# What makes a Master Plumber



## Castiron (May 4, 2010)

Hi there guys,

Never mind that I am miles away from it (new apprentice - the type who doesn't say can't - unless it's dangerous!)  - reading the posts I keep coming across Masters. I am familiar with Journeymen, Foremen and so on but have never heard of master plumbers here - what is the deal? If we don't have it in Canada what is the equivalent?

As far as I know journeymen here can pull permits and so on.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

There is no equivalent. You either are one are you are not. No inbetween. 

The general public knows this to be just that.


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## Castiron (May 4, 2010)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> There is no equivalent. You either are one are you are not. No inbetween.
> 
> The general public knows this to be just that.


So who decides if you are one?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

I'm a journeyman, but can perform work like any Master on here, there is no difference where I'm at.

Meh................


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## luv2plumb (Apr 30, 2010)

Castiron said:


> So who decides if you are one?


 
In Texas we are licensed under a State Board which we have to meet certian requirements in order to obtain any type of plumbing license. Here a Master is the one that is allowed to pull permits and only a responsible Master can own a business


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

Castiron said:


> Hi there guys,
> 
> Never mind that I am miles away from it (new apprentice - the type who doesn't say can't - unless it's dangerous!)  - reading the posts I keep coming across Masters. I am familiar with Journeymen, Foremen and so on but have never heard of master plumbers here - what is the deal? If we don't have it in Canada what is the equivalent?
> 
> As far as I know journeymen here can pull permits and so on.


Vancouver got rid of the Master Plumber thing long ago - sometime before I became a journeyman in 1985. I'm pretty sure the rest of B.C. never had it - there if you're a journeyman plumber you can buy permits and/or go into business.

They still have it in Toronto - when I moved there in 1987 I had my B.C. journeyman ticket, which is supposed to be "inter-provincial". Guess what? Toronto wouldn't honor that. Nor would Mississauga. I had jobs to do *right now* and had to quickly bone up on Ontario code (there are some weird differences) and take the Master Plumber test. It was mostly multiple guess and there were sections of it where I just didn't know and just checked 'C' over and over. But I passed and became an official Toronto master plumber. Then I could use that to get a business license and permits in Mississauga (and a couple dozen other towns in the area) as well.

I actually got a Master ticket in Alberta too. No test, but I had to fight them - they didn't want to honor my inter-provincial ticket at first. Alberta code is real similar to B.C., but again with some pretty strange differences.

What it is... They ask a bunch of stupid questions supposedly to prove that you're not too dumb to run a business. Really very simple stuff, but your average dumbass employee might not know it, so they keep him from pulling permits and/or starting a business until he learns. Just keepin out the riff-raff. :laughing:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Castiron said:


> So who decides if you are one?


 

The state you reside in, along with your competency to pass the masters test.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Castiron said:


> So who decides if you are one?


 
The state statute (Florida, that is) requires testing, insurance, background checks, credit checks, etc. before they issue master's license. The actual legal term is "state certified plumbing contractor." Here, a journeyman designation is not a license. Journeyman can't run a business (at least legally) or pull permits. I worked for years w/o a journeyman card, didn't need one. Guys w/ journeyman card earned the same as guys w/o one. Inspectors never asked if anyone on a job had a journeyman card. So to go through the effort of getting a journeyman card was just a feather in one's cap-nothing more.

But any plumber in this trade for years will tell you that just because someone has a master's license doesn't mean he's a great plumber. And there are men w/o the master's license that can run circles around others. Bottom line, master's license is needed to own and run a business.


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## DownHill (Oct 15, 2010)

Being in a 14" crawlspace holding the copper up with one foot to give it pitch and keep the water off to get it soldered while answering the phone and smoking a primer dipped cig....


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*that about covers it....*



DownHill said:


> Being in a 14" crawlspace holding the copper up with one foot to give it pitch and keep the water off to get it soldered while answering the phone and smoking a primer dipped cig....


 
you have nailed it down pretty good there..


the only difference between a journeyman and a masters
in this state is the ability to own and run a business.....
 while laying in that crawl space talking on the phone

I have a masters in indiana and colorado , they really dont mean much except that...
most fellows I have known that were masters had a little more drive and survival skills in place over than the guys that just showed up for work every morning at the job trailer with their asses dragging.

right now in this state their are hundreds of laid 
off journeyman plumbers, and I know a lot of them
they dont know how to motivate themselves..... 
.....
most of them only know how to stand around with 
their thumbs in their asses till someone tells them what to do
all while makeing union wages...


and they had years and years to get the masters lisc but
would never go take the test... now they are hurting bad.


one thing for sure...... 
I know that if their is a mean job to do ,
their is a good chance I will be the one
to do it cause everyone will call in sick that day:furious:..


