# Need A Tool? Make One.



## Tommy plumber

Ever been in a situation where you needed a tool but didn't have because one wasn't made? 

Well, make one. Show us your home-made tools. Mens' minds have produced many clever tools over the centuries.


----------



## Tommy plumber

I made a tool today to make my job easier.


----------



## OpenSights

... for some deep low torque nut or plug... but for something that I don’t deal with... I think?

For below ground check valve lids I have a 3’ 3” scl40 and a 2” chunk of pipe notched with a hole through the top for a screwdriver as leverage. Plenty of other tools that just aren’t coming to mind at the moment.


----------



## Tommy plumber

OpenSights said:


> ... for some deep low torque nut or plug... but for something that I don’t deal with... I think?
> 
> For below ground check valve lids I have a 3’ 3” scl40 and a 2” chunk of pipe notched with a hole through the top for a screwdriver as leverage. Plenty of other tools that just aren’t coming to mind at the moment.


 












You're a service guy right? Then you may have needed the tool that I posted or I should say could have used.

I want to see what my highly esteemed plumbing colleagues have fabricated. Maybe I can poach an idea or two which will make my job easier.


----------



## Tommy plumber

For those who do service work, do you guys ever replace that diamond-shaped gasket and flush valve on Kohler W/C's? The flush valve nut is surrounded by the rubber gasket and a large channel locks doesn't fit well. So I made a socket to fit it.


----------



## Tango

Oh goodie! I just saw this thread, I have a few "show and tell" tools I've made. I love home made tools. Pics will be in this evening!


----------



## Tango

This tool is to loosen moen cartridges in corner tub faucet. These cartridges are like 3 inches deep. I hate those! I can use a screw driver or wrench.













This wrench is for shower drains, Couldn't find it for sale on the net and no one ships here. I made my own with a more comfortable handle and the hex part is so I can use a wrench for extra torque. The small metal strip they provide with a new drain sucks, it always falls in the p-trap and the pipe has to be right on the money. This tool is perfect for service jobs.


----------



## OpenSights

I’ll have to take a picture tomorrow, but a scl 30 notched makes a good check valve cap remove when it’s deep.


----------



## Tango

OpenSights said:


> For below ground check valve lids I have a 3’ 3” scl40 and a 2” chunk of pipe notched with a hole through the top for a screwdriver as leverage. Plenty of other tools that just aren’t coming to mind at the moment.


I use a piece of 2x4 and a pipe wrench, it fits perfectly between the fins.


----------



## Tango

When I used to work on commercial sites and had to pop those black sleeves between floors the ones that have the same shape as a top hat. The companies never provided proper tools to remove them so I made a sleeve cutter on their time on the job! Pry the sleeve away from the concrete then slice it all the way through. A lot easier than the huge and heavy concrete pry bar that you had to borrow in secret.


----------



## canuck92

Lost my inside cutter so i used my abs cutting weel with a brass w.c bolt an a couple nuts worked better then an off the shelf inside cutter


----------



## 89plumbum

canuck92 said:


> Lost my inside cutter so i used my abs cutting weel with a brass w.c bolt an a couple nuts worked better then an off the shelf inside cutter


Ive used a fender washer as well. Just nip the edges with snips and it works pretty well.


----------



## 89plumbum

Nothing special. Just what we use to catch dust. Now every truck is stocked with a hepa filter because of this whole silica thing, but this works well too.


----------



## Tango

89plumbum said:


> Nothing special. Just what we use to catch dust. Now every truck is stocked with a hepa filter because of this whole silica thing, but this works well too.


We now have to wear dust masks with cartridges in our province to protect against silicosis. Anyone caught without wearing one when drilling anchor shots for example will get fined. I've been wearing masks since I can't remember.

When I went to work in the other province I was the only person to wear one and they looked at me like I was an extra terrestrial. They never saw masks with cartridges let alone know what the silicosis disease is.


----------



## 89plumbum

Tango said:


> We now have to wear dust masks with cartridges in our province to protect against silicosis. Anyone caught without wearing one when drilling anchor shots for example will get fined. I've been wearing masks since I can't remember.
> 
> When I went to work in the other province I was the only person to wear one and they looked at me like I was an extra terrestrial. They never saw masks with cartridges let alone know what the silicosis disease is.


New osha laws have taken effect. From what I understand, you have 2 options. Hepa filters, or a respitory program. More cost effective to go the hepa route.


----------



## Tango

The problem with hepa filerters is the employers don't want to buy new drills that accepts filters. When they do buy the filters they clog up fast, the guys don't take care of them. The employers don't buy more filters or the brush collector when they wear out and after a week you're breathing all that crap again.

The last decade as an employee I supplied my own safety equipment from masks, gloves, safety glasses, face shield, harness, ear plugs etc. The employers were supposed to supply that by law but they were D---cks. I was not going to lose my health for those clowns.


----------



## Dpeckplb

The most ingenious tool I've ever made was a spanner to go across the top of a curb stop. too much wasted time trying to get a seized nut out of the top. Just to add to the box of precision bent wrenches, drilled out nut drivers and socket extensions.


----------



## Tango

I wanted the original tool but since I'm up north the price tag was over 200$ including all kinds of rip off fees. Yes thats right that much. So I made my own. 1/8 flat stock with a welded Sawsall blade and shrink tube. 2 years later that tool is still 3 times as much as down south.


----------



## Tango

Forgot to say its the tool to hold toilet bolts.


----------



## 5onthefloor

Tango said:


> Forgot to say its the tool to hold toilet bolts.


I could tell even before you posted what it was. Awesome!

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


----------



## Gargalaxy

I made this one years ago and I found it looking for something in my garage.


----------



## OpenSights

Putty cup?


----------



## chonkie

OpenSights said:


> Putty cup?


Looks like a basket strainer holder and tub drain wrench.


----------



## OpenSights

chonkie said:


> Looks like a basket strainer holder and tub drain wrench.


Lol! Same thing. Always amazes me how one single part can have numerous names.


----------



## chonkie

I was gonna ask what was a putty cup ... hopefully being something besides the little tub it comes in.


----------



## chonkie

I use one of these dumbbells. Is it what you are calling a putty cup?


----------



## Logtec

I needed a tiny flathead screw driver to close the “water stops” on a imported “tub and shower valve” 
The smallest flathead I had, had a tapered shaft and It couldn’t close the stop %100. 
Fak!
I was in the city, in a place that was very hard to find parking, so I wasn’t interested in going to buy a tiny flathead, coming back and trying to find parking- so I took my yellow aviator snips and cut a 1/2” copper pipe clip into a long thin flathead. The clip lasted just long enough to close the stops before it twisted. 

Was back at this job today- but with a tiny Flathead.. that copper clip saved me 1hr of time and a headache driving/parking!


----------



## Logtec

Gargalaxy said:


> I made this one years ago and I found it looking for something in my garage.


Nice!


----------



## Tango

Did you ever curse and swear trying to install a one piece toilet where the flange bolts are inside? Your fingers don't fit and you get bruised and cramped and the nut falls off inside? Now you have to pull the toilet, shake it to get the nut back and replace the wax? Try again and again? I made this!

I had to order this pass through ratchet from South Korea, couldn't find it anywhere else and waited 2 month to receive it. I made my own special sockets for the nuts bolts. I start off with the supplied sleeves (cotter pin sleeve or the one with inward bent sleeve) then I can switch to my pass through sockets. No more fracking around. Guess what I didn't have to install one of them since!





















Here's a socket for the dishwasher connection. I got the idea from this site I think.


----------



## Logtec

Tango said:


> Did you ever curse and swear trying to install a one piece toilet where the flange bolts are inside? Your fingers don't fit and you get bruised and cramped and the nut falls off inside? Now you have to pull the toilet, shake it to get the nut back and replace the wax? Try again and again? I made this!
> 
> 
> 
> I had to order this pass through ratchet from South Korea, couldn't find it anywhere else and waited 2 month to receive it. I made my own special sockets for the nuts bolts. I start off with the supplied sleeves (cotter pin sleeve or the one with inward bent sleeve) then I can switch to my pass through sockets. No more fracking around. Guess what I didn't have to install one of them since!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a socket for the dishwasher connection. I got the idea from this site I think.



Nice!

