# typical florida starter house with cpvc



## stillaround

Typical cpvc Fla. home in this area. Cpvc is not my choice but he pays on Friday and they dont change fast around here. I took a pic of the sharkbites just to incite.


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## stillaround




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## Optimus Primer

I have that same nail gun. What part of Fl are you located in?


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## GREENPLUM

Huh, you FL guys dont have to use BOCA plates on the top+bottem plates? From the pict it looks like the Washing Machine Drain is Backfalling a taste. Hey the sharkbites are cheaper than threaded adapters


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## Optimus Primer

In my area we have to use the 4x6 nail plates on the bottom plate and 2 4x6 nail plates on the top plate. The reason for 2 at the top is for nails on the crown molding. I don't think it's backfall at the washer. i think it was more of an angle. But my area in Fl you do have to put a test tee on the washer stack. Any stack that doesn't have an accessable trap needs a c.o. I was wondering why he sleeved the cpvc. maybe to know which is hot and cold. We don't have to sleeve cpvc coming through the slab. We also run a 2 inch stack at the washer for residential. 3 inch for commercial.


P.S. I'm not picking your work by no means at all. Just stating what we do in my area. looks good though


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## stillaround

Hes not quite finished , I came with a box of plates when I took the pics. Good observation. North central ( Lake City, Gainesville and surrounding).The counties vary on the plates. Columbia where this is at doesnt require the larger plates but almost everywhere else does. As far as picking..this is my new angle on the boys.." you cant do that, the guys on the forum would fry you".


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## stillaround

We dont have to water test the top out here...its like heaven.


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## GREENPLUM

Do those "air chamber" things on the tub valve,lavs,ect, do anything. Ive done it before but it was because I ran out of 90' s


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## Protech

typical crap florida home. I like the sharkbite on the roman tub and the studor under the window. Your going to make some service plumber very happy at the expense of the homeowner:thumbsup:


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## stillaround

Protech said:


> typical crap florida home. I like the sharkbite on the roman tub and the studor under the window. Your going to make some service plumber very happy at the expense of the homeowner:thumbsup:


 Thanks for the thoughtful evaluation.......Ill be the service plumber thank you. I started these 19 or 20 years ago and get very few copper leaks or faucet problems. The studor vents and cpvc is newer and the jury is still out but I suspect there will be years of trouble free service. As far as the sharkbites, I get a thrill knowing so many plumbers of self renown think they are a time bomb....all the more reason to use them. Mostly septic tank issues over the years.


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## stillaround

GREENPLUM said:


> Do those "air chamber" things on the tub valve,lavs,ect, do anything. Ive done it before but it was because I ran out of 90' s


I dont know if they fill up or not. Havent had any hammer issues --mostly wells on these. Force of habit. At least one set per group and we put them in the wall at the water heater-no technical reason other than air chambers or WHA's are the bomb. I never studied enough to know where or how many is the "right" way.

The time I had a hammer issue was because of a very long straight run and 3/4 mechanical arrestors didnt fix it.


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## Protech

Also, (not your fault) They seem to be doing the famous stucco with no roof over hang thing. When you get a call in a few years about a leak but can't find one, have the exterior walls thermo-camed. Then call the GC.:yes:


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## stillaround

They do that here but this one is brick.


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## Protech

real brick? or "sprayed on brick"? It's cool if it's real brick.

I get allot of "leak" calls in davenport, FL that are stucco leaks. They built them just like your photos show with virtually no roof over hang. Every time it rains the wall gets wet and the stucco sucks up the water. I'm tellin you man they build'em cheaper and crappier every year and that's why when a GC calls me and asks if I wanna bid I say "nah, I'm good"


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## stillaround

Real, and a closer look at the house exterior pic you can barely make out the stacks of bricks but they are there. Lake City does alot of brick and hardy board. Head south and the hardy board and stucco seems to get more predominant.


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## uaplumber

Air chambers do work, expecially on "fast closing" valves such as single handle t&s valves. However, the water will absorb the water after a while. When this happens you need to empty the lines and allow air in. Then they will work again.Water hammer is not really a problem with pex. (cough, cough)
But chambers are a good practice anyways.


