# Septic line cleaning



## SlickRick

Cleaning a septic line down stream of the tank without a open end has always been a losing proposition for me. If there is no where to go, how can you unstop one? My sewer machine can eat a hole in the pipe too easy.


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## TheMaster

You cant clean the typical field line. I only clean the line from the house to the tank. Once it leaves the tank it could have a distribution box...you can clean from the tank to the box and thats it. Around here thats how it is anyway.


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## user2090

I agree with TM, anything after the tank is a septic company problem. If its plugged after tank then the leach field has a problem.


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## waldrop

*don' t try*

if possible blow it out with a bladder,if not then get a backhoe put in a new drain field


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## SlickRick

That's what I thought. I wanted to see if anyone had any success, I never have. there are some guys advertising that they can clean septic lines, I have always seen it as impossible, being a closed system. Another state agency regulates septic in Texas, TCEQ. (Texas Commission on Environmental Quality), is that a mouth full or what? Plumbers gave it away back in the day. I don't feel like jacking with another agency. I just refer to others. If there was a way, it would be big business around here.


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## waldrop

in georgia it is seperate license here to but is real easy test my 12year old could pass it ,but it is good money feeling the gaps . because they call us first if there is a backed up line .so we usually get the job.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

I like replacing drain fields. Have done a couple of them in my day. I like to use these sweet things right here:











http://www.infiltratorsystems.com/productline/quick4_infiltrator.asp :thumbsup:


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## SlickRick

waldrop said:


> in georgia it is seperate license here to but is real easy test my 12year old could pass it ,but it is good money feeling the gaps . because they call us first if there is a backed up line .so we usually get the job.


Texas is big into continued ed. For every license I could carry, I could spend a month a yr. taking in repeated useless info.


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## TheMaster

slickrick said:


> Texas is big into continued ed. For every license I could carry, I could spend a month a yr. taking in repeated useless info.


 Heres the name of your new business........."Sunday fieldline replacements" "we only take cash":laughing:


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## TheMaster

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I like replacing drain fields. Have done a couple of them in my day. I like to use these sweet things right here:
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> http://www.infiltratorsystems.com/productline/quick4_infiltrator.asp :thumbsup:


 Replacing a drain field is the nastiest job in plumbing period. The reason most drain fields fail are too much water.....and the nasty biomat....a biomat is basically dead virus's and bacteria that make a water tight seal on the ground like a pond bottom and the water just sits there in the field and doesn't drain anymore. Dissolved solids are pushed out of the tank by too much water being introduced to the system and then will clogg the drain field also. Laundry detergents and soaps help clogg a drain field with dissolved solids....the go back to a solid form in the drian field.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Got a straw Tm?


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## service guy

Some drainfield leechlines CAN be cleaned. Dig up the distributon box, and use a jetter to clean the lines from teh box out. You will likely need a camera/pushrod locator system as some bad spots will be crushed or otherwise need to be repaired. The rightsized jetterhose will maneuver the pipes usually. It will break up roots and other blockages.

IT WON'T however fix a bad drainfield that is saturated. It will only help clear blockages from the leechpipes to allow the water to leech out properly.


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## SlickRick

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I like replacing drain fields. Have done a couple of them in my day. I like to use these sweet things right here:
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> http://www.infiltratorsystems.com/productline/quick4_infiltrator.asp :thumbsup:


I have hacked in a few panels, I could pick up a lot of field line replacements,but in Texas you can't legally replace field line. It has to be a entire system tanks and all. Most are pushing aerobic systems to the tune of $8500.00. It puts a lot of people in a financial bind, when a new field line would last for years more. I could do a graveless system using existing tank for $3000.00 but that would be too easy. I would have to bootleg them in.


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## SlickRick

service guy said:


> Some drainfield leechlines CAN be cleaned. Dig up the distributon box, and use a jetter to clean the lines from teh box out. You will likely need a camera/pushrod locator system as some bad spots will be crushed or otherwise need to be repaired. The rightsized jetterhose will maneuver the pipes usually. It will break up roots and other blockages.
> 
> IT WON'T however fix a bad drainfield that is saturated. It will only help clear blockages from the leechpipes to allow the water to leech out properly.


I have never seen distribution box used here, just 1 run of line.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

slickrick said:


> I have hacked in a few panels, I could pick up a lot of field line replacements,but in Texas you can't legally replace field line. It has to be a entire system tanks and all. Most are pushing aerobic systems to the tune of $8500.00. It puts a lot of people in a financial bind, when a new field line would last for years more. I could do a graveless system using existing tank for $3000.00 but that would be too easy. I would have to bootleg them in.



The won't make you replace the tank here, unless it is a really old one, undersized, and usually made of block or brick. Or, you could be like me, on a septic system, new sewer facilities available, but they want a $7,500.00 TAP fee. Same bastards I buy permits from everyweek, want that much for a tap fee from me.:furious:


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## TheMaster

service guy said:


> Some drainfield leechlines CAN be cleaned. Dig up the distributon box, and use a jetter to clean the lines from teh box out. You will likely need a camera/pushrod locator system as some bad spots will be crushed or otherwise need to be repaired. The rightsized jetterhose will maneuver the pipes usually. It will break up roots and other blockages.
> 
> IT WON'T however fix a bad drainfield that is saturated. It will only help clear blockages from the leechpipes to allow the water to leech out properly.


 Say you have 10 drainfields not working.....out of those 10 how many do you think the camera/jetter method would correct?


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## TheMaster

If sewer is available here the field lines or septic tank cannot have any service done to it...not even pumping. Once it fails for any reason its SUPPOSE to be discontinued and filled with dirt,connect to city service. Now ask me if I've ever seen a pumper truck in the city on sunday........:yes:


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## service guy

TheMaster said:


> Say you have 10 drainfields not working.....out of those 10 how many do you think the camera/jetter method would correct?


I am not sure. Usually its easy to tell if the field is saturated, because it will be spongy and wet like a swamp. In that case, the whole thing needs to be replaced. I have seen quite a few drainfields that simply were blocked with grime and/or roots. In that case, the jetter method is WAY cheaper than a new drainfield.


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## TheMaster

service guy said:


> I am not sure. Usually its easy to tell if the field is saturated, because it will be spongy and wet like a swamp. In that case, the whole thing needs to be replaced. I have seen quite a few drainfields that simply were blocked with grime and/or roots. In that case, the jetter method is WAY cheaper than a new drainfield.


 Hey its worth a shot I guess but most systems here are way over sized and if your having problems it usually means the partys over. We had 75" of rain this year so I know alittle about saturated drain fields:laughing::thumbsup:. Theres no money in that business here.....you can get a septic tank system installed for a new house here for about 2,000.00 thats labor and materials conventional system for a 3 bedroom house with a garden tub.


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## waldrop

slickrick said:


> Texas is big into continued ed. For every license I could carry, I could spend a month a yr. taking in repeated useless info.


 get wife to do it online  just kidding i would never do that:no:


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## SlickRick

service guy said:


> I am not sure. Usually its easy to tell if the field is saturated, because it will be spongy and wet like a swamp. In that case, the whole thing needs to be replaced. I have seen quite a few drainfields that simply were blocked with grime and/or roots. In that case, the jetter method is WAY cheaper than a new drainfield.


So if it is sludge, would the jetter pull the sludge back into the tank so it could be removed? Most of the lines here are just 1 run.


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## TheMaster

slickrick said:


> So if it is sludge, would the jetter pull the sludge back into the tank so it could be removed? Most of the lines here are just 1 run.


 The problem is the entire earth surrounding the leach pipe or bed is sludged up and thats what usually causes the pipe to sludge up. I can see were the camera would be helpful as to why theres a problem...like a crushed section or somthing cutting off part of the field.


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## UnclogNH

slickrick said:


> So if it is sludge, would the jetter pull the sludge back into the tank so it could be removed? Most of the lines here are just 1 run.


Jetting will remove the sludge from the line but not all the sludge build up in the drain field. They have some chemical BIO stuff but don't think it works. Digging up the lines is nasty. The septic guys can keep it.


