# Gate valve question



## RDW 920 (Mar 30, 2009)

I have always installed ball valves and have always been in new construction.


So.....I have had few dealings with gate valves.

I need to 'rebuild' the gate valve you see in the pictures. It has no markings on it at all. Any advice would be appreciated.


Further info for the curious: 2 gate valves on either side of meter, neither shut the water down.
Curb stop (8'deep) also doesn't shut the water down. 1st Gate valve is only 6" above slab so no room to freeze the line and solder in new valve. That is why I would like to rebuild the one.....then I will replace the 2nd one. I will shut the curb stop down to a slow stream while repairing the first valve......(and this was not even the original reason for the call)


Thanks


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

replace, don't rebuild on somthing that small.


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## uaplumber (Jun 16, 2008)

Cut and remoce old valve, use full port ball valve to replace. Use a dam to hold back the water. Or, convert to pex.


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## uaplumber (Jun 16, 2008)

Sorry, one more step, if using pex, relocate the ground wire back to existing copper before the pex.


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## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

I agree. There is not much likelihood of finding another valve to get parts from. That's a super-cheap valve. So, no matter what it takes, you need to replace it.

If the city valve doesn't shut off the water, then get them to replace that. It's rare that one of those doesn't work.

How about this:

Shut off the city valve until you get a trickle. Cut the pipe off above the first gate valve. Open it. Get a piece of 3/8" soft copper tube and thread it into the pipe as far down as you can get it. Use a shop vac on the end of the 3/8" tube to keep the water sucked out while you remove the valve and replace it. I'd put an adapter on the pipe so that you can screw another valve on even when there's water running.


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## Plumbworker (Oct 23, 2008)

jet sweat.. with full port ball valve


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Any reason you can't just add a full port ball valve on the front side of that gate somewhere?


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## RDW 920 (Mar 30, 2009)

this valve in the picture is not the tough one to replace, the meter is just to the left of this picture, so I will pull the meter and sweat in new ball valve while water drains into shallow bucket.

The reason I wanted to rebuild valve is to repair the one prior to the meter, which is only 5"-6" above the slab. If I cut that one out and have any problems getting solder to take (even with shop vac idea) I am screwed as there is not other way to shut water down.

Curb stops are homeowners responsibility not water dept.

Thanks for the input, I will just replace the valve after the meter, this will give them a whole house (functioning) shut off.

hopefully the water district never needs to service their meter.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

You can buy the exact same valve and swap out the bonnets and gates.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

shut the curb stop off. stick a jet sweat in there at the gate valve. heat it up with your torch to unsweat it. Clean the copper up real good. Apply flux and install full port ball valve. Solder ball valve. and so on

Also, they make jet sweats that will continue to drain water out of the handle that won't affect your soldering. A regular jet sweat shouldn't be used with pressure building up on it.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

It doesn't look like it's that old of a gate valve. Is it a Hammond? They're pretty common. At least in Florida they are.


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## RDW 920 (Mar 30, 2009)

House and airgap.

If I could find the same valve that would make it simple, but then again that is my original question, what brand valve is it.....no markings on it, and I am not familiar enough w/GV's I am a BV man myself.


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## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

house plumber said:


> shut the curb stop off. stick a jet sweat in there at the gate valve. heat it up with your torch to unsweat it. Clean the copper up real good. Apply flux and install full port ball valve. Solder ball valve. and so on
> 
> Also, they make jet sweats that will continue to drain water out of the handle that won't affect your soldering. A regular jet sweat shouldn't be used with pressure building up on it.



You're right houseplumber it's not a hard one, I've got to wonder. There are so many different options to make this work. :whistling2:


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## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

RDW 920 said:


> House and airgap.
> 
> If I could find the same valve that would make it simple, but then again that is my original question, what brand valve is it.....no markings on it, and I am not familiar enough w/GV's I am a BV man myself.



I don't know anyone that tries to fix a defective gate valve, just doesn't happen. Replace the thing and be done with it. You have jet swets as you were told a number of times, you have propress, hell you have bread if you have to do it that way.:thumbsup:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

is he even a plumber? A real plumber shouldn't have to ask what to do in a case like this. It's second nature


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Disconnect the water meter nipple, hell the meter is right there right? and you won't need to worry about the water disrupting your soldering job, reconnect when done.