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## Protech

^^^^^^^^:yes:


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## Plasticman

All looks good. Got a question or two, or a thought that is....
Here in Tally, we don't have to have a 3" stack. All is required is one 2" somewhere in the system. ( Fla. building code ) 
Also, we here can not install a 1/4 bend directly on top of a sanitary tee and connect a studor vent there. We can not 90 a vent unless it is 6 inches above the flood rim of the fixture.
We just reduce the two inch to 1-1/2 above the slab, stub out in the cabinet using a 1/4 bend. Then on the trim out, we install an 1-1/2 san tee on its back and the studor of course goes vertical but must be at least 4 inches above the trap. Then the trap is connected to the front of the tee. The inspectors here usually require what the manufacturers recommendations are. The recommendations for a studor vent is printed on the package and it does say to install at least 4 inches or more above the trap. Some jurisdictions are different but it was our understanding that the new Florida building code was supposed to be inforced the same way in each county with no differences, except for I think Duval and I think, Broward county.
I was told in cont. ed class that if an inspector says to you he wants 100 psi test done, when Fla. code only requires 50, that he is actually breaking the law and you could protest it. I don't know if thats true, just is what the instructor was saying.
I don't cut down anyones work. I just am saying how different it is in each county.
Keep the pictures coming. Very interesting to view other folks plumbing work.


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## stillaround

Dont need a 3" stack here either. It may have been his way of making sure he runs 3" for w/m drain. Have had sudsing issues and gurgles with toilets nearby. For a while I had them separate the wm drain to avoid it--also if they add a laundry tub later some counties (Alachua) wanted 3" waste. I dont know what code is now(2004) but I have to buy 2007 so Ill read it again then. And no perceived offense at all . If somethings off I want to hear otherwise I wouldnt post it. Im not particularly proud of this work--just an example of typical Florida here anyway. I guess we get away with the 90. I think my son is tired of drilling through 7 2X4's on an exterior wall. Only 4 2X4s whatever.1/8 bend on the vent would be an easy workaround.I used to do it that way with the tee but it sometimes gets cramped with the extra tee from back to front.


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## Plasticman

yea here we can't drill a hole larger than 7/8 inch in a 2x4 stud on a weight bearing wall unless the stud is doubled up. And I think no more than 2 can be drilled so if we have double lavs on an outside wall, we add an extra stack and keep them as close to center of lavs as possible.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

I had an inspector tell me in carabelle once that came over from Panama city that i couldn't run my cpvc in the same ditch lines as my Draingage lines in the slab of a clubhouse that i roughed in. I scratched my head at that one. Anybody else in FL came across this?


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## Optimus Primer

Plasticman said:


> yea here we can't drill a hole larger than 7/8 inch in a 2x4 stud on a weight bearing wall unless the stud is doubled up. And I think no more than 2 can be drilled so if we have double lavs on an outside wall, we add an extra stack and keep them as close to center of lavs as possible.


 
What part of Florida is that? Personally I think every plumbing wall should be a 6". If you ever have to run a waste arm and water lines through the wall, you just end up drilling to much of the wall away.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Thats here in tally. I do all my double lavs on a load baring wall the same way as Plasticman described. i stack for each lav. Plus, drilling holes suck anyways.


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## Optimus Primer

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I had an inspector tell me in carabelle once that came over from Panama city that i couldn't run my cpvc in the same ditch lines as my Draingage lines in the slab of a clubhouse that i roughed in. I scratched my head at that one. Anybody else in FL came across this?


 
No but I learned that running a sch 40 sewer and a sch 40 water service can be in the same ditch without stepping it. As long as it's the same sch pipe its ok. Of course I found out after I ran a 3034 sewer that was about 300 feet then backfilled it after inspection, then dug the next ditch 5 feet away to do the water service.


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## Optimus Primer

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Thats here in tally. I do all my double lavs on a load baring wall the same way as Plasticman described. i stack for each lav. Plus, drilling holes suck anyways.


 
I hate it when someone stubs up 2 water lines in the center of the wall on a rough, say for to lavs. then you have to run them through the wall around stacks or conduit or whatever else is in the way. it takes less time to dig the ditch just a little further and lay the pipe where it needs to go compared to drilling all the studs and running through the wall.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Had a guy at a company that i worked for that was famous for that type of BS. 2 3/4 lines for a whole bathroom group. Never roughed for the icemaker, like to add more vents then required. Standard hall bathroom, and he'd have two stacks in the damn thing EVERYTIME. Really would piss me off. Wet venting is cool and legal here. I think he didn't really know how to rough.