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## SlickRick

TheMaster said:


> The problem is the entire earth surrounding the leach pipe or bed is sludged up and thats what usually causes the pipe to sludge up. I can see were the camera would be helpful as to why theres a problem...like a crushed section or somthing cutting off part of the field.


But you can't see with water and sludge. it is just not a good deal. Wish I could help them.


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## UnclogNH

Slick sometimes even Rambo has to give up.


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## retired rooter

I once saw a demo of a machine that was (suppose) to give old field lines new life.It was a compressor that blew air and some kind of small beads into the ground.The guy guessed where the lines ran and blew about 10 areas in a yard ,The ho had a co just ouside the septic tank that was holding water.When the guy was about 1/2 finished all the water drained out of the cleanout on the outlet side of the tank.How long did it last/?( about 3 months ) then field lines had to be repaired. I agree with MASTER if lines are not taking water its time to call in a septic tank contractor .I was the foolish ho on that job(I met a guy at a trade show in nashville and for 300 bucks he came by my house on one of his runs and I got several of my buddys to watch the show, I only know of one(septic) guy around here that bought one and we laughted at my experence ,he was wanting to sell his ,it would not last long enough for him to keep his customers happy) I had used my jetter , my camera would not work in black sludge, ,my big machine, every trick in my hat,the end of the story (get backho and start digging ,septic guys can have that kind of work, we found a dry field line approx 3 OR 4 months later and tied into it ,now I have tank pumped every yr whether it needs it or not


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## ILPlumber

You guys don't set aeration units? 

I do those 99 percent of the time. the other 1 percent would be buried sand filter. 

We have inadequate perc in these parts.


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## SlickRick

ILPlumber said:


> You guys don't set aeration units?
> 
> I do those 99 percent of the time. the other 1 percent would be buried sand filter.
> 
> We have inadequate perc in these parts.


We have a mix of both systems here, depending on conditions and acreage. People do not like having to maintain the pumps here.


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## All Clear Sewer

I jet septic systems all the time and have great luck bringing the old field back to life. Only had one out of 200 not start working again. :thumbup:
It works if the drain field was installed right :blink:


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## ILPlumber

All Clear Sewer said:


> I jet septic systems all the time and have great luck bringing the old field back to life. Only had one out of 200 not start working again. :thumbup:
> It works if the drain field was installed right :blink:


Please explain to me how introducing more water to a drain field that is already water-logged fixes the problem?


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## Airgap

3 line field


Airgap said:


>


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## Miguel

TheMaster said:


> Replacing a drain field is the nastiest job in plumbing period. The reason most drain fields fail are too much water.....and the nasty biomat....a biomat is basically dead virus's and bacteria that make a water tight seal on the ground like a pond bottom and the water just sits there in the field and doesn't drain anymore. Dissolved solids are pushed out of the tank by too much water being introduced to the system and then will clogg the drain field also. Laundry detergents and soaps help clogg a drain field with dissolved solids....the go back to a solid form in the drian field.


Aye, Master. My credo has always been that if it's clear to the tank but stopped up afterwards then, "C'mon, Jetro. Bring in the backhoe and commence ta diggin'!"
Those infiltrator chambers are the bees knees, though, aren't they?


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## Bollinger plumber

ILPlumber said:


> Please explain to me how introducing more water to a drain field that is already water-logged fixes the problem?


 A lot of times the holes in the perforated pipe get clogged. Running the jetter through them sometimes opens up the holes allowing water to seep back through. The only probelm I have with jetting a leech line is I want to throw my jetter hose away cause it stinks so bad. I have to take it to the car wash and spray the hell out of it to get the smell off of it. not too bad now that I have a box truck but when I had a van i would puke all the way to the car wash.


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> I jet septic systems all the time and have great luck bringing the old field back to life. Only had one out of 200 not start working again. :thumbup:
> It works if the drain field was installed right :blink:


 It might work if the drain field is installed improperly or abused. Properly designed and installed drain field will work for years and years with NOTHING being done to it. Once the biomat is formed your wasting your time. The jetter cannot clean outside the pipe in the soil and thats where the problem is. Its like trying to unclogg a pond that has no drain with a jetter.:laughing: All you will do is fill it up.


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## All Clear Sewer

The jetter will create vaccum and pull every thing out of the field. Roots, poo, grease, sand and biomat. The bigest problem is *biomat* layers. The jetter will blast the biomat out of the holes in the pipe and help clean the soil. Once you have pumped the tank clean and jetted the drain field and made sure theres a 90 on the outlet side of the tank, the drain field will start to work once again. 

Most drain fields become clogged because the tank was not pumped or the 90 was missing on the outlet side of the tank. Now keep in mind you need more then just a 90. You also need about a 12" drop off that 90 to keep the poo from going in to the drain field.

Once you have done everything the system can once again take care of it`s self with bacterial growth and control the biomat.

I`ll try and post a few pictures some time today


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## RealLivePlumber

I have heard that you can pump the tank, then jet the drainfield pipe. Then vac the pipe. get a fitting onto it to really vac it good. Pour, directly into the drainfield pipe, a bunch of hydrogen peroxide. The bubbling of the peroxide will open it up.

Or so I've heard. I wonder if it would work?


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## SlickRick

How many days is doing all this going to take?


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## TheMaster

slickrick said:


> How many days is doing all this going to take?


 Do you read minds on the side:laughing:


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## SlickRick

Rick, can you clean my field line? Yes sir! $4000.00 and you get a free 30 day gaurantee!


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## miketheplumber

Had an emergency call on Christmas day....house was flooded with sewage from below toilet. Got out there to find septic, removed C/O from front of house and it blew out of my hand. We had alot of rain that day and night before but I still in my years have never seen anything like this. I dug up the lid until it overflowed with sewage and quit. C/O was still spewing when I left 2 hours later. I was thinking same thing about using my jetter but figured if there was that much water coming out there-there was a MUCH bigger problem.


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## saysflushable

miketheplumber said:


> Had an emergency call on Christmas day....house was flooded with sewage from below toilet. Got out there to find septic, removed C/O from front of house and it blew out of my hand. We had alot of rain that day and night before but I still in my years have never seen anything like this. I dug up the lid until it overflowed with sewage and quit. C/O was still spewing when I left 2 hours later. I was thinking same thing about using my jetter but figured if there was that much water coming out there-there was a MUCH bigger problem.


 I bet they had there sump pump tied into the septic line. I'm assuming they had a basement. Or the lift pump was getting a bunch of ground water in it.


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## saysflushable

I should ask this in a new thread but I'm curious as what percentage of houses on septic you guys get called to for a back up but it turns out to be a full septic?


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## SlickRick

saysflushable said:


> I should ask this in a new thread but I'm curious as what percentage of houses on septic you guys get called to for a back up but it turns out to be a full septic?


99%

I get calls everyday, Tell them to have it pumped first and save some money.


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## saysflushable

slickrick said:


> 99%
> 
> I get calls everyday, Tell them to have it pumped first and save some money.


 I wish I kept hard numbers on it. But it has to be at least 80%. I try talking them into getting the tanks pumped but they insist it must be the plumbing! I don't care if it's just one toilet acting funny or the whole house is backed up it always turns out to be the septic. I don't do anything without digging the lid 1st.


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## All Clear Sewer

slickrick said:


> How many days is doing all this going to take?


Takes 2 of us about 4 hours from start to finish. :thumbup:
Sorry for not posting any photos today I got to busy. maybe tomorrow?


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## Bollinger plumber

I did 2 septic tank stoppages last week. Both of them were caused by bad installations. Both ho's were happy that I came out first rather than just having the tank pumped first. saved them both 275 dollars. And yes I did dig up the septic tanks to make sure they were not malfunctioning. Both sewer lines were 4 inch pvc.


