# I am sick of this!



## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

*Have any of you ever felt like quitting plumbing or giving up on a job cause something went wrong or as an apprentice NO ONE was there to help you?*

I have felt like this a a couple of times in my apprenticeship. If is doesn't kill you it makes you stronger. I am not quitting though, I really enjoy plumbing a lot. 

What about you guys?


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

WaterBoy said:


> *Have any of you ever felt like quitting plumbing or giving up on a job cause something went wrong or as an apprentice NO ONE was there to help you?*
> 
> I have felt like this a a couple of times in my apprenticeship. If is doesn't kill you it makes you stronger. I am not quitting though, I really enjoy plumbing a lot.
> 
> What about you guys?


I have been threatening to quit everyday for the last 35 yrs.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

I say it's not worth the grief, quit now while you still can.

I had a whinny helper pull that crap on me back in 1975. I suggested he look into a career as a florist. Twenty-five years later he bought my shop from me.

Mark


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## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

Everybody has bad days/weeks/months even years.

I don't care what they do for a living.

Suck it up, buttercup and get used to it!:thumbsup:


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

I've got my 2 boys working for me and had to here them whine their whole apprenticeship. Made me want to kill myself instead. Told them to go work for someone else if they didn't like it. They did and then came back. Found out it isn't always greener on the other side.
Just sayin':whistling2:


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## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

I am not whiny about it. Just throwing a feeling out there that I am sure all of us have come face to face with. Just wanted to know how many of you have ever had those tough jobs or bad days? OR, has any of you had another plumber come to relieve you from a job?


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

WaterBoy said:


> I am not whiny about it. Just throwing a feeling out there that I am sure all of us have come face to face with. Just wanted to know how many of you have ever had those tough jobs or bad days? OR, has any of you had another plumber come to relieve you from a job?


I have been relieved by other plumbers many times. When the project is almost completed it's time for me to start another underground. it's just a cycle.


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Never. Never finished a job without a magnificent display of plumbing acumen. Never had to overcome any obstacle because I saw them all well in advance. Pipe falls down in awe at my presence. Fixtures rearrange themselves in the back of my truck as I drive down the road, jockeying for position, in hopes that I will pick them first. Never tore my clothing, never cut myself, never hit a nail with my drill bit, never had a primer run or pipe joint leak, and I've never had another person's poo touch me.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

smellslike$tome said:


> Never. Never finished a job without a magnificent display of plumbing acumen. Never had to overcome any obstacle because I saw them all well in advance. Pipe falls down in awe at my presence. Fixtures rearrange themselves in the back of my truck as I drive down the road, jockeying for position, in hopes that I will pick them first. Never tore my clothing, never cut myself, never hit a nail with my drill bit, never had a primer run or pipe joint leak, and I've never had another person's poo touch me.


 
:notworthy: You go, plumber man.:laughing:


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Waterboy, What exactly is bothering you? What stage are you at? Do they have you on projects that may be a little over your skill level? answer these questions and I bet we can talk you off the ledge.


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## para1 (Jun 17, 2008)

jUMP....IF IT DONT KILL YOU, IT WILL MAKE YOU STRONGER.


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

para1 said:


> jUMP....IF IT DONT KILL YOU, IT WILL MAKE YOU STRONGER.


That is unless it leaves you a PARAplegic!


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## para1 (Jun 17, 2008)

outch!


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## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

slickrick said:


> Waterboy, What exactly is bothering you? What stage are you at? Do they have you on projects that may be a little over your skill level? answer these questions and I bet we can talk you off the ledge.


Nothing is bothering me at the moment. Stage level= any residential service. 

A couple of weeks ago, I was sent to a job to rebuild a Delta kitchen faucet-*Complete*. Repair a hose bib-*Complete*. Last, replace the Delta cartridge on a t/s. - *Messed up*. I approached this one, knew what I was doing. Shut the water off, take the handle off, discussion plate off, discussion sleeve off. Now the cartridge and bonnet nut is exposed. Took a large channel lock pliers to try back the nut off, did not nudge a bit. Took the torch heated the nut up then wacked it with the pliers. Again, tried to back the nut off did not nudge again. So I kept trying after I spoke with my boss for advice, he said to keep trying or I will never learn which is good though. I moved the whole valve and broke the whole cartridge body from the 3/8" copper. My boss had to come and relieve me from that job to install a new valve and he complained that he did not make any money on that job he said. The house was on well water also. 

Another plumber told me it's about trial and error. I am not quitting plumbing just from making a mistake on a job. 

