# Favorite Customer???



## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

I got a call on a Friday afternoon, but ended up being a good time.
This older middle eastern lady, barely spoke any English pointed me towards a leak coming through the floor into the basement. It turned out to be a leaky angle stop valve on the toilet.

no problem.

Run to Ferguson down the road, fixed in five minutes.

Afterwards, she had me sit down at the dinner table, made me coffee, gave me a sandwich and cookies, chatted with me for a good half hour...what the heck, sweet lady.

The funny thing is, she went on a tangent of how her daughter just got divorced from a VERY BAD MAN, kept showing me pictures of her...not gonna lie...she was beautiful. I'm pretty sure this lady was trying to hook me up with her daughter hahahahahaha

I'm married, but no thanks


Anyone else wanna share???


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

ROCcity88 said:


> I got a call on a Friday afternoon, but ended up being a good time.
> This older middle eastern lady, barely spoke any English pointed me towards a leak coming through the floor into the basement. It turned out to be a leaky angle stop valve on the toilet.
> 
> no problem.
> ...


Sounds like a good thing,the daughter was "backed up" and needed unclogging,mans got to know his limitations :devil3


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## badknees (Apr 23, 2020)

I had a lovely old lady customer who my teacher at primary school,would call on thursday for Friday appointment, wanted to renovate her bath room.
Always fresh baked fruit cake and Jasmin tea. Talk about why I should have gone to university, I would not have made the grade.
I would measure up she would choose tiles and sanitary ware etc.
I would send the quote .
A couple of months we would do it again, she was lonely.
I never charged , it was to thank her for all the time she spent with me at school.
I am a soppy old bugger.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

ROCcity88 said:


> I got a call on a Friday afternoon, but ended up being a good time.
> This older middle eastern lady, barely spoke any English pointed me towards a leak coming through the floor into the basement. It turned out to be a leaky angle stop valve on the toilet.
> 
> no problem.
> ...


sounds like your doing illegal plumbing..HVAC is not licensed to touch potable water lines......


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

The company you work for has a plumbing division and they paid your time to chat for half an hour?


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## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> sounds like your doing illegal plumbing..HVAC is not licensed to touch potable water lines......


No, this was not recent,
it was several years ago when I worked for a plumbing company.


And no, I didn't charge the company haha
I clocked out when the job was done, the socializing was on my time


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> sounds like your doing illegal plumbing..HVAC is not licensed to touch potable water lines......


Back to the big house he goes,once again,mans got to know his limitations :devil3:


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

ROCcity88 said:


> No, this was not recent,
> it was several years ago when I worked for a plumbing company.
> 
> 
> ...


Surrrrrre it was,mans got to know his limitations :devil3:


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

ROCcity88 said:


> No, this was not recent,
> it was several years ago when I worked for a plumbing company.
> 
> 
> ...





LOL..bro your stories are like a fish market on a sunny summer day.....




"so this friday"...certainly sounds like now...
dont take it personally, but do you have business insurance? do you have any licenses or certs to do anything? or your just an employee for an HVAC company?


you ask questions like a homeowner or hack that has not even the basic of basic knowledge about plumbing, and im just stating that from the questions you have asked now and in the past and your explanation of past and present work...
its great you are posting and being active, so post what you have done in the world of HVAC as there are overlaps with some plumbing....


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## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

It's one of the biggest HVAC companies in the area, but the recently started a plumbing division in which I worked for a time.
They didn't care to hire a master plumber to oversee the work being done and all the training was pretty much left up to us techs in the field to learn on our own. 
it ended up being a major waste of my time.

That's why I left and do industrial refrigeration now instead.
I have my EPA 608, now working on several licenses such as the 
R4, R3 & R2 Refrigeration/Stationary Engineer License and the
Water Treatment Plant Operators Licenses


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

ROCcity88 said:


> It's one of the biggest HVAC companies in the area, but the recently started a plumbing division in which I worked for a time.
> They didn't care to hire a master plumber to oversee the work being done and all the training was pretty much left up to us techs in the field to learn on our own.
> it ended up being a major waste of my time.
> 
> ...


cool lets see some pics from that and work done, I use to work refrigeration and air conditioning in new york city, meat plants, commercial bakeries and big stuff like that, but it was over 30 years ago then transitioned into plumbing and new I wanted my own business, back when I was doing the ac/refrig they were getting stupid with the freon r-12 and r-22 and were talking about all kinds of crazy regulations, now they have all the newer refrigerants to replace the old ones...


