# DeltaFaucet..now a chrome plated TURD



## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

Installed a few new plastic ..
.chrome plated Delta lavaroty faucets today.....

Basically this is JUNK... its now a throw away facuet.....

I am very disapointed in this faucet and almost had a
major problem getting the ****ty new areator to go back 
into the unit...

I dare anyone to take one of these apart and put it back 
together again..especailly after a few months of being in 
bad water ....

after a few minutes of cussing and fighting the plastic threads ,, I was finally able to make it right..

.

check out the crappy little tool they expect you to use 
when you stand on your head to put the areator back in.

Delts is going to hell in a hand basket........


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

My wholesaler knows better than to send me DST crap.

You can still buy the regular delta faucets. If your wholesaler says they can't, find a new wholesaler.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

We can still buy good delta faucets, I think that the big boxes are trying all plastic. They are super crap, with a good reputation, for now.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*wave of the future*

according to my one wholesaler, they are switching to Kohler Faucets for this very reason..

and another one of my wholesalers claim that soon I wont be able to bet anything but this junk...

Delts is trying to get all the hardware store business and
I dont think they care for the plumber anymore:furious:

its a shame to see this happen


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## 3KP (Jun 19, 2008)

*Plastic crap*

The reason for the plastic crap is for California and Vermont lead laws. This is Delta's answer to the problem plastic crap at teh same high price! I'm surprised they haven't made there shower valves plastic yet!:blink:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Master Mark said:


> according to my one wholesaler, they are switching to Kohler Faucets for this very reason..
> 
> and another one of my wholesalers claim that soon I wont be able to bet anything but this junk...
> 
> ...


I haven't been in the plumbing business as long as alot, dare I say most, on this site, but I have noticed a steady decline over the years in the quality of everything from WC to tubs and of course faucets. Aqua Glass is a fairly common tub here. As a first year apprentice I installed at least 48 as we had a 48 unit apartment complex going. They were sturdy, required little if any shimming, and therefor easy to install. Lately an aqua glass is marginal at best. Delta shower valves used to have a much nicer backing plate with 2 adjustments, now a thin square pos that is tempramental at best. Granted the universal valve body is nice.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

I once installed a WC that had every piece seperate down to the flush lever. All the paperwork was only in Spanish. I told him we don't warranty anything that only has Spanish paperwork. By far the very worst I had ever installed. Now I stand corrected, the worst I had ever installed soooo faaaarrr.:laughing:


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Delta has been producing crap for years now and sticking it to the plumber for at least as long. What is truly amazing is that it took so long for so many of you to catch on to that fact. Anybody been to their website lately? It's full of how tos and diy info. They don't give one flying flip about any of you and could care less what you think about anything.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*Now that we have got that figured out.....*



smellslike$tome said:


> Delta has been producing crap for years now and sticking it to the plumber for at least as long. What is truly amazing is that it took so long for so many of you to catch on to that fact. Anybody been to their website lately? It's full of how tos and diy info. They don't give one flying flip about any of you and could care less what you think about anything.


now that this has been established that Delta is turning into DOG ***** , I am trying to decide on what brand of faucet I need to recommend to my customers....

I REFUSE to install the PEX DELTA tub and shower faucets. that are comming down the road real soon, ... 


I will be running out of 1300 and 1700 tub and shower valve bodies some day, I probably sitll have around 75 of them stored  in our shop....

....

I suppose the only thing left that I can say is still
of good quality is MOEN...

what is everyone useing out there these days????


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

3KP said:


> The reason for the plastic crap is for California and Vermont lead laws. This is Delta's answer to the problem plastic crap at teh same high price! I'm surprised they haven't made there shower valves plastic yet!:blink:


The lead laws only apply to sections of the faucet that carry water. There are plenty of AB1953 compliant faucets that aren't chrome plated plastic dog turds. This has everything to do with money and nothing to do with anti lead laws. If that's Delta's story they're just blowing smoke.





Paul


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## pdxplumber (Nov 21, 2009)

I recently rebuilt a ten year old Chicago lav faucet. I had worked on a few, years ago when I used to service restaurants. I forgot how great they were. I think I have found my new faucet. I have been true blue to Delta but they keep ******x me over with plastic this and that, and now the pex supplies. I still like the shower valve. How long till they make those out of plastic.
Anybody use Chicago on a regular basis? I don't think they sell them at the big box stores.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

:thumbsup:



smellslike$tome said:


> Delta has been producing crap for years now and sticking it to the plumber for at least as long. What is truly amazing is that it took so long for so many of you to catch on to that fact. Anybody been to their website lately? It's full of how tos and diy info. They don't give one flying flip about any of you and could care less what you think about anything.


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## kentdmo (Dec 15, 2008)

Moen still good in my book


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

*delta faucet*

http://wolverinbrass.com
Take a look at these faucets.Two years ago we started to stock these faucets. Our clients had a choice of Kohler,moen and wolverine the majority chose wolverine. Nice brass maufactured faucets. The tub and shower units have volume control along with the pressure balancing feature.Special orders can take anywhere from one day to 3 days to receive if you do not stock the items.


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## grandpa (Jul 13, 2008)

Of course, it has everything to do with money. But you have to remember the lawyers got their fingers into this as well. There is a problem for manufacturers who might wish to produce two versions of a faucet.....inventory segregation. Once some part like lets say a brass faucet body has been made....there is nothing on it which tells you for sure if it is lead free or not. The company would have to be able to convince the inspector...yes they inspect this stuff....that they know and control what is what. Some companies...Chicago and T&S notably, are just making everything out of lead free brass. They can afford to suck up the cost, and even pass a little of it on. I predict that for Moen and Delta, there will be an eventual TOTAL migration of their product lines to lead compliant, using the plastic designs. People inside both of those companies have told me as much. Of course I am talking to the lower end of the food chain, so we will just have to wait and see.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

*The truth may hurt!*

There is power in numbers and the home centers have the largest percentage of the plumbing fixture market. Last I read it was somewhere between 65- 75% market share. Manufacturers will continue to cater to this group.

Supply houses and plumbers also could have a lot of control if they put up a united front. Supply houses could refuse to carry the junk and plumbers could refuse to sell the junk.