Thanks guys.


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Those valves can be a PITA. Escutcheon not discussion


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

wait till you work on Grohe shower valves and try to set the temp at the 100 degree benchmark and you're only getting hot water even though there is cold water there.


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

I flooded a basement the day before the HO was suppose to move in. The carpet was soaked at the bottom of the stairs 20 feet away in the basement. $15,000 damage. Contemplated maybe I wasnt cut out for this....


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

I was called for an odor in a 9 story bldg. in downtown Fort Worth, offices and a Bennigans rest. We agreed to smoke the bldg. Made Mr. Patel understand the importance of making sure the fire alarm was off for test........We evidently had a communication problem.

Told the owner of the bldg. to make sure the fire alarm was off, Mr. Patel assured me it would be. Started at 5:30 am, by 6:45 the entire downtown fire dept. was nipping at my heels. Rescheduled for the following week, Mr. Patel assured me is was off again......once again it was NOT. BTW, the fire capt. does not take this sort of thing lightly. 

I was changing a W/H, sediment was really bad. I was alone, no helper. I put a little air on the heater.........next thing I know there is water sediment and who knows what else all over the room. Ceiling, walls, carpet and even in the crack of my butt. Amazing how long your arms can get when your in a pinch, I was able to stick my thumb in the drain and reach to the top of the heater and take the air adapter off.

There's more, but I ain't telling..........


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*get an education while you still can....*

:laughing:


WaterBoy said:


> *Have any of you ever felt like quitting plumbing or giving up on a job cause something went wrong or as an apprentice NO ONE was there to help you?*
> 
> I have felt like this a a couple of times in my apprenticeship. If is doesn't kill you it makes you stronger. I am not quitting though, I really enjoy plumbing a lot.
> 
> What about you guys?


 
sometimes I wonder what if.., dealing with the idiots I deal with every day, sometimes I want to go postal. on them... but that is against the law in these parts.....:laughing::laughing:

sometimes I wonder what other
paths I should have taken in life too....

If you are young enough, and if you are not happy, you can always come back
anytime to this line of work in your mid 30s. especially service work... 

Just go to college ...part time or full time....if you can afford to and see what else makes you happy... 

I know a few guys that are male nurses, and they 
make as much as me doing half the work and get to be around hot chicks and fairley smart people all day long ....thats a big perk....

and that is better than being around guys cleaning their
 sewer cables every morning at the plumbing shop for the next 30 years....
( ohhh the horror....... the horror ....of it all)

remember....once you are older , 
a lot of other opportunities will pass you by
*get an education if you can, while you can.......*

if you cant hack college, 
you better stick with it...:laughing::laughing:


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## ZL700 (Dec 8, 2009)

WaterBoy said:


> Nothing is bothering me at the moment. Stage level= any residential service.
> 
> A couple of weeks ago, I was sent to a job to rebuild a Delta kitchen faucet-*Complete*. Repair a hose bib-*Complete*. Last, replace the Delta cartridge on a t/s. - *Messed up*. I approached this one, knew what I was doing. Shut the water off, take the handle off, discussion plate off, discussion sleeve off. Now the cartridge and bonnet nut is exposed. Took a large channel lock pliers to try back the nut off, did not nudge a bit. Took the torch heated the nut up then wacked it with the pliers. Again, tried to back the nut off did not nudge again. So I kept trying after I spoke with my boss for advice, he said to keep trying or I will never learn which is good though. I moved the whole valve and broke the whole cartridge body from the 3/8" copper. My boss had to come and relieve me from that job to install a new valve and he complained that he did not make any money on that job he said. The house was on well water also.
> 
> ...


 
Just don't ask for a concussion when you mean escutcheon!
Those words mixed up can kill ya


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I remember breaking a toilet as an apprentice and the boss said everyone does it once.....then he said if I broke the next one to run.
If you learn to think early on, you are way ahead.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

My first boss used to always tell me "The more ya think, the more ya make".

He was right.


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

My crew in Iraq cut a cable that went to the NSA (National Security Agency) They were none to happy. My crew had never seen a trencher in their lives. 4 of them were hanging on it being thrown around like rag dolls. In my mind they were gnawing on a root. There were no roots for 500 mi. Before I could get them shut down, up came the wires. I had marked the line myself.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

Every-time I have a job go bad, or have a serious recall, I like others contemplate quitting the trade. It seems that the good times are rare, but when they happen, I rejoice, and revel in it. Its a good thing that you have found a good outlet. Although there are some who are not as receptive and have a tendency to downplay others growing pains, as if they never went through it.