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## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> cool lets see some pics from that and work done, I use to work refrigeration and air conditioning in new york city, meat plants, commercial bakeries and big stuff like that, but it was over 30 years ago then transitioned into plumbing and new I wanted my own business, back when I was doing the ac/refrig they were getting stupid with the freon r-12 and r-22 and were talking about all kinds of crazy regulations, now they have all the newer refrigerants to replace the old ones...


That's cool man, yeah it's definitely changed alot. I don't there will ever be an end to the regulations on the refrigerant gases unfortunately, even the most recent choices (like R-410A & R-134) are on the way out. The scary thing is, now they're discussing using propane as a general use refrigerant for AC...I can name a few techs in our area that I'm terrified to see do that hahaha

Dang dude,
I really wish I could show you some pics of what we have here. Unfortunately there's all sorts of security regulations in here on what you can photograph and share, I work exclusively for the utilities branch of Kodak Tech Park...so yeah it's locked down good.
I'll look into that some more though on if our equipment is included in that clause (we are a seperate entity from Kodak at this point, the park is diversifying quite a bit noawadays. We even have the Tesla batteries being produced here).

Just a teaser though, most of the chillers are York centrifugal units, anywhere from 600 to 4,000 tons, powered by steam turbines.
We have a few newer ones that just got put in, they're made by Smardt (i believe they're out of Montreal). Pretty cool, they use magnetic bearing compressors)


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

ROCcity88 said:


> That's cool man, yeah it's definitely changed alot. I don't there will ever be an end to the regulations on the refrigerant gases unfortunately, even the most recent choices (like R-410A & R-134) are on the way out. The scary thing is, now they're discussing using propane as a general use refrigerant for AC...I can name a few techs in our area that I'm terrified to see do that hahaha
> 
> Dang dude,
> I really wish I could show you some pics of what we have here. Unfortunately there's all sorts of security regulations in here on what you can photograph and share, I work exclusively for the utilities branch of Kodak Tech Park...so yeah it's locked down good.
> ...



I know they have propane refrigerators for off grid living, but propane is highly explosive/flammable..I can see lots of things going boom unless they can put an additive that will render it inert....


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ROCcity88 said:


> .......Unfortunately there's all sorts of security regulations in here on what you can photograph and share, I work exclusively for the utilities branch of Kodak Tech Park...so yeah it's locked down good.
> I'll look into that some more though on if our equipment is included in that clause ......







Certainly taking a picture to order a part or show a manager would be fine.






.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I know they have propane refrigerators for off grid living, but propane is highly explosive/flammable..I can see lots of things going boom unless they can put an additive that will render it inert....


Oh please, propane is fine for refrigeration, no more dangerous than any other refrigerant. Like you said it's already used in trailers, if that ain't a high risk use than I don't know what is!


Ever heard of sulphur dioxide? That schit is NASTY. Explosive and so damn awful to smell!!! Hasn't been in use for like 80 years but I got a good whiff of it last summer. I have this old fridgidaire compressor. Some old guy had it bolted to a board with a kill yourself switch, when he died his family brought it to the dump where this guy found it 



It's super quiet, had it a couple years, makes like 120psi now that I hooked it up to a larger, faster motor with a bigger pulley. Mounted it on an old expansion tank and rolling frame. Anyway, I loosened one of the plugs on the other ports and immediately regretted it as I was greated with the tiniest hiss of the nastiest thing I have ever smelled. Scorched my nostrils. Auschwitz gas stuck in there for 80 years!


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## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Oh please, propane is fine for refrigeration, no more dangerous than any other refrigerant. Like you said it's already used in trailers, if that ain't a high risk use than I don't know what is!
> 
> 
> Ever heard of sulphur dioxide? That schit is NASTY. Explosive and so damn awful to smell!!! Hasn't been in use for like 80 years but I got a good whiff of it last summer. I have this old fridgidaire compressor. Some old guy had it bolted to a board with a kill yourself switch, when he died his family brought it to the dump where this guy found it


We did at one point (this is like 20/30 years ago) have a chiller plant that had chillers running on two outlawed gases, sulfur dioxide being one of them.
It was used to create a NEGATIVE 30 DEG BRINE!!
That was wild. But I guess most of the guys working at that plant died of some crazy cancers and whatnot. Kodak is still just a massive chemical plant, the stuff we do here is wild.

