# What's the Kiss of death?



## Scott K (Oct 12, 2008)

Many of you have been burned before and swear never to have it happen again. 

So I'm curious - for you, what is the Kiss of death? If a Customer (or contractor) does or says THIS, you're gone, period, or you decline wanting to work for them? Everything might be going great and everything is leading up to you doing work and they do or say this and that's it, OUT!

Shoot....


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Liquidated damages on the subs.

I'm not about to pay if I'm waiting on something beyond my control Such as painting, flooring, wiring...................


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

In no particular order.

-I poured a gallon of drano down the drain.

-The last plumber that was here said to (fill in the blank).

-Is that the lowest you can go?

-Nothing said but getting an unapproved set of prints with no date stamp.

-Can't understand why it's so expensive.

-I'm an engineer (walk out)

-I'm an engineer for NAVFAC (run out)


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## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

If a customer says he wants to help....yeah, no. I will not use Craftsmen tools....I just hate them. I also rarely work on rental properties. But I am upfront about it, I often tell landlords that I do things the right way and I am typically the guy you want working on your own home, not your "investment" property. They usually get the picture pretty quick.


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## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

Hay boss, look at my shower / trap line!!

And ahhh, you got any kind of announcement you want to make there pal???







gear junkie said:


> In no particular order.
> 
> -I poured a gallon of drano down the drain.
> 
> ...


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

I only left and canceled my permit on one job. People had sewerage coming out from under the house. Not really a crawl space, more that it was built 6" above the ground. So we opened up the floor and seen that someone knocked a hole in the cast iron and tied in a sink line. So we started to cut it all out and put a call into the inspector to see if he wanted cast iron back in or PVC. While waiting the slum lord owner was getting mad as hell waiting for us to move any further on this. I explained to him I need to talk to the rent-an-inspector and find out what he requires. He then said " Well if you do not know the plumbing code you should of told me and I would of hired someone else"! I said heck with this crap, told my helper to pack up we are leaving. Went across the street to the village hall and told them I want to pull my permit and want my check back. I told them why and they had not problem.

They sent the building inspector to the home to post a condemned signage on the home till the plumbing was fixed to code. I drove by there for a month, after 5 weeks went by he finally got a plumber that was willing to do the job.


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## tungsten plumb (Apr 15, 2010)

A have a extreme distaste for know it all engineers. I find out they're an engineer the price goes up 30% off the bat.



gear junkie said:


> In no particular order.
> 
> -I poured a gallon of drano down the drain.
> 
> ...


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> I only left and canceled my permit on one job. People had sewerage coming out from under the house. Not really a crawl space, more that it was built 6" above the ground. So we opened up the floor and seen that someone knocked a hole in the cast iron and tied in a sink line. So we started to cut it all out and put a call into the inspector to see if he wanted cast iron back in or PVC. While waiting the slum lord owner was getting mad as hell waiting for us to move any further on this. I explained to him I need to talk to the rent-an-inspector and find out what he requires. He then said " Well if you do not know the plumbing code you should of told me and I would of hired someone else"! I said heck with this crap, told my helper to pack up we are leaving. Went across the street to the village hall and told them I want to pull my permit and want my check back. I told them why and they had not problem.
> 
> They sent the building inspector to the home to post a condemned signage on the home till the plumbing was fixed to code. I drove by there for a month, after 5 weeks went by he finally got a plumber that was willing to do the job.


I'm not 2nd guessing you, I've just never heard of an inspector determining what type of pipe you use. Wouldn't cast iron, or pvc both be approved materials to use? Only time I've ever heard of pvc not being accepted in a residential house, is maybe if it was in a cold air return.
I totally agree that when a wye or tee is cut into a cast iron drain, that it looks more professional to install a no-hub cast iron wye or tee, instead of a pvc fitting with 2 ferncos, that looks like DIY work. But either way is code, & inspector would have to approve it, right?


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Ya know, my husband is always out of town, and I sure get lonely.......:brows:

:scooter:


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> I'm not 2nd guessing you, I've just never heard of an inspector determining what type of pipe you use. Wouldn't cast iron, or pvc both be approved materials to use? Only time I've ever heard of pvc not being accepted in a residential house, is maybe if it was in a cold air return.
> I totally agree that when a wye or tee is cut into a cast iron drain, that it looks more professional to install a no-hub cast iron wye or tee, instead of a pvc fitting with 2 ferncos, that looks like DIY work. But either way is code, & inspector would have to approve it, right?


