# best fill valve?



## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

I have only used the 528pro but I am wondering your preferred fill valves. Which ones give you the least & most callbacks?


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I use the pro45. I don't think there's any difference from a 400. Only time it hasn't worked was in a fancy toto. A korky probably would have but I put a toto back in for that.


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

I was looking at the pro45 vs 400...looks like the only difference is the cap's color


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## Workhorseplmg (Apr 10, 2013)

Is it the pro45 that has the brass shank?


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

I think that's like a pro45b. I use the plastic shank version.


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

I am looking at trying wolverine brass. they seem the best quality.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Pro45 is what I install. I can't say they're the cat's meow, I do find bad ones, probably one or two per hundred. Good enough odds, but always tell my customers to call anytime they think something's wrong. Nothing is made to last anymore, which, on the bright side for us means more work.

On my first week of plumbing I had to tell a little old lady that she just needed her cock and balls replaced. Yeah, I didn't have the terminology down quite right yet. Thankfully it just went right over her head. The guy that was training me took off running so he wouldn't burst out laughing. I never heard the end of it around the shop.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

The Hydro Clean is an awesome valve. Many many clever ideas. I've used them exclusively for a decade or more.


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

dhal22 said:


> The Hydro Clean is an awesome valve. Many many clever ideas. I've used them exclusively for a decade or more.


Never heard of them before. I will look into this.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

I would love to find one that's not sold by a box storeroom looks like the ones sold at the box store. Any suggestion?


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

plungerboy said:


> I would love to find one that's not sold by a box storeroom looks like the ones sold at the box store. Any suggestion?


Why does that matter? In my opinion, the person who's going to purchase it from a box store won't call you to fix it anyhow. Unless they mess it up and call you to fix it. I get your point but I have given up caring about what those stores sell because it ain't changing.

I'm not meaning this in a harsh way, PB, just my opinion. BTW, do you have your reservations for next year's WWETT show, yet? Looking forward to seeing you again.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

versaceflappers said:


> Never heard of them before. I will look into this.


11? I think patents on a simple filler valve. It blows the fluid master away.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> Why does that matter? In my opinion, the person who's going to purchase it from a box store won't call you to fix it anyhow. Unless they mess it up and call you to fix it. I get your point but I have given up caring about what those stores sell because it ain't changing. I'm not meaning this in a harsh way, PB, just my opinion. BTW, do you have your reservations for next year's WWETT show, yet? Looking forward to seeing you again.


I see your point about the box store purchaser. My only concern is I charge good money to rebuild a customer's toilet. If the customer sees me use parts that they know are low-cost that they can buy at a home Center then I feel that I cant charge what I need to make on a job like that. I buy as much as I can from the supply house which my customers typically don't have access to therefore they don't have any idea what the costs are. Plus if I can buy something that's only sold at our supply houses that appears that I'm using a superior part that they can't get at the home centers.

As of now no reservations yet but would like to still planning on attending. 

Check out this toilet from 1928 that we worked on: all I did was install stopper and adjust the water level too afraid to touch the other parts.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Wow, beautiful antique.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

plungerboy said:


> I see your point about the box store purchaser. My only concern is I charge good money to rebuild a customer's toilet. If the customer sees me use parts that they know are low-cost that they can buy at a home Center then I feel that I cant charge what I need to make on a job like that. I buy as much as I can from the supply house which my customers typically don't have access to therefore they don't have any idea what the costs are. Plus if I can buy something that's only sold at our supply houses that appears that I'm using a superior part that they can't get at the home centers.
> 
> As of now no reservations yet but would like to still planning on attending.
> 
> ...


I hear ya and get your point. I guess I have never had a customer that I rebuilt a toilet for ask about the fill valve I use. I have had them ask how I can justify the cost for a $10 part but not in a long time. I used to put in all brass Mansfield ball cocks but they're limited as to where they will fit and eventually I got tired of messing with them and switched to fluidmaster after that. Very few issues and inexpensive. Here, any old Joe can go to a plumbing supply house and buy whatever they want except CSST pipe. But at home cheapo they can legally buy CSST. (Sigh) whatever... My biz hasn't slowed down because of it. And again, it ain't gonna get better.


