compression flapper check valve, then 45'd over to the riser. I wanted to put the valve on the vertical, but, I did not intend to mess with the vent at all, and, I couldn't quite get past it, so, I put it where I did.


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

here is looking towards the lid, and also my tie in to the main. I tried real hard to be as good as you guys with my primer and glue, but I've never really been that good at it. But it works! One problem is they cut in the dump from the toilets about 1 " above the top of the pump, a good 18" below the rim! So, to get enough runtime, I had to cheat a little and set the float so it does back up the line, but, the toilets work fine, we flushed them like 12 times. You can hear the flapper valve slam shut when the pump stops. And I did drill the bleed hole in the pipe below the lid. Oh, and the basement shot gives you an idea of the working condition. This job was a bear, but I think its way better than before, and I hope I never have to look at it again. Well, I will when my rubber seals come in, they had to ship them seperate. So, go easy on the criticism, it was my first time, it was hard, it was messy, but its done.


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