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## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

Thank you all for the replies. Thank you for the correction on my spelling error. :whistling2:

I really enjoy plumbing and will continue in the trade, unless my college degree in two years will open a different door. I am hoping to go into business for myself. 

I kind of like the beating from the intense labor we all do. It makes us more discipline.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

WaterBoy said:


> Thank you all for the replies. Thank you for the correction on my spelling error. :whistling2:
> 
> I really enjoy plumbing and will continue in the trade, unless my college degree in two years will open a different door. I am hoping to go into business for myself.
> 
> I kind of like the beating from the intense labor we all do. It makes us more discipline.


 If you think you felt like quitting alot of times now, wait till you try your own business.
If I were you I would get alot more experience before even trying it on your own. Breaking off that Delta faucet, is a miniscule problem, compared to running your own show. And there aint no-one to call, to get you out of trouble. JMHO.


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## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

Don The Plumber said:


> If you think you felt like quitting alot of times now, wait till you try your own business.
> If I were you I would get alot more experience before even trying it on your own. Breaking off that Delta faucet, is a miniscule problem, compared to running your own show. And there aint no-one to call, to get you out of trouble. JMHO.


Your right. I won't own my own biz for a while. 
I need all the experience I can get.


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

WaterBoy said:


> Nothing is bothering me at the moment. Stage level= any residential service.
> 
> A couple of weeks ago, I was sent to a job to rebuild a Delta kitchen faucet-*Complete*. Repair a hose bib-*Complete*. Last, replace the Delta cartridge on a t/s. - *Messed up*. I approached this one, knew what I was doing. Shut the water off, take the handle off, discussion plate off, discussion sleeve off. Now the cartridge and bonnet nut is exposed. Took a large channel lock pliers to try back the nut off, did not nudge a bit. Took the torch heated the nut up then wacked it with the pliers. Again, tried to back the nut off did not nudge again. So I kept trying after I spoke with my boss for advice, he said to keep trying or I will never learn which is good though. I moved the whole valve and broke the whole cartridge body from the 3/8" copper. My boss had to come and relieve me from that job to install a new valve and he complained that he did not make any money on that job he said. The house was on well water also.
> 
> ...


Never, ever, do this again. It is completely unnecessary and will virtually always make things worse. I will pm you instructions on how to get this ring off easily. There is a trick to it but since I discovered it it has never failed to work for me.

p.s. channel locks are the worst tool in your bag, were it not for that occasional, legitimate need for them, I would not even carry them. They should never, ever, come in contact with any improved finish, brass, copper or plastic fitting.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Every now and then the Plumbing Gods will smile and bless upon you.


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## kentdmo (Dec 15, 2008)

this stuff happens to everyone of us it's part of learning the job so pull up your big boy panties and get on with yourself


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

*Mistakes*

One time I was about to change a re-circ pump in a W/H closet of a commercial building. I glanced around to look for smoke detectors before I lit my torch, (not thinking to check for any fire sprinkler heads). As you can guess I had one right over my head. When it let go I was covered in rusty, nasty smelly water. I quickly found the maint. man who thankfully knew precisely where the fire line shut-off was. By then the fire dept. was on scene. They wanted to evacuate all the elderly residents (it was an old-age home) had it not been for me telling them there wasn't a fire just one dumb-ass plumber to blame. I am thankful there are floor drains in comm. bldgs.....


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

smellslike$tome said:


> Never, ever, do this again. It is completely unnecessary and will virtually always make things worse. I will pm you instructions on how to get this ring off easily. There is a trick to it but since I discovered it it has never failed to work for me.
> 
> p.s. channel locks are the worst tool in your bag, were it not for that occasional, legitimate need for them, I would not even carry them. They should never, ever, come in contact with any improved finish, brass, copper or plastic fitting.


I use a strap wrench. Share your tech. with me.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

WaterBoy said:


> Nothing is bothering me at the moment. Stage level= any residential service.
> 
> A couple of weeks ago, I was sent to a job to rebuild a Delta kitchen faucet-*Complete*. Repair a hose bib-*Complete*. Last, replace the Delta cartridge on a t/s. - *Messed up*. I approached this one, knew what I was doing. Shut the water off, take the handle off, discussion plate off, discussion sleeve off. Now the cartridge and bonnet nut is exposed. Took a large channel lock pliers to try back the nut off, did not nudge a bit. Took the torch heated the nut up then wacked it with the pliers. Again, tried to back the nut off did not nudge again. So I kept trying after I spoke with my boss for advice, he said to keep trying or I will never learn which is good though. I moved the whole valve and broke the whole cartridge body from the 3/8" copper. My boss had to come and relieve me from that job to install a new valve and he complained that he did not make any money on that job he said. The house was on well water also.
> 
> ...


