# Epoxy job



## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

Gotta little Epipe job to do today





























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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

Whoa that's cool man.. I've heard of that. Is that your equipment or is it subbed out?


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

UN1TED-WE-PLUMB said:


> Whoa that's cool man.. I've heard of that. Is that your equipment or is it subbed out?


It's ours

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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

I like the hose clamp repair on the side of the truck :laughing:


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

That's pretty cool. How does it not gum up shower valves, water heaters etc..


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

UN1TED-WE-PLUMB said:


> That's pretty cool. How does it not gum up shower valves, water heaters etc..












I know it's kind of hard to see but this stem will let you change from hot and cold on the showers valves.. The water heaters you just cut loose and epoxy the water lines to that point.. Shark bites only after you epoxy the lines

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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

So, do you leave a brass tag on the main shutoff that says the system has been epoxy lined and that the copper can never be repaired with a torch?






Paul


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

stupid helper said:


> View attachment 21722
> 
> 
> I know it's kind of hard to see but this stem will let you change from hot and cold on the showers valves.. The water heaters you just cut loose and epoxy the water lines to that point.. Shark bites only after you epoxy the lines


I've never understood the logic behind that. What prevents water from getting between the epoxy coating and the copper tube and migrating to the pinhole leaks?


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

That is a crazy procedure for sure. And only shark bites huh.. Strange. This must save money over a water pipe job right? How long does it take?


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

ha, mandatory sharkbites. Now I've seen everything.


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> ha, mandatory sharkbites. Now I've seen everything.


 
I can imagine everything else, including brass compression and Propress would stress the pipe too much and possibly crack the epoxy lining inside. 





Paul


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

rocksteady said:


> So, do you leave a brass tag on the main shutoff that says the system has been epoxy lined and that the copper can never be repaired with a torch?
> 
> Paul


We put stickers on but usually just at the water heater.. Because in "theory" your not supposed to have anymore problems with the waterline.. We offer a lifetime warranty

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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

What if they want to move some plumbing, like the kitchen sink from the dark corner to the center of a window? Or if they plan on adding a powder room.


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

UN1TED-WE-PLUMB said:


> That is a crazy procedure for sure. And only shark bites huh.. Strange. This must save money over a water pipe job right? How long does it take?


We're doing a 2 1/2 bath house and we got 3 days figured in it. One day to dry and sand the line.. One day to shoot epoxy and one day to put it all back together

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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

SewerRatz said:


> What if they want to move some plumbing, like the kitchen sink from the dark corner to the center of a window? Or if they plan on adding a powder room.


You can still add on.. Just cut into the line and use a shark bite fitting then after that its business as usual

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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

Widdershins said:


> I've never understood the logic behind that. What prevents water from getting between the epoxy coating and the copper tube and migrating to the pinhole leaks?


You dry the lines out before you do the epoxy

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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

So it's safe to use cutters on?

And what is the advantage to this over a water pipe job?

It almost seems more labor intensive.. I can re pipe a house with copper in 2 days start to finish.


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

UN1TED-WE-PLUMB said:


> So it's safe to use cutters on?
> 
> And what is the advantage to this over a water pipe job?
> 
> It almost seems more labor intensive.. I can re pipe a house with copper in 2 days start to finish.


Don't have to tear out walls.. And it's gotta lifetime warranty on it. But yeah you can still use cutters on it.. Its good when you have a leak under a slab.. It takes 24 hrs for the epoxy to cure so that adds a day.. I would rather re-pipe but I just do what I'm told

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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Junk, Junk, Junk! I have never seen a job where it made sense to use epoxy in lieu of replacing the pipe. That junk usually cares a 10-year warranty with no coverage for ensuing damage. 

Mark


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

ToUtahNow said:


> Junk, Junk, Junk! I have never seen a job where it made sense to use epoxy in lieu of replacing the pipe. That junk usually cares a 10-year warranty with no coverage for ensuing damage.
> 
> Mark


If I wanted to hear a smartass comment I'll go talk to my boss.. I don't need it from you too

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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

stupid helper said:


> You dry the lines out before you do the epoxy


That isn't what I meant.

