# When Codes don't make sense...



## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I'm sure I'll get blasted for this thread, and I have and do follow all codes, but sometimes codes can be overly excessive depending on the application.

My first SNCOIC had a play on Admiral Nimitz's words that cannot be disputed. "Common sense is an uncommon virtue."

Just wondering if anyone has any good stories to share.

About two years ago we picked up a new customer who owns one of those kid places where you buy tokens to play games and win more tokens to buy cheap China toys, play laser tag.... It was an old movie theater that had a three bay sink, soda fountain, popcorn, and what not. The only outside food allowed in is birthday cakes, but if you wanted pizza, they would order it for you and have it delivered.

Owner decided he wanted to have a hotdog roller to boost sales and contacted the township to find out any local codes and regulations so he wouldn't get popped. Now were talking about just hotdogs. Well they required a grease trap, mop sink with soap mixer, hand sink, the whole 9 yards. There were two ways for us to do it. A ton of jackhammering, ripping apart their laser tag room, or run a two inch through a crawl and mount the grease trap and the floor sink above ground. Now the funny thing is we obviously had to have all the normal backflows, and what not, but, because of the height of the grease trap there was no way to get an air gap, infact the 90 dumping into the floor sink was 1/2" below the top... And because height was such an issue and to keep proper fall the floor sink has a 1/2" of water in it at all times. We knew it was going to be tight at the beginning, but didn't think it would be that bad. Inspector passed it anyway. If I remember right the job total was just about $6k.... just to have a hotdog roller. Not complaining, we made money. I told the employees, they better charge $12.50 a dog if they wanna start making money in the next five years.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

Geese traps on the same floor level as 3 compartment sinks are the Bain of my existence. Last on I did I bought these short turn 90's that were a hub on one side and a turntable 11/2" nut on the other with a washer. It screwed right onto the bottom of the basket strainer. Then I put 11/2x1 reducers in the hub of the 90's and ran 1" to my 3" trap and used 1" 90's to turn down into trap. It worked but barely.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

Btw it also passed, I don't know why or how but it did.


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## Absaroka Joe (Mar 30, 2013)

The UPC needs to address AAVs clearly, as the IPC has done. Accept them or reject them, but make it clear. Having to rely on section 301.2 to claim that they are acceptable is not good enough. And most building inspectors are not qualified to have a meaningful opinion. IMHO.


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## plumbdrum (Nov 30, 2013)

Very easy, just ban AAV's all together, let the handy hacks use them


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Auto vents have there place. For instance I've installed a 3" aav in a building where getting a pipe through the roof would have cost thousands due to businesses above. It's been installed for 5 years now with no problems.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I don't know if it's still current, but in the Grand Rapids area in MI ball valves are not legal as they're consider a quick opening valve like an ice maker or washing machine.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OpenSights said:


> I don't know if it's still current, but in the Grand Rapids area in MI ball valves are not legal as they're consider a quick opening valve like an ice maker or washing machine.


Are u fookin kidding?? What u use? The slow dripping gate valves made in some wazzo countries that the stem will breaks almost every time when used..???


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

Absaroka Joe said:


> The UPC needs to address AAVs clearly, as the IPC has done. Accept them or reject them, but make it clear. Having to rely on section 301.2 to claim that they are acceptable is not good enough. And most building inspectors are not qualified to have a meaningful opinion. IMHO.


They have addressed them. They are not allowed. 301.2 will only work with unqualified inspectors. Inspectors with a solid background in plumbing usually refer to 301.2.1, asking for proof of equivalency. In the case of an AAV there is no proof. An AAV is not equivalent to a vent.


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## jeffreyplumber (Dec 7, 2009)

very interesting I googled upc 301.2  and read a few things companys like soix chief claim aav are upc aprooved. Seems 301.2 just confuses things. just about any 2 things that are similar could easily be argued to not be equivilant. I too cant see an aav as equivalant perhaps close but not equal.. perhaps even good enough but the code dosent say almost as good as or similar I like codes to be a bit more concrete


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

AAV not approved in Illinois, As stated let the hacks use them. My opinion they foul quite abit, if open may flood or let sewer gas infiltrate into the structure. Using this is not "plumbing" in my boat.

