# Shark Bite



## ShaneP

I saw this in a local restaurant today. I guess some plumbers have no pride in their work at all.


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## Dpeckplb

It's such a shame, around here it's usually people that say they can do it if they get free food until its paid off. Which brings out the shoddy work, which leads to more money for me.


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## Master Mark

there had to be a reason to do that.....

perhaps the water would not shut off all the way
when they made this repair ...


I wonder if the constant thump from that sloan valve
will eventually pull that thing loose??
..

he should have at least covered his shame with 
some sort of chrome or white pvc pipe...

why not throw a peice of 1 1/2 white pvc over it 
cause that brass shark bite will turn green over time
from people pissing on it......


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## Shoot'N'Plumber

Hey, I didn't know my last company opened up a shop in Arkansas:laughing:
I'm with mark, I can't see that think holding up to constant thumping and water hammer. When that thing goes....Holy S.H.I.T


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## vinpadalino

It's sad, soldering is a dying trade. Those things killed the plumbing industry.


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## Flyout95

I can see a use for Sharkbites in a limited capacity. I use them on my test gauge, and I have a few caps with me just in case of a bad valve and i need to hold water while I get a water catch set up. But in terms of using for every fitting... blah.


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## SSP

Who says it was a plumber?? It could have been just as easily Owner or Hack handyman.. No?

Regardless SB are great IMO for certain applications, but NEVER permanent... I use SB caps on my wirsbo and copper waterlines during rough-in and for temp water meter spacers i use the SB x MIP ..

They are Much faster for caps and pay themselves off if you re-use them politely and store them properly. They have by no way shape or form hurt or "destroy" what i perceive to be my industry... Sure HO's can spend $50 in a handful of parts and fix some leak they couldn't afford done right and because they ARE unqualified it will fail in time or need to be replaced eventually... Properly by qualified people.

I don't see any new construction being done in SB.... They are really only applicable to service and reno work... So big deal HO springs leak on a cracked pipe so they go to box store and spend $50 to put a couple couplings in and new pipe ... Is that $250 service call really hurting anybodies bottom line? NO because HO doesn't understand WHY it cracked or HOW... They put a band-aid on a fractured bone... The system is still flawed by original design.... Thus it will fail until completely corrected in its entirety.. 

Let them spend and waste their time all day, maybe after a flood or two they realize the money they didn't save and the cost of a professional will become justified.


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## vinpadalino

It sucks because 10 years ago if you couldn't solder you had to call a plumber. Those service calls add up quick take 4 a day that's over a G note a day multiply by 5 days a week that's good money for plumbers.


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## CTs2p2

I'll bet it was the guy who got paid to install the plastic on the wall that said easy "I'll cut the copper and just shark bite her back on"


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## saskplumber

I see sharkbites used on W/H's around here they use them on the hot/cold lines,asked about using them and they said it was quick.......calling BS on that one!Really how long does it take to clean some fittings and use them......:furious:


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## PlumberDave

Freakin Shark bites are awesome they will pay for my new Truck.


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## love2surf927

PlumberDave said:


> Freakin Shark bites are awesome they will pay for my new Truck.


Just did a repair on a failed SB the other day myself.


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## ShaneP

I guess it might not of been a plumber, but regardless who did it I believe it is poor workmanship. Maybe I am to critical.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber

PlumberDave said:


> Freakin Shark bites are awesome they will pay for my new Truck.
> View attachment 30479


Truly amazing, the laziness of people to not only use the sharkbite, but not even pay A-Dam-Tention to instructions and kept the insert on with copper :thumbsup: I mentioned to a guy at home cheapo the other day on the disadvantages of those things only to be interrupted and scolded by a douche bag that I dunno what I'm talking about. I then pissed him off when I told him the reason you love em so much is cuz your fat azz is too lazy to take care of yourself let alone solder. Fortunately it was a home cheapo out of my service area and I didn't have any company markings so I laid into him good.