I make my apprentice tighten those bolts!
1/8 of a turn, flip the wrench, 1/8 turn, flip wrench- repeat until tight!


----------



## Tango




----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Did you ever curse and swear trying to install a one piece toilet where the flange bolts are inside? Your fingers don't fit and you get bruised and cramped and the nut falls off inside? Now you have to pull the toilet, shake it to get the nut back and replace the wax? Try again and again? I made this!
> 
> I had to order this pass through ratchet from South Korea, couldn't find it anywhere else and waited 2 month to receive it. I made my own special sockets for the nuts bolts. I start off with the supplied sleeves (cotter pin sleeve or the one with inward bent sleeve) then I can switch to my pass through sockets. No more fracking around. Guess what I didn't have to install one of them since!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a socket for the dishwasher connection. I got the idea from this site I think.


 https://www.amazon.com/CRL-SQW100R-...id=1540158121&sr=8-2&keywords=squeeze+ratchet
says its made in the USA...who knows..


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> https://www.amazon.com/CRL-SQW100R-...id=1540158121&sr=8-2&keywords=squeeze+ratchet
> says its made in the USA...who knows..


Yes I know its usa made however, the only one available to me was from south korea. We are very limited to what we can buy online, it feels like we are in a third world country and can barely get anything. Also very few sellers on ebay will ship up here. I don't know what the fear is. Then on amazon we only have a fraction of the things you have. Then the private sellers like to put a price tag of hundreds of dollars for a simple item that cost 20$.


----------



## skoronesa

Tango said:


> Yes I know its usa made however, the only one available to me was from south korea. We are very limited to what we can buy online, it feels like we are in a third world country and can barely get anything. Also very few sellers on ebay will ship up here. I don't know what the fear is. Then on amazon we only have a fraction of the things you have. Then the private sellers like to put a price tag of hundreds of dollars for a simple item that cost 20$.







I assume it's an issue with import restrictions. Similar to what trump wants to do. They think if they restrict or place fees on certain items that they will magically start to be made domestically.


Don't get me wrong, import laws can be a good thing, it's all about how and what you do. But most of those in charg don't have the motivation to make laws that are so nuanced and don't fire up voters because they are complex or just fix something small. It's not worth their time to do small good things.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Yes I know its usa made however, the only one available to me was from south korea. We are very limited to what we can buy online, it feels like we are in a third world country and can barely get anything. Also very few sellers on ebay will ship up here. I don't know what the fear is. Then on amazon we only have a fraction of the things you have. Then the private sellers like to put a price tag of hundreds of dollars for a simple item that cost 20$.


but you can buy weed legal anyplace now in canada...if you cant get tools you can get stoned..:vs_laugh::vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> but you can buy weed legal anyplace now in canada...if you cant get tools you can get stoned..:vs_laugh::vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


We can't buy guns so....

Tell you what I'll trade you weed for guns? :wink: :biggrin:

On another note they legalized weed and the same evening the police made roadblocks to check for weed consumption! :tt2::tt2::brows::brows:


----------



## Tango

skoronesa said:


> I assume it's an issue with import restrictions.


No it's been like that since I've been buying on ebay for over a decade. American sellers in general do not want to ship to Canada.


----------



## Tango

Here's a tool I had to make to install 24 stories worth of shower faucets. The whole female part had to buried inside the wall, be exactly 1/8" below tile so I could install the shower fittings. Many occasions I had to shorten the "nipple" as seen here to be half that length. lots of mini hacksaw work and soldering and an extra layer of 50/50 to strengthen it.

The escutcheon were the size of the hex so a regular socket wouldn't of worked.

Stupid shower faucet rough design, I was the first guinea pig to install those directly from the manufacturer.

I bet no one else will ever install those faucets after me.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Here's a tool I had to make to install 24 stories worth of shower faucets. The whole female part had to buried inside the wall, be exactly 1/8" below tile so I could install the shower fittings. Many occasions I had to shorten the "nipple" as seen here to be half that length. lots of mini hacksaw work and soldering and an extra layer of 50/50 to strengthen it.
> 
> The escutcheon were the size of the hex so a regular socket wouldn't of worked.
> 
> Stupid shower faucet rough design, I was the first guinea pig to install those directly from the manufacturer.
> 
> I bet no one else will ever install those faucets after me.



do you TIG weld? that gives you much more control to make tools and you can weld steel, SS, copper, brass , aluminum, basically any weldable metal...


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> do you TIG weld? that gives you much more control to make tools and you can weld steel, SS, copper, brass , aluminum, basically any weldable metal...


I have an arc welder and mig. The mini mig I got from the trash and fixed the issues. I use flux wire and I don't have gas bottle(there is a port for it), it makes booger welds but I get by for what I usually make. 

There was a tool store who used to throw away returns that were brand new or "defective" in an outside trash container. It was an awesome time to gather so many tools that I fixed and kept. It was christmas every thursday at one am. It made it tough to go to work on fridays! However now it's in an enclosed crusher.

I got so many brand new things, dozens of chainsaws, a mini generator, welder, dozens of hand tools, power tools, air tools, sockets, etc.


----------



## Debo22

Tub stoppage today. I pulled off the waste and overflow to access and noticed no plunger on the linkage. I asked the homeowner for a wire coat hanger. I put a bend on the end of it, stuck it down the w/o and plucked the plunger out. Drains great now.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Debo22 said:


> Tub stoppage today. I pulled off the waste and overflow to access and noticed no plunger on the linkage. I asked the homeowner for a wire coat hanger. I put a bend on the end of it, stuck it down the w/o and plucked the plunger out. Drains great now.



you got lucky on that, many times the dam plunger is corroded in place and gunked up with soap and hair locking it in place...and the coat hanger doesnt have enough strength to pull it out before the hook just bends straight..


----------



## skoronesa

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> you got lucky on that, many times the dam plunger is corroded in place and gunked up with soap and hair locking it in place...and the coat hanger doesnt have enough strength to pull it out before the hook just bends straight..


The best is a length of small welded chain with a hook on one end and you wrap/bolt the other end to a piece of steel pipe and just pull!!!

Or if its above a dirt crawl you tell them they should try a bottle of draino and let it sit a couple days 

I have also poured some HCl down the overflow and it dissolved the rust between the plunger and the tee freeing it.



.


----------



## Tango

I will eventualy need this shower wrench again to use in a confined space. The one I bought originaly works only on hex nut shower drains and brass drain nuts (I've never encountered those). I modified it with extra notches to fit an ABS style drain. See the black marker points

































I wanted to purchase a different wrench for other types of drains but the seller doesn't have it in his repertoire. I decided to make my own. I used this wrench as a template to make a version for confined spaces. I cut down a socket to allow to clip in a ratchet extension.


----------



## The Dane

I have that same wrench but mine is blue, I wonder why.

Sent from my BLN-L24 using Tapatalk


----------



## Tango

The Dane said:


> I have that same wrench but mine is blue, I wonder why.
> 
> Sent from my BLN-L24 using Tapatalk


Red for the Canadian flag... Blue for the British?? Just joking. :wink:


----------



## CaptainBob

Tango, fine job sir. I tip my hat to ya.:vs_cool:


----------



## skoronesa

The Dane said:


> I have that same wrench but mine is blue, I wonder why.
> 
> Sent from my BLN-L24 using Tapatalk



You must not use it much so it doesn't feel appreciated or valued.






.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> I will eventualy need this shower wrench again to use in a confined space. The one I bought originaly works only on hex nut shower drains and brass drain nuts (I've never encountered those). I modified it with extra notches to fit an ABS style drain. See the black marker points
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I wanted to purchase a different wrench for other types of drains but the seller doesn't have it in his repertoire. I decided to make my own. I used this wrench as a template to make a version for confined spaces. I cut down a socket to allow to clip in a ratchet extension.



treat yourself to a plasma cutter, they work great...


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> treat yourself to a plasma cutter, they work great...


I'll have to check the cost of things, How much do they cost? 1500$?? 

I won't be for a long time, gotta do the fence against the neighbor, replace 4 windows, Remove a 5th and redo the wall and roof shingles all this summer.


----------



## Tango

I just repaired my 3/8" drop head. The pin broke last year when I was trying to navigate some awful hack plumbing. I had previously posted about it.

