# Help Leaking Shower Pan.... Maybe



## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

So I have been to my third call back. I installed a fiberglass shower pan and surround with moen shower head temperature control and trim. Every time they shower water leaks into their basement. The ceiling is exposed and there is no water coming from the drain, trap or copper piping. I got it to leak by holding the shower head to the escution plate, which had been caulked but caulk had broken lose, I dont know how, this is a new remodel. So I did recaulk that. The water is definately 100% not coming from any piping. 

I am almost convinced the client is getting water all over the floor and it is leaking down into the basement because it is a rh drain and the leak is to far left where water doesnt even get to. 

There is a shower head with a flexible hose on it, so I was able to really soak all the seams while standing in the pan I can not get anything to leak. 




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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

3 things to look for those mysterious leaks.

1) Wingback shower head inside the wall was leaking.

2) Tile grout on the wall were cracked and water was dripping from the walls.

3) Floor tile gout or broken silicone around shower or tub.


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

I have a 2 piece T/S upstairs in my bathroom. Whomever put it in never caulked it to begin with, so I did so when I moved in. At one point i noticed a dark spot on my ceiling downstairs and figured the tub was leaking somewhere. I discovered that a break in the caulking was letting water in behind the seam and filling up the "lip" of the tub and it was spilling over where there was a flaw or a break in that lip.

I ended up pulling the whole thing off and using a fkload of that tub surround adhesive to glue the two pieces together and then caulked white over the top of that. What a pain in the rear end that was. It doesn't leak anymore. 

I hate breakdown units.

Other leaks I have found was a ridiculously bad glass door seal to top of the threshold and water running under it, across the floor and under the baseboard, sometimes ran under uncaulked toilets and showed downstairs.

Sometimes those overflows have holes all the way through them, but you said this is a shower not a tub. I've had to caulk those screw holes to stop mystery leaks too.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

who installed the walls, tile , flooring? what did you install?


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> who installed the walls, tile , flooring? what did you install?




its a fiberglass shower pan and fiberglass shower 3 piece surround. 

there is vinyl plank on floor


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## exclamation (Mar 11, 2013)

I’ve seen more than a few mystery leaks that were from various ways of water cascading down the wall with the valve on it - small leaks at the shower head/arm threads spraying a small jet of water back on the wall, hand shower hoses/connections, shower caddy with shampoo bottle catching a bit of water off the shower head, cartridges leaking, diverter spouts not fully diverting and at an odd angle so water rolls back to the wall - if you got water cascading down the wall then there’s tub trim, grout/seams, overflow plate, and just water rolling off the rim of the tub onto the floor that are all possible - shower doesn’t have a tub but it’s the same concept and with showers there’s shower doors/glass frames that are always suspect too. I’ve even seen a shower head that wouldn’t angle down enough to not spray the far wall and had about 1/2 of the water going straight out onto the floor and for some reason (probably to avoid blame for picking out a bad shower head) the renter acted like that couldn’t possibly be why water pours through the ceiling and I “should be ripping the whole ceiling out looking for another leak” - what a jackass lol.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

was it a complete bath reno? was it a contractor that did the floor and tile work? tell him its not the shower and its a tile leak, his problem now and if you get another call back you will charge him or the person..just make dam sure it wasnt your work that has the issue..


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> was it a complete bath reno? was it a contractor that did the floor and tile work? tell him its not the shower and its a tile leak, his problem now and if you get another call back you will charge him or the person..just make dam sure it wasnt your work that has the issue..




full remodel. The walls and floor of shower is fiberglass. 

The flooring is vinyl plank. For sure hes spilling out of the shower. 


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Are you as heavy as the HO? Service call way back, I had the much larger than myself (I'm only 150lbs) HO get in a fiberglass base to test and they caused it to flex more than me and it leaked at surprisingly a wall seam. The guy that installed it didn't set it in anything.

Did you set it in a cement bed to firm it up? I ended up resetting the base in concrete and issue gone. It was a square shower only base and 3 walls. Took the walls off easily after some sheetrock cutting, I ground out the tile grout on the front edge with my oscillating tool, the drain was one of those with the rubber seals you tap into place so it wasn't too difficult getting it up to lay down some crete.

Are you dealing with one of those bases that converts a normal tub space into a shower?


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

chonkie said:


> Are you as heavy as the HO? Service call way back, I had the much larger than myself (I'm only 150lbs) HO get in a fiberglass base to test and they caused it to flex more than me and it leaked at surprisingly a wall seam. The guy that installed it didn't set it in anything.
> 
> Did you set it in a cement bed to firm it up? I ended up resetting the base in concrete and issue gone. It was a square shower only base and 3 walls. Took the walls off easily after some sheetrock cutting, I ground out the tile grout on the front edge with my oscillating tool, the drain was one of those with the rubber seals you tap into place so it wasn't too difficult getting it up to lay down some crete.
> 
> Are you dealing with one of those bases that converts a normal tub space into a shower?




no a 60”x32” base and three walls. Im probably 75 lbs heavier than the ho. I did not set it in crete. typically i do but this one said specifically not to. 


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

If he's spilling out of the enclosure is it possible that the water is travelling under the vinyl plank and finding a pipe or wire penetration?

Could you pop up a piece of that vinyl and see if it's wet underneath?

I'm not sure about install procedure on that stuff, but if I was doing it, I think i'd lay the plank down, and caulk the edges to the wall, then put down the base, and caulk the base to the vinyl, especially in a wet scenario. 

Perhaps no caulking at all around the edges?


