# Silicone anybody?



## WaterBoy (Mar 4, 2010)

By code all drainage and water systems should be watertight. Do any of you use silicone to seal a hose bib on a brick home, silicone a water closet flange to prevent water from leaking under the stool, etc. ?


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## Neplumber (Mar 12, 2010)

WaterBoy said:


> By code all drainage and water systems should be watertight. Do any of you use silicone to seal a hose bib on a brick home, silicone a water closet flange to prevent water from leaking under the stool, etc. ?



I do, for basket strainers, tub/shower drains, seal a silcock, and many other uses, very few around my area us plumbers putty anymore.


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

I still use plumbers putty. How long does silicone have to set up on a 

basket strainer or shower strainer before you can run water?


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## Neplumber (Mar 12, 2010)

KCplumber said:


> I still use plumbers putty. How long does silicone have to set up on a
> 
> basket strainer or shower strainer before you can run water?



usually by the time I finish putting the drain together I run water to test. It takes time to fully cure, but doesn't take long at all to be able to run water. Generally I tell ppl to try and leave it be for a couple hours....never had any problems


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Silicone repels water very well, once it has a good starting seal it should not leak unless under pressure.


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## Plumbworker (Oct 23, 2008)

the only time i use it is sealing the base of fixtures w/c, urinal, lav etc

my strainers get set in putty


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*silicone is good but...*

Silicone can be extra mean to get off ...

I have had to use my turbo torch before just to 
get a basket strainer to come off a stainless steel sink...
becasue of silicone..

have you ever tired to change out a hose bib that the last S.O.B used about a half a tube of silicone to seal up that 
hole through the brick "air tight"??? Thats mean too...

It works good, but I still prefer the putty


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## LEAD INGOT (Jul 15, 2009)

This is what I've been using for about 2 years now.Ive had good luck with it. I used 100% silicone for awhile, but I agree with one of the above posts, they are a nightmare to remove.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Ever try to remove a toilet that has been heavily caulked with silicone?

Takes like 20 minutes with a heat gun and putty knife.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

All fibreglass/acrylic fixtures get silicone for their drains. TOO MANY guys out here still using putty to seal them. Wrecks alot of ceilings.:no:


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

The thing I don't like about silicone is that it can temperarily disguise an improper installation. 

With putty if it ain't right you'll know right away.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> The thing I don't like about silicone is that it can temperarily disguise an improper installation.
> 
> With putty if it ain't right you'll know right away.


 Like I said though, it won't be a temorary F*** up if you use putty on Fibreglass products. It'll be a couple of years down the road after bsmt's have been finished. Putty dries out and leaks. So I guess you have to be carefull where you use any product for sealing. I still use putty for china lavs.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

njoy plumbing said:


> Like I said though, it won't be a temorary F*** up if you use putty on Fibreglass products. It'll be a couple of years down the road after bsmt's have been finished. Putty dries out and leaks. So I guess you have to be carefull where you use any product for sealing. I still use putty for china lavs.


IF installed properly, both silicone and putty will work fine. I see 20-80 year old putty installed tub drains, shower drains, pop-ups still working fine and not leaking on fiber glass, iron, steel and china. Yes the putty will dry, but if installed right to begin with it won't leak. With basket strainers and shower drains you have to be careful not to us too much, you want most of the putty to push out the top, not the bottom where the gasket is.


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## ranman (Jan 24, 2010)

be care full with putty some man made products like marbleite and courian ars silcone only putty will causes them to crack and it sometimes causes rust around the strainers in cast iron sinks.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> IF installed properly, both silicone and putty will work fine. I see 20-80 year old putty installed tub drains, shower drains, pop-ups still working fine and not leaking on fiber glass, iron, steel and china. Yes the putty will dry, but if installed right to begin with it won't leak. With basket strainers and shower drains you have to be careful not to us too much, you want most of the putty to push out the top, not the bottom where the gasket is.


 By Installing putty properly in f.glass tubs and showers, do you mean kneeding it or putting more, what. My experience is that putty cracks over time do to drying out. That has nothing to do with installation. Just saying.


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## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

Silicone feels more realistic than putty.


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## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

But what do I know- I'm drunk, sittin' on the beach.

Back to live action......


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

I use silicone to install self rimming sinks, faucets on corian or granite, and anywhere else putty might stain, I don't use any on ff bibbs, usually the bricker will mortar them in, then I screw them down with tapcons. Never had a problem with putty, just kneed it to soften it and roll it in your hands, always works for me. Silicone, I believe, is not supposed to be submerged in water for long periods of time.


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

aquarium sealant. silicone. breid.............:rockon:


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

I dont think we use putty on anything anymore.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

I use silicone for damn near everything. I have never, nor do I ever, intend to use putty. I am sure it is fine to use, but I prefer silicone.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Indie said:


> I use silicone for damn near everything. I have never, nor do I ever, intend to use putty. I am sure it is fine to use, but I prefer silicone.


I have used it on sink baskets, but it's too messy for me, so I went back to putty


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## Neplumber (Mar 12, 2010)

I used to use putty all the time, never even thought of using silicone besides for caulking tubs/showers. Guy I work for now said don't use putty while you work for me, so, I switched, I've actually found I prefer to putty now


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

I think guys that like and use silicone are scared of the putty, and what it's intended use is for. I've seen guys use too much, and what happens. Only needs a little bit of that chit.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Well use silly cone all you want...
It's the choice of handy hacks and if it will cover their sins then it should be fine when a real plumber uses it...:whistling2:

I use Hercules Sta-Put Ultra Plumbers Putty on everything!
It's non staining so it's good for any material...

I can't remember the last time I had a kitchen sink basket strainer, lav sink drain or, waste and overflow overflow leak...

If any of you need a lesson in how to plumb let me know!

When you glue that stuff in place all you are doing is screwing the customer and the guy that comes along behind you...

So go ahead and do it!
Just don't feel bad when I come along and have to take your hacked up mess apart and I start saying all kinds of crap about your mother, wife, daughter(s), and ancestry...