I had purchased a box of nails just for that and I found the head as I'm starting to clean the garage. I used a nut as a cap with a tack weld.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> I'll have to check the cost of things, How much do they cost? 1500$??
> 
> I won't be for a long time, gotta do the fence against the neighbor, replace 4 windows, Remove a 5th and redo the wall and roof shingles all this summer.



it depends on what thickness your gona cut, they have decent cheap ones but I have the hypertherms, and I first bought a hobart plasma along time ago and it still works good, just for thinner metal up to a 1/4 inch you can go slow and get a cut..
this is the one..
https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200647339_200647339


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> I just repaired my 3/8" drop head. The pin broke last year when I was trying to navigate some awful hack plumbing. I had previously posted about it.
> 
> I had purchased a box of nails just for that and I found the head as I'm starting to clean the garage. I used a nut as a cap with a tack weld.



nails are soft and have no shear strength from metal twisting in that swivel, you would be better off buying some grade 8 hardware and using that and tack welding the nut so it wont loosen up, I bet that nail doesnt last long if you get into some tough muck to clean out..


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> nails are soft and have no shear strength from metal twisting in that swivel, you would be better off buying some grade 8 hardware and using that and tack welding the nut so it wont loosen up, I bet that nail doesnt last long if you get into some tough muck to clean out..


I haven't measured the hole but it's a little more than 1/8. I wonder where I would find grade 8 or even grade 5 in that size.

All little bolts to my knowledge are grade 2.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

this place has everything...
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwj53-vC7qrhAhUKPN8KHQ9BDrsQFjAAegQIBhAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fastenal.com%2F&usg=AOvVaw18DHOO6J8V5h56CyTOS_CY


or use a masonry nail, they are much harder than standard nails..


----------



## skoronesa

I want a nipple caddy for 1/2 and 3/4 but just a slim one like 3 rows wide. Can't seem to find one, guess I will have to spend some time in our sheet metal shop. I do service, I don't need 75 nipples lolz





.


----------



## Tango

*Here's another home made tool. *

This is for another type of shower drain. I've been using shower drains with a hex nut underneath but they keep stripping. I'm starting to use these drains. I did have a few calls where they were loose. I think the plumbers only used their hand to tighten them. I know the last one was a true pirate. I never saw a plumber using a special tool like I have. This drain has more threads and I can apply more torque. 

I made a tool so I can tighten it from the top on a service call or turn the tool upside down and pull on it hard from underneath so I can screw the other half downstairs. It had to have the possibility to be as long as I wanted. Sometimes reaching deep through the floor joists and ceiling below.


----------



## Tango

More pics.


.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

necessity is the mother to all inventions...


----------



## Venomthirst

Are you selling these lol works better than channel locks or an adjustable stretched open


----------



## Tango

Venomthirst said:


> Are you selling these lol works better than channel locks or an adjustable stretched open


It wouldn't be profitable, I would sell 2 or 3 at most. Plumbers around here don't buy special tools. The employers are even worse.

Channel locks don't work as the drain is always tight against floor joist or in it or the nut is above the floor and you can't reach it. Then you have air ducts and other nuisances. Then most pliers don't open wide enough to make it tight enough. Not easy being a service plumber working in small cramped ceilings while customers expect you to make it right and last forever. :vs_OMG:


----------



## Toli

Plastic shower drains blow. Use one of these instead.


----------



## Tango

I'll be making a wrench for free standing made in cheap china tub drains. I've had 3 calls on those. It's going to be a guessing game as I don't have one on hand. I did find a picture of it in my archives and tweaked the lighting. The last one I did was a nightmare from under neath. I gave the guy some pliers upstairs and I was below and the pliers kept on slipping. I'll have a wrench ready for next time. Freaking stupid design with the overflow trapped in 2 layers of fibreglass and you can't put it tight or it will collapse.

And check the last picture of the tub I fixed last fall. These people weren't even grateful I fixed the hack. All she did was complain about the price trying to get me to provide a hack price without taxes.:furious:


----------



## Tango

Toli said:


> Plastic shower drains blow. Use one of these instead.


Never seen that, I doubt the supply house have them and how do you connect that to abs? Threaded I suppose, then those threads abs to brass loosen over time. Or you have to solder a piece of copper and a fernco?


----------



## Toli

not threaded, nor any need for a fernco. It attaches to the drain same as any no caulk or caulked shower drain. Stick your pipe up in the drain, insert rubber gasket and tighten it in with the inside threaded compression ring. Or yarn it and caulk it if you fancy. 

Here's sioux chief's version-

http://www.wolffbros.com/catalog/documents/POD_SC8272J.pdf


----------



## Venomthirst

Tango said:


> Venomthirst said:
> 
> 
> 
> Are you selling these lol works better than channel locks or an adjustable stretched open
> 
> 
> 
> It wouldn't be profitable, I would sell 2 or 3 at most. Plumbers around here don't buy special tools. The employers are even worse.
> 
> Channel locks don't work as the drain is always tight against floor joist or in it or the nut is above the floor and you can't reach it. Then you have air ducts and other nuisances. Then most pliers don't open wide enough to make it tight enough. Not easy being a service plumber working in small cramped ceilings while customers expect you to make it right and last forever. <img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/vs_OMG.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Vs OMG" class="inlineimg" />
Click to expand...

Usually it's a 2 guy job for us one guy hold bottoms with pipe wrench while other guy tightens it in... I too never seen the brass ones at supplier but if it can make a 2 man job into a 1 man job then it's worth extra cost looks better quality too


----------



## Venomthirst

However I'm not the biggest fan of push fit gaskets... we've used them on terrazzo slop sinks we were putting in schools.. over head I dont like them but if it's going ground floor I guess it's okay lol... 

Faucet grease helps those rubbers slide in better... just too much friction there for my liking... gotta luber up.. ky might work too never know 😜


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Venomthirst said:


> However I'm not the biggest fan of push fit gaskets... we've used them on terrazzo slop sinks we were putting in schools.. over head I dont like them but if it's going ground floor I guess it's okay lol...
> 
> Faucet grease helps those rubbers slide in better... just too much friction there for my liking... gotta luber up.. ky might work too never know 😜



I use clear silicone..lubes it on the way in and once it sets it aint going nowhere..one and done..


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Toli said:


> Plastic shower drains blow. Use one of these instead.





all you anti silicone people have all the issues trying to set drains with putty....clear silicone...once it sets it aint ever moving or leaking...I never had a plastic drain leak or loosen...


----------



## Venomthirst

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> all you anti silicone people have all the issues trying to set drains with putty....clear silicone...once it sets it aint ever moving or leaking...I never had a plastic drain leak or loosen...



I use silicone aswell... there is a place and time for putty however, I've read that putty can attack plastics so I steer clear when using it on plastics... really I'll use silicone on everything... even setting brass or plastic p.o's and sometimes when setting a basket strainer in a stainless sink where the beveled part of the sink is more of a bowl shape and there is no way to get a good seal without putty or silicone..

Never really thought of it for using it on push fit gaskets thanks for the pro tip


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Venomthirst said:


> I use silicone aswell... there is a place and time for putty however, I've read that putty can attack plastics so I steer clear when using it on plastics... really I'll use silicone on everything... even setting brass or plastic p.o's and sometimes when setting a basket strainer in a stainless sink where the beveled part of the sink is more of a bowl shape and there is no way to get a good seal without putty or silicone..
> 
> Never really thought of it for using it on push fit gaskets thanks for the pro tip



with all of todays plastics, the putty is too stiff and you end up cracking or stripping the threads more than the putty affecting the plastic chemically, and any natural or even cultured stone sinks the oil from the putty stains yellow..I havent found anytime putty is better than silicone, but it comes down to personal choice..I havent touched putty in over 20 years and couldnt if i tried think of where silicone doesnt work better, but thats just me..


----------



## Tango

I use silicone too, once the drain is set I put a bead all over. The last shower drain as the one for my new tool I put silicone in the threads because that's where it can seep up and also leak under the gasket. And a bead to finish off.


----------



## Tango

I use putty only under one hole faucets or side spray.


----------



## Toli

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> all you anti silicone people have all the issues trying to set drains with putty....clear silicone...once it sets it aint ever moving or leaking...I never had a plastic drain leak or loosen...


