# Root x



## fixitright

Does Root X work?

Does it make sense to have it on my truck?

Can I buy copper sulfate in bulk? If so what can I use for a foaming
detergent?


----------



## gear junkie

We're plumbers, not chemists. 

Yes RootX is worth having on the truck


----------



## KoleckeINC

For 13$ a product called root reach can be mixed with anything to make a foaming root killer. Your not supposed to flush caustic chemicals like sodium hydroxide-metam sodium or high concentrated weed killer containing the same active ingredient in RootX known as dichlobenil. Be careful-some weed killers are systemic-which means it kills all the way up the root vein.


----------



## plungerboy

We have it in our truck and offer it to our customers as needed. I feel it's a money maker.

I really like the database and customer contact rootx has.


----------



## Redwood

Check the laws of your state regarding application of root killers.

Here in CT. Copper Sulfate is not allowed while Root-X is, and in RI. The opposite is true....

Also in CT. you may sell Root-X to a customer, but if you apply it you must have a pesticide applicators license....


----------



## cable or root

If you're willing to sell a piece of your soul you can make a lot of money with rootx. Honestly I find that it does not work. Don't do yearly treatments of the chemical only with the promise of no more root blockages in the line or you will find yourself cabling lots of lines for free.


----------



## Redwood

cable or root said:


> If you're willing to sell a piece of your soul you can make a lot of money with rootx. Honestly I find that it does not work. Don't do yearly treatments of the chemical only with the promise of no more root blockages in the line or you will find yourself cabling lots of lines for free.


Are you applying it correctly? Dosage per length of pipe and allowing it to remain in the pipe long enough?

Because I have seen it work quite well....


----------



## cable or root

2lbs for 100' of 4", and we tell ho's not to use water for atleast 4 hours later. We usually apply renewals just before they go to work or bed to eliminate the water usage (I usually do it between 10:00-11:30 pm. Applications are yearly to keep the warranty. We clean lots of lines under rootx warranty and yes we do charge if roots are not what causes the blockage. It's just peace of mind in a bottle. I dunno maybe Midwest trees are just different than east and west coast trees.


----------



## fixitright

Not sure what Cable and Root means by " Selling my Soul" but then
again not sure I want to. The damage to the environment is worrisome. 



Wonder how products like Root X would do with a belly in the line?


----------



## cable or root

I meant selling a product that does not work. I seem to be the odd man out here but I do 5-6 rootx warranty cleanings A WEEK. The $hit don't work. Its peace of mind in a can, but that's all it is. On the plus side though, once we do a rootx treatment we pretty much own every drain in that house, so it is one good thing. Also as an employee who still gets full commission on chemical recalls it doesn't hurt meat all and at the end of the day if the costumer still backs up every year due to roots it's cheaper for them to pay us $150 for a can of rootx(200 if it's 4lbs) than it is for them to pay $200+ for us to cable their line.


----------



## mtfallsmikey

Yea, heard that it worked, would have like to have had that stuff years ago when fighting root growth in Orangeburg pipe.


----------



## Redwood

cable or root said:


> *2lbs for 100' of 4".*


Well then... There lies the problem...

The correct dosage for 100' of 4" is 4lbs...

You are only giving 1/2 doses and the foam is only going partially down the line...

Here are the directions on the Root-X Website.


----------



## Redwood

fixitright said:


> Wonder how products like Root X would do with a belly in the line?


The foam will not pass the water in the belly if it is 100% submerged...


----------



## cable or root

Oh. Well I guess I take that back then. I did not realize we were not dosing properly. I suppose we do this to avoid messes in toilets. Maybe it's the plan to make them feel more dependent on the chemical. I'll shut up on the subject from now on until I do some more research on the subject. The boss is talking about switching over to something called obliteroot supposedly made by the same guy. Anyone know anything about it?


----------



## PPRI

A couple of us know Toby. He lives down the road from me.


----------



## Debo22

I turned my back on an apprentice for a second and he dumped it in the toilet without flushing, stuff foams and makes a mess real quick.


----------



## theplungerman

I've been using root X for the past 15 plus years and know it works, in fact it works so well I got myself licensed to apply Vaporooter. Which has 4 times the dicholbinal (the secret sauce of root x) with meta sodium. The reason for going to Vaporooter is for those bellies, and or root problems a long way down the line. I have a foamer machine that with its pump and compressor working in tandem it squirted the foam down the line as far as you need to go. I've been doing Vaporooter treatments for over a year. Probably at least 50 so far and haven't had to re snake a line yet in the 1 year guarantee time frame. I also have seen with my eyes what it does to roots. It kills them. Use root X right and if flow permits a proper application it will work as advertised every time.