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## plungerboy (Oct 17, 2013)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> I hear ya and get your point. I guess I have never had a customer that I rebuilt a toilet for ask about the fill valve I use. I have had them ask how I can justify the cost for a $10 part but not in a long time


This is exactly why we are on the hunt. Some jerk went and reviewed me and slammed me "how can the plumber charge $$ for a part that only cost $10.00" you can try and explain the usual cost of business but some dummies don't get it or they think it's okay to make a profit as long as it's not off them. This is why I am looking for a "professional" ballcock. 

We where using the Mansfield 08-10 but they don't fit well in the 1.6 very often. We are now on to korky all black fill valve. I think it's for a toto. 
This is what it looks like. 










When I went to the box store to see what I was up against I noticed the korky was not at eye level at 3 stores. Boy does that make me seem crazy or what!! But I am hoping most home owner wouldn't notice them as much as the FM at eye level. So far it has been 8 months with no issues.


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## Green Country (Mar 6, 2009)

dhal22 said:


> The Hydro Clean is an awesome valve. Many many clever ideas. I've used them exclusively for a decade or more.


Which model do you use? Where do you get them?


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

plungerboy said:


> This is exactly why we are on the hunt. Some jerk went and reviewed me and slammed me "how can the plumber charge $$ for a part that only cost $10.00" you can try and explain the usual cost of business but some dummies don't get it or they think it's okay to make a profit as long as it's not off them. This is why I am looking for a "professional" ballcock.
> 
> We where using the Mansfield 08-10 but they don't fit well in the 1.6 very often. We are now on to korky all black fill valve. I think it's for a toto.
> This is what it looks like.
> ...


Were you allowed to respond to the negative review? And you're not doing your job right if you don't get a price complaint every once in a while.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Green Country said:


> Which model do you use? Where do you get them?


http://www.gomjsi.com/products/flush-valve-cleaning-tube/


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

dhal22 said:


> http://www.gomjsi.com/products/flush-valve-cleaning-tube/


That's the one I was thinking you were talking about. I've seen them at Menards, but never used one. I figured they were a gimmick, but I can see keeping the tank clean without intank chemicals voiding warranty.

I may have to try one.


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

plungerboy said:


> I would love to find one that's not sold by a box storeroom looks like the ones sold at the box store. Any suggestion?


Do you mean one that is sold by a wholesaler but not at home depot?
Only ones I know of are Korky 528PRO, fluidmaster PRO45(U/B) and i think wolverine brass.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

They are not a gimmick. Fluidmaster copied several of the designs. 

Just the single ability to balance the bowl filling and tank filling idea is brilliant. Once home owners understand that I swap every filler valve in the house. 
The sediment jetting hose, the torque nut underneath, the filler arm lock, the height adjustment simplicity, all are ideas never seen before this valve came out. If I was the fluid master ceo, I would have called a board meeting and shot everyone including myself. Instead they just copied some ideas.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

dhal22 said:


> They are not a gimmick. Fluidmaster copied several of the designs.
> 
> Just the single ability to balance the bowl filling and tank filling idea is brilliant. Once home owners understand that I swap every filler valve in the house.
> The sediment jetting hose, the torque nut underneath, the filler arm lock, the height adjustment simplicity, all are ideas never seen before this valve came out. If I was the fluid master ceo, I would have called a board meeting and shot everyone including myself. Instead they just copied some ideas.


The balancing option is on the brass Mansfield ball cock. Lots of Kohler one piece toilets used that technology with the 1B1X style ball cock and older styles too as did other brands in the past. It is a good idea. I can see how the sediment jet could help. What do these cost?


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

dhal22 said:


> They are not a gimmick. Fluidmaster copied several of the designs.
> 
> Just the single ability to balance the bowl filling and tank filling idea is brilliant. Once home owners understand that I swap every filler valve in the house.
> The sediment jetting hose, the torque nut underneath, the filler arm lock, the height adjustment simplicity, all are ideas never seen before this valve came out. If I was the fluid master ceo, I would have called a board meeting and shot everyone including myself. Instead they just copied some ideas.


You a salesman for them? LOL. I have some rebates from Menards coming.... I'll get a couple and put 'em in my stools. If they are as good as you say, I'll start using them.

