# New Minnesota plumbing code 2015



## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

So, Minnesota has just a few days ago switched from Minnesota's own plumbing code to an adopted version of the UPC code with amendments. I just got mine and it looks interesting as we will now be allowed to wet vent which we could not do before. Although I don't need it because I'm just an apprentice I'm going to a continuing ed class next week with my boss because it focuses on the new code. I think it will be interesting. I am wondering if anyone else has got the new code book and has noticed interesting changes they want to share.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

What makes you think *you* don't need a code book just because you are an apprentice? 
How do you expect to become proficient in the installation of plumbing if you don't have a code book to refer to?


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

I agree... I use mine all the time... Dbl check vent distance etc... Talking to my instructor here in Wisconsin, we may also change soon to either IPC or UPC... Apparently our great governor here got rid of our state plumbing council also.


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## moonapprentice (Aug 23, 2012)

Ace4548.... is that a rumor that it may change or fact?


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

He wasn't saying he didn't need a code book. He said he didn't need the continuing education class.


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

Plumbus said:


> What makes you think *you* don't need a code book just because you are an apprentice?
> How do you expect to become proficient in the installation of plumbing if you don't have a code book to refer to?


I wrote that I just got my code book. It was the continuing education class that I don't need as it is not required of apprentices because I'm am learning every day at work. So I do have a code book I actually have several, my old and new Minnesota code and north Dakota code and I read a little in them from time to time to make sure I really remember the code. I actually got my new code book before my boss and other plumbers I know. And I have signed up for the continuing ed class even though I am not required to, simply because I want to learn as much as I can. So thank you very muck for your quick judgement.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

It may not be required of apprentices (or journeymen for that matter). But, if you worked for me, I would require it. How can you be sure that what you are "learning every day at work" meets the minimum standard (i.e. your state code) without some sort of reference?


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

bct p&h said:


> He wasn't saying he didn't need a code book. He said he didn't need the continuing education class.


"I just got mine (code book) and it looks interesting as we will now be allowed to wet vent which we could not do before. Although *I don't need it* because I'm just an apprentice..."


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

Moon- as of now it's being talked about according to my instructor, and a few other instructors. There was also a plumbing code change, but it wasn't done to the *plumbing code at least not for our code book... It was made in the building code, deals with garage drains.. Because we no longer have a plumbing council, nobody was there to say "why are carpenters changing plumbing code"... 

As for changing to IPC or UPC.. I guess its something government wants... Bad things will happen to our trade if we don't get our council back... Blame our great governor again.


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

Plumbus I have my code book as a reference, I have my master plumber with 14 years of experience that I work with every day. I can assure you that I almost always not just meet the minimum standards but exceed them. I am only human so yes I can make mistakes on occasion but I make sure to correct them. I aspire to be better than the 2 master plumbers that have tought me what I know so far. I am probably one of the better apprentices in what I do that you will be able to find. I work very hard to make sure I will one day end up better than the people who tought me. So please stop trying to judge me with out knowing me. Now again I would like to ask Minnesota plumbers if they have seen some interesting changes in the new code book that might be worth pointing out?


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

Plumbus said:


> "I just got mine (code book) and it looks interesting as we will now be allowed to wet vent which we could not do before. Although *I don't need it* because I'm just an apprentice..."










The Dane said:


> Although I don't need it, because I'm just an apprentice, I'm going to a continuing ed class next week with my boss because it focuses on the new code.


Of course if you snip the two sentences together like that it looks odd. With just the sentence snipped, and with commas added, it makes better sense.


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

Negativity sucks


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

My post?


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

chonkie said:


> My post?



Naw,


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

The Dane said:


> Plumbus I have my code book as a reference, I have my master plumber with 14 years of experience that I work with every day. I can assure you that I almost always not just meet the minimum standards but exceed them. I am only human so yes I can make mistakes on occasion but I make sure to correct them. I aspire to be better than the 2 master plumbers that have taught me what I know so far. I am probably one of the better apprentices in what I do that you will be able to find. I work very hard to make sure I will one day end up better than the people who taught me. So please stop trying to judge me with out knowing me. Now again I would like to ask Minnesota plumbers if they have seen some interesting changes in the new code book that might be worth pointing out?


I do not wish to impune your work ethics or your skill level. I just had a problem with your saying that though you have a code book for reference, you don't need it, since you are just an apprentice. Though you are fortunate to have a seasoned master plumber to learn from, 
I've got two good reasons why having a code book handy is essential. 
1) Even a master plumber doesn't know everything. 
2) You stated that your state has a new code. I'll bet you boss hasn't put to memory all the new rules that conflict with those of your old code.