We do as of now still have a 9 Deg brine system, as well as 40 deg, 46 deg, etc
it's all for film and chemical production


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ROCcity88 said:


> ...........
> We do as of now still have a 9 Deg brine system, as well as 40 deg, 46 deg, etc
> it's all for film and chemical production















.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

skoronesa said:


> Oh please, propane is fine for refrigeration, no more dangerous than any other refrigerant. Like you said it's already used in trailers, if that ain't a high risk use than I don't know what is!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I’m not a refrigeration guy but I don’t think propane is the actual refrigerant used in trailers and RV’s. Those refrigerators use a propane flame to move the actual refrigerant which could be ammonia.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Debo22 said:


> I’m not a refrigeration guy but I don’t think propane is the actual refrigerant used in trailers and RV’s. Those refrigerators use a propane flame to move the actual refrigerant which could be ammonia.



Of course! That's exactly what I meant :whistling2:





If an open pilot/constant stream of gas "intentionally leaking" is safe they can certainly use it as a refrigerant. It is used commercially as a regular refrigerant.




How many 1lb cylinders leak out every year? What about 20lb'ers? You don't hear about a dearth of explosions from those things. I can't imagine half a pound in a brazed copper system would be very risky at all. Even if we just used it in factory made/non-serviceable units like air conditioners. Your air conditioner literally hangs out in the wind all the time anyway.









.



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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Debo22 said:


> I’m not a refrigeration guy but I don’t think propane is the actual refrigerant used in trailers and RV’s. Those refrigerators use a propane flame to move the actual refrigerant which could be ammonia.


yeah I thought they used propane burning to get refrigeration but wasnt sure so I left it generic..but I think your right, a quick google will answer it..


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Of course! That's exactly what I meant :whistling2:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 your wrong, there are multiple saftey to prevent a large amount of gas released( some would say some peoples azzholes could use a saftey)burning propane or natural gas are quiet safe, but when pipes are cut things go boom.....so now if you used the actual liquid propane as a refrigerant that could lead to many booms...
and everytime you want to open a system your gona have to vacuum pump all the propane out, you cant let a large amount of flammable gas out in a building enclosed space...
a pilot light is no comparison to a refrigeration system filled with liquid/gas propane


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Oh please, propane is fine for refrigeration, no more dangerous than any other refrigerant. Like you said it's already used in trailers, if that ain't a high risk use than I don't know what is!
> 
> 
> Ever heard of sulphur dioxide? That schit is NASTY. Explosive and so damn awful to smell!!! Hasn't been in use for like 80 years but I got a good whiff of it last summer. I have this old fridgidaire compressor. Some old guy had it bolted to a board with a kill yourself switch, when he died his family brought it to the dump where this guy found it
> ...


how about the old ammonia systems...that will kill you quick...


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> and everytime you want to open a system your gona have to vacuum pump all the propane out, you cant let a large amount of flammable gas out in a building enclosed space...





Yeah, that's what is done on every refrigeration system :smile:




Flammable or not guys shouldn't just be cutting linesets and letting refrigerant piss out lolz






.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Yeah, that's what is done on every refrigeration system :smile:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


where flammable gas is let out is not good for ones health...too many things around to ignite it....so if a freon line blows no big deal...


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## ROCcity88 (May 13, 2016)

Debo22 said:


> I’m not a refrigeration guy but I don’t think propane is the actual refrigerant used in trailers and RV’s. Those refrigerators use a propane flame to move the actual refrigerant which could be ammonia.


You are correct, but propane is also being proposed for more widespread use in AC systems due to environmental concerns of other gases such as R-410a and the like.
Believe it or not, propane actually does behave the same way as other refrigerant gases do under pressure in a refrigeration system. It will change from a liquid, to a gas, then back again constantly in order to boil off and absorb/release heat. It's just got it's own unique pressure/temperature relationship like any other gas does.
Really the same concept, the only difference it's a hell of alot more flammable/explosive than the other options.


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## Venomthirst (Jun 20, 2018)

Debo22 said:


> I’m not a refrigeration guy but I don’t think propane is the actual refrigerant used in trailers and RV’s. Those refrigerators use a propane flame to move the actual refrigerant which could be ammonia.





