# Got a fine today



## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Yes like the topic says I got a fine today 

from the MTO which is Ministry of transportation

It was for one of our cube trucks ... the province is on a blist drumming up money

This cube we were told that we didnt need a CVOR which is an anual inspection and sticker indicating the date it was done on...

It just so happens I was driving it...

I get pulled over...... I didn't have my driver licence with me..

But had all the other papers.... the cube passed mechanical inspection....
because i always have it in for needed repairs.

But there was a weight issue...

they say I was over weight......

I didnt think i was ...... but she had an axe to grind... so there was a gravel pit down the road.... she made me drive to the pit following her to get the truck weighted.... I was 1,000 lbs over weight..

She gave me a ticket for not having the annual inspection and for being over weight...

$ 400.00 bucks in total....

I could fight this in court as who only knows when this scale was calibrated..... and also I was in the truck when it was weighted...

What would you guys do?????

pay the fine and roll over or fight the ticket


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

Pay the fine. It wan't a moving violation and $400.00 is chump change.



I


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Widdershins said:


> Pay the fine. It wan't a moving violation and $400.00 is chump change.
> 
> 
> 
> I


Had to be for a moving violation as I was not parked at the time


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## okcplum (Jul 16, 2011)

You could fight it but think of the lost income and stress in doing so, it's the system and it's designed to steal money from us hard working folk in any way it can to give it to the scum of the world.

I have tried and failed to fight fines before and it cost me a hell of a lot more than if I had just rolled over in the first place.

Take it on the chin and learn from it.

It hurts I know and it's not the cash amount, it's the fact they are punishing the working class people hard.


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Had to be for a moving violation as I was not parked at the time


Will it reflect on your insurance?

If it doesn't, then just pay the fine.

If it does, fight it tooth and nail.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

mark kiernan said:


> You could fight it but think of the lost income and stress in doing so, it's the system and it's designed to steal money from us hard working folk in any way it can to give it to the scum of the world.
> 
> I have tried and failed to fight fines before and it cost me a hell of a lot more than if I had just rolled over in the first place.
> 
> ...


Actually I never lost anything in court...

I have won seat belt tickets... speeding tickets... to improper use of plates and unauthorized use of plates...

I have done this for many people that need my help... and actually they all know me down there... and address me by MR.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

mark kiernan said:


> You could fight it but think of the lost income and stress in doing so, it's the system and it's designed to steal money from us hard working folk in any way it can to give it to the scum of the world.
> 
> I have tried and failed to fight fines before and it cost me a hell of a lot more than if I had just rolled over in the first place.
> 
> ...


 


A police officer is a working class person..btw.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Actually I never lost anything in court...
> 
> I have won seat belt tickets... speeding tickets... to improper use of plates and unauthorized use of plates...
> 
> I have done this for many people that need my help... and actually they all know me down there... and address me by MR.


 
It's great that people take time out to insure that no one is being wrongly charged. 

How have you won a no seat belt ticket...were you wearing it and got a citation anyways?


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> I guess the cops could just stop enforcing the laws and we could just all do as we pleased. I love laws, and really love the fact they are enforced. Ever been to Mexico?
> 
> What if he was over weight? Also he needed the sticker and did not have it. On him.
> 
> ...


If this is the case.... then why would you have to wait to be told to right tickets for a certain offence...it should be an every day affair...


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> If this is the case.... then why would you have to wait to be told to right tickets for a certain offence...it should be an every day affair...


 
Huh? You never had a boss to tell you to do something?


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

If the cop was wrong then the cop was wrong, don't want anyone to think I taking sides here. Just don't want to see a bunch of cop bashing start.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> Huh? You never had a boss to tell you to do something?


You said you had to be told to write tickets for a certain offence,,,,

This is how I see the whole law enforcement issue now that you brought it up.

When it comes to defending my rights the cops are never there... or make excuses as not to proceed to enforce the law.... 

Must times Police officers do not even know the law... they abritarily bend the the law and make improper decisions,,,

It seems however they like or prefer to enforce the law when it comes to the state or province is the complaintant...

It is a revenue source for them.......

If it is in the states interest they will pull out all stops so they get their revenue....


