# Shower Pan's



## Jeff (Oct 12, 2010)

Have a city that's making us water test shower pans on the rough?
No big deal, I actually take pride in my pans. Well did my first one to be tested
and it leaked? I even went as far as not cutting the hole for the drain, still leaked? so I called another plumber buddy who started laughing, because he went through the same problem. Had to go to a pond equipment store to buy a special calk, 50$ a tube and use it on the bolt threads, it held. A 2 hour shower pan! so, just a heads up if you have to go through this.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

squirt silicone under the pan around the drain after you cut your hole and it wont leak





Jeff said:


> Have a city that's making us water test shower pans on the rough?
> No big deal, I actually take pride in my pans. Well did my first one to be tested
> and it leaked? I even went as far as not cutting the hole for the drain, still leaked? so I called another plumber buddy who started laughing, because he went through the same problem. Had to go to a pond equipment store to buy a special calk, 50$ a tube and use it on the bolt threads, it held. A 2 hour shower pan! so, just a heads up if you have to go through this.


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## Jeff (Oct 12, 2010)

I have talked to a hand full of plumbers, and everyone of them had a problem.
If you dont take precautions they will leak. Your right though, some guy's are laying down some silicone. This should be fun come February here in MI.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

that is what our inspectors want is silicone





Jeff said:


> I have talked to a hand full of plumbers, and everyone of them had a problem.
> If you dont take precautions they will leak. Your right though, some guy's are laying down some silicone. This should be fun come February here in MI.


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## Pal (Jun 12, 2010)

I put cilicone under the pan on the strainer and on the top of the pan where the flange is secured by the bolts.


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

Pal said:


> I put cilicone under the pan on the strainer and on the top of the pan where the flange is secured by the bolts.


not on top, you defeat the purpose of the weep holes that way dude :thumbup:

and we always test shower pans, i think you would be foolish not to


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## Epox (Sep 19, 2010)

Do you get inspectors to sign off standing test? If not you should.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

yes



mpsllc said:


> Do you get inspectors to sign off standing test? If not you should.


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## LEAD INGOT (Jul 15, 2009)

Schluter/Kerdi. These leak problems will disappear.


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## Proud Plumber (Sep 15, 2008)

Our inspectors are now requiring they inspect a pre slope before the pans are installed. Now we have plumbers on the loose with cement trowels floating floors... Hilarious 

it amazes me how many different ways people screw up shower pans, when it is actually easier to do them properly. I found one last week the installer actually cut in the corners of the pan with a knife, and used drywall screws to tack it to the bottom plate of the framing. That is a lot of extra work.


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## Proud Plumber (Sep 15, 2008)

house plumber said:


> that is what our inspectors want is silicone


Ours are asking us too as well now except they only want it between the flange and bottom of the pan. They want the top left dry.


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## DownHill (Oct 15, 2010)

Please STOP testing shower pans. 

I need more bathrooms to remodel...:tongue_smilie:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

yeah never do the top. you'll block the weep holes





Proud Plumber said:


> Ours are asking us too as well now except they only want it between the flange and bottom of the pan. They want the top left dry.


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## pdxplumber (Nov 21, 2009)

Am I the only one not doing shower pans? Around here the tile guy does the pan. Plumbers install fiberglass pans but never heard of a plumber building the pan. I'm not proud of it but I can't say I would want to do it.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

pdxplumber said:


> Am I the only one not doing shower pans? Around here the tile guy does the pan. Plumbers install fiberglass pans but never heard of a plumber building the pan. I'm not proud of it but I can't say I would want to do it.



Same here PDX but you do know we are the ones responsible that it gets installed correctly, it is in our code book. It can come back and nip us in the arsie if it leaks in the future and the issue is pushed about who installed it.


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## DownHill (Oct 15, 2010)

Installed and tested every one.


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

pdxplumber said:


> Am I the only one not doing shower pans?


Maybe. Probably.



> Around here the tile guy does the pan.


Including the liner? Oh... that's... just scary.  But I suppose they can learn to do it as good as anyone.



> Plumbers install fiberglass pans but never heard of a plumber building the pan. I'm not proud of it but I can't say I would want to do it.


We don't usually "build" the pan. Here at least, the carpenters block it and build the threshold. Then I come in and install my drain, mask it off and pour a sloped sub-base with topping mix (sand mix). I trowel that as accurately sloped as I can and let it set overnight. Next day I come back with a shop vac and a block of wood - give it a good scrub while it's still green to smooth out any rough spots - then vacuum thoroughly. Then install the liner (yes, silicone under the liner around the drain and none on top) and fill test to the rim. Leave tested as long as possible. I can't remember ever having a leak in any of my liner installs.

