# New Sewer



## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

Had one of the local plumbers called me wanting me to camera a sewer for a lady. Said they were going to replace it and wanted me to mark it so they would know where to dig. After I looked at it from the house to the main I found the sewer to be in perfect shape. Told the lady it was just that. I said it had a couple of joints with a few roots and the tap at the city had roots. Told her he had not cleaned it properly. Offered to clean it and get rid of the roots. She said NO it was bad that the plumber told her it needed replaced.
I just HATE it when someone takes advantage of older people in these cases. I could have slicked that pipe to the main and she would not of had any trouble for a long time. Instead she is going to spend money on a new one she doesn't need and if they don't repair the tap she is still going to have trouble. I know this plumbers reputation and he will just furnco it just before the main so he doesn't have to mess with the tap.

Just venting guys, I just hate these things sometimes.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Roto-Rooter said:


> Had one of the local plumbers called me wanting me to camera a sewer for a lady. Said they were going to replace it and wanted me to mark it so they would know where to dig. After I looked at it from the house to the main I found the sewer to be in perfect shape. Told the lady it was just that. I said it had a couple of joints with a few roots and the tap at the city had roots. Told her he had not cleaned it properly. Offered to clean it and get rid of the roots. She said NO it was bad that the plumber told her it needed replaced.
> I just HATE it when someone takes advantage of older people in these cases. I could have slicked that pipe to the main and she would not of had any trouble for a long time. Instead she is going to spend money on a new one she doesn't need and if they don't repair the tap she is still going to have trouble. I know this plumbers reputation and he will just furnco it just before the main so he doesn't have to mess with the tap.
> 
> Just venting guys, I just hate these things sometimes.


unfortunalty, when you are a sub to someone, and you come across something like this, you should have talked to the plumber not HIS customer,and offer to do the work and steal HIS customer and find out what the story behind changing the sewer main and let him know it might be wrong to do it..now im sure the customer will tell the plumber what you said and you wont be getting another call from him, and im sure he will bad mouth you to HIS customer..I think you did yourself more harm here...if one of my subs did that, there would be hell to pay, come talk to me first and then ill make a decision..but, I dont look to screw people over so most likley it wouldnt come to that..life isnt always fair..


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Good job Roto! F**k that thief! Who cares if he never calls you again, I'd never work for a crook like that again anyway. 


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

Drain Pro said:


> Good job Roto! F**k that thief! Who cares if he never calls you again, I'd never work for a crook like that again anyway.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks Drain Pro. He is a crook most of the time. I usually follow him around opening up what he can't. The main reason I cameraed this one for him is I know the lady and wanted to help her out so they didn't dig the yard up looking for it. 
Also he puts in a lot of C/O's for people and EVERYTIME he will put a 3" C/O on a 4" pipe. Just grips my a**. I have ask him several times to not do it that way BUT!!!!!!!
Just more venting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Roto-Rooter said:


> Thanks Drain Pro. He is a crook most of the time. I usually follow him around opening up what he can't. The main reason I cameraed this one for him is I know the lady and wanted to help her out so they didn't dig the yard up looking for it.
> Also he puts in a lot of C/O's for people and EVERYTIME he will put a 3" C/O on a 4" pipe. Just grips my a**. I have ask him several times to not do it that way BUT!!!!!!!
> Just more venting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Got a question, not looking to start anything here..if you knew the lady and she knew you..why did she hire somebody else to do the original work??


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> Got a question, not looking to start anything here..if you knew the lady and she knew you..why did she hire somebody else to do the original work??


I wish I could answer that.

I looked on the books when I got back home and it had lasted her 4 years since I cleaned it the last time. Doesn't make since to me. 
I would say he was there to fix some of the plumbing and talked here into this.

He is NOT a sewer cleaner. In fact when he does do one he has to go rent a machine to do it.


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Roto-Rooter said:


> I wish I could answer that.
> 
> I looked on the books when I got back home and it had lasted her 4 years since I cleaned it the last time. Doesn't make since to me.
> I would say he was there to fix some of the plumbing and talked here into this.
> ...


hmm, I would give the lady a call and ask why she went with him, I do that under the same circumstances to see if there was any problems they had with prior service or repairs, if for nothing else just some input on what happened and why..many times we leave thinking the customer is happy , only to find out not, and they dont call to resolve an issue, they just go elsewhere..


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

With all these problems for years and years, 

sounds like it needs to be replaced to the tap


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

It appears the customer is tired of paying to have it rodded, by you or anyone else. Just because he offered this repair does not mean he is a crook.


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## cable or root (Oct 7, 2015)

There's a fine line. In some people's minds root intrusion means a defective sewer that needs replaced. In others the line just needs cleaned everyonce in a while. But it's the "oh my god! You have a root ball the size of my fist growing in there! Your line must be broken! That's the worst root I've ever seen!" Mother fu€Kers I can't stand. That whole act is disgusting thievery.

For me to suggest repair or replacement I either have to pull back mud see an offset over an inch or see bottomed out pipe or misshapen sdr35. The only exception is orangeburg. Roots are not an issue and can be dealt with.