----------



## Tommy plumber

theplungerman said:


> I've been using root X for the past 15 plus years and know it works, in fact it works so well I got myself licensed to apply Vaporooter. Which has 4 times the dicholbinal (the secret sauce of root x) with meta sodium. The reason for going to Vaporooter is for those bellies, and or root problems a long way down the line. I have a foamer machine that with its pump and compressor working in tandem it squirted the foam down the line as far as you need to go. I've been doing Vaporooter treatments for over a year. Probably at least 50 so far and haven't had to re snake a line yet in the 1 year guarantee time frame. I also have seen with my eyes what it does to roots. It kills them. Use root X right and if flow permits a proper application it will work as advertised every time.












Good to know...thanks for introducing Vaporooter.


----------



## dhal22

I prefer my customers to be out of the house over the weekend but a minimum overnight. It works pretty good.


----------



## plungerboy

Can you post some videos or pictures. 

Can vapor fix this picture. Haha


----------



## cable or root

plungerboy said:


> Can you post some videos or pictures.
> 
> Can vapor fix this picture. Haha
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 68706


That's pretty impressive, did that house sit vacant for a few years? That would be an interesting cable fight.


----------



## gear junkie

plungerboy said:


> Can you post some videos or pictures.
> 
> Can vapor fix this picture. Haha
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 68706


No but my jetter could with no problem.


----------



## Drain Pro

That's an appetizer for my jetter. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## plungerboy

cable or root said:


> That's pretty impressive, did that house sit vacant for a few years? That would be an interesting cable fight.


Not really these people go south for the winter so it does sit empty for a few months. 

Your a better man than I if you choose to fight that with a cable.


----------



## dhal22

plungerboy said:


> Can you post some videos or pictures.
> 
> Can vapor fix this picture. Haha
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 68706


RootX is used after you clear the drain. It is root prevention not removal.


----------



## theplungerman

dhal22 said:


> I prefer my customers to be out of the house over the weekend but a minimum overnight. It works pretty good.


nah,, roots almost ALWAYS only grow where this no flow. So I tell em go for it immediately. Just wait a few hours to do a load of laundry.


----------



## theplungerman

Tommy plumber said:


> Good to know...thanks for introducing Vaporooter.


my pleasure,, check this out,,


----------



## fixitright

Cool video, neat product, not sure we can use it in Minnesota yet.

At 58 seconds / 53' there is an opening. What will the foam do there?
Hope it makes you lots of $$$$$$$$$$


----------



## theplungerman

fixitright said:


> Cool video, neat product, not sure we can use it in Minnesota yet.
> 
> At 58 seconds / 53' there is an opening. What will the foam do there?
> Hope it makes you lots of $$$$$$$$$$


good catch, that was a hole in middle of yard. foam goes where it can.


----------



## Roto-Rooter

plungerboy said:


> Can you post some videos or pictures.
> 
> Can vapor fix this picture. Haha
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 68706


Looks like an everyday stoppage here in NE Missouri. That would be nothing for a cable to take care of.


----------



## plungerboy

Roto-Rooter said:


> Looks like an everyday stoppage here in NE Missouri. That would be nothing for a cable to take care of.


Seriously? You guys would fight that with a cable! 

Honestly How long would it take you 4+ hours? 

Why wouldn't you dig it up?


----------



## gear junkie

plungerboy said:


> Seriously? You guys would fight that with a cable!
> 
> Honestly How long would it take you 4+ hours?
> 
> Why wouldn't you dig it up?


Because I can cut through that with a jetter in 10 minutes. You got all that jetter....why not use it?


----------



## cable or root

Just how I was taught. Honestly I never heard of anyone using a jetter for roots before the online world. Proper blade selection and skill will get it done. Start with half a 3" pear and work at it. Long cable jobs can be frustrating but good for the soul. I suppose a jetter might be nice in some root battles but no residence is going to be willing to pay $800+ for me to jet their line. Can you guys tell what the nozzle is doing? I rarely jet(mainly just between manholes) sems like going through a broken spot could be disastrous. Maybe if I did it more I would decide I like it but for what I do on a daily basis it is in necessary.


----------



## Cuda

I used to jet everything that came my way! Nowdays I really prefer history with the line from past visits or I run the snake through to get some flow and a quick camera to see if I want to even put my jetter in there. But depending on how old the sewer is I still will jet some with out using the cable. That shot of those roots would be me and the e.e.l. punching the hole first.


----------



## Roto-Rooter

cable or root said:


> Just how I was taught. Honestly I never heard of anyone using a jetter for roots before the online world. Proper blade selection and skill will get it done. Start with half a 3" pear and work at it. Long cable jobs can be frustrating but good for the soul. I suppose a jetter might be nice in some root battles but no residence is going to be willing to pay $800+ for me to jet their line. Can you guys tell what the nozzle is doing? I rarely jet(mainly just between manholes) sems like going through a broken spot could be disastrous. Maybe if I did it more I would decide I like it but for what I do on a daily basis it is in necessary.


Cable you were taught the same as me. The picture I saw it would not take long with a cable, the only different is I would have gone in with full 4" cutters the first time. I have a jetter also but don't use it much on roots. Besides most of the time in a home it doesn't work well for me. I do use the jetter on thick sludged up lines and that does work great. It is better than in-out-in-out-in-out to get it thin enough to move.