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## Optimus Primer

sounds like that guy i posted about the 20 year plumber. our estimater draws in on the framing page a layout for the plumbing for bidding purposes. And the 20 year plumber wouldn't be able to rough in if it wasn't drawn in. Then I went to go do a sewer on one of his roughs and he stubbed out of the house about 4 feet from an oak tree thats about 4 feet wide. I went back and told the boss I wasnt doing the sewer and told him why. He said ok. But I asked the guy why he stubbed it out in front of that tree and he said it was drawn in that way. Like the estimater goes out to look at a lot a house is going to sit on and see where every tree is at. That guy was a freaking idiot.


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## Protech

This is just one of the many reasons I don't do new construction. It's all about just how fast and cheap it can be done. What's best for the HO and what will last the longest and/or be easiest to service isn't even a consideration. IMHO, it's this "f#$k it, just get it done" attitude that is running our whole country into the ground and why we can't keep pace with the Japs and Europeans. My .02


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## stillaround

house plumber said:


> I hate it when someone stubs up 2 water lines in the center of the wall on a rough, say for to lavs. then you have to run them through the wall around stacks or conduit or whatever else is in the way. it takes less time to dig the ditch just a little further and lay the pipe where it needs to go compared to drilling all the studs and running through the wall.


It depends. I like to get out of the 1st rough as fast as possible. They screw up things and walls. 2 pipes to move is easier than 4 or 6. I also wanted less copper in the ground looped when doing copper. Those 1/16 bends offset the 2" and after a few quick holes it slides thru. Most plumbers that are original Floridians do it like you said.
Also the framers are not kind to extra pipes. The lay their pattern and "watch out" anything that is in its way. Timing wise hole drilling 1" is not that time consuming if your in a groove on it.


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## stillaround

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I had an inspector tell me in carabelle once that came over from Panama city that i couldn't run my cpvc in the same ditch lines as my Draingage lines in the slab of a clubhouse that i roughed in. I scratched my head at that one. Anybody else in FL came across this?


 Yeah, they dont want that here and crossing over any waste pipe has to be insulated.


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## Plasticman

Sometimes we take shortcuts roughing a slab. Such as not running waterpipe to each individual fixture and just roughing a 3/4 hot and cold, mostly cause we have several slabs ready at one time and the builder is on your case to get er done. And its fixing to rain and you are on a tight schedule. If not for those circumstances, I would take my time on the slab and reduce the tubset time by piping the individual fixtures. Yes, I admit, it has dawned on me on a top out, "why the hell did you do this?" but hey, I did 3 roughs in one day. That my friends is one helluva paycheck!!!!


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

stillaround said:


> Yeah, they dont want that here and crossing over any waste pipe has to be insulated.


I think that is a little insane. This guy was the first and only time i have ever heard such BS. you cant lay it in the same ditch, but you can tape the lines to the stack when you roll up. The odds of a waste line, and a water line busting at the same time, right beside each other, and then waste water getting into that pressured water line, blowing out like crazy, and letting waste water in has got to be pretty common then i guess. NOT.:laughing:


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## Plasticman

Btw Rock, Carrabelle inspectors uhh, well. I will shut up while I am ahead..


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Re-read post, carreblle has no commercial plumbing inspectors, this guy came from panama city to inspect this clubhouse.


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## Plasticman

They had me use armaflex intead of plastisleeve because he said cpvc expanded and contracted too much. Cpvc by code does NOT have to be sleeved. I should have protested that one.


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## Plasticman

re-read? I am on beer 9. Its hard enough to focus as it is. :laughing:


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## Optimus Primer

Plasticman said:


> Sometimes we take shortcuts roughing a slab. Such as not running waterpipe to each individual fixture and just roughing a 3/4 hot and cold, mostly cause we have several slabs ready at one time and the builder is on your case to get er done. And its fixing to rain and you are on a tight schedule. If not for those circumstances, I would take my time on the slab and reduce the tubset time by piping the individual fixtures. Yes, I admit, it has dawned on me on a top out, "why the hell did you do this?" but hey, I did 3 roughs in one day. That my friends is one helluva paycheck!!!!


 
piece work?


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## Plasticman

If you know fla code good enough and know that you know your sh==, then I think we should protest some of their bullskate. I just ain't had the time or the ball-s


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## Plasticman

piece work? What are you talking about? I did those 3 slabs with only 3 helpers. Me, myself, and I.  And I aint' no teen ager either.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Challenge them if you want too. I make them show me in the code book where they get there desicion making skills on an inspection. 75% of the time, it works every time. Go ahead and marinate on that for a minute PMan.


