# shower valve replacement



## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

........ no tile damaged and the customer is pleased.:thumbsup:


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## HSI (Jun 3, 2011)

Is that a Wolverine Brass valve?


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Good job, however, I'm a MOENTROL guy..


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Fixed it for you.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

HSI said:


> Is that a Wolverine Brass valve?


Yep! I don't like the remodel plates for other brands.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Tommy plumber said:


> Fixed it for you.


I tried to figure out how to turn them but couldn't. How do you do it?


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## vinpadalino (Aug 27, 2010)

Plumb26 said:


> Yep! I don't like the remodel plates for other brands.


Totally agree. There as cheap as they come. 
Just did one today. It was a total *****. I wish it was wolverine brass.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

That is a great heavy remodel plate! I keep 2 myself. Love the essence valve also !!


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Plumb26 said:


> I tried to figure out how to turn them but couldn't. How do you do it?


 







I copied your photos to my computer, then rotated them, then re-loaded them here....


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Tommy plumber said:


> I copied your photos to my computer, then rotated them, then re-loaded them here....


Maybe I'll play with this tablet enough to figure it out.


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## younger-plumber (Sep 12, 2008)

i like how the remodel plate has some shape to it and not just a flat piece of metal. looks classy.where do you purchase them from?


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

younger-plumber said:


> i like how the remodel plate has some shape to it and not just a flat piece of metal. looks classy.where do you purchase them from?


Wolverine Brass. They have chrome, brushed nickel, and oil rubbed bronze. They only fit wolverine brass valves though.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

These things come in waves. I won't do one for months and aside from this one, I have 3 more to do in the next two weeks.


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

I really like the look of that remodel plate. Are you sure those holes won't line up with a Delta?

Are they brass?

I've been using the Delta remodel plates when I change from 2 or 3 handle to single. They suck....plastic.

I'm not ready to go from Delta to WB on my shower valves, but I really do like the look of that plate.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

PlungerJockey said:


> I really like the look of that remodel plate. Are you sure those holes won't line up with a Delta?
> 
> Are they brass?
> 
> ...


IM absolutely positive. Why not change? Customers can't shop you on a brand they can't get. I've been using WB for a long time and have had only a handful of issues that are ALWAYS resolved by my rep. Delta, while there are more style options, are so widely available, it's always a haggling contest when it comes to pricing. Not to mention the valve body is not made of much substance and they do not have interegal stops.
I get around $600-$700 to cut tile and install a valve with that remodel plate. Like I tell the customer, you won't have to replace tile or patch drywall.


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

I like the Delta shower valves, I don't really experience the hangle problems on fixtures. If the HO wants to save a few bucks at a box store and go get it. I have no problem with that, besides it's fun to tell them they got the wrong one.

Delta does offer the integral stops on their shower valves, I install them in hotels ,nursing homes and large multi-family jobs. The stops are nice but not nessasary for residential.

http://www.deltafaucet.com/bath/details/r10000-mfws.html


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## younger-plumber (Sep 12, 2008)

600-700 to cut tile and install a valve? that seems a little low especially for a wb valve..i get nearly 700 for a standard install with access panel...


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

I get the big hole and the remodel plate...
I rarely use them....

What was on the other wall behind that valve?
I usually find a closet.... :whistling2:


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

That's a huge hole.......I'd prefer to cut the Sheetrock if the option is available. How does the faceplate not leak with only those two screws securing it? Seems if it had a way to secure it further out on the faceplate would make since.


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## PlungerJockey (Feb 19, 2010)

Redwood said:


> I get the big hole and the remodel plate...
> I rarely use them....
> 
> What was on the other wall behind that valve?
> I usually find a closet.... :whistling2:


I don't think he enlarged the hole. If you look close you can see chalk around the hole. I think his only choice was with a remodel plate.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Will said:


> That's a huge hole.......I'd prefer to cut the Sheetrock if the option is available. How does the faceplate not leak with only those two screws securing it? Seems if it had a way to secure it further out on the faceplate would make since.


 The remodel plate has a large RUBBER ( not foam ) gasket. When you pull those screws down it gets real snug on the wall ! :thumbup:


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## vinpadalino (Aug 27, 2010)

I've used many of those with my last company. No problems with them at all. Cartridge is easy to install. Heavy duty valve. 
I haven't used them since starting my own company. But seeing that picture I might have to give them a call.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Will said:


> That's a huge hole.......I'd prefer to cut the Sheetrock if the option is available. How does the faceplate not leak with only those two screws securing it? Seems if it had a way to secure it further out on the faceplate would make since.