You deserve every bit of it!:furious:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

I have changed pop ups, sink baskets, hose bibbs, faucets, toilets, etc. that where installed with silicone in some way or another and never had trouble changing them


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> I have changed pop ups, sink baskets, hose bibbs, faucets, toilets, etc. that where installed with silicone in some way or another and never had trouble changing them


Is this what you use then?


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*you will have your turn some day*



plumbpro said:


> I have changed pop ups, sink baskets, hose bibbs, faucets, toilets, etc. that where installed with silicone in some way or another and never had trouble changing them


if someone used silicone on a fibergalss tub drain shoe, and you need to change it some day, you will be in tears before it is over.....

like I already stated, I had to burn off a basket strainer before cause some s.o.b glued it in place...

the putty is really all you need


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> the putty is really all you need


If you know how to plumb that is....:whistling2:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Master Mark said:


> if someone used silicone on a fibergalss tub drain shoe, and you need to change it some day, you will be in tears before it is over.....
> 
> like I already stated, I had to burn off a basket strainer before cause some s.o.b glued it in place...
> 
> the putty is really all you need


Hey i said i really don't use it, I use putty, because silicone is not designed for use under water. The only place I use it is on a self riming sink or when installing on corian or granite. My boss doesn't buy stainless sta put, all we have is regular sta put. I work with what I have


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Redwood said:


> If you know how to plumb that is....:whistling2:


 Obviously no finished basements in your part of the world eh?:blink:


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

99% basements here, most of them are finished, and almost all plumbers here use putty. We also have alot of 2 story homes, and they all have 2nd floor bathrooms. 

Even a 60+ year old tub waste with old dried up putty is not gonna leak if installed right to begin with. I'm not exagerating for the sake of arguement, I honestly see these all the time.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

I run a crew of 4 plumbing service trucks, and including my service truck you won't find a tube of silicone on any of them....Plenty of putty though....:thumbsup:


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## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

I use putty when I can. I don't use it on strainers with a marble or plastic sink. I don't use it on plastic basins. (Cast tops or "real" plastic basins.)

Sure, I've had trouble getting things apart when they're siliconed, but just not that much. It usually involves getting one spot started and the rest will follow.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Airgap said:


> I run a crew of 4 plumbing service trucks, and including my service truck you won't find a tube of silicone on any of them....Plenty of putty though....:thumbsup:


 I guess that settles it. But I wonder why the wholesalers sell it. hmmmmm? I use both because there is place for both.:yes:


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Here's to the J.O. that used Polyseamseal acrylic latex (ADHESIVE) on the basket strainers on the Corian countertop I worked on yesterday.

F YOU, YOU FREAKIN IDIOT!

It took me well over an hour to remove the basket strainer and disposal strainer, thanks to you, and your dumba$$ idea of using glue when you installed them. And yes, I said things about you, your momma, and your whole family that I can't even repeat on this forum, as I cut my hand with the brand new razor blade, as I tried to remove the residue from the sink. :furious::furious:


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

*rlp*

off our meds are we? breid....................:rockon:


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Nah, just a little venting. 

I feel much better now:thumbsup:


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

RealLivePlumber said:


> Here's to the J.O. that used Polyseamseal acrylic latex (ADHESIVE) on the basket strainers on the Corian countertop I worked on yesterday.
> 
> F YOU, YOU FREAKIN IDIOT!
> 
> It took me well over an hour to remove the basket strainer and disposal strainer, thanks to you, and your dumba$$ idea of using glue when you installed them. And yes, I said things about you, your momma, and your whole family that I can't even repeat on this forum, as I cut my hand with the brand new razor blade, as I tried to remove the residue from the sink. :furious::furious:


Look at the bright side, he didn't use liquid nails.


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

Wow, when this post started I thought I was the only dumb-ass using 

putty.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

This is precious. One of my guys just came in to restock and said we were out of putty.:whistling2:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> Obviously no finished basements in your part of the world eh?:blink:


Plenty!

The only thing is my plumbing works and doesn't leak! 

Cover it over and forget about it!:thumbup:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Well use silly cone all you want...
> It's the choice of handy hacks and if it will cover their sins then it should be fine when a real plumber uses it...:whistling2:
> 
> I use Hercules Sta-Put Ultra Plumbers Putty on everything!
> ...


:thumbup: I couldn't agree more. The only places I use caulk is on the base of toilets, self rimming sinks, urinals etc. and when i do its clear siliconized acrylic so it can be removed at a later date if necessary


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Redwood said:


> Plenty!
> 
> The only thing is my plumbing works and doesn't leak!
> 
> Cover it over and forget about it!:thumbup:


You can only put so much putty on the shower/tub drain,so maybe it's the quality of putty they are selling up here. I'm sure your the best plumber around, but my understanding is the messiah has not arrived yet lol


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> You can only put so much putty on the shower/tub drain,so maybe it's the quality of putty they are selling up here. I'm sure your the best plumber around, but my understanding is the messiah has not arrived yet lol


Actually he did come just a little over 2,000 years ago and he said to use plumbers putty!:whistling2:


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Nice one.:no:


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

when i get a service call for a leaky basket strain it was installed with putty, could be a numbers thing....I use silicone and dont have the problem removing it because its never gonna leak


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## robthaplumber (Jan 27, 2010)

In my 17yrs. of plumbing I have never used silicone on drains period. Nor have I had any leaks using putty unless a part was defective. I stand corrected. I have used silicone on floor sinks with gasket/slab drains (3"). I don't silicone commodes to the floor except for commercial with tile or concrete floors. Why don't I do silicone? Cause its too easy and doesn't take the least bit of skill. Mainly, for when the next guy has to service the fixture he will appreciate that I didn't gorilla glue it.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Actually on a waste and overflow the putty does not make the watertight seal that would stop water from leaking through a ceiling below...

That job is relegated to the rubber gasket between the drain shoe and the bottom of the tub.

The putty keeps water from leaking past the flange and the tub then down through the straight threads into the drain...

Too much putty or, silly cone is a bad thing and can cause the rubber gasket to push out of place when tightening casing a leak. The silly cone when wet can act as a lubricant pushing the rubber gasket out very badly.


The situation is very similar on lav sinks the putty only creates a seal that prevents water from going down the drain bypassing the pop up stopper.