Thanks for the info!


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

dhal22 said:


> They are not a gimmick. Fluidmaster copied several of the designs.
> 
> Just the single ability to balance the bowl filling and tank filling idea is brilliant. Once home owners understand that I swap every filler valve in the house.
> The sediment jetting hose, the torque nut underneath, the filler arm lock, the height adjustment simplicity, all are ideas never seen before this valve came out. If I was the fluid master ceo, I would have called a board meeting and shot everyone including myself. Instead they just copied some ideas.


Fluidmaster copies designs from everyone. This is why I am hesitant to use their products. They have faced lawsuits in the past for this. Their products are cheap but you get what you pay for.


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

OpenSights said:


> You a salesman for them? LOL. I have some rebates from Menards coming.... I'll get a couple and put 'em in my stools. If they are as good as you say, I'll start using them.
> 
> Thanks for the info!


this looks interesting.
http://www.constructionrepair.net/product-review-mjsi-hydroright-dual-flush.html


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

versaceflappers said:


> this looks interesting.
> http://www.constructionrepair.net/product-review-mjsi-hydroright-dual-flush.html


Oh heck no! I hate dual flushers! If a HO wants one, fine. No warranty other than bolts and wax.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

OpenSights said:


> You a salesman for them? LOL. I have some rebates from Menards coming.... I'll get a couple and put 'em in my stools. If they are as good as you say, I'll start using them.
> 
> Thanks for the info!



No, I saw them at a supply house and didn't consider them for years. Once while awaiting my turn I found an open installation guide and was amazed at some of the great ideas. Many years later, other than Toto or other specialized valves, I only install the hydroclean.

Just read the manual.


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## plumb1bob (Dec 14, 2012)

I use plain fluidmaster, right out of the box. work great in crappy well water or public water. low or high pressure. NO CALLBACK PROBLEMS, I always take the top off to flush any debris before putting in service.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Wolverine Brass " hush" , brass shank ballcock with USA made Wolverine Brass DOUBLE metal nut supply tube !

What do you see crack and flood most times anymore ? The plastic nuts provided on ballcocks or the plastic shank itself ,,,, NO THANK YOU


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> http://www.gomjsi.com/products/flush-valve-cleaning-tube/





OpenSights said:


> That's the one I was thinking you were talking about. I've seen them at Menards, but never used one. I figured they were a gimmick, but I can see keeping the tank clean without intank chemicals voiding warranty.
> 
> I may have to try one.


They are a gimmick...

Think twice about washing any debris and sediment from the bottom of the tank into the ports in the base of the toilet...

I installed some for a customer years ago (Customer Supplied) who had a sand problem in his well. He never did get his well problem fixed but he does have new toilets now...

He'll be getting a new well soon enough, his shallow well on the lake will probably be going dry soon as the lake is being drained down for dam repairs. He thinks the state will be giving him a new well but the word I heard from the state is if you are drinking lake water out of a shallow well you need a real well and you are on your own...:laughing:


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

I've installed the Hydroclean filler valve exclusively for 10 yrs or more, 100's and 100's of them. I buy them by the case. Probably 2 or 3 failures ever. I see my valves on toilets of repeat customers so old that I don't even remember replacing it's been so many years. 

11(?) patents is not a gimmick.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> 11(?) patents is not a gimmick.


Well yes it is a gimmick...

As I stated I'd think twice about washing sediment from the tank into the internal water passages of the bowl...

You can patent pretty much anything you dream up...
But that doesn't make it a good idea...


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

What is the gimmick? The 1st bowl/tank balancing valve ever, the best height adjustment idea, the 1st to have a float lock to stop the water while other repairs are made, the torque nut underneath is a great idea, etc, etc.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> What is the gimmick? The 1st bowl/tank balancing valve ever, the best height adjustment idea, the 1st to have a float lock to stop the water while other repairs are made, the torque nut underneath is a great idea, etc, etc.


Gimmick is cleaning the tank...



Redwood said:


> As I stated I'd think twice about washing sediment from the tank into the internal water passages of the bowl...