----------



## plungerboy

gear junkie said:


> Because I can cut through that with a jetter in 10 minutes. You got all that jetter....why not use it?


We did attempt with the Jetter but it was an upstream 3" clean out (co) and all the water was showing up in the crawl space. We tried to punch thru with the small WH but it was too much water for my liking. If the customer had a down hill CO I would have jetted it for sure. 

Keep in mind the broken pipe around the root mass was smashed with the machine and it didn't deform. It was really cool to see.


----------



## bulldozer

I would have ran the picote and chewed right through it! Most likely in a back and forth pass.


----------



## Cuda

I used the Picote the other day to deroot a line we where installing a cleanout on, It was more work than the jetter would have been but I had the picote in the van and would have had to make a trip back and forth to our lot to get the jetter so the picote got the nod


----------



## bulldozer

Were you using the maxi miller or drill set up?


----------



## plungerboy

Can you please post a picture of the head you use on the picote


----------



## fixitright

I put Root-X in the truck today. 
Still need to read the fine print and warranty along with customer sign up.

Some like it, some not ... time will tell


----------



## theplungerman

Root x works, it has diclobinal (spelling?) that is why vaporooter works. Iv'e seen it with my eyes time and time again over the years. Root X works so well i invested several thousand dollars and got licensed to treat sewers with Vaporooter. People who say it doesn't keep roots away do not know what they are talking about.


----------



## Drain Pro

You can count me as one who doesn't know what he's talking about because I think RootX is BS. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## fixitright

I have a test for Root x. 
This may solve some doubts so tell me if it is worth the effort.

I have a line that needs regular cleaning and is due.
If instead of cleaning I camera and treat with Root X and re camera in, say two months?
More? Less?

Now I realize the best treatment is just after cleaning as the root ends are exposed
BUT..........

Feed back?


----------



## KoleckeINC

The active ingredient in Root/X Dichlobenil will kill roots. The problem is-accurate delivery vs cost.
If the pipe is 6" and 75' to the roots-heck 12 lbs is 150$. 
Now if you gave a isht. You could use a product called Root Reach with a "systemic root killer" what that means is that it will kill "up the root". Something in the weed killer family will do. The product Metam Sulfate aka Metam Sodium has been banned from the root killer market but that's the stuff that used to be in good root killer. It's also the key ingredient in oven cleaner.


----------



## cable or root

Drain Pro said:


> You can count me as one who doesn't know what he's talking about because I think RootX is BS.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm with ya all the way drain pro the $hit dosn't work. Just peace of mind in a bottle. From a business stand point you can make lots of money selling it, but selling products that dosn't work isn't ethical unless you sell it with a warranty you're willing to stand by. For me though, I'm here to cut roots, not sell some bull $hit can of chemical to upsell for a quick buck.


----------



## fixitright

How do you know it doesn't work?

Was it applied properly?
Camera verification months down the line?

Easy to say things don't work so show me one way or another.

There's just too many lines around here that you can't clean properly because
of poor access. If it works ..........

I'll be the first to say Root X doesn't work if shown proof.

( our Minnesota Twins Home opener is Monday. Snowing today. I told them we need a roof)


----------



## cable or root

No camera but I do rootx recalls on a very regular basis. One home im particular was upped to 6 lbs yearly treatment, two years before we swithced to obliteroot. We still have to clean her sewer every 6 months. And she does have a 4" cleanout in the basement and her line is 80' 4". She paid 250 a year for the last two treatments but had her sewer line cleaned 4 times in that period. The last two cleanings were done by me so I know the line was cleaned the right way. Now she pays 150 a year for one can of obliteroot. I'm telling you man, it simply does not work. All yearly treatments are done before the HO goes to work, or at 10:30-11:30 pm (last call of the night) and we explain that the costumer needs to go atleast 4 hours before running water.


I will say I don't know if obliteroot works better or not, we haven't used it long enough. It probably yeilds the same results. It is easier to flush down a toilet. I probably never will learn. Roto rooter dosn't offer it here.


----------



## Drain Pro

fixitright said:


> How do you know it doesn't work?
> 
> Was it applied properly?
> Camera verification months down the line?
> 
> Easy to say things don't work so show me one way or another.
> 
> There's just too many lines around here that you can't clean properly because
> of poor access. If it works ..........
> 
> I'll be the first to say Root X doesn't work if shown proof.
> 
> ( our Minnesota Twins Home opener is Monday. Snowing today. I told them we need a roof)




It didn't work in my testing (in laws house). Did I apply it correctly? Well I followed the suggested dose. When I scoped the line a year later there was no discernible difference to prior years when Root X was not used.