Hate to say it, but it's true. Plumbers sold out and are reaping what they have sown. No need to blame the manufacturer for delivering what the buyer wants.

Don't believe me, just read any Flat Rate / T & M Pricing thread and you will see that plumbers spend more time bashing other plumbing cos. (& methods) rather than uniting and rallying around common philosophies. Nothing will change until we change first.

More unites us than divides us. There is a much bigger picture here, but so many focus on the little details.

*Most would agree on the following:*

Licensing laws should be enforced.

Stiffer penalties for unlicensed plumbers.

HO's should be required to get inspections when they install a water heater.

Certain things should not be sold or rented to the HO (i.e. - cable sewer machines)

Professional plumbers should not be installing inferior quality plumbing fixtures / parts . . . EVER. It is what separates us from the handyhack.

Plumbers who don't know their cost and lowball are hurting the industry

Drugs have no place in the workplace

If you have a "I don't give a crap attitude anymore," or "If you can't beat them, join them mentality," then you should do your industry a favor and get the hell out because plumbing is no longer for you!!!

This post is NOT directed at any one individual, it's a commentary on what is wrong with this industry.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

PlumbCrazy said:


> Professional plumbers should not be installing inferior quality plumbing fixtures / parts . . . EVER. It is what separates us from the handyhack.


My license and skill level seperates me from the handyhack. Handyhacks shop at the supply houses too...is that news to you? I think you read too much to form your opinions and ignore whats going on out in the world while you sit in your office.

You should worry more about whats wrong with what you can change by yourself. Your energy is directed in the worng direction.
You claim not to be concerned with what others are charging for their services or how they charge but in the same breath complain about big box and other working or selling material cheaper. I cant help it you get price shopped day in and day out...maybe your reaping what you've sown.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

So what! And plumbers shop @ Lowes & Home Depot . . . what's your point?

MOST handyhacks shop at the home centers the majority of the time.

Quit nitpicking the exceptions - it is tiresome for all of us!


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

PlumbCrazy said:


> So what! And plumbers shop @ Lowes & Home Depot . . . what's your point?
> 
> MOST handyhacks shop at the home centers the majority of the time.
> 
> Quit nitpicking the exceptions - it is tiresome for all of us!


NO NO whats your point? Who cares where they shop...whats it your business? You cant compete maybe you should rethink the type of business your in rather than complaining about it.......Doesnt that get tiresome to you? Constantly making excuses for your shortcomings?


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

*It's easy to fix this problem*

Just don't supply the product. 


I'm nearly down to the 'pipe and fittings' guy and any problem a faucet, toilet, water heater has down the pike, 

I'm sitting there getting paid for the gamble the customer made.


Started doing this years ago because when you pay out on that top number for occupational license fees from county to county, and that number you have to pay off your gross earnings?


You work in numerous counties, you gave your profit margin to another entity.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned this ever on this site, which would indicate that the majority here don't have a good accountant. 

And I didn't even mention the callbacks, product liability, the down time with a customer when you tried to pull money off the product and it backfires.

Anything above $100 the customer must supply me to perform the task, with exception to sump pumps.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

That's just because you work out of a pickup truck and can't/won't carry a complete inventory of fixtures.

You like many others, have found your place in the bigbox circle-jerk.



DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Just don't supply the product.
> 
> 
> I'm nearly down to the 'pipe and fittings' guy and any problem a faucet, toilet, water heater has down the pike,
> ...


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Just don't supply the product.
> 
> 
> I'm nearly down to the 'pipe and fittings' guy and any problem a faucet, toilet, water heater has down the pike,
> ...


Nothing wrong with operating a business that way but I choose to stock and supply most all my products. I use Delta and they honor their warranty. I have enough of the solid brass/copper faucets to last me along time....by the time I run out they will have corrected the problems with the new ones. Licenses here are cheap even with the higher gross I still make a healthy profit and I dont hafta worry about the home owner dragging up some POS faucet to install because they liked how it looked.
I prolly have 20,000 invested in faucets and the return will be atleast double that. I sold 8 of them yesterday alone and about 12-15 for the week. I flipped the script on big box.....I have more delta faucets than they do:laughing: Supply house doesn't even have the inventory selection that I do on delta.

I dont hafta order it.....Do you realize how much I sell because I have it NOW? It's a tremendous amount for one guy.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I use the same strategy, except it's all on my truck so there is no going to get it.



TheMaster said:


> Nothing wrong with operating a business that way but I choose to stock and supply most all my products. I use Delta and they honor their warranty. I have enough of the solid brass/copper faucets to last me along time....by the time I run out they will have corrected the problems with the new ones. Licenses here are cheap even with the higher gross I still make a healthy profit and I dont hafta worry about the home owner dragging up some POS faucet to install because they liked how it looked.
> I prolly have 20,000 invested in faucets and the return will be atleast double that. I sold 8 of them yesterday alone and about 12-15 for the week. I flipped the script on big box.....I have more delta faucets than they do:laughing: Supply house doesn't even have the inventory selection that I do on delta.
> 
> I dont hafta order it.....Do you realize how much I sell because I have it NOW? It's a tremendous amount for one guy.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Just don't supply the product.
> 
> 
> I'm nearly down to the 'pipe and fittings' guy and any problem a faucet, toilet, water heater has down the pike,
> ...


 

And I have an E350 van. :laughing:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Dam I love the place this thread went from Delta Faucets to Inventory and the IRS.

Can we not keep a topic on topic.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Ron said:


> Dam I love the place this thread went from Delta Faucets to Inventory and the IRS.
> 
> Can we not keep a topic on topic.


should we move our arguing to the new "inventory/IRS thread":laughing:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Thread Split

See Inventory and the IRS


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## Everflow (Feb 1, 2010)

Delta has turned into box store junk. Set one of there bathroom faucets a couple of weeks ago, could not believe Delta had went so far down hill. 

It's just a darn shame when a quality manufacturer starts making pure junk.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

I never was a Delta fan from way back, even Moen is looking bad.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

It's no big switch for me, I've always hated delta.

Did I ever mention that delta is crap?



