# Pex to dishwasher



## copperhead

Does anyone run pex to dishwasher and if so, what do you use to connect to dishwasher? I see online now they sell a 1/2" PEX x 3/8" MPT Brass Dishwasher Elbow. Pex would be cheaper than a 4 or 5' braided supply.


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## beachplumber

I,ve thougt about it. Most dw seem to have hose thread now.

It wouldn,t pull out as well

I asuume u know of the 3/8 comoresion pex crap and were referring to 1/2 pex


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## Mississippiplum

Copper or a braided hose, they are the strongest and most durable.


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## beachplumber

I,ve tried to find 20'lengths of braded hose to save on couplings,but can,t find a decent supplier.

Its seems it would be better to run in the walls tan PEX


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## Protech

I have installed 3/8"od pex on hundreds of dishwashers without problems. It must be done right or it will blow out. No dope on the plastic ferrel. Crank it down ALL the way. Make sure the pex is fully inserted into the fitting as you tighten it.


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## rocksteady

Protech said:


> I have installed 3/8"od pex on hundreds of dishwashers without problems. It must be done right or it will blow out. No dope on the plastic ferrel. Crank it down ALL the way. Make sure the pex is fully inserted into the fitting as you tighten it.


Also, don't forget to use an insert in the pex.





Paul


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## stillaround

You dont need an insert on 3/8 od pex with a plastic ferrule( in my experience)....but inserts are in general a good idea. We have also done hundreds in residential new work and roger that tighten down all the way....


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## Bayside500

i have installed thousands of 3/8" pex supplies in my time, use a poly ferrule and no dope, tighten securely and walk away.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

When you have a plumber putting in a less than $2.00 component against a $7 to $10 braided stainless steel supply that you can tell is of good quality,


Who has the better representation of themselves as a plumber and plumbing company.



I already know the answer.


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## stillaround

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> When you have a plumber putting in a less than $2.00 component against a $7 to $10 braided stainless steel supply that you can tell is of good quality,
> 
> 
> Who has the better representation of themselves as a plumber and plumbing company.
> 
> 
> 
> I already know the answer.


 No you dont :laughing:......

Ok, your game...
Mrs Smith see this beautiful kitchen....
Yes, the cabinets are lovely and the tile is divine.....would you please undo the 4 little black screws from the bottom of the dishwasher and expose the supply line....I like to know that a quality plumber did my house and used stainless steel braided supplies.....oooh, they look soooo professional


The moment you walked thru the door , I could tell you were a man of distinction .......:whistling2:...Hey big spender>>>>>>>


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## rocksteady

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> When you have a plumber putting in a less than $2.00 component against a $7 to $10 braided stainless steel supply that you can tell is of good quality,
> 
> 
> Who has the better representation of themselves as a plumber and plumbing company.
> 
> 
> 
> I already know the answer.


As a point of habit, I install braided supply lines for dishwashers most of the time. That said, I have seen braided lines burst but I have never seen a piece of pex burst. If it's installed correctly, the chance of failure is probably less than a pre-assembled braided hose.




Paul


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## 504Plumber

Show of hands, who has seen what a poisoned rodent does to a dishwasher drain hose? Ever seen a rodent chew through copper or a braided hose?


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## RealLivePlumber

Is it really that much more money?

I mean , my God.


And yes, I use 3/8 copper.


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## stillaround

504Plumber said:


> Show of hands, who has seen what a poisoned rodent does to a dishwasher drain hose? Ever seen a rodent chew through copper or a braided hose?


spoiled sport.....and what is a rodent doing in the kitchen,


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## stillaround

RealLivePlumber said:


> Is it really that much more money?
> 
> I mean , my God.
> 
> 
> And yes, I use 3/8 copper.


 Yeth it ith more money:laughing:...and multiply it by 100 houtheth each year and that could pay for a brand new fishing reel:laughing:


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## 504Plumber

Is this the same argument some plumbers use to justify not putting a female adapter for the hosebib? I mean c'mon, what's an extra $5-10 on a $15,000 job... Also, is the markup on pex higher than the markup on a braided hose?


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## stillaround

Thinking new construction is slightly different than service....In service you charge for the part ..usually( I use braided )... In new its bid in and saving $100 on a house that is $7000 is not considered petty....and pex d/w supply is not the cheap out area.....all cpvc adapters no brass, and cpvc valves are a sign of schlok


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## 504Plumber

stillaround said:


> Thinking new construction is slightly different than service....In service you charge for the part ..usually( I use braided )... In new its bid in and saving $100 on a house that is $7000 is not considered petty....and pex d/w supply is not the cheap out area.....all cpvc adapters no brass, and cpvc valves are a sign of schlok


thank god we don't have hardly any cpvc down here, probably would have shot myself by now.