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Ahh. What about how cool the customer thinks that idea is? Or how much is assists in a sale? Many many customers seeing the valve and it's ideas (especially the balancing valve) have instructed us to replace every valve in the house no matter how old the toilet is. 

I would say you are doing your customer an injustice to continue to install valves that waste water.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> Ahh. What about how cool the customer thinks that idea is? Or how much is assists in a sale? Many many customers seeing the valve and it's ideas (especially the balancing valve) have instructed us to replace every valve in the house no matter how old the toilet is.
> 
> I would say you are doing your customer an injustice to continue to install valves that waste water.


As with any product I carefully evaluate it and decide whether it is a product that I would supply to a customer...

The Hydro-Clean Fill Valve was used by me on several jobs and I decided it was not a product I wanted to back with my time and money for several reasons...

The first obviously is that I do not want to flush sediment and debris from the bottom of the tank into the internal water passages of the toilet where it may clog the water passages and degrade the flushing of the toilet...

The second reason was the balancing valve which proved to be very finicky to adjust in a customer's home that was supplied by a well system and had a wide pressure/flow variation. I'm not exposing myself to possible callbacks for this reason...

Sorry! It didn't pass muster as a product I would recommend to customers...

If the customer thinks it is a Great Idea they are free to provide it and I'll happily install it at their own risk...


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I do see how they can clog up the "jets", as I call them/describe them, in the bowl especially in hard/iron water areas like mine. I've even replaced a fluidmaster under warranty twice in one week to find the whole issue was sediment in the old galvie supply lines, even after purging them.

There will never be a perfect product for anything.... but that just insures future work for all of us.


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## srloren (Nov 19, 2014)

*I like them...*



OpenSights said:


> I do see how they can clog up the "jets", as I call them/describe them, in the bowl especially in hard/iron water areas like mine. I've even replaced a fluidmaster under warranty twice in one week to find the whole issue was sediment in the old galvie supply lines, even after purging them.
> 
> There will never be a perfect product for anything.... but that just insures future work for all of us.


 I have used them with success in my own home but I am not on a well. I do get debris in the bottom of my tanks from time to time when the Water District works on nearby lines in the street but I have not had a problem with these fill valves. I like the innovations they offer..


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Other than the major city near me we have crappy water. I have to remove my shower head and soak it in CLR overnight every 3-4 months when Mrs. OpenSights starts complaining it stings her upper lady parts... and I'm on city water. That's just a simple Kohler shower head... So I can see the argument about sediment build up in the bowl being valid in my area... guess it all depends on where you are and what the potable water quality/content is.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

VersaciFlapper - How about an intro???


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Phat Cat said:


> VersaciFlapper - How about an intro???


I thought that at first.... but got wound up in the rest of the thread and forgot about it! LOL!


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

OpenSights said:


> I thought that at first.... but got wound up in the rest of the thread and forgot about it! LOL!


A few slip by here and there. :laughing:


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## Green Country (Mar 6, 2009)

I picked up a hydroclean from Home Depot the other day. I haven't installed it yet but just by feeling it it seems like a higher quality than the fluidmasters. I'm going to install it at my house and try it out. I think the self cleaning feature will be a selling point if I decide to start carrying it. 

Redwood, I can see what you're saying but that is also an extreme example. I admit I don't KNOW, but I would be surprised to find passageways in a toilet clogged with sediment that made it through the fill valve under normal conditions. 

And if the cleaning feature is the only drawback you could probably leave that part off or position it so that it didn't really clean.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

dhal22 said:


> What is the gimmick? The 1st bowl/tank balancing valve ever, the best height adjustment idea, the 1st to have a float lock to stop the water while other repairs are made, the torque nut underneath is a great idea, etc, etc.


What makes you think they have the first ever balancing valve? I named a few other brands that utilize that technology in an earlier post. That technology has been around for a long time. When did Hydro-clean invent it?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> What makes you think they have the first ever balancing valve? I named a few other brands that utilize that technology in an earlier post. That technology has been around for a long time. When did Hydro-clean invent it?


Fluidmaster did the one with the screw clamp pinching the nose...


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Redwood said:


> Fluidmaster did the one with the screw clamp pinching the nose...