The plastic nuts loosen. my guess is from expansion and contraction. We change plastic drains all the time. Putty'd and silicone'd.


----------



## Tango

Toli said:


> not threaded, nor any need for a fernco. It attaches to the drain same as any no caulk or caulked shower drain. Stick your pipe up in the drain, insert rubber gasket and tighten it in with the inside threaded compression ring. Or yarn it and caulk it if you fancy.
> 
> Here's sioux chief's version-
> 
> http://www.wolffbros.com/catalog/documents/POD_SC8272J.pdf


I'm not too fond of that shark bite style drain with o-rings. Going in and out of the shower will wobble it and I think it will eventually leak. Or the o-rings will flatten or dry out.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> I use putty only under one hole faucets or side spray.





why? if you use silicone everywhere else...


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Toli said:


> The plastic nuts loosen. my guess is from expansion and contraction. We change plastic drains all the time. Putty'd and silicone'd.



probably from poor original installation..from not wanting to tighten the plastic nut tight enough, otherwise if it was from heat cool cycles, everything with a plastic piece would be leaking..such as shower drains, trip levers on tubs and so on....


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> I'm not too fond of that shark bite style drain with o-rings. Going in and out of the shower will wobble it and I think it will eventually leak. Or the o-rings will flatten or dry out.



I think a few more years down the line you will see much more failures in the shark bite fittings and the press fittings ..as the only surface holding back a leak is from a small O ring with small surface area compared to a soldered or glued joint, any vibration , heat cool cycles and the O ring its self breaking down over time and any chemicals that make contact with that....
how about a drain cleaner running his machine through sharkbite drain fittings???


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> why? if you use silicone everywhere else...


Because silicone smears off when installing it and stains the sink.


----------



## Tango

Toli said:


> The plastic nuts loosen. my guess is from expansion and contraction. We change plastic drains all the time. Putty'd and silicone'd.


Like I said and ShtRnsdownhill, poor installation. These guys have no tools and are hand tight by 18 year old. Employers don't supply tools and silicone and materials like they should. Kids are in a race and pushed to the max or they're laid off.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Because silicone smears off when installing it and stains the sink.



how does clear silicone stain a sink? what is the sink made of, I have never seen silicone stain anything, but have seen yellow stains from the oil in putty...


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Like I said and ShtRnsdownhill, poor installation. These guys have no tools and are hand tight by 18 year old. Employers don't supply tools and silicone and materials like they should. Kids are in a race and pushed to the max or they're laid off.



many many moons ago when I worked for a guy that had a few crews going, there was one helper who used a big ratchet to bolt down toilets and to tighten tank bolts, I lost count of how many toilets he cracked because he had no clue on what he was doing..I left the company before I knew what happened to him....


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> how does clear silicone stain a sink? what is the sink made of, I have never seen silicone stain anything, but have seen yellow stains from the oil in putty...


Corian sinks and sinks are made of stone dust of some kind. For example some become darker on contact of silicone and I haven't found a way to remove it. it feels like it absorbs. I know my own black sink stained on contact. I put masking tape outlining the faucet when I put mine in. Then customer always inspect a new faucet install and if it's not perfect watch out for the pitch fork they've got stored away.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Corian sinks and sinks are made of stone dust of some kind. For example some become darker on contact of silicone and I haven't found a way to remove it. it feels like it absorbs. I know my own black sink stained on contact. I put masking tape outlining the faucet when I put mine in. Then customer always inspect a new faucet install and if it's not perfect watch out for the pitch fork they've got stored away.



I never had that problem , I use this, its alot more pricey now from when I first bought it, but it seems to clean up silicone GREAT with no residue..
https://www.amazon.com/Guardsman-Professional-Strength-Cleaning-Solution/dp/B01E0HOAHM/ref=sr_1_3?crid=38MSVEQ11FYFA&keywords=afta+cleaning+solvent&qid=1559517453&s=gateway&sprefix=afta+clean%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-3


just use a terry cloth towel/rag and wet it with the fluid and it cleans the silicone away..


----------



## skoronesa

Tango said:


> *Here's another home made tool. *
> 
> This is for another type of shower drain. I've been using shower drains with a hex nut underneath but they keep stripping. I'm starting to use these drains. I did have a few calls where they were loose. I think the plumbers only used their hand to tighten them. I know the last one was a true pirate. I never saw a plumber using a special tool like I have. This drain has more threads and I can apply more torque.
> 
> I made a tool so I can tighten it from the top on a service call or turn the tool upside down and pull on it hard from underneath so I can screw the other half downstairs. It had to have the possibility to be as long as I wanted. Sometimes reaching deep through the floor joists and ceiling below.





My manager made a very similar tool but instead of a socket it is a foot long 1" pipe.






.


----------



## skoronesa

Venomthirst said:


> I use silicone aswell... there is a place and time for putty however, I've read that putty can attack plastics so I steer clear when using it on plastics... really I'll use silicone on everything... even setting brass or plastic p.o's and sometimes when setting a basket strainer in a stainless sink where the beveled part of the sink is more of a bowl shape and there is no way to get a good seal without putty or silicone..
> 
> Never really thought of it for using it on push fit gaskets thanks for the pro tip





Regular putty doesn't "attack" the plastic anymore than silicone caulk does. Regular putty is filler combined with a petroleum oil which will act as a solvent on some plastics until it evaporates leaving hard putty behind. Silicone caulk is silicone with a solvent that also will dissolve some plastics. The solvent is what makes the silicone stick to the plastic. If you didn't have a solvent to partially dissolve the surface you want to glue than nothing would stick together.


Another way to look at it is this. Clear pvc primer is all solvent(Xylene, xylol, acetone, methylethylketone). If you take clear primer and put it on pvc pipe it will make the surface soft for a bit until the solvent evaporates leaving just the pvc again. The solvents dissolve the plastic like water and dirt make mud. Pvc glue is basically pvc primer with some finely ground pvc pipe materials so after you apply the glue and the solvent evaporates it leaves behind the ground up pvc material in the gap.


If you just take a scoop of dirt and put it on some other dirt they dont get mixed together and you just have a pile of dirt on another pile. If you add some solvent like water than the two different clumps of dirt mix together and when the water/solvent evaporates you are left with one solid dirt pile.


Non-staining plumbers putty isn't petroleum based, it is silicone based. It is basically silicone lubricant with finely ground filler. There is no solvent so it won't "attack" plastic. I would prefer that over caulk. I don't like to use caulk because it makes things more difficult to fix when it does leak which it will still do even with the best silicone caulk.










.


----------



## Tango

skoronesa said:


> My manager made a very similar tool but instead of a socket it is a foot long 1" pipe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


I made it so I can adjust the length of it. It's always an issue working in joists, closets and such. It took several hours of thinking with coming up with a simple idea that the extensions would click together and not pull off.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

skoronesa said:


> Regular putty doesn't "attack" the plastic anymore than silicone caulk does. Regular putty is filler combined with a petroleum oil which will act as a solvent on some plastics until it evaporates leaving hard putty behind. Silicone caulk is silicone with a solvent that also will dissolve some plastics. The solvent is what makes the silicone stick to the plastic. If you didn't have a solvent to partially dissolve the surface you want to glue than nothing would stick together.
> 
> 
> Another way to look at it is this. Clear pvc primer is all solvent(Xylene, xylol, acetone, methylethylketone). If you take clear primer and put it on pvc pipe it will make the surface soft for a bit until the solvent evaporates leaving just the pvc again. The solvents dissolve the plastic like water and dirt make mud. Pvc glue is basically pvc primer with some finely ground pvc pipe materials so after you apply the glue and the solvent evaporates it leaves behind the ground up pvc material in the gap.
> 
> 
> If you just take a scoop of dirt and put it on some other dirt they dont get mixed together and you just have a pile of dirt on another pile. If you add some solvent like water than the two different clumps of dirt mix together and when the water/solvent evaporates you are left with one solid dirt pile.
> 
> 
> Non-staining plumbers putty isn't petroleum based, it is silicone based. It is basically silicone lubricant with finely ground filler. There is no solvent so it won't "attack" plastic. I would prefer that over caulk. I don't like to use caulk because it makes things more difficult to fix when it does leak which it will still do even with the best silicone caulk.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


 I believe you are wrong about how silicone connects to a base material, I dont see silicone " dissolving" the surface of metal, stone , glass , ceramic and so on to make a seal...
nor does putty attach plastics.....
putty dries up over time and powders away..the issue with plastic and putty is the thin plastic cracks before compressing the putty and pushing the excess out of whatever drain top your trying to put together, where silicone before curing is very easy to squeeze out...
the plastic cracks or breaks, it isnt dissolved...