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

Plumbus said:


> I do not wish to impune your work ethics or your skill level. I just had a problem with your saying that though you have a code book for reference, you don't need it, since you are just an apprentice. Though you are fortunate to have a seasoned master plumber to learn from,
> I've got two good reasons why having a code book handy is essential.
> 1) Even a master plumber doesn't know everything.
> 2) You stated that your state has a new code. I'll bet you boss hasn't put to memory all the new rules that conflict with those of your old code.


Read his first post over a couple more times. He said he is taking a continuing education class even though he doesn't need to. He's an apprentice, continuing education is not required. 
I understood what he said. Chonkie understood what he said. If anything, this kid should have a problem with your reading comprehension, you shouldn't have a problem with him having a code book.


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

Plumbus. I guess we miscommunicated since I was trying to say that I have the new code book, and that continuing ed I not required of me as an apprentice but I still have chosen to go to one because it focuses on our new code. I guess I just felt attacked for no reason. I'm glad we just misunderstood each other. I had hoped someone could give their oppinions on the new code so we could have a discussion on what the new code will mean for us. It seems no one has anything to say about it.


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

Hey Dane,

The fish are biting and the ice is thick


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## ace4548 (Feb 10, 2015)

What was the reasoning you couldn't wet vent in Minnesota? I know in Wisconsins code we can.. Just curious why they didn't allow this.


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## bct p&h (Jan 19, 2013)

The Dane said:


> I had hoped someone could give their oppinions on the new code so we could have a discussion on what the new code will mean for us. It seems no one has anything to say about it.


You probably won't get a lot of response to your new code because there aren't a lot of people from where you are on here.
I can tell you wet venting saves a ton of time and material. I just brought back a couple thousand dollars worth of SV pipe and fittings plus saved time on the job because I wet vented instead of individual venting like the print showed, take off was per print.
The problem I see is that even in a state where wet venting has been legal for years there are still a lot of licensed plumbers that don't do it correctly. For you, in a state where it just became code, I have a feeling there will be a lot more incorrect wet vents. That is going to lead to problems with guys failing inspections and bad mouthing it or systems not working correctly and having the end user upset. Good luck, should be interesting especially if you're in service.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

bct p&h said:


> Read his first post over a couple more times. He said he is taking a continuing education class even though he doesn't need to. He's an apprentice, continuing education is not required.
> I understood what he said. Chonkie understood what he said. If anything, this kid should have a problem with your reading comprehension, you shouldn't have a problem with him having a code book.


I did read it over. I see now that by "it" he was referring to continuing education class. I think his decision to attend is a good idea. And, I hope he doesn't have too much of a problem with my reading comprehension or lack thereof.

Dane 
How the code will effect you only time will tell. Hopefully, your class will have some literature highlighting conflicts between the old and the new. The change will be a learning experience for both installers and inspectors.
I am familiar with the UPC, having used it for 40 years, but I haven't a clue when it comes to your old Minnesota code, so I may not be of much use to you discussion wise. However, if you have a question specific to the UPC I'd be happy to take a shot at an answer. BTW: I do know when and why horizontal wet venting became part of this code.


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

I have heard that the old Minnesota plumbing code was one of the strictest in the country. The new Minnesota version of the UPC (UPC with a bunch of Minnesota's own amendments) should make life easier for us. Most noticeably we are now allowed to wet vent. I don't know why we could not wet vent before. I haven't looked at it but I immagine we still have to install radon vents. I just got this in the mail today after I already got my new book.


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## 760GWS (Mar 16, 2015)

Why were flexible water heater connectors not allowed in the previous code? 

Now that push fittings are allowed, I guess the flood gates are open for those manufacturers: SharkBite, JohnGuest, TecTite, GatorBite, Apollo something-or-other, etc, etc... lol


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## The Dane (Feb 19, 2015)

760GWS said:


> Why were flexible water heater connectors not allowed in the previous code?
> 
> Now that push fittings are allowed, I guess the flood gates are open for those manufacturers: SharkBite, JohnGuest, TecTite, GatorBite, Apollo something-or-other, etc, etc... lol


I don't know why flex connectors were not allowed, and I would not use it. We are now required to hard pipe the first 18" on a water heater before we can go to pex. I think the airgap fitting above countertop for dishwashers are something we are not going to like. We already had push fittings and we have used them a couple of times as a coupling between polybutylene pipe and pex or copper. I guess for homeowners it is now allowed for a new construction situation where it might not have been before but we will still only use it in a rare case.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

The reason flex connectors are in the UPS is that this code originates from CA where earthquakes are a constant threat.
Air gaps have been in the UPC since the 60's. They are an effective guard against sewage backing up into the the dishwasher.
There was a time when the UPC was very restrictive, but the competition between the rival model code bodies (UPC-IPC) has forced them to be more inclusive in allowing new materials for the purpose of attracting participation by the various states.


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