# locating a well casing



## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Here the health department controls wells. When we abandon a well it must be capped off and plugged before we can connect to domestic water. I agree that it should be completed. Here is our dilemma the house was built in 1978. The pool was added after the house was built. The health department does not have a record where the well was drilled.

In order to raise the pool to the level of the back door 5 feet of fill was added. The well equipment is located on a concrete pad 10x10 that is 5 foot below the grade of the pool. We broke the concrete slab to locate the pipe and the direction of the water pipe. It heads directly under the pool decking.

Typically with older homes the well casings is buried 2 foot under grade and now add the 5 foot of fill it is impossible to locate the well casing to plug and cap. There is either a crack pipe in the well pipe in the casing or the shallow well pipe is too high and needs lowered and or possibly a bad foot valve. Someone installed a check valve at the pump to maintain pressure however it loses prime and will not self prime. Back when the home was built it was common practice for the shallow well drop pipe to be 7-12 feet into the well casing due to a high water table.

Any of you have ideas locating the well casing? We had a metal detector out there and could not locate the well casing. Thought about locating an old timer to locate with divining rods, since the economy dropped the old timers have dropped off like flies. Too dangerous to chase and tunnel, home is located by the intercostals and would collapse faster than we could brace and shore up the sides.

I cannot pull a permit which means the home owner cannot pay the impact fee to get domestic water.


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

Ground penetrating radar. :thumbup:







Paul


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Here the health department controls wells. When we abandon a well it must be capped off <SNIP>
> 
> 
> *Use voodo [brass rods], if you have the touch. When they cross over you will be over a hole in the ground could be a well == or cesspool.*
> ...


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Run an electricians snake for pulling wire through conduit out through the pipe the charge it up with the locating transmitter...


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

You may want to try a valve locator but if they are really that deep you will need a deep metal detector.

Mark


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Run an electricians snake for pulling wire through conduit out through the pipe the charge it up with the locating transmitter...


 
you may be on to something here. can use tracer wire. through 1 inch pipe. pressure fittings will stop us but hopefully they did not use 90's under ground.

Thanks


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> Richard Hilliard said:
> 
> 
> > Here the health department controls wells. When we abandon a well it must be capped off <SNIP>
> ...


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

rocksteady said:


> Ground penetrating radar. :thumbup:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 I wonder if a water restoration company's infra red equipment will work. will call tomorrow thanks for the idea.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

ToUtahNow said:


> You may want to try a valve locator but if they are really that deep you will need a deep metal detector.
> 
> Mark


 
We had a guy with a metal detector out today to locate and he had no luck. I od have a friend that works on utilities and he may have something.

yall have given me new ideas thanks.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Richard Hilliard said:


> We had a guy with a metal detector out today to locate and he had no luck. I od have a friend that works on utilities and he may have something.
> 
> yall have given me new ideas thanks.


Keep in mind some of the deep detectors will go 12 meters (40') deep but they are big bucks.

Mark


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

http://www.groundpenetratingradarfloridagpr.com/

No idea what they charge but there's a branch in St. Petersburg.










Paul


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

At this time if he wants water price cannot be a challenge.Before a permit can be pulled and impact fees paid to get the meter the old well must be plugged and capped. There is no other choice.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

http://www.accuratelocators.com/

scroll down


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Check the products page here: http://www.geophysical.com/index.htm

This company offers rentals as well.


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Ask the neighbors. If they have been there a long time, they might have an idea of where wells were typically located in the area. 

Why can't you grout the well from the pipe inside?

Think outside the box.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

RealLivePlumber said:


> Ask the neighbors. If they have been there a long time, they might have an idea of where wells were typically located in the area.
> 
> Why can't you grout the well from the pipe inside?
> 
> Think outside the box.


Been there done that. No one seems to know and now they seem to want to know where there wells are located.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Vibration based PVC pipe locator. Pressurize the line with a pulsation valve hooked up to it and back trace it to the well. If there is no foot valve or a bad foot valve, blow water into it with a reed valve to generate sound. Back trace it to the well.

Thermal imaging won't to jack for you at those depths.

Ground penetrating radar will most definitely work, but for what you are going to be charged, you could likely purchase the pvc vibration locator and own it for next time.

Deep metal detectors will work to but again, big money.


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## AWWGH (May 2, 2011)

They have well locating devices that you hook up the the wires on a submersible pump and it sends a signal through so that you can follow the signal with a wand. I personally have one and they work great. In your case you can send a snake with a wire attached in until in stops (or hook right to the pipe if its metal) and send the signal and follow it. You might want to try a local well company, usually can pin point the area of the well fairly quickly. Also alot of times when I'm having trouble locating a well I step way back and look at the yard, look for a area slightly settled. 80% of the time it will be settled where the buried well is. But then again, I've spend a matter of minutes locating buried wells and sometimes days.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

AWWGH said:


> They have well locating devices that you hook up the the wires on a submersible pump and it sends a signal through so that you can follow the signal with a wand.