Yeah and the 1B1X ball cock had that technology it on theirs a long time ago with the outlet screw adjuster on the hush tube. Mansfield had it on theirs with a brass screw on the fill tube connection. All I was saying is that technology isn't exclusive to Hydro-clean and as you have stated, some versions end up getting calcified with hard water or well water.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> What makes you think they have the first ever balancing valve? I named a few other brands that utilize that technology in an earlier post. That technology has been around for a long time. When did Hydro-clean invent it?


Ok, the 1st one I ever saw. It being patented I assumed it was the 1st.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Fluidmaster did the one with the screw clamp pinching the nose...


I noticed that well after I started using the hydroclean.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> I noticed that well after I started using the hydroclean.


They were selling them years before HydroClean fill valves were on the market...

They had them on the Fluidmaster Leak Sentry fill valves which was another bad idea I had tried out...


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Green Country said:


> Redwood, I can see what you're saying but that is also an extreme example. I admit I don't KNOW, but I would be surprised to find passageways in a toilet clogged with sediment that made it through the fill valve under normal conditions.


I find that to be the #1 reason for a poor flushing toilet...
I use a piece of coathanger wire to clean the ports under the rim of the toilet on every toilet auger job and every rebuild...

But then again, that might be why I charge $200 to auger a toilet and guarantee it will not clog for 1 week...

I get it and almost never have callbacks...:yes:


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Hydroclean works for me. Easy EASY to sell (+1), it sells itself after an introduction to the customer, almost never a callback (+2), easy to install, no failures causing and insurance claim ever, therefore it is my preferred fill valve. Beyond that if I am wrong I don't care because the Hydroclean puts money in my pocket.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

No offense of course.....................................


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## Green Country (Mar 6, 2009)

Redwood said:


> I find that to be the #1 reason for a poor flushing toilet... I use a piece of coathanger wire to clean the ports under the rim of the toilet on every toilet auger job and every rebuild... But then again, that might be why I charge $200 to auger a toilet and guarantee it will not clog for 1 week... I get it and almost never have callbacks...:yes:


Is that sediment or mineral deposits? I see mineral buildup all the time, but can't recall ever seeing sediment clogging anything.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Green Country said:


> Is that sediment or mineral deposits? I see mineral buildup all the time, but can't recall ever seeing sediment clogging anything.


When the mineral deposits close enough to restrict water do you really think that sediment will pass?


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

I've got 10 year old (at least) hydroclean fill valves in a couple of the builders grade toilets in my house and no sediment problems. We replace flappers, etc in repeat customers toilets with previously installed hydroclean fill valves so old I don't even remember when I installed them. Again, never a sediment problem. I service toilets I installed the 90's and most of them now have hydroclean valves, again, no sediment problems.

Maybe it's our water quality.....


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

dhal22 said:


> Hydroclean works for me. Easy EASY to sell (+1), it sells itself after an introduction to the customer, almost never a callback (+2), easy to install, no failures causing and insurance claim ever, therefore it is my preferred fill valve. Beyond that if I am wrong I don't care because the Hydroclean puts money in my pocket.


Fair enough, man. I was mostly curious because I had seen that technology on many other ball cocks. If you like it and it works for you, then by all means, stick with it. I stick with parts that work for me. 

Some parts work better in different regions due to water quality. I appreciate your opinions on it as I do most plumbers on here because I sure as hell don't know about every product. Not everyone can be a Redwood and know or have used every plumbing product.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> Fair enough, man. I was mostly curious because I had seen that technology on many other ball cocks. If you like it and it works for you, then by all means, stick with it. I stick with parts that work for me.
> 
> Some parts work better in different regions due to water quality. I appreciate your opinions on it as I do most plumbers on here because I sure as hell don't know about every product. Not everyone can be a Redwood and know or have used every plumbing product.


He is a national treasure.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Redwood said:


> I find that to be the #1 reason for a poor flushing toilet...
> I use a piece of coathanger wire to clean the ports under the rim of the toilet on every toilet auger job and every rebuild...
> 
> But then again, that might be why I charge $200 to auger a toilet and guarantee it will not clog for 1 week...
> ...


Interesting idea! 1 week warranty is void for objects I assume. 

