# I've learned I'm not the best...



## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

So I've have 4 calls for rodding since I've gone to the service division. One was a 3" slop sink, finally got that to clear after way too long. The next was a main of unknown size with unknown fittings in a hospital. 8.5 hours later I got it clear with assistance from my partner who I woke up at midnight (he's also a lurker here... Hi Luke!) You should have seen that mess. Today I just got home from 2 rod jobs, first at the same hospital, different building. Sink stopped up, tried for 4 hours, nothing couldnt get through the galvanized fittings. Destroyed my drop head bulb. The next was a 4" fd in a mechanical room. That one I got easy since it appeared to be a styrafoam cup and some slurry or grout. 

Moral of this is that I'm not that good at rodding. 

Which one of you have the most k50 experience, I want to pick your brain.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

A lot of us have experience with the k-50. Myself, gear junkie, Tommy plumber. Perhaps I need to take a trip out there and help ha out and see a some new scenery in the process. Even make a stop at AJ Coleman!
I sent ya a PM


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

GOOD JOB... you have to get experience on those things,,,

I am a pro with the k50 smaller sewer machine but dont fool with the larger k-60 they take some getting used to. but are basically the same thing..

usually you can get through just about anything with a k50 by just stopping in mid grind and reversing the machine... and repeat the process a few times...... that always worked for me on most problems... 

Is the k50 big enough for the lines you are fooling with??/

I suggest if you are fooling around in a hospital, you better be extra careful what you breath and what you get into..double up on gloves and eye wear

hospitals are full of hepatitis c and other nasty things you dont want 
to get into... I suggest you get some booster shots...


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Don't know anything about the K50, but have used 9 different machines, all of them act different. All it takes is time to get to know how each one works and how to feel the line you're in. I remember when I first started taking 8+ hours to clear a drain. Sucks for everyone involved! Give it time, take every call you can, try and watch how you are going about things, how the cable is acting, how the drain feels and don't be afraid to try doing something different. One thing I learned, that works for me, but not everyone I know, is have a small kink at the end of my cable with or without blade. Some drains need a small kink, some need a more aggressive kink, almost a 90 degrees. Most employers I've worked for hated that as it puts an extra wear spot in the cable, but they shut up when they see how much quicker and better I can clean a drain with it.

Did your company just hand you the machine and send you to the first job or did you ride along and learn from someone?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

OpenSights said:


> Did your company just hand you the machine and send you to the first job or did you ride along and learn from someone?


This is huge!


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Get rid of the drop head. It's for special occasions only. Open up a bare end cable with your chisel and use that for gal.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

My bad, that kinda sounds like a dig at ya Flyout. If no hands on with someone, I'd say you're doing very well! I had two weeks before being pushed out of the nest and still took a good year or two to become dangerous, add another two or three to be able to walk in and out in a short time with the problem fixed or solved with what the next step is.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Clear your PM box Fly....


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

U were send to hospital for plumbing...???? Must be a really small one.. hospital usually have their in house crew with equipment and ' haz mat ' get up to protect themsleves.. be extra caution Flyout, we want you here for a long time..


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

Sorry Flyout! I can't post anything longer than a fewlines right now and yur inbox is full. If ya want call me sometime I can really dive you some good tips. I'm usually up till midnight my time watching hockey


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> Sorry Flyout! I can't post anything longer than a fewlines right now and yur inbox is full. If ya want call me sometime I can really dive you some good tips. I'm usually up till midnight my time watching hockey


Ya watching the WILD to win??? PTL!


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Quick tip on floor drains and mop sinks by using your six foot drop head toilet auger. Makes light work of hand towels and such stuck in the trap.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

Pm box free


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

rjbphd said:


> U were send to hospital for plumbing...???? Must be a really small one.. hospital usually have their in house crew with equipment and ' haz mat ' get up to protect themsleves.. be extra caution Flyout, we want you here for a long time..


Decent sized. They have house plumbers, but dont rod


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

Get yourself one of those bad azz reverse augers I hear they can open anything in no time flat !


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

OpenSights said:


> My bad, that kinda sounds like a dig at ya Flyout. If no hands on with someone, I'd say you're doing very well! I had two weeks before being pushed out of the nest and still took a good year or two to become dangerous, add another two or three to be able to walk in and out in a short time with the problem fixed or solved with what the next step is.


No it was good...
I think Flyout is a damn good plumber, I'm in awe at the work he has posted...:thumbup:
He knows he's good too...:yes:

But he's here saying, "Damn this drain cleaning stuff ain't easy. In fact it's kickin my azz."

He's right! It isn't easy and I'd go so far as to say it takes a full year before I'd consider a new drain cleaner to be worth anything. But he's here asking the right people for a chance to pick their brain and he'll master this like everything else he's done...:yes:

Flyout if you were using a drum I'd be all over so I've got to bow out and let the guys in that know sectionals. 