----------



## theplungerman

Like I said, if someone says it dosn't work, THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. 
Or they are not applying it correctly or it isn't getting to the roots. That is why I went with Vaporooter. It foams the whole line due to the hose I pump up and block line so the foam pushes all the way. 
I've done about 50 foam jobs. No call backs. 
I've treated more than one line and came back later to see dead roots. 
I'll say it one more time if someone says it doesn't work they don't know what they're talking about and embarrassing themselves at the same time as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## Drain Pro

theplungerman said:


> Like I said, if someone says it dosn't work, THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT.
> Or they are not applying it correctly or it isn't getting to the roots. That is why I went with Vaporooter. It foams the whole line due to the hose I pump up and block line so the foam pushes all the way.
> I've done about 50 foam jobs. No call backs.
> I've treated more than one line and came back later to see dead roots.
> I'll say it one more time if someone says it doesn't work they don't know what they're talking about and embarrassing themselves at the same time as far as I'm concerned.




Did it ever occur to you that you might be wrong? Don't come on here accusing people of not knowing what there talking about just because you need to justify spending thousands on vapor rooter. You pull the same crap with your Mongoose. Your opinion is only that, an opinion. It certainly doesn't make you right.


----------



## gear junkie

I have an opinion too. Does that count?!


----------



## Drain Pro

gear junkie said:


> I have an opinion too. Does that count?!




Yours definitely doesn't count.


----------



## PPRI

Come on guys. My wife doesn't let me have an opinion at home. Can't I have one here?


----------



## Drain Pro

PPRI said:


> Come on guys. My wife doesn't let me have an opinion at home. Can't I have one here?




Ok. You get a pass.


----------



## bulldozer

PPRI said:


> Come on guys. My wife doesn't let me have an opinion at home. Can't I have one here?


Nooooope! Shut up and do the dishes or your cut off!


----------



## PPRI

Bahaha I don't think doing the dishes will help. She cut me off a long time ago. You've met her, she's the admiral around here.


----------



## fixitright

*My Test*

If Root X works it will fill a void in my business so I started a test today.

75' line, mostly 4" turns to 6" at boulevard. Know the line well (Dad's).
Ran a 4" cutter (3.5" actual size) through city tap.

Put in two 2 pound jars of Root X and let sit for over six hours. 
(still sitting there as I write this)

I'll camera the line in two months to see the existing root conditions.
Success will be no or withered roots in lines I can not get to normally.

I'm not trying to convince anyone but myself if this will help my business.

I'm willing to share the results. Just not the drama.


----------



## Drain Pro

fixitright said:


> If Root X works it will fill a void in my business so I started a test today.
> 
> 
> 
> 75' line, mostly 4" turns to 6" at boulevard. Know the line well (Dad's).
> 
> Ran a 4" cutter (3.5" actual size) through city tap.
> 
> 
> 
> Put in two 2 pound jars of Root X and let sit for over six hours.
> 
> (still sitting there as I write this)
> 
> 
> 
> I'll camera the line in two months to see the existing root conditions.
> 
> Success will be no or withered roots in lines I can not get to normally.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not trying to convince anyone but myself if this will help my business.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm willing to share the results. Just not the drama.




I appreciate your input. I'm not looking for drama, but I'm not going to let someone dress me and others down just because we have a difference of opinion. I find that guys around here are usually helpful and constructive in their suggestions, we don't just accuse others of not knowing what they're doing. 

I didn't let the RootX sit for 6 hours as the RootX people prescribed a different time frame (can't remember). I'm interested in your results.


----------



## wharfrat

Do any municipalities use it, or a similar product?


----------



## fixitright

Applying the Root X did get exciting today.
Poured two 2 pound containers in the clean out all at once.
I think I should have put one container in, then water, then the next container.

Closed the clean out and flushed the upstairs toilet and foam started coming
out the downstairs toilet and the shower drain.

Poured five gallons of water in the toilet, it went down some and then foamed
back up but not over the rim.

In a minute or two it went down and flushed again with no problems.

It was worth it as Pops Eyes got really big. 

He's 85 now and everyday I spend with him is ........


----------



## PPRI

wharfrat said:


> Do any municipalities use it, or a similar product?


Some use it. We apply some through the rootx fdu applicator. As of yet we don't have the vaporooter on our jetter because the competition does it at such a low price. I'm not gonna lie, I sell oblitiroot when we come across a line that is plagued by roots but they don't want to pay for a repair. 

It's not the silver bullet for roots in a sewer but it's an arrow in our quiver.


----------



## theplungerman

Drain Pro said:


> Did it ever occur to you that you might be wrong? Don't come on here accusing people of not knowing what there talking about just because you need to justify spending thousands on vapor rooter. You pull the same crap with your Mongoose. Your opinion is only that, an opinion. It certainly doesn't make you right.