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## titaniumplumbr

Just to chime in shark bites are a valuable part of the plumbing industry they are a perfectly legal transitional fitting. If they are installed correctly meaning cleans deburr the pipe and measure the pipe to where the two ends have just a small gap between and I don't know maybe strap the thing too , one should not have a problem and FYI those inserts are meant for pex because it doesn't have the integral strength the other pipes have. I can solder with the best of you but after we line a water pipe we use these to make any transitions needed thank you


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## SSP

titaniumplumbr said:


> Just to chime in shark bites are a valuable part of the plumbing industry they are a perfectly legal transitional fitting. If they are installed correctly meaning cleans deburr the pipe and measure the pipe to where the two ends have just a small gap between and I don't know maybe strap the thing too , one should not have a problem and FYI those inserts are meant for pex because it doesn't have the integral strength the other pipes have. I can solder with the best of you but after we line a water pipe we use these to make any transitions needed thank you



Legally you stand correct. But as professionals we retain the right to criticize every aspect of our industry as it affects us. Whether good or bad, everybody has an opinion for a reason and sharing those reasons/opinions gives us the power to utilize such resourceful information to scrutinize manufacturers and deliver feedback from an educated POV on whether or not an item is functional, sound and void of deficiencies. 

I'm a shark bite user, but they have their place on my van. Nothing is faster than shark-bites, but the question is whether or not they can effectively withstand the sands of time. The fact that they cannot be used in concealed locations further indicates a lack of endurance...


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## dclarke

SSP said:


> The fact that they cannot be used in concealed locations further indicates a lack of endurance...


Last I checked they are legal to be concealed, buried, and even used on hydronic heating. I use them but its not my go to fitting like some people out there.


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## titaniumplumbr

I agree with your statement while we are on the subject I believe pex shark bites and even pro press will begin to fail because of what the water does to rubber


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## wyrickmech

titaniumplumbr said:


> I agree with your statement while we are on the subject I believe pex shark bites and even pro press will begin to fail because of what the water does to rubber


 it's the treatment chems that do the damage not the water. We will see but I think pro press has a 50 year warranty,you can't get any better than that.


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## Tommy plumber

Nobody is trying to re-invent the wheel with air conditioning piping. The A/C trade has used copper for years and it's still copper. And they braze every connection as well. Nobody is using PEX, CPVC, sharkbites, etc in the A/C trade. Around here {FL}, only licensed A/C companies can get the refrigerant and equipment needed to repair and perform installs. No home-owners can purchase the items needed. But my trade is up for grabs.....:furious:

Some days I wish I had my mechanical contractors license.


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## titaniumplumbr

Actually you just take a short course and you can buy the stuff at a supply house


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## titaniumplumbr

And water is 100% substance anytime you take minerals and other teals out by way of softening or treating it water will then leach out of the pipe whatever it needs this and electrolysis are two main causes for leaks. here in Florida our water is terrible so a lot of times conditioning and softening is a must


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## sparky

titaniumplumbr said:


> Actually you just take a short course and you can buy the stuff at a supply house


correct,i could have grandfathered in back yrs ago when they first started licenses for ac,but i figured just another payment for a license,now i wish i had it,if you have rental property you cant go buy a furnace or ac without the license.


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## wyrickmech

sparky said:


> correct,i could have grandfathered in back yrs ago when they first started licenses for ac,but i figured just another payment for a license,now i wish i had it,if you have rental property you cant go buy a furnace or ac without the license.


 yes it was sad that it came to a point every body had to take a class but four six hour classes with one three hour test isn't that big of an investment for a permanent license.


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## dclarke

I must confess.....I used a shark bite today. I use them as a union transition for an outside faucet.


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## Plumberman

The insert is garbage when using it on copper.

It's a pex stiffener.

I take them out when I use them on copper, offshore I run crimp ring pex. Heck of a lot better than these tards running schedule 40 PVC over head for water distribution.