The advice I'll give you is get some phone numbers of the good guys here and be ready to call them when you need advice on the job. Maybe even set up Skype or a Google Hangout so you can video chat what is going on...

I use Skype & Google Hangout with the guys I work with and it really helps me to see what they are up against and offer advice.


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## Plumbducky (Jun 12, 2010)

Flyout95 said:


> So I've have 4 calls for rodding since I've gone to the service division. One was a 3" slop sink, finally got that to clear after way too long. The next was a main of unknown size with unknown fittings in a hospital. 8.5 hours later I got it clear with assistance from my partner who I woke up at midnight (he's also a lurker here... Hi Luke!) You should have seen that mess. Today I just got home from 2 rod jobs, first at the same hospital, different building. Sink stopped up, tried for 4 hours, nothing couldnt get through the galvanized fittings. Destroyed my drop head bulb. The next was a 4" fd in a mechanical room. That one I got easy since it appeared to be a styrafoam cup and some slurry or grout.
> 
> Moral of this is that I'm not that good at rodding.
> 
> Which one of you have the most k50 experience, I want to pick your brain.


What machine for the main?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

When you call me, we'll be discussing this photo.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

plumbducky said:


> what machine for the main?


k1500


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Call me when you have steam boiler questions!


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## Plumbducky (Jun 12, 2010)

So many things cross my mind with 8 hours on a main.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

Plumbducky said:


> So many things cross my mind with 8 hours on a main.


All that crossed mine was, "F¡%¢ this S&@#"


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

Flyout95 said:


> All that crossed mine was, "F¡%¢ this S&@#"


Don't worry man, yur doin fine. I will add that me first f**k up as a drain tech in which I was authorized to use the camera was ....wrapping the 11/16" cable around the entire 200' pushrod and snapping the camera head off in a deep cesspool. That was a $8,000 eff up.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

If your going horizontal to vertical in a 2" line, like down a tee, you have to go slow enough to make the cable end drop by gravity. I mean real real slow. That k50 doesn't help. So anything 2" should be a 5/16" but if it won't go, I'd do the 1/4". And make a kink about 2' past the end of the cable so that it will scrape the walls clean. A lot of times you just need to make a left or a right bend on the end of your cable. Sometimes a backward S. Sometimes reverse it in. It's normal to get frustrated/curse/spit at it. It's all just practice.


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## saysflushable (Jun 15, 2009)

if I could post pictures I would show you so much scrap cable I have on my garage floor. Im a bit of a slob so it has been here awhile. however I have taken a bunch to the scrap yard, But I still have a ton laying all over. Not to mention all the splices I have put in my drum machines. It amazes me. It was a hard learning curve. Plenty of guys here will help with technique.

Ill help with attitude, You just got to make it happen. do what you got to do to get that cable to the blockage, If somebody else can do it so can you. Think about why the cable isnt progressing and try something different. If need be take a break and get after it again. If you dont have training you are going to turn a lot of cable into knots. so be it, thats the cost your boss has to pay for not training you. If you have have zero training and you arent destroying cable then you arent trying hard enough. 

dang I sound like the zig ziglar of drain cleaning.


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## wharfrat (Nov 1, 2014)

First drain cleaning advice I received was to, "put my head on the end of the cable."

It helped. I think drain cleaning is all feel. Feeling how much torque has built up on the cable, feeling fittings and feeling when something ain't right. Feeling when you have entered a larger pipe or feeling when the cable has flipped. Feeling a running trap or a broken line is important also.

Listening too. Sometimes You can hear the cable in a vent or in another floor drain.

Knowing how to repair your machine and cable in the field is very important too. It can save a lot of time.

I think it just takes time to develop your style. It will come...


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

rjbphd said:


> Ya watching the WILD to win??? PTL!


Absolutely......not! :laughing: hoping for a Kings loss!


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## affordabledrain (Nov 24, 2009)

AssTyme said:


> Get yourself one of those bad azz reverse augers I hear they can open anything in no time flat !


They do open a lot of lines


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## Drain Pro (Nov 3, 2013)

Flyout95 said:


> So I've have 4 calls for rodding since I've gone to the service division. One was a 3" slop sink, finally got that to clear after way too long. The next was a main of unknown size with unknown fittings in a hospital. 8.5 hours later I got it clear with assistance from my partner who I woke up at midnight (he's also a lurker here... Hi Luke!) You should have seen that mess. Today I just got home from 2 rod jobs, first at the same hospital, different building. Sink stopped up, tried for 4 hours, nothing couldnt get through the galvanized fittings. Destroyed my drop head bulb. The next was a 4" fd in a mechanical room. That one I got easy since it appeared to be a styrafoam cup and some slurry or grout.
> 
> Moral of this is that I'm not that good at rodding.
> 
> Which one of you have the most k50 experience, I want to pick your brain.



