# Eel 4"x6" Expansion Blades...



## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Had a job this afternoon that was 4" cast trans into 6" clay at 69'. The cleanout opening was 3". This set of pics is after I had already had the line open using the General 4" root saw which is actually 3" in diameter. I went back and forth several times until no resistance was felt through the cable.













This set of pics was taken after running the Eel 4x6 expansion blades through the line several times feeling no resistance though the cable.
















Say what you will about the results although not perfect the line is 99% cleaner than just running the General 4" (3") root saw which is what most drain cleaners would do without having or explaining options to the customer. I did NOT do this as a special presentation chasing the bit with a camera to achieve greater results. I was in & out.

Believe it or not (I know, I know...) this is actually the worst results I have achieved with the expansion blades. The results will mostly vary depending on the type of tree roots this being a silver maple which are tougher than most. Some will easily cut/break off and others will be more difficult such as fishing line.

The question... is it really worth all of the extra drama to run a jetter on residential lines ? This was also an extreme example, bad case sewer of needing the expansion blades as most consistent sized lines are fine with regular bits. For me the answer is a simple no.


Let the discussion begin...


Wooooo !!!


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

Not as good as a Jetter. Sorry I couldn't help myself


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

plungerboy said:


> No as good as a Jetter. Sorry I couldn't help my self.




The extra 1% root removal makes all the difference ?


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

How long did the entire job take you?


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

plungerboy said:


> How long did the entire job take you?



Roughly 1 hour 45 minutes with before & after camera also bull chitting with the customer.

I'm a one man shop.


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

For me the real drama would be lugging heavy equipment into tight locations. 

I ran an auger for years before I saw the light. Those are good results, I would walk away from a line that looked like that. What was your total time on the job?

A Jetter would clean that up in two maybe three passes with a good nozzle. The only set up is stringing out a hose and carrying maybe 20 lbs of hose. I think the camera may be heavier than more portable reel.


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Good job ass, although that line looks like it's pretty much intact. Show me a line that's got separated/offset joints. I don't believe that expansion cutter will make it through.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

Holy $hit!...I never would've guessed it....yur a light beer kinda guy!:laughing:
In all seriousness though, I think that's a great job. It really does boil down "too each their own" I know the last thread got a little out of hand, but hey, we're blue collar plumbers. 

In the end we all use what works for us. I still cable more lines than jet myself. I'm getting a bigger jetter for my greasy restaurant accounts, but will most likely make the transitions to using the jetter more and more. Right now I have good success removing roots wit the K-60(sissy), but i do use the root ranger on heavy clay laterals. i was also a drum guy for the better part of 12 years but since using sectionals, I love them. I mean I still choose the K-60 over the 2001 everyday because I like it. And I think that's what matters. If I wind up liking the jetter 100% of the time, then so be it. In the end I still feel confident that no matter if I use the drum, sectional or jetter it's gonna get the job done, and often times better than my competition, because even the biggest baddest jetter is worthless without the operators knowledge of pressure loss and nozzle selection for their type of environment. 

Hell, my last company just purchased a spartan soldier and already are declaring it doesn't do what they thought it would do because they listened to rep. So I feel confident that I could do a better job at root restriction with my 4k psi @ 3.5 gpm and a root ranger than they can do with 12gpm @ 3k psi.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> *Holy $hit!...I never would've guessed it....yur a light beer kinda guy*!:laughing:
> In all seriousness though, I think that's a great job. It really does boil down "too each their own" I know the last thread got a little out of hand, but hey, we're blue collar plumbers.
> 
> In the end we all use what works for us. I still cable more lines than jet myself. I'm getting a bigger jetter for my greasy restaurant accounts, but will most likely make the transitions to using the jetter more and more. Right now I have good success removing roots wit the K-60(sissy), but i do use the root ranger on heavy clay laterals. i was also a drum guy for the better part of 12 years but since using sectionals, I love them. I mean I still choose the K-60 over the 2001 everyday because I like it. And I think that's what matters. If I wind up liking the jetter 100% of the time, then so be it. In the end I still feel confident that no matter if I use the drum, sectional or jetter it's gonna get the job done, and often times better than my competition, because even the biggest baddest jetter is worthless without the operators knowledge of pressure loss and nozzle selection for their type of environment.
> ...




Actually I've went back to my first love, Point Special Beer


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

It all boils down to the operator. 

An experienced sewer cleaner with a 3/8" cable and single 2" blade is going to do a better job than someone who can't "feel" a sewer but has the biggest baddest sectional/drum/Jetter/picote available.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

I have know problems with cable machines or guys that only cable. But from our experience the jetter is by far more efficient. Reason being you can run a camera at the same time and search and destroy on roots. You have way more length, and the hose is way lighter working in basements. Every machine or method has their place. And Ass. You did a pretty good job with the cable machine. But experienced operators are getting harder and harder to find and even harder to find guys who will hump a snake down the steps.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

I like putting the jetter hose thru a basement window and walking down the basement stairs with my wireless remote, you can do that with a beer in your hand.lol


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> Holy $hit!...I never would've guessed it....yur a light beer kinda guy!:laughing:
> 
> In all seriousness though, I think that's a great job. It really does boil down "too each their own" I know the last thread got a little out of hand, but hey, we're blue collar plumbers.
> 
> ...



