# Winterizing a house



## JenkPlbg (Nov 27, 2011)

I winterized my first house today, but wonder if I was instructed to do it the best way.

We poured RV Anti-freeze down the traps of all the fixtures, drained the toilets and poured RV Anti-freeze in the tank and bowl. We blew out the water lines with air, and bled down the ice maker, and dishwasher. We drained the water heater, and left all fixtures, including hose bibs open. And then tagged everything as winterized.

Is it necessary to blow, or fill up the water lines with the RV Anti-freeze? The bottle claimed that you should, but cross contamination comes to mind there. That, and if you blow the water lines out with an air compressor, is there any benefits of trying to put RV anti-freeze through the lines? 

I just want to make sure I learn things in the highest quality way, I would hate to winterize a house, and have to go back and replace something, because it froze, due too poor workmanship.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

JenkPlbg said:


> I winterized my first house today, but wonder if I was instructed to do it the best way.
> 
> We poured RV Anti-freeze down the traps of all the fixtures, drained the toilets and poured RV Anti-freeze in the tank and bowl. We blew out the water lines with air, and bled down the ice maker, and dishwasher. We drained the water heater, and left all fixtures, including hose bibs open. And then tagged everything as winterized.
> 
> ...


 




You're joking right? Anti-freeze in someone's potable water line?


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## JenkPlbg (Nov 27, 2011)

That is what the bottle said, I did not go along with that obviously. It said to De-winterize the house, you run water until it is clear.

The RV Anti-freeze, is made of a different chemical make-up than a regular anti-freeze. But i still did not think it was wise to mix with potable water. 
I was just wondering if anyone else did any extra steps to prevent freezing.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h4936/show



The gov't. mandated that anti-freeze manufacturers add a bittering agent to their product due to a deliberate poisoning. A woman murdered her husband by spiking his drinks with anti-freeze. After the police learned what she did, the gov't. acted to prevent it from happening again. 

Anti-freeze is highly toxic to people.


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Tommy plumber said:


> http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h4936/show
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's for regular antifreeze. Supposedly it's naturally sweet to the taste and spilling it on the ground is a no-no because dogs drink it.

Pink RV antifreeze is supposedly non-toxic, but everything is toxic in the right quantity.

They put that stuff in RV potable water systems all the time. You just flush it out in the spring. It's supposed to be compatible with all types of plumbing systems. 

I don't do it, but I have considered it when winterizing a house, but the nitrogen bottle blows the water out nicely, so why waste the RV fluid.

When the FHA or VA start requiring it, then I'll do it.


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## NYC Plumber (May 4, 2011)

JenkPlbg said:


> I winterized my first house today, but wonder if I was instructed to do it the best way.
> 
> We poured RV Anti-freeze down the traps of all the fixtures, drained the toilets and poured RV Anti-freeze in the tank and bowl. We blew out the water lines with air, and bled down the ice maker, and dishwasher. We drained the water heater, and left all fixtures, including hose bibs open. And then tagged everything as winterized.
> 
> ...


Come on man, its just scary that idea crossed your mind..


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## NYC Plumber (May 4, 2011)

ChrisConnor said:


> That's for regular antifreeze. Supposedly it's naturally sweet to the taste and spilling it on the ground is a no-no because dogs drink it.
> 
> Pink RV antifreeze is supposedly non-toxic, but everything is toxic in the right quantity.
> 
> ...


I cant believe what im reading.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*you did it ok*

I have begun to winterize homes around town again...
I used to do about 250 homes a year but 
now that the obama administration has taken over
the work has been given to "special interests" to
spread the wealth and even out the playing field...:yes::yes::whistling2: yea right.....


I might do 30 this year,,,, but you did everything right,,, 
as long as you use an air compressor with high pressure at around 150psi 
to blow out the lines it all good... 
I use one of those hand guns with an acetylene hose clamped to
the end with about 6 feet of hose... you stick that into all the faucets
and give it a good blast of air... 

I got a 300 foot air hose from harbor freight on a reel and just 
reel it into the home then crank it on and blow everything out 




*you do not need to put pink rv antifreeze in *
*the water lines...that is a total waste of antifreeze*
*and a huge complete waste of time.*


as long as you took out the meter or drained down the well tank
then blew out all the lines, that is all that is necessary....