The actual watertight seal is the mack washer against the bottom of the sink.

The most common leak here is water leaking down through the threads for the nut to tighten the mack washer. The hard rubber of the mack washer doesn't always push into the threads enough to seal.

If you coat the threads where the mack washer will land with some of* Rock Star Plumbers Rectum Seal T+2 Teflon Paste* then assemble the drain you will not have a leak and years from now when the drain needs replacement nobody will say bad things about your family members or, ancestry...

This concludes Redwood's plumbing lesson for today...:thumbup:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

If you coat the threads where the mack washer will land with some of Rock Star Plumbers Rectum Seal T+2 Teflon


:thumbup: LMAO! :thumbsup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> when i get a service call for a leaky basket strain it was installed with putty, could be a numbers thing....I use silicone and dont have the problem removing it because its never gonna leak


I think I'll give the lesson on these tomorrow morning...:laughing:


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

to you guys stuck in the putty age, do not fear change, embrace it. Just because its "NOT EASY" to remove does not make a bad product, come to think of it I dont want to install stuff thats so easy to remove a homeowner could do it. How is that a plus? easy to remove , what a joke.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

I like to make every1 happy, so next time I install a basket strainer, I'm going to put putty on one half, & sillycone on the other half.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Could it be some you are using chitty basket strainers like these:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

I can use either without a callback. I use putty or silicone depending on the conditions. If I use silicone I let it cure before they use water a couple days.....thats why i dont use silicone much because it takes time to cure per the instructions. I could really careless about the next guy. the end.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

You don't always replace a strainer due to it leaking. I have replaced many just because they were peeling or discolored. Lots of times if I'm putting in a new disposal, they want the strainer on other side of sink replaced too. So it may not be the other guy it may be you, replacing it.
I personally use putty, with no problems.
Alot of the new strainers that are being used, mostly the satin nickel, stainless, white, or biscuit finishes, are all plastic. Most popular around here is Opella brand. I don't like them, but thats all customers buy, or supply houses carry anymore. These would be a PITA to replace, if they were siliconed in.
My personal preference is Jomar,all brass, with deep basket, & 2" tighten down nut. Has nice long threads to connect tail piece, heavy brass jamb nut, with rubber flat tailpiece washer. I carry chrome & satin nickel in the Jomar brand, all other colors I carry are "unfortunately" plastic Opella brand.
I think the main thing with putty, is knowing how much to use.

Mrs HO comes home from work or vacation, and calls you to say you installed the wrong finish sink strainer, or she decided she liked the S.N. instead of chrome. Now which sealer would you be happier you chose, sillycone or putty?:yes: :no: :yes: :no: :yes: :no: Ok I'm ready for the beat down.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> You don't always replace a strainer due to it leaking. I have replaced many just because they were peeling or discolored. Lots of times if I'm putting in a new disposal, they want the strainer on other side of sink replaced too. So it may not be the other guy it may be you, replacing it.
> I personally use putty, with no problems.
> Alot of the new strainers that are being used, mostly the satin nickel, stainless, white, or biscuit finishes, are all plastic. Most popular around here is Opella brand. I don't like them, but thats all customers buy, or supply houses carry anymore. These would be a PITA to replace, if they were siliconed in.
> My personal preference is Jomar, with deep basket, & 2" tighten down nut. Has nice long threads to connect tail piece, heavy brass jamb nut, with rubber flat tailpiece washer. I carry chrome & satin nickel in the Jomar brand, all other colors I carry are "unfortunately" plastic Opella brand.
> ...


 I use putty 99% of the time. You think silicone is hard to get off try removing some 3m marine grade adhesive shiot they sell at the boat store...... It makes it almost permanent. I've used it to install drains in shower bases.....its better than putty but dont expect to remove it. If you let it cure for the full 7 days its not coming out...you hafta tear it out.


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## ranman (Jan 24, 2010)

do you putty guys use putty that is safe for plastics? or do you usa any putty?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Could it be some you are using chitty basket strainers like these:


:laughing: My thoughts exactly RockStarPlumber... :laughing:

The Kohler DuoStrainer is top shelf in my opinion...
If you are kooking for a cheaper alternative the Double cup strainers are a great choice... :thumbup:










IMHO the only thing worse than the one you pictured RockStar would be a plastic version of the same...:laughing:

Yea I guess if you are a handy hack installing junk plumbing you better just keep gluing the crap in...

Pass the flexi trap willya?


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Redwood said:


> :laughing: My thoughts exactly RockStarPlumber... :laughing:
> 
> The Kohler DuoStrainer is top shelf in my opinion...
> If you are kooking for a cheaper alternative the Double cup strainers are a great choice... :thumbup:
> ...


 At least the one you and RSP posted have brass nuts. How about the ones with aluminum nuts. Thats quality:whistling2:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

RealLivePlumber said:


> At least the one you and RSP posted have brass nuts. How about the ones with aluminum nuts. Thats quality:whistling2:


Yea it's junk for sure..

Those large diameter nuts have so much friction they can't be tightened and I sure do make a bunch of money replacing them...:laughing:

That's what it all boils down to...
If you install junk you have to glue it in...:laughing:


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## Song Dog (Jun 12, 2008)

I got reading this thread and I have really enjoyed it, it made me laugh:laughing:

I love the double cup strainers and we use putty 100% of the time.

In Christ,

Song Dog


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## robthaplumber (Jan 27, 2010)

I'm just gonna start heli-arc'n mine in thata way the next man can make em a buck by having to replace the entire sink. job security for all:thumbup:


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

robthaplumber said:


> I'm just gonna start heli-arc'n mine in thata way the next man can make em a buck by having to replace the entire sink. job security for all:thumbup:


 That would be especially nice, on the under counter mount sinks


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

This thread is a classic.
Why do my easily removable puttied in drains and strainers last for decades.
Because I take the time to fully compress the putty out of the gap.

Sure,I seen putty fail.
I just recently gone to the customers house to re-putty the garbage disposal cause ole speedy with the noodle arms hasn't had enough experience to know he has to tighten things down:thumbsup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

If you are going to glue them in why not use...