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## jrsaltz

We use a 3/8 Warthog nozzle to remove sludge and knock loose biomat blocking the holes in septic lines. First we locate and dig up the distro box if there is one and have it pumped down there as much as possible. Then we use the camera to locate tees where the fingers of the field head out and dig them up. Using a hole saw, we drill holes in the top (or back) of the tee and jet each line as needed making sure that the hole is dug deep enough to catch water. We have a pumper remove the water as we jet. Then we video inspect each line to be sure we have removed all the sludge, roots and any other debris. Install expandable plugs in the tees and fill holes back in.

We can see in most cases where the water shoots through the holes and into the stone surrounding the pipe and loosens the sludge and biomat. We will jet until this water begins to turn fairly clear.

This has worked well on many systems. We have had customers with stacks of quotes from local septic installers stating that the field has reached the end of its life and has to be replaced immediately and these same systems years later are still working great! I check with them often to be sure.

I will say that this is not an end all answer to this problem but if it saves a HO from having to pay for a whole field for a few years it is worth it. Some still just need replacement completely due to age.

I also agree with ILPlumber that installing a aeration system is a great alternative to field replacement. A system like this and a good cleaning could potentially extend the life of a system for many years.


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## TheMaster

jrsaltz said:


> We use a 3/8 Warthog nozzle to remove sludge and knock loose biomat blocking the holes in septic lines. First we locate and dig up the distro box if there is one and have it pumped down there as much as possible. Then we use the camera to locate tees where the fingers of the field head out and dig them up. Using a hole saw, we drill holes in the top (or back) of the tee and jet each line as needed making sure that the hole is dug deep enough to catch water. We have a pumper remove the water as we jet. Then we video inspect each line to be sure we have removed all the sludge, roots and any other debris. Install expandable plugs in the tees and fill holes back in.
> 
> We can see in most cases where the water shoots through the holes and into the stone surrounding the pipe and loosens the sludge and biomat. We will jet until this water begins to turn fairly clear.
> 
> This has worked well on many systems. We have had customers with stacks of quotes from local septic installers stating that the field has reached the end of its life and has to be replaced immediately and these same systems years later are still working great! I check with them often to be sure.
> 
> I will say that this is not an end all answer to this problem but if it saves a HO from having to pay for a whole field for a few years it is worth it. Some still just need replacement completely due to age.
> 
> I also agree with ILPlumber that installing a aeration system is a great alternative to field replacement. A system like this and a good cleaning could potentially extend the life of a system for many years.


 Biomat is formed on the outside of the pipe in the soil...the only way to remove the biomat is to remove the soil in the drain field. All your doing is cleaning the pipe of disolved solids that have became a solid again in the drain field...its usually caused by excessive water use. There is NOWAY to remove biomat with a jetter since its in the SOIL and not the pipe. I've seen biomat that extended 2' below the field. 99% of the time the septic contractor disconnects the washing machine from the tank and runs it out seperate.....since the washing machine is 99% responsible for pushing dissolved solids from the tank into the drain field where they are filtered and clogg up the field. Read the definition of biomat and you'll understand your not removing it with a freakin jetter:laughing:


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> Biomat is formed on the outside of the pipe in the soil...the only way to remove the biomat is to remove the soil in the drain field. All your doing is cleaning the pipe of disolved solids that have became a solid again in the drain field...its usually caused by excessive water use. There is NOWAY to remove biomat with a jetter since its in the SOIL and not the pipe. I've seen biomat that extended 2' below the field. 99% of the time the septic contractor disconnects the washing machine from the tank and runs it out seperate.....since the washing machine is 99% responsible for pushing dissolved solids from the tank into the drain field where they are filtered and clogg up the field. Read the definition of biomat and you'll understand your not removing it with a freakin jetter:laughing:


I think the part that you are missing here is:


> Once you have done everything the system can once again take care of it`s self with bacterial growth and control the biomat


This is because the tank wasn't pump in years. the drain field failed and had to be jetted. We jetted this system 4 years a go and it`s still working.










This system failed and was jetted last spring and is still working. They were paying to pump the tank once every 2 months. Still working with-out pumping 



















This DB was full and filled the drain field. The pumping company was out once a month and kept trying to sell them a new system. We jetted it 4 years a go and have an appointment set to pump the tank next month.









When jetting a DB you have to cap off every line excetp the one your jetting and the ong going to the tank. The waste will flow back in the tank where you can once again pump it out and start the system over.










This one was being pumped about ever month and 1/2 tell we jetted the drain field. here we are doing it from the septic tank out. it was missing the 90 and the drop leag. We found em at the bottom of the tank. It seems the pumpers were knocing em off to try and sel;l new systems.










This here shows how much water we put through a system while jetting.










Well Mr TheMaster I have showed my proof of it does work and now you show me where you have proof that it dosen`t :laughing:


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## SlickRick

I see water running into a trench. It looks like more than 4 hrs work. How long do you guarantee this work.


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> I think the part that you are missing here is:
> 
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> This is because the tank wasn't pump in years. the drain field failed and had to be jetted. We jetted this system 4 years a go and it`s still working.
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> This system failed and was jetted last spring and is still working. They were paying to pump the tank once every 2 months. Still working with-out pumping
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> This DB was full and filled the drain field. The pumping company was out once a month and kept trying to sell them a new system. We jetted it 4 years a go and have an appointment set to pump the tank next month.
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> When jetting a DB you have to cap off every line excetp the one your jetting and the ong going to the tank. The waste will flow back in the tank where you can once again pump it out and start the system over.
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> This one was being pumped about ever month and 1/2 tell we jetted the drain field. here we are doing it from the septic tank out. it was missing the 90 and the drop leag. We found em at the bottom of the tank. It seems the pumpers were knocing em off to try and sel;l new systems.
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> Well Mr TheMaster I have showed my proof of it does work and now you show me where you have proof that it dosen`t :laughing:


All you showed me is a freakin tank dug up. Big deal. You also admit the 90 had been knocked off.....so the system was improper. Biomat is not in the pipe and it cannot be corrected after it has formed,,,infact here if biomat has formed in a drainfield all the dirt must be removed from the field or the field must be relocated. And thats way more than 4 hrs of work.....see ya:laughing:


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## TheMaster

Look everybody knows you can dig up field lines and run a jetter through. if the field line pipe itself is full of sludge well sure everyone knows you can clean that out. HERE IS MY POINT. Once biomat has formed in the soil its over the fat lady has sung,lights out goodbye exit left. The jetter cannot correct that.


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## All Clear Sewer

slickrick said:


> I see water running into a trench. It looks like more than 4 hrs work. How long do you guarantee this work.


No guarantee on the time that it will last. But we have only had one that didn't work afterwards. (ONE) (1) out of a few hundred isn't all that bad  

They either work or they don't is what I have figured out. The one that didn't work was installed in dirt and not road gravel like most drain fields. 

Like I said "If they were installed correctly they will work again and continue to work if you pump the tank like you should. 

House of 2 should be pumped every 3 to 4 years and a house of 4 should be pumped at least every 2 years. 
For some reason people think they never have to do anything but flush the stool....rotflmao

When your on a septic system you have to do some maintenance or be ready to pay the big bucks later!


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> Look everybody knows you can dig up field lines and run a jetter through. if the field line pipe itself is full of sludge well sure everyone knows you can clean that out. HERE IS MY POINT. Once biomat has formed in the soil its over the fat lady has sung,lights out goodbye exit left. The jetter cannot correct that.


Sure ok, what ever .... I don't understand what your talking about as I`m guessing you know nothing about what you are talking about :laughing:

You seem think your the Master, so please explain you`er thoughts better because I cant understand your thinking. 

You know I`m not trying to sell you a jetter job, so please explain to me why all my jobs have been so successful :yes:


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## Bollinger plumber

I have jetted only 3 or 4 drain field pipes in my career, but as far as i know the fields are still working to this day. I drive by them quite often and I have never seen them dig up the drains fields and replace them so evidently it does work.