----------



## skoronesa

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I believe you are wrong about how silicone connects to a base material, I dont see silicone " dissolving" the surface of metal, stone , glass , ceramic and so on to make a seal...
> nor does putty attach plastics.....
> putty dries up over time and powders away..the issue with plastic and putty is the thin plastic cracks before compressing the putty and pushing the excess out of whatever drain top your trying to put together, where silicone before curing is very easy to squeeze out...
> the plastic cracks or breaks, it isnt dissolved...




https://www.explainthatstuff.com/adhesives.html



"In some cases, adhesives can make much stronger chemical bonds with the materials they touch. For example, if you use certain glues on certain plastics, the glue and the plastic actually merge together to form a very strong chemical bond—they effectively form a new chemical compound at the join. That process is called *chemisorption*. 



Absorption and chemisorption are chemical connections between the glue and the surface. Glues can also form physical (mechanical) bonds with the surface they're sticking to. Suppose the surface is porous (full of holes). The glue can seep into those holes and grip through them, like a climber's fingers grabbing holes in a rock face. That's called the *mechanical* theory of adhesives."




What I said was that putty doesn't dissolve plastic anymore than silicone because I disagreed with his argument that silicone was better because it didn't attack the plastic like putty did.





Venomthirst said:


> I use silicone aswell... there is a place and time for putty however, I've read that putty can attack plastics so I steer clear when using it on plastics...







skoronesa said:


> Regular putty doesn't "attack" the plastic anymore than silicone caulk does. Regular putty is filler combined with a petroleum oil which will act as a solvent on *some* plastics until it evaporates leaving hard putty behind. Silicone caulk is silicone with a solvent that also will dissolve some plastics. The solvent is what makes the silicone stick to the plastic. If you didn't have a solvent to partially dissolve the surface you want to glue than nothing would stick together.
> .




I was wrong to say that last sentence. Obviously there is mechanical cohesion as is described in that link. But I am sure we have all seen silicone and other caulks peel right off of metal, ceramic, and other smooth *nonporous *surfaces.


I know what you mean about the putty being difficult to squeeze out. We don't use plastic pop-ups, sink baskets, or other tailpieces, we only use metal, but the same can still be an issue, especially with thin sink baskets. My normal technique for a kitchen sink basket is to put a 3/8" bead of putty, pull/push it down tight by hand, scrape out the extra that squeezes out below, put on the rubber seal and basket, tighten the nut most of the way. Then while I do something else some more will squeeze out and then I finish tightening.


I use putty instead of silicone simply because it is easier to get off later if need be and either one can make a good seal. That's just the way we do it here, I am not saying your way is wrong, it's just not the way we choose to do it. As long as it doesn't leak and the customer is happy nothing else matters really.









.


----------



## skoronesa

Also, I would like to see you set a toilet in silicone caulk like you can with putty :biggrin:








.


----------



## Venomthirst

I've just heard that it's a no no.. to mix putty with plastics so I dont do it... I've read on a abs p.o plug dont use it... maybe it doesn't really attack it but if the putty is a petroleum product and plastic is a petroleum product there is a possibility there is some reaction... 

Basically its silicone for everything except brass p.os into cermaic glazed and metal enamel sink and the odd time I'll put it in if a basket strainer isn't fitting into the cup properly.. 

If it seals and lasts I'm fine with that... the only reason I dont use silicone on the things mentioned is that I can only clean it so good when its wet (silicone) the customer will have to take a scouring pad and scrub the excess off once its lost its tack where as the putty is easier for clean up wise... 

There is a guy at work never uses either... like obviously there are some things its needed for but.. he just says the rubber is what seals the basket strainer..

Now we've had this conflict before and he says rubber goes on bottom I say top... i dont know anymore because other guys say the top aswell but I trust him... whatever he does it works never have had a call back to fix his things plus hes been doing this work for 40 years plus... he said 2020 will be 43 years for him.. just an addition to stir pot lol.. 

Also I use master brand putty and it says dont use on plastic... so whatever it does.. I follow what manufacturers recommend.. hell I even have a torque wrench for fernco gear bands


----------



## skoronesa

Venomthirst said:


> I've just heard that it's a no no.. to mix putty with plastics so I dont do it... I've read on a abs p.o plug dont use it... maybe it doesn't really attack it but if the putty is a petroleum product and plastic is a petroleum product there is a possibility there is some reaction...



Correct, there is some reaction but it isn't enough to cause damage or we would be seeing failures indicating such in the field. If anything it helps the putty seal in my opinion.




Venomthirst said:


> There is a guy at work never uses either... like obviously there are some things its needed for but.. he just says the rubber is what seals the basket strainer..
> 
> Now we've had this conflict before and he says rubber goes on bottom I say top... i dont know anymore because other guys say the top aswell but I trust him... whatever he does it works never have had a call back to fix his things plus hes been doing this work for 40 years plus... he said 2020 will be 43 years for him.. just an addition to stir pot lol..




The large rubber seal for a basket strainer goes below the sink. Mind you there are two(most common) types of basket strainer and this is true for both. One has a small nut and no fiber washer but does have a rubber washer. The other has a large nut with a fiber washer and then rubber.



I guess neither has to have putty(or silicone) as when you squish the rubber washer it should expand in as well as squishing out and thus seal against the basket. I have never relied on this and don't really want to. Either way the putty(or silicone) is mainly there to fill the small gap under the lip of the strainer so no food sticks in there and rots. It also makes a seal.


Not using putty(or silicone) on a pop-up seems fine except again for the issue of stuff getting in that gap like soap and rotting or corroding the metal. The rubber washer has to make a seal whether you use putty(or silicone) or not because the holes for the overflow are there.


Honestly now that I think about it I am questioning if putty(or silicone) is really needed at all on sink baskets or pop-ups. I know that every plumber I have worked with has used putty and every one i have taken apart even from 80 years ago has had putty. But the more I think about it the more I can see how putty(or silicone) isn't really needed.


I feel like these putty(or silicone) posts need to be moved to a dedicated thread where we can debate this subject.








.


----------



## Venomthirst

Now this is where it gets messed up.. because your picture shows it on the bottom... in the kindred manual it shows the gaskets on the top... let me find you a pic


----------



## Tango

Venomthirst said:


> Now this is where it gets messed up.. because your picture shows it on the bottom... in the kindred manual it shows the gaskets on the top... let me find you a pic


It depends on the manufacturer and the thickness of the gasket. Thin gasket can go on top. Thick gasket on the bottom.

Sometimes I put silicone on kitchen basket strainers and sometimes not, it depend on the kit I have at the moment.

As for lav pop ups. No need for for a seal on top because if it goes through the overflow part catches it. It's underneath the sink that matters. I still put silicone on top and below. I don't want call backs.


----------



## Debo22

Tango said:


> As for lav pop ups. No need for for a seal on top because if it goes through the overflow part catches it. It's underneath the sink that matters. I still put silicone on top and below. I don't want call backs.


If you don’t seal the top then the water will leak through when someone uses the pop-up plunger to fill the sink, it won’t hold water. 

No need to seal the top on a lav grid strainer.


----------



## Tango

Debo22 said:


> If you don’t seal the top then the water will leak through when someone uses the pop-up plunger to fill the sink, it won’t hold water.
> 
> No need to seal the top on a lav grid strainer.



Ah ok I see. You are correct sir. Who uses the popup anyways?


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Ah ok I see. You are correct sir. Who uses the popup anyways?


anyone that wants to fill a sink with water, shaving, washing etc....


----------



## skoronesa

Venomthirst said:


> Now this is where it gets messed up.. because your picture shows it on the bottom... in the kindred manual it shows the gaskets on the top... let me find you a pic





I have seen one or two with a real thin gasket for the topside but if it has the 1/8" thick ones it goes below.


I would love to see one that your coworkers put in with the thick seal on top lolz, must look like azz!!!:vs_laugh:






.