Here in Illinois our plumbing code is the minimum requirements, each and every county, town, or city can make the code stricter. At that time when I walked off the job I never did work in that city, so I did not know what the requirements for that city where. For example where they just following State code, or where they following Chicago code, or did they have their own requirements. A town just north of this one does not want any plastic in the dwv system unless its all plastic. 

As for the job I described, some one just knocked a hole in the cast iron to tie in a sink. All the cast iron under ground was rotten due to the crack in the pipe so it all had to come out. Also the lav sink, tub, and the other sink they tied in where not vented at all. So we where going to have to repipe the whole under the house DWV and do the right type of revents. I would of hated to did it all in PVC and when I got it inspected to find out they required it all to be done in cast iron and copper like the town just north of them. 

The issue was they did not have a inspector on staff full time. So this guy was out running calls when I needed to get a hold of him with our questions about which code they followed and if their where any amendments we needed to know before we went to far into this. If it was a simple repair we probably would of just put in cast iron and been done with it all. But since we where replacing all the under the house DWV and the slum lord did not want to spend tons of money on this and wanted us to use PVC, so we wanted to verify if it was allowed. We had everything on the truck to do it in CI and copper, as well as in DWV. I tried to explain to the owner that if he wants me to plumb it in with out verifying whats allowed, I will do it in CI and copper, that it would pass no matter what. 

So to answer your question "But either way is code, & inspector would have to approve it, right?" It would meet Illinois code but if it does not meet the city's code he would not approve it.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

I actually don't own this place, so when your done just send a bill to my landlord and he'll pay ya.


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## LEAD INGOT (Jul 15, 2009)

Well, it's been leaking under the trailer for a few months now, and can I pay you on the 5th, that's when I get my check. I don't even say goodbye. I want word to spread in the trailer park, not to call me.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Had a six flat that was backing up in the basement apartments utility room. The landlord lived in that unit, and as he had me remove my boots before I walked on his arctic white carpet, and lead me to the utility room he said "If you get one spot on my carpet I am not paying you!" When I looked in the utility room there was an inch of black muck all over the floor in there. I told him I need to get my rod. Went out to my truck called my Uncle (was his job) told him what the guy said, my uncle said just leave. So I split with out saying a thing to the landlord.

about two weeks goes by, our company gets the call, my father gives me the info. I told him I can't go back there I was there 2 weeks ago for Abbalinski. So him and my uncle went there. The guy did not say a word about getting the carpet dirty to them.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Customer on phone- "I have a really easy ten minute job for you to do, my husband was going to do it, but he just doesn't have the time".


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## SPH (Nov 4, 2008)

"Wow thats alot of money, can we trade labour? I'm an (insert job here)"


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> Customer on phone- "I have a really easy ten minute job for you to do, my husband was going to do it, but he just doesn't have the time".


 ^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^ No problem I can do it in ten minutes but I am charging you an hour minimum service call. Thankyou very much!!:thumbup:


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

A HO acting as GC on a job. Always turns into more trips and the subcontractors end up running the job. HO is too inexperienced to understand they are being lead astray. If we do a job for a HO who is clueless, we bump up the price and spell out the number of trips included in our bid. Unnecessary trips will be billed at our normal labor rate. "No, we do not set the toilet before the tile man does his job!" and "No, we will not return to pull the toilet because you decided to wallpaper."


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

Kiss of death would be Ron laying a wet one on ya:laughing:


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## Leviathan (Mar 14, 2010)

1) Engineers

2) People who want to "help" in order to offset the bill.

3) Contractors who ask me to take shortcuts/compromise the quality of my work: total scum bags. Asking me to stiff their customer so I can charge less and the contractor keep the extra profit. It could get ugly the next time I'm asked that.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

go ahead and just do the job.....

the price is no object., no concern what-so-ever

I TRUST YOU........:laughing::laughing:



 they really dont care what the final price is because they aint paying you anyway:no::no:

I ALWAYS get out my billbook when I hear this and make them out an estimate and then watch their reaction....


