# Speaking of water heaters....



## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Speaking of water heaters and pipe leaks........

During cold weather, have you ever had a gas water heater pour a river of condensation onto the floor while the heater was firing non stop because the cold water was running through it full throttle due to a busted pipe under the house letting the hot water out?? 

A similar situation is when the customer calls and says their water heater is leaking and they shut it down, so when the plumber arrives, he sees water inside the shroud and a flood under the heater and still dripping, so the plumber instantly assumes the customer is correct about the tank having a hole in it and replaces the heater, he installs a new tank and fires the unit and the customer still doesn't get any hot water because there is still a leak under the house.


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## Qball415 (Nov 20, 2010)

Must be a hell of a leak.
Other signs weren't noticed like water pressure dropping, bill,etc...


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## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> Speaking of water heaters and pipe leaks........
> 
> During cold weather, have you ever had a gas water heater pour a river of condensation onto the floor while the heater was firing non stop because the cold water was running through it full throttle due to a busted pipe under the house letting the hot water out??


Yes.

I replaced an old 100 gallon heater in a pizza hut years ago because it wasn't heating. This thing was at least 15 yrs old.

Put the new one in, same problem. You guessed it, leak under slab. That was a fun one to explain.

That episode taught me to never, EVER assume anything. 

There is an explanation for everything. The trick is figuring out the correct one.

In fact, just had a steak house last month. Wanted a price on new heater- 100 gal, x00,000 BTU. Not heating water completely.

Went And looked at it, something didn't seem right. Looked around and found the dish machine solenoid wasn't closing and running a healthy stream of hot water straight to drain.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Qball415 said:


> Must be a hell of a leak.
> Other signs weren't noticed like water pressure dropping, bill,etc...


The first situation happened overnight after a freeze, I had installed the heater two years prior. When I shut the burner off, the condensation stopped, but I still heard the water running, a peek underneath the house revealed the split copper.

The second was also immediate according to the homeowner, but it was on a concrete slab. He turned the heater off and shut off the gas and went to work, then met me at his lunch break.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

It is always worth some troubleshooting effort to ensure that your proposed repair will indeed fix the customers problem. :thumbup:

It's just good plumbing! :yes:


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## billy_awesome (Dec 19, 2011)

Yeah I've heard of all this problem, a horror story my boss told me.

That's why no matter what, look at the water meter first! and if electric, test each element with a multimeter for either 110 or 240 volt depending on the tank.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

The heater I installed last night was condensating heavily onto the floor when first fired. 

By the time I wrote the bill, took the customer downstairs the water stopped dripping out the tank, could see the wet spot on the floor. 

It's expected during fall and spring transitions, warm tank/cold water scenario.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*what brand was it?*



DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> The heater I installed last night was condensating heavily onto the floor when first fired.
> 
> By the time I wrote the bill, took the customer downstairs the water stopped dripping out the tank, could see the wet spot on the floor.
> 
> It's expected during fall and spring transitions, warm tank/cold water scenario.


 
we used to h ave problems with pro-max heaters from smith that sweat like pigs all through the year...

what brand did you install last night that did this??


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Pigs don't sweat


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> we used to h ave problems with pro-max heaters from smith that sweat like pigs all through the year...
> 
> what brand did you install last night that did this??


A.O. Smith 50gallon PowerVent. 













Either my camera is going bad or I had it on the wrong setting when taking pictures. 

This heater replacement, I video'd the entire process... that's going to be a good one for youtube.


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

Why is there a cleanout T on your 3" vent off the water heater? Why not just tubing or a leg for the condensate from combustion?


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## Anonymous (Jan 7, 2012)

mccmech said:


> Why is there a cleanout T on your 3" vent off the water heater? Why not just tubing or a leg for the condensate from combustion?


When I seen that it also looked odd

Another thing. Where is the front of that furnace. It looks like you installed that HWT right in front of the furnace. 

Pretty sure. That you need per code and manufacture instruction that you need 2ft in front of furnace for servicing. 

From the pic it looks like there is walls on the back side of the furnace. So that tank is in front of furnace


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

mccmech said:


> Why is there a cleanout T on your 3" vent off the water heater? Why not just tubing or a leg for the condensate from combustion?


 It looks like 4" to me.


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## TPWinc (May 30, 2011)

I'm curious about the expansion tank being upstream of the ball valve. Not very service friendly.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> A.O. Smith 50gallon PowerVent.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
not to be a critic here, but those expansion tanks are nothing but a dead weight just waiting to snap off some day at the copper tee arm. when they finally get water-logged.. 
have you ever considered useing bailing wire or 
a strapping to support that tank down from the rafters above???


it all looks good, but I wont install one without putting it in a pan....I dont care if it is only a foot away from the floor drain:no::no:

and I wont put in smith


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

TPWinc said:


> I'm curious about the expansion tank being upstream of the ball valve. Not very service friendly.


Code here says no pass....


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## TPWinc (May 30, 2011)

Redwood said:


> Code here says no pass....


As it should. There should be no means of isolating the expansion tank from the water heater.


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

Widdershins said:


> It looks like 4" to me.



Regardless of the pipe size, my question was "why the cleanout t?".


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## tungsten plumb (Apr 15, 2010)

mccmech said:


> Regardless of the pipe size, my question was "why the cleanout t?".


Maybe to drain the built up condensate that's the only thing that makes sense to me.


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Colgar said:


> Yes.
> 
> I replaced an old 100 gallon heater in a pizza hut years ago because it wasn't heating. This thing was at least 15 yrs old.
> 
> ...


The pizza hut by the mall?


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## Flyguy199 (Sep 20, 2011)

IMO, that expansion tank should be downstream of the ball valve and it definitely needs to be supported with some 3/8" threaded rod or some other supports.


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