The epoxy lining separates from the copper tube when you cut it with a tubing cutter, thus allowing water to get between the epoxy coating and the copper tube.

I do remodels on several commercial spaces in Seattle that have been epiped and I can assure you the epoxy doesn't stay adhered to the copper tubing for very long. In some cases you can pull it straight out of a 5'-10' section of pipe in one piece with very little resistance.


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

stupid helper said:


> If I wanted to hear a smartass comment I'll go talk to my boss.. I don't need it from you too


I deal with epipe all the time. It's fine if you never cut into it, but it's pretty much worthless once you do.

Water *WILL* get between the epoxy lining and the CT and eventually migrate to pinholes once you breach the contiguousness of the epoxy liner.


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

Widdershins said:


> I deal with epipe all the time. It's fine if you never cut into it, but it's pretty much worthless once you do.
> 
> Water *WILL* get between the epoxy lining and the CT and eventually migrate to pinholes once you breach the contiguousness of the epoxy liner.


I believe you

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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

stupid helper said:


> If I wanted to hear a smartass comment I'll go talk to my boss.. I don't need it from you too
> 
> best helper minimum wage can buy



That's not smart-ass that is the truth. It is a bad system for everyone but the franchisee and the plumber who scores the referral fee. The owner ends up with a job that is guaranteed for 10-years. Then when and if it leaks they tear up whatever they want to add a repair and the owner gets to fix the mess themselves.

I've been watching this system evolve for years and in my opinion it is junk. As a consultant I have worked on everything from a single residential home to 750 Condo project where this has been offered as a repair. It has never been less expensive then replacing the pipe and repairing the walls.

Mark


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## Mississippiplum (Sep 30, 2011)

I think it's just easier to re-pipe, one weak spot or hole in that Epoxy and the whole thing is fuucked. I'd rather have my walls torn out and spend the money once for a repipe rather then pay for the lining and then pay again for a repipe when that lining fails.

Sent from my iPhone 10.5


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Now Stupid...you're just an employee or are you the owner pushing the product? Not trying to be dumb but am curious.

Also curious...if you could do this your way, would you stick with the sharkbite?


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

gear junkie said:


> Now Stupid...you're just an employee or are you the owner pushing the product? Not trying to be dumb but am curious.
> 
> Also curious...if you could do this your way, would you stick with the sharkbite?


Haha I'm not trying to push the product.. I'm a commercial guy.. This is too much like service work to me.. And no I don't like shark bites.. I don't trust anything to join pipe together except me soldering lol

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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

I know the leak detector company I use has found leaks in epipe.

My neighbor had it done, it took them 3 times before the epoxy plugged his leak. But hey, he has a lifetime warranty.

I have often wondered how they are sure all the pipes are coated evenly.

The only advantage is the lack of damage to the house. Tile and fancy wallpaper come to mind.


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

Biggest downfall is you can only turn your water heater up to 120 degrees

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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

gitnerdun said:


> I know the leak detector company I use has found leaks in epipe.
> 
> My neighbor had it done, it took them 3 times before the epoxy plugged his leak. But hey, he has a lifetime warranty.
> 
> ...


I would double check that lifetime warranty. In the first place their web site clearly states "Complete ePIPE - Ten Year Warranty". Secondly, the system has only been out there for 12-years so who knows how long it will last.

http://www.restoremypipes.com/services/residential

Mark


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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

stupid helper said:


> Biggest downfall is you can only turn your water heater up to 120 degrees
> 
> best helper minimum wage can buy


 
Thats a new one, maybe that should be on a label too. I like a shower hotter than that. Heck, my solar water heater rises to 150 easily.


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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> I would double check that lifetime warranty. In the first place their web site clearly states "Complete ePIPE - Ten Year Warranty". Secondly, the system has only been out there for 12-years so who knows how long it will last.
> 
> http://www.restoremypipes.com/services/residential
> 
> Mark


 
There are different companies out there, and yes, he said lifetime. I asked him who takes it over when his company is gone.