After that it's the tile guy's job to do the pour on top of the liner and tile it.


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## PlumberPete (Nov 14, 2009)

I always use a copper shower pan. Tried and True. Never have a leak. I have a local metal shop fabricate the pan for me. I sweat a brass shower drain in place. Now it's up to the tile guy to do the rest.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

pdxplumber said:


> Am I the only one not doing shower pans? Around here the tile guy does the pan. Plumbers install fiberglass pans but never heard of a plumber building the pan. I'm not proud of it but I can't say I would want to do it.


You are not the only one. We do not do them, the tile guy does them.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

the tile man does them cheaper than me so i dont do them at all anymore. 

i like it this way


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

I too install the shower pan liner, however I don't slope the base. I usually get the GC to do it for me and then I install the liner, and yes 100% silicone under the liner and on top of the drain. Then when I install the clamping ring on top, it seals well. Snug the (4) bolts down well. 

Once I had a shower with a bench and funny angles and it leaked on the test, but that is exactly why we test. Had to rip out the leaker and start anew. I want to find a leak when testing, not later after HO is living in home.

I find it hard to believe there are plumbers NOT testing shw pans after installs.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> I too install the shower pan liner, however I don't slope the base. I usually get the GC to do it for me and then I install the liner, and yes 100% silicone under the liner and on top of the drain. Then when I install the clamping ring on top, it seals well. Snug the (4) bolts down well.
> 
> Once I had a shower with a bench and funny angles and it leaked on the test, but that is exactly why we test. Had to rip out the leaker and start anew. I want to find a leak when testing, not later after HO is living in home.
> 
> I find it hard to believe there are plumbers NOT testing shw pans after installs.


Here the tile guys always install the pans, weird I know.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I do them too. All I do is Kerdi pans now though. I won't do liners anymore.


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## Jeff (Oct 12, 2010)

22 years of installing pans, I never even heard of a plumber testing them until recently?
I can live with water testing them, but mudding & sloping, I call bull-crap. That's as bad as me installing mirrors on Hospital finishes.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Our builders get the tiles guys to do the sloping. 

Florida 2007. 

417.5.2 Shower lining. Floors under shower compartments, except where prefabricated receptors have been provided, shall be lined and made water tight utilizing material complying with Sections 417.5.2.1 through 417.5.2.4. Such liners shall turn up on all sides at least 2 inches (51 mm) above the finished threshold level. Liners shall be recessed and fastened to an approved backing so as not to occupy the space required for wall covering, and shall not be nailed or perforated at any point less than 1 inch (25 mm) above the finished threshold.* Liners shall be pitched one-fourth unit vertical in 12 units horizontal (2-percent slope) and shall be sloped toward the fixture drains and be securely fastened to the waste outlet at the seepage entrance, making a water-tight joint between the liner and the outlet. 
*





Jeff said:


> 22 years of installing pans, I never even heard of a plumber testing them until recently?
> I can live with water testing them, but mudding & sloping, I call bull-crap. That's as bad as me installing mirrors on Hospital finishes.


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

I can't believe that someone would actually put silicone or any other sustance between the drain and the clamping device. Look at the design of the drain. See those weep holes with the flow slots fabricated in the top part of the clamping device? Ever wondered what that was for? :bangin:


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

Well, then, and all these years I've been letting the tile guy do all the sloping etc...Hmm, I guess if I'm on the hook, I'll start charging accordingly.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Will said:


> I do them too. All I do is Kerdi pans now though. I won't do liners anymore.


 At my continued education class today ,, the instructor tells us that the 2009 code book has approved the Kerdi system and all are VERY impressed with it :thumbup::thumbup:


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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

I have always swiped a dauber of pvc glue between the bottom of the pan aand the top of the drain. Never had one leak. It has been code for more than 8 yrs to slope the floor prior to pan install and test with water. I leave water in overnight to be sure. I like to have the contractor supply the sloped floor, but have used the presloped styrofoam in a pinch. 

Does silicone bond to pan material well? Sounds like a good alternative. 

When I have a shower bigger than a roll is available i've always overlapped 6 inches and glued with pvc glue. No leaks yet. You just gotta put a stack of 2x6s on it to dry before installing.

Bob


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## a22ozbeer (Jan 15, 2011)

Oatey makes a showerpan liner glue. Stuff works really well. Plasticman is right though. There are weep holes and small channels in the top piece of bolt downs. Thats why I am very careful when glueing these. I put the glue just around where the bolts penetrate the liner.


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## Lifer (Nov 23, 2010)

The very nice tile man and his HOT wife do all the drain pans and concrete work that is to be done in a shower in my service area . And for this I am thankful..

Lifer...


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