----------



## Venomthirst

skoronesa said:


> Venomthirst said:
> 
> 
> 
> Now this is where it gets messed up.. because your picture shows it on the bottom... in the kindred manual it shows the gaskets on the top... let me find you a pic
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have seen one or two with a real thin gasket for the topside but if it has the 1/8" thick ones it goes below.
> 
> 
> I would love to see one that your coworkers put in with the thick seal on top lolz, must look like azz!!!<img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/vs_laugh.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Vs Laugh" class="inlineimg" />
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .
Click to expand...

We never actually use the ones with thick gasket... just thin gasket ones... like I say they are kindred with the 1 1/2" large nut nut the monster 3" nut or whatever it is... I just meant the thin gasket ones... 

Some guys put them on top others on bottom I asked them.. but never any leaks they say


----------



## Tango

This one is a prototype for those forgettable "no name" free standing tub drain. I've had to deal with 3 of those till now. Cheap junk but I still have to deal with them. Maybe I should find a 1 1/2" kitchen/lav type drain to replace them or something.

I have no idea if it's going to work the next time I see one. Step spade 1 1/4" to 1 3/4"

.


----------



## Venomthirst

Abs eh.. stuff is like so brittle after 5-10 years. 

Sure it is quick and cheap to put in but it dont last like copper or cast.

How's the cell core PVC in the states guys does it go brittle too..

Usually the sys 15 and xfr is quite tough and doesn't get brittle like the abs does


----------



## skoronesa

Venomthirst said:


> Abs eh.. stuff is like so brittle after 5-10 years.
> 
> Sure it is quick and cheap to put in but it dont last like copper or cast.
> 
> How's the cell core PVC in the states guys does it go brittle too..
> 
> Usually the sys 15 and xfr is quite tough and doesn't get brittle like the abs does





The little cellular core pvc I have seen was old and seemed fine. They like to use that in the city. Where I am most of us prefer pvc except for some of the older "less aspirational" guys who prefer abs.


The only application I have seen where abs might be preferred for performance reasons is when pouring a lead joint with an abs adapter. The pvc ones tend to light on fire easier where as the abs adapters put up with the heat. But really? How often are you going to pour a joint?








.


----------



## Tommy plumber

Nothing fancy, just more for convenience. I've had this copper glue pot holder for years.

The glue cans aren't likely to tip over and spill with this holder.


----------



## Tommy plumber

Nothing fancy. Just more for convenience.


I do not understand why the hell I can't rotate these pictures. It's irritating.


----------



## skoronesa

Tommy plumber said:


> Nothing fancy. Just more for convenience.
> 
> 
> I do not understand why the hell I can't rotate these pictures. It's irritating.





Assuming you have windows, open the picture with mspaint/paint, rotate the picture, and then save the file.


If you just open the file with windows picture viewer and rotate it that doesn't save the file as rotated, it just rotates it whenever you look at the file on your computer with windows picture viewer.


If you don't have the paint program you can easily download it or any other number of picture editing software.








.


----------



## Tommy plumber

...real PITA.


----------



## Tommy plumber

skoronesa said:


> Assuming you have windows, open the picture with mspaint/paint, rotate the picture, and then save the file.
> 
> 
> If you just open the file with windows picture viewer and rotate it that doesn't save the file as rotated, it just rotates it whenever you look at the file on your computer with windows picture viewer.
> 
> 
> If you don't have the paint program you can easily download it or any other number of picture editing software.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .









We used to have to use Pix re-sizer to upload photos here at PZ. But something changed and you can just up-load pictures without having to re-size them. I used to be able to rotate the pictures on my PC and then upload them here, but I can't figure it out. I'll have to go back to using my digital camera, I never had a problem with that. For some reasong I-phone pictures get screwed up.


----------



## Debo22

Tommy plumber said:


> We used to have to use Pix re-sizer to upload photos here at PZ. But something changed and you can just up-load pictures without having to re-size them. I used to be able to rotate the pictures on my PC and then upload them here, but I can't figure it out. I'll have to go back to using my digital camera, I never had a problem with that. For some reasong I-phone pictures get screwed up.


Take pictures with your iPhone horizontal not vertical and they will upload normal.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

Tango said:


> Here's one of my custom sockets in action. The moen tool didn't work in this situation.
> 
> 
> .


I like it..an invisible tool...:vs_laugh:


----------



## Tango

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> I like it..an invisible tool...:vs_laugh:


You were real quick on the trigger! I was removing the pics and going to put it in the lounge.


----------



## skoronesa

Today I made my own tools twice. The first was for a moen 1248 cartridge in a widespread tub faucet. There is a screw in retaing ring for the cartridge that has notches made to accept a tool you can get from moen. It wasn't until after I was unscrewing it with my copper pipe that I remembered I actually do have that tool in my toolbox. Oh well. Making my own was actually easier than digging to get to it! lolz :biggrin:



The second one I cut a notch in a piece of 1/2" black iron. It's hard to see in that pic but the c.o. plug I put in was about 6" down. With the notched pipe I could easily tighten the wingnut. I could have used a heavy 3/8" nut to replace the wingnut but for some reason I told my self it was best to leave the wing nut on. :vs_worry: I have had a rough start to the week. I went the whole day thinking it was tuesday too.


----------



## Alan

Seconded on the moen tool. I've made one out of cpvc before in a pinch too. Even though the diameter of the pipe is slightly off compared to their tool it works pretty good as long as they haven't let it leak for eons and corrode the inside of the valve body.

I remember the other plumber teaching me that you use needlenose pliers to remove those. After 2 or 3 times I decided he was wrong, and went searching for the right tool. :vs_laugh:


----------



## skoronesa

plumber.joe said:


> i made one a these once except i didnt have the tee handle i just used channel locks. i used it to hold the handsink drains in place while i tightened the bottom nut.





Lavatory sink


Pop-up assembly OR grid strainer


Mack gasket nut, gasket nut, mack nut




Just figured I would help you with the jargon. We all feel like an idiot when we go to the supply house and describe something like a homeowner. It happens to all of us.








.


----------



## skoronesa

plumber.joe said:


> If its in a kitchen, like a stainless steel sink mounted to a column is that still a lav? we were calling it handsink basket strainers?
> 
> mack nut i did not know of thank you... i love knowing the proper names...





Yeah, you're right lolz, in a commercial kitchen you do have a handsink or handwashing sink. And yeah, basket strainer, usually that refers to the 3-1/2" ones that fit kitchen sinks but they do make 1-1/4" basket strainers as well.










.


----------



## ShtRnsdownhill

skoronesa said:


> Lavatory sink
> 
> 
> Pop-up assembly OR grid strainer
> 
> 
> Mack gasket nut, gasket nut, mack nut
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just figured I would help you with the jargon. We all feel like an idiot when we go to the supply house and describe something like a homeowner. It happens to all of us.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .





problem with proper names is that we have seen in the past how they differ so much from region to region just in this country,,,
so your proper name by you may not be the proper name else where...


----------



## skoronesa

ShtRnsdownhill said:


> problem with proper names is that we have seen in the past how they differ so much from region to region just in this country,,,
> so your proper name by you may not be the proper name else where...





Yeah but in this day and age you can google any of the names with at least some success.


Besides, my main intent was for him not to look like an idiot. He recently moved and can just blame it on what you just described, they call it that where he comes from. Then he can proceed to explain what the part is and they won't look at him like he is an idiot hack.





.


----------



## Logtec

skoronesa said:


> Today I made my own tools twice. The first was for a moen 1248 cartridge in a widespread tub faucet. There is a screw in retaing ring for the cartridge that has notches made to accept a tool you can get from moen. It wasn't until after I was unscrewing it with my copper pipe that I remembered I actually do have that tool in my toolbox. Oh well. Making my own was actually easier than digging to get to it! lolz <img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/biggrin.png" border="0" alt="" title="Biggrin" class="inlineimg" />
> 
> 
> 
> The second one I cut a notch in a piece of 1/2" black iron. It's hard to see in that pic but the c.o. plug I put in was about 6" down. With the notched pipe I could easily tighten the wingnut. I could have used a heavy 3/8" nut to replace the wingnut but for some reason I told my self it was best to leave the wing nut on. <img src="http://www.plumbingzone.com/images/smilies/vs_worry.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Vs Worry" class="inlineimg" /> I have had a rough start to the week. I went the whole day thinking it was tuesday too.