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## Mongrel (Mar 4, 2010)

I've only been up and runnin' a few weeks but I think I found one...

"...the last plumber I had here charged me $*** and hour, but he was a real plumber, he put a sump pump in for me."

Now, lay that over the fact that this came from:

1. a family 'friend' who KNOWS I am 'legit' and have a license, insurance, and all the other credentials of a 'real' plumber. 

2. someone who had just paid me $40 LESS for a one hour service call than the hourly price she gave me above. 

3. paid me by check with my full company name on it so I even get to eat the tax.

4. knows that I have no other source of income for my family but my plumbing business.

Not sure if this will be her kiss of death or not, but it sure was an eye opener. I finished up a quote for her on some other work using 'real' plumber prices. We'll see how that's received.

Ironically enough, I had a 70 year old country preacher specifically tell me NOT to cut him a break because my family needs the money! Who do you think will get the A-1 service when they call? heheh


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

PlumbCrazy said:


> A HO acting as GC on a job. Always turns into more trips and the subcontractors end up running the job. HO is too inexperienced to understand they are being lead astray. If we do a job for a HO who is clueless, we bump up the price and spell out the number of trips included in our bid. Unnecessary trips will be billed at our normal labor rate. "No, we do not set the toilet before the tile man does his job!" and "No, we will not return to pull the toilet because you decided to wallpaper."


 Just finished a laundry room remodel where the customer was the G.C.
All the old plumbing, & gas pipe, was being torn out & relocated to opposite wall, along with appliances & heat ducts. 1st day on job, the tileman/handyman is there, who barely speaks english, & is tearing up the old flooring, & wanting to lay down new subflooring, all in this one day. This room was about 300 sq. ft. I told the G.C., either he walks out the door now, or I will.:furious: Thankfully, when the H.O. seen how stupid this was to have both of us working in this one room, at the same time, she made him walk out.


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

"i Want You To Put It Back The Same Way, Those Old Plumbers Knew What They Were Doing" I Was Told This After Finding A Rusted 1/2" Black Ell On Brass Domestic Water Line That Blew Off. Oh And Also Asked If I Was Sure That The Water Wasn't Leaking Out Of The Gas Pipe. Didnt Walk Out Just Charged Them Double And Of Course I Used Brass :thumbsup:


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Having a homeowner ask you for a price to replace a galv. lav drain, over a drum set, that he just got done telling you is worth $14,000.00. (Yes, fourteen thousand dollars). 

Then he tell's you he ain't moving the drum set, because it is set up perfect, and he'll never be able to get it back in the same exact location. 

Buh bye.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

" Need ya to look at one more LITTLE thing " ,,, AAARRRGGGHHHH !!


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Cal said:


> " Need ya to look at one more LITTLE thing " ,,, AAARRRGGGHHHH !!


Ahhhh, the 3 famous words in the world "WHILE YOUR HERE".


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Don The Plumber said:


> Ahhhh, the 3 famous words in the world "WHILE YOUR HERE".


I love those words, it means my ticket is about to JUMP!!!


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

BROOKLYN\PLUMB said:


> "i Want You To Put It Back The Same Way, Those Old Plumbers Knew What They Were Doing" I Was Told This After Finding A Rusted 1/2" Black Ell On Brass Domestic Water Line That Blew Off. Oh And Also Asked If I Was Sure That The Water Wasn't Leaking Out Of The Gas Pipe. Didnt Walk Out Just Charged Them Double And Of Course I Used Brass :thumbsup:


So you ripped them off.....nice. And some of you wonder why people price shop.....well heres one answer.....plumbers like this guy charging double because sombody makes a couple comments prolly just to hear themselves talk.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

smellslike$tome said:


> I love those words, it means my ticket is about to JUMP!!!


 Yeah, thats fine, so then what do you do with all the other calls you had lined up that day? Call them & tell them you can't make it? Or you will be late. Then when you get to the 2nd call, they want something extra too, & so on. 
Don't get me wrong, this happens to me all the time, & I find myself trying to do it all, & stay on schedule, but it all depends on what they want done that was not anticipated. Sometimes a simple ballcock replacement, can turn into a project, which is all fine & good,"if you have the time".