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## okcplum (Jul 16, 2011)

RealCraftsMan said:


> A police officer is a working class person..btw.


Do you ever here of a cop giving him or her self a ticket for speeding or no seat belt, what about using there lap tops while driving ?

Now you drive past a cop and see if you get away with it....

Just saying....

I always thought the police were civil servants.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

mark kiernan said:


> Do you ever here of a cop giving him or her self a ticket for speeding or no seat belt, what about using there lap tops while driving ?
> 
> Now you drive past a cop and see if you get away with it....
> 
> ...


No they are self serving


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

mark kiernan said:


> Do you ever here of a cop giving him or her self a ticket for speeding or no seat belt, what about using there lap tops while driving ?
> 
> Now you drive past a cop and see if you get away with it....
> 
> ...


I was an Officer for six years and never worked as a civil servant.


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## okcplum (Jul 16, 2011)

So, a public servant.... You tell me.

Just an employee clocking in and out, educate us a little...


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

RealCraftsMan said:


> I was an Officer for six years and never worked as a civil servant.


That might explain how your collar changed to its present color.

I'm just saying. . . .


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> You said you had to be told to write tickets for a certain offence,,,,
> 
> This is how I see the whole law enforcement issue now that you brought it up.
> 
> ...


 
You're just playing word games now. I never said I had to be told to write certain tickits. I was told that we needed to write more of a certain kind. 

Braging about how you get out of seat belt tickets etc. lol

I knew the law as did the other officers I worked with. All of us had DEgrees and most had them in CJ...yep that's four years buddy. 

I have been attacked and beatin breaking up fights etc. Yall people only see what you want to see. You never think of all the good they do.


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

mark kiernan said:


> So, a public servant.... You tell me.
> 
> Just an employee clocking in and out, educate us a little...


Maybe they might remember who it is they work for if the paycheck was signed 'John Q Public'.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

Widdershins said:


> That might explain how your collar changed to its present color.
> 
> I'm just saying. . . .


 
Not all cities are civil service...really?!?! talking smack about what you know nothing of??

I'm medically retried btw


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

Did the blinkers on your squad cars work? They all seemed to be broken in AZ.


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

RealCraftsMan said:


> Not all cities are civil service...really?!?! talking smack about what you know nothing of??
> 
> I'm medically retried btw


I can spot a guy with a chip on his shoulder at 100 yards. Yours is just easier to spot because of its bulk.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

Widdershins said:


> Maybe they might remember who it is they work for if the paycheck was signed 'John Q Public'.


 
I loved helping people. Nothing made my day more than keeping a family together or letting a guy off for a speeding ticket. 

But sometimes you just have to write that citation of put those handcuffs on. 

Sorry I jacked your thread op....I'm stopping so you can get it back on track.


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## okcplum (Jul 16, 2011)

Real craftsmen I'm not trying to bust your balls here.

I have had a lot of help from the police in the past and I hope I don't need them in the future but If I do what number do you think I will dial 999, sorry I mean 911.

999 is the uk number but if you dial it here it works the same.

However, entrapment is not a good thing, by entrapment I mean hiding under bridges with speeding guns to catch people to give out fines.

Prevention is better than cure, prevent speeding by being on show to slow people down, not hiding in the shadows like a thief waiting to get the numbers up for tickets.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> You're just playing word games now. I never said I had to be told to write certain tickits. I was told that we needed to write more of a certain kind.
> 
> Braging about how you get out of seat belt tickets etc. lol
> 
> ...


not play games... you did say... that you were told what to do.. that is plain and simple...

Not bragging... 

I found that... in all instances... and I mean all... that the officer involved did not know the complete law... there is exemption under the law...

Ignorance of the law is no excuse.... as the law goes... and some one enforcing the law should IMO know the complete law they are trying to enforce......

This is how I take thing to trial.....

there should be no mistakes... when it comes to enforcing the law...

I am not bragging by no means .......

when it comes to matters of the law.... you have to know it all....