Try not to take this personal as this is not about you it is about your boss. If I am reading this correctly, your boss sent a second year apprentice out on his own to do these repairs. My guess is he charged the customer as if you were a Journeyman Plumber. That was not fair to the customer or the apprentice and he wants to com plain about money he is losing?

The idea of an apprenticeship is you work with a Journeyman who teaches you how to handle situations like this. The reason you are not paid as a Journeyman is because there is a ton you don't know yet. You work for less money as an offset for the value of the training you should be receiving. Your boss is cheating both you and the customer to send you out as a plumber.

Mark


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## para1 (Jun 17, 2008)

Choctaw said:


> I was called for an odor in a 9 story bldg. in downtown Fort Worth, offices and a Bennigans rest. We agreed to smoke the bldg. Made Mr. Patel understand the importance of making sure the fire alarm was off for test........We evidently had a communication problem.
> 
> Told the owner of the bldg. to make sure the fire alarm was off, Mr. Patel assured me it would be. Started at 5:30 am, by 6:45 the entire downtown fire dept. was nipping at my heels. Rescheduled for the following week, Mr. Patel assured me is was off again......once again it was NOT. BTW, the fire capt. does not take this sort of thing lightly.
> 
> ...


 That was you?:laughing:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

slickrick said:


> I use a strap wrench. Share your tech. with me.


I'm sure it took years to develop and test.....you think he's gonna give that info away:laughing:. Tricks are for kids......use alittle heat or cut it off with a hacksaw or a dremel.


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> I'm sure it took years to develop and test.....you think he's gonna give that info away:laughing:. Tricks are for kids......use alittle heat or cut it off with a hacksaw or a dremel.


I have been able to remove them all so far. If I can get them to move at all, I work them back and forth not appling too much pressure. Put grease on it when I screw it back on.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

slickrick said:


> I have been able to remove them all so far. If I can get them to move at all, I work them back and forth not appling too much pressure. Put grease on it when I screw it back on.


 Same here. Its amazing how many guys won't work it back and forth first. All you want to do is break it loose. Ta Da.:thumbsup:


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

slickrick said:


> I have been able to remove them all so far. If I can get them to move at all, I work them back and forth not appling too much pressure. Put grease on it when I screw it back on.


 I thought you put silicone on them:laughing:


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## TheSkinnyGuy (Sep 15, 2009)

Tell you what, I got stuck with a journeyman one time that told me it was his goal to work me out of the company, and away from the trade. For about 8 months all we did was ground roughs, with an occasional top-out or some service thrown in. I felt like quitting on more than one occasion. But I'm still around.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

smellslike$tome said:


> "p.s. channel locks are the worst tool in your bag"
> 
> I work magic with mine on a daily basis. It's all about feel.


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## JK949 (Mar 18, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> smellslike$tome said:
> 
> 
> > "p.s. channel locks are the worst tool in your bag"
> ...


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## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

TheMaster said:


> I'm sure it took years to develop and test.....you think he's gonna give that info away:laughing:. Tricks are for kids......use alittle heat or cut it off with a hacksaw or a dremel.


Actually, I've already pm'd everybody on the PZ except for you, .


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

smellslike$tome said:


> Actually, I've already pm'd everybody on the PZ except for you, .



I didnt get the PM.:blink: Maybe my computer is broken. Ah, i'll just grab the channel locks.:laughing:


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

He forgot me too! sledge hamma.


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## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

I remember a time, when I was a young apprentice, and I was working with several journeymen filling in a huge trench or something. And I asked them all if they had really wanted to be a plumber or if they'd planned on going into something else. To my surprise, every one of them talked about what they had really wanted to do with their lives.

I had never planned to stay in plumbing - I wanted to go to college - but it kept me out of the Viet Nam jungles.

I often thought of going into something else over the years. Part of the reason for that may be that this is a low-income area and I'm not one to move to where the money is. But I've been a plumber so long now that I think even if I won the lottery and could do whatever I wanted I'd just keep plumbing at least part time. Between vacations or something.

By the way, my original love was commercial art. 

And Smells, if your fixtures are re-arranging themselves in your truck, you may want to investigate the fine art of the tie-down.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

smellslike$tome said:


> Actually, I've already pm'd everybody on the PZ except for you, .