After all it's...









:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:


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## LEAD INGOT (Jul 15, 2009)

Redwood said:


> If you are going to glue them in why not use...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Hell Red, a few sticks of that and I could shave 20 lbs off of my tool box.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

I choose to use silicone because it will outlast putty, instantly waterproof, cleans up well, wont stain the material, and weakling plumbers have a tuff time removing it :laughing:.

If i was the customer and the Plumber was cryin about how hard it is to remove a basker strain, I would hire someone elso :thumbsup:


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## SummPlumb (Feb 19, 2010)

I am a putty man on strainers. If you install it right, it will last as long as the strainer does. 

Sometimes I feel plumbers in general try to over due things. I am guilty myself. If the customers buys a fifty dollar sink, then I will install 5 dollar basket strainers. If they are buying a 500 dollar sink, I put in the 50 dollar stainers. But I never use silicone. Silicone is not truck friendly. Putty lasts for months during any kind of weather. Putty is also easier to clean up. The excess goes back into the tub. There is zero waste. But that is my opinion. It all depends on what you have always used I guess.

To each its own.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> I choose to use silicone because it will outlast putty, instantly waterproof, cleans up well, wont stain the material, and weakling plumbers have a tuff time removing it :laughing:.
> 
> If i was the customer and the Plumber was cryin about how hard it is to remove a basker strain, I would hire someone elso :thumbsup:


Yea it looks great when the customer wants a new faucet with a smaller base installed too...:laughing:

I tell em just keep picking at eventually you'll get it all off...
Remember that guy that put it on there for you...:laughing:


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Redwood said:


> Yea it looks great when the customer wants a new faucet with a smaller base installed too...:laughing:
> 
> I tell em just keep picking at eventually you'll get it all off...
> Remember that guy that put it on there for you...:laughing:


I dont use anything when setting faucets putty or silicone, so that would not be a problem. And because it lasted im sure they wouldn think bad about the original install, they would prolly be wandering why your takin so long to install a faucet, then if they ask they would hear nothing but excuses about "well the guy b4 me used silicone "


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> I choose to use silicone because it will outlast putty, instantly waterproof, cleans up well, wont stain the material, and weakling plumbers have a tuff time removing it :laughing:.
> 
> If i was the customer and the Plumber was cryin about how hard it is to remove a basker strain, I would hire someone elso :thumbsup:


Do you use it on toilets as well.
How do you clean it off for a reset?
If you have a time saving trick I know I'd appreciate knowing it.

The customer wouldn't hear cryin,Kinda sound like something else.


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> I dont use anything when setting faucets putty or silicone, so that would not be a problem. And because it lasted im sure they wouldn think bad about the original install, they would prolly be wandering why your takin so long to install a faucet, then if they ask they would hear nothing but excuses about "well the guy b4 me used silicone "


 Sometimes I seen damage to a cabinet base from water off the sink deck getting through at the faucet.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

drtyhands said:


> Do you use it on toilets as well.
> How do you clean it off for a reset?
> If you have a time saving trick I know I'd appreciate knowing it.
> 
> The customer wouldn't hear cryin,Kinda sound like something else.


use a razor scraper and a magic eraser


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> use a razor scraper and a magic eraser


 The razor works.
Looks like I'm buyin a magic eraser.


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

drtyhands said:


> Do you use it on toilets as well.
> How do you clean it off for a reset?
> If you have a time saving trick I know I'd appreciate knowing it.
> 
> The customer wouldn't hear cryin,Kinda sound like something else.


 
No i dont use putty/silicone to set toilet, neither are needed. I do use a regular wax ring, 5/16 brass tees, ss flange, with a SS braided supply line.:thumbsup:

Cryin, *****in, its all the same to the customer, nobody cares or wants to hear about it


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

drtyhands said:


> Sometimes I seen damage to a cabinet base from water off the sink deck getting through at the faucet.


cool, ive seen that to, ive also seen a leaky p-trap.....:whistling2:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> cool, ive seen that to, ive also seen a leaky p-trap.....:whistling2:


Do you use silicone on those as well?:laughing:


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Redwood said:


> Do you use silicone on those as well?:laughing:


No, but ive seen a plenty of P-trap with putty smashed into the slip nut, all crusty and molded.

the silicone could fix a leaky p-trap unlike putty :thumbup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> No, but ive seen a plenty of P-trap with putty smashed into the slip nut, all crusty and molded.
> 
> the silicone could fix a leaky p-trap unlike putty :thumbup:


I've never put anything on a p-trap...

You shouldn't have to...

But many handy hacks do...


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

I should buy stock in the company where I get silicone, I buy so much of it. It is a great invention, and I like it.


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## robthaplumber (Jan 27, 2010)

Don The Plumber said:


> That would be especially nice, on the under counter mount sinks


There's a whole countertop job Don. Now you can add a faucet as well.:laughing:


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

I use putty on everything except for porous materials.

Mark


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## drtyhands (Aug 16, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> No i dont use putty/silicone to set toilet, neither are needed. I do use a regular wax ring, 5/16 brass tees, ss flange, with a SS braided supply line.:thumbsup:
> 
> Cryin, *****in, its all the same to the customer, nobody cares or wants to hear about it


You don't think they want to know why they are spending more money?
You think I'm cleaning up the mess for free?
I'm done here


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

drtyhands said:


> You don't think they want to know why they are spending more money?
> You think I'm cleaning up the mess for free?
> I'm done here


The job should have been priced accordingly :thumbsup:, guess its not in the Flat Rate book. 

I hope your not doing Plumbing for free, I dont :thumbsup: 

I would like to know, how much more do you charge a Customer that has a Basket Strain installed with silicone vs putty. I charge the same price. ( id bet the strainer isnt leakin but)

This is what I take from the comments:

 Silicone is hard  I cant do iti gotta charge more


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> The job should have been priced accordingly :thumbsup:, guess its not in the Flat Rate book.
> 
> I hope your not doing Plumbing for free, I dont :thumbsup:
> 
> ...


Found your new logo....