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## Mississippiplum

504Plumber said:


> thank god we don't have hardly any cpvc down here, probably would have shot myself by now.


This place is plumbed to the high heavens with cpvc, i live in a house with cpvc, luckily I haven't had problems yet, all the post 1998 houses here have cpvc. Believe it or not it holds up ok here if it's installed right, my house was plumbed well, so I'm one of the lucky ones.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

stillaround said:


> No you dont :laughing:......
> 
> Ok, your game...
> Mrs Smith see this beautiful kitchen....
> Yes, the cabinets are lovely and the tile is divine.....would you please undo the 4 little black screws from the bottom of the dishwasher and expose the supply line....I like to know that a quality plumber did my house and used stainless steel braided supplies.....oooh, they look soooo professional
> 
> 
> The moment you walked thru the door , I could tell you were a man of distinction .......:whistling2:...Hey big spender>>>>>>>


 

You missed the point.


I utilize Watts, or Fluidmaster stainless steel supply lines. Watts has a very tight woven braid on their stainless steel mesh pattern, unlike Fluidmaster. 


I'm persuaded to use Fluidmaster because the the connecting ends are the best I've seen in plumbing.


The bottom line,


If I choose to put the cheapest parts possible in my hands, conveying that attitude to my customers provides a whiplash effect. As many plastic products I deal with that go bust in the night (just got back from a job that did just that) and think that I'm not going to protect that position...


I'm not going to be in business long. People have a degree of expectation that I'm investing in them as much as they are investing in me. I should afford them the best products I can get my hands on.

This is how I beat my competition, and I don't care if they are making $5 more a call because they threw in cheaper product than I.

I run by old school design completely and it'll stay that way until I retire. 

Watching this profession switch gears to simplicity and temporary is the unbecoming of this trade.


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## Redwood

beachplumber said:


> I,ve tried to find 20'lengths of braded hose to save on couplings,but can,t find a decent supplier.
> 
> Its seems it would be better to run in the walls tan PEX


You can put those in walls?


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## beachplumber

Mpeepee said it was stronger than 1/2" pex.


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## stillaround

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> You missed the point.
> 
> 
> I utilize Watts, or Fluidmaster stainless steel supply lines. Watts has a very tight woven braid on their stainless steel mesh pattern, unlike Fluidmaster.
> 
> 
> I'm persuaded to use Fluidmaster because the the connecting ends are the best I've seen in plumbing.
> 
> 
> The bottom line,
> 
> 
> If I choose to put the cheapest parts possible in my hands, conveying that attitude to my customers provides a whiplash effect. As many plastic products I deal with that go bust in the night (just got back from a job that did just that) and think that I'm not going to protect that position...
> 
> 
> I'm not going to be in business long. People have a degree of expectation that I'm investing in them as much as they are investing in me. I should afford them the best products I can get my hands on.
> 
> This is how I beat my competition, and I don't care if they are making $5 more a call because they threw in cheaper product than I.
> 
> I run by old school design completely and it'll stay that way until I retire.
> 
> Watching this profession switch gears to simplicity and temporary is the unbecoming of this trade.


 I usually dont miss points..maybe dodge but I see them coming....if you had said copper only I could believe the commitment to old school whatever...but I think you are just tweaking yourself....people dont measure your company...certainly not mine..by the d/w supply I use....and if using braided stuff is what gives you the swagger you need to uphold the legacy...then thats sicko:laughing:..........especially since there are people here who have put more pex d/w supplies in than you will ever see in your lifetime without losing it all:thumbup:


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## Protech

99.9% of customers want a guarantee that it won't leak and that's it.

I prefer to use 4 layer stainless steel braided lines when practical though due to idiot proofing. It's just to easy for an employee to flip a ferrel or forget to tighten it all the way. A SS line will just drip if installed wrong, a pex line will blow off and flood a place with a quickness if not installed correctly.

Pex is more resistant to chemicals though. It's the old story, the right material for the right application.


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## Widdershins

I like the braided supplies for appliances.

I've hooked up a few that had integral PEX supplies (flared with a tiny Supplier provided 3/8" O-Ring). I don't feel so good about those installations.

