# Bad shut off valve with water main leak



## gredus (Sep 22, 2011)

Any possible solutions to a serious leak in a 3 and half inch water main, with a bad shut off valve? The gate valve just spins, won't stop in any direction when turned. The valve and line is about 4 and half foot deep. It would be necessary to shut off a lot other buildings on this branch to isolate the bad valve and I would like to avoid a big shut down of domestic water supply to the unaffected buildings. Any thoughts?


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

Sounds like you need to replace the valve.


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

Get a fat chick to sit on it while you post an intro.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Better head to an intro quick or they'll have you for dinner.

http://www.plumbingzone.com/f3/


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## gredus (Sep 22, 2011)

*bad valve*

I know I need to replace the valve , just wanted to know if any possible clever idea's was out there to possibly fix the problem


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

gredus said:


> I know I need to replace the valve , just wanted to know if any possible clever idea's was out there to possibly fix the problem


I have one .


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

"Hammer Time"

Hisnotnayheyyyyy


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

gredus said:


> I know I need to replace the valve , just wanted to know if any possible clever idea's was out there to possibly fix the problem


Did you try a Mind Meld?

Your thoughts to my thoughts. . . . .


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## gredus (Sep 22, 2011)

Yes, I tried the Mind Meld


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

Under water welder?


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

gredus said:


> Yes, I tried the Mind Meld


Sure you had the finger spread just right?

13mm between middle finger and index finger is what works for me.

Thumb placement is also very critical.

Shaving your head also helps.


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

You have the internet use it, post an intro, maybe search this site. I do remember a system to install a valve by tapping a water line. I usually just shut the water off and replace valve, but the water is not off long when I do this. The zone is a cool place for info.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Just freeze the line,, and replace the valve ,, that was easy !! Now are you smart enough to know how to freeze it ??? Lol


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## Greenguy (Jan 22, 2011)

Just shark bite it...

Or pro-press a new valve in. 


Better yet do a night shut down when demand is at it's lowest.


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## hroark2112 (Apr 16, 2011)

I've never seen a 3 1/2" valve....


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## Greenguy (Jan 22, 2011)

hroark2112 said:


> I've never seen a 3 1/2" valve....


It's actually a 4" valve before being hit with a pipe stretcher.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

hroark2112 said:


> I've never seen a 3 1/2" valve....


Iv seen lots of them ,,, 3 1/2" O.D. That is


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## incarnatopnh (Feb 1, 2011)

Do a live valve insert. I've used them on 20" watermain when we couldnt shut it down. Expensive but they are a great solution.


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## gredus (Sep 22, 2011)

underwater welding that might get it ! Not ! You can't freeze a line with running water, pro press to iron pipe; maybe not, shark bite, maybe not, our best bet a full shut down to replace that one valve as quickly as possible, thanks for the suggestions. The big problem is that half of the buildings have occupants 24/7, thanks again. Ps. Easttexasplumb, I used the fine points of the mind meld as you listed, maybe the aluminum foil that I cover my head with interfered, next time I'll unglue it.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

gredus said:


> underwater welding that might get it ! Not ! You can't freeze a line with running water, pro press to iron pipe; maybe not, shark bite, maybe not, our best bet a full shut down to replace that one valve as quickly as possible, thanks for the suggestions. The big problem is that half of the buildings have occupants 24/7, thanks again. Ps. Easttexasplumb, I used the fine points of the mind meld as you listed, maybe the aluminum foil that I cover my head with interfered, next time I'll unglue it.


You can freeze a line with it leaking, you never said how bad it was leaking!!! But go ahead and do a shut down,, I'd try freezing it first tho, what do you have to lose,,, hope fully y
Those buildings arnt full of flush valves cuz if they Are you'll have fun bleeding air and cleaning sediment out of them, if they arnt check you could have one stick and have a hell of a mess


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## U666A (Dec 11, 2010)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> You can freeze a line with it leaking, you never said how bad it was leaking!!! But go ahead and do a shut down,, I'd try freezing it first tho, what do you have to lose,,, hope fully y
> Those buildings arnt full of flush valves cuz if they Are you'll have fun bleeding air and cleaning sediment out of them, if they arnt check you could have one stick and have a hell of a mess


You're right, TX. 

Never tried personally, but i doubt you could freeze a "3-1/2" line running at full bore...(still confused about the size in 
question... but whatever) but I have contracted out cryogenic companies to freeze 8" carbon, not under zero flow conditions...

If you've never seen it, you'd be amazed at what some liquid nitrogen and a roll of tinfoil could do to make your life easier...


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

U666A said:


> You're right, TX.
> 
> Never tried personally, but i doubt you could freeze a "3-1/2" line running at full bore...(still confused about the size in
> question... but whatever) but I have contracted out cryogenic companies to freeze 8" carbon, not under zero flow conditions...
> ...


He'll yea kinda scary the first time you do it... We have a canvas bag system we use it works well ,, If I were him I'd put a repair clam on the leak to slow it and then freeze the line ,,,, he said it was steel so I'd bet he measured the o.d... My guess he is in maintenance at a university or some thing like that


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

gredus said:


> ...You can't freeze a line with running water...


You're right. I don't know what ever possessed Tex to think you could freeze 3-1/2" of water. Everyone knows it must be at least 60' wide to freeze. Don't feel bad. Most maintenance men aren't aware that Plumbers do it all the time.

The liquid nitro systems that that UA mentioned are only good for pipe up to 12" and pressures up to 2,000psi. You're right. That would never work for your situation.

By the way, don't tell the folks living near Salmon Falls that moving water doesn't freeze. It'll ruin their Christmas. :laughing:


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

So, you're a plumber, Right?......:whistling2:


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Tommy plumber said:


> So, you're a plumber, Right?......:whistling2:


I was wondering that too


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

gredus said:


> Ps. Easttexasplumb, I used the fine points of the mind meld as you listed, maybe the aluminum foil that I cover my head with interfered, next time I'll unglue it.


 
Go back and read the posts again, give credit where it is due. I did not say anything about mind melds.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

easttexasplumb said:


> Go back and read the posts again, give credit where it is due. I did not say anything about mind melds.


Easy to get confused. I think Mr. Shins was typing with a Southern drawl.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

This by far has always been my favorite image of a burst water pipe damage.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> This by far has always been my favorite image of a burst water pipe damage.


That is awesome!!!


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