That faceplate is solid brass....... Not much flexibility in it. The back rim of the plate has a thick rubber seal as does the valve hole in the middle. Behind that wall was a freshly painted wall at the top of her stairs. I try not to do damage that requires the customer to have to fix something else in order to do my work. They appreciate it, for the most part.

I did have to cut the tile to access the piping, btw. What was there was an old single handle delta that the company before me twisted enough to cause a leak. They told her she would have to remove the tile or the drywall to replace the valve. She got a second opinion and saved a little money and aggravation in the process.:thumbsup:


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Cal said:


> The remodel plate has a large RUBBER ( not foam ) gasket. When you pull those screws down it gets real snug on the wall ! :thumbup:


Can we get a pic of the backside of the faceplate?


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Will said:


> Can we get a pic of the backside of the faceplate?


Yeah, I'll get one posted tomorrow.


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## PuttyTruck (Apr 28, 2013)

Redwood said:


> I get the big hole and the remodel plate...
> I rarely use them....
> 
> What was on the other wall behind that valve?
> I usually find a closet.... :whistling2:


Hey, who do you work for in CT? I'm from Bridgeport and looking to get back there someday.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

PuttyTruck said:


> Hey, who do you work for in CT? I'm from Bridgeport and looking to get back there someday.


Why are u here again,Putty??? U said before u weren't going to post again because you refused to do a proper introduction.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

rjbphd said:


> Why are u here again,Putty??? U said before u weren't going to post again because you refused to do a proper introduction.


Oh he hasn't done an intro yet?:blink:

:no:


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## crown36 (May 21, 2013)

What?! No pics of the new valve??


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

C'mon guys, we need intros and before and after pictures....sheeesh, standards are slipping....


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## crown36 (May 21, 2013)

Putty truck????? What a name! :laughing:


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Triplecrown24 said:


> Putty truck????? What a name! :laughing:


 







I have heard new construction plumbers condescendingly refer to service plumbers as driving a 'putty wagon.'...:laughing:


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Triplecrown24 said:


> What?! No pics of the new valve??


Sorry, here is one I did today.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Moen has updated their remodel plate a couple months back. Looks a lot like the wolverine brass one.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

SewerRatz said:


> Moen has updated their remodel plate a couple months back. Looks a lot like the wolverine brass one.


You have a part # on that? I only see the ugly one when I Google it.


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## HSI (Jun 3, 2011)

Putting the same valve and plate in tomorrow.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Plumb26 said:


> You have a part # on that? I only see the ugly one when I Google it.


I'll get it fir you Monday, I seen it my plumbing supply house when the rep was there showing it off.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> Moen has updated their remodel plate a couple months back. Looks a lot like the wolverine brass one.


Oh gwad I hope


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I'll diffidently have to check out the Moen remodel then. Here is one I did yesterday with the Delta remodel plate. There always ugly, but with out taking down the tile its the only option I offer since I won't install Wolverine Brass. And no I did not cut the dry wall, HO did. And yes that is a compression union on the riser to the shower head. I always use them there, and have 100% confidence they will last as long as the valve.


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## JDGA80 (Dec 9, 2012)

Tommy plumber said:


> I have heard new construction plumbers condescendingly refer to service plumbers as driving a 'putty wagon.'...:laughing:


That's funny. Almost as funny as the extra zeros in my bank account since I went from doing new construction for someone else to service work for myself.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Delta 17 Series...


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## younger-plumber (Sep 12, 2008)

im curious about the compression fitting? its cheaper to sweat a coupling isnt it? id think it;d be easier also not having to wrench it down and all.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

younger-plumber said:


> im curious about the compression fitting? its cheaper to sweat a coupling isnt it? id think it;d be easier also not having to wrench it down and all.


Just what I use and prefer in that situation.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> Delta 17 Series...


Do you chisel the tile with a hammer?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Plumb26 said:


> Do you chisel the tile with a hammer?


I use to just use a small, VERY sharp chisel. 

Now we usually cut it with a diamond blade on a grinder.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> I use to just use a small, VERY sharp chisel.
> 
> Now we usually cut it with a diamond blade on a grinder.


I use a rotozip with a tile cutting bit. Then beat the heck outta the center tiles until the mesh is the only thing left. Then I grab hold of it and snip it all out of the way. I have had almost a whole wall of tile fall right off the wall before. That's never a fun conversation.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Plumb26 said:


> I use a rotozip with a tile cutting bit. Then beat the heck outta the center tiles until the mesh is the only thing left. Then I grab hold of it and snip it all out of the way. I have had almost a whole wall of tile fall right off the wall before. That's never a fun conversation.


