# Pex spaghetti repipe (no copperholics allowed)



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Let’s see if this thread makes it to 100 posts before Ron shuts it down.......


Some shots of the attic of a repipe we just did.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

one more


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

#1

There, I did my part. I like spaghetti.

Ron, please don't shut it down. Easy Ron, down boy. Good mod.......


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Protech said:


> Let’s see if this thread makes it to 100 posts before Ron shuts it down.......
> 
> 
> Some shots of the attic of a repipe we just did.


 
SWeet.....


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## leak1 (Mar 25, 2009)

looking at that makes me like copper more and more then ever!:thumbup: know what i mean vern?


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## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

Why no red and blue? is white less expensive?


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

No. It's just a pain to keep both colors stocked. I do color code on "premium" repipes. This was an economy job.



Tankless said:


> Why no red and blue? is white less expensive?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

I'm a pex man, why should I shut it down. :laughing:
Thread Is Closed.​


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## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> I'm a pex man, why should I shut it down. :laughing:
> 
> Thread Is Closed.​


 
Ron are you still using the SS clamps, or did you go to the dark side with the copper rings?


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## uaplumber (Jun 16, 2008)

One word, UPONOR.


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## leak1 (Mar 25, 2009)

copper rings!!!! did i hear somebody say copper?:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

For now I am, there are going to phase them out at the end of the year and go with the newer rings, the ones that won't slip down the pipe, the ones that have the top collar on the end them, oh and there is a new zurn pex emerging, it will be able to hold it's shape when bent, higher uv rating also, I'll get more details and post in a new thread over the next few days


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*what kind of pex is that???*

I see the white stuff everywhere. 
with those ****ty black steel rings..

what kind of pex is that, anyway....????,

I am sort of scared of the brass tees lasting anytime at all.

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now for your veiwing pleasure

here is the good --top of the line---Wirsbo stuff installed a cheap dump.
useing the black plastic tees and black manifolds.

I will trust Wirsbo over all the rest with the black plastic fittings......

 

 and here is a manifold that turned out nice


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Oh and did you know Zurn now has pipe and fittings up to 2" in size, and it does use the copper ring for it, the crimp head can attach to the ridgid propess, but you probably already knew this right?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> I am sort of scared of the brass tees lasting anytime at all.


There bringing in a new plastic fitting, had a demo of it at our shop, a week or so ago, they showed how you could not break it if you really tried, that even took a hammer to it, it would only warp it but it never would break or crack. 

The pex pipe there going to stock can be kept outside for a max of 6 months, so it is the highest UV protected pipe on the market.

We can thank CA for this.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Why do people think the black copper crimp rings are steel all the time? I've never used anything but copper crimp rings on any crimp pipe.....including polybutylene. I've had the same crimper for about 20 years. Still works great.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Who thinks that TM?


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Been using brass pex fittings in central Florida now for over 10 years. Not a single failure. Better get out of the plumbing industry if you are afraid of brass.



Master Mark said:


> I see the white stuff everywhere.
> with those ****ty black steel rings..
> 
> what kind of pex is that, anyway....????,
> ...


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

The only nitpick I can do is your strapping. I like the sioux chief style that grips the pipe all round and not just from the top. Looks alright other than that. Nothing to brag about but alright.


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

UAPlumber called it IMO, UPONER has it hands down. Protech, years ago I heard of a freeze on the Florida Orange Crop...Are those PEX lines getting insulated? Also, any and all, what are your thoughts on the EP fittings???


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

No insulation.

I have a tough time trusting plastic fittings. I do have to admit that I have never seen a glass impregnated polysulphone fitting fail. I'ver just seen so many plastic fittings crack (pvc, cpvc, acetyl insert fittings) that I'm gun shy of plastic fittings. Again, I have NEVER seen a glass impregnated polysulphone fitting fail. I guess it an unreasonable fear. Brass has always worked in this area without problems so why mess with a good thing. There are parts of the country where copper lasts just fine with no pinholes so that’s what everyone uses. Same logic here, pex with brass holds up great here so that’s what I use.



M5Plumb said:


> UAPlumber called it IMO, UPONER has it hands down. Protech, years ago I heard of a freeze on the Florida Orange Crop...Are those PEX lines getting insulated? Also, any and all, what are your thoughts on the EP fittings???


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*what brand are you useing???*



Protech said:


> Been using brass pex fittings in central Florida now for over 10 years. Not a single failure. Better get out of the plumbing industry if you are afraid of brass.