I knew a guy that would offer a muriatic acid flush through the jets at an up charge for any rebuild or auger. It works great to get the major gunk out. I pull my toilet every six months, rebuild it and do the flush in a tote. He lets it go down the drain. I do it over a metal barrel cut in half, filter the acid and put it back in the container for next time.

Like I said, we have bad water here. It's about time for me to do it again. Monday when getting dressed my 6Y/O comes up stairs and says "Daddy, I flushed the toilet and water came out from the top!"  "That's OK, just don't flush it again and I'll be right down to clean it up and fix it." Less than 1 minute later I'm at the bottom of the stairs hearing an overflowing stool.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

OpenSights said:


> Interesting idea! 1 week warranty is void for objects I assume.


Lightbulbs, bowling balls, & chicken bones will void the guarantee..

Unless you digest them first...:laughing:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

dhal22 said:


> Maybe it's our water quality.....


I did state there was a water quality issue due to their well having a defect...



Redwood said:


> I installed some for a customer years ago (Customer Supplied) *who had a sand problem in his well. He never did get his well problem fixed* but he does have new toilets now...






Best Darn Sewer said:


> Not everyone can be a Redwood and know or have used every plumbing product.





dhal22 said:


> He is a national treasure.


Why... Thank You Guys...:whistling2:
I've never claimed to have used every product but in the couple of years I've been plumbing I've used a few...

And I keep very current on what is available for us to use through numerous resources including this forum. If I hadn't already tried this product years ago I certainly would have tried it after reading about it in this thread...

It certainly sounded like an interesting product with innovative ideas incorporated into it...

However, It also had those 2 limitations which made me decide to avoid the product... Sorry If my choice makes your male virility feel threatened... Buy a bigger gun, boat, truck, or whatever... What I say is for the use of those who want it... I'm still learning to be a good plumber... When I stop I'll retire...


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

No issues here Redwood. Happy to discuss all views of plumbing anytime.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

SOB! If I didn't go to a "toilet leaking" call today. Was hard to tell where it was "leaking" from so I rebuilt it. One tank to bowl bolt had to be removed by my sawzall... my best guess... the guy said he had it shut off since Monday. 

Looked at the jets and thought "CRAP! I don't have a coat hanger on my van yet!" But it was an awesome flusher. Some brand I never heard of. Dated 2/2/85, "Vernamax" or something....


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## myakka (Jun 15, 2011)

Pro45u for toto


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

I've been using the Korky fill valve for years. Recently I came across their PRO line. I think the only physical difference was the dial to meter the water on the refill and the color was all black. The regular Korky has a five year warranty and the PRO has a seven year warranty.

Doesn't matter much what the manufacturers warranty is on such an inexpensive part.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Redwood said:


> I did state there was a water quality issue due to their well having a defect...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just gotta mess with you some, Red. Your advice on here is always appreciated. There are plenty of products I was not aware of until i came to this forum and you were one of the ones that edumacated me.


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## klempner (Mar 4, 2011)

had about 18 out of a case of 25 Fluidmasters be defective. five or six callbacks. the rest i discovered before leaving. probably a one time thing, but switched to Korky. harder to adjust, as in, the water level cannot be adjusted independently of the critical level. which means the water level will always be about 1/2" below the overflow. But Korky 1. never interferes with lid (about 1" shorter than FM). 2. Korky tends to accommodate side mount flush levers quite a bit better. 3. Korky seems to shut off with less water hammer. 4. so far, my impression is they are less sensitive to debris in the line. 5. no defective ones so far (2 years).

that said, i prefer FM flappers to Korky, and FM flushvalves to Korky.

also, as to replacing just the FM seal, that has never worked for me. very hit and miss.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> I've been using the Korky fill valve for years. Recently I came across their PRO line. I think the only physical difference was the dial to meter the water on the refill and the color was all black. The regular Korky has a five year warranty and the PRO has a seven year warranty.
> 
> Doesn't matter much what the manufacturers warranty is on such an inexpensive part.


One big thing I like about the Korky Fill Valves is the way they are adjusted. They are different and a little harder to adjust especially when the lock is used, so customers are less likely to mess with them and try to make it a callback...