I'm sold on PEX, but that doesn't mean I'm sold on the OEM connections.


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## HOMER

I have only run copper or braided..

forgive my ignorance please,

are you using pre fab supply hoses that are made out of pex and adding a plastic ferrule and nut at one end , 

or are you cutting it off a roll and adding nut and ferrule at both ends ?

if so, which type of pex do you use ?


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## HOMER

Widdershins said:


> I like the braided supplies for appliances.
> 
> I've hooked up a few that had integral PEX supplies (flared with a tiny Supplier provided 3/8" O-Ring). I don't feel so good about those installations.
> 
> I'm sold on PEX, but that doesn't mean I'm sold on the OEM connections.


 
which PEX system are you sold on ?
sorry .what PEX system are you currently using ?


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## Protech

HOMER said:


> I have only run copper or braided..
> 
> forgive my ignorance please,
> 
> are you using pre fab supply hoses that are made out of pex and adding a plastic ferrule and nut at one end ,
> 
> or are you cutting it off a roll and adding nut and ferrule at both ends ?
> 
> if so, which type of pex do you use ?


that


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## Widdershins

HOMER said:


> I have only run copper or braided..
> 
> forgive my ignorance please,
> 
> are you using pre fab supply hoses that are made out of pex and adding a plastic ferrule and nut at one end ,
> 
> or are you cutting it off a roll and adding nut and ferrule at both ends ?
> 
> if so, which type of pex do you use ?


 There are a few manufacturers who's appliances come with PEX supplies right out of the box.

Miele, Bosch and Fisher/Paykells are the standouts.


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## Widdershins

Protech said:


> that


 Never.

I threw out all of the 3/8" expansion heads that shipped with our Wirsbo expander tools.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

stillaround said:


> I usually dont miss points..maybe dodge but I see them coming....if you had said copper only I could believe the commitment to old school whatever...but I think you are just tweaking yourself....people dont measure your company...certainly not mine..by the d/w supply I use....and if using braided stuff is what gives you the swagger you need to uphold the legacy...then thats sicko:laughing:..........especially since there are people here who have put more pex d/w supplies in than you will ever see in your lifetime without losing it all:thumbup:


 

We've reached agreement then:


You stick to $2 simplicity and I'll operate with $10 quality. 


I have seen too many supply lines blow off, snap at the ferrule, split in a hard turn, pinched in a dishwasher installation. 


It's not how many times you do something, it's how much you contribute to the trade and how much your knowledge is valued in this profession that builds the gain.


I market myself to others unwillingness to put the best in. 


"See this pipe right here Mr/Mrs. Customer? The plumber who installed it is no longer around. That's why I'm here. They put the cheapest product available in your house because they don't expect to come back. This is how my business increases by noting the fault and correcting by change."

^^^^ 

Powerful words.


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## Protech

Widdershins said:


> Never.
> 
> I threw out all of the 3/8" expansion heads that shipped with our Wirsbo expander tools.


To each his own but.....I have thousands of those type of connections installed with 25 years warranties and may magnets stuck everywhere. I've had ONE pop due to an idiot plumber installing it wrong. I fired the plumber, not the material.


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## HOMER

Widdershins said:


> Never.
> 
> I threw out all of the 3/8" expansion heads that shipped with our Wirsbo expander tools.


 
propex, thanks


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## Widdershins

Protech said:


> To each his own but.....I have thousands of those type of connections installed with 25 years warranties and may magnets stuck everywhere. I've had ONE pop due to an idiot plumber installing it wrong. I fired the plumber, not the material.


 I'm not arguing with you.

I'm sold on PEX, remember?

My only issue with PEX as an appliance supply is the reduced ID of the supply.


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## Widdershins

HOMER said:


> propex, thanks


 Propex is what allows me to be competitive.

It's pretty much the only plastic product/system I would install in my own home.


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## Bayside500

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> We've reached agreement then:
> 
> 
> You stick to $2 simplicity and I'll operate with $10 quality.
> 
> 
> I have seen too many supply lines blow off, snap at the ferrule, split in a hard turn, pinched in a dishwasher installation.
> 
> 
> It's not how many times you do something, it's how much you contribute to the trade and how much your knowledge is valued in this profession that builds the gain.
> 
> 
> I market myself to others unwillingness to put the best in.
> 
> 
> "See this pipe right here Mr/Mrs. Customer? The plumber who installed it is no longer around. That's why I'm here. They put the cheapest product available in your house because they don't expect to come back. This is how my business increases by noting the fault and correcting by change."
> 
> ^^^^
> 
> Powerful words.


holy shiet dude, get over your self, 

i mean a fancy rubber hose over pex for a supply line, really ?