High pressure AIR is cheap


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## Mississippiplum (Sep 30, 2011)

Rv antifreeze is non toxic. I winterize my rv on a reg basis cause it's in ms and it gets cold there, I blow the lines out with air and drain the heater and never had any problems. That anti-freeze stuff Is messy as hell, and u have to pump in into the system till it runs out of every faucet, a pita . Compressed air is the best thing.

Not to mention u have to install a bypass on the wh if u use the antifreeze stuff,


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## NYC Plumber (May 4, 2011)

I honestly dont care if it says its not toxic. Would you drink a glass of it?
Nothing belongs in domestic water piping except domestic water.


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## greenscoutII (Aug 27, 2008)

JenkPlbg said:


> I winterized my first house today, but wonder if I was instructed to do it the best way.
> 
> We poured RV Anti-freeze down the traps of all the fixtures, drained the toilets and poured RV Anti-freeze in the tank and bowl. We blew out the water lines with air, and bled down the ice maker, and dishwasher. We drained the water heater, and left all fixtures, including hose bibs open. And then tagged everything as winterized.
> 
> ...


You did it right. You'll be fine.....

I've winterized hundreds of houses in Colorado. I've never introduced RV anti-freeze to the water lines, simply blow them out with air. Ideally, if the meter is in a pit out by the curb, you would disconect it and blow out the lines all the way to the meter as well.....


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

NYC Plumber said:


> I honestly dont care if it says its not toxic. Would you drink a glass of it?
> Nothing belongs in domestic water piping except domestic water.


 

I doubt that it would kill you , but it probably would give
 you the pink runs for about a week.
 it would clean you out real good..


I dont see any reason to tempt fate I would not put it in the water system
 especially if you are not the fellow that will de-winterize the home next spring...

, you could possibly get some dumb ass new home owner trying to sue
 you if you filled the water lines up with pink RV...


.If they de-winterize the home themselves and did not flush out the lines properly..
. they they could possibly make themselves sick.. and then they turn 
around and sue you for no warning signs on the fixtures... or whatever....


I have seen some pretty stupid things go down with 
REO homes over the years

Just dont use it on potable water lines you have no control of later on down the road.... :no: 

..


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

If you must put something in the water lines that doesn't freeze, try vodka....:laughing:


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## Mississippiplum (Sep 30, 2011)

I agree I wouldn't use it, maybe on my own rv where there's not alot of piping and I can flush everything out good, but I wouldnt use it in a house.


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## NYC Plumber (May 4, 2011)

Master Mark said:


> I doubt that it would kill you , but it probably would give
> you the pink runs for about a week.
> it would clean you out real good..
> 
> ...


Getting sued is not the reason why i wouldn't put antifreeze ina domestic water line....


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

NYC Plumber said:


> I honestly dont care if it says its not toxic. Would you drink a glass of it?
> Nothing belongs in domestic water piping except domestic water.


Well, nobody is using it, just considering what makes the job better. 
C-O-N-S-I-D-E-R-I-N-G.


I wouldn't drink pvc cement, primer or flux either and that stuff *is* toxic. Oh, wait, the line gets flushed out, doesn't it?

Obviously you don't know what non toxic means. :whistling2:


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

Did the owner of the home vote for Obama? I'm just saying.


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## NYC Plumber (May 4, 2011)

ChrisConnor said:


> Well, nobody is using it, just considering what makes the job better.
> C-O-N-S-I-D-E-R-I-N-G.
> 
> I wouldn't drink pvc cement, primer or flux either and that stuff is toxic. Oh, wait, the line gets flushed out, doesn't it?
> ...


And you obviously dont know what domestic water is or how or understand how to protect it.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

Tommy plumber said:


> http://www.opencongress.org/bill/110-h4936/show
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Big difference between RV anti-freeze and standard automotive anti-freeze. Usually the RV is deemed safe for potable systems.

As for the OP, sounds like you got it mostly right. I was never a fan of doing it like that, but learned from the master of winterizing. He does 300 cottages a year.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

NYC Plumber said:


> And you obviously dont know what domestic water is or how or understand how to protect it.



Because of course its not like they use toxic chemicals to make the water potable, with EPA approval and regulation. :laughing:

Chlorine
Ammonia
Charcoal
etc....


