# Overflow protection on toilet?



## Bill

http://www.penguintoilets.com/

Seen this at Lowes. Just wondering what happens when the toilet never overflows, what primes the trap?


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## NYC Plumber

The problem is if there ever is a stoppage **** will go down the overflow and smell and cause an unsanitary situation. I would never install that.


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## AlbacoreShuffle

They say at 1 min 42 seconds that the rinse feature flushes the over flow on every flush.

I'm looking at the bottom of that toilet and questioning how the wax ring is going to seal on an "oval " shaped connection.


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## NYC Plumber

I wouldn't get with any girl who had this toilet, thats all i know lol


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## RealCraftsMan

Only time will tell.


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## Redwood

Really not much point to them as 1.6 and 1.28 gallon per flush toilets won't overflow with a single flush anyway...

Not much need for the product unless you are dumb enough to flush a clogged toilet with a full bowl or a kid who clogged the toilet and is making waterfalls... :laughing:

Still being as they are now in Lowes they should sell well given the intelligence of the clientele...

Last I looked they didn't have a WaterSense or MaP Report rating...


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## MarkToo

Since OF aren't allowed on kitchen sinks, food prep sinks etc., I'm pretty sure this toilet wouldn't meet code for similar reasons. Also, that little OF trap wouldn't meet code requirements for trap volume/depth either.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Besides all that, anyone ever see a plugged toilet that wasn't also full of TP that would promptly cover that OF anyhow?

I'd like to meet whomever designed that mess.


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## DesertOkie

I bet the engineer who designed that wants us to forgive his student loans. At least the marketing guys will earn their $$.


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## Michaelcookplum

As much as you may dislike this, they are sold at lowes. The phone will be ringing soon for all of you to install these, did 1 last week. Had no issues setting with wax ring. I told the customer I had no info about the penguin. I don't have any complaints after installing one bygthe same token id never put one in my house. Enjoi fellow penguins!


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## MarkToo

Michaelcookplum said:


> As much as you may dislike this, they are sold at lowes. The phone will be ringing soon for all of you to install these, did 1 last week. Had no issues setting with wax ring. I told the customer I had no info about the penguin. I don't have any complaints after installing one bygthe same token id never put one in my house. Enjoi fellow penguins!



That's fine but, it's another item I'm adding to my "Will not install" list.

Sometimes it does not matter how much you try to educate a customer with products you don't supply, their memory gets short when things don't work the way the Lowes/Home Depot expert told them it would.

I have not yet lost a customer by refusing to install an item or fixture I feel has a design or functionality issue (and there's been many times). Some initially get a little ticked that I won't do exactly what they ask but, when I explain they are not just paying for me to turn a wrench but also for my experience and insight, they ultimately appreciate it.

It's a win win for me. The customer truly gets what they are paying me for and I don't get a call back where I have to convince a customer that it isn't/wasn't an install issue but a problem with the crap they bought.

I may be wrong about this particular toilet but, I'm willing to suffer the embarrassment if that turns out to be the case...


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## plbgbiz

Man oh man! Bill I really wish I had seen this before the radio show yesterday morning.

One of the callers asked about the new Penguin toilet with overflow protection she saw at Lowe's. I told here I wasn't familiar with it or the overflow protection it claimed to have. My recommendation was to stick with "known" brands such as Kohler and Toto.


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## OldSchool

How does that overflow trap stay primed 

Wouldn't it dry out if the over flow was never used in several years


NVM the above comment. I just watched the video and it get water every time it is flushed

They only thing I don't like is the drain outlet. 
Sent from my portable office....yes I am at work


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## PLUMBER_BILL

Bill said:


> http://www.penguintoilets.com/
> 
> Seen this at Lowes. Just wondering what happens when the toilet never overflows, what primes the trap?


This was topic on here before ... 2009

Even the Master was here. 

*New toilets with the built in overflow*


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## RealCraftsMan

I have to ask how many customers would not unstop the wc if it kept draining. We know the way some people are and they are going to keep shioting in it til its full of crap and then call. 

Went on a call the other day the tub valve had been running so long there was no spout left and there was almost a hole threw the tub, she was shocked when I told her it was unfixable....point is people are lazy arses.


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## plbgbiz

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> This was topic on here before ... 2009
> 
> Even the Master was here.
> 
> *New toilets with the built in overflow*


Nothing new under the sun.


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## Redwood

plbgbiz said:


> My recommendation was to stick with "known" brands such as Kohler and Toto.


I'd say that was good advice... :laughing:

What's next a rim for a car tire that has 2 valve stems? :laughing:


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## plbgbiz

Redwood said:


> I'd say that was good advice... :laughing:
> 
> What's next a rim for a car tire that has 2 valve stems? :laughing:


How about no valve stems. :thumbsup:

http://www.rhinotire.com/


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## Redwood

DesertOkie said:


> I bet the engineer who designed that wants us to forgive his student loans. At least the marketing guys will earn their $$.