Commercial three pan sink minimum 1 1/2" often 2", not 1" waste. Heck a residential lav. only has a 1 1/4" waste.

They do make low profile "grease interceptors" (not the grease traps) where you can trap each bowl and as long as a FD or hub drain is in between the sink and interceptor inlet the sink can be directly connected, providing the traps & hub drain are vented.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

rjbphd said:


> Are u fookin kidding?? What u use? The slow dripping gate valves made in some wazzo countries that the stem will breaks almost every time when used..???


any valve that requires a pipe wrench to close and a hammer to open needs to be outlawed.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

How many of you contect the dishwasher discharge to garbage disposal connection after running hose up against the bottom of countertop?


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

rjbphd said:


> How many of you contect the dishwasher discharge to garbage disposal connection after running hose up against the bottom of countertop?


that's pretty well standard around here almost never see a vacuum breaker on them.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

rjbphd said:


> How many of you contect the dishwasher discharge to garbage disposal connection after running hose up against the bottom of countertop?


All the time. I don't really like it myself.... but what I've always done in the past is tallon or use a flat micky the drain hose as close to the top of the flood line. Most of this solves the backwater issue when the drain gets plugged. It's really a double edged sword, lazy people like myself don't pre rinse my dinner plates, scrape, yes. When the extra crud goes into the disposal you can flush the line with a full sink of water. That said, in my house I just have a continuous waste, and my dishwasher wears a wedding ring. Kind of a faulty unit though, seems to only work when she wants too.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I don't really care for AAVs. Any mechanical device can fail. There is this one medical building I use to take care of where one hand sink drain had been plumbed at 22" OC off the floor, so the only option was an up pump box with an AAV. The tenant of the building didn't want to spend the money to run a real vent, or even re-vent it. I'm sure it has to do with the sudden surge from the pump, but the vent would shut not allowing the water in the crock to discharge. Only solution was to leave the AAV barely threaded in. It's enough for the health inspectors and the customer, but not for me. I've seen this issue even on lines with no up pump.

One high end restaurant over in collage town has a total of 10 AAVs between the bar and kitchen. Every three months we'd get a sewer smell call. Show up, replace all ten, charge them and say see ya in three months.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OpenSights said:


> I don't really care for AAVs. Any mechanical device can fail. There is this one medical building I use to take care of where one hand sink drain had been plumbed at 22" OC off the floor, so the only option was an up pump box with an AAV. The tenant of the building didn't want to spend the money to run a real vent, or even re-vent it. I'm sure it has to do with the sudden surge from the pump, but the vent would shut not allowing the water in the crock to discharge. Only solution was to leave the AAV barely threaded in. It's enough for the health inspectors and the customer, but not for me. I've seen this issue even on lines with no up pump.
> 
> One high end restaurant over in collage town has a total of 10 AAVs between the bar and kitchen. Every three months we'd get a sewer smell call. Show up, replace all ten, charge them and say see ya in three months.


Even in the AVV installation guide.. its NOT to be used for pump up tank,sewage pit... however, u can use it on sewage ejector pit if you piped it right... country of Illinois inspectors won't or can't understand this..


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

Recently did a sewer ejector job for a new bathroom in the basement. The inspector let me install it with a AAV, using only a studor vent which is in our code now. (NSPC) He made me submit a drawing for the proper piping.
So when the job was done he fails me !!!!
Citing me for not submitting the ICC report for the AAV.
I'm not a fan of these mechanical vents but it was nice not having to rip the walls open to get the vent out the roof.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

plumber11928 said:


> Recently did a sewer ejector job for a new bathroom in the basement. The inspector let me install it with a AAV, using only a studor vent which is in our code now. (NSPC) He made me submit a drawing for the proper piping.
> So when the job was done he fails me !!!!
> Citing me for not submitting the ICC report for the AAV.
> I'm not a fan of these mechanical vents but it was nice not having to rip the walls open to get the vent out the roof.