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

so it only leaks when someone is standing in it.... 

drain???? I dont know I can feel and drain from basement is bone dry


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Is the drain the type with the rubber doughnut you press or tap in around the pipe? Does it seems like the base flexes at all in any spots?


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

chonkie said:


> Is the drain the type with the rubber doughnut you press or tap in around the pipe? Does it seems like the base flexes at all in any spots?




negative on drain. yes it flexes a little but no sign of stress cracks or uncaulked seams


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Have you actually seen any water in the basement other than when you purposely caused the escutcheon to leak?

Or are these those people that find a drop of dog piss, melted ice cube or something else wet in the basement and it must be a leak from your work?


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Silicone or putty on the drain? I've seen both leak due to flexing.

I would almost bet it's leaking due to flex since it only leaks when someone is in it. Even though the instructions said not to, i would reset it in crete if not too difficult.


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

the thing is i can see the entire drain from the basement and no water is coming from it..... 

yes there are several gallons spilled on basement floor


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

JohnnieSqueeze said:


> the thing is i can see the entire drain from the basement and no water is coming from it.....
> 
> yes there are several gallons spilled on basement floor
> 
> ...


have the customer get in the shower wearing a bathing suite( unless shes smoking hot) and take a shower and put an end to this madness of returning a dozen times and see if it leaks and from where.. and yes I had people do it to solve the tough where is the leak coming from on some jobs..


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> have the customer get in the shower wearing a bathing suite( unless shes smoking hot) and take a shower and put an end to this madness of returning a dozen times and see if it leaks and from where.. and yes I had people do it to solve the tough where is the leak coming from on some jobs..


Yep, because sometimes no matter how much water we spray with the head, or dumping 5 gallon buckets full onto the walls / shower door, the way water reacts when it runs off our bodies sometimes baffles the mind.

Maybe they're overfilling their washing machine with clothes and it's spilling onto the floor while they take a shower. :vs_laugh:


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Alan said:


> Yep, because sometimes no matter how much water we spray with the head, or dumping 5 gallon buckets full onto the walls / shower door, the way water reacts when it runs off our bodies sometimes baffles the mind.
> 
> Maybe they're overfilling their washing machine with clothes and it's spilling onto the floor while they take a shower. :vs_laugh:


dont laugh that hard, I had something similar, but it was a sewer ejector that leaked when they used water, a crack in the pipe that sprayed water so it looked as other pipes were leaking..


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> dont laugh that hard, I had something similar, but it was a sewer ejector that leaked when they used water, a crack in the pipe that sprayed water so it looked as other pipes were leaking..


No, it's just the audacity of people that feel like they are entitled to free leak source location forever once you do a job for them, it must be something you did.

It happened to me a lot working as an employee. Boss would tell me that "so and so called and that shower valve you repaired is still leaking."

Well what the ##%$ that was 4 weeks ago, why are they just NOW calling?

Then when I get there, it's worked fine for 4 weeks and just started acting up today when their kid was hanging from the handle or some other equally stupid nonsense. Nice try I guess? :vs_laugh:


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

I understand that if it is something that we have installed and there is a leak in that vicinity, then it is a service warranty call. {unless something other than what the plumber installed is leaking}.


But I do leak searches all the time and I charge. 


There is a minor leak search {visual, looking around} and an electronic leak search {for slab leaks}.


I agree with Shtruns downhill, have customer take a shower and get to the bottom of this.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Alan said:


> No, it's just the audacity of people that feel like they are entitled to free leak source location forever once you do a job for them, it must be something you did.
> 
> It happened to me a lot working as an employee. Boss would tell me that "so and so called and that shower valve you repaired is still leaking."
> 
> ...


I agree 100% with you, I tell the customer if the leak or issue is not do to my work you will be charged a service call...ill get a few people that say they will make sure and call back and I never hear from them....but most people just assume they can call if you did work in the house..if its my fault I will fix it for free, unless there are signs of tampering or abuse..then the camera comes out to take some pics before the customer is notified of what I find..


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## Fatpat (Nov 1, 2015)

I vote for the home owner making a mess while showering and the water finding the path of lease resistance. 


All Fiberglass enclosures that are not a single piece will eventually leak.


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## PLUMB TIME (Feb 2, 2009)

Fatpat said:


> I vote for the home owner making a mess while showering and the water finding the path of lease resistance.
> 
> 
> All Fiberglass enclosures that are not a single piece will eventually leak.







I would have to disagree. Many times,always for me since I do mostly remodels, I use a four piece remodel unit.
I have installed at least a couple hundred Sterling units and have never had an issue.
If a unit does leak, one-piece or modular, I have found that installer error is usually the culprit.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

PLUMB TIME said:


> [/COLOR]
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> 
> 
> ...






















Plumb Time, do you sling mud under the bases? When I set fiberglass tubs {or shower bases made of fiberglass} I mix mud and set the fiberglass {or plastic, fiber, etc.} base in a bed of mud.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

I sure do and put plenty around the drain area as thats the place they will flex and crack...


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I sure do and put plenty around the drain area as thats the place they will flex and crack...


Yep. My boss never wanted to put mortar under fiberglass unless it was a roman tub (drop in style)

The remodel neo angle I put in recently I had planned on putting mortar under it anyway, but the floor or wall was out of level about 1/4 from one side of the base to the other so it definitely needed to be levelled up.

When I went back to set finish and i stepped in to put the shower trim on it felt like I was standing in a tile shower. A little bit of mortar makes the fiberglass a much better product.


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