# Smoke Test



## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

I'm doing a smoke test this week hopefully to find the source of sewer smell in a residential bathroom so I decided to make a smoke machine vs buying one. It works pretty good, all for less than $100. Anyone have any tips when doing a smoke test, I've never done or seen it done before.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

That's going to melt, that abs tee will catch fire. You need something metal, your setup is cool and it would work provided you could keep the bomb in metal but surrounded by water to stay cool. 20$ bucket vac with a bowl inside works fine. Plug the base of the stack through the cleanout(if there is one) and create positive pressure within the stack. Tape the hose to the vent on the roof. Smoke will find its way out.


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

Nice setup :thumbup: This one was in a commercial building but basically is the same thing.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Gargalaxy said:


> Nice setup :thumbup: This one was in a commercial building but basically is the same thing.


Galaxy that's not a smoky take a look that's a 50,000 ft.³ smokebomb


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## Cajunhiker (Dec 14, 2009)

KoleckeINC said:


> 20$ bucket vac with a bowl inside works fine.


I've heard of this but haven't tried it. Seems like it should work.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

The vac may blow smoke through traps...

Before smoke testing give the entire drain waste vent system and each fixture a very thorough inspection before smoking...

Consider it almost as a last resort...

If you miss the obvious your test will conclude that there is a lot of smoke in the house and you aren't sure where it came from...:laughing:

I tried to warn him...:laughing:

I really did...:laughing:


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## Mykeeb33 (Mar 6, 2015)

90% of the time it's a bad bowl wax seal.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

Seal the bathroom in question so you don't get confused by drift. Before my first smoke test (smoke bomb lowered down the 4" vent stack) it was warned that I should contact the fire department. I decided that would be overkill not to mention an invitation to the fire dept to charge me a fee for the privilege. When I looked up from the stack and saw smoke pouring out of the manhole in the middle of the street, I wished I had listened.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Step one-peppermint test,
Step two smoke
Step 3 work like hell
Step 4 have a beer


20$ shop vac-not 5 peak horsepower craftsman.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Only type of smoke test I've done are the type you light with a lighter and toss them in the closest clean out... But I can see how that could be used for bigger problems.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Check out Superior smoke website, they have info a first timer needs to know to properly perform a smoke test.
I purchased the 5-e electric smoke for $450. I know it's a lot of money for a fan motor but I didn't want any false positives.


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## theplungerman (Oct 26, 2011)

GREENPLUM said:


> Check out Superior smoke website, they have info a first timer needs to know to properly perform a smoke test.
> I purchased the 5-e electric smoke for $450. I know it's a lot of money for a fan motor but I didn't want any false positives.


That looks like the one I've been eyeing at the Rooter machine store. Have you used it yet.? Do. You think it's worth the money or just fashion up a shop van.


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## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

Mykeeb33 said:


> 90% of the time it's a bad bowl wax seal.


It ended up being a leaking wax ring. The smoke test pin pointed it right away. Has anyone used smoke to find cracks in the sewer main outside? Will the smoke penetrate the soil?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

sierra2000 said:


> It ended up being a leaking wax ring. The smoke test pin pointed it right away. Has anyone used smoke to find cracks in the sewer main outside? Will the smoke penetrate the soil?


The leaking wax ring is most often easily found on an inspection of fixtures...
Is the toilet loose, moving around, or rocking?
Fix it before you smoke test, the wax ring is certainly compromised...

On most of my smell complaints I find the problem without smoke testing, just by a thorough inspection, and I'm the guy that has a nose that hardly works...

As for smoke penetrating the soil during a test that would depend on shallow depth and loose soil...

I wouldn't count on it...

A careful camera inspection should see the cracks, and no doubt if it is leaking you'll probably find roots...


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## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

Redwood said:


> The leaking wax ring is most often easily found on an inspection of fixtures... Is the toilet loose, moving around, or rocking? Fix it before you smoke test, the wax ring is certainly compromised... On most of my smell complaints I find the problem without smoke testing, just by a thorough inspection, and I'm the guy that has a nose that hardly works... As for smoke penetrating the soil during a test that would depend on shallow depth and loose soil... I wouldn't count on it... A careful camera inspection should see the cracks, and no doubt if it is leaking you'll probably find roots...


The homeowner said it only smelled when they showered and not every time they showered so I thought it'd be the broken vent. Seeing the smoke coming out the ground from their cracked sewer line would be undeniable and almost guarantee you're awarded the job.


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## Workhorseplmg (Apr 10, 2013)

I get down on the floor and smell with water running in the sink or tub. The water running through the drain system stirs up the rookie butter.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

theplungerman said:


> That looks like the one I've been eyeing at the Rooter machine store. Have you used it yet.? Do. You think it's worth the money or just fashion up a shop van.


Yes, used many times with positive results from loose clean-out plugs buried behind sheetrock, rusted out nails and screws in drain pipe, hairline cracked fittings in walls.