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## Optimus Primer

my boss did that with some other local plumbers. They went up to tally and complained to whoever. Later that year, my boss got hit with some kind of a rare audit. But he's always calling the building dept and trying to straighten them out. aw man. 


I just hit 100 posts. In a month, i should get a t shirt or something.


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## Plasticman

I had an inspector, local county , I won't say ( unless in a pm ) , but anyway, back when we had to have at least one 3 inch stack in a building connected to any sewer or septic tank, I did this addition where the masterbath was extended. The new mb was tied in to the existing septic tank and the other existing bath supported the 3 inch stack law. Well, I had already had the slab rough approved, ( same inspector came out on topout) and called for topout inspection and this guy did not even go inside to see if the tub was full of water or anything. He just asked, " where is your 3 inch stack? Ok, tubset, he inspected the slab already and he is asking me this now. I pointed to him the stack on the hall bath sticking above the roof and he then tells me that I have to have a 3 inch stack in the master also. I asked him if he knew his codebook and told him he was wrong. He turned away really quickly and started talking about the weather while he signed the permit. All this in front of the home owner. PRICELESS!!!!


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## Optimus Primer

we had an inspector that made us put riser clamps on the top plate of a wall. That lasted about 3 months.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

house plumber said:


> we had an inspector that made us put riser clamps on the top plate of a wall. That lasted about 3 months.


WTF? are you serious?


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## Optimus Primer

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> WTF? are you serious?


 
Yeah, I can't remember all the dumb sh*t he made us do. maybe if bayside500 is reading this he can come up with a few. But the stuff he enforced like that didnt last long.


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## Optimus Primer

oh I know one I think he did. We would have to get a water closet flange inspection. Either on tubset or on trim. 1st day of trim we would have to put flanges on then get them inspected the next day. Then we can set the water closets. That one lasted awhile though. it wasn't even to test them. It was just to see if they were approved or not.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

One that gets me in wakulla county here in FL, they want you to concrete your tub box holes back in after you set the tubs on a stack out. That one kinda blows my mind.


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## Optimus Primer

I'd like to know where these inspectors come up with this stuff


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## Plasticman

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> One that gets me in wakulla county here in FL, they want you to concrete your tub box holes back in after you set the tubs on a stack out. That one kinda blows my mind.


Rat and or termite proofing. We used to have to staple screen wire in our cutouts for tub drains on off grades. That didn't last long either.


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## Optimus Primer

thats supposed to be the purpose of the tub boxes though. to eliminate the bug and rodent problem. As long as the soil is treated like it supposed to be and you drill a tight hole in the box. back when we used to tar the tub holes. Some plumber to his helper to tar the tub. He came back a little bit later to see the tub tarred and not the hole.


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## Plasticman

We used to have to have a termite man spray any back fill we had to bust up, as in using a tub box around a shower drain pipe and on tubset pour it back. 50 dollars for bugman to spray a shower drain, ha ha. He would sign a certificate and post it on the permit card. That too did not last long.


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## Optimus Primer

yeah I remember that too. that didnt last very long, did it?


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## Plasticman

Here they don't spray the soil any more on some homes. Instead they come back on tubset just when you get your tub in and spray that gd purple borax crap that gets all over the place, including you and all your tools. I cussed out a bug man not long ago for it. Basturd sprayed purple sh88 all over my fiberglass tubs and on my water piping. He calls me sir now.


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## stillaround

rockstarplumber said:


> one That Gets Me In Wakulla County Here In Fl, They Want You To Concrete Your Tub Box Holes Back In After You Set The Tubs On A Stack Out. That One Kinda Blows My Mind.


 Yeah, They Require That Here.


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## Optimus Primer

Plasticman said:


> Here they don't spray the soil any more on some homes. Instead they come back on tubset just when you get your tub in and spray that gd purple borax crap that gets all over the place, including you and all your tools. I cussed out a bug man not long ago for it. Basturd sprayed purple sh88 all over my fiberglass tubs and on my water piping. He calls me sir now.


Had that too. It was either green or clear. The clear stuff was really sticky and nasty. But most places still spray the slab


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## Plasticman

Our City of Quincy inspector has to be the best I have ever encountered. He is polite,easy going,and will bend over backwards to help you if he can. He is very knowledgeable and is always happy to answer any questions you may have. Just don't get on his bad side.