Everflow said:


> Delta has turned into box store junk. Set one of there bathroom faucets a couple of weeks ago, could not believe Delta had went so far down hill.
> 
> It's just a darn shame when a quality manufacturer starts making pure junk.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> It's no big switch for me, I've always hated delta.
> 
> Did I ever mention that delta is crap?


 Yeah you also mentioned in one of your post how well made one of them was and how easy it was to install. It was customer supplied too:thumbsup:.


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## Everflow (Feb 1, 2010)

I've always told my supplier when I send people in to pick their faucets show them Moen then Delta. Never really had a big problem with Delta, just like Moen better, to me they are easier to work on. In the end we seemed to do as many homes with Delta as we did Moen.

Last week I told my supplier not to even bring up Delta unless someone asks to see it.

If Delta happens to get another quality product, someone on here let me know, because there is a good chance I won't be seeing many Delta products in the future.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Everflow said:


> I've always told my supplier when I send people in to pick their faucets show them Moen then Delta. Never really had a big problem with Delta, just like Moen better, to me they are easier to work on. In the end we seemed to do as many homes with Delta as we did Moen.
> 
> Last week I told my supplier not to even bring up Delta unless someone asks to see it.
> 
> If Delta happens to get another quality product, someone on here let me know, because there is a good chance I won't be seeing many Delta products in the future.


Have you ever replaced the garter spring in a moen kitchen sink faucet that looks like a periscope? The spout will rise up to two or three different heights. Ever take a moen K-sink faucet apart to find 4 or 5 plastic parts under the handle? How about the 4 or 5 plastic pieces in the moen widespread lavatory faucet handles and the cartridge is held in by a plastic nut that takes a special wrench to remove? They are hunks of over engineered crap like kohler is.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

I have never ran into a problem working on Delta. We live in a Delta market, and every supplier down to the little hardware store here carries Delta parts. I carry an assortment of Delta parts on my truck. I wish Delta wasn't going this route, but seems like they are. For me, delta stuff is easy to install, I have installed thousands by now. When we do a commercial job, it is always delta faucets. I'm comfortable with Delta. 
I have installed several Moen, Kohler, AS, Peerless, PP, and on down the line. I still prefer Delta, beacause that is what I'm used to. 

Kohler makes a good product as far as I know, I have had to work on a few and they were a PITA.

Moen makes a fine product aswell, once again a PITA to work on.

AS, Peerless and PP are total junk, and I rarely work on these-I usually replace them with a Delta.


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

Protech said:


> It's no big switch for me, I've always hated delta.
> 
> Did I ever mention that delta is crap?


Oooops........
"I give it 4.5 pipe wrenches out of 5 (only because of the cheap plastic push rod)" 

http://www.plumbingzone.com/f22/delta-25919-lewiston-2-handle-faucet-review-7956/


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Choctaw said:


> Oooops........
> "I give it 4.5 pipe wrenches out of 5 (only because of the cheap plastic push rod)"
> 
> http://www.plumbingzone.com/f22/delta-25919-lewiston-2-handle-faucet-review-7956/


Hey, he did start with I hate Delta. The plastic pop ups by Delta are really fast to install and they are alot heavier than any other platic pop ups I've seen. They are the only ones I will install. Other faucets with plastics, I install a metal and charge the HO. Most all Deltas were going with the foam base, which is nice. Not sure if they are going the other direction on those now or not.


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

I know, I know............sometimes you just gotta bust 'em. 

On another note.........I installed about 35 Banner faucets the other day that the owner furnished and I must say......for cheapo faucets they're all brass and seem pretty good quality.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Yes I did post that. I posted it because it was a stark contrast from most of their other products that are indeed.....crap.




TheMaster said:


> Yeah you also mentioned in one of your post how well made one of them was and how easy it was to install. It was customer supplied too:thumbsup:.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

I say install whatever you want. Why get down on someone else for what they chose to install. As for me, I still like Delta for the most part. With the exception of the lower end ones. As long as I can still get the regular ones I've been putting in, I'll be happy. 
I want to give a shout out to Plumb Crazy for articulating so well what is really wrong with our trade. I rarely go a few days without hearing someone slam their competition. We are definitely reaping what has been sown. I have said as much before in previous posts. If we would figure out how to band together, we might actually get something done. Living in an area that is full of handyhacks and worse is very aggravating. Yet, no one seems willing to do anything, especially if it involves more effort than *****ing to others. Well anyway.
I still like Delta and will continue to install them, so take that for what its worth (which is not much).:wallbash:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> Yes I did post that. I posted it because it was a stark contrast from most of their other products that are indeed.....crap.


The Delta faucets I use have a full metal pop up thats second to none. All the Delta faucets I sell are all metal construction. lifetime warranty. No problem for me.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

The shower valves with the 3/8" copper lines connecting the 2 pieces of the valve were a joke. The new monitors with that godawful plastic cartridge are to.

That faucet that I reviewed was 1 sigle THICK hunk of brass. That's unusual for delta and that's why I liked it. The finnish was very thick and the outer body was as well. Those are all qulities that I normally don't associate with delta and that ios what made it atractive. Also, because it was a 2 handle, it didn't have the common delta problem of leaking out of that ball joint packing.



TheMaster said:


> The Delta faucets I use have a full metal pop up thats second to none. All the Delta faucets I sell are all metal construction. lifetime warranty. No problem for me.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> The shower valves with the 3/8" copper lines connecting the 2 pieces of the valve were a joke. The new monitors with that godawful plastic cartridge are to.
> 
> That faucet that I reviewed was 1 sigle THICK hunk of brass. That's unusual for delta and that's why I liked it. The finnish was very thick and the outer body was as well. Those are all qulities that I normally don't associate with delta and that ios what made it atractive. Also, because it was a 2 handle, it didn't have the common delta problem of leaking out of that ball joint packing.


 Why are they joke because idiots dont know how to repair them and twist them off or that the cam packing has an adjustment ring?Whats wrong with the cartridge??? Doesn't moen make plastic cartridges and If I remember right they STICK to the insides of the valve and are hard to remove a flaw they have not corrected yet but instead make a puller to remove it....nice:laughing:


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## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

For many years, I have had problems getting the brass 1200 Moen cartridges out. The hard water here builds up next to the O-rings and they won't jump over it, especially because the rubber gets hard over time.