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

luv2plumb said:


> In Texas we are licensed under a State Board which we have to meet certian requirements in order to obtain any type of plumbing license. Here a Master is the one that is allowed to pull permits and only a responsible Master can own a business


Same here


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Taken from the Plumbing Licensing Law of 1955 for the State of Oklahoma

4. "Apprentice" or "plumber's apprentice" means any person sixteen (16) years of age or older who, as the principal occupation of the person, is engaged in learning and assisting in the installation of plumbing under the direct supervision of a licensed journeyman plumber or plumbing contractor;


5. "Journeyman plumber" means any person other than a master plumber or plumbing contractor who engages in or works at the actual installation, alteration, repair and/or renovation of plumbing;


6. "Temporary journeyman plumber" means any person other than a person permanently licensed as a journeyman plumber, master plumber, or plumbing contractor in this state who meets the temporary licensure requirements of Section 1006.1 of this title;


7. "Master plumber" is a term used and defined under laws which have been repealed. A person formerly known as a master plumber is henceforth to be known as a "plumbing contractor" as defined in this section;


8. "Plumbing contractor" means any person who is skilled in the planning, superintending, and practical installation of plumbing and who is familiar with the laws and rules governing the same. This definition may be construed to mean any person who has qualified and is licensed under The Plumbing License Law of 1955 as a plumbing contractor, who may operate as an individual, a firm, partnership, limited liability company, or corporation, or other legal entity to engage in the business of plumbing, or the business of contracting to do plumbing, or furnish labor or materials or both for the installation, repair, maintenance, or renovation of plumbing according to the requirements of The Plumbing License Law of 1955;


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

luv2plumb said:


> In Texas we are licensed under a State Board which we have to meet certian requirements in order to obtain any type of plumbing license. Here a Master is the one that is allowed to pull permits and only a responsible Master can own a business


Ditto in AR


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

in order to be a master plumber, one must be able to clearly articulate a plumbing problem to a home owner while bitc% slapping an apprentice.

No other known requirements at this time.......


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## Castiron (May 4, 2010)

Protech said:


> in order to be a master plumber, one must be able to clearly articulate a plumbing problem to a home owner while bitc% slapping an apprentice.
> 
> No other known requirements at this time.......


I don't think I can argue with the b$&@h slapping apprentices - but for the record I'm against it!


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Time ,,,


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Illinois has apprentice, journeyman and retired plumbing licenses. No masters.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

In MA you can hire employee's and an apprentice can put their time in (500 hrs) under you.

I'm thinking of going for my master's just incase one of my boy's decides for some strange reason they wanna be a plumber.


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## plumbear (Jun 24, 2010)

There is no Master Plumber designation in Arizona. There is a journeyman card, but only in the Phoenix area and it is not required. 
I guess the closest thing to Master in comparison to the other posts I have read is a plumbing contractor. We have a years in the trade requirement and state testing in both trade and business management and there are separate tests for commercial and residential. Only licensed contractors can pull permits, perform jobs that require permits, or do jobs that cost more than $1000.00.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*how do you get that*

that "contractor status" seems sort of shadey to me.....

what exactly is necessary to receive your 
"contractors status"??? and start doing plumbing all
over town??? 50 bucks ???

can anyone claim to be a contractor....????

I know a few here in town that I would not let on my property .....



and what about Nacho is he considered a contractor????:laughing:











/


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## Pipe Rat (Apr 5, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> In MA you can hire employee's and an apprentice can put their time in *(500 hrs)* under you.
> 
> I'm thinking of going for my master's just incase one of my boy's decides for some strange reason they wanna be a plumber.


Pauli was the 500 hrs a typo?  Only 3 months reqiured to get your time in. :blink: I hope it was supposed to be 5000 hours, that would be more like it. Here it is five years.:thumbup: Not sure of the minimum hours but around here they dont hand out journeyman's licenses like candy. Five year apprenticeship, then you must be a journeyman for at least five years to be eligible to take the Masters test. Ten years here to prove yourself. :yes:


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

What makes a Master Plumber? A HUGE ego! :yes:

J/K . . . maybe?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> that "contractor status" seems sort of shadey to me.....
> 
> what exactly is necessary to receive your "contractors status"??? and start doing plumbing all over town??? 50 bucks ???
> 
> ...


I agree Mark the California "Contractor's License" thing is a tad bit sketchy and doesn't seem to offer much in the line of consumer protection...

Nacho however is a different animal...
When his license # was run through the California License Check it was found that it could have just as easily been a different number that he would use if the store was out of one of the numbers....

It sure had nothing to do with any number assigned by the state...:laughing:

So Nacho is not a contractor...
He's just a plain old crook...
Hopefully up for deportation soon....


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Master's license lets you charge more than a guy without master's license. Ha ha ha :thumbsup:


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Piperat said:


> Pauli was the 500 hrs a typo?  Only 3 months reqiured to get your time in. :blink: I hope it was supposed to be 5000 hours, that would be more like it. Here it is five years.:thumbup: Not sure of the minimum hours but around here they dont hand out journeyman's licenses like candy. Five year apprenticeship, then you must be a journeyman for at least five years to be eligible to take the Masters test. Ten years here to prove yourself. :yes:


Yep my bad, it's 500 hrs of schooling and 3 years under a master to be able to take journeymens test.

I_ think_ it's 200 more schooling and 2 more years under a master to take masters test.


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

Redwood said:


> I agree Mark the California "Contractor's License" thing is a tad bit sketchy and doesn't seem to offer much in the line of consumer protection...
> 
> Nacho however is a different animal...
> When his license # was run through the California License Check it was found that it could have just as easily been a different number that he would use if the store was out of one of the numbers....
> ...


I highly doubt it.............:whistling2:

*Immigration cases being tossed by the hundreds* *Docket review pulls curtain back on procedure by Homeland Security*

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7249505.html


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## luv2plumb (Apr 30, 2010)

Choctaw said:


> I highly doubt it.............:whistling2:
> 
> *Immigration cases being tossed by the hundreds* *Docket review pulls curtain back on procedure by Homeland Security*
> 
> http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/7249505.html


That's Houston for ya........gotta love it


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