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## express

I have to jump in and add my 2 cents. My company installs about 200 DW a year.

1. copper can not handle some of the tight spaces that are under the new DW
2. braided is what the stores sell to the customers, and I'm required to install. I have had a couple leak.
3. 3/8 pex on a roll with plastic Ferrell is my Favorite. ( cut open braided and you will see pex inside) No call backs on pex.

If a rodent chews through the water line, not my problem. They chew through wood should we get rid of wood?

With braided or pex, I can attach to the DW first and make my final connection under the sink last


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## stillaround

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> We've reached agreement then:
> 
> 
> You stick to $2 simplicity and I'll operate with $10 quality.
> 
> 
> I have seen too many supply lines blow off, snap at the ferrule, split in a hard turn, pinched in a dishwasher installation.
> 
> 
> It's not how many times you do something, it's how much you contribute to the trade and how much your knowledge is valued in this profession that builds the gain.
> 
> 
> I market myself to others unwillingness to put the best in.
> 
> 
> "See this pipe right here Mr/Mrs. Customer? The plumber who installed it is no longer around. That's why I'm here. They put the cheapest product available in your house because they don't expect to come back. This is how my business increases by noting the fault and correcting by change."
> 
> ^^^^
> 
> Powerful words.


I can see that working....there is a guy around here who was not so great and he undercut either because he didnt know what to charge or needed the job...later on he started to market himself as I'm not the cheapest...and it helped his business......I think he was taken more seriously


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

Google "Terrible Discoveries Albums" and you'll find me, my plastic pipe and fitting atrocities and many many discussions since 2002 where I took the high road.


What works for me may not work for you. I'm not special... I just care a little more than some of you. 

Kapish? 

Kapish.



Wow, 1st on google with 1.8 million results. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!


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## Tommy plumber

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Google "Terrible Discoveries Albums" and you'll find me, my plastic pipe and fitting atrocities and many many discussions since 2002 where I took the high road.
> 
> 
> What works for me may not work for you. I'm not special... I just care a little more than some of you.
> 
> Kapish?
> 
> Kapish.
> 
> 
> 
> Wow, 1st on google with 1.8 million results. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!


 




I just searched, and it said site unavailable due to site maintenance.


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## Protech

express said:


> I have to jump in and add my 2 cents. My company installs about 200 DW a year.
> 
> 1. copper can not handle some of the tight spaces that are under the new DW
> 2. braided is what the stores sell to the customers, and I'm required to install. I have had a couple leak.
> 3. 3/8 pex on a roll with plastic Ferrell is my Favorite. ( cut open braided and you will see pex inside) No call backs on pex.
> 
> *If a rodent chews through the water line, not my problem. They chew through wood should we get rid of wood?*
> 
> With braided or pex, I can attach to the DW first and make my final connection under the sink last


That's what I'm saying. They chew through PVC and CPVC as well. They damn sure chew through romex cables, should we get rid of those? If you have disease carrying vermin running around get rid of them! They piss and sh!t everywhere, a water leak is the last thing I'd be worried about!


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## plbgbiz

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> ....Wow, 1st on google with 1.8 million results. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET!!!


I hate to burst your bubble Mr. D but Google isn't that predictable or simple. That number one result on Google took into account your ISP, the part of town you live in (depending on the quality of your ISP), your Google search habits, and countless secret algorithms that make your search results vary a little bit from your neighbor and sometimes not even closely related to an identical search on a computer 20 miles away on a different ISP.

But if your whole geographical area is getting you as number one then that's very impressive. :thumbup:


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## plbgbiz

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> ....The bottom line,
> ....I run by old school design completely and it'll stay that way until I retire.....


OLD SCHOOL stainless supplies?!?! :laughing::laughing:

Here's some old school we replaced with stainless supplies over the weekend. Upstairs wood decking and a museum of a den downstairs ruined. Any given product can fail on any given day. :yes:


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## gitnerdun

SS dishwasher supplies are for HOs and inexperienced helpers IMO. Sorry Dunbar, a solid pipe is more profesional.

SS supplies are simple and easy period.


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## Plumb Bob

I prefer copper for connecting DW. I prefer to keep my pex in the walls (that is propex).