I did the same for the moen tool, it wasn’t available anywhere a while back. 
I got the moen tool with a new moen faucet at some point after, I’m pretty sure HD sells them now..


----------



## Tango

I designed and built this before I learned such a tool existed already. Oh well I was late to the party. But it sure doesn't exist in Canada!

Rubber bottom and it prevents the block of wood and pan from sliding away where you wanted it to go in the first place. Since then I've notched the tabs to sit flush. I used it twice already and it's perfect.


.


----------



## skoronesa

Yard hydrant plunger removal tool

I don't have a welder and wanted one a little nicer than what my manager welded so I drilled and tapped a 1/2"-20 bolt for 3/8"-16. I'm surprised it's so concentric given I hand drilled it


----------



## skoronesa

Dolese Tool Co said:


> Love this thread!! Just started a new one with this info but I wanted to chime in and add to all the other rad ideas on the thread already. ...........


Plumber or not you're just spamming now.

There is a part of this forum specifically for manufacturers and salesmen.

@OpenSights I suggest you remove this link, it's the same as the one in his intro.


----------



## OpenSights




----------



## DDDave

No really Officer, it IS my car!


----------



## Debo22

I needed to stop water from draining in the wall while I was changing the cartridge


----------



## Logtec

Debo22 said:


> I needed to stop water from draining in the wall while I was changing the cartridge
> View attachment 130755


Nice, I use a business card to do the samw


----------



## skoronesa

Debo22 said:


> I needed to stop water from draining in the wall while I was changing the cartridge


I was changing a waterworks T-static hockey puck the other day and it occurred to me that a lot of the newer valve body designs don't stick out as far as the old designs, even when they are roughed in properly. Those waterworks ones hold a lot of water too! Very annoying. 

Luckily there was room to shove a rag in the wall but the tile was very sharp and I knicked myself.


----------



## Debo22

I was trying to pull these Moen cartridges straight up and out with channel locks and they wouldn’t budge. Went out to the van and came up with this idea. They came out in 2 seconds each.


----------



## sparky

Debo22 said:


> I was trying to pull these Moen cartridges straight up and out with channel locks and they wouldn’t budge. Went out to the van and came up with this idea. They came out in 2 seconds each.
> View attachment 131151


Turn hammer around and hit cartridges with "ping" end of hammer and they will come out in one second lololololololololololo


----------



## sparky

Tommy plumber said:


> For those who do service work, do you guys ever replace that diamond-shaped gasket and flush valve on Kohler W/C's? The flush valve nut is surrounded by the rubber gasket and a large channel locks doesn't fit well. So I made a socket to fit it.


I take a wood chisel and split the nut easy pezy greasy


----------



## skoronesa

Tommy plumber said:


> For those who do service work, do you guys ever replace that diamond-shaped gasket and flush valve on Kohler W/C's? The flush valve nut is surrounded by the rubber gasket and a large channel locks doesn't fit well. So I made a socket to fit it.


I have a large socket meant for truck hub nuts. 17.99$ at an autoparts store. I forget the size, 65mm maybe? Have to be acareful picking one out because many of them are 8 flats or 6 flats with rounded corners.


----------



## skoronesa

sparky said:


> I take a wood chisel and split the nut easy pezy greasy


Tightening.


----------



## Debo22

I was attempting to clear a Lav sink stoppage with the SuperVee. First I went through the pop up and could hear the cable going up the vent rattling in the wall. I pulled the trap and tried again, it kept going up. Tried forward, reverse, bent cable, and it kept going up. Hard blockage right at the throat of the santee not allowing the cable to go down. I cut a piece of PVC and jammed it in the trap arm to the back of the santee and ran the cable through it. It’s only choice was to go down. Success!


----------



## Logtec

Noce


----------



## Tommy plumber

Debo22 said:


> I was attempting to clear a Lav sink stoppage with the SuperVee. First I went through the pop up and could hear the cable going up the vent rattling in the wall. I pulled the trap and tried again, it kept going up. Tried forward, reverse, bent cable, and it kept going up. Hard blockage right at the throat of the santee not allowing the cable to go down. I cut a piece of PVC and jammed it in the trap arm to the back of the santee and ran the cable through it. It’s only choice was to go down. Success!
> View attachment 132963
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 132964





*You go boy! Now that's brilliant.*


----------



## Tango

Nice! Now I'm going to have to start carrying a small diameter pipe to fit a 1 1/2". Although I've encountered a tee inside a wall out of reach of such a trick. The problem was only a few months ago, I inserted a camera after a while to discover the tee was upside down and the cable was always going up the vent. Took over 3 hours to clear the kitchen drain. What a nightmare.


----------



## sparky

Debo22 said:


> I was attempting to clear a Lav sink stoppage with the SuperVee. First I went through the pop up and could hear the cable going up the vent rattling in the wall. I pulled the trap and tried again, it kept going up. Tried forward, reverse, bent cable, and it kept going up. Hard blockage right at the throat of the santee not allowing the cable to go down. I cut a piece of PVC and jammed it in the trap arm to the back of the santee and ran the cable through it. It’s only choice was to go down. Success!
> View attachment 132963
> View attachment 132964


Thanks for the tip,I learn something everyday from you guys


----------



## sparky

Debo22 said:


> I was attempting to clear a Lav sink stoppage with the SuperVee. First I went through the pop up and could hear the cable going up the vent rattling in the wall. I pulled the trap and tried again, it kept going up. Tried forward, reverse, bent cable, and it kept going up. Hard blockage right at the throat of the santee not allowing the cable to go down. I cut a piece of PVC and jammed it in the trap arm to the back of the santee and ran the cable through it. It’s only choice was to go down. Success!
> View attachment 132963
> View attachment 132964


Very nice but on a lot of drains we do it goes back to a 90 then to the tee


----------



## sparky

Tango said:


> Nice! Now I'm going to have to start carrying a small diameter pipe to fit a 1 1/2". Although I've encountered a tee inside a wall out of reach of such a trick. The problem was only a few months ago, I inserted a camera after a while to discover the tee was upside down and the cable was always going up the vent. Took over 3 hours to clear the kitchen drain. What a nightmare.


What did you end up doing to get cable to go down????


----------



## Tango

sparky said:


> What did you end up doing to get cable to go down????


With the camera at the tee and the cable at the junction I put vise grips on the cable, twisted and pushed until I got lucky to go down. I then removed the camera and proceeded to snake.

In debo's case you'd need to jam a hose in there first and clean the black goo with hot water.


----------



## skoronesa

A couple months ago I had back to back lav sinks that each 90'd to a mutual crosstee. My cable kept jumping accross the tee. I had to pull both traps and run the camera down one so I could watch and carefully guide my cable. I also bent the end of my cable.


----------



## sparky

skoronesa said:


> A couple months ago I had back to back lav sinks that each 90'd to a mutual crosstee. My cable kept jumping accross the tee. I had to pull both traps and run the camera down one so I could watch and carefully guide my cable. I also bent the end of my cable.


What would you do without a camera???


----------



## skoronesa

sparky said:


> What would you do without a camera???


Not work as hard.

In that instance I would have cut the wall open instead of dicking around for 20mins trying to get the snake to go down. There would be a lot more cases where I could simply say must be broken or you have to dig.


----------



## Tommy plumber

sparky said:


> What would you do without a camera???



I don't own a camera. A few years back I toyed with the idea of purchasing one, but opted to purchase electronic leak detection equipment and it hasn't disappointed. With slab leaks {for those of us who live where basements are few and far between} it is an easy sell to locate a slab leak. If fact, there is no selling involved, it sells itself. People don't have to be talked into locating and repairing a slab leak. 

But I don't think that it is as easy to sell a camera inspection. Once the stoppage is cleared, people are like, "thanks, if it backs up again, we'll call you to inspect it with the camera." In my opinion, a camera is a more difficult add-on to sell. I have had drain line stoppages where I was highly recommending a camera inspection and they didn't want to do it. I would say something like, "We should investigate this sewer line and locate the bad spot so it can be dug up and repaired." And they were not interested. Just my observation. Maybe others are skillful at selling camera inspections, but I wasn't.
So I could never justify spending $10,000 on that tool. I could not see a meaningful ROI {return on investment} whereas getting into elec. leak detection has been a real winner.