Before I purchased it I tried using a shop vac, it blew way too much air than needed and smoke was coming outta the P-traps. Normally it's a big deal when we perform the test and tennants are notified well in advance, so in effort to have the best results I spent the money and got the $450 tool. Only took 1 job to pay for itself and nice profit for me.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

To be a great smoke tester you hafta have the system sealed up tight before you start, there is a process. I learned the hard way, trial and error. There is an art to it. Now it's easy peasy $$


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## theplungerman (Oct 26, 2011)

GREENPLUM said:


> To be a great smoke tester you hafta have the system sealed up tight before you start, there is a process. I learned the hard way, trial and error. There is an art to it. Now it's easy peasy $$


Thank you very much for that. Do you agree with Redwood that it should be a last resort. IOW, Exhaust all other options first. I'm thinking it would be harder to notice a crack in a sewer pipe as opposed to seeing smoke. A hole? Easy,,, a small crack in an old line full of scale, this and that? Hard I would think.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

theplungerman said:


> Thank you very much for that. Do you agree with Redwood that it should be a last resort. IOW, Exhaust all other options first. I'm thinking it would be harder to notice a crack in a sewer pipe as opposed to seeing smoke. A hole? Easy,,, a small crack in an old line full of scale, this and that? Hard I would think.


I don't mean go nuts over it...

But yea I'm giving really good look at all fixtures and in the area of the odor...

At a truck stop I found a broken vent pipe in a drop ceiling near their soda fountain just by looking...

In a modular home attic I found a vent that they missed connecting when they put the house together just by looking...

I found 2 dead mice by taking the cover off the boiler emergency switch at the top of the stairs just by looking when there was no plumbing in the area of the complaint...

I can't tell you how many missing p-traps and bad wax rings without a smoke test...

Just by looking...


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## plumbdrum (Nov 30, 2013)

Funny your saying this, at city hall they are complaining about a smell and the city plumber is getting blamed for the smell because of new pair of bathrooms that got installed. He is in defense mode with the employees and I told him to relax and stop being a plumber and start being a detective. His work was tested and approved and I'm telling him to start looking at other things and not the work he performed. I'm waiting in suspense . Lol


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

sierra2000 said:


> The homeowner said it only smelled when they showered and not every time they showered so I thought it'd be the broken vent. Seeing the smoke coming out the ground from their cracked sewer line would be undeniable and almost guarantee you're awarded the job.


It always "only" smells when they are showering. They are filling the air with hot mist and also spending a longer amount of time in there. It always smells the customer just noticed it more the longer they stayed in the room.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Sewer gas odor locating can be difficult. I approach it one item at a time. Pull and reset a toilet, get paid (get a signature), pull another toilet, get paid, replace a studor vent, get paid. Crawl space inspection rate approved in advance. Smoke test rate approved in advance. I learned the hard way.


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

Redwood said:


> The leaking wax ring is most often easily found on an inspection of fixtures...
> Is the toilet loose, moving around, or rocking?
> Fix it before you smoke test, the wax ring is certainly compromised.


Sometimes even if the toilet is tight the seal is still gone. I ran into this today at the house of the contractor that we do a certain fast food chain for. The toilet was lagged to the floor so it was tight. Unfortunately the metal ring rotted away and that was how someone decided to fix it. The riser was just floating in the floor. It must have been like that for a while because the hardwood floor is about 10 years old and the only screw holes in it where from the lags and there was no evidence of the metal ring.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

dhal22 said:


> Sewer gas odor locating can be difficult. I approach it one item at a time. Pull and reset a toilet, get paid (get a signature), pull another toilet, get paid, replace a studor vent, get paid. Crawl space inspection rate approved in advance. Smoke test rate approved in advance. I learned the hard way.


It's also difficult because the odor you are chasing can be in a H.O.'s head. After two pull / resets, a customer may start to think you don't know what you are doing, and will swear they still smell "something," not all the time mind you, and it never smells when you are there. :no:


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

I have exposed and separated the main sewer outside the house and blown smoke upstream a couple of times. It worked.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

bct p&h said:


> Sometimes even if the toilet is tight the seal is still gone. I ran into this today at the house of the contractor that we do a certain fast food chain for. The toilet was lagged to the floor so it was tight. Unfortunately the metal ring rotted away and that was how someone decided to fix it. The riser was just floating in the floor. It must have been like that for a while because the hardwood floor is about 10 years old and the only screw holes in it where from the lags and there was no evidence of the metal ring.


I agree it can be...

But before I smoke test I'm taking care of the obvious...
I save the smoke for when it gets tough...

Even though I'm on commission (I wouldn't have it any other way) there is no need to bring on the expense of a smoke test to the customer when there is obvious leakage...


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## plumberjesse92 (Nov 6, 2015)

When doing a smoke test having a laser is a good idea... It helps you see the "thin" smoke.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> Check out Superior smoke website, they have info a first timer needs to know to properly perform a smoke test.
> I purchased the 5-e electric smoke for $450. I know it's a lot of money for a fan motor but I didn't want any false positives.


Bump


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Unclog1776 said:


> It always "only" smells when they are showering. They are filling the air with hot mist and also spending a longer amount of time in there. It always smells the customer just noticed it more the longer they stayed in the room.


Always check the distance from Shower Drain to P-Trap. 
I have found many times the developed length to be +4' with fittings, when they run hot water the gelatinous material coating the inside drain pipe gives off a bad smell.


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