Actually if remember right the idea was hatched by a couple of guys that owned a hotel that had vandals plug the toilets and flood the place...

One of the few applications where it might prove helpful...
Since a modern toilet when plugged has to be flushed intentionally a second time to overflow...

I believe they pitched the idea on a forum somewhere before they hit the big time at Lowes and were told don't quit the day job... :laughing:


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## Redwood

plbgbiz said:


> How about no valve stems. :thumbsup:
> 
> http://www.rhinotire.com/


Ahhh That obsolete technology...

You haven't heard about the Michelin Tweel yet have you.... :laughing:






This was announced in 2005 so shorten up the 15 years accordingly...


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## bizzybeeplumbin

wonder what happens when that secondary trap gets stopped up. I don't even think it will have a chance to get stopped up, those small "overflow" holes will stop up first.


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## Redwood

bizzybeeplumbin said:


> wonder what happens when that secondary trap gets stopped up. I don't even think it will have a chance to get stopped up, those small "overflow" holes will stop up first.


It uses those small holes at the back of the bowl but it also uses the holes under the rim as I recall....


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## bizzybeeplumbin

Redwood said:


> It uses those small holes at the back of the bowl but it also uses the holes under the rim as I recall....


Yeah, first nice toilet paper filled toilet stoppage and those holes will stop up. nice milkshake of poo rising to the rim, those little porcelin holes wont have a chance.


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## ChrisConnor

I have had enough calls for smells from lavatory bowl overflows. I can only imagine what this thing will be like. 

I had a customer call me about that particular type of toilet in the last few weeks. I told her that it hasn't passed my brand criteria yet, so they weren't recommended by us until then.


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## [email protected]

Here's a graphic from the penguin website showing how water enters the OF drain. I saw this in Lowes today and thought it was interesting. I would like to see test reports of performance and endorsements. I think just about any toilet can be clogged--even pressure assist models. I think the OF component gives a conscientious user a chance to avoid costly flood damage, especially for u/s locations.


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## Tommy plumber

I can't recommend them to my customers. Looks like they'll be working the bugs out for some time to come with that overflow trapway. Chris Connor made the point that lav drain overlfows get fouled with debris, so how will a similar design with a toilet not become fouled.


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## sandpiper plumb

Bill said:


> http://www.penguintoilets.com/
> 
> Seen this at Lowes. Just wondering what happens when the toilet never overflows, what primes the trap?


I seen a demonstration of this product and called IAPMO in regards to the testing and listing of this product. 

Every time the toilet is flushed a small amount of water jets the secondary drainline, maintaining the trap seal and sanitary conditions.

I asked if is water is counted in the 1.28gpf and IAPMO said yes.


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## sandpiper plumb

*It does meet code!*



MarkToo said:


> Since OF aren't allowed on kitchen sinks, food prep sinks etc., I'm pretty sure this toilet wouldn't meet code for similar reasons. Also, that little OF trap wouldn't meet code requirements for trap volume/depth either.
> 
> Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Besides all that, anyone ever see a plugged toilet that wasn't also full of TP that would promptly cover that OF anyhow?
> 
> I'd like to meet whomever designed that mess.


This toilet has a full listing by IAPMO and meets all requirements for code compliance. The overflow feature has a 2" trap which too had to be tested in order to get the listing. I believe if you watch the video on their website it would answer you question on the toilet paper. I recieved a copy of their listing and reviewed the test proceedures.


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## RealCraftsMan

You must work for them correct??


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## Caduceus

I also saw these at Lowe's and came home to search for the video. As others have stated, the primary design flaw for this system is that it relies on a second trap that is in no way service accessible. In the video you can see that the overflow trapway is inconsistent and once a piece of debris clogs it, the entire selling point of the feature is lost. That is another reason why it violates 'the minimum size of traps' section of most codes. Regular flushing directly from the tank is no guarantee that the overflow trap will not also clog.


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## justin

Crap! Junk! Scam to homeowners! Just another way to try and convince a homeowner that you can fill your house with plumbing appliances that are maintenance free. " you will never have to call a plumber again !!" I'm such a diick head to people at **** depot and lowes. Licensed individuals teaching others how to hack it up.


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## sandpiper plumb

RealCraftsMan said:


> You must work for them correct??


Nope, I came across these toilets a few years ago for a housing project.


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## azmike

Thats the dumbest thing I've seen yet!:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Catlin987987

Looks good for rental property, no massive damage from overflowing poo. Some suppliers are stocking them


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## jc-htownplumber

I'll stick with the cadet 3 toto drake 2 kohler cimmeron


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