# Habitat for oh the Humanity



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

here are some pics of a house I did for Habitat


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

*more pics*

More pvc rough pics


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I can't remember why I went horizontal on the kitchen sink vent so low. I must have had a reason and the inspector passed it. Now I usually dirty arm the kitchen drain.


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

If we installed a laundry trap that close to the floor we would fail an inspection. Looks good.


----------



## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Great pix. I noticed the wetwall. When I frame a house I always try to include a wetwall. (2x6 framing) Its so much easier to get the plumbing in it. 

Noticed you double 45'd out from the bottom plate. (pix 3) Did the foundation get in the way??


----------



## 22rifle (Jun 14, 2008)

Looking good man. Someone has some pride in their work. I also notice you "think" like I do with how you run your pipes, etc. Got some questions.

1. Why the size increase on the vent? That cold where you are? (I know the UPC at least has requirements for it in certain areas.)

2. Why a 2" outlet on the KS?

3. What kind of glue and primer?


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Illinois code doesn't make you increase anymore. It used to, and some inspectors still make you do it, even if it isn't needed. I used regular purple primer and cold weather glue. You are right, I used the 45's because of the footing.


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Illinois code doesn't make you increase anymore. It used to, and some inspectors still make you do it, even if it isn't needed. I used regular purple primer and cold weather glue. You are right, I used the 45's because of the footing.


Far as I know, you still have to run 3" out the roof here in IL. Transition made by a smooth increaser 12" or more below the roof.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Minimum roof penetration is 3". A 3" stack doesn't need to be increased.


----------



## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Minimum roof penetration is 3". A 3" stack doesn't need to be increased.


In Chicago it still does.


----------



## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> If we installed a laundry trap that close to the floor we would fail an inspection. Looks good.


It's also a crown vent. Not allowed in IPC.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

What makes it a crown? Does there have to be so many inches per pipe diameter between the tee and the trap?


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

This is shameful, but I can't remember the max drop into a trap is. If it's more than 34," that's an illegal install:whistling2:


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Minimum roof penetration is 3". A 3" stack doesn't need to be increased.


 
Forgot about the increased stack in the photo. I had 2" on the brain when I typed that.:whistling2:


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> What makes it a crown? Does there have to be so many inches per pipe diameter between the tee and the trap?


2 pipe diams. So 4"


----------



## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> 2 pipe diams. So 4"


Correct, JJ installed what is essentially an S-trap.


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Killertoiletspider said:


> Correct, JJ installed what is essentially an S-trap.


Good job Jeff!:laughing::jester:


----------



## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

No cleanouts required on kitchen and laundry?


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

smellslike$tome said:


> It's also a crown vent. Not allowed in IPC.


Only thing wrong I see under UPC Code is trap from floor to low and stand pipe to long and no clean out, that's it, it is not a s-trap.


----------



## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

Looks great!


----------



## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

Agree with ILPlumber.


----------



## Kyle181 (Sep 5, 2008)

yeah thats definately not an s trap looks good dude


----------



## 22rifle (Jun 14, 2008)

Wow, you are neat with the primer.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

The kitchen sink cleanout is installed on the trim. I use a 2"x1-1/2" wye, with a 2" cleanout and plug. Yeah, I pride myself on being neat with the primer. I don't dilute it or anything, I shake the dauber into a empty cardboard box that I sweep the wood shavings into. Really helps with neatness.


----------



## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

jjbex said:


> The kitchen sink cleanout is installed on the trim. I use a 2"x1-1/2" wye, with a 2" cleanout and plug. Yeah, I pride myself on being neat with the primer. I don't dilute it or anything, I shake the dauber into a empty cardboard box that I sweep the wood shavings into. Really helps with neatness.


I found that clear pvc glue and clear primer...that's all I buy now.


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Plumber said:


> I found that clear pvc glue and clear primer...that's all I buy now.


More often than not, the inspector requires purple primer.:thumbsup:


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

That's purple primer in them pictures.