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

A red flag for me is when the jackoff asks me for a material list so he can get the stuff himself! 

That's like going to IHOP and bringing your own bacon and eggs and asking the waitress, "Is it cheaper if you cook my food?":blink:


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

Scott K said:


> Many of you have been burned before and swear never to have it happen again.
> 
> So I'm curious - for you, what is the Kiss of death? If a Customer (or contractor) does or says THIS, you're gone, period, or you decline wanting to work for them? Everything might be going great and everything is leading up to you doing work and they do or say this and that's it, OUT!
> 
> Shoot....


If my integrity is challenged or if a payment is missed or late, I'm done and down the road.


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## Flynbyu (Aug 31, 2012)

SewerRatz said:


> Here in Illinois our plumbing code is the minimum requirements, each and every county, town, or city can make the code stricter. At that time when I walked off the job I never did work in that city, so I did not know what the requirements for that city where. For example where they just following State code, or where they following Chicago code, or did they have their own requirements. A town just north of this one does not want any plastic in the dwv system unless its all plastic.
> 
> As for the job I described, some one just knocked a hole in the cast iron to tie in a sink. All the cast iron under ground was rotten due to the crack in the pipe so it all had to come out. Also the lav sink, tub, and the other sink they tied in where not vented at all. So we where going to have to repipe the whole under the house DWV and do the right type of revents. I would of hated to did it all in PVC and when I got it inspected to find out they required it all to be done in cast iron and copper like the town just north of them.
> 
> ...



I've always found it easier to get forgiveness than permision.


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

Flynbyu said:


> I've always found it easier to get forgiveness than permision.


Brilliant !

Just go ahead and do the whole job and risk having to tear it all out.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Copper is the WORST pipe to use on any DWV system


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

"I had a plumber come out and I am filing a complaint with the State Plumbing Board. Would you come finish the work?"


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

SlickRick said:


> "I had a plumber come out and I am filing a complaint with the State Plumbing Board. Would you come finish the work?"


:laughing::laughing::laughing:

I'll be right there !


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

rjbphd said:


> Copper is the WORST pipe to use on any DWV system


Why do you say that ?

Ive seen copper dwv that looks like new at 50 + years old.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> Why do you say that ?
> 
> Ive seen copper dwv that looks like new at 50 + years old.


Then it never been used!! I've seen copper DWV get eaten out all the time around here.


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

rjbphd said:


> Then it never been used!! I've seen copper DWV get eaten out all the time around here.


Must be that fine Chicago water ! :laughing:

Out here It looks damn near new.

I replace a lot more cast than copper, as a matter of fact, I have never replaced copper dwv since moving here to Idaho.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> Must be that fine Chicago water ! :laughing:
> 
> Out here It looks damn near new.
> 
> I replace a lot more cast than copper, as a matter of fact, I have never replaced copper dwv since moving here to Idaho.


 Its the Lake Michigan water causing all the sewer backing up in DuPage county.


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## Plumbdog (Jan 27, 2009)

"The last two plumbers didn't know what they were doing"


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## MarkToo (Dec 17, 2011)

If it's a new, unknown client and they don't ask for a price - they just say "Do it", I immediately cannot fit the job into my schedule.


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## 89plumbum (May 14, 2011)

Ahh... I remember the first time (shortly after going out on my own) having a customer ask "hey, do you do any side work?" I just smirked and didnt respond.:laughing:


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## plumberinlaw (Jan 13, 2010)

When Mr. Patel is trying to beat my price down and he say's "I have many houses"


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

plumberinlaw said:


> When Mr. Patel is trying to beat my price down and he say's "I have many houses"


This is similar to my favorite. When a GC tells you this one is really tight, if you can help me out we will make it up on the next one.


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## Flynbyu (Aug 31, 2012)

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> Brilliant !
> 
> Just go ahead and do the whole job and risk having to tear it all out.


I believe the job in question is underground either cast or pvc. I can't see any advantage of cast over pvc underground but can think of quite a few advantages of pvc over cast underground. Both meet code. I can't imagine an inspector having you tear out a total repipe of underground pvc.


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## Flynbyu (Aug 31, 2012)

My kiss of death is a customer demanding bosch tankless water heaters be used. I hate em.