I would never be as bold as I am concerning this topic if I didn't have over 15 years experience with it. Iv'e seen it works continually for over 15 years. With my own eyes. That means with 100 percent certainty, I know,,IT WORKS, PERIOD. 
So yes i can be wrong from time to time, but not on dichlobenil. It's been used for a long time BECAUSE it works. Crop growers are not going to continue spending gobs of money on a pesticide that doesn't work.
So when you say it doesn't work, i said you don't know what you are talking about. That's not necessarily a bad thing. When it comes to brain surgery I don't know what I'm talking about. IOW I'm ignorant when it come to brain surgery. But an (almost) expert with dichlobenil as it relates to roots in sewer. I got 98 percent right on my test on the subject treating roots in sewers. 
So when you said the 2nd time it doesen't work i felt embarresed for you.
I've been at this game for about 30 years. I saved a lot of butts out there with root x and vaporooter. 
You came on here saying something that works doesn't. Something I sell. Just sticking up for all the good people using and selling root x vaporooter.
I''ll never forget the first time i used rootX. This line had more roots than i had seen in a long time. I told the owner he needed to replace it or spend a wad cutting them out for the rest of his life. This is when i just got my 1st camera. So the slum lord landlord forced my hand,, I remembered being told about this product rootx from another honest plumber,,, that is what led me try this root killer. The roots were close and i was able to get a good dose of it down the sewer. When i came back in 3-4 weeks all the roots were dead, shriveled up. I flew through and cut em out.
There have been times when I haven't been able to get through certain root intrusions, so treated with root x and came back 3-4 weeks,,, then an easy pop through. Not once or twice or thrice but dozens of success stories,,,,,seen with my eyes, it works. Apply it correctly and you will see. Or maybe you just want to sell a new sewer. Smile.


----------



## theplungerman

wharfrat said:


> Do any municipalities use it, or a similar product?


Yes, they are the predominate buyers in the us. LA County uses it.
It's popular in the residential market in Australia. But not here,,,,,,, yet.


----------



## theplungerman

Drain Pro said:


> I appreciate your input. I'm not looking for drama, but I'm not going to let someone dress me and others down just because we have a difference of opinion. I find that guys around here are usually helpful and constructive in their suggestions, we don't just accuse others of not knowing what they're doing.
> 
> I didn't let the RootX sit for 6 hours as the RootX people prescribed a different time frame (can't remember). I'm interested in your results.


Oh come on, don"t be so sensitive. 
It wasn't a dress down, you called me a liar, twice,,,, what else you expect?


----------



## theplungerman

Drain Pro said:


> You can count me as one who doesn't know what he's talking about because I think RootX is BS.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You see,, them is fighting words, I should have been more gentle from the beginning. I got a big mouth.


----------



## gear junkie

I stopped using it because I found the laterals that were gonna last for a while were going to last the same amount of time with or without rootx. Just one less consumable to carry on the truck.

The foliage and weather present makes a big difference in it's effectiveness.


----------



## theplungerman

cable or root said:


> Drain Pro said:
> 
> 
> 
> You can count me as one who doesn't know what he's talking about because I think RootX is BS.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> 
> 
> 
> I'm with ya all the way drain pro the $hit dosn't work. Just peace of mind in a bottle. From a business stand point you can make lots of money selling it, but selling products that dosn't work isn't ethical unless you sell it with a warranty you're willing to stand by. For me though, I'm here to cut roots, not sell some bull $hit can of chemical to upsell for a quick buck.
Click to expand...

These are fighting words too, now it's all coming back to me. I got my panties in a bunch over this comment t as well. 
I'm this and that but not unethical, I don't sell BS. so when someone void of knowledge uses these words I'm going to come out throwing. 
It's kind of ironic,, you come off all above board,,,, I'm here to cut roots......... Well if all you do is keep cutting them will keep coming back stronger and thicker, and will eventually cause the joint-pipe to fail. If you could get some diclobinal on those bad boys you could save someone having to buy a new sewer down the line. So when push comes to shove you are doing less for your customer than I am. And if you want to split hairs, doing them (your customers) a disservice by not letting them know all their options. 
I'm here (also) for the lurkers, the home owners, etc who are researching.


----------



## cable or root

With the system we have at our company I can go back and look at sewer line history I took the time to condense the history of a particular sewer line I'm cleaning tomarrow, most likely for free. Here it is gentlemen a prime example of why I know rootx is complete and utter bull$hit.

Feb 2012 cleaned 50' sewer 2 lbs of rootx started program

December 2012 cleaned sewer roots at tap rootx recall

Feb 2013 rootx renewal 2lbs

Nov 2013 cleaned 50' sewer heavy roots at tap rootx recall

Feb 2014 rootx renewal 2 lbs

Oct 2014 cleaned 50' sewer root blockage. Rootx recall.

Feb, 3rd 2015 rootx renewal 2 lbs

Feb 20th 2015 cleaned 50' sewer rootx recall

Feb 2016 rootx renewal 2 lbs




Now I will say that costumer has had us clean his sink line 3 times in that period and we did a water heater changeout. So we have made money and he saves money on rootx but by no means is the chemical doing any good.


----------



## gear junkie

Another reason for me why I got out of the RootX program was it wasn't saving my customer that much money. Maybe if I charged 1000 for a jet, then a rootx treatment of 200 might make sense. But for what I charge, just let them see me ever couple of years or longer and I'll jet the line and they'll come out ahead on price. 