Your a hundred percent correct... The refrigerant on a propane fridge is Ammonia, the heat to create the cycle is created by propane..


fridges in trailers are 3 way fridges meaning they operate on 120vac/ 12/24Vdc and propane... Propane is only allowed to be used when trailer is stationary.. 



the propane flame is essentially the compressor, and its not much bigger than a pilot lite .. takes forever to get that thing cold but once its there its good..


Ask me how I know.. there was a whole section on My Gas fitters exam about propane fridges... and its the only place where refrigeration and gas overlap in our course


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## rwh (Dec 17, 2014)

Ammonia as a refrigerant isn't all that dangerous. It is nasty as h#ll. It is cheap as can be and not hazardous to the environment. If you have a leak (all refrigeration systems leak eventually), you will know because people smell it. It is detected by the human nose at much lower concentrations than what are fatal. When people get a big whiff, they voluntarily leave the area.


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## Venomthirst (Jun 20, 2018)

rwh said:


> Ammonia as a refrigerant isn't all that dangerous. It is nasty as h#ll. It is cheap as can be and not hazardous to the environment. If you have a leak (all refrigeration systems leak eventually), you will know because people smell it. It is detected by the human nose at much lower concentrations than what are fatal. When people get a big whiff, they voluntarily leave the area.



One guy I work with.. was working at a cold storage facility... he was snaking a sewer, and when he cleared it I guess it pulled a whole bunch of Ammonia gas from a leaking refrigeration system.... it knocked him out....


He woke up to fire fighters and paramedics... I guess one of the guys working there found him and dragged him out into fresh air... Crazy stuff.. I'm not sure but when were talking he thought that when he cleared the drain it pulled a vacuum in another room and pulled the gas into the room


He says I'm lucky to be alive..


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

rwh said:


> Ammonia as a refrigerant isn't all that dangerous. It is nasty as h#ll. It is cheap as can be and not hazardous to the environment. If you have a leak (all refrigeration systems leak eventually), you will know because people smell it. It is detected by the human nose at much lower concentrations than what are fatal. When people get a big whiff, they voluntarily leave the area.


About two years ago a customer called me asking if I could remove an ammonia condensing unit. I posted the question on HVAC-Talk.com and the guys were just saying empty the ammonia into a bucket of water and pour it on plants. The smell was horrendous and no scrap guys wanted to take the equipment. Finally found a guy to haul it away.

Never again


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

ROCcity88 said:


> You are correct, but propane is also being proposed for more widespread use in AC systems due to environmental concerns of other gases such as R-410a and the like.
> Believe it or not, propane actually does behave the same way as other refrigerant gases do under pressure in a refrigeration system. It will change from a liquid, to a gas, then back again constantly in order to boil off and absorb/release heat. It's just got it's own unique pressure/temperature relationship like any other gas does.
> Really the same concept, the only difference it's a hell of alot more flammable/explosive than the other options.


I just found and fixed a leak in the evaporator coil of a residential system. The coil was under the house. I recharged the system with 13 pounds of R-410a. Imagine if that leak was propane


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Debo22 said:


> I just found and fixed a leak in the evaporator coil of a residential system. The coil was under the house. I recharged the system with 13 pounds of R-410a. Imagine if that leak was propane



or ammonia....suppose it leaked at night and everyone was sleeping..they would be dead by morning....ammonia is toxic and deadly...propane they would wake up in kansas from the blast....refrigerant needs to be non lethal to be safe...maybe in a commercial or industrial situation with plenty of sensors to monitor the air quality, but not in residential...


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> or ammonia....suppose it leaked at night and everyone was sleeping..they would be dead by morning....ammonia is toxic and deadly...propane they would wake up in kansas from the blast....refrigerant needs to be non lethal to be safe...maybe in a commercial or industrial situation with plenty of sensors to monitor the air quality, but not in residential...


The old ammonia systems had all the ammonia contained in the outdoor unit and then circulated some blend of water and coolant through the house and evaporator coil so you weren’t at risk inside the house. 

The propane as actual refrigerant circulating through the entire system scares me.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Debo22 said:


> The old ammonia systems had all the ammonia contained in the outdoor unit and then circulated some blend of water and coolant through the house and evaporator coil so you weren’t at risk inside the house.
> 
> The propane as actual refrigerant circulating through the entire system scares me.