Except it is not a submersible pump...


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Protech said:


> Vibration based PVC pipe locator. Pressurize the line with a pulsation valve hooked up to it and back trace it to the well. If there is no foot valve or a bad foot valve, blow water into it with a reed valve to generate sound. Back trace it to the well.
> 
> Thermal imaging won't to jack for you at those depths.
> 
> ...


Not interested in owning equipment I may use once in 18 years. First one I could not find since 1993. I just became involved with this Thursday afternoon.Had a friend thta searches for treasure look with a detector Friday. Need to give this home some thought and I may come up with a different idea. Back in the day wells ahd to be 75 feet from the septic and now it is 150 feet. I may explore the possibility the plumber changed the direction of the pipe when they installed the pool. I have several calls into well drillers and will ask when drilling a well bythe intercoastal what has been your best practcie for location and try to figure it out that way.

Talked with a leak location company today and may give him a shot.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Not interested in owning equipment I may use once in 18 years. First one I could not find since 1993. I just became involved with this Thursday afternoon.Had a friend thta searches for treasure look with a detector Friday. Need to give this home some thought and I may come up with a different idea. Back in the day wells ahd to be 75 feet from the septic and now it is 150 feet. I may explore the possibility the plumber changed the direction of the pipe when they installed the pool. I have several calls into well drillers and will ask when drilling a well bythe intercoastal what has been your best practcie for location and try to figure it out that way.
> 
> Talked with a leak location company today and may give him a shot.


I know a guy in fl that can find it for ya. Dunno if you would be willing to pay for the drive from winter haven to sarasota though. :brows:


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## Marlin (Aug 14, 2008)

Just break out the trusty pipe locator.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Marlin said:


> Just break out the trusty pipe locator.


 I wish I could ,nice pool would be destroyed.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Protech said:


> I know a guy in fl that can find it for ya. Dunno if you would be willing to pay for the drive from winter haven to sarasota though. :brows:


Before I get his information let me try some of the ideas already posted. I may send a person to pick him up and bring him down.Is he afraid to fly?


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

ask all the well drillers if they drilled the well. the driller that lives in my neighborhood can tell you from memory when, where and how deep for ever well he has driver. also have that info in office. just a thought. breid..............:rockon:


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## piercekiltoff (Jul 22, 2009)

Too be honest - I've always just chased the pipe/wire with an excavator. Some of the ideas on here I had thought about, but never really pursued. I've only been in this situation a handful of times where the owner wouldn't take the chore on (since we don't do landscape restoration, etc and we don't run shovels, they'll generally take over).

I'm going to go get one of those line charging systems with a tracing wand - that'd do it for me most of the time.

Also, as to grouting down the pump suction - you might be able to blow the pipe apart with a high pressure grouter - most foot valves/ball valves are rated for 200 PSI, or so. Maybe hitting it with a 500 PSI well grouting system might (GeoLoop - try your local driller) you might be able to blow the end off and plug the well...Of course, there's no guarantee it won't burst another part of the line. This is assuming the suction line is mostly galvanized & brass.


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## AWWGH (May 2, 2011)

Redwood said:


> Except it is not a submersible pump...


That's why I said that he could use a snake to push a wire as a tracer wire to hook up to.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Found it.

3 inch pvc well casing. Blew me away, back in 1978 most of the well drillers used metal casing we would have never found it. I should play the lotto tonight. I started walking the backyard. Found a second septic tank abandoned and used that to measure distance.
When the pool was added the well equipment was relocated from the middle of the house to the far left. That is why the piping lead to the pool area. Found the well casing in the left corner of the property. Drop pipe10 feet deep.

Thanks for all the ideas and will save them for the next time.


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## SewerRat (Feb 26, 2011)

Richard, try a magnetic locator, this may be what others have been posting about, I didn't click on the links that have been provided. I have a Schonstedt Magnetic Locator for finding septic tank lid handles and it's proven to be a very useful tool, it has like 5 or 6 sensitivity settings and we can usually find a small rebar handle 18" or so below grade on only like the second to lowest setting.

They will locate any metal that holds a magnetic charge, like steel, cast, or ductile iron. 

They're a little tricky to get to know, but if this guy is really needing to find this thing you could probably buy one and charge him enough to own it and then you'd always have it.


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## SewerRat (Feb 26, 2011)

Sorry, didn't read your last post. PVC, huh? Mag locator wouldn't have worked anyway .


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