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## Flynbyu (Aug 31, 2012)

Flynbyu said:


> I believe the job in question is underground either cast or pvc. I can't see any advantage of cast over pvc underground but can think of quite a few advantages of pvc over cast underground. Both meet code. I can't imagine an inspector having you tear out a total repipe of underground pvc.


How many times have you had to rip a customers floor out, break up the concrete, and replace pvc because the whole bottom of the pipe has rotted out?


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## Adamche (Feb 10, 2012)

Flynbyu said:


> My kiss of death is a customer demanding bosch tankless water heaters be used. I hate em.


Any tankless, overcompliated shyte. Put them all in the trash


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## drain surgeon (Jun 17, 2010)

When the customer argues about code!


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

There are 3 kiss of deaths where I fire customers. Swearing, rude or obnoxious behavior with our office staff is a definite no no. Lack of respect for the trade qualifies someone as my competitions customer.

The last kiss of death is when my time exceeds the monetary value of the customer. I just fired a customer yesterday. She called me 4 times Friday night and again Saturday, plus calls by my office and the on call plumber. Then an email Monday, all contact made while I was still in Ohio with family. She could not and would not understand why I was in Ohio and it did not matter to her.

Tuesday when I arrived at work I did look into her inquiry and called to let her know that was the last job we will do for her. Her account is on hold.

I welcome objections, reluctance, and resistance questions; these are minor challenges that present opportunities.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Richard Hilliard said:


> There are 3 kiss of deaths where I fire customers. Swearing, rude or obnoxious behavior with our office staff is a definite no no. Lack of respect for the trade qualifies someone as my competitions customer.
> 
> The last kiss of death is when my time exceeds the monetary value of the customer. I just fired a customer yesterday. She called me 4 times Friday night and again Saturday, plus calls by my office and the on call plumber. Then an email Monday, all contact made while I was still in Ohio with family. She could not and would not understand why I was in Ohio and it did not matter to her.
> 
> ...


That is not like you ,,, I though you never give up


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

OldSchool said:


> That is not like you ,,, I though you never give up


One of the keys to success is knowing when to cut your losses (even better to not accrue any to begin with).


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## chuckscott (Oct 20, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> A red flag for me is when the jackoff asks me for a material list so he can get the stuff himself!
> 
> That's like going to IHOP and bringing your own bacon and eggs and asking the waitress, "Is it cheaper if you cook my food?":blink:


My first boss used a similar analogy asking customers if they would bring in a pound of hamburger to Burger King and ask them to cook it.. Too funny!


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

89plumbum said:


> Ahh... I remember the first time (shortly after going out on my own) having a customer ask "hey, do you do any side work?" I just smirked and didnt respond.:laughing:


i got a neww one for that..i say yes i do. would you like to do that now. (whatever it is) if they say yes. i do it then, give them a invoice after im done. ho say whats this ! thats you invoice for my side work. it be ok im aloud to do side work as long as i write it up. its a hidden upsell. sometimes if its a bigger job i'll bid it, and schedule it for later and come back with my boss and do the job togather:laughing:


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## saysflushable (Jun 15, 2009)

It's not a mean thing but if I find out I'm not talking to the property owner or rep. I'm not working there. 

I try not to work on trailors but I still get suckered into it.

Try not to work in bars and restaurants espcially after hours but still seemed to work there.

I won't go out on weekends or after hours to replace a delta tub valve a home owner broke trying to fix a drip.

my prices are to high for any motels around. So my price is the kiss of death to any motel owners.


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

piper1 said:


> i got a neww one for that..i say yes i do. would you like to do that now. (whatever it is) if they say yes. i do it then, give them a invoice after im done. ho say whats this ! thats you invoice for my side work. it be ok im aloud to do side work as long as i write it up. its a hidden upsell. sometimes if its a bigger job i'll bid it, and schedule it for later and come back with my boss and do the job togather:laughing:


 this has turned out to be a mother load of work. the prices are the same anyway. some customers think that side work is cheaper. people like to think they are getting over. i don't tell them any diff. the differnce is, i tell my boss the truth. to keep everthing above broad.


