# jet pump ?



## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Shallow well jet pump call. Brand new pump and tank. Bladder set at 28 psi on a 30/50 switch pump mounted on tank and new check valve. When it would call for water the psi switch chatters. No idea why, tried a different psi switch just in case. Same issue. Psi switch line is clear. Runs fine from 0 psi till satisfied just not from 30psi unless I manually close the switch. Called a few plumbers and a well company with no help. Any ideas ?


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

dclarke said:


> Shallow well jet pump call. Brand new pump and tank. Bladder set at 28 psi on a 30/50 switch pump mounted on tank and new check valve. When it would call for water the psi switch chatters. No idea why, tried a different psi switch just in case. Same issue. Psi switch line is clear. Runs fine from 0 psi till satisfied just not from 30psi unless I manually close the switch. Called a few plumbers and a well company with no help. Any ideas ?


Where the check valve located??


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Its right on the front of the pump.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

dclarke said:


> Its right on the front of the pump.


If I recall, only check valve shud be at the foot inlet to keep the line primed.. if u have 2, one at the pump and one footvalve.. that line won't 'see' the pressure.


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

Is that a new pressure gauge? The galvanized fittings look used,maybe the guage is reading wrong.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

I re look at the pix... something fishy about the setup and can't 'see' it as its been so long I worked on shallow well pump. What's with the glav fitting when all others are cpvc and pvc?? No primer on the inlet??


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

Why is that ball valve closed? Did you purge the air from the system?


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Its all new. The other plumber and helper from the company was there the day before and i have no idea what was done but the pump and tank were in the crawl. I was told it was extremely tight and unable to work on anything so he decided to move it into the laundry room above.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

The valve is closed just to isolate the pump and tank from the house. The galvanized is just because we never thread plastic straight into a pump. The pump has prime and all the air is out. Like I said it builds pressure and there is water everywhere. The check valve is holding its just at cut in the switch would chatter.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Where's Missisippiguy, he's real good with jet pump troubleshooting and set up.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

In my parts we have a lot of jet pumps. We also have crap water. Another call today was pex piped. Guy said 6 years old and I had to replace 4 crimp fittings because the water ate holes through the brass.


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

Use the troubleshooting guide and check everything. I don't work on enough of these things to be much help.

http://flotecpump.com/residentialpage_resource_ts_jetpump.aspx


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## PlumbDumber (Aug 7, 2013)

The pressure on the bladder tank should be checked with te pump off & the tank empty. The bladder should be inflated to 4 PSI below the pressure switch cut-in pressure.

Since your pressure gauge and the pressure switch may not be in complete agreement, first check to see what the gauge shows at cut-off & compare to the 50 PSI setting of the switch to determine how close they are to each other.

If chattering continues, you can get a device called a "Pulsation plug" (AKA " the little Pink Pill ") from a pump supply. It is a small plastic disc with a very small orifice that you would place in the inlet of your pressure switch to slow down the transfer of hydrualic pressure to the switch.

If you can't find one, I will pull one out of my stock & mail it to you.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I always do 2 psi less than cut in pressure. I had the bladder as low as 16 on a 30/50. Its fixed. I did use a pulsation plug. I had never heard of it before. My only issue with it was it made the pressure switch cut out at 40 not 50. The pressure gauge was reading proper cut in and cut out before the plug. I adjusted it and its fine but cut out is cranked way down to get 50 psi


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Checked my other web site on shallow well, one of the trouble shooting is having a check valve and fittings too close to inlet of pump will causes cavation.. creating air and airbounded. Said to have 10 pipe dia for the TEL .. or play it safe.. 2 ft.


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## PlumbDumber (Aug 7, 2013)

From the picture, that appears to be a Sta-rite SND or SNE pump (3/4 or 1 HP Pump). The tank is awfully small for that pump. The outlet of the pump appears to be bushed down to 3/4". The piping should be full size of the pump outlet (1") from the pump to the tank. Then the feed to the system can be reduced to 3/4".

The reduction of piping size & the size of the tank may be the cause of the chatter.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I have never heard of or had an issue with the check valve to close


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

It is a sta-rite I believe 1/2 horse. I was just working with what I was given. I would have had a larger tank had I been the one making the calls but the rest would have been the same. Never had an issue with a bushing out the top but I will definitely keep it in mind. Im all for learning new ways and reasoning behind them.


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## PlumbDumber (Aug 7, 2013)

The instructions on the bladder tanks that I use changed several years ago to 4 PSI below. Prior to that, they said 2 PSI. I just went with their instructions. We do loads of pump work down here.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

PlumbDumber said:


> The instructions on the bladder tanks that I use changed several years ago to 4 PSI below. Prior to that, they said 2 PSI. I just went with their instructions. We do loads of pump work down here.


That's new to me and thanks for posting..


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I was wondering how long it would take for someone to suggest a pulsation plug. Like I said I had never heard of such a thing until today and had I not had it I'd still be there trying to figure it out.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Its a lowes utilitech tank. I would never use one of them but it wasn't my call on this job.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

With all that trouble.. I would blow out the well and installed sub pump and tank setup inside..


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

The well was fine. Primed extremely easy and developed plenty of water.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

dclarke said:


> Its a lowes utilitech tank. I would never use one of them but it wasn't my call on this job.


How ur company would buy it from Lowes?? Esp if ya in the shallow water area with pump supply houses around??


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Because the other plumber likes parts shopping at night and is an idiot


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## PlumbDumber (Aug 7, 2013)

rjbphd said:


> If I recall, only check valve shud be at the foot inlet to keep the line primed.. if u have 2, one at the pump and one footvalve.. that line won't 'see' the pressure.


As stated, if the check valve is at the pump, the suction line never sees the pressure when the pump is a rest. If that suction line ever developes a leak, it is almost impossible to locate.

Our code always called for the check valve to be as close to the well as possible. I *NEVER* want a check valve at the pump. When a customer gives me a Flo-tec pump with a built in check valve to install, I dis-able it I install a proper one at the well.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

Definitely makes sense to me. Its just something I've never thought about. This has just been standard practice around here from everything I've ever seen. Around here the check is always at the pump.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

dclarke said:


> Definitely makes sense to me. Its just something I've never thought about. This has just been standard practice around here from everything I've ever seen. Around here the check is always at the pump.


Not here in Illinois.. they want only want check valve at the sub pump, so the drop pipe, pitless adt and the service line to tank is always under pressure.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

It is weird how different things are in other parts of the country.


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## jtmell (Apr 27, 2013)

In my opinion the pump discharge has been reduced,
It is also too long a distance to the tank.
This would cause the pump switch to cycle rapidly as if you had no tank at all.


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

The tank is less than 5' of pipe from the tank and every pump I see in this area is reduces immediately


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## jtmell (Apr 27, 2013)

A 3/4 90 is equal to 4.4 feet . I count 5 turns to the tank


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

jtmell said:


> A 3/4 90 is equal to 4.4 feet . I count 5 turns to the tank


Never heard that one and it doesn't really make sense I could see each 90 counting as longer than the 90 but not 4.4 feet.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

dclarke said:


> Never heard that one and it doesn't really make sense I could see each 90 counting as longer than the 90 but not 4.4 feet.


Oh man..defly not a gas pipe fitter here


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

rjbphd said:


> Oh man..defly not a gas pipe fitter here


Definitely not.


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