Plus RootX selling to H/O kinda did them in for me. That's one big advantage vapor rooter has over rootx.

Now one place I do think rootx should be tried is with orangeburg until the H/O replaces it. That stuff is so bad, any little bit helps.


----------



## cable or root

theplungerman said:


> These are fighting words too, now it's all coming back to me. I got my panties in a bunch over this comment t as well.
> I'm this and that but not unethical, I don't sell BS. so when someone void of knowledge uses these words I'm going to come out throwing.
> It's kind of ironic,, you come off all above board,,,, I'm here to cut roots......... Well if all you do is keep cutting them will keep coming back stronger and thicker, and will eventually cause the joint-pipe to fail. If you could get some diclobinal on those bad boys you could save someone having to buy a new sewer down the line. So when push comes to shove you are doing less for your customer than I am. And if you want to split hairs, doing them (your customers) a disservice by not letting them know all their options.
> I'm here (also) for the lurkers, the home owners, etc who are researching.



Do you warranty your chemical? Do you clean the line for free when the chemical fails and and the roots cause a sewer backup? If you do then its not unethical. Re read my post you felt free to quote. I didn't call you unethical for selling a chrmical you believe works. If you used rootx but offer no help when their $hit does back up, your a damn crook. When I sell it I am very blunt with costumers. "Your sewer will back up again, but when it does as long as its due to roots you will be covered, you say you back up every year? You can pay us 150 a year to have a perpetual warranty against roots, instead of 320 a year to clean your 100' sewer. If you never want to back up again have it cleaned on a regular basis before it backs up, or replace your sewer line"


----------



## gear junkie

theplungerman said:


> These are fighting words too, now it's all coming back to me. I got my panties in a bunch over this comment t as well.
> I'm this and that but not unethical, I don't sell BS. so when someone void of knowledge uses these words I'm going to come out throwing.
> It's kind of ironic,, you come off all above board,,,, I'm here to cut roots......... Well if all you do is keep cutting them will keep coming back stronger and thicker, and will eventually cause the joint-pipe to fail. If you could get some diclobinal on those bad boys you could save someone having to buy a new sewer down the line. So when push comes to shove you are doing less for your customer than I am. And if you want to split hairs, doing them (your customers) a disservice by not letting them know all their options.
> I'm here (also) for the lurkers, the home owners, etc who are researching.


You do know that no one is saying you're a crook....they're just saying that rootx didn't work for them.


----------



## cable or root

theplungerman said:


> I''ll never forget the first time i used rootX. This line had more roots than i had seen in a long time. I told the owner he needed to replace it or spend a wad cutting them out for the rest of his life. This is when i just got my 1st camera. So the slum lord landlord forced my hand,, I remembered being told about this product rootx from another honest plumber,,, that is what led me try this root killer. The roots were close and i was able to get a good dose of it down the sewer. When i came back in 3-4 weeks all the roots were dead, shriveled up. I flew through and cut em out.
> There have been times when I haven't been able to get through certain root intrusions, so treated with root x and came back 3-4 weeks,,, then an easy pop through. Not once or twice or thrice but dozens of success stories,,,,,seen with my eyes, it works. Apply it correctly and you will see. Or maybe you just want to sell a new sewer. Smile.



Wait just re read this post do you not use rootx to keep roots from growing back into a line after the line was properly cleaned? I'm a little confused, from the looks of it you're using the chemical to kill roots that are already in the physical line. That's not how we use it. In fact when we do the first treatment we do so after making 2 full passes in both directions with a 4" pear. There shouldn't be many roots left inside the pipe to kill. I thought it was meant to pilfer through the joints to kill the roots growing around the outside the pipe preventing root intrusion in the first place.


----------



## fixitright

I seem to have stirred the pot.


----------



## Drain Pro

theplungerman said:


> I would never be as bold as I am concerning this topic if I didn't have over 15 years experience with it. Iv'e seen it works continually for over 15 years. With my own eyes. That means with 100 percent certainty, I know,,IT WORKS, PERIOD.
> 
> So yes i can be wrong from time to time, but not on dichlobenil. It's been used for a long time BECAUSE it works. Crop growers are not going to continue spending gobs of money on a pesticide that doesn't work.
> 
> So when you say it doesn't work, i said you don't know what you are talking about. That's not necessarily a bad thing. When it comes to brain surgery I don't know what I'm talking about. IOW I'm ignorant when it come to brain surgery. But an (almost) expert with dichlobenil as it relates to roots in sewer. I got 98 percent right on my test on the subject treating roots in sewers.
> 
> So when you said the 2nd time it doesen't work i felt embarresed for you.
> 
> I've been at this game for about 30 years. I saved a lot of butts out there with root x and vaporooter.
> 
> You came on here saying something that works doesn't. Something I sell. Just sticking up for all the good people using and selling root x vaporooter.
> 
> I''ll never forget the first time i used rootX. This line had more roots than i had seen in a long time. I told the owner he needed to replace it or spend a wad cutting them out for the rest of his life. This is when i just got my 1st camera. So the slum lord landlord forced my hand,, I remembered being told about this product rootx from another honest plumber,,, that is what led me try this root killer. The roots were close and i was able to get a good dose of it down the sewer. When i came back in 3-4 weeks all the roots were dead, shriveled up. I flew through and cut em out.
> 
> There have been times when I haven't been able to get through certain root intrusions, so treated with root x and came back 3-4 weeks,,, then an easy pop through. Not once or twice or thrice but dozens of success stories,,,,,seen with my eyes, it works. Apply it correctly and you will see. Or maybe you just want to sell a new sewer. Smile.