What was the drawing showings?? Can u post it?.. like steam heating system... there's only one way of doing it..


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

Please excuse the primitive drawing.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

plumber11928 said:


> Please excuse the primitive drawing.


I get the drawing.... But it's kinda sort of re-vented into the drain line? Does this work in reality?


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I'm a bit surprised no one has really commented on the OP about one code being enforced, and one ignored. That IMHO wasn't as necessary and one that is a blatant disregard of the code, yet passed. All, IMHO, sticking it to my customer just to F him over in taxes and fees. 

Government is necessary for public/infrastructure purposes, but with only limited power over individual rights. Our current Government is a nanny State hell bent on screwing over people who work for a living and reward those sucking off it's teet. The more money they can charge, even if wrong ethically, the more the corruption continues.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

rjbphd said:


> What was the drawing showings?? Can u post it?.. like steam heating system... there's only one way of doing it..


That's is the proper way to pipe it... fire the inspector..


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

I agree it is sort of a revent. I hate to say, but it does work.
* until the AAV fails * which we all know it will.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OpenSights said:


> I get the drawing.... But it's kinda sort of re-vented into the drain line? Does this work in reality?


Absoulty, yes.. it will works.. which is why you must have that pipe dia. distance.. almost just like the old timer's loop venting that's works for many years.. banned it coz they don't understand the basic principle..


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

This inspector has over 500 complaints on him from homeowners and plumbing contractors. But he's a part timer and life goes on.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

plumber11928 said:


> This inspector has over 500 complaints on him from homeowners and plumbing contractors. But he's a part timer and life goes on.


Located where??


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

Teaneck NJ


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

plumber11928 said:


> This inspector has over 500 complaints on him from homeowners and plumbing contractors. But he's a part timer and life goes on.


Is he a licensed as well CPI as now required in 'Country' of Illinois??


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

rjbphd said:


> Absoulty, yes.. it will works.. which is why you must have that pipe dia. distance.. almost just like the old timer's loop venting that's works for many years.. banned it coz they don't understand the basic principle..


I wasn't introduced to "re-venting" until about four years ago. Yeah the old timers were smart! I'm sure tough as nails too! Anytime I get to talk to an oldschool plumber he has my full attention.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OpenSights said:


> I wasn't introduced to "re-venting" until about four years ago. Yeah the old timers were smart! I'm sure tough as nails too! Anytime I get to talk to an oldschool plumber he has my full attention.


I concur,.. my late father and his old books.. have to admit that I don't agree with them all... had a job at non profit club.. city caught us doing the rehab of 2nd story.. plumbing old timer inspector was impressed with my apprentice work.. asked me about the remote bar sink drain and vent... told him planning on using mech vent.. nope..he said... he looked up and see the problems I'm gonna have with regular venting.. then said.. I want a loop venting installed.. told him..thought loop venting is not allowed.. he said, " loop venting is better than no vent and draw me a layout if you know what I'm talking about.".. so I did a drawing on top of the bar.. perfect he said... passed.. got it from one of the first state code book on my Dad's desk...that was back in 85'..


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## plumber11928 (Feb 18, 2015)

rjbphd, I would have to look into that.


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## plumbdrum (Nov 30, 2013)

Loop/bow vent is all we allow here. I'll say it again, leave the AAV's for the hacks


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

jeffreyplumber said:


> very interesting I googled upc 301.2 and read a few things companys like soix chief claim aav are upc aprooved. Seems 301.2 just confuses things. just about any 2 things that are similar could easily be argued to not be equivilant. I too cant see an aav as equivalant perhaps close but not equal.. perhaps even good enough but the code dosent say almost as good as or similar I like codes to be a bit more concrete


"UPC Approved" only means is was approved per it's listing by the IAPMO lab. That means it is legal when the code allows, but that code is probably the IPC. For instance, a PVC 90 may be "UPC Approved", that doesn't mean it is interchangeable with a cast iron 1/4 bend.