Spartan Soldier is a toy.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Asstyme-your the real deal brother.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Thanks for actually posting the pics of the cable results. If you like cabling go for it. 3 root intrusions....80 something feet out.....about 1 hour 15 minutes and the heaviest lifting I would do is a 15 lbs coil of hose. Also that expansion cutter....what is that in cost? About $400? Can it go down a 2-1/2" cleanout?


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

I respect anyone who can properly do the job. I don't miss lugging machines up and down stairs. I don't miss paying for cables (hose is cheaper in the long run) I don't miss getting stuck. I sure as hell don't miss one bad sewer ruining my schedule for the day. It's either full of roots or broke either way I know the answer and am on my way to the next call within 2 hours.


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

AssTyme said:


> Actually I've went back to my first love, Point Special Beer



Does that say happy hour 7-9 am? That's my kind of joint. Btw, is that you in the pic ass?


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Unclog1776 said:


> I respect anyone who can properly do the job. I don't miss lugging machines up and down stairs. I don't miss paying for cables (hose is cheaper in the long run) I don't miss getting stuck. I sure as hell don't miss one bad sewer ruining my schedule for the day. It's either full of roots or broke either way I know the answer and am on my way to the next call within 2 hours.




You make owning a jetter sound so simple, there are no maintenance costs or procedures ? The cable equipment is not that heavy, they also make carts with wheels you know. Eel 1.25" cable lasts for years with frequent use...

I also don't let sewers ruin my day. I just tear through them and move to the next one.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Drain Pro said:


> Does that say happy hour 7-9 am? That's my kind of joint. Btw, is that you in the pic ass?




7-9 PM :laughing:

Yep that's me and the pyramid actually got bigger before the night ended


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

7-9am. I used to love day drinking.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

AssTyme said:


> 7-9 PM :laughing: Yep that's me and the pyramid actually got bigger before the night ended


 It's called a beeramid.haha


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

I love it when the sewers broke!


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Mini excavator is better than both cable or jetter, case closed.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

Will said:


> Mini excavator is better than both cable or jetter, case closed.


No way. I can find guys to dig for $50 an hour. I haven't yet found anybody to jet for anywhere near that.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

AssTyme said:


> 7-9 PM :laughing:
> 
> Yep that's me and the pyramid actually got bigger before the night ended


Drinking beer seems like such an incredible waste of time. If you were able to go through a pyramid of 12oz containers in one evening, you were drinking from the wrong containers. On the upside, at least it tastes horrible. :jester:


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

plbgbiz said:


> Drinking beer seems like such an incredible waste of time. If you were able to go through a pyramid of 12oz containers in one evening, you were drinking from the wrong containers. On the upside, at least it tastes horrible. :jester:
> View attachment 45138




Say what...


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

So, how many 4x6 expansion blades have I just sold for Electric Eel ?

Not that you jet heads would ever switch over but just to have on hand if needed to do a better job with a cable.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

AssTyme said:


> Had a job this afternoon that was 4" cast trans into 6" clay at 69'. The cleanout opening was 3". This set of pics is after I had already had the line open using the General 4" root saw which is actually 3" in diameter. I went back and forth several times until no resistance was felt through the cable.
> 
> 
> 
> ...












*I** like that expanding auger head. How much do they sell for? And, does Ridgid make one for their 7/8" sectional cable? {Just the facts Asstyme, no comments on my K-60.....:laughing:}*


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> *I** like that expanding auger head. How much do they sell for? And, does Ridgid make one for their 7/8" sectional cable? {Just the facts Asstyme, no comments on my K-60.....:laughing:}*




The Eel blades retail for $325.00. I don't think the 7/8" sectional cable would be up to snuff running such a heavy bit. Maybe if it were 7/8" innercore ??? I myself wouldn't run it on anything but high speed 1.25" cable.


Others make expansion blades but none are as good as the Eel. Adapters are available to run the Eel bit on other ends.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

AssTyme said:


> The Eel blades retail for $325.00. I don't think the 7/8" sectional cable would be up to snuff running such a heavy bit. Maybe if it were 7/8" innercore ??? I myself wouldn't run it on anything but high speed 1.25" cable.
> 
> 
> Others make expansion blades but none are as good as the Eel. Adapters are available to run the Eel bit on other ends.












Ok I see. I didn't know that you use that bit on an 1 1/4" cable. That is a larger diameter cable than I run. I don't see many 6" lines. Residential lines around here are 3" or 4".

Those pictures you posted are outstanding. Very impressive considering you entered a 4" line and wound up in a 6" line.


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## affordabledrain (Nov 24, 2009)

Nice job. Asstyme. Do you ever get hung up with the root cutter?