----------



## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

ILPlumber said:


> More often than not, the inspector requires purple primer.:thumbsup:


Not here---or at least not me. 



jjbex said:


> That's purple primer in them pictures.


Sick.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I think there is 4" between the trap seal and the face of the vent. If so, it's not a crown vent. I will put those fittings together and measure it up.


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Distance between a trap and the vent for 2" is 5' according to my code, I see no problem with what you have there.


----------



## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

jjbex said:


> I think there is 4" between the trap seal and the face of the vent. If so, it's not a crown vent. I will put those fittings together and measure it up.


I know more than one Chicago inspector that would fail it as an S-trap, they want the horizontal piping twice the center to center measurement distance of the trap inlet and outlet.


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

JJ you better listen to KTS he is in your state, if you listen to me or anyone else not from there, we will tell you the wrong way. Just ignore what I have said, sure you already have.


----------



## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> JJ you better listen to KTS he is in your state, if you listen to me or anyone else not from there, we will tell you the wrong way.


You may well be right Ron, Chicago code and Illinois code are two completely different things, and he probably knows state code far better than I do, I rarely deal with it.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I will try to post illustrations from the Illinois code.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

*crown vent illustration*

Here it is from the Illinois code


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Guess you will need to take a measurement, a crown vent is not even mentioned in my code.


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Here it is from the Illinois code


Your code sinks, that is a legal connection by my code.


----------



## 3KP (Jun 19, 2008)

Nice clean looking work:thumbup:


----------



## pzmember (Sep 20, 2008)

nice work jj. ive done enough of those habitat houses. that hole in the floor for the crawlspace is bringing back bad memories. i finally got a cooridinator who would actually be ready for me and i had those suckers down to 6 hours rough-in by myself.


----------



## IlliniPlumber (Mar 2, 2009)

Looks good except for, the trap is crown vented! (890.1480.a) Illinois plumbing code.
No trap vent shall be installed within two pipe diameters of the trap weir. 
Also see 890.410g)1) Illinois plumbing code. Concealed trap requires a cleanout with 3' of the trap. Must be readily accessible as well.


----------



## afterburner (Mar 22, 2009)

nice job very clean,although the traparm appears too short here the length must be at least 2x the dia. otherwise it's an s-trap


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I went back and looked at these pics, Illinois code lets you have a longer drop on w.m. standpipes, so mine is legal. Also, there is a cleanout in the crawl for the w.m. drain. It could still be nitpicked as a crown vent, though.


----------



## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

Hey JJ, good looking work! That laundry standpipe is within 2 pipe sizes of the drain. That may siphon. It passed I am guessing?


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Yeah, it passed. No call backs, so I guess the trap doesn't siphon out.


----------



## sikxsevn (Jun 23, 2009)

jjbex said:


> here are some pics of a house I did for Habitat


3rd pic, the p-trap is glued on backwards


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I used to know what the deal was with them, I don't do enough construction now to remember the difference.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

jjbex said:


> Yeah, it passed. No call backs, so I guess the trap doesn't siphon out.


Nice of you to volunteer and you do very neat and clean work. Now for the critic.....please do not take offense. We all plumb different and thats ok.:thumbsup: I would have did the vent for the kitchen sink in the attic section on 45 degree angles instead of the 90's and used (2) fittings instead of the Sant. cross in the attic. Used a fixture drain in the wall for the k-sink instead of off-setting the vent in the wall. The washing machine p-trap is crown vented but just because its crown vented doesn't mean it will not work just fine.....and I see why you did it and I woulda did it too.We do not increase vents here due to freeze...no freeze here. The p-trap does appear to be glued backwards as to in-flow and outflow as another poster said......but all that is nitpicking B.S. great job JJ:thumbsup:


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

45's wouldn't have worked on the kitchen drain vent in the attic, that *roof* is too flat. That's why I went sideways and made a swing joint. Thinking about it, I should have came up for the k.s. next to the window, and dirty armed over for the lookout. My excuse is that's how we did it when I was an apprentice bungalow buster. I really don't do residential construction, so this was all a poke and a hope. I really appreciate constructive criticism, it helps me grow Mean spirited criticism is okay, if it makes me laugh:jester:


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

jjbex said:


> 45's wouldn't have worked on the kitchen drain vent in the attic, that rough is too flat. That's why I went sideways and made a swing joint. Thinking about it, I should have came up for the k.s. next to the window, and dirty armed over for the lookout. My excuse is that's how we did it when I was an apprentice bungalow buster. I really don't do residential construction, so this was all a poke and a hope. I really appreciate constructive criticism, it helps me grow Mean spirited criticism is okay, if it makes me laugh:jester:


 Maybe use the elusive 60 degree fitting in that case or 22.5+45 to bypass the truss and then shoot a 45 directly into a upside down 3x2 sant tee. Would have been easier and cheaper to just go straight through the roof....on second look at the pics. One roof jack would be cheaper than using all those fittings.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Those fittings were sitting at the house waiting for me to use them, so the cost was nothing. I would rather have as few roof penetrations as possible.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

jjbex said:


> Those fittings were sitting at the house waiting for me to use them, so the cost was nothing. I would rather have as few roof penetrations as possible.[/quote
> We dont have basements here or snow.......we have alot of old houses that have a crawl space thats about 24" tall.....so you cant clean the drain from underneath......rarely is there a cleanout stubbed outside. I hop on the roof and run a cable down the stack to clean the drain if it cloggs. All the newer homes and "MOST" oldr homes on slabs had a cleanout in the wall......but alot of times its behind bushes and just not very friendly....so its easy to jump on the roof.....as you can see thats why i didn't care for the set up in the pics for the k-sink. I understand you have a basement....I try to read the threads completely,somtimes I get distracted! good man:thumbsup:


----------



## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

I would automatically have dirty-armed the kitchen. But the code says that if it isn't 6" above the flood rim of the fixture you have to run it in sch. 40, so it's all good.

I thought the washer standpipe was a bit tall, and I'm guessing that the box is more than 48" from the floor to the top of the box? I always made the top of my box at 48" and the hold through the stud at 8" off the floor.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Master,
I put the c/o for the k.s. in on the trim I use a 2" x 1.5" wye. We have c/o at the base of every stack and at every turn of direction in basements and crawlspaces. I have seen some houses that had 10 c/o's in them. However, Illinois code doesn't make us put a 3" c/o in the bathroom for every toilet. I would like to see that.


----------



## Double-A (Aug 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Here it is from the Illinois code



Its not crown vented... look at the drawing. The distance A is on the trap arm. The trap arm ends at the beginning of the change of direction, the same point your vent starts. In order for a crown vent to exist, you must continue the horizontal travel of the arm past the vent before a change of direction.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Double-A said:


> Its not crown vented... look at the drawing. The distance A is on the trap arm. The trap arm ends at the beginning of the change of direction, the same point your vent starts. In order for a crown vent to exist, you must continue the horizontal travel of the arm past the vent before a change of direction.


 No where does it say that you must continue the travel of the arm past the vent before a change of direction. Read the definition above the pic.


----------



## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

No matter where you are that's a crown vent and an s trap although it can not self siphon because of the crown vent. Regardless though the trap arm needs to be 2 x the pipe diameter before connecting to the san tee or whatever fitting takes the waste down. That will not pass anywhere where the inspector knows his stuff.


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I have cut open many walls and found the laundry to be piped just like that. They never had any problems working that way. It may be illegal, but it will work forever without a problem. Just because it's against code doesn't mean that it won't work perfectly, and just because something is within code doesn’t mean it will work well if at all. Codes are updated frequently because they are imperfect. Don't let people who are code book thumping plumbing Nazis get under your skin man. 

That work looks fine to me. I might have done a thing or two different but doesn't make your work wrong.


----------