Mark


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

Hey...... it is not the Country of Illinois. It is the Country of Chicago.

For sure AAV are for those who either are not plumbers who know how to correctly install a DWV system or your average hack.......


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

Codes don't make sense if I get busted for ignoring them. Otherwise, they're totally ignored.


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## Ghostmaker (Jan 12, 2013)

plumber11928 said:


> I agree it is sort of a revent. I hate to say, but it does work.
> * until the AAV fails * which we all know it will.



Obviously the inspector never read the AAV engineering documents. :whistling2:

We have a sealed bucket when it fills it produces positive pressure.
What does an AAV do when we have positive pressure?


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## jeffreyplumber (Dec 7, 2009)

ToUtahNow said:


> "UPC Approved" only means is was approved per it's listing by the IAPMO lab. That means it is legal when the code allows, but that code is probably the IPC. For instance, a PVC 90 may be "UPC Approved", that doesn't mean it is interchangeable with a cast iron 1/4 bend.
> 
> Mark


 I see there is still interest in this topic its been monthes! Well Mark Im not an advocate of aav but. I dont quite get what your talking about this aav has been approved but there is no code to support its use? Like a pvc 90 or a cast iron 1/4 bend they are approved and have uses. but an aav has no use. I personaly have never used an aav,but my folks house in fl has one under the kitchen sink illegal there too? Ive run bbq sinks outside islands and had to island vent and run a stack up out away in the landscape I suppose I should be glad to have the extra work. I mean more regulation does mean more money for us I suppose. It wouldnt bother me if pvc, pex , abs, cpvc and shark bites were to be outlawed. I could tell you I would concider using an aav outside bbq sink at my house rather than have a stack out side and dont think it would nessesarily be a hack job. 
Aside from opinion of weather I or any of you like or dont like products or
practice. Does any one actualy know how or when an aav is legal to use in UPC country since it is supposedly approved for something?


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I used an AAV today to bring a rental up to code. Inspectors out here love them, so do customers.

New construction and a total gut job, I would say revent and no AAV's. That said, when you have a section 8 rental or an existing home, most people don't want all the extra cost of ripping up their walls and or ceiling just to vent.

The worst situation I've seen from using an AAV was a pricey bar/restaurant in college town. About every 3-4 months they would get a really bad sewer smell. I'd go in replace all six AAV's and charge them. My suspicion was their sewer gasses gumming them up. Twice a year I had to jet their main and every two months clean their grease trap. Either one I'd have to get there at 5:30am so they could clear the stench out in time for lunch. Even I thought the smell was bad!


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

jeffreyplumber said:


> I see there is still interest in this topic its been monthes! Well Mark Im not an advocate of aav but. I dont quite get what your talking about this aav has been approved but there is no code to support its use? Like a pvc 90 or a cast iron 1/4 bend they are approved and have uses. but an aav has no use. I personaly have never used an aav,but my folks house in fl has one under the kitchen sink illegal there too? Ive run bbq sinks outside islands and had to island vent and run a stack up out away in the landscape I suppose I should be glad to have the extra work. I mean more regulation does mean more money for us I suppose. It wouldnt bother me if pvc, pex , abs, cpvc and shark bites were to be outlawed. I could tell you I would concider using an aav outside bbq sink at my house rather than have a stack out side and dont think it would nessesarily be a hack job.
> Aside from opinion of weather I or any of you like or dont like products or
> practice. Does any one actualy know how or when an aav is legal to use in UPC country since it is supposedly approved for something?


They are UPC approved meaning they were tested in the IAPMO LAB which is the organization that writes the Uniform Plumbing Code. However, the Uniform Plumbing Code does not allow their use. The International Plumbing Code requires plumbing items to be tested by and approved by an accredited lab. Because the IAPMO Lab tests 99% of all plumbing items regardless of which code is used, the AAV are tested by them. The IPC allows the installation of AAVs.