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

NYC Plumber said:


> And you obviously dont know what domestic water is or how or understand how to protect it.



I do. I've never used rv antifreeze in a potable system, I just said that I considered what made the job better.

I didn't use it because :

1. It wasn't necessary since I purged the lines with air.

2. Even I wasn't sure if it was safe, even though it says it is.


If you find it appalling that I read the instructions on the container that say it's safe and wondered, then that's your problem. 

Comprehension lacking much?


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## Eric (Jan 10, 2011)

Not sure if you did or not, but I always put some AF in the washing machine and dishwasher and pump it out to protect the pumps on them. 

I also do not add antifreeze in the potable but know some that do, it is not necessary if it was blown out correctly. I rig a washing machine hose to a hose bib at the main/well tank. All the homes we do have a hose bib there for ease of draining/blowing them out. 

The other end of the WM hose gets a hose x male/female and then a quick connector to the compressor, set the regulator and have at it.


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Whadda you think flouride will do to you.? 

And our Govt puts it in the water.........................


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

How does one deal with shower risers,capped off tub supplies,handheld hoses and other satelite stub-outs.
Freezing ever blow out a valve body?
you leave the cartridges sitting in the soap dish for winter?


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Are we talking hunting and fishing cabins out in the woods? Or just a home where the outside hose spigots are drained for the winter?


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

Tommy plumber said:


> Are we talking hunting and fishing cabins out in the woods? Or just a home where the outside hose spigots are drained for the winter?


 Out here I got a few buddies that have retired to communities that not only freeze but have the vacation homes making up a great deal of the community.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

drtyhands said:


> How does one deal with shower risers,capped off tub supplies,handheld hoses and other satelite stub-outs.
> Freezing ever blow out a valve body?
> you leave the cartridges sitting in the soap dish for winter?


If done properly these items are never really an issue. However, they can lead to a little bit of return business from creating a little maintenance need when you turn the place back on. 

In the 300 plus lake cottages and homes my former employer did there were usually 10% that would need some small repairs, of which were charged, because of being out of use. 

Plumbing systems in my opinion are not really meant to be out of service for months at a time, but can handle it.


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

JenkPlbg said:


> I winterized my first house today, but wonder if I was instructed to do it the best way.
> 
> We poured RV Anti-freeze down the traps of all the fixtures, drained the toilets and poured RV Anti-freeze in the tank and bowl. We blew out the water lines with air, and bled down the ice maker, and dishwasher. We drained the water heater, and left all fixtures, including hose bibs open. And then tagged everything as winterized.
> 
> ...



Just my experience & understanding, but the whole purpose of leaving the hose-bibs, etc. open is to allow any residual water an avenue of escape should it freeze & expand. I would never put any sort of anti-freeze in proximity to cross-contamination. You put the anti-freeze in the traps to maintain your seal from sewer gasses & not risk water expanding & cracking the trap. Short of that, as long as you have drained the house down & leave any trapped water an expansion route, you should be good as gold.


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## JenkPlbg (Nov 27, 2011)

Thanks!


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

I actually like the taste of RV antifreeze. Keeps me regular too.



We normally charge $279.00 to winterize and can't find one customer willing to pay that.


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## JenkPlbg (Nov 27, 2011)

I bet. Looked pretty tasty.

We charged time and material. Ended up being about 180. Took 1.5 he's and 2 gal of af


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

We do quite a few winterizations each year as there are quite a few seasonal homes...

If you think that little pancake compressor at 150 psi is going to adequately blow the water out of the lines you are sadly mistaken... :yes:

As plumbers we know that with water supply it is not the pressure that really counts it is the volume available at the fixtures and when it comes to blowing out the lines compressed air is no different.

We run a trailer rig to our winterizations...

You need the air volume to move the water or you will be doing repairs....


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## beachplumber (Feb 7, 2010)

I use the w.h. to build up the air volume.

That being said i will b rolling with 200' of hose a lg comp. And gen. In a trailer.


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## JenkPlbg (Nov 27, 2011)

so do you have a shut-off on the hot side of the w.h. and fill it up with air first, then open the shut-off? Or do you cap the hot side, and fill it up with air from the drain? How do you know how much air to put in it, do you use any gauges?


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