But now, I've started seeing a similar problem with the plastic cartridges - they will pull out leaving the bottom half in the barrel of the faucet. 

It's hard to find a faucet I can recommend anymore, and it will be interesting to see what Moen offers the market next.

My Delta supplier has yet to get the new Delta faucets in stock. They really don't want them, either. I've only installed one Delta kitchen since they switched over - customer supplied - and it installed very easily. I have no idea how it will hold up. The only flaw was the large stubs under the faucet that caused it to stick too far forward on the SS sink, overlapping the edge of the raised section the faucet sits on. But the seal was in full contact and should work until it rots.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> The Delta faucets I use have a full metal pop up thats second to none.


Except maybe to the Wolverine Brass popup.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> Except maybe to the Wolverine Brass popup.


 I paid 15.00 each for my delta all metal pop up's.....what does the woverine cost ya? I bought about 120 of them and have about 60 left and I sell them for 40.00 each.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> I paid 15.00 each for my delta all metal pop up's.....what does the woverine cost ya? I bought about 120 of them and have about 60 left and I sell them for 40.00 each.


I may not know the exact price difference, but Chris is correct. Wolverine brass makes a hell of a good pop-up. With that being said, I agree TM, that the Delta pop-ups are great. I install more of the Delta, because I install the Delta lavatory faucets.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

TheMaster said:


> Have you ever replaced the garter spring in a moen kitchen sink faucet that looks like a periscope? The spout will rise up to two or three different heights. Ever take a moen K-sink faucet apart to find 4 or 5 plastic parts under the handle? How about the 4 or 5 plastic pieces in the moen widespread lavatory faucet handles and the cartridge is held in by a plastic nut that takes a special wrench to remove? They are hunks of over engineered crap like kohler is.


Installed 2 Watermark widespread lav faucets yesterday. Suppose to be high end. Bigger junk than all the faucets you mentioned IMO. 2 faucets about 4ft apart, on countertop. Same faucet model numbers on each box, with different looking parts in each. Seperate accent pieces, on bottom of spouts, different size, with wrong hole pattern. Had to drill them out.Tops on pop up rod different. Had to drill out extra hole in each lift rods, on pop ups, H&C stems & accents were not easy to install uniform, ect.......
Customer bought faucets. T&M for me, but still PITA. Customer bought faucets from Nu-way plumbing supply, not my supply house, & paid almost $400 each.
I'd take Delta over these POS's any day, even if they were plastic.


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

TheMaster said:


> Why are they joke because idiots dont know how to repair them and twist them off or that the cam packing has an adjustment ring?Whats wrong with the cartridge??? Doesn't moen make plastic cartridges and If I remember right they STICK to the insides of the valve and are hard to remove a flaw they have not corrected yet but instead make a puller to remove it....nice:laughing:


No they are a joke because it was a  design plain and simple. I have replaced many because they have been twisted off by others. Cartridges seem to last about 5 years around here. Personally I'm a Moen fan I've had a few cartridges give me a little trouble coming out but nothing I couldn't handle :whistling2:. Also like the fact that I can take the bad Moen cartridge to my supplier and exchange it, can't do that with delta around here .


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> Installed 2 Watermark widespread lav faucets yesterday. Suppose to be high end. Bigger junk than all the faucets you mentioned IMO. 2 faucets about 4ft apart, on countertop. Same faucet model numbers on each box, with different looking parts in each. Seperate accent pieces, on bottom of spouts, different size, with wrong hole pattern. Had to drill them out.Tops on pop up rod different. Had to drill out extra hole in each lift rods, on pop ups, H&C stems & accents were not easy to install uniform, ect.......
> Customer bought faucets. T&M for me, but still PITA. Customer bought faucets from Nu-way plumbing supply, not my supply house, & paid almost $400 each.
> I'd take Delta over these POS's any day, even if they were plastic.


I've said several times on here that watermark are crap. Glad someone else got to experience them,


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

plumbrob said:


> No they are a joke because it was a  design plain and simple. I have replaced many because they have been twisted off by others. Cartridges seem to last about 5 years around here. Personally I'm a Moen fan I've had a few cartridges give me a little trouble coming out but nothing I couldn't handle :whistling2:. Also like the fact that I can take the bad Moen cartridge to my supplier and exchange it, can't do that with delta around here .


I'll admit that the old Delta valve bodies were garbage with some age on them, you just had to know how to take them apart without twisting the body in half. The new design is much better for that and simpler than Moen for assembly and adjusting the hot limit stop


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> I'll admit that the old Delta valve bodies were garbage with some age on them, *you just had to know how to take them apart without twisting the body in half*. The new design is much better for that and simpler than Moen for assembly and adjusting the hot limit stop


 
I was able to see the machine that was brought in from another company that made that faucet valve body in 3 seconds out of brass billet. 

It would port the valve, thread it, you name it, DONE in 3 seconds. 


I had my hands on another one of those Delta monitor series valves wednesday night, I made almost $200.00 to be the one who knew how to get that frozen bonnet nut off that valve. It felt good. 

I was there 15 minutes, tops. My torch was the blue tipped wrench I needed and it works flawlessly every time. I'say praise da lord, pass dat ketchup! I'm eatin' gooooooo-ooood!


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

At least moen designed a puller from the get go. The delta monitor cartridge can be a real PITA to remove. I have had to cook some of them out with a torch before.



TheMaster said:


> Why are they joke because idiots dont know how to repair them and twist them off or that the cam packing has an adjustment ring?Whats wrong with the cartridge??? Doesn't moen make plastic cartridges and If I remember right they STICK to the insides of the valve and are hard to remove a flaw they have not corrected yet but instead make a puller to remove it....nice:laughing:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Say what?!?! :blink:



plumbpro said:


> I'll admit that the old Delta valve bodies were garbage with some age on them, you just had to know how to take them apart without twisting the body in half. The new design is much better for that and simpler than Moen for assembly and adjusting the hot limit stop


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> At least moen designed a puller from the get go. The delta monitor cartridge can be a real PITA to remove. I have had to cook some of them out with a torch before.