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## Optimus Primer

thats how they should be. not acting like the god they're not.


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## Plasticman

My main builder likes the borax on the dry in. That way he doesn't have to wait on a bug mans schedule to spray a slab, then get inspection.


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## Optimus Primer

I did notice in some pictures that they caught a few fixtures on 1/2". How many fixtures can you catch on 1/2" up there? Here we can only catch one including hose bibbs. So say there is a water closet and a lav. We bring 3/4 in the bathroom and split 1/2 to each fixture.


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## stillaround

house plumber said:


> I did notice in some pictures that they caught a few fixtures on 1/2". How many fixtures can you catch on 1/2" up there? Here we can only catch one including hose bibbs. So say there is a water closet and a lav. We bring 3/4 in the bathroom and split 1/2 to each fixture.


 No they dont push that. 2 fixtures plus a toilet. The code used to have that 20 lb. rule with everything on (or was it 12 lbs.) or something like that. With the master bath shower/whirlpool tubs 3/4 to a master shower is a must to cover yourself---but we went pex except for this one contractor whose pics these were. Everything overhead now except for islands.


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## Optimus Primer

so much for the fl plumbing code being the same then, huh? by the way, pm nathan. you just hit 250 posts


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Ill tee of of a 1/2" line for a toilet, a hose bib, or an icemaker, other than that its 3/4" x1/2" to everything else. 3/4 to the master bath shower, especially if a rinnai is invloved.


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## Optimus Primer

here toilets play a part in the hot line too. I think if you have more than 5 toilets you need a 1" hot line from the heater to the first full bath.


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## Bayside500

house plumber said:


> Yeah, I can't remember all the dumb sh*t he made us do. maybe if bayside500 is reading this he can come up with a few. But the stuff he enforced like that didnt last long.



okay, things i can remember off the top of my head........

had to use purple primer on PVC on trim inside of cabinets on trim, no way am i bringing purple primer into some $100,000+ kitchen with wood floors

had to place whirlpool tubs in garage and fill with water before installing them to check for jet leaks, which i still think is a good idea 

fill all vent stacks through roof with water on tubset to check for leaks, and we are in a years long drought and they want everyone to save water

have had to hydrostaic test PVC water services, even though you can look at the meter and see if it leaking

i did a 1-1/2" water service one time and next day inspector came out to inspect it, it was raining so he yellow tagged it because couldn't tell it if was leaking or wqas rain in the ditch , again just look at the freaking meter to see if the little triangle is spinning.

having jobs yellow or red tagged because the proper signed print was not on job, or address not clearly visible, or some wierd ass tub that doesn't have an approved ASNI sticker.

having to label the main valve for house "main valve", we usually take a 2" PVC test cap and mark it with a black marker then wire it to the handle, real professional looking LOL

i still think we need to tar or concrete tub drain holes in concrete slabs, we did for many years in the past, but they don't now WTF ?


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Same inspector in lil ol carabelle that came over from panama city to do an inspection on mysewer main, from the club house to the tap, in the yard, failed me. Wanted me to put a head test on it. Gravity line, 180' long. I asked him why (never heard that one before) he said, "well what if there is a leak, and waste water weeps into the ground?" I said, well what about all these mobile homes in this same area on all these septic tanks? That waste water seeps into the ground.
So, I told him to come back the next day it would be ready. RSP might have put a wafer cap at the bottom of the 1/4 bend for my 5' head he required, then filled that section with water only. He showed the next day, shook the head, saw it was full and left. Checked the code book, what it said is that Sewer mains "MAY" be tested, not "SHALL".


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## Optimus Primer

thats a good idea. :thumbsup:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

hey, i said i "MAY" have put a wafer cap inthere. Not "SHALL".:laughing::whistling2:


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## Optimus Primer

:laughing:


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## Protech

I like when the building plumber pours tar in the tub box when his cpvc water risers are in the box. The oils in the tar seep into the cpvc and they will snap off at slab level in 3-5 years flooding the place. I've seen in many times:yes:


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## Plasticman

In Gadsden county we have to sleeve our drain and water stub out with a pipe larger than our stub out, when it passes through a foundation. No other jurisdiction around requires that. Used to have to have 10 ft head on drain lines there also. I don't mean 10 ft above the stub out but 10 ft above the slab. We had to make up a 3/4 pvc "pole" with 2 90's at top to make a hook , one 90 over, the other down, with a garden hose attached to be bottom, just to fill the pipe. When a big wind came up the stack would lean really bad to one side. If you didn't come back after inspection and saw it short they would pour the concrete with it leaning. 
Also had a Gadsden county inspector tell me I could not use the backing plate or plaster guard on our tub/shower valves when installed on a fiberglass tub. He wanted it strapped to 2x4's. What an idiot.