Mark


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

AAV are awesome, use them all the time in new construction kitchen sinks and island sinks. Have only had to replace 1 in past 7 years. I'd say it's a good product when it makes since to use it


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## pipe-it-up (Feb 7, 2015)

you all have to remember that plumbing code as well as all building codes are derived from the the dept of insurance. todays architecture does not allow for conventional venting everytime. In NC we use AAV all the time.


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

pipe-it-up said:


> you all have to remember that plumbing code as well as all building codes are derived from the the dept of insurance. todays architecture does not allow for conventional venting everytime. In NC we use AAV all the time.


I do most of my work in a state that doesn't allow fake vents. I have never had a situation where a real vent wasn't an option. An AAV is a cheap way out. As I've said before, an AAV only does half the job of a vent. They work when the system is under negative pressure, but do nothing for positive pressure. They are mechanical and will fail.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

pipe-it-up said:


> you all have to remember that plumbing code as well as all building codes are derived from the the dept of insurance. todays architecture does not allow for conventional venting everytime. In NC we use AAV all the time.


Not true.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

Insurance companies as well as product manufactures are at the table, but they don't drive the boat.


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

How about when thermal expansion tanks are required on an open loop system.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

plumberkc said:


> How about when thermal expansion tanks are required on an open loop system.


I just went through this with RJ-apparently some meters are sensitive to back pressure. I miss the good old days-when you could turn the meter around and fill your swimming pool. J\K


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

KoleckeINC said:


> I just went through this with RJ-apparently some meters are sensitive to back pressure. I miss the good old days-when you could turn the meter around and fill your swimming pool. J\K


 Some meters have check valves, those are easy to spot and are rarely installed. Kansas City, KS was one of the only city's around the entire KC area that had them. They switched to a standard meter about 8 months ago because they had too many complaints of high water pressure.


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

This meter has a check valve, BW tank lasted 9 years.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

plumberkc said:


> Some meters have check valves, those are easy to spot and are rarely installed. Kansas City, KS was one of the only city's around the entire KC area that had them. They switched to a standard meter about 8 months ago because they had too many complaints of high water pressure.


The check valve at the meter is generally a dual check built into the meter yoke, not the meter. I am the president of a water company in Utah and the State requires dual checks at the meter yokes. Where I live in Southern California we do not have dual checks at the meter yokes. 

Mark


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## Workhorseplmg (Apr 10, 2013)

I've never had to use an AAV in a new construction situation. While architecture changes I don't see a situation where an AAV was the only option.


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## plumbdrum (Nov 30, 2013)

There is never a need for an AAV. We are plumbers, perform plumbing


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## heaan (Oct 23, 2012)

I personally like AAV valves


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## Plumbdog (Jan 27, 2009)

the way I figure it is its my job to know and follow the code. Its really not my place to pick and choose which part of of the code that I will or won't follow just because it may make my life easier or being able to complete the job quicker. I know that I could get plenty of things past the inspectors around here . But as soon as I go that route I may as well not have my license that I worked so hard to earn.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Ok, we all know how everyone feels about AAV's now... :yes::laughing:

How 'bout trap primers? I hate them. Leaky pieces of garbage IMHO. Michigan has recently (in the last two or three years) has approved a new insert that does the opposite of a backflow ball, lets water in, but doesn't allow it to evaporate. I've replaced hundreds of trap primers, but have only installed a few of these. IDR the manufacture or what they call them, but they seem to be a good economical replacement.

Thoughts?


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

To add; I understand the reason for a trap primer, and agree with the reason as to why they are needed... This post is just a preemptive strike against backlash.:whistling2:


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

They're called trap guards. I've only put in a few of them because architects and engineers usually spec trap primers. We're only allowed to use a certain percentage of them compared to trap primers on any given job. The problem is they don't really prevent the trap from evaporation, can still evaporate into the vent. They are rubber and rubber will degrade over time so it's going to end up being an issue anyway. They'll probably last longer than a trap primer anyway so I don't really have an issue with them but I don't see them as being perfect.