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## leak1 (Mar 25, 2009)

J-e-t S-w-e-a-t !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

Hate to say it but this might be a good spot for a shark bite valve.:yes::whistling2:


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

RDW 920 said:


> House and airgap.
> 
> If I could find the same valve that would make it simple, but then again that is my original question, what brand valve is it.....no markings on it, and I am not familiar enough w/GV's I am a BV man myself.


It's an import that was made in either Taiwan or Korea, and distributed through one of the many plumbing wholesale import suppliers, like B & K or Jones Stephens.


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## Double-A (Aug 17, 2008)

Option 1

Go by the water dept or local municipal water supply and get a meter 1/2 union with threads on the outlet. Install short brass nipple and threaded ball valve. Cut the old mess out with the curb stop turned off and thread on the new with the ball valve open. Rebuild down stream as you wish.

Option 2

You have threads to the left of that 90 just below the failed ball valve. See option 1 and don't worry about the 1/2 union.

Before I attempted either of these, I'd make sure of three things. 

1. I know how much water is still gonna come through that pipe.
2. All the downstream fixtures have been drained, and toilets flushed.
3. The nearest floor drain is not stopped up!

Option 3

This is the one I like the best. Dig up that defective curb stop and replace it. Then replace all those stupid gate valves with good quality ball valves. 

This last option is in the best interests of your client. Anything less than this and they're just asking for a problem down the road. With my luck, it would be sooner than later.


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## SPH (Nov 4, 2008)

im thinking he should just open the yellow pages and look under Plumbing


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

gusty60 said:


> Hate to say it but this might be a good spot for a shark bite valve.:yes::whistling2:



I'm coming after you :laughing:


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## RDW 920 (Mar 30, 2009)

Okay my last comments on this:furious:

2nd valve after the meter has been replace, this was never a question. just pulled meter, installed threaded BV on incoming line while valve was changed out, drained water, installed meter.

Again if you would READ my initial post, first GV is the only issue.

GV has ST 90 in it then over to meter, framing on top of that so no room for Jet Swet, too much water for bread, customer is out of work due to layoffs, and family heath issues. so replacement of curb stop is way out of their options.

anyway probelm solved for now.

Those who say call a plumber, KMA. Been at if for 25 yrs. and I am okay with admitting I haven't seen it all. Unlike some of you who think you never had a question....
The biggest change for me is moving to a different region of the US, code interpretation, products used etc are all very different.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Tell them RDW, don't let these hoodlums get to you.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I suppose you could attempt to re-lap the wafer and seat with abrasive compound............Not high on my list of options though.....


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## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

I would love to see more pictures of this impossible valve replacement. If there's framing in the way then cut the sh*t out of the way! You're saying you can't cut off the street 90 and rebuild it? Do whatever it takes to replace the valve. An experienced licensed plumber would do whatever it took to get the job done. That's what seperates us professionals from the hacks.
How are we suppose to tell what to do when you didn't even post a picture of the other valve in relation to the "framing" etc.? 
I would love to see that picture but I doubt you will post it.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

ironranger said:


> I would love to see more pictures of this impossible valve replacement. If there's framing in the way then cut the sh*t out of the way! You're saying you can't cut off the street 90 and rebuild it? Do whatever it takes to replace the valve. An experienced licensed plumber would do whatever it took to get the job done. That's what seperates us professionals from the hacks.
> How are we suppose to tell what to do when you didn't even post a picture of the other valve in relation to the "framing" etc.?
> I would love to see that picture but I doubt you will post it.


There's really no need to respond like this. Some things are best kept to yourself.


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## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

airgap said:


> There's really no need to respond like this. Some things are best kept to yourself.



Touche!:thumbsup: Though I believe you misunderstood my post. It wasn't meant to be condescending, just straight to the point. With 25 years experience this shouldn't be a problem. If it really is that big of a problem then post the entire picture so we can see it so we can understand it better.


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## Kyle181 (Sep 5, 2008)

there is a ton of different ways to resolve this issue, you could even just get a frickin compression ball valve for cryin out loud


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

I was gonna mention the compression valve way back in the beginning but it seemed more fun to wait a bit. :whistling2:


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## Kyle181 (Sep 5, 2008)

ya i was waiting to see if someone would say it too


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