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Sure ok, what ever .... I don't understand what your talking about as I`m guessing you know nothing about what you are talking about :laughing:
> 
> You seem think your the Master, so please explain you`er thoughts better because I cant understand your thinking.
> 
> You know I`m not trying to sell you a jetter job, so please explain to me why all my jobs have been so successful :yes:


 1st off please dont piss on my leg and tell me its raining...THATS MORE THAN 4 HRS OF WORK. OK now....BIOMAT is in the soil. If you dont understand what biomat is do some research,if you still dont understand then i cant help you. Jetters cant remove the soil outside the pipe so quit telling lies to people saying you can remove biomat. All your doing is cleaning the pipe in a system that had been damaged.


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## SlickRick

My mind is going along the same thoughts as TM, The problem started outside the pipe and worked its way in. I just can't see this being effective. To take all my equipment out there and labor, It's at least a $2000.00 job with no warranty.


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Sure ok, what ever .... I don't understand what your talking about as I`m guessing you know nothing about what you are talking about :laughing:
> 
> You seem think your the Master, so please explain you`er thoughts better because I cant understand your thinking.
> 
> You know I`m not trying to sell you a jetter job, so please explain to me why all my jobs have been so successful :yes:


 Here go educate yourself...its not my responsibility.
http://www.dupagehealth.org/ehs/ws/fs/sds_care.asp


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## TheMaster

Here read where biomat forms. Jetter will not correct biomat.
................................................................................................
Septic loading and dye tests look for this "breakout" of effluent on the soil surface - a condition which will occur when the biomat has become so thick that septic effluent no longer percolates through it to the soils below. If you dig a neat cross section of a traditional leach field trench, and if it was properly constructed, you'll see the perforated effluent pipe surrounded first by gravel, and then the sides of the trench as it was originally cut through the soil. You will also see a 1cm (about 1/2") to 5cm (about 2") thick gray band around the perimeter of the trench - this is where the soil clogging has occurred.


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## SlickRick

I would love to believe jetting would work, I would have a hugh, exclusive market here. But this woud be a major undertaking on every job with no guarantee. I feel like I would be taking advantage of a despirate situation that HOs have. If it were me, I would take the money and...

(1) Go to the boat and try to parley my money and buy a new system.

(2) Buy $2000.00 - $3000.00 worth of scratch offs.

(3) Flip a coin

(4) Take the 25 points with TM on the Texas - 'Bama game for $10g which is a sure thing, and buy a new system and have some pocket change left over.


----------



## TheMaster

Hey All Clear Sewer......here Have A Good Read.....heres Your Proof.
Straight FF THE DUPAGE WEBSITE FROM THE LINK ABOVE.
........................................................................................................................................
Correction of these problems can be costly. Hydrojetting may remove pipe blockages, but a septic field repair or replacement is needed to correct a biomat problem. Hydrojetting will not remove a biomat build up. The following information can help prevent these problems.
Do not add excess water to your septic system. Water from sinks, toilets, baths, and laundry machines need to go to the septic system. Water from footing sumps, water softener discharges, furnace humidifiers and air conditioners should not drain into the septic system. Repair dripping faucets and running toilets. Attempt to limit laundry loads to 2 or less a day. Use water wisely.


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Sure ok, what ever .... I don't understand what your talking about as I`m guessing you know nothing about what you are talking about :laughing:
> 
> You seem think your the Master, so please explain you`er thoughts better because I cant understand your thinking.
> 
> You know I`m not trying to sell you a jetter job, so please explain to me why all my jobs have been so successful :yes:


 I dont think your even a real plumber. Your ripping people off.


----------



## rainman

*Septi field Lines?*

No Problem! I started useing a General J-2900 Jetter Open the dist box Put on the correct tip Have a septic pumper truck right there with you as the sludge comes to you the pumper takes it, now the field is a little more aerobic and thats your goal. Roding machines are a "waste of time" on field laterals. The best thing is (even though I do) have a contractors sewage disposal license here in Illinois which is a must, You really dont need it because cleaning does not require a permit. yes, even licensed plumbers can do the cleaning and guess what we dont take offense to it like alot of plumbers do comparing drain cleaning vs Plumbing work. And to be Technical A licensed Plumber cannot install a septic system legally without the private sewage license. Lifes to short, there is enough for everyone!:yes:


----------



## TheMaster

rainman said:


> No Problem! I started useing a General J-2900 Jetter Open the dist box Put on the correct tip Have a septic pumper truck right there with you as the sludge comes to you the pumper takes it, now the field is a little more aerobic and thats your goal. Roding machines are a "waste of time" on field laterals. The best thing is (even though I do) have a contractors sewage disposal license here in Illinois which is a must, You really dont need it because cleaning does not require a permit. yes, even licensed plumbers can do the cleaning and guess what we dont take offense to it like alot of plumbers do comparing drain cleaning vs Plumbing work. And to be Technical A licensed Plumber cannot install a septic system legally without the private sewage license. Lifes to short, there is enough for everyone!:yes:


 Tell me how it works on a stepped trench system?:laughing: Jetting fieldlines is a poormans fix...its not a proper repair for biomat. Hack on brother:thumbsup:


----------



## SlickRick

rainman said:


> No Problem! I started useing a General J-2900 Jetter Open the dist box Put on the correct tip Have a septic pumper truck right there with you as the sludge comes to you the pumper takes it, now the field is a little more aerobic and thats your goal. Roding machines are a "waste of time" on field laterals. The best thing is (even though I do) have a contractors sewage disposal license here in Illinois which is a must, You really dont need it because cleaning does not require a permit. yes, even licensed plumbers can do the cleaning and guess what we dont take offense to it like alot of plumbers do comparing drain cleaning vs Plumbing work. And to be Technical A licensed Plumber cannot install a septic system legally without the private sewage license. Lifes to short, there is enough for everyone!:yes:


I bet when that nozzle gets close to you the sludge does come out, all over the fricken place.


----------



## TheMaster

slickrick said:


> I bet when that nozzle gets close to you the sludge does come out, all over the fricken place.


 People will do anything for a quick buck:thumbsup: Remember it only takes 4 hours:whistling2:


----------



## Redwood

slickrick said:


> I bet when that nozzle gets close to you the sludge does come out, all over the fricken place.


:laughing:Keep your mouth closed!:laughing:

I'm just saying its gonna be ugly!

Now about the failed field if you can put in a second field and run the system on that the failed field will be just fine after sitting unused for a year or two.
If you set them up with alternating fields they will never have a field failure.:thumbup:


----------



## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> I dont think your even a real plumber. Your ripping people off.


 I see you have no proof just as I thought. It`s people like you that are ripping people off replacing systems that dont need to be replaced beause your not near as smart as you think you are :laughing:


----------



## Redwood

All Clear Sewer said:


> I see you have no proof just as I thought. It`s people like you that are ripping people off replacing systems that dont need to be replaced beause your not near as smart as you think you are :laughing:


I would consider jetting a leaching field to be a rip off at best and incompetence at worst...

I haven't formulated an opinion yet but keep talking and I will...:whistling2:


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Redwood I dont care what your formulated opinion is gonna be :whistling2:
Thats one thing about me you`ll have to figure out, I dont really care :no:
I make my living doing things that others cant do. :laughing:
I have saved many Home Owners allot of money because they were dealing with contractors like TM. For this I can hold my head up high and look anyone in the eye and feel good about the work I do.


----------



## Redwood

Yep...
I've just formulated my opinion...:whistling2:
It ain't looking good...
Kinda like ya have a high weasel factor in how your business operates....
Aside from clearing a blockage in a line there really is little jetting would do to restore a leaching field...
If your selling that well I have some oceanfront property in Montana that if you sell it for me I'll give you a healthy commission on the sale...:laughing:

Why don't you at least go and get your self a Terra Lift and maybe sell them something that actually might work for a couple of years...

Personally I'd tell them save their money and put in a second leaching field so they can have an alternating field that ends their problems forever.

But hey that would involve actually selling a solution...
An honest solution!:whistling2:
And a conscience...

The mere thought that anyone could believe they are cleaning the biomat in a leaching field through the holes of a perforated PVC pipe is a hoot!:laughing:


----------



## Bollinger plumber

I don't know if I am being accused of being a rip off here or if you are only talking about all clear. Just in case let me tell you I jetted the leech lines upon the customers request. I informed them that I had doubts about it working but they insisted that we should at least try it. I make no claims as to the fact that jetting the leech lines will break up the biomat. All I know is that I jetted the lines and I have not heard from the customers since. When I go by there again I will stop and ask if they have done anything else to the lines since I have been there. Just to satisfy my curiosity.