Think back to what you were doing about 25-27 years ago.....I was repairing plumbing and have been everyday since......theres not much left to teach me about residental repair and with your new construction background...well its prolly not gonna come from you. Just calling a spade a spade:thumbsup:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> I work magic with mine on a daily basis. It's all about feel.


I bet somtimes more than once:laughing: Ditto ....I say channel locks are one of the best tools ever made if you know how to use them properly.:thumbsup: Some people need a special tools to do simple repairs. They waste their money on a crutch to make up for lack of skill.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

ToUtahNow said:


> Try not to take this personal as this is not about you it is about your boss. If I am reading this correctly, your boss sent a second year apprentice out on his own to do these repairs. My guess is he charged the customer as if you were a Journeyman Plumber. That was not fair to the customer or the apprentice and he wants to com plain about money he is losing?
> 
> The idea of an apprenticeship is you work with a Journeyman who teaches you how to handle situations like this. The reason you are not paid as a Journeyman is because there is a ton you don't know yet. You work for less money as an offset for the value of the training you should be receiving. Your boss is cheating both you and the customer to send you out as a plumber.
> 
> Mark


 I have stated many times throughout all of my complaining, that here in Indiana, no one gives a shiot about an apprentice working with a journeyman, especially in the rural areas. I feel for any apprentice that is sent out to make repairs by themselves with only a phone to call for advice. 
I myself completed an apprenticeship several years ago that sounds oddly similar to Waterboy, and you can bet your fanny that the boss was charging the customer journeyman rates. It always made me feel like a heel, and I worked my a$$ off trying to compensate for my lack of knowledge.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

I use mine for everything from channel locks to channel hammer....

Do I have the "proper" tool on the truck for every job? Probably.

But the channel locks have constant residence in my left side pocket:laughing:

So, you can be holier than thou. Or you can just get your ass to work. Whateva......

And no, I'm not carry my pliers while on vacation.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Indie said:


> , and you can bet your fanny that the boss was charging the customer journeyman rates.


I do. They are always with a journeyman though. It's all part of it. Show me a contractor that doesn't charge the whole 9 yards for an apprentice.:no:

I'm in business to make money. Pulling 1 apprentice for every journeyman makes me more money.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> I bet somtimes more than once:laughing: Ditto ....I say channel locks are one of the best tools ever made if you know how to use them properly.:thumbsup: Some people need a special tools to do simple repairs. They waste their money on a crutch to make up for lack of skill.


Geez, roughing them up pretty good. I have channel locks in my bag, and I always carry good sense with me. I know there is a strap wrench in my van somewhere, but I use it so infrequently I don't know where its at. 

Are we gonna start a thread about what tools to use and when? I think it would be great.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Matt said:


> I use mine for everything from channel locks to channel hammer....
> 
> Do I have the "proper" tool on the truck for every job? Probably.
> 
> ...



I would matt. The shower heads down in O town suck. no pressure at all. I take my own, modified moen.:thumbsup:


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Can I raise the shower head with my channel hammers?

They don't put the heads at sasquatch height down here.


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

Channel locks work great againt biting dogs. Just ask Fido.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Plasticman said:


> Channel locks work great againt biting dogs. Just ask Fido.


 
so do cars backin out the driveway :laughing:


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## bartnc37 (Feb 24, 2009)

a 3' piece of 1/2 pex used whip style will send any dog running for the hills, doesn't seem to injure em but i bet it hurts like hell.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

WaterBoy said:


> I moved the whole valve and broke the whole cartridge body from the 3/8" copper.


One word...kroil.


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## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

Indie said:


> I have stated many times throughout all of my complaining, that here in Indiana, no one gives a shiot about an apprentice working with a journeyman, especially in the rural areas. I feel for any apprentice that is sent out to make repairs by themselves with only a phone to call for advice.
> I myself completed an apprenticeship several years ago that sounds oddly similar to Waterboy, and you can bet your fanny that the boss was charging the customer journeyman rates. It always made me feel like a heel, and I worked my a$$ off trying to compensate for my lack of knowledge.


Agreed. The thing is, as an apprentice your suppose to be in training and to be train by someone. Any other job requires training. I used to work for Kroger in the meat dept. I had someone train me along my side at Kroger. You just can't walk into a job and know what to do without the proper training. My boss was with someone at all times when he went through his apprenticeship. I want to learn from the best so I can be a great plumber one day. Does reading plumbing books help a lot?


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