All I asked you was what kind of pex that white stuff is , 

and what kind of brass fittings are they that you use....

and *YES I am a great big pussey* when it comes to the brass becasue of all the horror stories and Nightmares in Nevada, and Minnesota.....

their are a lot of large plumbers ---50 truck companies in Nevada ----now bankrupt-
 that have been SUED out of the plumbing industry because they were not afraid of where their Kitech brass fittings came from...

and the same thing for Minnesota too.........


the Black Wirsbo plastic manifolds. in my pictures are never gonna corrode, wont come apart cause they got too much Zinc mixed in with the brass..

and can literallly freeze solid and wont snap and break...


I am just wondering what brand that you use....


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Ron The Plumber said:


> For now I am, there are going to phase them out at the end of the year and go with the newer rings, the ones that won't slip down the pipe, the ones that have the top collar on the end them, oh and there is a new zurn pex emerging, it will be able to hold it's shape when bent, higher uv rating also, I'll get more details and post in a new thread over the next few days


 Interesting, I've seen alot of those type used around here already. They are paper thin, make me a little nervous. A lot of plumbers are using them, so I'm guessing they must be having good success. 
I don't know why, but the copper crimp rings are rarely used in my area. I used them alot in the 90's with poly. They worked well when used with copper or brass fittings. 
I really like the SS rings I use now (they have the little nob to crimp), there thick and heavy, and not a leak yet.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

Uponor is telling everyone to only use plastic fittings whenever possible.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Bartender, I'll have what he's drinking :laughing:



Master Mark said:


> All I asked you was what kind of pex that white stuff is ,
> 
> and what kind of brass fittings are they that you use....
> 
> ...


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I don't think I'll be revealing my trade secrets on a public forum for all my competitors to see and copy. They do enough of that already.

What do the problems in Nevada and Minnesota have to do with my area? Nevada was due to dezincification and Minnesota was just a bad batch of fittings. 

So what do you do for nipples, valves, faucets and such since brass is evil?



Master Mark said:


> All I asked you was what kind of pex that white stuff is ,
> 
> and what kind of brass fittings are they that you use....
> 
> ...


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

No, but you just have to worry about the bug guy getting chemicals on them and causing them to undergo rapid ESC failure.



Master Mark said:


> All I asked you was what kind of pex that white stuff is ,
> 
> and what kind of brass fittings are they that you use....
> 
> ...


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## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

In looking at that first picture of your "manifold", it looks to me that it has been handymanned. I assume the WnD are going there, well, it could be exposed to damage. I don't know your laws, but that would never pass an inspection in my parts. As for your manifold, I guess that would be termed a mani...but it looks more like a "this is all I got in the truck" kind of job. I don't know....I couldn't do stuff like that. I could tear it out pretty good, but I just could not see myself doing something like that and than asking to get paid for it. You don't have to explain anything because I don't care...i guess it's just a pride thing for me. 




Master Mark said:


> All I asked you was what kind of pex that white stuff is ,
> 
> and what kind of brass fittings are they that you use....
> 
> ...


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

That may have something to do with profit margins. They might also worry about bad press if someone installs them in aggressive water.



nhmaster3015 said:


> Uponor is telling everyone to only use plastic fittings whenever possible.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*What is the dysfunction here???*



Protech said:


> I don't think I'll be revealing my trade secrets on a public forum for all my competitors to see and copy. They do enough of that already.
> 
> What do the problems in Nevada and Minnesota have to do with my area? Nevada was due to dezincification and Minnesota was just a bad batch of fittings.
> 
> So what do you do for nipples, valves, faucets and such since brass is evil?


I dont really know what I did xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx....
whatever it was , I am sorry...:laughing:

all I asked was what kind of pex you used in
your pictures

you post some of your work , then you are afraid that someone will steal your trade secrets???:laughing::laughing:

I will now reveal my trade secrets...

I use only Delta faucets....
I use sch 40 pvc for drain lines
I use* type m and type L* copper 
I use Wirsbo PEX with the expanding ring
and plastic fittings...
I install Bradford White and Rheem heaters.
I use nibco ball valves
Cerro copper fittings..


now will you telll me what kind of pex that is
pretty please ??

Here is some of the junk I see every day around our town that passes for plumbing


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## Turd Burglar (Sep 26, 2009)

type m copper? for waterlines? pinholes galore.
I use type L copper or viega pex for my domestic waterlines.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*its all realtive to where it is being installed*



Tankless said:


> In looking at that first picture of your "manifold", it looks to me that it has been handymanned. I assume the WnD are going there, well, it could be exposed to damage. I don't know your laws, but that would never pass an inspection in my parts. As for your manifold, I guess that would be termed a mani...but it looks more like a "this is all I got in the truck" kind of job. I don't know....I couldn't do stuff like that. I could tear it out pretty good, but I just could not see myself doing something like that and than asking to get paid for it. You don't have to explain anything because I don't care...i guess it's just a pride thing for me.