----------



## SlickRick

Bollinger plumber said:


> I don't know if I am being accused of being a rip off here or if you are only talking about all clear. Just in case let me tell you I jetted the leech lines upon the customers request. I informed them that I had doubts about it working but they insisted that we should at least try it. I make no claims as to the fact that jetting the leech lines will break up the biomat. All I know is that I jetted the lines and I have not heard from the customers since. When I go by there again I will stop and ask if they have done anything else to the lines since I have been there. Just to satisfy my curiosity.


Nothing wrong with that. Like you said, No claims.


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Redwood said:


> Yep...
> I've just formulated my opinion...:whistling2:


Boy your slow as I had mine the first time you posted in this topic :whistling2:


----------



## Cuda

slickrick said:


> Cleaning a septic line down stream of the tank without a open end has always been a losing proposition for me. If there is no where to go, how can you unstop one? My sewer machine can eat a hole in the pipe too easy.


Well it seems like there is a way to service the system, should the drain field be replaced? Yes and a warranty goes with it, but what about side sewer lines that are seperated and have roots? Well by the same logic they should be replaced also but does the HO do it? No they have it serviced (snaked) to get them by. Jetting seems like a way to extend the life of their system to buy them some more time. So if all options (replace or repair) are given it would be up the the owner as how to proceed.


----------



## Redwood

All Clear Sewer said:


> Boy your slow as I had mine the first time you posted in this topic :whistling2:


Well I'll tell ya the truth as soon as I saw that jetting was being proposed as a fix for a failing leaching field my opinion had already been formed. My thoughts are the success you claim to have had was just a blockage of the line and not a biomat clogging the field. No Way, No How!


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Redwood
Does the jetting remove all the biomat? "NO" 
Does the jetting open up the holes in the pipe? "YES"

Jetting will open the soil below the holes in the piping and allow the drain field to flow once again. 

If and I do say "IF" the system was installed correctly with gravel then "YES" you can jet the system and blast the soil below the holes in the piping. Blasting the holes allows the system to work once again and "IF" they have the tanked pumped like they "SHOULD" then it will last a long time. How long??? Don't know, that's why I myself don't put a warranty on jetting a system. 
Now like I said "NO" it doesn't remove all the soil below the piping it only blast the soil below the holes in the piping. Once you brake up the layer of biomat blow the holes the system can once again take care of it`s self with "bacterial growth" and help control the biomat left behind.

If you cant understand this then I really cant explain it to you any better.

If you haven't tried it then you cant make judgment. I was a hard sell on a jetter but now that I bought one and did the first septic job for "FREE" to see if it really worked, I am sold. I always said, I don't need no stinking jetter now I understand that it is a tool that can make me a living just like all my other machines that go along with my business.

No one has ever said it`s a 100% fix 
Does it work? "YES"


----------



## waldrop

will bio-clean work on the bio-mat in drain field?


----------



## Redwood

waldrop said:


> will bio-clean work on the bio-mat in drain field?


They have some solutions that are alleged to work just like the jetting and Terra Lift...

In reality the real answer is a second field added and going to alternating fields.
A period of non use will renovate the field to as good as new.

Anything else is a wing and a prayer that may get them by for a while or, was simply a case of a blocked line in the field.:whistling2:


----------



## jrsaltz

Master, Do you own a jetter? Have you ever worked with one for an extended period of time? Have you taken classes regarding the science of pressures and flow rates involved with the hydro jetting process? What experience do you have with septic systems aside from what you have read in books and on the internet? Explain a little more about your real life, on the job experience with this type of problem. Careful who you label a HACK my friend! You have no place judging anyone who enters a word on this forum. You know nothing about me or any of the others who use this method. I run a very honest and clean business. Perhaps i could share my list of satisfied customers with you and let them explain if my methods are ridiculous or not. I am a union trained plumber 3rd generation. I work with nearly every pumper around my area with a very high referral rate. I don't claim to be the ultimate authority on septic systems nor am i licensed to install them, but i can tell you that i know what i am talking about when it comes to this process. Biomat CAN be removed from around septic pipe end of story!!! You will never be right about this. EVER!!! With the right nozzle and enough flow the water will blow through the holes and into the stone around it and clean the rock allowing flow to again filter through it. I NEVER said ALL biomat present around the field will be gone, i said that it will clear enough sludge and biomat to keep it filtering for a while longer. I also said that this is not the right fix for every situation. Way to show the world you know how to cut and paste, I know i'm impressed! I could care less what the definition of biomat is. It means nothing to a homeowner either. What means something to them is not having to fork out a pile of cash if THEY choose not to. If they wanted the system dug up and replaced they would have just had it done instead of looking to me for another solution. If a customer wants to take the cheaper way out then that is their call not mine. I always leave with the disclaimer that it may not work and they will have to go another route anyway. I'm so sick of people talking smack about drain cleaners. There are plenty of plumbers out there that are HACK drain cleaners! Just cuz you got a license in your pocket doesn't mean you know anything about drain cleaning! I hope you are not one of these kind. If you are.....good riddens!!!


----------



## All Clear Sewer

With over 3100 post in 6 months I`d call TheMaster a "Master post whore". 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,153


> *post whore*
> One who posts stupid **** just to be making posts. The Postwhore has no real purpose in posting except to piss people off and look like an idiot.


He must not have much work if he`s got that much time on his hands. From what I`ve seen most of his post are about calling others out and most of the time he retreats after he`s put in his place. Looks like he`s just out for post count to me.

We are licensed to install, licensed to pump and inspect. If I was just looking for a quick buck I wouldn`t be jetting for 4 HOURS


----------



## TheMaster

jrsaltz said:


> Master, Do you own a jetter? Have you ever worked with one for an extended period of time? Have you taken classes regarding the science of pressures and flow rates involved with the hydro jetting process? What experience do you have with septic systems aside from what you have read in books and on the internet? Explain a little more about your real life, on the job experience with this type of problem. Careful who you label a HACK my friend! You have no place judging anyone who enters a word on this forum. You know nothing about me or any of the others who use this method. I run a very honest and clean business. Perhaps i could share my list of satisfied customers with you and let them explain if my methods are ridiculous or not. I am a union trained plumber 3rd generation. I work with nearly every pumper around my area with a very high referral rate. I don't claim to be the ultimate authority on septic systems nor am i licensed to install them, but i can tell you that i know what i am talking about when it comes to this process. Biomat CAN be removed from around septic pipe end of story!!! You will never be right about this. EVER!!! With the right nozzle and enough flow the water will blow through the holes and into the stone around it and clean the rock allowing flow to again filter through it. I NEVER said ALL biomat present around the field will be gone, i said that it will clear enough sludge and biomat to keep it filtering for a while longer. I also said that this is not the right fix for every situation. Way to show the world you know how to cut and paste, I know i'm impressed! I could care less what the definition of biomat is. It means nothing to a homeowner either. What means something to them is not having to fork out a pile of cash if THEY choose not to. If they wanted the system dug up and replaced they would have just had it done instead of looking to me for another solution. If a customer wants to take the cheaper way out then that is their call not mine. I always leave with the disclaimer that it may not work and they will have to go another route anyway. I'm so sick of people talking smack about drain cleaners. There are plenty of plumbers out there that are HACK drain cleaners! Just cuz you got a license in your pocket doesn't mean you know anything about drain cleaning! I hope you are not one of these kind. If you are.....good riddens!!!


 Dupage county IL. has the info on their website. What do they say about it?


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> With over 3100 post in 6 months I`d call TheMaster a "Master post whore".
> Join Date: Jun 2009
> Posts: 3,153
> 
> 
> He must not have much work if he`s got that much time on his hands. From what I`ve seen most of his post are about calling others out and most of the time he retreats after he`s put in his place. Looks like he`s just out for post count to me.
> 
> We are licensed to install, licensed to pump and inspect. If I was just looking for a quick buck I wouldn`t be jetting for 4 HOURS


I get paid per post.:laughing:


----------



## Redwood

TheMaster said:


> Dupage county IL. has the info on their website. What do they say about it?