I never worked on those units, the freon ones run right into the house with the freon..that was many many moons ago..havent touched one in at least 20 years...


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I never worked on those units, the freon ones run right into the house with the freon..that was many many moons ago..havent touched one in at least 20 years...


I’ve never worked on an ammonia system either. Only remove that one, here’s the nomenclature plate.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Funny this thread is on page 4 with no mention of a favorite customer from anybody besides the OP


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Debo22 said:


> The old ammonia systems had all the ammonia contained in the outdoor unit and then circulated some blend of water and coolant through the house and evaporator coil so you weren’t at risk inside the house.
> 
> The propane as actual refrigerant circulating through the entire system scares me.



Bah, can't be any worse than all that corrugated stainless crap they're using now. And you could do as you say here, keep the propane outside and just use water/antifreeze. How many houses have old flared copper gas lines running every where? I see some really scary 3/8" and 1/2" in some crawlspaces. Rat piss corroding it and every guy that crawls through kicking it. I am sure an insulated lineset would hold up much better, just make code require proper hangers every like 3 feet.


If you're not blind to global warming than you realize we have to change a lot. You can't just rule out a better refrigerant because it's scary.


What about propane solely in window units?


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

BBBAAAAAHHH global bullschit is what its all about, just another way to screw the citizens of the world out of more money...


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> *BBBAAAAAHHH* global bullschit is what its all about, just another way to screw the citizens of the world out of more money...





Spoken like a true sheeple :devil3::vs_laugh:


Yes, believe the republicans who profit from giving corporations tax cuts. Corporations who don't want to worry about the pollution they create. And don't forget, trump has his own "empire" that would lose lots of money if they had to worry more about pollution.



Globalism isn't an ideology, it's a type of economy that just happens. As people have traveled farther we have traded on a larger scale.








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## badknees (Apr 23, 2020)

*i loved plumbing*

Back in the 50's and 60's , we did not have any sort of regulation, I learnt my trade , we done plumbing ,heating , drainage and roof work.
The only reglation was if you was not very good at what you were doing you got fired, people would never employ you .
Remember it was a proper trade then, all copper or galv and cast iron nobody could buy the materials without a account at the store.
Now anybody can buy the materials glue it together or push together.
Of course you now have the wonderful teacher the Internet, ten minutes on there you can do any plumbing.
No amount of regulation will stop that as long as you walk into store and buy material.
I started a company by doing what you call side work my boss knew, because I asked for more money, told i was getting to much , told him i had to do side to live.
Never looked back till I retired.
I think sort of got off the subject.:vs_OMG:
Age tells.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Spoken like a true sheeple :devil3::vs_laugh:
> 
> 
> Yes, believe the republicans who profit from giving corporations tax cuts. Corporations who don't want to worry about the pollution they create. And don't forget, trump has his own "empire" that would lose lots of money if they had to worry more about pollution.
> ...


 I believe through my own research and the actions I see going on around the world... only countries with people with money are regulated where other countries do as they please like china...it all goes up in the air so id doesnt matter..
local pollution like plastics in the water I agree its a problem..but theres nothing humans can do to change the atmosphere way up over our heads...


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I believe through my own research and the actions I see going on around the world... only countries with people with money are regulated where other countries do as they please like china...it all goes up in the air so id doesnt matter..
> local pollution like plastics in the water I agree its a problem..but theres nothing humans can do to change the atmosphere way up over our heads...





Not all pollution goes up and not all of it stays up. Even if you don't believe in man made global warming you still can't deny all that schit will give you cancer.






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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

skoronesa said:


> Not all pollution goes up and not all of it stays up. Even if you don't believe in man made global warming you still can't deny all that schit will give you cancer.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 I dont believe one bit of the global warming/ change, its complete bullschit...
but yes there are many things of pollution that effect at ground level, im 100% agree with you on that..all the chemicals like round up and toxic oils used in transformers, plastics in the waters, toxic dump sights ..and on and on..all that is absolutely true and needs to be cleaned up..ill go as far and say all the GMO foods, hormones pumped into livestock to make them grow and all the antibiotics are horrible for good health..and we will kill ourselves off that way long before anything else will...
the planet is 4.6 billion years old and has lasted this long..we are not hurting the planet , we are just hurting ourselves ..


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