Really it gives you that much trouble? I find them quite simple to repair and always have. Ever have the center pull out of a moen stem with the puller:whistling2: I'm no rookie despite what you may think protech:laughing: You cant bullshiot your way through a debate about faucet repair with me friend.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I've had the center pull out on the older moen/stanadyne brass cartridges but it was still a very quick affair to remove the remaining body of the cartridge.

And yes, the monitor cartridge can become stuck just like a moen can. I had it happen twice in the last 2 years. On one of them I had to heat up the valve body with a torch to get the thing out and even then it was fight to the death to get it out. Do the all go that way? No. But at least when a moen cartridge gets stubborn there is a puller for it. Not so with the delta monitor.



TheMaster said:


> Really it gives you that much trouble? I find them quite simple to repair and always have. Ever have the center pull out of a moen stem with the puller:whistling2: I'm no rookie despite what you may think protech:laughing: You cant bullshiot your way through a debate about faucet repair with me friend.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> I've had the center pull out on the older moen/stanadyne brass cartridges but it was still a very quick affair to remove the remaining body of the cartridge.
> 
> And yes, the monitor cartridge can become stuck just like a moen can. I had it happen twice in the last 2 years. On one of them I had to heat up the valve body with a torch to get the thing out and even then it was fight to the death to get it out. Do the all go that way? No. But at least when a moen cartridge gets stubborn there is a puller for it. Not so with the delta monitor.


Theres not a problem with a delta that cannot be prevented by alittle faucet grease on all the threads and "o"rings. When I install a new faucet I remove the cartridge apply the grease to the threads and the cartridge "o" ring and remove the set screws from the handles and grease them too. I look out for myself and my customers and I dont mind taking the time to do it because i charge time and material...I even make money on the grease.:laughing:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

And then there's Moen, that makes all of that unnecessary.



TheMaster said:


> Theres not a problem with a delta that cannot be prevented by alittle faucet grease on all the threads and "o"rings. When I install a new faucet I remove the cartridge apply the grease to the threads and the cartridge "o" ring and remove the set screws from the handles and grease them too. I look out for myself and my customers and I dont mind taking the time to do it because i charge time and material...I even make money on the grease.:laughing:


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

I am glad I don't have these problems with Moen. The only time I've had problems with Delta is when the HO tries to take the cartridge out and badly egg shapes the ring and body.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> And then there's Moen, that makes all of that unnecessary.


Ok so we covered the single lever tub/shower valves.....lets move on to the other POS moen makes. How about moens two handle faucets,lets talk IMPACT handles and how they have brittle plastic parts within them and how the handle portion will fuse to the bell portion of the handle that screws over the rough valve. And how the have plastic rings that require a special wrench to remove them with to get to the stem out. The handles literally have 5 or 6 pieces to it.

Which moen widespread lavatory faucet do you like? Or is that Barnett Premier crap where I should be looking for fine quality?


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*I worry about the future of Delta....*

according to my sales rep they will be eventually 
only selling this plastic dog crap , and they will be phaseing out all the good stuff...I just dont know how soon 

the biggest plumbing supplier in teh State
is switching to Kohler faucets because they are disgusted
with this cheap end junk .....but I dont care for kohler too much either...

So, it Looks like Moen is going to be the only decent brand that you can half way depend on


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Herk said:


> It's hard to find a faucet I can recommend anymore, and it will be interesting to see what Moen offers the market next.


Ceramic cartridges! :laughing:

They are already here...


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Considering the complaints, why haven't these others been abandoned for WB or some other line.

Anybody here install Rohl?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> Considering the complaints, why haven't these others been abandoned for WB or some other line.


I consider installing WB to be the equivalent of screwing your customer and other plumbers...



ChrisConnor said:


> Anybody here install Rohl?


The only time I install that Foo Foo stuff is when some kitchen designer sells the customer a bill of goods...

Mostly I fix them...:whistling2:


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

How is installing WB screwing your customer or other plumbers?


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## 3KP (Jun 19, 2008)

I believe Red is say most plumbing Companys don't stock WB parts and some don't even have a clue where to find them..


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

3KP said:


> I believe Red is say most plumbing Companys don't stock WB parts and some don't even have a clue where to find them..


Yep!
I still remember the first one I met...:furious:

No markings to indicate brand...

Carrying the cartridge to 3 different supply hoses that usually come through on any cartridge...:whistling2:

Looking on line at Alfano and NYRP...:whistling2:

Finally a friend said it might be WB...

Whadda waste of time...

Yep I was screwed by another plumber...


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

I don't think you were screwed, I think you learned something that you didn't know about a faucet brand. If they were throw away junk like PP, Aquasource or Glacier Bay, then yeah, I'd understand your sentiment, but it is a good quality faucet. 

So, you fix the "foo foo" faucets, such as Rohl? Do you keep the parts stocked on your truck or do your supply houses keep the parts stocked? My local supply houses do not stock any repair parts for the "foo foo" stuff. The Rohl distributor orders parts on an "as needed" basis for their customers.


I had never heard of Rohl until I saw a homeowner in Ferguson's with pictures of her faucet trying to get parts. Coincidentally, it came from Ferguson's and they were having to have a "showroom specialist" order the parts for her from the manufacturer.

My point is, why not support a manufacturer that is offering consistent quality products and not just cheapening their products every few years?


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

ChrisConnor said:


> How is installing WB screwing your customer or other plumbers?