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## rwh (Dec 17, 2014)

Trap gaurds are ok I guess. The ones I have seen definitely slow water entering the drain. Bct is right, still can evaporate through vent side. Trap primers are a pita. What about veggie or other oil in seldom used drains? My code allows it


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## pipe-it-up (Feb 7, 2015)

some codes in different states do not allow use of loop vents of others so AAV is absolutely needed in some cases. I do very high end very large custom homes. running 150ft of vent pipe for one sink in basement sometimes is impossible, or is so much work that it is not worth it.


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## pipe-it-up (Feb 7, 2015)

and the dept of insurance does "make" the codes, sure there is a little tweaking here and there by others, but do you really think that the dollar doesnt drive building codes too? if you disagree you are misinformed or an idiot.


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

@Pipe-it-up 15 posted and no intro....would be nice if you do it or we need to tell you the same thing in every post.


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

pipe-it-up said:


> and the dept of insurance does "make" the codes, sure there is a little tweaking here and there by others, but do you really think that the dollar doesnt drive building codes too? if you disagree you are misinformed or an idiot.


Massachusetts plumbing board is made up of 9 people, only one has anything to do with insurance. If I remember correctly the others are a plumber, a plumbing engineer, a consumer, a lawyer, board of health, a building engineer, and I'm drawing a blank on the other two. I'm not saying that insurance companies don't heavily influence the code but to say they are pulling all the strings is idiotic in its own right.


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## jeffreyplumber (Dec 7, 2009)

I dont think insurance companies write building code . but there are many numerous interested parties including builders , labor union . Wood companys, plastics, of course , the CDA (copper developement ass.} cast iron companys. 
The Idea that Insurance companys write codes I just dont think so.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

To veer slightly.... In a city near me that I work in there is a new city plumbing inspector... Lets call him Bob. I finally got to meet him a couple of weeks ago in person, however his reputation proceeds him. He use to work for the Master I help out when needed, and along side my last boss. I guess he is one heck of a drain cleaner, if he couldn't open a line that meant it needed to be replaced, however every plumbing repair job he did would turn into a back call quickly. He lost his job by stealing from the company. Not sure if the city knows all of his back story.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

pipe-it-up said:


> and the dept of insurance does "make" the codes, sure there is a little tweaking here and there by others, but do you really think that the dollar doesnt drive building codes too? if you disagree you are misinformed or an idiot.


Nope, you are misinformed. The first Uniform Plumbing Code was written in 1926 by a bunch of LA City Plumbing inspectors. The core of the original UPC remains unchanged even today. Today it is written through an open consensus process.

http://www.iapmo.org/Pages/CodeDevelopmentProcess.aspx

Mark


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

Well systems date back to 4,000 BC. I thought the first Plbg. Code was the "Hoover" Code. http://www.iveyengineering.com/blog/historical-events-plumbing-systems/


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

GAN said:


> Well systems date back to 4,000 BC. I thought the first Plbg. Code was the "Hoover" Code. http://www.iveyengineering.com/blog/historical-events-plumbing-systems/



That is interesting that you have a link to Bill Ivey's web site. I have sat across the table from Bill on various cases many times over the last 25-years. Bill is a nice guy but we rarely agree on much.

Mark


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

From 

Building Codes and Housing
David Listokin
Rutgers University
David Hattis
Building Technology Inc.
April 2004

_Plumbingcodes developed early at the local level. The earliest on record is that of Washington, DC, in effect in l870. Since its organization in l883, the National Association of Master Plumbers had been concerned with plumbing codes. Nevertheless, extreme diversity reflecting local practices and conditions typified the early plumbing codes. _


_The National Association of Master Plumbers itself did not publish a model plumbing code until l933. The National Association of Plumbing-Heating-Cooling Contractors, successor to the National Association of Master Plumbers, has been publishing the National Standard Plumbing Code, which is used in many jurisdictions, since the l970s.

_Here's an article from 2012 by Ron George that sums it up nicely._
http://www.asse-plumbing.org/plbg_stds/PSM-winter2012-online.pdf

See page 318 of the following:
https://books.google.com/books?id=h...#v=onepage&q=The Hoover Plumbing Code&f=false

_


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