That's why we use the grinder instead of the chisel nowadays. Super quick with no impact. Especially nice when it is a thick mud wall rather than Durarock or drywall.


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## Letterrip (Jul 28, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> That's why we use the grinder instead of the chisel nowadays. Super quick with no impact. Especially nice when it is a thick mud wall rather than Durarock or drywall.


What do you do for dust control? Need an apprentice holding a wet/dry vac, or just figure on cleanup when you are done?


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

If possible I prefer to drill out the hole. Kicks up no dust. If that's not an option I'll cut it with a grinder and diamond wheel


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## JDGA80 (Dec 9, 2012)

Letterrip said:


> What do you do for dust control? Need an apprentice holding a wet/dry vac, or just figure on cleanup when you are done?


I think they have attachments for the roto-zip not sure though. I know Fein tools have attachments though


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Letterrip said:


> What do you do for dust control? Need an apprentice holding a wet/dry vac, or just figure on cleanup when you are done?


You can either duct tape the vac hose to the grinder / rotary tool or some rotary tools have vac attachment.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Wet grout sponge at the back of the wheel.


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## Letterrip (Jul 28, 2013)

The duct taped wet vac I can see. Would have to see the sponge to believe it. I would think that the sponge would quickly fill with dust unless you rinse it several times during the process. Either way, nice idea in a pinch.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Letterrip said:


> The duct taped wet vac I can see. Would have to see the sponge to believe it. I would think that the sponge would quickly fill with dust unless you rinse it several times during the process. Either way, nice idea in a pinch.


I'll video the next one for you. Works great.


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## victoryplbaz (May 19, 2012)

I totally forgot that wolverine sold that valve and face plate. Going to have to order one of chrome and stainless. I hate the one you normally see. I think they make the job look like a handy mans work. But the wolverine is the way to go.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

victoryplbaz said:


> I totally forgot that wolverine sold that valve and face plate. Going to have to order one of chrome and stainless. I hate the one you normally see. I think they make the job look like a handy mans work. But the wolverine is the way to go.


I think they both look like hammered dog crap,but unless the tile comes down its there only options. The WB face is nice, but the valve sucks. Pretty much the same as American Standard. Deltas remodel plate sucks but atleast the valve is good. I'd rather have a good valve and subpar face plate than the other way around. That's why I put in Delta. Now if Moen comes put with a remodel plate like WB, them I'll start installing Moen.


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## Plumb26 (May 18, 2013)

Will said:


> I think they both look like hammered dog crap,but unless the tile comes down its there only options. The WB face is nice, but the valve sucks. Pretty much the same as American Standard. Deltas remodel plate sucks but atleast the valve is good. I'd rather have a good valve and subpar face plate than the other way around. That's why I put in Delta. Now if Moen comes put with a remodel plate like WB, them I'll start installing Moen.


Delta, while they are ok valves, have problems just like all the others. I'll go as far as saying that I work on all series, makes, and models of Delta faucets more than any other brand. Maybe if Delta would find a way to eliminate the same springs and cups they've been using since they began, instead of finding new ways to package the spring and cup, they'll actually be making something called progress. You can call it "Diamond Seal" or whatever but, it's still builders grade crap.


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## Letterrip (Jul 28, 2013)

Plumb26 said:


> Delta, while they are ok valves, have problems just like all the others. I'll go as far as saying that I work on all series, makes, and models of Delta faucets more than any other brand. Maybe if Delta would find a way to eliminate the same springs and cups they've been using since they began, instead of finding new ways to package the spring and cup, they'll actually be making something called progress. You can call it "Diamond Seal" or whatever but, it's still builders grade crap.


Is that "diamond seal" their new cartridge? Haven't gotten to take one apart yet.


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## PathMaker (May 10, 2013)

Reading this thread and realized I got a WB catalog right next to me. Their part number out of the catalog is 8542903 for the oval chrome repair plate escutcheon. It sells separate from the valve.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Ok here is a pic of the new Moen remodler faucet. Model numbers are as follows

L2368EP Posi-Temp Shower Remodel kit
L2369EP Posi-Temp Tub/Shower
TL2368EP Chateau Shower trim kit - less valve
TL2369EP Chateau Tub/Shower trim kit - less valve


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## JDGA80 (Dec 9, 2012)

I will remember this!


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Btw I took the picture at 

Michael Wagner & Sons Inc
2321 Foster Ave, Wheeling, IL

For those that are local and want to see this.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Why crappy postitemp valve?? Moentrol are far much better.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

rjbphd said:


> Why crappy postitemp valve?? Moentrol are far much better.


I was not involved in the decision or development of the new remodeling kit.


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