I have bought many items through the years, from WB., satisfied with most, including their faucets. I E-mailed my salesman, & the co direct, well over 3mos ago. No response from co., salesman sent me 1 e-mail, 1-1/2 weeks later, & said to call him. I E-mailed back, & repeated my message that I wanted a new catalog, along with the list of items I was interested in, & I would then call him, when I looked through the new catalog. Still no response.
But then the salesmen wanna show up here, once in a while, unannounced, & expect me to take time, right then & there, to place an order. 
So right now WB, I'm still waiting!!!
Your customer service sux.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

The question is, Who is not cheapening their product?. Every manufacturer that you can readily buy parts for has cheapened their faucets in one way or another. Is it too much to ask for a manufacturer to offer a professional line that you can buy parts at a supply house and still get a metal pop up and less plastic in the handles? Delta and Moen I hope you are reading this.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> I have bought many items through the years, from WB., satisfied with most, including their faucets. I E-mailed my salesman, & the co direct, well over 3mos ago. No response from co., salesman sent me 1 e-mail, 1-1/2 weeks later, & said to call him. I E-mailed back, & repeated my message that I wanted a new catalog, along with the list of items I was interested in, & I would then call him, when I looked through the new catalog. Still no response.
> But then the salesmen wanna show up here, once in a while, unannounced, & expect me to take time, right then & there, to place an order.
> So right now WB, I'm still waiting!!!
> Your customer service sux.


 I called once and the lady who answered the phone sounded like she ran in from the parking lot...totally out of breath. I aked her if i could fax her a list of material and have them price the order for me and the price would determine the quanity that I purchse. She agreed and told me to fax it to her and she would fax a quote back to me. I didn't hear anything for about a week and UPS rang my doorbell and dropped a big box off from wolverine....those jackass's billed my account and sent all the items i wanted prices on......and then I checked the order against my invoice and they left a few things out of the box that they billed me for. I called and told them if they did that again I wouldn't pay for it and would call them to send sombody to get the box off my doorstep. They semed like they didn't care one way or the other. They always send the werthers candy tho:thumbsup:


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

TheMaster said:


> I called once and the lady who answered the phone sounded like she ran in from the parking lot...totally out of breath. I aked her if i could fax her a list of material and have them price the order for me and the price would determine the quanity that I purchse. She agreed and told me to fax it to her and she would fax a quote back to me. I didn't hear anything for about a week and UPS rang my doorbell and dropped a big box off from wolverine....those jackass's billed my account and sent all the items i wanted prices on......and then I checked the order against my invoice and they left a few things out of the box that they billed me for. I called and told them if they did that again I wouldn't pay for it and would call them to send sombody to get the box off my doorstep. They semed like they didn't care one way or the other. They always send the werthers candy tho:thumbsup:


Funny you say that. About 2 or 3 yrs ago, around Christmas time I faxed in an order to WB. The next morning, the salesman from WB shows up at my house, unannounced :furious:, which I hate. I told him I placed an order by fax the day before, & he asked me for a copy of the order, so I gave it to him. The next week I received the same order, 2 times. They sent me double of everything. I complained, so they gave me 10% off 2nd order but that was it. I kept it all. I think that is their game. 
As I said in my last thread, I asked the salesman for a catalog, & to e-mail me. He e-mails 10 days later, & says to call him. I don't wanna call him! I know the diff. between e-mail & phone, if I wanted to call, I would, I said e-mail!!!!!Get it?


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> Funny you say that. About 2 or 3 yrs ago, around Christmas time I faxed in an order to WB. The next morning, the salesman from WB shows up at my house, unannounced :furious:, which I hate. I told him I placed an order by fax the day before, & he asked me for a copy of the order, so I gave it to him. The next week I received the same order, 2 times. They sent me double of everything. I complained, so they gave me 10% off 2nd order but that was it. I kept it all. I think that is their game.
> As I said in my last thread, I asked the salesman for a catalog, & to e-mail me. He e-mails 10 days later, & says to call him. I don't wanna call him! I know the diff. between e-mail & phone, if I wanted to call, I would, I said e-mail!!!!!Get it?


I've only met a few salesmen I like.....that sums it up for me. Factory reps hate to see me walk in on counter day.....I draw a crowd when i get going.:laughing: And its usually nothin nice being said.:laughing: I left the american standard reps almost in tears when they brought that traveling toilet demo through town a couple years back. It was a hellva good time:laughing:
The rep told the manager to credit my account for a champion toilet so i could try one out for free but i told the manger dont bother because you cant give me somthing I wouldn't buy.....its not about the money. Some people dont understand that.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

A short piece of 3/4" hard copper is hardly a "special wrench". If you have allot of them in your area to work on then I could see getting the wrench though.

And yes, premier does actually make some nice stuff. Of course the concord line is cheapo, but the higher up models are quite nice. I personally have the Essen 2 handle lavatory faucet in both of my bathrooms and a Sanibel in my kitchen. I also put all premier in my mom’s house as well as all of her rentals.



TheMaster said:


> Ok so we covered the single lever tub/shower valves.....lets move on to the other POS moen makes. How about moens two handle faucets,lets talk IMPACT handles and how they have brittle plastic parts within them and how the handle portion will fuse to the bell portion of the handle that screws over the rough valve. And how the have plastic rings that require a special wrench to remove them with to get to the stem out. The handles literally have 5 or 6 pieces to it.
> 
> Which moen widespread lavatory faucet do you like? Or is that Barnett Premier crap where I should be looking for fine quality?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> I don't think you were screwed, I think you learned something that you didn't know about a faucet brand. If they were throw away junk like PP, Aquasource or Glacier Bay, then yeah, I'd understand your sentiment, but it is a good quality faucet.
> 
> So, you fix the "foo foo" faucets, such as Rohl? Do you keep the parts stocked on your truck or do your supply houses keep the parts stocked? My local supply houses do not stock any repair parts for the "foo foo" stuff. The Rohl distributor orders parts on an "as needed" basis for their customers.
> 
> ...


My point is that while parts may be a headache for foo-foo such as Rohl at least when you go to a supply hose that is geared up to be a leading supplier of stems and cartridges or, one of the good on-line distributors of stems and cartridges Rohl will be found. WB will not be found!

If it wasn't for my friend saying because of not finding it anywhere that it might be WB the customer would have received a new faucet. Hence I was screwed and the customer was nearly screwed.

There is nothing bad about the quality of a WB faucet...
They work and break like any other...
But they do break and because of WB's choice to only make themselves available to the plumbers in their stocking program that is the problem.:whistling2:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> A short piece of 3/4" hard copper is hardly a "special wrench". If you have allot of them in your area to work on then I could see getting the wrench though.
> 
> And yes, premier does actually make some nice stuff. Of course the concord line is cheapo, but the higher up models are quite nice. I personally have the Essen 2 handle lavatory faucet in both of my bathrooms and a Sanibel in my kitchen. I also put all premier in my mom’s house as well as all of her rentals.