Dont worry, I dont take any offence to this at all.... pride has its time and place...

this home was a *flea bitten, roach infested .... hell hole....*

re-possessed and about to fall down into itself..

they wanted water on, for the lowest price it could be done for.

I guess its probably a welfare rental these days.
with enough grease and dirt over those pipes you probably 
could not see them



here is some real *choice spagetti pex* work I stumbled on a year ago....


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Here we go!


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Wow, that dude really didn't GAF.

And I certainly agree about working in crap holes. Some times it's just about getting in and out with a payment.



Master Mark said:


> Dont worry, I dont take any offence to this at all.... pride has its time and place...
> 
> this home was a *flea bitten, roach infested .... hell hole....*
> 
> ...


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*you take your clothes off at the door*



Protech said:


> Wow, that dude really didn't GAF.
> 
> And I certainly agree about working in crap holes. Some times it's just about getting in and out with a payment.


many times I have taken my clothes off
and put them in a garbage bag...

took my shoes and sprayed them down with bleach..

hell holes dont matter to me how it looks

 I just dont want to get lice, fleas or roach eggs on me...and drag them home...



on a nother note 
that "spagetti pex" in the picture I posted looks very sinmilar to the stuff you use.....:laughing::laughing:


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## RollinSoLo (Sep 22, 2009)

AKA Wirsbo


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## EasyEman (Jun 1, 2009)

Should'nt the pipe be strapped below the insulation level. To keep the hot, hot and cold, cold.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

So the cable guy can step on it? No.....


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Have you ever had anyone complain of no COLD water after a re-pipe? meaning the cold runs hot from being in the attic.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

It will make a nice handrail for the cable guy. 

What kind of pipe is durable with no concern for someone accidentally stepping on it when supported properly?:whistling2:

Just kiddin.... 

Here, the pipe would be below the insulation, covered with a suitable cover. Then insulated over to allow heat to radiate through the ceiling to the pipe.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

TheMaster said:


> Have you ever had anyone complain of no COLD water after a re-pipe? meaning the cold runs hot from being in the attic.


 
I wonder just how hot that water would become in an improperly vented attic space??? Scalding


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

I know nothing about pex but I know about attic re-pipes. All I can say is I thought the job Protech did that everyone is calling spagetti looked fine to me. My .02 worth.


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## hulihan (Aug 11, 2009)

That looks easy, is it, everything here is copper, no plastic, but it sure would cut down on weight  Nice looking job I guess, never seen a repipe with plastic, how long does it take to do two complete apts, with each unit has its own water heater, it takes us 5 days for 2 guys to do it in copper, but turns out clean, just courious, is it alot faster ?


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## EasyEman (Jun 1, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> Have you ever had anyone complain of no COLD water after a re-pipe? meaning the cold runs hot from being in the attic.


I went call the HO said that the hot and cold were switched. He could not get cold water anywhere. I went into the attic and the wirsbo was run across the rafters and not insulated. The summers here are hot so we have to either bury the pipe in the insulation or insulate the pipes.


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

hulihan. i did a whole house, 1 bath in 11.5 hrs by myself not to long ago. manifold and colored pex. breid................:rockon:


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Plasticman said:


> I know nothing about pex but I know about attic re-pipes. All I can say is I thought the job Protech did that everyone is calling spagetti looked fine to me. My .02 worth.


Protech called it spaghetti. Look at the thread title.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

it get get up to 140F. It will get that hot anyway though under the insulation unless it's right up against the drywall. I've seen houses flooded because cpvc was ran low an then the HO or cable guy stepped on them. PEX is a little more forgiving than cpvc but I won't risk it. HO want's constant cold water? Fine, we will install a chiller and recirc at an additional charge and insulate everything. When I tell them it's going to cost an extra 2 grand they say, "well, I waited for hot water before, now I'll be waiting for the cold. :laughing:"



ILPlumber said:


> I wonder just how hot that water would become in an improperly vented attic space??? Scalding


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

It does get smokin hot in the summer but the r-value of the pipe is high enough that once you purge the line it stays cold during usage. It’s just like a hot water system without a recirc just with cold water instead of hot.



TheMaster said:


> Have you ever had anyone complain of no COLD water after a re-pipe? meaning the cold runs hot from being in the attic.


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

No worse than waiting on a Rinaii to get hot water to the opposite side of the house. Look at all the cold water wasted


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> Protech called it spaghetti. Look at the thread title.


 
I am aware of that. It's just that everyone seemed to agree that it was ugly, was all I was saying.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

The same kind that flooded that house out and got me that pex repipe.
"yes madam, we will be replacing this leaky copper pipe with.........more copper pipe. You shouldn't have any more problems." 




ILPlumber said:


> It will make a nice handrail for the cable guy.
> 
> What kind of pipe is durable with no concern for someone accidentally stepping on it when supported properly?:whistling2:
> 
> ...


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