You guys that are using pex for dishwasher supplies are probably the same guys that are stubbing pex out of the walls under cabinets. What a flimsy A** angle stop! But you saved a few bucks on a copper stub out and a pex adapter.

Quality does count and will help your buisiness to succeed


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## AlbacoreShuffle

plbgbiz said:


> I hate to burst your bubble Mr. D but Google isn't that predictable or simple. That number one result on Google took into account your ISP, the part of town you live in (depending on the quality of your ISP), your Google search habits, and countless secret algorithms that make your search results vary a little bit from your neighbor and sometimes not even closely related to an identical search on a computer 20 miles away on a different ISP.
> 
> But if your whole geographical area is getting you as number one then that's very impressive. :thumbup:


I googled it here in Idaho and It did come up in the number one spot.
Theres some entertaining pictures in there.


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## plbgbiz

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> I googled it here in Idaho and It did come up in the number one spot.
> Theres some entertaining pictures in there.


My apologies to Mr. D. It happened here as well.:blush:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

AlbacoreShuffle said:


> I googled it here in Idaho and It did come up in the number one spot.
> Theres some entertaining pictures in there.


 

The only issue is this:


No one, I mean no one will search by keywords "Terrible Discoveries Album" ever. 


So it's value is devalued, except for this thread of course which counts for everything. :laughing:


I checked it logged out of google and my temp files erased... still came up #1.

As I said, means nothing in the big picture of plumbing. Just proves how cheap plumbing is commonly used by plumbers which gives me a job every time.

We used to run copper for dishwashers all the time. #1 leak was at the connections, always. I've never had a high end stainless steel flex supply for a dishwasher ever leak, and I'm sold on its value. 

It's nice to connect that supply and be able to push it back without much effort. 


With copper, you have to watch the back or have it already installed, fishing it to the front left corner.

I've had calls for leaks at that compression connection... and that's a strike against copper, dare I say.


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## stillaround

I do it my way
Well I do it the right way
I do it the good old way
I do it the new improved way
There is no new improved way
I do it howe customers want
I do it how my future customers want
I do it the way most plumbers say
I do it the way real plumbers say
Do not
I do it the plumbingzone way
Which way is that
See above


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## Widdershins

Jeebus Cripes. . . . .

Just cinch it up and move on.

Y'all wouldn't believe the different ways I've hooked up dish washers over the years.

1/2" OD

1/2" ID

Soft copper.

Rigid copper.

Type K.

Type L.

Braided.

Push fittings.

Compression fittings.

Flared fittings.

The list goes on. . . . .

Y'all want to know what really matters? -- It's being able to walk away from an installation and still get a good nights sleep.

I have enough things keeping me awake at night -- The very last thing I need is an installation practice that intrudes upon my dreams and jars me awake. I need my 'beauty sleep'. Trust me, I need my beauty sleep.

The reality is you need to stick with the tried and proven, essentially what makes you feel comfortable.

What makes me comfortable these days are braided supplies with a compressible brass insert -- No O-Rings or compressible cone washers.

Soft copper and brass ferrules will accomplish the same task -- Unfortunately, they will, over time, succumb to incipient hammering every time that solenoid slams open and slams shut.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING

*I'm going to rag on soft copper for a minute*

As much as I like copper I have to say that those humbling years "in the beginning" were not the best.


Bending toilet supplies, lav supplies between two fixed positions were never easy... sometimes they'd kink.


The chrome type? Discoloring from the go, urine and household chemicals always made what should look new for some time, look rough.


The connections almost always leaked at the compression connections to the valve. 

The green patina always gave it away. 

Seeing that the ferrule collapsed the piping on both sides of the ferrule indicated that overtighteining was the direct result to stop a leak, most times.


As when stainless steel supply lines came out, the flexible types, I was hesitant, waited to see if their life would be short. 

Now, it's common, very common. You can buy a high grade braided line which I make a point of purchasing. A toilet supply line I bought, 12" was $6.49. 

When I'm charging $8 or $10 for that line, it's expected. If you're charging that much for that same line in PEX, shame on you. 



F-ing hilarious this topic is about defending the cheap ass products of plumbing and not what's the best that money can buy for added benefit to the customer.

I run 1500psi through these same stainless steel flexible supply lines.





 

I'd say that's a hell of a testament.


Why would anyone trust water pressure of any kind to a two dollar component.


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## Mississippiplum

Trying to loosen the compression nut on a stop for a copper supply line, pex, etc. Is a pain in the arse when the stub out Is cpvc. Talking bout some some scary stuff.


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