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

I have the same type of thing happen with water heaters. It will be 3-4 year old State and the plumber says how it's a piece of junk and then replace it with an AO Smith. 

I know some elderly people like to have their affairs in order so they don't pass a burden on to their children. 

At the end of the day you can only control how to run Your business, be honest with your customers and they should come back to you. In this case maybe the lady thought you didn't want to see it replaced so you could continue to clean it for her. 





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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

GREENPLUM said:


> With all these problems for years and years,
> 
> sounds like it needs to be replaced to the tap


If you would have seen it on the camera it was n perfect shape. Jus because it had a few roots doesn't mean the whole thing needed replaced.




ChrisConnor said:


> It appears the customer is tired of paying to have it rodded, by you or anyone else. Just because he offered this repair does not mean he is a crook.


You don't know this guy!!!!!!!


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

cable or root said:


> There's a fine line. In some people's minds root intrusion means a defective sewer that needs replaced. In others the line just needs cleaned everyonce in a while. But it's the "oh my god! You have a root ball the size of my fist growing in there! Your line must be broken! That's the worst root I've ever seen!" Mother fu€Kers I can't stand. That whole act is disgusting thievery.
> 
> For me to suggest repair or replacement I either have to pull back mud see an offset over an inch or see bottomed out pipe or misshapen sdr35. The only exception is orangeburg. Roots are not an issue and can be dealt with.


I agree with you to a point. But a sewer back up in a finished area can be costly. I used to believe the same thing. We are on an epa infiltration project and i thought it was total bs at first. They flow monitored the laterals before we started lining the laterals for a year. Were a third of the way through on the first phase and they have reduced the infiltration of clean water into the sanitary by 70%. That is a lot of water that is being treated at a treatment plant let alone reducing overflows in a rain event. If the roots penetrate a pipe it is an active area to introduce infiltration. I dont disagree cleaning a sewer to by time but in the end they will eventually need to be replaced.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

The whole situation is bazaar. Why aren't you handling everything, all or nothing

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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

It does seem odd, how is the guy going to know the sewer needs to be replaced or how much to charge if he doesn't know the condition or depth. 

I'm doing a sewer replacement as part of a large room addition for the GC. His plumber underbid me by $1200 but never ran a camera.


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## Cuda (Mar 16, 2009)

I always have to remember that we are all in different population areas, I too use to think that if the pipe had grade and the bottom had not worn out to being 20 grit sandpaper and just some roots that it was fine. But in overly populated areas this is not the case anymore infiltration is expensive because it causes city sanitary systems to overflow and dump into the lakes and rivers when it cant keep up and treat the sewage. Then it evaporates into the atmosphere and rains back down to earth on us hits the water table and repeats. Also then there is exfiltration where the sewer does not take in water but lets the sewage out and makes the ground soft then the pipe sinks on it's own weight and if it goes on long enough trenchless repair may not be possible and excavation will cost the owner more. Plus that same sewage contaminates the ground into the water table and flows to the lakes and rivers and sea again and the whole bad vicious circle starts again. Bigger populations are bigger problems that have to be dealt with or it will just get worse for our kids and grandkids. In smaller towns you could probably not have to worry as much but it is still a concern. You haven't seen a sewer until after a good snow and it's melting and the sewer is acting like a french drain at the separations.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> unfortunalty, when you are a sub to someone, and you come across something like this, you should have talked to the plumber not HIS customer,and offer to do the work and steal HIS customer and find out what the story behind changing the sewer main and let him know it might be wrong to do it..now im sure the customer will tell the plumber what you said and you wont be getting another call from him, and im sure he will bad mouth you to HIS customer..I think you did yourself more harm here...if one of my subs did that, there would be hell to pay, come talk to me first and then ill make a decision..but, I dont look to screw people over so most likley it wouldnt come to that..life isnt always fair..


What he said


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

GREENPLUM said:


> With all these problems for years and years,
> 
> sounds like it needs to be replaced to the tap


Agreeeeeee,it needs to be replaced,like it or not but the plumber made the right call imo


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## saysflushable (Jun 15, 2009)

It didn't take long after I got my 1st camera to realize the under ground business is about as shady as you can get. Used car salesmen must graduate to under ground work after they have proven themselves sleazy enough.

For those that do a good job for the Home owner my hat is off to you.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

saysflushable said:


> It didn't take long after I got my 1st camera to realize the under ground business is about as shady as you can get. Used car salesmen must graduate to under ground work after they have proven themselves sleazy enough.
> 
> For those that do a good job for the Home owner my hat is off to you.


I go out and do my best everyday to find the right solution. From a simple cleaning, to a pipe patch, to a whole line replacement. Ive probably walked away from more sewers then i have sold that competitors have scared the customers to death and alls it needed was a simple cleaning. Thats why $99 dollar drain cleaning evolved. my company will never be as big as some of them but i will sleep just fine at night knowing i made the best options available to my customers and didnt use a scare tactic to do it.


