# 3" drain undersized



## plumsolver (Apr 7, 2011)

I may have made a big mistake just recently without going into a basement I quoted a job for a new bathroom to be added to an existing building. Got the job and started today finally I was allowed to able to access the basement and find they already have 3 w/cs on the three inch drain and to add insult to injury the drain line going out of the building isn't any larger. This washroom and two double sinks I am supposed to rough in tomorrow are for a soup and sandwich shop so the owner has the plumbing permit, how do I explain this to the inspector ?
and what can be done besides upgrading sewer to the street? Oh yeah I should mention that I'm from Ontario so the national code will apply.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

plumsolver said:


> I may have made a big mistake just recently without going into a basement I quoted a job for a new bathroom to be added to an existing building. Got the job and started today finally I was allowed to able to access the basement and find they already have 3 w/cs on the three inch drain and to add insult to injury the drain line going out of the building isn't any larger. This washroom and two double sinks I am supposed to rough in tomorrow are for a soup and sandwich shop so the owner has the plumbing permit, how do I explain this to the inspector ?
> and what can be done besides upgrading sewer to the street? Oh yeah I should mention that I'm from Ontario so the national code will apply.


That is weird ... Because I am in Ontario also and the main building drain has to be 4"

2 wc on a 3" horizontal ..... 4" after that

So how did they get away with a 3" main to begin with????


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

plumsolver said:


> I may have made a big mistake just recently without going into a basement I quoted a job for a new bathroom to be added to an existing building. Got the job and started today finally I was allowed to able to access the basement and find they already have 3 w/cs on the three inch drain and to add insult to injury the drain line going out of the building isn't any larger. This washroom and two double sinks I am supposed to rough in tomorrow are for a soup and sandwich shop so the owner has the plumbing permit, how do I explain this to the inspector ?
> and what can be done besides upgrading sewer to the street? Oh yeah I should mention that I'm from Ontario so the national code will apply.


 
You're just going to have to break the bad news to them....no other way.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

No big deal 

I had one today at a mall where the wanted to add another washroom.... I look over the system and some thing didn't seem right

Lifted the ceiling tile and the venting on existing washroom was on an AAV

I know this mall well and it's been there for at least 40 years and the existing was room had PVC fire rated pipe... Which 40 years ago that pipe was notary yet...

So I looked around some more and there was no vent stack at all

There was however a rain water leader from the roof drain 

So i am pretty sure that washroom is tied to the storm drain

Started talking to the tenant of the space and they tell me last year the had a flood and the water was coming out of the rain water leader and the toilet at the same time

When the cleaned the storm line .. It also cleared the the toilet 

Might be busting out a lot of concrete for this one


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## plumsolver (Apr 7, 2011)

Couldn't,t quite get to the outlet so I'm hoping It is a 4 inch main but I forgot the best part was the one w/c drain had came free from its supports and went down and back up about 3 ft before tying into the main line. Foot meet a! Never going to 'look' at job without being able to see everything again. Never ever never ever ever...


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## billy_awesome (Dec 19, 2011)

Never seen anything smaller than 4" for building drains in Ontario.....but then again I'm a bit green.

If you worried about materials and buying in 4 inch, always remember, you can run two wc's on a 3" horizonal drain, and a third wc on it's own 3" line. Tie them together vertically to your building drain that should be 4"


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

sounds like cost plus, you can't see behind walls can you?


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## MarkToo (Dec 17, 2011)

While anything is possible, it's unlikely that the sewer is 3" - it would never have passed inspection inside or out.

You might want to take a second fresh look and see where you can effectively tie in.


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## plumsolver (Apr 7, 2011)

Yep lucked out big time the main was 4 inch someone had put a 4x3 bushing in the end of it luckily the same silly goose wasn't to heavy with the glue cause as I was trying to decide how to change over we noticed some movement and with enough wiggles to my astonishment popped right out. Now I've seen everything but first time I felt good about job since we gained access to basement and made the discovery of my almost blunder. Wahoo giver


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## MarkToo (Dec 17, 2011)

plumsolver said:


> Yep lucked out big time the main was 4 inch someone had put a 4x3 bushing in the end of it luckily the same silly goose wasn't to heavy with the glue cause as I was trying to decide how to change over we noticed some movement and with enough wiggles to my astonishment popped right out. Now I've seen everything but first time I felt good about job since we gained access to basement and made the discovery of my almost blunder. Wahoo giver



Glad to hear it's sorted out.

There's never a reno where you can "see" everything. That's why there's extras outside the scope of work. You can only make best efforts based on what should be. Outside of that, the rest is an opportunity to earn more money and get things working the way they should.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Imagine that, with the luxury of having a basement, and not looking at it......:bangin: ........here in FL it's mostly slab-on-grade construction. So everything is under the slab where it isn't visible until you do the demo.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Tommy plumber said:


> Imagine that, with the luxury of having a basement, and not looking at it......:bangin: ........here in FL it's mostly slab-on-grade construction. So everything is under the slab where it isn't visible until you do the demo.


A house I'm doing in Ocala has a basement. 100 miles from the gulf and they dig 15 feet down to pour the slab and hit ground water. In the big hills of Ocala no less.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

house plumber said:


> A house I'm doing in Ocala has a basement. 100 miles from the gulf and they dig 15 feet down to pour the slab and hit ground water. In the big hills of Ocala no less.


 






Is it a big custom home? On one of the horse farms?


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Tommy plumber said:


> Is it a big custom home? On one of the horse farms?


yeah. 15,200 sq ft. on 4500 acres. Go to the post your trashed truck thread and the prints are in the back


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

house plumber said:


> yeah. 15,200 sq ft. on 4500 acres. Go to the post your trashed truck thread and the prints are in the back


 






Wow. Nice job. Travel time is a little long though for you. Just today I was leaving Ocala going down I-75 to Tampa. I passed a sign for New Port Richey. It said 30 miles from the Interstate.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Tommy plumber said:


> Wow. Nice job. Travel time is a little long though for you. Just today I was leaving Ocala going down I-75 to Tampa. I passed a sign for New Port Richey. It said 30 miles from the Interstate.


We stay up there. The boss has a lake house in Hawthorne. It's like a 40 minute drive so it isn't that bad plus we're not sleeping in a nasty hotel. That was probably state road 52. Get to s.r.54 or 56 it's closer. The house in Ocala is right on s.r. 40. Talk about weird, we went to the mcdonalds for lunch and an ex coworker was there working.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

house plumber said:


> We stay up there. The boss has a lake house in Hawthorne. It's like a 40 minute drive so it isn't that bad plus we're not sleeping in a nasty hotel. That was probably state road 52. Get to s.r.54 or 56 it's closer. The house in Ocala is right on s.r. 40. Talk about weird, we went to the mcdonalds for lunch and an ex coworker was there working.


 





I'm very familiar with SR 40. It runs right through the Ocala National Forest and heads to Ormond Beach. When I first moved to FL in '93, I lived in Ocala. Now I'm back there again. Got the heck out of S. FL. I had business in Tampa, that's what brought me down there today.


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## pilot light (Apr 21, 2012)

In reponse too old school. Wow nice work !:yes:


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## jeffreyplumber (Dec 7, 2009)

Well in UPC code 4 water closets is well within the fixture unit loading, though it is specificaly stated that a max of 3 is allowed. I dont think adding another W/c is a problem in most cases. I think we have a clause in the code allowing a minor deviation on existing work with inspector approval. 
Why not ask the Inspector? Otherwise its gonna cost!


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