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

drtyhands said:


> Do you use it on toilets as well.
> How do you clean it off for a reset?
> If you have a time saving trick I know I'd appreciate knowing it.
> 
> The customer wouldn't hear cryin,Kinda sound like something else.


 Try razor blade wth a holder, takes a couple of seconds.:whistling2:


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

I imagine there is a significant difference between guys like drtyhands who are comfortable on multi-million dollar projects and those who are not. In 35-years I have never had a problem with an installation I did using putty. I have seen some limited failures where a hack who called himself a plumber used old dried out putty because his stock was not rotated fast enough. Silicone is fine if you are not comfortable with putty but it is messier in your truck, in yout finish box, during the installation and during a repair or a replacement. When I have to use silicone because of the materials the owner picked I feel like a bit of a hack but understand it is needed.

Mark


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Scenario:
HO: can you please come and see what is leaking from my ceiling. I think the shower is right above it.
Me: We'll be there promptly
After arrival and inspection.
Me: whomever installed this shower drain used putty to seal it. For some reason, even though there seems to be enough of it, it did not hold. How old is your house?
HO: 2 years.
me: well I can either replace it with new putty or I can use shower grade silicone and have you let it sit for 24hrs and I will gaurantee no more leaks at his unit.
HO: SILICONE of course why would I would I want that s**t in there again. Oh and by the way can you replace the other drains putty with that same wonderful silicone.

Just sayin it happens guys. I'll bet we have all left jobs and never gone back and the sameconversation has happened with another plumber.
I'm out:thumbup:


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> Scenario:
> HO: can you please come and see what is leaking from my ceiling. I think the shower is right above it.
> Me: We'll be there promptly
> After arrival and inspection.
> ...


Fixed it....


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Airgap said:


> Fixed it....


Sorry, I would give her my brother-inlaws card, he's the window guy. He has the super sized caulking gun.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

"whomever installed this shower drain used putty to seal it. For some reason, even though there seems to be enough of it, it did not hold. How old is your house?"

This is where your 100% wrong.

What you should have said:

"Whoever installed your shower drain, either used too much putty, or didn't properly tighten it. In any event, I'll do it right, and you won't have any more problems."

"Or, for about 1/4 the price, you can call a handyman and he can silicone it in for you." Sorry, I had to throw that in there:laughing:.

I have no problem with silicone, but putty works just as well, so why glue it together if it's unecessary.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I use putty most of the time and silicone when needed. Putty is fine for most things. Silicone has a short shelf life and is more expensive. Silicone is also allot messier. I carry both on my truck at all times and use the right one for the circumstance.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> "whomever installed this shower drain used putty to seal it. For some reason, even though there seems to be enough of it, it did not hold. How old is your house?"
> 
> This is where your 100% wrong.
> 
> ...


 Read further...... you think that perhaps it wasn't some plumber like you who thought it was good enough when you left ...but wasn't. I make sure it won't. QUE THE SILICONE FOR THIS JOB.:thumbup: Hey keep on puttying it up. I'll keep on fixin' em because thats what it amounts to as I SEE IT.:yes:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> Read further...... you think that perhaps it wasn't some plumber like you who thought it was good enough when you left ...but wasn't. I make sure it won't. QUE THE SILICONE FOR THIS JOB.:thumbup: Hey keep on puttying it up. I'll keep on fixin' em because thats what it amounts to as I SEE IT.:yes:



Seems you have some prematures, Yes, i said prematures, not even worthy of amature, setting things in putty. No wonder your so busy. Only takes a lil bit of that chit.


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

Silicone gives me a severe headache if I inhale the fumes so I shy away from it. Besides it being messy


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

GREENPLUM said:


> No, but ive seen a plenty of P-trap with putty smashed into the slip nut, all crusty and molded.
> 
> the silicone could fix a leaky p-trap unlike putty :thumbup:


So could a new washer or maybe even a new $1.29 P-Trap :thumbup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> Scenario:
> HO: can you please come and see what is leaking from my ceiling. I think the shower is right above it.
> Me: We'll be there promptly
> After arrival and inspection.
> ...


Actually I have fixed some leaking showers installed with putty...
None of my own of course...

The #1 problem that I found contributed to leaks was usually a very well secured drain and trap that would not move and a shower pan that was not properly bedded that flexed with every step...

Seems to be a very common contributor to shower drains leaking...

Good plumbing seldom fails and doesn't require glue...:thumbup:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

I stopped using putty altogether, especially after I saw the condition of 10 month old putty on a disposal. 


#1 service call for leaking drains is usually putty related.


I've seen putty break down numerous times once it comes in contact with water. 


The sink faucet I replaced today...someone didn't know that you can not putty a faucet and sink drain in on a synthetic marble top.


Urine yellow around the new faucet, same as around the ring for the pop-up assembly. Silicone stops that consideration completely.


I use the 3.79 squeeze tubes of 100% silicone, no worries.


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## Everflow (Feb 1, 2010)

I've used silicone on upstairs tubs and shower drains. After reading all of this thread I'm now rethinking this and just might go to all silicone.

What makes this dissention hard is I've never had a problem with putty.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Everflow said:


> I've used silicone on upstairs tubs and shower drains. After reading all of this thread I'm now rethinking this and just might go to all silicone.
> 
> What makes this dissection hard is I've never had a problem with putty.


Yea might as well fix things that aren't broke...:laughing:


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> I stopped using putty altogether, especially after I saw the condition of 10 month old putty on a disposal.
> 
> 
> #1 service call for leaking drains is usually putty related.
> ...


 
I have never had a leak on an ISE type disposal clamp. Come to think of it, it's rare to ever have to repair one. 

The #1 reason for leaking drains is installer related.

Putty breaks down when it comes in contact with water? Say What:blink:?

I think some of you are using silly putty, buy the stuff at the plumbing supply.:1eye:


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## Everflow (Feb 1, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Yea might as well fix things that aren't broke...:laughing:


 
It's all about call backs Woody if it saves 1 call back a year it is worth it.

I still have not made up my mind....... still have plenty of putty on hand atleast a years worth.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Hell just use play-doh, comes in different colors.