Oh you mean this link TM?

http://www.dupagehealth.org/ehs/ws/fs/hydrojet.asp

It's kind of frowned upon here too...:whistling2:
Many of the smaller towns on LI Sound and the Connecticut River have very active sewer avoidance programs that really takes an interest in having the septic systems working right...:whistling2:


----------



## All Clear Sewer

I think it would be safe to say that their lack of experience is = to the two of yours.
I haven`t seen many heath departments with much hands on experience. 
Hey did you know the world is flat and if you go to far one way or the other you will fall off? 
Hey it use to be in print from people that claimed to know everything :whistling2:

I find it funny at how many of us that do jetting have replied about our out-come of jetting septic lines but the two of you that dont even own a jetter think you can shoot down something you know nothing about. Talk about HACKS


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> I think it would be safe to say that their lack of experience is = to the two of yours.
> I haven`t seen many heath departments with much hands on experience.
> Hey did you know the world is flat and if you go to far one way or the other you will fall off?
> Hey it use to be in print from people that claimed to know everything :whistling2:
> 
> I find it funny at how many of us that do jetting have replied about our out-come of jetting septic lines but the two of you that dont even own a jetter think you can shoot down something you know nothing about. Talk about HACKS


 You need to stop using those unshielded fernco boots underground. Thats hackish.:whistling2: Plus you need to stop taking your customers money saying you can take care of biomat with a jetter. Thats not being an honest business man sir:thumbsup:


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Is that really the best you can dream up TM? 

BTW.... the only place you should use a fernco is underground. No-Hubs for inside a building


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Is that really the best you can dream up TM?


Its ok I wont tell


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Is that really the best you can dream up TM?
> 
> BTW.... the only place you should use a fernco is underground. No-Hubs for inside a building


 What plumbing code do you use?


----------



## All Clear Sewer

So how do you conect 4" orangeburg to 4" PVC and 4" Clay to 4" PVC. As far as I know theres not a no-hub band made to do this. You are the master so teach me :yes::yes:

2003 IPC


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> So how do you conect 4" orangeburg to 4 PVC and 4 Clay to 4" PVC. As far as I know theres not a no-hub band made to do this. You are the master so teach me :yes::yes:
> 
> 2003 IPC


 How about a mission band?


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Show me one that fits the pipes I said :whistling2:

4" orangeburg to 4" PVC and 4" Clay to 4" PVC


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Show me one that fits the pipes I said :whistling2:
> 
> 4" orangeburg to 4" PVC and 4" Clay to 4" PVC


 Go to page 10 and read sir:thumbup:
http://www.missionrubber.com/pdf/catalog.pdf


----------



## All Clear Sewer

sorry but I cant seem to find any thing that says it`s for the piping I said

I`m sure someone makes something somewhere but getting one at a parts house would be like selling you a jetter. Ferncos are what we use for outside underground, No-hubs or Mission bands are what we use inside or under a building.


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> sorry but I cant seem to find any thing that says it`s for the piping I said


 Well I cant read it for you. And its ANYTHING not any thing:thumbsup:


----------



## All Clear Sewer

If I want it to be ANY THING or one word. thats what it`s gonna be :whistling2: These frecken faces screws up my laptop when I`m typing. I have to edit to make it stop skiping letters.

Arnt you gonna copy the code and past it? 2003 IPC


----------



## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> Well I cant read it for you.


Copy and past it. You seem to be good at that:thumbup:

Well while you look everything up I`m gonna go to bed.

"And its ANYTHING not any thing" *and I believe it is ( it`s ) not its*


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Copy and past it. You seem to be good at that:thumbup:
> 
> Well while you look everything up I`m gonna go to bed.
> 
> "And its ANYTHING not any thing" *and I believe it is ( it`s ) not its*


 You could always use that jetter to open up a carwash if things get slow removing biomat. :whistling2:.


----------



## Redwood

All Clear Sewer said:


> I think it would be safe to say that their lack of experience is = to the two of yours.
> I haven`t seen many heath departments with much hands on experience.
> Hey did you know the world is flat and if you go to far one way or the other you will fall off?
> Hey it use to be in print from people that claimed to know everything :whistling2:
> 
> I find it funny at how many of us that do jetting have replied about our out-come of jetting septic lines but the two of you that dont even own a jetter think you can shoot down something you know nothing about. Talk about HACKS


While we would love to keep our jetter*s* busy out there rescuing the failing leaching fields of the world we choose to stay in a more legitimate line of work with them and manage to keep them quite busy. 

You are correct I don't own the company so I don't own the jetter*s* personally but we do have a few of them...:whistling2:

Its kind of funny that you talk about this because I tried to pitch this very idea to my boss and the shoot down wasn't fun! Took a bunch of tracer rounds right through the fuel tank and was going down in flames when I bailed out....


----------



## SlickRick

Like Bollinger said, Some HOs want you to try something before investing in the cost of a new system. Getting my excavator out there and back, digging, jetting, camera and back-filling. Realistically appears to at least be a days work. Without divulging any secrets give me a free estimate here and I won't hold you to it. How much does the average job run?
Are they running gravelless lines in your area? Can you deal with them?

P.S. I don't think either of you guys should enter a spelling bee, stick to plumbing and drain.


----------



## All Clear Sewer

Excavator is 200.00 an hour 
Jetter is 150.00 is an hour 
Pump truck is 150.00 a trip + 4.00 a mile
We dont camera septic drain fields but if someone really wanted it, I would for another 150.00 an hour
Most jobs take around 4 hours and cost the HO anywhere from $600 to $1200.00
New drain field starts around $3500 up.


----------



## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> You could always use that jetter to open up a carwash if things get slow removing biomat. :whistling2:.


Just as I thought, no legitimate reply....:laughing: Just uping your post count :whistling2:
Well unlike you, I have a few jobs to go do, so see ya later


----------



## Bollinger plumber

slickrick said:


> Like Bollinger said, Some HOs want you to try something before investing in the cost of a new system. Getting my excavator out there and back, digging, jetting, camera and back-filling. Realistically appears to at least be a days work. Without divulging any secrets give me a free estimate here and I won't hold you to it. How much does the average job run?
> Are they running gravelless lines in your area? Can you deal with them?
> 
> P.S. I don't think either of you guys should enter a spelling bee, stick to plumbing and drain.


Like I mentioned I have only done it a few times so don't take my rates as the going rates. I charged 250.00 for each leech line up to 100 ft. most of them around here are usually about 80 ft. Anything over 100 ft I would charge 2.00 a ft extra. I also put in a 50.00 dollar cleaning charge for taking my jetter to the car wash and cleaning it. I also charge the same for the camera if they want it cameraed but I try like hell to talk them out of it. I don't really want to run my camera in a leech field.


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Just as I thought, no legitimate reply....:laughing: Just uping your post count :whistling2:
> Well unlike you, I have a few jobs to go do, so see ya later


 What was I suppose to reply to? Copy and paste somthing I already posted a link to? YOU CONNECTED PVC TO PVC WITH UNSHIELDED FERNCO BANDS ON A SEWER.......ALL THE WHILE BASHING WHAT THE LAST GUY DID ON THE JOB 20 YEARS AGO.....its on your website,go have a look for yourself:whistling2:


----------



## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Excavator is 200.00 an hour
> Jetter is 150.00 is an hour
> Pump truck is 150.00 a trip + 4.00 a mile
> We dont camera septic drain fields but if someone really wanted it, I would for another 150.00 an hour
> Most jobs take around 4 hours and cost the HO anywhere from $600 to $1200.00
> New drain field starts around $3500 up.