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## Keefer w

Plumberman said:


> The insert is garbage when using it on copper.
> 
> It's a pex stiffener.
> 
> I take them out when I use them on copper, offshore I run crimp ring pex. Heck of a lot better than these tards running schedule 40 PVC over head for water distribution.


You are supposed to remove and not use the inserts on cu and cpvc. There is the risk of it breaking off and lodging in the water system.


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## SSP

dclarke said:


> Last I checked they are legal to be concealed, buried, and even used on hydronic heating. I use them but its not my go to fitting like some people out there.


Oh, have they always been approved for concealed? Thats new to me , maybe i just assumed because of the way they turn and rotate so freely that they shouldn't be inaccessible. You would think water hammer and water chemicals etc would hit them harder than any other fittings since they are so loose fitting. 

I am a bigger fan of shark-bites When used in temporary applications. I have a test gauge assembly with a SB connector and its so fast to snap on and pressure up water-lines , only downside is your gauge flops around like a limp one. Capping any line with water passing is a breeze , and i even use SB adaptors to make up temporary garden hoses too with pex if needed. 

If i hadn't experienced them failing first hand when we first tried them, maybe I'd have more faith, but then again it may not have been de-blurred enough, ovalish pipe maybe, etc etc. they help in a jam but require near perfect conditions to last. 

I think i would like them a whole lot more, if they were sold exclusively to pros , the main peeve on these suckers is that any joe blow can out-perform seasoned vets with zero experience in plumbing. 

And lets face it a whole job done in SB would look pretty gross.. And if the holes or grommets for copper are tight to pipe size, pulling a fitting against it will disconnect it... Just feels like theres a lot of room for error


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## Plumberman

Keefer w said:


> You are supposed to remove and not use the inserts on cu and cpvc. There is the risk of it breaking off and lodging in the water system.


Yeah, that's what I said


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## SSP

A random benefit to SB is they also always act as unions, on any single fitting.


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## plbgbiz

I am a huge fan of shark bites and foamcore. Both work hard to guarantee me employment for years to come.


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## dclarke

I'd love for you to come to Delaware and see our supply houses. The pipe is mostly foam core and cpvc and they have a large supply of shark bites. They are even stocking 1 1/4 which is larger than any homeowner should ever need.


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## Ptturner91

I stock 1 size of each shark bite valve 
Never know when you get that call at 2 am on a Saturday night

In fact once I went to a job site and the copper was in rough shape, so rough I put rubber on it and a gear clamp as soon as I tightened the gear clamp the pipe just crumbled, moved my arm 2 feet, put on the 3/4" shark bite valve, closed it and said I'll go get material


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## Coolcanuck

Ptturner91 said:


> I stock 1 size of each shark bite valve
> Never know when you get that call at 2 am on a Saturday night
> 
> In fact once I went to a job site and the copper was in rough shape, so rough I put rubber on it and a gear clamp as soon as I tightened the gear clamp the pipe just crumbled, moved my arm 2 feet, put on the 3/4" shark bite valve, closed it and said I'll go get material


Same here, carry only valves in SB.


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## Tommy plumber

Coolcanuck said:


> Same here, carry only valves in SB.












You guys are joking I hope?


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## Leach713

I use bread help soak water so then I can solder a valve


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## Bayside500

Leach713 said:


> I use bread help soak water so then I can solder a valve


a jetsweat is what i use


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## titaniumplumbr

Jet sweats are the best although I have used a line freezer very cool crests a block of ice in the line but you have to work quickly. Sometimes if I'm alone on a house and the water just keeps screwing up my solder joint I take a supply off of a lav or WC and blow into it this usually works nicely


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## Ptturner91

I was saying I carry them for a quick fix so I can get the proper material and come back and fix it properly
At 2 am on a Saturday I'm not going to be bringing my plumbers bread and torch, I'll put the valve on and come back at a better time 

The customers really appreciate it as well


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## Leach713

Bayside500 said:


> a jetsweat is what i use



Jetsweat?