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

it, I'm convinced I'm getting rid of all my glues, dopes, solder, etc. and going stirictly silicone. Think about a tube of silicone in one hand and a pair of 440's in the other and I can finally compete with that handy hack. :thumbup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Everflow said:


> It's all about call backs Woody if it saves 1 call back a year it is worth it.
> 
> I still have not made up my mind....... still have plenty of putty on hand atleast a years worth.


Let me break it to ya...

You've never had a problem...

I'm telling you I haven't had a problem in fact I've maintained a callback rate of less than 1% for years...

What we've go here is a bunch of track hacks installing crap..
Crap that you and I would look at and say your kidding me that you use this stuff...:laughing:

Like one of these beauties...




























Geeze I wonders why I gots to glue dis chyt in...:laughing:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

plumbrob said:


> it, I'm convinced I'm getting rid of all my glues, dopes, solder, etc. and going stirictly silicone. Think about a tube of silicone in one hand and a pair of 440's in the other and I can finally compete with that handy hack. :thumbup:


I'm going to completely strip my truck down, just silicone, sharkbites, and fernco's. Of course some duck tape and baling wire too:laughing:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

pauliplumber said:


> I have never had a leak on an ISE type disposal clamp. Come to think of it, it's rare to ever have to repair one.
> 
> The #1 reason for leaking drains is installer related.
> 
> ...


 
I guess this is where the new construction plumber makes themselves as useless as tits on a fish, because I have seen countless times *I'll start taking pictures to prove it* where the putty is destroyed, dried, flaking, leaking through the sink down the disposal and down off the edges, sometimes even trailing the romex wire leading from the unit.

I understand putty being oil based.....but how do you explain that brown gravy when I pop those strainers off, and dry like a brown paste on everything including my gloves? 

I'm installing a lot of disposals lately so it's not random on my end. 

If putty stayed pliable and didn't have a petroleum base (I know they make putty free of petroleum) i'd use it. But the f-ing idiots installing don't know that there's that type of putty, otherwise I wouldn't see so many god damn yellowing sinks on synthetic marbles or leaking strainers.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> *I guess this is where the new construction plumber makes themselves as useless as tits on a fish*, because I have seen countless times *I'll start taking pictures to prove it* where the putty is destroyed, dried, flaking, leaking through the sink down the disposal and down off the edges, sometimes even trailing the romex wire leading from the unit.
> 
> I understand putty being oil based.....but how do you explain that brown gravy when I pop those strainers off, and dry like a brown paste on everything including my gloves?
> 
> ...


umm. :furious:


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

Now I'm really confused, I think I'll just use silicone, no wait, putty....

naw silicone, ahh **** I'll just stick with what worked for the last 35 years

Putty ! :laughing:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

plumbpro said:


> I'm going to completely strip my truck down, just silicone, sharkbites, and fernco's. Of course some duck tape and baling wire too:laughing:


Yea and I'm thinking just a couple of 4" ferncos - that way we can just trim to fit :laughing:. Hell I'm getting rid of my truck, maybe a nice KIA or perhaps a TOYOTA :laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Lets just mix putty with silicone, guaranteed to seal one way or the other.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Wow Dunbar...

A leaking disposer...
Thats about as bad as it can get...

Gawd help us all we have a severe last of talent arriving in the trade then...:blink:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

house plumber said:


> umm. :furious:


 

Not you, everyone else. 

I'm nice like that. :thumbup:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

Sometimes i put just a dab of silicone on the pipe before I slip on the sharkbite:whistling2: . Can't be too careful ya know :laughing:


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

Ron said:


> Lets just mix putty with silicone, guaranteed to seal one way or the other.





plumbrob said:


> Sometimes i put just a dab of silicone on the pipe before I slip on the sharkbite:whistling2: . Can't be too careful ya know :laughing:


Dah, doesn't everybody


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Ron said:


> Lets just mix putty with silicone, guaranteed to seal one way or the other.


Yeah, and we could mix glue and purple primer together in the same can, like the goober pb&j


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## Everflow (Feb 1, 2010)

I'm one of them new construction guys you call hacks.

I guarantee my plumbing for 2 years after that I tell the customer that were a pain to call a service plumber, and give them the name of a guy that used to work for me. Now the customers that I liked over them 2 years I will go back on for years, last year i changed out a angle stop on the first home I did 10 years ago for free. Liked the guy and he paid on time.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> Yeah, and we could mix glue and purple primer together in the same can, like the goober pb&j


 

Don't be f'n with pb&j....that s*** rocks! 


Time for show and tell: 


I've been using silicone for a couple/few years...makes the product I use universal to all applications and I don't have to worry about putty oozing out hours/days later even though I put it on super thin.





 

Turn the volume down, you all know who I am. :whistling2:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

We must be a couple of hacks here too, even though we still get referral business from customers that my boss did their houses 15 yrs ago. Talk about hacks, I've seen some service hacks around here, licensed even.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

If you are really worried about it leaking, just TIG it:laughing:


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

plumbrob said:


> Yea and I'm thinking just a couple of 4" ferncos - that way we can just trim to fit :laughing:. Hell I'm getting rid of my truck, maybe a nice KIA or perhaps a TOYOTA :laughing::laughing::laughing:


Hey, easy on the Toyota's, just don't drive in front of me and every thing will be fine......:whistling2:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Bill said:


> If you are really worried about it leaking, just TIG it:laughing:


 
:thumbsup:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

What does a cracked disposer grind chamber have to do with putty?

The logic eludes me Dunbar...:blink:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

pauliplumber said:


> Hey, easy on the Toyota's, just don't drive in front of me and every thing will be fine......:whistling2:


 lol :thumbsup:


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## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

Master Mark said:


> if someone used silicone on a fibergalss tub drain shoe, and you need to change it some day, you will be in tears before it is over.....
> 
> like I already stated, I had to burn off a basket strainer before cause some s.o.b glued it in place...
> 
> the putty is really all you need


I don't understand why you would have so much trouble with that. Tub drains done with silicone come off super easy, no matter how old they are. Simply use your Smart Dumbell (scroll down) and crank it out. Easy.