 So you drive the pump truck over....then you drive a backhoe over to the house and then dig the tank up...then dig the distribution box up. You jet the lines all the while pumping out all the water your jetter is putting into the mix. After all that is done you cover all the holes up you dug. Then you clean and load the equipment up. Where do you dump your sewage that you pumped? Congradulations you just used $100,000 worth of equipment and two men to do a half assed job that you grossed $600-$1200 bucks in what you claim takes 4 hours. Maybe you should go back to washing cars bud:thumbsup:


----------



## jrsaltz

TheMaster said:


> Dupage county IL. has the info on their website. What do they say about it?


 Are you going to seriously not answer any of my questions? Well, i guess you don't have any real experience with this type of service. I thought so.:no:

Who do you suppose wrote that information on their website? OK, i'll shoot:

Someone who more than likely has not done this either. AGAIN........when you have some real facts please share with the group!!!!! Stop cutting and pasting, it makes you look bad!:laughing:


----------



## Cuda

The web site did see a use for jetting ,clearing the line just not the bio mat.
The original poster asked what could be done besides snaking and 3 people gave an answer that was positive for jetting helping the system work again.


----------



## Redwood

slickrick said:


> I am the Op, and I have a question. I don't own a jetter,and I have seen the hoses wrecked. I assume that jetters, with training are capable of doing more than I can imagine , is this true ? Is training available?


US Jetting has an excellent training program. :thumbup:
I believe Song Dog just went through it recently.
I went quite a while ago.

Yes Jetters open up a lot of work that you just can't effectively do with a cable.
Protech has some pretty good videos of some of the things like descaling.


----------



## Redwood

jrsaltz said:


> Jetters can be used in many applications if you just think outside the box. I know a guy who created a nozzle for cleaning well casings and the screens in the bottoms. It works great as long as the system is chlorinated afterward.




I think I'd want to see a dedicated machine for that application... :whistling2:
Say is that a chocolate shake? :laughing:

I'll stay in the box thanks!


----------



## Ron

Thread reopened I cleaned it up some, if more post need to be moved send a report on it, keep this topic under control is all we ask.


----------



## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> What was I suppose to reply to? Copy and paste somthing I already posted a link to? YOU CONNECTED PVC TO PVC WITH UNSHIELDED FERNCO BANDS ON A SEWER.......ALL THE WHILE BASHING WHAT THE LAST GUY DID ON THE JOB 20 YEARS AGO.....its on your website,go have a look for yourself:whistling2:


Can you not read???? PVC to ORANGEBURG and PVC to CLAY ...duhhhhhhh 
On that job you talk about the last guy (might have been you for all I know) put a 22 in backwards. The only other way to do that job would have been brake out $5000 worth of concrete under a driveway and reinstall the complete sewer. The uses of the UNSHIELDED FERNCO`S were the best choice for the project as the job wasn't done right to begin with and the costumer didn't have the money to re`do the complete system. 
Please explain to me what a shielded flex cupping No-Hub or as you want to call em Mission band would have done different? Nothing, not one damn thing as this was an "outside under ground" repair. 
Here we can use UNSHIELDED FERNCO`S "Outside a building", "above and under ground". You gotta come up with something better then that if you wants pick crap with me.

Now show me those mission bands that fit 4" PVC to 4" ORANGEBURG and 4" PVC to 4" CLAY :whistling2:


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## ironandfire

...so your breaking up biocrust with a jetter?


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> So you drive the pump truck over....then you drive a backhoe over to the house and then dig the tank up...then dig the distribution box up. You jet the lines all the while pumping out all the water your jetter is putting into the mix. After all that is done you cover all the holes up you dug. Then you clean and load the equipment up. Where do you dump your sewage that you pumped? Congradulations you just used $100,000 worth of equipment and two men to do a half assed job that you grossed $600-$1200 bucks in what you claim takes 4 hours. Maybe you should go back to washing cars bud:thumbsup:


No, I don't drive my Excavator to the job site....rotflmao
$100,000 worth of equipment ....hummmmm YEP :thumbup: and it`s all paid for too 

Man you suck at this game :laughing:


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## All Clear Sewer

Cuda said:


> The web site did see a use for jetting ,clearing the line just not the bio mat.
> The original poster asked what could be done besides snaking and 3 people gave an answer that was positive for jetting helping the system work again.


I think I`ll end my posting on this topic with this quote. Not much more to say on this topic as it looks like Cuda has pointed out what the topic is about.
Master you have my number or you can PM me if you`d like


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Damn, I missed the good stuff. Always miss the good stuff. Damn you bath remodel, Damn you all to hell.:furious:


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## All Clear Sewer

Nothing to see here ROCKSTARPLUMBER, Move along please, theres nothing to see here :laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Theres plenty to see here. What I didn't see is a License number on your website. Are you a drain cleaner, or a plumber?


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## ILPlumber

TheMaster said:


> Maybe you should go back to washing cars bud:thumbsup:


Dayum! Somebody was doing some major research to dig that fun fact up:laughing: 

That is some "Precision" searching:laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

ILPlumber said:


> Dayum! Somebody was doing some major research to dig that fun fact up:laughing:
> 
> That is some "Precision" searching:laughing:


Wut is intriguing is that the word "fact" is in your quoted statement above.:blink:


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## SlickRick

Must be the auto detail.


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## All Clear Sewer

Yes Rick I own a Auto Detail & Body Shop. Something wrong with that? Guess I dont get it


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## SlickRick

All Clear Sewer said:


> Yes Rick I own a Auto Detail & Body Shop. Something wrong with that? Guess I dont get it


No, No problem, I was trying to figure out where the "go back to car washing " comment came from. More business the better. I am not one that tries to be offensive.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

:laughing: Gawd Dammit.:laughing: 

Who let you in here?:laughing: What kind of license do you hold fella?


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## Airgap

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> :laughing: Gawd Dammit.:laughing:
> 
> Who let you in here?:laughing: What kind of license do you hold fella?


*Multi-state field line car detailing jetter"s license* #007


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## Redwood

He's got a storm chasing license too! :laughing:


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## SlickRick

Redwood said:


> He's got a storm chasing license too! :laughing:


I saw that while I was going Dick Tracy. The mans busy.


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## Airgap

Maybe a roofer's license, they cover it ALL....:laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

Dah dah dah.​


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## ILPlumber

OK boys. I sent the man a pm. He confirmed that he is in fact a licensed plumber. The end.

I also own a car wash so, don't ridicule that business:jester:


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## Redwood

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> A Tale of 2 Cleanings
> 
> By
> 
> Rockstarplumber
> 
> Scene 1.
> 
> Teenage boy: "Im tired of washing cars daddy. All I do is clean spinners and wipe bugs off of wind sheilds all fuggin day.
> 
> Old man: "Son, cleaning cars is a fine job. Wut else would you wanna do besides this. Look at Mrs. Watson's Beamer, I got to drive it from belt line, to the clean line. Where else would you get to drive a nice car like that son?"
> 
> Teenge boy looks around, hesitating to look his father in the eye. The old man can't seem to understand why his son will not talk to him honestly. Finally, the teenage boy snaps.
> 
> Teenage boy:
> "Alirght then dammit daddy! I was at the diner the other day, and Roto rooter came by. They was spraying out a pipe with this high pressure hose. Like the wands we wash the cars with. Only they's was differnent. Real differnt."
> I wanna clean ****ter pipes out daddy. Thas wut i wanna do. I wanna clean ****ter pipes. I hate you daddy, damn you and this car wash!:furious:"​


Look out he'll go disorderly conduct on ya...:blink:


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## Airgap

ILPlumber said:


> OK boys. I sent the man a pm. He confirmed that he is in fact a licensed plumber. The end.
> 
> I also own a car wash so, don't ridicule that business:jester:


 :laughing::laughing::laughing: Alot of high strung car wash owners around here lately....


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

I have seen no proof that he is a licensed plumber. To me he is just a drain cleaner. I have seen drain cleaners booted on the spot on this forum. Where is the consistency on this forum. No offense to the ones who have been here a while. But come on,









OR,


Semi-







?
​


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## ILPlumber

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I have seen no proof that he is a licensed plumber. To me he is just a drain cleaner. I have seen drain cleaners booted on the spot on this forum. Where is the consistency on this forum. No offense to the ones who have been here a while. But come on,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OR,​
> 
> Semi-
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?​


What exactly is it that you want me to do Rock? I pm'd the man. He replied that he is a licensed plumber. We somewhat operate on the honor system here.