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## Optimus Primer

Plasticman said:


> In Gadsden county we have to sleeve our drain and water stub out with a pipe larger than our stub out, when it passes through a foundation. No other jurisdiction around requires that. Used to have to have 10 ft head on drain lines there also. I don't mean 10 ft above the stub out but 10 ft above the slab. We had to make up a 3/4 pvc "pole" with 2 90's at top to make a hook , one 90 over, the other down, with a garden hose attached to be bottom, just to fill the pipe. When a big wind came up the stack would lean really bad to one side. If you didn't come back after inspection and saw it short they would pour the concrete with it leaning.
> Also had a Gadsden county inspector tell me I could not use the backing plate or plaster guard on our tub/shower valves when installed on a fiberglass tub. He wanted it strapped to 2x4's. What an idiot.


Yeah we used to do that too. same set up but i put a valve on mine so it could have the valve off and go turn the water on without it spraying every where. And wth the plaster guard thing, he's a retard. Manufacturing specs even says to do it that way.


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## Plasticman

( Stillaround) I watched your avatar for at least a whole minute. Someone needs to flush now. No, WAIT!! I think that was my wallet!!! :laughing:


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## Optimus Primer

lol. i stole it off the gsxr.com forum i'm on. i figured its more appropiate here than on a motorcycle forum.


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## Bayside500

Protech said:


> I like when the building plumber pours tar in the tub box when his cpvc water risers are in the box. The oils in the tar seep into the cpvc and they will snap off at slab level in 3-5 years flooding the place. I've seen in many times:yes:


oh wow, i didn't know that


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## Optimus Primer

if chuck said that, would you believe him?


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## Plasticman

HousePlumber: I see you used Delta valves. What do you think of the new roman rough in valves? I personally think they should add at least another 3ft to those freekin adjusting screws. And how about they make phillips head instead of slotted? ARRRRRGGG :bangin:


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## Plasticman

Isn't it strange that the ac guy always wants to bum a boca plate after he darn near cuts the outside wall in half to accomodate his piping. Don't they sell them at their supply houses for a dollar or so each? Oh yea, brain fart. Plumbing code, not ac or electrical.


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## Optimus Primer

Plasticman said:


> HousePlumber: I see you used Delta valves. What do you think of the new roman rough in valves? I personally think they should add at least another 3ft to those freekin adjusting screws. And how about they make phillips head instead of slotted? ARRRRRGGG :bangin:


Yeah, i really don't care for the new delta tub valves. Plus I had to go buy an 1 1/2 tile bit after I drilled for an 1 1/4 cuz I didn't know they changed in that sense. Grohe is notorious for using slotted screws on their stuff too. I think delta needs to add another inch to their 8 inch spread lav faucets also. They aren't long enough to go through 1 1/4 granite. You have to get extensions.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Plasticman said:


> HousePlumber: I see you used Delta valves. What do you think of the new roman rough in valves? I personally think they should add at least another 3ft to those freekin adjusting screws. And how about they make phillips head instead of slotted? ARRRRRGGG :bangin:


dude, i know. Those delta roman tub valves suck. I hate them, They are garbage, and a peice of carboard tube is suppost to set the depth when your mounting on the tub deck before tile. What a PITA.:furious:


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## TheMaster

house plumber said:


> Yeah, i really don't care for the new delta tub valves. Plus I had to go buy an 1 1/2 tile bit after I drilled for an 1 1/4 cuz I didn't know they changed in that sense. Grohe is notorious for using slotted screws on their stuff too. I think delta needs to add another inch to their 8 inch spread lav faucets also. They aren't long enough to go through 1 1/4 granite. You have to get extensions.


 Oh thats no mistake...they figure if you have 1 1/4 granite then you can afford to spring for the extensions..:yes:


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## stillaround

You cant miss on the depth of the spout or the handles if you install it on the finished surface. It has a washer for the spout shank that sets the depth right where it should be. Delta finally made a press. bal cartridge that you can flip and fits all the trims.