I've had a few siliconed in kitchen sink strainers that were a little tough. But you just have to put strong upward pressure from below on one side (with your hand) to start the silicone tearing and they come right out.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Redwood said:


> What does a cracked disposer grind chamber have to do with putty?
> 
> The logic eludes me Dunbar...:blink:


 


First frame on the video shows silicone on the new strainer, relative to this topic completely.

And I just bought siliconevsputty.com :laughing: 

Or was it, puttyvssilicone.com ??? 


Damn that go daddy express checkout! :furious:


:laughing:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> First frame on the video shows silicone on the new strainer, relative to this topic completely.
> 
> And I just bought siliconevsputty.com :laughing:
> 
> ...


Exactly but you implied that putty cause a leak and you had a smoking gun...

Clearly any leak there was a cracked grind chamber and nothing to do with putty...

So you brought egg drop soup to the table...:laughing:


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Redwood said:


> Actually I have fixed some leaking showers installed with putty...
> None of my own of course...
> 
> The #1 problem that I found contributed to leaks was usually a very well secured drain and trap that would not move and a shower pan that was not properly bedded that flexed with every step...
> ...


Finnaly, constructive critisism


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Redwood said:


> Exactly but you implied that putty cause a leak and you had a smoking gun...
> 
> Clearly any leak there was a cracked grind chamber and nothing to do with putty...
> 
> So you brought egg drop soup to the table...:laughing:


 

It's okay. That video has created 3 other disposal installs because apparently my competition talks and writes about what they do, never shows...


I've bought a lot of egg drop soup and rice with that method. 


How bout you post some pictures of your work, any work and I'll hold my breath. Are you working now?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

No of course not it's 11:30 at night...:laughing:

During the daylight hours I do keep things going pretty good...:thumbup:


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## Leviathan (Mar 14, 2010)

Silacone most of the time: makes a more professinal looking install: cleans up nicely if you're willing to take an EXTRA TWO MINUTES.

Putty when putting a strainer on an old crappy sink that you may not be able to get COMPLETELY DRY.

Silacone on any drain connection that might flex, like a shower pan made of fiberglass. You'd be a goddamn fool to use putty on that. You haven't seen your call backs, because they were dusgusted with you to begin with. It's not 1%, it's more like, 50% of any flexible shower pans that aren't supported by mortar, and are installed with putty. They leak. I fix them. If I don't install a new shower pan with mortar, I get the connection bone dry, and use silacone because it is a flexible sealant. Not because it is a glue.


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Leviathan said:


> Silacone most of the time: makes a more professinal looking install: cleans up nicely if you're willing to take an EXTRA TWO MINUTES.
> 
> Putty when putting a strainer on an old crappy sink that you may not be able to get COMPLETELY DRY.
> 
> Silacone on any drain connection that might flex, like a shower pan made of fiberglass. You'd be a goddamn fool to use putty on that. You haven't seen your call backs, because they were dusgusted with you to begin with. It's not 1%, it's more like, 50% of any flexible shower pans that aren't supported by mortar, and are installed with putty. They leak. I fix them. If I don't install a new shower pan with mortar, I get the connection bone dry, and use silacone because it is a flexible sealant. Not because it is a glue.


Where were you 130 posts ago.


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

We support all fiberglass pans and tubs with mortar (you should too) and putty the drains -never a problem. I have two in my house-seven years no problems :thumbsup:


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## plumbrob (Mar 21, 2010)

Im sure the customer appreciates the fact that his five year old unsupported pan doesn't leak as well as the fact the pan is riddled with spider cracks :laughing:. I'm sure he'll call you back :thumbsup:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Leviathan said:


> Silacone most of the time: makes a more professinal looking install: cleans up nicely if you're willing to take an EXTRA TWO MINUTES.
> 
> Putty when putting a strainer on an old crappy sink that you may not be able to get COMPLETELY DRY.
> 
> Silacone on any drain connection that might flex, like a shower pan made of fiberglass. You'd be a goddamn fool to use putty on that. You haven't seen your call backs, because they were dusgusted with you to begin with. It's not 1%, it's more like, 50% of any flexible shower pans that aren't supported by mortar, and are installed with putty. They leak. I fix them. If I don't install a new shower pan with mortar, I get the connection bone dry, and use silacone because it is a flexible sealant. Not because it is a glue.



you sir, have somewhat of an ANTI- christian name, but took the lords name in vein. That is just religulous.:no:


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> you sir, have somewhat of a christian name, but took the lords name in vein. That is just religulous.:no:


RSP, where do you get that Leviathan is a Christian name? :laughing:

I suppose you think Lucifer and Baal are Christian names too.:whistling2::no:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

ChrisConnor said:


> RSP, where do you get that Leviathan is a Christian name? :laughing:
> 
> I suppose you think Lucifer and Baal are Christian names too.:whistling2::no:



you sir, are correct, and excuse me for leaving out the ANTI-christian name. CC-1 RSP-0:laughing:


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> you sir, are correct, and excuse me for leaving out the ANTI-christian name. CC-1 RSP-0:laughing:


Don't mention it. :laughing:


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

So what I gather from all the silicone guys out there, is that if you have a shower base, that was installed by a hack, with no support, & it flexes with every move a person makes, while standing inside, the possibility of whether it will leak, or not leak, is totally dependant on whether silicone, or putty was used to seal the flange on strainer?

I think it would also have alot to do with plumbing underneath, & whether it could flex too. Like if the trap was drilled through a floor joist, & had very little or no movement. I mean if the guy didn't think about supporting the fiberglass base, nothing else was thought about either.

I have only repaired about a dozen or so of these, as there thankfully is not many of these fiberglass pans around here, mostly 1pc shower units from the 80's is what I come across. But what I see leaking is the rubber gasket,around 2" pipe, inside the strainer, that eventually loosens up around the pipe, or cuz it was cut crooked or both. But still lasted more than 20 yrs. JMO.


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

In thinking about this discussion, I have come to the conclusion that people are under the impression that they have to resort to using silicone to overcome potential problems, that was thought that putty would not be adequate to properly seal. 

For example, all of the cheap @$$ plastic, fiberglass, pot metal, and so on. 