Ok...where to start? I don't sell new sewers. I've never needed RootX to kill roots in order to return at a later date to pass my cable. Why would you assume I applied it incorrectly when I stated that I did? Is that arrogance or ignorance, either way you come across like a dick. And finally, please don't ever be "embarresed " for me but if you must, please make sure you spell "embarrassed" correctly. Actually having to return several weeks later to cut out roots after applying your miracle powder when you've been cleaning drains for 30 plus years is a little "embarrassing". Big Smile!


----------



## PPRI

I think this conversation is great. I no longer sell ROOTX as it has become to mainstream. We sell oblitiroot from Toby. I'm not 100% sold on its effectiveness like plungerman but it is another service we offer. We all have to see conversations with customers after we clean their lines.

Them : "how can we keep this from happening"
Us: we offer a a comprehensive list of cleaning services and each has its place and it's appropriate guarantee. We can cable this line open for $xx and you get xx days guarantee. We can cable and treat with our foaming root killer and we add xx guarantee. We can jet the line and offer xx guarantee or we can jet and treat to offer xx guarantee. 
If you would like to be setup on a maintenance schedule we can prescribe a solution that will give you xx guarantee every x years.

They always want a solution and we offer a whole menu of options and combinations that we can tailor to fit. 

It doesn't matter if it's grease, roots, hair or septic. We are there to offer solutions. 

Sure we clean a couple warranty. It's a price we account for.


----------



## theplungerman

gear junkie said:


> You do know that no one is saying you're a crook....they're just saying that rootx didn't work for them.


Howdy,
Yes your right, in a way, but it was somewhat inferred. And by the way I treat call backs with more respect then a first time caller and when they are on me then its all good. Because now they have their honest plumber who stands by his work.


----------



## theplungerman

Drain Pro said:


> Ok...where to start? I don't sell new sewers. I've never needed RootX to kill roots in order to return at a later date to pass my cable. Why would you assume I applied it incorrectly when I stated that I did? Is that arrogance or ignorance, either way you come across like a dick. And finally, please don't ever be "embarresed " for me but if you must, please make sure you spell "embarrassed" correctly. Actually having to return several weeks later to cut out roots after applying your miracle powder when you've been cleaning drains for 30 plus years is a little "embarrassing". Big Smile!


Your flaming me for a misspell, and then tell me to make sure I spell correctly,, oh puhhhleeeeze.
Yes I know how I come across. And sorry for any ill feelings I may have caused you.

I jsut knwo thta atfer oerv 20 yesra usnig Dichlorobenzonitrile (DCBN or dichlobenil),thta fi ti si ueds properyl ti korws.

It's better then just cutting. Like a hedge if you keep cutting it, it comes back thicker, stronger etc. But if you kill the root "properly" it wont come back. Yes another one will but after a few treating's that results in a build up of root killer and eventually that bad joint stops being a bad joint. 

I have some very exciting findings to share with you. I'm starting to have some 3rd treatments come around. A particular job another plumber passed off to me because the roots were coming back and choking off a 6 inch joint in less then SIX months, 6 MONTHS,, over and over and over after being completely hydro jetted spotless. This plumber gave up with this cheapo landlord who didn't want to do a spot repair. Plus he,(the plumber) knew i just started using Vaporooter and wanted to see how it worked on this very bad joint-spot,,, so 2 years ago i jet it spotless and treat it. It lasts 1 year. A small victory. But still more growth then I wanted to see. So just last week I went back again and this year it was at least 75% better then last year. Vaporooter is building up and making this very bad joint not so bad any more. Next year I'm going to expect that he can go 2 years next time. This is a rare case, where for some odd reason 1 particular joint gets blasted big time. I think it is due to a wide gap made from previous intrusions. I know for certainty this stuff works. Because most of the time there are no roots that grow back. This I know from all the the 2nd treatments that I'm starting to view. Remember I'm trotting off into my 3rd year using this stuff on a regular basis. Roots are a formidable opponent. And sometimes they out wit a treatment, but will succumb to the next one. Roots can't beat dichlobenil. It is a scientific fact.
So when someone says it doesn't work I can only "assume" they applied it incorrectly.

My miracle powder? that's disrespectful to the fine folk who make, sell and use Dichlorobenzonitrile (DCBN or dichlobenil).