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## Ptturner91

Leach713 said:


> Jetsweat?



It's just a rubber compression that goes inside the pipe stopping water and you can solder on a ball valve pull it out and then close the valve


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## Coolcanuck

Tommy plumber said:


> You guys are joking I hope?


Ya, doing service where I live, -40 weather, poly b lines trailers. Sometimes you just have to cut a line and let water flow through while setting a valve and then close it. Deal with finding/getting to a shutoff afterwards. Some of the crap I've been to, and all hours of the day/night. I don't use the valves often and don't leave them installed. Just another tool


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## Coolcanuck

Ptturner91 said:


> It's just a rubber compression that goes inside the pipe stopping water and you can solder on a ball valve pull it out and then close the valve


Pipe plug is the one I use to use. Pita to pack it up after use. Handy for commercial shut down and repairs on bigger copper.


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## wyrickmech

Anymore veiga press or nibco press fittings are the easy way. For sweat joints I use a tool that just simply diverts the water away from the pipe wall. Sweat a valve on and pull the tool.


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## Nathan901

Jet sweats are an indispensable tool on my truck. 
They're awesome for working on free flowing well heads. 
I wish I had the flow through set, although I have had the 1/2 and 3/4 both hold under city pressure.


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## wyrickmech

Nathan901 said:


> Jet sweats are an indispensable tool on my truck. They're awesome for working on free flowing well heads. I wish I had the flow through set, although I have had the 1/2 and 3/4 both hold under city pressure.


I had a crew sweat a valve on and wile removing the tool it shot across the hall and buried itself in the wall like a bullet out of a gun. That was the last time I ever used one.


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## titaniumplumbr

Yeah one thing no one mentioned best thing to in this situation is open a faucet or a bib for all that pressure that's building behind the plug


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## dhal22

Propress.


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## titaniumplumbr

Prioress machines don't always fit buddy sometimes you gotta kick it old school and solder that b;([email protected]


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## dhal22

I hear you. We had an after hours shutdown recently where a section of 1 1/2" soft copper service line had failed. Probably 30 year old copper, heavily corroded, not an inch of the pipe round, well over 2' deep and in the mud. Propress or solder?

David


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## sparky

if i have a line leaking that wont let me solder a valve on,i will sweat on a union,you can solder one half a union on the pipe if the water is not running full force,then tighten her down.


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## Leach713

dhal22 said:


> I hear you. We had an after hours shutdown recently where a section of 1 1/2" soft copper service line had failed. Probably 30 year old copper, heavily corroded, not an inch of the pipe round, well over 2' deep and in the mud. Propress or solder? David



Solder I would apply 50/50 with light heat


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## plumbdrum

Leach713 said:


> Solder I would apply 50/50 with light heat


Your joking right?

Sent from my iPhone using PlumbingZone


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## Leach713

plumbdrum said:


> Your joking right? Sent from my iPhone using PlumbingZone


Nope


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## Ptturner91

Solder it with lead free then cap it with 50/50 

It's potable water you can't have a lead solder joint 

I never thought about the union and valve! That's a great idea


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## Leach713

Ptturner91 said:


> Solder it with lead free then cap it with 50/50 It's potable water you can't have a lead solder joint I never thought about the union and valve! That's a great idea


. 


I know code 

And why not , the used to have lead pipe for yard service


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## Ptturner91

Leach713 said:


> . I know code And why not , the used to have lead pipe for yard service


Oh yeah makes sense! They use to do it that way so it's ok to do it now 
Why don't we just insulate that repair with some asbestos insulation well were at it! They use to do that too, what's the harm


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## Leach713

Ptturner91 said:


> Oh yeah makes sense! They use to do it that way so it's ok to do it now Why don't we just insulate that repair with some asbestos insulation well were at it! They use to do that too, what's the harm


Why would you insulate If is in the ground???


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## Gunnar

Leach713 said:


> Why would you insulate If is in the ground???