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

Cool technology but it may be just that... Cool technology and fancy equipment..


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

The *ONLY* scenario where I can see some value would be in an under slab leak where a reroute was a PIA and a total repipe is out of the budget. For it to be worthwhile though, you'd have to just line the section that has failed and be able to do it for less than a grand. Even still, I would consider it a temporary repair until a repipe could be worked into the budget and would tell the customer as much.




Paul


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## UN1TED-WE-PLUMB (Oct 3, 2012)

stupid helper said:


> Biggest downfall is you can only turn your water heater up to 120 degrees
> 
> best helper minimum wage can buy


Huge downfall.. I'm not liking what I learning about this stuff.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

gitnerdun said:


> There are different companies out there, and yes, he said lifetime. I asked him who takes it over when his company is gone.


Ace Duraflo which is ePipe is the biggest out there follow by Curaflow and they both only offer a 10-year warranty. I am not aware of any others but would be interested to hear of anyone offering a "lifetime" warranty.

Mark


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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> Ace Duraflo which is ePipe is the biggest out there follow by Curaflow and they both only offer a 10-year warranty. I am not aware of any others but would be interested to hear of anyone offering a "lifetime" warranty.
> 
> Mark


I just called him, it was nuflow with a 250 year warranty.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

gitnerdun said:


> I just called him, it was nuflow with a 250 year warranty.


Thanks, I thought NuFlow only did commercial work. They relined a cast iron vent stack on a project I am on. They charged $14,450 for 90' of 2" in a five year old building.

Mark


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## Cuda (Mar 16, 2009)

This is a system I was looking at for water mains not repipes.

http://www.lmktechnologies.com/images/pdfs/neofit-sellsheet.pdf

It is big in Australia where they have lead water lines, I read a lot about it and thought how much could it be? A steamer some heat looks real portable, I called and was floored....... the small unit was 85k we will keep doing them with the pipe burster mole or a shovel. But the concept is really cool!


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## PrecisePlumbing (Jan 31, 2011)

ToUtahNow said:


> Thanks, I thought NuFlow only did commercial work. They relined a cast iron vent stack on a project I am on. They charged $14,450 for 90' of 2" in a five year old building.
> 
> Mark


Wow (long whistle)


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

gitnerdun said:


> I just called him, it was nuflow with a 250 year warranty.


It looks like that warranty must be from the franchisee and not from Nu Flow.

_"5. Guaranteed - All potable lining restoration work performed includes a full 10 year installation guarantee. The coating used in potable water applications has a rated life of 35-50 years under normal use and has exhibited a potential useful life of up to 80 years in accelerated laboratory mechanical testing."_

http://www.nuflowamerica.com/pdf/The Cost-Effective Alternative to Re-Piping Booklet.pdf

Mark


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## gitnerdun (Nov 5, 2008)

My neighbor brags about his warranty constantly. I'm not going to burst his bubble.


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## stupid helper (Sep 30, 2012)

gitnerdun said:


> My neighbor brags about his warranty constantly. I'm not going to burst his bubble.


I don't know what other company's do but we offer a lifetime guarantee.. If you ever have problems with it we come and fix it

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## James420 (Nov 14, 2012)

I have been out of service work too long, I was always taught to keep stuff out of the potable water system, not directly add to it.

Maybe I shoud start a business re piping houses with schedule 80 or better yet schedule 160 galvenized. By the time it leaks I'll be dead. Lifetime Warranty. :laughing:


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

I wouldn't want my drinking water coming from a line coated with epoxy.


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## antiCon (Jun 15, 2012)

is it just me or are there (2 ) too many numbers in the phone number? and yeah.. not good to cut into system... if you do you need to recoat the whole thing...


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## flynnstone (Nov 14, 2011)

First time hearing about lining water lines, thought they only did that for drain lines. Learn something everyday, I'd go the repipe route, but to each his own.


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