A friend of mine bought the mini or micro camera for $5,000 and he was dis-appointed. He wasn't selling sewer repairs and also, the push cable was not that stiff. Even though it had like 100' of push cable, he had trouble sending the head down sewer lines that far, because the push cable would tend to kink on him at around 50' or so and he was un-happy with that camera.

So I wisely stayed away from purchasing a camera.


----------



## MACPLUMB777

*VISIONHD 1080P CAMERA SYSTEM*



0 Review(s)
Add your review
Available instock
#SKU: VIS130-HD


1-1/2″ – 4″ Lines
1″ 1080P High Definition Self Leveling Color Camera Head with 8X Zoom Feature
Spring with Built in 512Hz Transmitter
10.2″ LCD Monitor with DVR, Speaker and Microphone for Voice Recording
Keyboard for Text Writing
100′ of 3/8″ Flexible Push Rod to Easily Maneuver Bends in Any Pipe
Foot Counter
Durable Protective Case with Partitioned Reel Housing for Quick Removal and Cleaning
Three Additional Input Connections For Use with the 200′, 400′ and Pan & Tilt Reels
Works with AC and DC Power (7hr Battery Life)
Includes: 2 Skids with Quick Change Adaptor
64gb SD Card with USB, Micro USB and USB-C Adaptor and Charging Cord

*PRICE*
$3,995.00


----------



## Debo22

Customer asked me if I can clean her dryer vent. No problem, I turned the SuperVee into the dryer vent cleaner 1000. I taped a rag to the cable and shot it through with my shop vac on the other side.


----------



## Tango

Debo22 said:


> Customer asked me if I can clean her dryer vent. No problem, I turned the SuperVee into the dryer vent cleaner 1000. I taped a rag to the cable and shot it through with my shop vac on the other side.


This is brilliant, I hope I can remember that one!


----------



## Tom F Ohio

I wish moen would come up with a tool to pull a 2 handle cartridge out instead of trying to pull on it and practically pull the sink off the counter.


----------



## skoronesa

Tom F Ohio said:


> I wish moen would come up with a tool to pull a 2 handle cartridge out instead of trying to pull on it and practically pull the sink off the counter.


Use a nipple with a cap, drill a hole in the cap, place it nipple side down over the valve body, drive a lag screw through the hole and into the plastic stem. As you tighten it will pull the stem out.


----------



## TerryTotoSucks

Tom F Ohio said:


> I wish moen would come up with a tool to pull a 2 handle cartridge out instead of trying to pull on it and practically pull the sink off the counter.











Need A Tool? Make One.







www.plumbingzone.com


----------



## Tom F Ohio

TerryTotoSucks said:


> Need A Tool? Make One.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.plumbingzone.com


PZ Do you use the nipple for anything. What size cap? You wouldn't be able to show a picture of it would you??


----------



## TerryTotoSucks

Tom F Ohio said:


> PZ Do you use the nipple for anything. What size cap? You wouldn't be able to show a picture of it would you??


@skoronesa 

You meant to quote @skoronesa


----------



## Tom F Ohio

skoronesa said:


> Use a nipple with a cap, drill a hole in the cap, place it nipple side down over the valve body, drive a lag screw through the hole and into the plastic stem. As you tighten it will pull the stem out.


Do you use the nipple. Also what size 1/2 or 3/4?? Would you be able to show a picture of what your doing?


----------



## Tom F Ohio

TerryTotoSucks said:


> @skoronesa
> 
> You meant to quote @skoronesa


Thanks Terry


----------



## skoronesa

Tom F Ohio said:


> Do you use the nipple. Also what size 1/2 or 3/4?? Would you be able to show a picture of what your doing?


You can use a 1/2" or bigger nipple, roughly a couple inches in length. You don't even really need a threaded cap, it could be a strong washer with the right size hole for the lag screw.

Think of a Moen plastic two handle stem, it has that center hole for the handle screw. You can drive a screw/lag into that hole. Then you can pull up on the head of the screw/lag. Often I will slip a wrench of some kind under the screw head and pry it up. The benefit of using that nipple/cap is as you drive the screw in it bottoms out on the cap and since it can't go down the stem comes up. You won't be prying on the edge of the valve body and risk damaging the bonnet threads.


----------



## Cityplumber

*







*
Made this from a piece of bar stock: it fits the top of Sloan flush valves and always does the job. Perfect when I'm working on a concealed one in a wall.


----------



## Nazareth

Cityplumber said:


> *
> View attachment 136590
> *
> Made this from a piece of bar stock: it fits the top of Sloan flush valves and always does the job. Perfect when I'm working on a concealed one in a wall.


Awesome


----------



## TerryTotoSucks

@Tommy plumber








2.5-Inch Wrench (for toilet flush valve nut) - Solid HDPE plastic | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2.5-Inch Wrench (for toilet flush valve nut) - Solid HDPE plastic at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.com





Scroll through the pics. You may be interested.


----------



## skoronesa

TerryTotoSucks said:


> @Tommy plumber
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2.5-Inch Wrench (for toilet flush valve nut) - Solid HDPE plastic | eBay
> 
> 
> Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 2.5-Inch Wrench (for toilet flush valve nut) - Solid HDPE plastic at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!
> 
> 
> 
> www.ebay.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Scroll through the pics. You may be interested.


I just use a wheel locknut socket. It was ~12$ at the local autoparts store. I have them in a few sizes on the van because some large PRVs require them for disassembly. Of course Apollo doesn't tell you this in the manual....









Amazon.com: Powerbuilt 647065 2-1/2-Inch 6-Point Hex Wheel Bearing Locknut Socket : Tools & Home Improvement


Amazon.com: Powerbuilt 647065 2-1/2-Inch 6-Point Hex Wheel Bearing Locknut Socket : Tools & Home Improvement



www.amazon.com


----------



## Cityplumber

Trying to loosen the thin hex bonnet on a Sloan flush valve inside of a wall with a socket will only round off the corners of the hex: Unless you crawl inside the wall and try to steady the socket with one hand while you pull on the handle: 
The hex is only 1/4 inch of chrome plated yellow brass and if it has not been moved in a while, the only way is heat and a straight pull thru a 12x12 access panel. Exposed valves are child's play----- go bust your knuckles in a jagged masonry wall and leave some skin on the brick ties and rebar. Bet you will put that socket back in the toolbox.


----------



## TerryTotoSucks

Cityplumber said:


> Trying to loosen the thin hex bonnet on a Sloan flush valve inside of a wall with a socket will only round off the corners of the hex: Unless you crawl inside the wall and try to steady the socket with one hand while you pull on the handle:
> The hex is only 1/4 inch of chrome plated yellow brass and if it has not been moved in a while, the only way is heat and a straight pull thru a 12x12 access panel. Exposed valves are child's play----- go bust your knuckles in a jagged masonry wall and leave some skin on the brick ties and rebar. Bet you will put that socket back in the toolbox.


The socket was posted as a tool to remove and install flushvalve nuts for kohler two piece toilets that install inside its tank to Bowl gasket. 

We’ve moved on from the sloan valves.


----------



## skoronesa

Cityplumber said:


> Trying to loosen the thin hex bonnet on a Sloan flush valve inside of a wall with a socket will only round off the corners of the hex: Unless you crawl inside the wall and try to steady the socket with one hand while you pull on the handle:
> The hex is only 1/4 inch of chrome plated yellow brass and if it has not been moved in a while, the only way is heat and a straight pull thru a 12x12 access panel. Exposed valves are child's play----- go bust your knuckles in a jagged masonry wall and leave some skin on the brick ties and rebar.  Bet you will put that socket back in the toolbox.


I don't use a socket for sloan valves, as Terry explained it's for Kohler T/B seals.

And yes, I have plenty of experience with concealed Sloan valves. I have a Sloan Superwrench but usually just use sharp Channellocks.

Did you know if you grind the end of a socket it will be sharper and bite onto shallow flats?


----------



## DDDave

TerryTotoSucks said:


> The socket was posted as a tool to remove and install flushvalve nuts for kohler two piece toilets that install inside its tank to Bowl gasket.
> 
> We’ve moved on from the sloan valves.


Missed that. Better late than never with the heads up I guess


----------