I think u missed his point


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## Leach713

Gunnar said:


> I think u missed his point



No I didn't it


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## wyrickmech

Leach713 said:


> . I know code And why not , the used to have lead pipe for yard service


probably because it's a felony.


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## Coolcanuck

I was taught to cap with 50/50 years ago, haven't done that in 10 years now at least. Haven't had 50/50 for a long time now, nor would I. I don't do much ground work but last time I brazed the joint.


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## dhal22

I soldered the repair. I ruined several couplings re rounding the pipe, tapping lightly and removing the coupling over and over until the pipe was round (2x). Then it was a sanding marathon. Old dirty copper does not sand easily, not down in a hole and in muddy conditions. Two of my guys and I took turns for a couple of hours polishing the pipe ends. I don't care how much they complained, it was a 1 shot repair. Instead of 2 couplings and a section of pipe I used a tee on 1 end with a ball valve for steam control. Even with a b-tank and a big Turbotorch tip it was a lot of careful work getting the solder to take on the bottomside of the pipe. I always check tough areas with a mirror before I approve my work, finally it looked and felt good so we pressurized and all was good. That was not a situation for Propress or Sharkbites.

David


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## plumbdrum

Are you allowed to use water service fittings with locking bands ( ford fitting, I think they are called?) in my area the water dept will not allow soldered connections before the meter.

Sent from my iPhone using PlumbingZone


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## jmc12185

plumbdrum said:


> Are you allowed to use water service fittings with locking bands ( ford fitting, I think they are called?) in my area the water dept will not allow soldered connections before the meter. Sent from my iPhone using PlumbingZone


 Same here... We call them mac-pac couplings.

Sent from my iPhone using PlumbingZone


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## wyrickmech

dhal22 said:


> I soldered the repair. I ruined several couplings re rounding the pipe, tapping lightly and removing the coupling over and over until the pipe was round (2x). Then it was a sanding marathon. Old dirty copper does not sand easily, not down in a hole and in muddy conditions. Two of my guys and I took turns for a couple of hours polishing the pipe ends. I don't care how much they complained, it was a 1 shot repair. Instead of 2 couplings and a section of pipe I used a tee on 1 end with a ball valve for steam control. Even with a b-tank and a big Turbotorch tip it was a lot of careful work getting the solder to take on the bottomside of the pipe. I always check tough areas with a mirror before I approve my work, finally it looked and felt good so we pressurized and all was good. That was not a situation for Propress or Sharkbites. David


would have been just as easy to use flare fittings.


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## dhal22

A great option but I don't own an 1 1/2" flare tool. This was an after hours repair for a busy daycare school, one of several that we service. I even considered compression couplings but no access to them after hours.


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## Letterrip

dhal22 said:


> I soldered the repair. I ruined several couplings re rounding the pipe, tapping lightly and removing the coupling over and over until the pipe was round (2x).


If you have the space, and you have a 90 with a short piece of pipe, it works well for rounding egged pipe. You use the short piece of pipe in one side of the 90 as a handle. Then twist the 90 onto the rounded pipe, turning back and forth. It will gently force the pipe back round as the 90 works it's way onto the egged pipe. Nearly 100% success.


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## wyrickmech

Below grade we can only use silver solder. Soft solder breaks down from the minerals in the ground. A set of hammer flaring tools from 2 in down is a good investment. If your pipe is out of round tapping the flaring tool in the pipe re shapes the pipe back. Makes even a solder joint easer.


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## dhal22

Letterrip said:


> If you have the space, and you have a 90 with a short piece of pipe, it works well for rounding egged pipe. You use the short piece of pipe in one side of the 90 as a handle. Then twist the 90 onto the rounded pipe, turning back and forth. It will gently force the pipe back round as the 90 works it's way onto the egged pipe. Nearly 100% success.


 Good one.


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## Nathan901

Get yer pliers on it and make it round! Haha

Ive had luck with rotating a crescent wrench around the pipe many times before also.


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