Its more than a straight piece of pipe now isn't it? Come on...remember you cant bullshit your way through this.....:whistling2: Premier is shiot and you know it...its just easy to make a profit on them because they are cheap.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> They always send the werthers candy tho:thumbsup:


Well then, that makes it okay. :laughing:

I just installed three WB brushed nickel lav faucets from WB and bought a couple of single lever kitchen sink faucets for stock. It came quickly and I was satisfied with the product quality and such. My rep is in Atlanta and called to check on everything right after I received it. He seems eager to please and is trying to build up his area. I'll keep on with them as long as the service is good.


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

My rep is really good, also. If there is a problem, it is handled. Bam.

Man, can you see TM at counter day!:laughing::laughing:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Yeah, you have to spend 1 minute cutting ears on the end of the pipe to make your own tool. Takes a total of 4 quick cuts with a sawzall metal blade.

Why do you keep accusing me of BS-ing? You sound awfully defensive.......perhaps it is not me who is BS-ing.......

And no, most of premier is not sh!t......that is except for the few faucets that are delta copies. In that case I would agree. It is crapola.



TheMaster said:


> Its more than a straight piece of pipe now isn't it? Come on...remember you cant bullshit your way through this.....:whistling2: Premier is shiot and you know it...its just easy to make a profit on them because they are cheap.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

ChrisConnor said:


> Well then, that makes it okay. :laughing:
> 
> I just installed three WB brushed nickel lav faucets from WB and bought a couple of single lever kitchen sink faucets for stock. It came quickly and I was satisfied with the product quality and such. My rep is in Atlanta and called to check on everything right after I received it. He seems eager to please and is trying to build up his area. I'll keep on with them as long as the service is good.


_Tell your rep if he sends me a fricken catalog, this millenium, I will place a nice order with him, since my rep here in Mich, must be too busy, in this bustling economy._


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> _Tell your rep if he sends me a fricken catalog, this millenium, I will place a nice order with him, since my rep here in Mich, must be too busy, in this bustling economy._


Would you like his number or for me to give him yours?


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Protech said:


> Yeah, you have to spend 1 minute cutting ears on the end of the pipe to make your own tool. Takes a total of 4 quick cuts with a sawzall metal blade.
> 
> Why do you keep accusing me of BS-ing? You sound awfully defensive.......perhaps it is not me who is BS-ing.......
> 
> And no, most of premier is not sh!t......that is except for the few faucets that are delta copies. In that case I would agree. It is crapola.


Sure I'm defensive and your answers keep changing....YOU WENT FROM JUST A PIECE OF 3/4" PIPE TO A PIECE OF 3/4" PIPE TO MAKE A WRENCH WITH....very nice. Thats what I mean by B.S. 1/2 the truth.

Can I go down to the local professional faucet parts store and find a premier cartridge on the shelf??? How about a new set of handles??? Premier sucks and the only reason you use it is because its cheap and you cant be price shopped. Its **** and you know it or maybe you dont.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

No reason to get defensive, all faucets are crap, moen is crap but I use there faucets, all faucets will fail, given time.

Now lets have a group hug.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

I don't visit the wholesaler often. But when I do have the occassion to visit a "counter day". There is always some know it all douche bag making a complete ass out of himself tearing apart some product to a rep. 

The funny part is, that person thinks they are the spokesman for the group, and the group is behind him/her all the way. When in reality, they just want him to shut the heck up.

If I'm not interested in a product, I certainly will not listen to some presentation or special offer on it. My time is much too valuable for that.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Matt said:


> I don't visit the wholesaler often. But when I do have the occassion to visit a "counter day". There is always some know it all douche bag making a complete ass out of himself tearing apart some product to a rep.
> 
> The funny part is, that person thinks they are the spokesman for the group, and the group is behind him/her all the way. When in reality, they just want him to shut the heck up.
> 
> If I'm not interested in a product, I certainly will not listen to some presentation or special offer on it. My time is much too valuable for that.


The douche is the rep who approachs you and tries to sell you garbage as a good product. Their Full-o-poop. American standard has been trying to set thier product apart by building parts exclusive to their design like flush towers and tilt back disc design and then come out with a flush tower 1.6 flush that was defective from the get go. I told that douche he had a crappy product and it wasn't 6 months later the recall hit and they started sending out replacement flushvalves that had been redesigned, people were dragging those toilets into the supply houses and getting refunds everyday. Yeah I gave that douche a hard time and he deserved it thinking he was gonna roll though town and teach the hillbillies somthing. I knew more about his company than he did and he admitted it that himself. It turned out that I also knew more about his crappity crap champion 3 or 4 whatever model it was at the time. Does the Vent-away toilet mean anything to you? How do feel about a vent-away toilet?


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> Yeah I gave that douche a hard time and he deserved it thinking he was gonna roll though town and teach the hillbillies somthing.


Why not just eat the free lunch and avoid the product? :laughing:


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

I love vent-a-way toilets. Not nearly enough parts.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> Why not just eat the free lunch and avoid the product? :laughing:



Thats what I do when there is a lunch given by some dumb rep from some dumb product supplier, I'm not there to talk, I'm just dam hungry.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> Why not just eat the free lunch and avoid the product? :laughing:


What did the 1st sentence of my post say? keyword to look for..Approach!!!

In recent years they have garbage anyway. Cheap ground beef and hotdogs...who where they expecting a t-ball team?


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

I especially like the little black rubber sheet thingy with the rusted metal clip holder thingy..................


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Did somebody say free lunch? :laughing:

If he tries to talk to me about products while I'm eating I might let him have it...:whistling2:


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

Redwood said:


> Did somebody say free lunch? :laughing:
> 
> If he tries to talk to me about products while I'm eating I might let him have it...:whistling2:


You gonna let him have your lunch??????? That's not too smart.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

TheMaster said:


> In recent years they have garbage anyway. Cheap ground beef and hotdogs...who where they expecting a t-ball team?