If you had to return after several weeks to rectify a treatment, job, procedure you did, you made a mistake, but that's cool, we all make mistakes. Big Smile.


----------



## theplungerman

cable or root said:


> Wait just re read this post do you not use rootx to keep roots from growing back into a line after the line was properly cleaned? I'm a little confused, from the looks of it you're using the chemical to kill roots that are already in the physical line. That's not how we use it. In fact when we do the first treatment we do so after making 2 full passes in both directions with a 4" pear. There shouldn't be many roots left inside the pipe to kill. I thought it was meant to pilfer through the joints to kill the roots growing around the outside the pipe preventing root intrusion in the first place.


It starts out with a root infested line that has caused a back up. I then remove all roots and treat. The foam does a real nice job of infiltrating the joints to stop re growth, like you said. I'll recommend just a treatment if they are less then 30 percent blocked.


----------



## Roto-Rooter

You believe in it you don't, it doesn't matter. Mother Nature will do as she pleases anyway.


----------



## theplungerman

Roto-Rooter said:


> You believe in it you don't, it doesn't matter. Mother Nature will do as she pleases anyway.


A dam stops mother nature flowing her waters, diclobinal stops roots from growing. Sorry try again. Big smile.


----------



## Roto-Rooter

theplungerman said:


> A dam stops mother nature flowing her waters, diclobinal stops roots from growing. Sorry try again. Big smile.


Then Mother Nature runs water over the Damn!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## fixitright

This thread has gone far enough.

I will have details of my test in about two months.
Although this test will determine only my wants from Root X 
it should be enough to satisfy most here.

We need to act as professionals in this professional forum.
See you in two months.


----------



## gear junkie

So real talk here. Plungerman.....is there a possibility that you depended on RootX for a majority of your time in business because you've only been jetting about 3-1/2 years and needed the product (rootx or vapor root) to catch any last remaining roots left behind by cabling?

Thinking back to myself, before I got into jetting, this is what I needed the rootx for. Now with jetting, I'm not seeing any advantage to the root treatment.


----------



## gear junkie

fixitright said:


> This thread has gone far enough.
> 
> I will have details of my test in about two months.
> Although this test will determine only my wants from Root X
> it should be enough to satisfy most here.
> 
> We need to act as professionals in this professional forum.
> See you in two months.


Holy crap. Quit your crying, we all our big boy pants on.....well apparently most of us do.


----------



## gear junkie

I call dibs on the seat between Drain Pro and Plungerman at next year's WWETT show!!!! Let the hilarity ensue!

(in oprah's voice)You get a smile, you're smiling, over there....a smile for you too. Big smiles for EVERYONE!!!


----------



## Drain Pro

gear junkie said:


> I call dibs on the seat between Drain Pro and Plungerman at next year's WWETT show!!!! Let the hilarity ensue!
> 
> 
> 
> (in oprah's voice)You get a smile, you're smiling, over there....a smile for you too. Big smiles for EVERYONE!!!




Whatever happens on the zone, stays on the zone.


----------



## theplungerman

gear junkie said:


> So real talk here. Plungerman.....is there a possibility that you depended on RootX for a majority of your time in business because you've only been jetting about 3-1/2 years and needed the product (rootx or vapor root) to catch any last remaining roots left behind by cabling?
> 
> Thinking back to myself, before I got into jetting, this is what I needed the rootx for. Now with jetting, I'm not seeing any advantage to the root treatment.


No, in no way, no. 
I got into vaporooter because I found out at the pumper show that vaporooter has 4 times the amount of diclobonil that root x has PLUS meta sodium, which is a root killer where diclobinal is a root growth INHIBITOR. It also had to do with the delivery system Vapor Rooter offers. So since I knew root x works I knew. 
Vapor Rooter was a no-brainer.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

I dont do drain cleaning, just during renovations ill snake out a kitchen or vanity drain,nothing over 2 inch piping, one one job the people called in a drain guy and after doing what he had todo, he sold them on a full house drain warranty only if they paid for a bacterial treatment of the whole house, so they agreed and the guy dumped down all the drains some liquid that he said would grow in the system and eat up the grease and soap build up, and if they had another clog it would be free to clean out, im sure he hit them hard on price to cover going back if he had to, did it work..Im gona say on the no side, in theory yes the anaerobic action will eat the soap and grease, but as soon as you run water, it got washed away and if you used any bleach or nail cleaning stuff it would kill the bacteria, just like in a septic system...I have used the foaming rootx in my parents main after they had it cleaned and the guy pulled up roots, it hasnt clogged for years after, so does it work, im gona say most likley...but with any treatment there are so many factors that it may not work all the time on all mains or systems..BTW, im holding a neutral position if its sold to customers as a money maker that does nothing for them..


----------



## saysflushable

I just videoed the 1st place we Vaporooted last year. The roots were the same no increase in size at all and not blocking flow. If they allow we will Vaporoot again with out cutting the roots as we did last year just to see what happens.

I have 2 more to inspect soon so we will see.


----------

