# Hot water and at SOME bathrooms (Noritz?)



## CCI (May 3, 2013)

Hi everybody - new here!

I've tried searching but couldn't find anything on this specific topic.\

I have two, yes two, different houses we've completed major remodels on within the last 6 years that have Noritz water heaters. Over the years, bith clients have experienced the same issue - Hot water everywhere EXCEPT the master bath...

We've tried various fixes over the year that only seem to provide temporary relief (i.e. changing the shower temp valves / stems, back-flushing the water heater, installing sediment filters, drain and re-charge the system, back-pressure the system, descale... the list goes on!)

Any thoughts on this. If it was just one unit, I'd write it off as a fluke, but TWO!!??

I'm stumped! :help:

Thanks - CCI


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

CCI said:


> Hi everybody - new here!
> 
> I've tried searching but couldn't find anything on this specific topic.\
> 
> ...


I'm stumped that you can't even post a proper intro as request on the front page of this site.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

An intro is requested from all new members. In case you missed it, here is the link. http://www.plumbingzone.com/f3/.

The PZ is for Plumbing Professionals ( those engaged in the plumbing profession)

Post an intro and tell our members where you are from, years in the trade, and your area(s) of expertise in the plumbing field.

This info helps members who are waiting to welcome you to the best plumbing site there is.

We look forward to your valuable input.


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

Zing! 

Tough room... OK - I'll go post my intro...


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## gardon (Apr 24, 2013)

Is the problem at the master bath (shower, and lavs? or just shower?)


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

Shower & lavs!


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

Master bath(s) only. Hot water at other baths and kitchens! (???)


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## gardon (Apr 24, 2013)

if the single handle shower, lav faucets, have a bad cartridge that is leaking through, meaning needs to be replaced, this would mix the hot and cold water and would cause this. first thing i would do is to clean the aerator screens as flow is what fire's the heater, and to low it would not. Then i would look at maybe mixing through a bad one handle faucet cartridge.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

CCI said:


> Hi everybody - new here!
> 
> I've tried searching but couldn't find anything on this specific topic.\
> 
> ...


What did your in-house liensced plumbers say ??


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

gardon said:


> if the single handle shower, lav faucets, have a bad cartridge that is leaking through, meaning needs to be replaced, this would mix the hot and cold water and would cause this. first thing i would do is to clean the aerator screens as flow is what fire's the heater, and to low it would not. Then i would look at maybe mixing through a bad one handle faucet cartridge.


Sinks have double handles... 

We've tried replacing the cartridge in the shower before (when we've had this issue) and it didn't solve the problem. Shower cartridge is new 



rjbphd said:


> What did your in-house liensced plumbers say ??


He's baffled and thinks that one of the clients in particular is crazy and imagining things as the problem is transient.

DWP has been doing a lot of work in the general are which seems to have kicked up a bunch of crap in the lines, but this house specifically has a complete filtration system on the main inlet...


UPDATE:

Just spoke with one of the clients.

The exact nature of the problem was.

*Last night:*

Downstairs kitchen & baths - hot water & pressure fine

Upstairs bathrooms (x2)

Low pressure on hot water side & luke-warm water

pressure fine on cold water side

*This morning:*

All pressure & temp fine at all locations...


This is not always the nature of the issue at this house in particular, just the most recent....

Gremlins? :devil:


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## gardon (Apr 24, 2013)

pressure is fine now at problem bath. When there is a pressure problem, it could be crap as you stated washing up in the line, which if low pressure would not fire the heater, as its flow activated. Kill water and remove cartridges and open water again, and flush out the line, and then reinstall the cartridge if its not plugged with sediment, or replace. WIthout enough flow, the heater will fire sometimes or not at all.


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## SlowDrains (Mar 25, 2013)

gardon said:


> pressure is fine now at problem bath. When there is a pressure problem, it could be crap as you stated washing up in the line, which if low pressure would not fire the heater, as its flow activated. Kill water and remove cartridges and open water again, and flush out the line, and then reinstall the cartridge if its not plugged with sediment, or replace. WIthout enough flow, the heater will fire sometimes or not at all.


Is the unit sized properly for the house is it when they are using multiple fixtures?


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

gardon said:


> pressure is fine now at problem bath. When there is a pressure problem, it could be crap as you stated washing up in the line, which if low pressure would not fire the heater, as its flow activated. Kill water and remove cartridges and open water again, and flush out the line, and then reinstall the cartridge if its not plugged with sediment, or replace. WIthout enough flow, the heater will fire sometimes or not at all.


Sediment shouldn't be able to get past the filter at the main line... I checked it last time we had this issue and the element was fine...



SlowDrains said:


> Is the unit sized properly for the house is it when they are using multiple fixtures?


Oversized!


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## gardon (Apr 24, 2013)

CCI said:


> Sediment shouldn't be able to get past the filter at the main line... I checked it last time we had this issue and the element was fine...
> 
> 
> 
> Oversized!


Lack of pressure, is a restriction in the line, be it overuse, sediment, faulty valve etc, something is slowing the flow down, and when it does the heater will not fire due to low flow.


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## gardon (Apr 24, 2013)

knowing the hot has no pressure when the problem exists, tells you why the heater is not firing, find the restriction, and you will fix the problem


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## SlowDrains (Mar 25, 2013)

gardon said:


> Lack of pressure, is a restriction in the line, be it overuse, sediment, faulty valve etc, something is slowing the pressure down, and when it does the heater will not fire due to low flow.


Yeah restriction could be anything I had one that there was a 3/8 brass plug that was in line from construction that would travel back and forth between 2 90s


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

I've had a similar issue. Are they on a well? Possibly the low side of the pressure switch is not giving enough gpm's then maybe when the switch is at the high side the pressure is enough to give better gpm's to activate flow switch properly. 

Just a thought.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Sell them tank water heater with return line?


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

rjbphd said:


> Sell them tank water heater with return line?


Bingo!

That's the real solution.


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## CCI (May 3, 2013)

I'm just not sure why the restriction comes and goes... There really doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason for it... 

I'm almost tempted to swap one of the tankless out for a conventional heater to see if anything changes... 

Thanks for feedback so far...


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