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

sparky said:


> Agreeeeeee,it needs to be replaced,like it or not but the plumber made the right call imo


The trouble is he will have a** it (as always) and I know he will not repair the tap. So I did my best to save the homeowner some money and make it right. Shame on me!!!!!!!


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

Roto-Rooter said:


> The trouble is he will have a** it (as always) and I know he will not repair the tap. So I did my best to save the homeowner some money and make it right. Shame on me!!!!!!!


Nobody is shaming you. You did what you thought was right and you owned it! People disagree on everything. I just had a call 10 minutes ago from a fellow zoner that i did a pipe burst for at a car dealership. The job done months ago and it was a tough one. The place backed up inside the building nowhere near where we worked. If that line we put in was the problem i would own it! Even if it was 10 years from now i would own it! I know he was stressing till he found out it wasnt us, but Plungerboy, go in there and make some money cleaning the bad area!


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Scott will knock 'em dead 


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Roto-Rooter said:


> The trouble is he will have a** it (as always) and I know he will not repair the tap. So I did my best to save the homeowner some money and make it right. Shame on me!!!!!!!


Here is a question, is continuing to rod the sewer making it right?


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

ChrisConnor said:


> Here is a question, is continuing to rod the sewer making it right?



It can be. Depends on the customers financial situation. If it costs an 80 year old lady 200 bucks a year to rod vs 8 grand for a new liner, it probably makes sense to continue to rod. 


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Drain Pro said:


> It can be. Depends on the customers financial situation. If it costs an 80 year old lady 200 bucks a year to rod vs 8 grand for a new liner, it probably makes sense to continue to rod.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


unless the customer is sick and tired of raw sewage backups in the basement, that s why I said in an earlier post he should have talked with the plumber why he is replacing the sewer..not tell the customer she doesnt need it...communication is the key to success and less hard feelings..if after talking with the plumber and having him say the sewer is fine but I sold it anyway, then it could be an option to explain to the lady whats happening, but nor before..


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

If a customer is sick and tired of raw sewage in their basement, I'd suggest preventive maintenance. In many cases it's more cost effective than a new line. Don't forget, even new lines can clog. 


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Drain Pro said:


> If a customer is sick and tired of raw sewage in their basement, I'd suggest preventive maintenance. In many cases it's more cost effective than a new line. Don't forget, even new lines can clog.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


true, but in this situation he should have had conversation with the plumber, since the lady was NOT his customer...and was called to the job by the plumber..


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

If Roto felt that the plumber was being dishonest, then I'm all for him shouting him out. I too, will not cover for a thief. 


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Drain Pro said:


> If Roto felt that the plumber was being dishonest, then I'm all for him shouting him out. I too, will not cover for a thief.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


he assumed , if he actually talked to the plumber , then he would have know either way for fact..and then take action..for all you know the lady got a grant to fix the sewer, or some other source of money to have it done, but not talking to the plumber first, the true facts are not known..not looking for a drawn out argument, but if your called to a job as a sub and have any issues, you talk to whoever called you to that job...


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

I disagree, particularly if the guy that contracted me is a crook. I'm not saying that's the case here but I've read enough of Roto's posts to know that he's a competent and decent guy who's been around for a long time. If he said that the line didn't need to be replaced, then that's good enough for me. 


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

Drain Pro said:


> I disagree, particularly if the guy that contracted me is a crook. I'm not saying that's the case here but I've read enough of Roto's posts to know that he's a competent and decent guy who's been around for a long time. If he said that the line didn't need to be replaced, then that's good enough for me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


if the guy is a known crook then why keep showing up to help him? his money is good to get paid, but not good enough to at least give the respect of talking the job over with...


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

Drain Pro said:


> I disagree, particularly if the guy that contracted me is a crook. I'm not saying that's the case here but I've read enough of Roto's posts to know that he's a competent and decent guy who's been around for a long time. If he said that the line didn't need to be replaced, then that's good enough for me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





ShtRnsdownhill said:


> if the guy is a known crook then why keep showing up to help him? his money is good to get paid, but not good enough to at least give the respect of talking the job over with...


I showed up to help the homeowner. She paid me for the camera work. If I had of done it for him ( I Know ) he would have doubled my camera price to her. That would have cost her twice plus the new sewer which didn't need to be replaced just cleaned. Small town knowledge sometimes is a good thing.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Roto-Rooter said:


> I showed up to help the homeowner. She paid me for the camera work. If I had of done it for him ( I Know ) he would have doubled my camera price to her. That would have cost her twice plus the new sewer which didn't need to be replaced just cleaned.


Sounds like you have a lot of resentment towards this guy that you insist is a crook. If he's that bad, why did you take the call in the first place.


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> Sounds like you have a lot of resentment towards this guy that you insist is a crook. If he's that bad, why did you take the call in the first place.


That and how does Roto know how many other drain cleaners or plumbers the customer has called in the 4 years since she called him.

Myself, I use different companies for services I buy, be it a grocery store or mechanic. I think staying with the same vendor limits choices. Too, not every person who has bought from me likes me nor I them. Roto may be a great poster, but that Swastika tat on his forehead could turn off some people.


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