I have had customers mess With Fluidmaster Fill Valves quite often. I know exactly how I set a valve, and that ain't how I set it!:furious::furious:


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## versaceflappers (Jul 13, 2015)

Redwood said:


> One big thing I like about the Korky Fill Valves is the way they are adjusted. They are different and a little harder to adjust especially when the lock is used, so customers are less likely to mess with them and try to make it a callback...
> 
> I have had customers mess With Fluidmaster Fill Valves quite often. I know exactly how I set a valve, and that ain't how I set it!:furious::furious:


I can't remember the last time I actually used the lock device on a korky valve. as mentioned theyre a pain.


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## Absaroka Joe (Mar 30, 2013)

The simplicity of BrassCraft fill valves is the reason we stock them.


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## HonestPlumb (Jan 25, 2015)

versaceflappers- I used Wolverine Brass ballcocks for 20 years. They are a nice solid brass vale. The only issue is the slow close. Which is easier on the system then a quick shut off like the Fluidmasters. The Wolverines take so long to shut off that when you get the "Over The Shoulder" customer, they say "You sure that is shutting off". Have to turn around real fast with your elbow up, and say "Oh excuse me, I am sorry. I did not realize you were so close to me" as they back up holding they're nose !!!


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## HonestPlumb (Jan 25, 2015)

Redwood- Just read your comment about customers messing with things, then a call back because they screwed it up. Like you said, "I know where I set it" !! I swear, I wish I had a quarter for every time I heard " It just started to do it after you left" !! I had a husband once who decide I had not installed their dishwasher correctly. It had the control buttons on the top of the door, so the edge of the door is supposed to stick out just a bit. The rubber flanges on the side were flush with the face of the side cabinets. He said he thought the door should be flush with counter top. I have OCD, so that thing was plumb, level and square when I left. They called back and said it was crooked. Went back and you can just imagine !!! I was curious how the copper feed was kinked ? That was the least of it !!!!


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## dclarke (Dec 22, 2012)

In plumbing class a teacher said he kept a bottle of fingernail polish on the truck. If he had a call back suspecting tampering it got fingernail polished. Tamper again and you have proof they touched it and goodbye warranty.


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## thumper (Aug 19, 2011)

Wow I missed this thread. So many pages for just fillvalves. I don't miss the old Case ballcocks Anyone remember the yellow/black American Standard "Smart Valve" that wasn't so smart?
Anyway heres my 2 cents....

The Korky 528pro is a copy of Hunter's G-Max fill valve used in the Toto toilets. I don't have any experience with the Korky version but know the G-max intimately. Wonder if it has the same problem as the G-Max where the rubber disc gets slimey and starts bouncing casuing a chirping sound when trying to shut off.

The G-Max has a bigger refill tube, thats why the Fluidmaster won't work properly in a Toto toilet. With the short duration that the Toto flapper stays open, the Fluidmaster's smaller refill tube will not have enough water to fill the bowl to the normal level. It reminds me of the old 1B1-X Coast Foundry ballcock that had that huge clear refill tube. It was used on Kohler's 1 piece toilets. If you used the Fluidmaster BC it would not fill the bowl enough and the flush suffered. Not sure why the 1B1=X couldn't have a brass shank.

The Fluidmaster Pro45 has the metal shank and has a restrictor to slow the flow into the toilet. This in turn reduces the hammer when the valve shuts. I think its best used with water saver toilets, the restriction takes too long to fill the older 3.5 gallon water hogs. The 400 is notorious for overflowing the tank when debris gets inbetween the diaphragm and the water pressure is too strong.

I really like Toto's balancing valve on their refill tube, much easier to adjust than Fluidmasters squeeze the tube version. But Toto's valve is for their larger refill tube system. Maybe fluidmaster will copy it once the patent runs out.
If you install a Fluidmaster 400 on a 3.5 gallon toilet, a lot of water is wasted down the refill tube and out the bowl while filling up the tank. In those cases I would use Fluidmaster's tube "squeezer" to adjust the flow into the refill tube. I will look into the Hydroclean for their refill tube valve, I think I actually bought one but never got around to trying it out. Might as well try it on my Western Pottery Clinton 1.6 toilet( I am on a well system).


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