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

Flynbyu said:


> I believe the job in question is underground either cast or pvc. I can't see any advantage of cast over pvc underground but can think of quite a few advantages of pvc over cast underground. Both meet code. I can't imagine an inspector having you tear out a total repipe of underground pvc.


I have one. The discharge piping off a commercial dishwasher that uses how water disinfection. The water is hot enough to melt PVC.


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## Flynbyu (Aug 31, 2012)

RW Plumbing said:


> I have one. The discharge piping off a commercial dishwasher that uses how water disinfection. The water is hot enough to melt PVC.


This is residential smarty pants. Lol


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

Flynbyu said:


> This is residential smarty pants. Lol


If you're seeing that kind of damage I would bet that they have condensate that isn't being neutralized going in those ci drains


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## retired rooter (Dec 31, 2008)

I knew a guy who said a lady hugged him as he was leaving her house. She had been crying about her hubby getting killed overseas and he felt sorry and gave he a causal pat on the back. Seemed she wanted more but he (said) all he did was give her a pat on the back. 
She called the office and said he touched her unapproately 
Enough to cost him his job.


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## cracker (Oct 28, 2012)

Rule of thumb, ”NEVER TOUCH THE CLIENT!!“


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

cracker said:


> Rule of thumb, ”NEVER TOUCH THE CLIENT!!“


 Where's the rest of the post???


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

rjbphd said:


> Where's the rest of the post???


I guess they got the kiss of death


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

I hope cracker's membership status also received the kiss of death.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

OldSchool said:


> That is not like you ,,, I though you never give up


 
It is funny oldschool many have this idea like you do that what I do is not final. You would be surprised to discover it is more final than what you do or any other person. The difference is I discover the ``why” before I decide my next response and action. I never react to a response. When the ``why” is discovered everything becomes absolute for the right reasons by making the right choice.

I learned many years ago when I react and respond many times it is directed by some sort of anger which is at times frustration and typically the wrong way to respond. I do not say you are a fu#k#n moron and to take your fu#k#n work elsewhere. What I tell them makes them think more about themselves and what they are not accomplishing. I love it when they walk away thanking me and then realizing 5 minutes afterwards that I just told them to go fly a kite and get struck with lightening. You should try it as it is more fun and a whole lot more enjoyable and the best thing is it does not affect the rest of my day.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Richard Hilliard said:


> It is funny oldschool many have this idea like you do that what I do is not final. You would be surprised to discover it is more final than what you do or any other person. The difference is I discover the ``why&#148; before I decide my next response and action. I never react to a response. When the ``why&#148; is discovered everything becomes absolute for the right reasons by making the right choice.
> 
> I learned many years ago when I react and respond many times it is directed by some sort of anger which is at times frustration and typically the wrong way to respond. I do not say you are a fu#k#n moron and to take your fu#k#n work elsewhere. What I tell them makes them think more about themselves and what they are not accomplishing. I love it when they walk away thanking me and then realizing 5 minutes afterwards that I just told them to go fly a kite and get struck with lightening. You should try it as it is more fun and a whole lot more enjoyable and the best thing is it does not affect the rest of my day.


Believe me I know the art of negotiation ...

It's just some people you can't negotiate with..


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

OldSchool said:


> Believe me I know the art of negotiation ...
> 
> It's just people you can't negotiate with..


 
This is exactly what I am talking about the small percentage or the exception. Why worry about them? It seems people love to bring up and talk about the exception when we should be focusing on the larger percentage that are willing, able, and ready. It makes no sense that people bring up the exception and think that the point is made. Why waste your time and breathe with the exception?

Sometimes people put too much focus on the exception and allow this crap to ruin their day, night and into the next morning. Put that energy into something that matters and make a difference with the high percentage.


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## chuckscott (Oct 20, 2010)

89plumbum said:


> Ahh... I remember the first time (shortly after going out on my own) having a customer ask "hey, do you do any side work?" I just smirked and didnt respond.:laughing:


I tell cust that I do indeed do side work, for $300.00 an hour plus parts. Haven't had any takers.... When I work after hours for my boss I get time and a half, it's not quite 300 an hour, but it's job security if I don't take the side work. If I am going to risk my job I might as well get as much as I can from the side job cust.. Like I said, haven't had any takers... Don't know why..:laughing:


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