Not here, they have Philly Steak and Cheese subs, hot of the grill. :thumbup:


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> In recent years they have garbage anyway. Cheap ground beef and hotdogs...who where they expecting a t-ball team?


Maybe in 'bama they do. Here they have good barbecue and one supply house has a brat fry every December.

Rinnai had one a couple of years ago then paid for dinner at a sit down family restauRanT.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> Maybe in 'bama they do. Here they have good barbecue and one supply house has a brat fry every December.
> 
> Rinnai had one a couple of years ago then paid for dinner at a sit down family restauRanT.


 Grohe took us to dinner one night complete with drinks. It was very nice,it was the launch of the "solid" stainless steel ladylux faucet.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

I'd like to weigh in. I used to tell customers things like, "You can't get this Wolverine Brass fill valve at home cheapo, it's only sold to plumbing professionals." I thought having big orange flappers and the copper float balls set me apart from the handy hack, and it did. But The master is right, if you're not stocking WB repair parts, it can be aggravating not being able to get the parts when you need them. Tom is the sales rep down here in SE Florida, and it sometimes takes him more than a few days to get back to me. When I call South Carolina, it is also not a quick response. Not having repair parts can turn a plumber into a BS artist: You tell the cust. his/her faucet needs to be replaced (only cuz it'll take 7-10 working days to get parts.)


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> I'd like to weigh in. I used to tell customers things like, "You can't get this Wolverine Brass fill valve at home cheapo, it's only sold to plumbing professionals." I thought having big orange flappers and the copper float balls set me apart from the handy hack, and it did. But The master is right, if you're not stocking WB repair parts, it can be aggravating not being able to get the parts when you need them. Tom is the sales rep down here in SE Florida, and it sometimes takes him more than a few days to get back to me. When I call South Carolina, it is also not a quick response. Not having repair parts can turn a plumber into a BS artist: You tell the cust. his/her faucet needs to be replaced (only cuz it'll take 7-10 working days to get parts.)


I thought the big sales pitch for WB faucets, was the fact that very few parts needed to be stocked. 1 cartridge for all single handle faucets, 1 cartridge stem for all 2 handle faucets, no? I have installed about a dozen 3 handle tub & shower valves, but never had to repair one yet. 

I don't get why these salesmen take so long to get back with their customers. For me, a 1 man show, it's frustrating, cuz when I have the time, it is a very short window of opportunity to place these stock orders, & by the time the salesman decides to call me, I'm back out in the trenches again.


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## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

Some of you have mentioned that the old style delta faucets are still available. I'd be curious as to where they are available at.

As to WB- we've bought from them for roughly 20 years. In the past 10 years, I've been through at least 6 sales reps (hhhmmmm). I've never had issues with any of them. I email them an order and its here in a couple of days. And I don't think I'm a big fish- 10-12K a year. I probably revolve around 2k of their product in inventory, but I don't track it seperately. I don't use their faucets. I think they are a quality valve, but I got enough in inventory.

If nothing else, it does prove that your product/service is only part of the story. If you can't/don't/won't communicate with your customers the quality of your product doesn't matter.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Colgar said:


> Some of you have mentioned that the old style delta faucets are still available. I'd be curious as to where they are available at.


TM bought them all. Only new style available now:chinese:.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

WB if you sell them you should be stocking the parts.I have never had a problem getting anything from Tom. Had a special order kitchen faucet and had it the next day and did not pay next day freight.

Normal wait time is 2-3 days.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Richard Hilliar said:


> WB if you sell them you should be stocking the parts.I have never had a problem getting anything from Tom. Had a special order kitchen faucet and had it the next day and did not pay next day freight.
> 
> Normal wait time is 2-3 days.


Sound like he left money on the table. I would have charged you for next day shipping if thats what you requested. Always give the customer what they want...and always charge them for it otherwise you may not be around to provide your serice enext time they call on you. Profit is not a dirty word.:jester:


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

the lions share of my customers don't repair they replace. a lot of it is the hard water build up and they just want a new one. the first is what they claim, the second is the truth. yanked out a moen kit faucet. replaced with pp. lol. both had lifetime guarantees according to lady. husband was to big to fit under cabinet. so there you go. breid...........:rockon:


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

TheMaster said:


> Theres not a problem with a delta that cannot be prevented by alittle faucet grease on all the threads and "o"rings. When I install a new faucet I remove the cartridge apply the grease to the threads and the cartridge "o" ring and remove the set screws from the handles and grease them too. I look out for myself and my customers and I dont mind taking the time to do it because i charge time and material...I even make money on the grease.:laughing:


 I'm a BIG grease guy !!! on Faucets i mean :whistling2::whistling2:


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

pdxplumber said:


> I recently rebuilt a ten year old Chicago lav faucet. I had worked on a few, years ago when I used to service restaurants. I forgot how great they were. I think I have found my new faucet. I have been true blue to Delta but they keep ******x me over with plastic this and that, and now the pex supplies. I still like the shower valve. How long till they make those out of plastic.
> Anybody use Chicago on a regular basis? I don't think they sell them at the big box stores.


I install them at the power plants and factories I do work in. I don't bother rebuilding Moen, Delta, Kohler, Wolverine, whatever. The only other shower faucets I rebuild are Powers brand. I love Chicago, and rebuild them with the ceramic stem units.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Does Chicago make shower faucets? Never seen one myself.
I like Chicago too, just too pricey for most of the jobs I do, which is residential. I use them mostly on replacements, of wall mounted kitchen faucets, in older houses. I tell customers a little white lie, when it comes to the wall mounted faucets. I tell them chicago is all that is available. Never had a complaint yet. The new ceramic 1/4 turn cartridge stems are awesome.


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Don The Plumber said:


> Does Chicago make shower faucets? Never seen one myself.
> I like Chicago too, just too pricey for most of the jobs I do, which is residential. I use them mostly on replacements, of wall mounted kitchen faucets, in older houses. I tell customers a little white lie, when it comes to the wall mounted faucets. I tell them chicago is all that is available. Never had a complaint yet. The new ceramic 1/4 turn cartridge stems are awesome.


Yes, they make two handle or one handle, I haven't had to service any one handle yet.


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