Way back when, when plumbing materials and workmanship were of top quality, you could putty a faucet, or whatever, and not to touch it for 60 years. Lead shower pans last 60 years. WC's were set for 60 years. The plumber set the closet flange after the wet bed tile floor was laid. 17 ga. traps last for 20 or more. 17 ga. pop ups, 50+. This is a fact. I see it every day. 

Now, fast forward to present time. All cheap. Plastic p traps. Plastic pop ups, plastic closet flanges are screwed to the floor, then nacho tiles it, and the new construction plumber just puts 2 or 3 bowl waxes to compensate. Cheapo flexible plastic shower bases that wiggle all over, and even cheaper strainers. Now the plumber has to purchase and use mortar or Structolite to avoid a leak. Most do not. Some will shoot spray foam window insulation under it. So, people turned to silicone to try to overcome leaks that are inevitable. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. 

I repair so much of this in houses that are a year or 2 old, and have been for a long time. It is disguisting.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Now, fast forward to present time. All cheap. Plastic p traps. Plastic pop ups, plastic closet flanges are screwed to the floor, then nacho tiles it, and the new construction plumber just puts 2 or 3 bowl waxes to compensate. Cheapo flexible plastic shower bases that wiggle all over, and even cheaper strainers. Now the plumber has to purchase and use mortar or Structolite to avoid a leak. Most do not. Some will shoot spray foam window insulation under it. So, people turned to silicone to try to overcome leaks that are inevitable. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. 

I repair so much of this in houses that are a year or 2 old, and have been for a long time. It is disguisting.[/quote]

_I get alot of work in new houses too, that wanna finish off basements, & plumbers put stacks out in the middle, or 4ft away from wall. Also reroute alot of drains that are piped in 2ft below joists, in basements._

_Your right on about quality of materials today. Alot of those strainers were probobly plastic. I carry nothing but the full brass shower strainers, for fiberglass units anyway.Now if anything lasts 10yrs, it's good._


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Don The Plumber said:


> Now, fast forward to present time. All cheap. Plastic p traps. Plastic pop ups, plastic closet flanges are screwed to the floor, then nacho tiles it, and the new construction plumber just puts 2 or 3 bowl waxes to compensate. Cheapo flexible plastic shower bases that wiggle all over, and even cheaper strainers. Now the plumber has to purchase and use mortar or Structolite to avoid a leak. Most do not. Some will shoot spray foam window insulation under it. So, people turned to silicone to try to overcome leaks that are inevitable. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
> 
> I repair so much of this in houses that are a year or 2 old, and have been for a long time. It is disguisting.


_I get alot of work in new houses too, that wanna finish off basements, & plumbers put stacks out in the middle, or 4ft away from wall. Also reroute alot of drains that are piped in 2ft below joists, in basements._

_Your right on about quality of materials today. Alot of those strainers were probobly plastic. I carry nothing but the full brass shower strainers, for fiberglass units anyway.Now if anything lasts 10yrs, it's good._[/quote]
Yep, but htey were the cheapsdt bidders for the project. No karma for them because they only have to give a year warranty if at all. And the GC is only worried about the low ball price. In most cases.:no:


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

plumbrob said:


> Im sure the customer appreciates the fact that his five year old unsupported pan doesn't leak as well as the fact the pan is riddled with spider cracks :laughing:. I'm sure he'll call you back :thumbsup:


 Not once did we say we did the original job. Read all the posts.:whistling2:


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

njoy plumbing said:


> Not once did we say we did the original job. Read all the posts.:whistling2:


I believe he was referring to the fact you addressed the leaking drain and not the unsupported pan. I'm actually wondering where you guys work that have had so many problems with putty? Is it possible there are just a lot of hacks or crummy plumbers there? Amongst all of our other work we had 8,000 rental units we use to do all of the service. Every fixture meant to be set with putty was set with putty. I can only remember a handful of times there was a leak related to putty.

Mark


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

We had a huge boom here the last 6 yrs or so, and that is probably the problem. Too much work, and the push was always on. We use slow expanding foam under our pans nad don't have problems when we have used putty. But our GC'S are freaked and demand silicone. We are inundated with calls to reseal showers and tubs and no way to get foam under them once cieling below is finished. Que the SILICONE:whistling2:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Don The Plumber said:


> So what I gather from all the silicone guys out there, is that if you have a shower base, that was installed by a hack, with no support, & it flexes with every move a person makes, while standing inside, the possibility of whether it will leak, or not leak, is totally dependant on whether silicone, or putty was used to seal the flange on strainer?
> 
> I think it would also have alot to do with plumbing underneath, & whether it could flex too. Like if the trap was drilled through a floor joist, & had very little or no movement. I mean if the guy didn't think about supporting the fiberglass base, nothing else was thought about either.
> 
> I have only repaired about a dozen or so of these, as there thankfully is not many of these fiberglass pans around here, mostly 1pc shower units from the 80's is what I come across. But what I see leaking is the rubber gasket,around 2" pipe, inside the strainer, that eventually loosens up around the pipe, or cuz it was cut crooked or both. But still lasted more than 20 yrs. JMO.


Bottom Line Don if it's moving, eventually it will leak somewhere in most cases...

I've seen plenty with pipes falling out of the rubber gasket too...

It's sad that the quality of work has sunken to what we expect from Nacho...:whistling2:


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## Leviathan (Mar 14, 2010)

One of the most demanding shops I worked at in my apprenticeship said we were to strive for a minimum of 25 yr life span of our installations.

I took that with me. It is true about the cheap plastic quality of many of the new fixtures. If silacone gives them a few more years of life, so be it.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Leviathan said:


> One of the most demanding shops I worked at in my apprenticeship said we were to strive for a minimum of 25 yr life span of our installations.
> 
> I took that with me. It is true about the cheap plastic quality of many of the new fixtures. If silacone gives them a few more years of life, so be it.


Yea the dead men would be proud of that caliber of workmanship fo sho


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## PlumbingTheCape (Mar 1, 2010)

we only use silicone for traps, gratings and toilet flappers


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

Redwood said:


> Yea the dead men would be proud of that caliber of workmanship fo sho


 I hear you. But it is what it is, unfortunatly.:no:


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