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

AssTyme said:


> So, how many 4x6 expansion blades have I just sold for Electric Eel ?
> 
> Not that you jet heads would ever switch over but just to have on hand if needed to do a better job with a cable.



Not for me. If I can't properly clear a line with cable and blades, it's time to jet. I'm still convinced jetting is more effective and efficient when a typical cable fails.


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

http://youtu.be/H46fdVQi_XE

I made this video. Granted it's pretty minimal roots. This was a one year follow up after being augured. One slow pass with the warthog and you can see the instant results


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> Ok I see. I didn't know that you use that bit on an 1 1/4" cable. That is a larger diameter cable than I run. I don't see many 6" lines. Residential lines around here are 3" or 4".
> 
> Those pictures you posted are outstanding. Very impressive considering you entered a 4" line and wound up in a 6" line.




Yes a 4" line through a 3" cleanout opening.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

affordabledrain said:


> Nice job. Asstyme. Do you ever get hung up with the root cutter?




I've had the root saw temporarily stuck several times but always managed to get it out.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Unclog1776 said:


> http://youtu.be/H46fdVQi_XE
> 
> I made this video. Granted it's pretty minimal roots. This was a one year follow up after being augured. One slow pass with the warthog and you can see the instant results




Careful badmouthing my Eel


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Man that eel cutter is high! I use the General 3 by 6. I break half a blade here and there but it's 60$.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

KoleckeINC said:


> Man that eel cutter is high! I use the General 3 by 6. I break half a blade here and there but it's 60$.




$70.00 just for a set of 3 replacement blades 

It doesn't look like I'd be able to use that General bit on my Eel cable without the use of a special adapter. I'd probably tear the chit out of it first use anyway :laughing:


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## septicguy (Feb 12, 2015)

As I read this post, am I'm hearing a lot of guys only jetting, no cabling? Guess I'm doing it wrong, but how do you guys jet completely blocked lines from the house side. Doesn't that create a hell of a mess. I lug a 300 with .55 cable in and out of every basement. Half broke hatchway stairs waiting to trip you up. If I have to Jett from upstream I set up a garbage can and use our septic tanker to control the flow. Love to hear how others are doing it


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Because I'm running the smallest jetter here, I have a custom nozzle....1 forward, 2 rear. The rear jets are at 15 degrees so it pulls very well. It won't clean the pipe but it blast through a root mass enough so a root ranger can go through. Most of the time the nozzle will blast through but if it won't, then I'll run the dreel. 

Lately however I've been digging the warthog more and more as my primary nozzle. Today's job....70' clay with 50% of roots at every joint. Did 2 passes with the warthog then sent it forward to the city. Sent the camera in there and found one joint I needed to hit again. Used the camera to get the warthog in position, spent 30 seconds going back and forth and then reinspected to find all the roots gone. Total runtime on the jetter today....less then 20 minutes.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

AssTyme said:


> $70.00 just for a set of 3 replacement blades  It doesn't look like I'd be able to use that General bit on my Eel cable without the use of a special adapter. I'd probably tear the chit out of it first use anyway :laughin
> 
> I use Amdex supply from Craigin hardware for all my eel stuff. Ed the mngr is great. He has your adaptor, 4 by 6 cutter, dreel adaptor, eel cables and a crap ton of eel cutters. Coleman is an hour away from me. Craigin is 15 minutes. It's great when I need sewer stuff to just run and pick it up.


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

Hey Azz, why do you use the General root saw over the Eel?

Just got off the phone with Eel and was told their 4x6 expansion blade would not go into a 3" clean out.

Every time I talk to the woman who answers the phone I feel dumbed down.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

fixitright said:


> Hey Azz, why do you use the General root saw over the Eel?
> 
> Just got off the phone with Eel and was told their 4x6 expansion blade would not go into a 3" clean out.
> 
> Every time I talk to the woman who answers the phone I feel dumbed down.



It goes through a regular 3" cleanout opening just fine. Not sure about a 3" T though, might be too long.

Same with calling Ridgid, they always have these clueless women answer the phone, ask for a tech.

I run the 4" General because it's a wee bit bigger in diameter than the Eel but still fits through a 3" cleanout opening. It's also less coin


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

http://draincleaningforum.com/showt...f-the-Eel-4x6-expander-blade&highlight=blades


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

I run the ridgid and the general no problems on my K1500 with eel cable. I prevented moto scooter from forcing a clean out on somebody last week. They wanted 5400$. General 3x6 did fine and the camera shows all is well.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

KoleckeINC said:


> I run the ridgid and the general no problems on my K1500 with eel cable. I prevented moto scooter from forcing a clean out on somebody last week. They wanted 5400$. General 3x6 did fine and the camera shows all is well.


$5400 to install a clean out?


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Yes sir! That's what moto scooter wanted. 5'4" deep, in a backyard. Utilities marked it out with only cable tv 12" down. These yo yo's out here in Chicago land think they can get everybody once.


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