The most important thing is to keep asking questions. Just the fact that you posted on here and acknowledged that you're not the best is a huge step in the right direction. Keep your nose to the grind. You'll be just fine.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

The real key is patience. It will never be as easy as any of us make it sound. The cool pictures are usually after a lot of hard work.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Good luck Padawan , it will take a year for you to get a real feel for it and become a Jedi lol . It's never easy ESPECIALLY in commercial work because you're dealing with plumbing that is used a 100 to a 1000x times more than a house. Wait till you get your grease cherry popped lol . Welcome to the brotherhood of cable and hose, doesn't matter if it's drum,sectional or jetter . There's times we all want to pull our ****ing hair out. My guys just got done with a grease monster at a store Saturday night , it took three nights to get through it. The grease line was Solidly packed for 150' . Had my Spartan 1065 beating on it with very little effect. Ended up cutting in two way cleanouts about 100' down from the end of the line. At the end of it all we figured out that the deli/bakery floor drains weren't on the grease line lol, they were on the CWV line, oops . Just keep at it and don't give up ,you haven't even gotten to fun stuff yet like double combo's and sancrosses . Ask questions on here and plenty of guys to help you. You might figure out you like a drum machine better than sectional .


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

Nathan said:


> That shouldn't be a problem. I was going to post a photo of the magazine once it comes out. But maybe people should have a heads up so they know to look for it.


Found a double combo and a cross. Found my rod coming up on a cleanout on the other side of the building.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

Flyout95 said:


> Found a double combo and a cross. Found my rod coming up on a cleanout on the other side of the building.


Thought double combo is not allowed in state of Chicago..


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

rjbphd said:


> Thought double combo is not allowed in state of Chicago..


When there is an argument between the code and the ditch, the ditch usually wins.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Flyout95 said:


> Found a double combo and a cross. Found my rod coming up on a cleanout on the other side of the building.


Thats where those bent whips in Plbgbiz's picture will come in handy, the rod just hates to make turns especially the ones you want it to make... :laughing:

Those @#%$ing new construction guys...
Some of the shiot they do just flat out pizzes us service plumbers off...:laughing:

When you one day land back on a jobsite doing new construction again, you'll be a changed man because of this experience. When you see fittings being used that would take an act of gawd to be able to find direction through it with a snake, when you see a floor cleanout buried so deeply in the floor that there is little hope of anyone ever opening it, or a wall cleanout so high above the floor it would take 4 hands to control the cable when using it you'll be a tyrant on the jobsite...:yes:

*One word of advice I'll give you is when a job is kicking your butt hard and you've been throwing everything you have at it for a couple of hours, stop! Just stop! Take a break! Don't even think about it! Take a walk... Step outside... Have a drink... Have a smoke... Walk in a circle...

Just clear the mind and relax a moment...

Then go back into battle, start thinking about what you are up against, and how to overcome it...

You'll find that most often, right after taking that break, you'll have your AhHah Breakthrough Moment...*


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Redwood said:


> Thats where those bent whips in Plbgbiz's picture will come in handy, the rod just hates to make turns especially the ones you want it to make... :laughing:
> 
> Those @#%$ing new construction guys...
> Some of the shiot they do just flat out pizzes us service plumbers off...:laughing:
> ...


Words of wisdom right there!

My last boss had a tendency of being a bit of a hothead when things didn't go right the first or third time. Him being the Master and myself the Apprentice, he quickly learned that when I said, let me give it a shot, it was time for him to take a break. Sometimes it was five minutes of struggling and getting PO'd, some times an hour... about the time he'd start cursing in grandma's house was my time to step in the beginning, then I never let it get that far when I saw the Hulk emerging. (Don't get me wrong, he's a great guy, brother jarhead, and still a good friend! And un-F'd my bad habits from the last guy I worked for.)

Redwood is right about new construction plumbers! When you are skilled in not just plumbing, but service and drain cleaning, you stop thinking about "What's the quickest, most cost effective way to do this job so it'll pass and collect?" and start thinking of "When this line backs up, or this will eventually need repair/replacement, what can I do to make it not a nightmare when I'm called back?". Sure, it may be years in the future, it may be three weeks after a family moves into a new build.

This is a great thread! Tons of good info from people who I can tell know what they're talking about, and have picked up some new tools/ideas for my brain bucket to think about.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

OpenSights said:


> Words of wisdom right there!
> 
> 
> 
> Redwood is right about new construction plumbers! When you are skilled in not just plumbing, but service and drain cleaning, you stop thinking about "What's the quickest, most cost effective way to do this job so it'll pass and collect?" and start thinking of "When this line backs up, or this will eventually need repair/replacement, what can I do to make it not a nightmare when I'm called back?". Sure, it may be years in the future, it may be three weeks after a family moves into a new build.


My father painted a very vivid picture for me. He said, "Consider the guy behind you. He might very well be you".


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Plumbus said:


> My father painted a very vivid picture for me. He said, "Consider the guy behind you. He might very well be you".


You mean you don't backfill with concrete and trash after a basement bust up? LOL!


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