I'm not about to call a guy I don't know from Adam a liar.

And no, I am not going to be asking folks to see a copy of their license.

For all you guys know, I am a frggin insurance agent.............

Thank you.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER

ILPlumber said:


> What exactly is it that you want me to do Rock? I pm'd the man. He replied that he is a licensed plumber. We somewhat operate on the honor system here.
> 
> I'm not about to call a guy I don't know from Adam a liar.
> 
> And no, I am not going to be asking folks to see a copy of their license.
> 
> For all you guys know, I am a frggin insurance agent.............
> 
> Thank you.


how do you find time to sell insurance when you own a carwash and lie about being a plumber? Huh? Mr. Smarty pants? Huh?


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## ILPlumber

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> how do you find time to sell insurance when you own a carwash and lie about being a plumber? Huh? Mr. Smarty pants? Huh?


I am quite the multi-tasker. Right now I'm viewing another window and ummm nevermind... while typing this post.:laughing::laughing:

I'm just glad to see this thread turn from the DRAMA.

To stay on topic. I have never operated any sewer cleaning equipment.


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## user4

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> I have seen no proof that he is a licensed plumber. To me he is just a drain cleaner. I have seen drain cleaners booted on the spot on this forum. Where is the consistency on this forum. No offense to the ones who have been here a while. But come on,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> OR,
> 
> 
> Semi-
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ?
> ​


I don't work in the trade, so I guess I should hit the road.


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## Ron

Killertoiletspider said:


> I don't work in the trade, so I guess I should hit the road.


BS KTS you are going no where, RSP is just having PMS tonight. :yes:


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## gear junkie

I've talked to all clear and although much of his business is sewer and drain, he does quite a bit of plumbing. Whether he's licensed....don't know, never asked and it's none of my business. I know of a couple guys that aren't licensed but provide some great insight. FYI. I'm not a licensed plumber. I'm going to be but as of right now, nope, not licensed by the state of CA. Just throwing it out there in case any asks.


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## All Clear Sewer

Easy there Ben, dont let TheMaster know you have talked to me or he`ll be on a mission band roll with ya :laughing:


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## Ron

Ok made new topic for the car chatter.

Not keep this thread on topic.

http://www.plumbingzone.com/f13/hot-rod-heaven-6737/


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## All Clear Sewer

Just to let you guys know, I`ve had about 10 or so phone calls about this topic from people wanting to jet their systems. We are not the only people reading this forum. We may want to think about how we talk to each outher as the people we work for do use the internet search :whistling2:
I had a few out of state calls so you jetter guys might want to post your contact info. They must be getting my number off my sig?


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Just to let you guys know, I`ve had about 10 or so phone calls about this topic from people wanting to jet their systems. We are not the only people reading this forum. We may want to think about how we talk to each outher as the people we work for do use the internet search :whistling2:
> I had a few out of state calls so you jetter guys might want to post your contact info. Then must be getting my number off my sig?


I suggest anyone reading this thread to call their local authority on septic systems and check if any perc test or permits are required when repairing of digging in a septic systems failing/failed drainfield. Plumbers protect the health of the Nation:thumbsup: In heavily populated areas a homes failing septic drainfield or tank can contaminate the neighbors yards and properrty or flow into a public waterway's. Usually the more populated the area is the more regulation you have.


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> I suggest anyone reading this thread to call their local authority on septic systems and check if any perc test or permits are required when repairing of digging in a septic systems failing/failed drainfield. Plumbers protect the health of the Nation:thumbsup: In heavily populated areas a homes failing septic drainfield or tank can contaminate the neighbors yards and properrty or flow into a public waterway's. Usually the more populated the area is the more regulation you have.


The best thing people can do is call a Septic Specialist as they should have all the info anyone could want or need. Calling a plumber is just wasting your time as most plumbers dont know or understand how a system works. Most Septic Specialist are licensed in the field they work in and have a better understanding on your needs.


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## Bollinger plumber

Oh boy here we go again.


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> The best thing people can do is call a Septic Specialist as they should have all the info anyone could want or need. Calling a plumber is just wasting your time as most plumbers dont know or understand how a system works. Most Septic Specialist are licensed in the field they work in and have a better understanding on your needs.


 I feel like its best if the general public for a person on a septic system thats failing to contact their local authority to make sure the septic specialist is following all the rules and regulations that go along with the job. I see nothing wrong with checks and balances.


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## Protech

There are many different reasons that fields fail. If the field is simply undersized then jetting will do nothing. If as TM said, there is a buildup over the holes (in the case if a perforated pipe system) then jetting will solve that problem as the high velocity water stream blasts the silt/grease/whatever out of the holes and the jet can sweep the debris into the tank where it can be pumped out. It's also common to have tree roots invade the d-box or one branch of a bed effectively reducing the system size. You can check for this by probing out each line with a sampling probe. If one line comes up dry then you know it's not getting any flow and you send the jetter and cam in for surgery. There are also various techniques to remove biomats but I'm not well read on them. service call



ILPlumber said:


> Please explain to me how introducing more water to a drain field that is already water-logged fixes the problem?


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## Protech

Around here the septic guys are the worst. They never pull permits and are frequently busted illegally dumping sludge/effluent.



TheMaster said:


> I feel like its best if the general public for a person on a septic system thats failing to contact their local authority to make sure the septic specialist is following all the rules and regulations that go along with the job. I see nothing wrong with checks and balances.


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## TheMaster

Protech said:


> Around here the septic guys are the worst. They never pull permits and are frequently busted illegally dumping sludge/effluent.


Dont worry its not just around you. Its all over the country,some of those guys will dump that sewage truck where they shouldn't to save a buck. If every homeowner that had a septic tank would call and notify the local authorites when their tank was pumped it would be a good way to cross check how many gallons of waste they are paying to dump. That way they couldn;t dump it into a creek down a dirt road for your kids to play in 2 miles down stream.


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## All Clear Sewer

Protech said:


> Around here the septic guys are the worst. They never pull permits and are frequently busted illegally dumping sludge/effluent.


Around here we see licensed plumbers doing the same thing as most of them are NOT licensed to do septic work. Most states require plumbers to also be licensed for septic and some plumbers think their above having to get and pay for another license. Thus the reason I said "Septic Specialist"


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> Dont worry its not just around you. Its all over the country,some of those guys will dump that sewage truck where they shouldn't to save a buck. If every homeowner that had a septic tank would call and notify the local authorites when their tank was pumped it would be a good way to cross check how many gallons of waste they are paying to dump. That way they couldn;t dump it into a creek down a dirt road for your kids to play in 2 miles down stream.


Around here, a "licensed" septic company has to log every load. We have a 4 page bill of lading that must be filled out before you leave the job site. Has to be signed by the Home Owner, the Waste Hauler and the Waste Water Control Facility Employee. It list Reason for Pumping, Gallons and Where it came from. The city, county, home owner and the septic waste company all get a copy of the bill of lading. We have very strict regulations when it comes to working on or with any septic system.

BTW.... jetting another one today


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## TheMaster

All Clear Sewer said:


> Around here, a "licensed" septic company has to log every load. We have a 4 page bill of lading that must be filled out before you leave the job site. Has to be signed by the Home Owner, the Waste Hauler and the Waste Water Control Facility Employee. It list Reason for Pumping, Gallons and Where it came from. The city, county, home owner and the septic waste company all get a copy of the bill of lading. We have very strict regulations when it comes to working on or with any septic system.
> 
> BTW.... jetting another one today


What does it cost per gallon to dump the waste? 
BTW.....better you than me:thumbsup:


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## Airgap

I use a plunger on my drain field....


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## All Clear Sewer

TheMaster said:


> What does it cost per gallon to dump the waste?
> BTW.....better you than me:thumbsup:


$10.00 per 1000 gallons


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