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## stillaround

Also I insist the finished deck is in before the front is closed in. Setting a whirlpool in mud, squished down to the finished surface is the best install method. Make the tile man come back to button up the front or coordinate schedules so thorough testing takes place.


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## stillaround

Are you sure about the 1 1/4 granite. I drill a 2+" hole from the underside to get rid of any plywood or durarock and tighten to the granite if its too thick.


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## Optimus Primer

stillaround said:


> Are you sure about the 1 1/4 granite. I drill a 2+" hole from the underside to get rid of any plywood or durarock and tighten to the granite if its too thick.


 
I'm talking lav faucets. Not tub deck.


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## TheMaster

Now they need to address the "frozen nut issue" on their shower valves. I cut 50% of them off. I realize they coat the retaining nut on the new ones but I think the should add a coat of plumbers grease. I always put grease on all my delta set screws,etc. It makes me alot of money but I would have designed better. They are kinda locked into that design because of the sleeve that slides over the rough body. They had the same problem with the older s/l valves. then they did the "hex" nut to solve that problem for the most part. Took over 30 years but they changed it.


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## Plasticman

So why does Delta send you with the trim, an allen wrench to fit the lav lever handles or the roman handles but they don't send one to tighten the roman spout or the chrome lever handle that comes with the tub/shower trim? Did they forget something here??? WTF!!
When a builder has me install a roman faucet to the tile deck on a whirlpool tub, I make sure with him how thick the finished tile will be. I then cut wood shims to match this measurement. For instance. Finished tile with durock--5/8 durock, + 1/4 inch tile,+ 1/8 mud= 1 inch. I cut 8 pieces of wood shims 1 inch thick and put 2 under each mounting washer and tighten up those set screws from the top. The valve can then be piped and tested. All the tile man has to do is loosen the screws just enough to pull out the wedges and slide his tile beneath the mounting washers. When I come in to trim out, its all ready to install the spout, escutions,and handles. Just agravating dealing with those slotted screws through the hole cut outs in the plywood. But with the old threaded shank style rough valves, this could not be done. You had to order extensions.


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## stillaround

I know that works. I just prefer installing on finished surfaces. Bad tile man experiences maybe. Over the years we decided to figure in an extra trip for the garden tub/whirlpool/deck faucet except in the circumstances where the framer wants the tub there at the time of framing. I still say if you drill up from thye bottom with a larger hole saw you dont need an extension.


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## Optimus Primer

9 times out of ten, our tub decks are granite. So I do what stillaround does because it ends up 3 to 4 inches thick by time you add everything. Just drill all the material out and mount the faucet right to the granite. But the granite guys drill the granite. We no drill anything but tile.


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## Plasticman

Ok so what do yall think about the allen wrench deal with Delta? 
I really like Delta cause the rough-in on single lever tub/shower valves are more forgiving than Moen. Also Moen roman valves have to be cut to fit the holes drilled in the tub and then soldered up to pre-fab it before you install, unless you solder it up as is from the box and drill the holes to fit. Plus, Moen was one of the first valves that the cartridge could be flipped to correct a mistake made by a helper when he got hot and cold backwards. Delta has now fallen to this fashion. Reminds me of Ford's better ideas. :laughing:


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## Optimus Primer

ha. to be honest i never really paid attention that they didnt. Yeah, now I want to know why they don't supply allen wrenches with all their trim.


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## Optimus Primer

stillaround said:


> I know that works. I just prefer installing on finished surfaces. Bad tile man experiences maybe. Over the years we decided to figure in an extra trip for the garden tub/whirlpool/deck faucet except in the circumstances where the framer wants the tub there at the time of framing. I still say if you drill up from thye bottom with a larger hole saw you dont need an extension.


The only tub we set on 2nd rough are cast iron big tubs. No way youre lifting that up and over a tub deck. Besides most c i tubs are undermount. Obviously we set regular tubs on 2nd rough.


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## TheSkinnyGuy

looks like a Lenar job.


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## Optimus Primer

TheSkinnyGuy said:


> looks like a Lenar job.


Lennar. They had this neighborhood where they were selling the rest of their houses. They had a huge banner on the main road that said, Lennar Red Tag Specials. I thought it was funny. Should have taken a picture of it.


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## PipeFitter 393

Why do you use CPVC for domestic water in Florida?


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