More than likely .. you will say this is not the case... but how in the world do you think most stuff gets through out of court ... because the officer screwed up


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

mark kiernan said:


> Real craftsmen I'm not trying to bust your balls here.
> 
> I have had a lot of help from the police in the past and I hope I don't need them in the future but If I do what number do you think I will dial 999, sorry I mean 911.
> 
> ...


 
You’re not busting my balls at all. What you’re talking about is even frowned down upon in law enforcement. You mainly see that in small town or sadly cash strapped towns. 



Now don't get me started on red light cameras.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> not play games... you did say... that you were told what to do.. that is plain and simple...
> 
> Not bragging...
> 
> ...


 
Why would I say this is not the case? You do have to know the law and if you don't how would you enforce the law? 

I agree with what you say above, just please don't rope all officers in the the pos category.


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## okcplum (Jul 16, 2011)

I live in a very large city and everyday I drive i40 and i35 and it's lined with cops in the shadows. I don't speed, I won't even use my cell while driving.

All hands free.

Let's get back on track like you say.

Take it to court and stick it to them with loss of earnings if you can win the case against the $400 ticket.....

We want pics though or it didn't happen. Lol.


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## bartnc37 (Feb 24, 2009)

No, entrapment is when the county takes a dead straight country back road that happens to be 1/4 mile exactly from intersection to intersection and for no apparent reasons paves it perfectly. How long do you think that took to become the local drag strip? Just an FYI drag racing tickets are almost as bad as a DUI as far as insurance companies are concerned especially if you happen to be an 18 yr old male in a camaro.:whistling2:


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

RealCraftsMan said:


> Why would I say this is not the case? You do have to know the law and if you don't how would you enforce the law?
> 
> I agree with what you say above, just please don't rope all officers in the the pos category.


Most of the LEO's I know are decent hard working people.

It's too bad we only hear about the dirtbags in the media.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

This is how I could fight this ticket if I wanted to...

First off the only thing they had me on was the over weight......

The officer ... says ... she does not have her scales with her because they are getting repaired...

So to prove her point she figures I should get weighted at a scale station at a gravel pit...

No problem I comply...

The scale says I am over by 1,000 lbs..

She gets a copy of the scale read out...

the real problem is this..

First off they weight the truck with me in it...I know for a fact that the driver does not count....I am not saying that I weight 1,000 lbs... but there is an other problem

the other problem is ... is the scale accurate... when was the last time the scale was calibrated

a 1,000 lbs on a gravel pit is not much to be out on...

We have a ministry here called weights and measures where every thing that is being sold by weight and volume has to be calibreted every so often...

where she failed is to get a copy of the weights and measures when the last time it was calibrated...

she would lose in court because there is no way to prove that the scale is not out of calibration...


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Unless you weigh over a 1,000 pounds, I would pay it.

Thankfully for me my son Jon was just names officer of the year for his California Highway Patrol office. Of course I am not the type to use my son's positions to help me.

Mark

My three sons


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OldSchool said:


> Yes like the topic says I got a fine today
> 
> from the MTO which is Ministry of transportation
> 
> ...


 Were you over weight by the vechicle standard or by the plate rating?


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

OldSchool said:


> This is how I could fight this ticket if I wanted to...
> 
> First off the only thing they had me on was the over weight......
> 
> ...


I say u have a good case...


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

rjbphd said:


> I say u have a good case...


I have been through the mill many times...

The thing is... at the time nobody is thinking about everything...

But once it is written... then you can put all the doubts together....

because there is always something missed...... what you got to do if find what was missed or the mistake that was made...

I still have a standing offer at a local law firm to work for them.... didnt want to give up the plumbing yet......


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## bartnc37 (Feb 24, 2009)

If you were three or four hundred over you might be in better shape but a full 1000 over is pretty hard to blame on scales. Those scales are how the pit charges and if they were off that much either the truckers or the pit owners would have been screaming bloody murder.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

bartnc37 said:


> If you were three or four hundred over you might be in better shape but a full 1000 over is pretty hard to blame on scales. Those scales are how the pit charges and if they were off that much either the truckers or the pit owners would have been screaming bloody murder.


Its called tipping the scale.....

I dont know if you ever heard of that...

Its a practice where the scales adjusted to their favour...

It always shows more than what is really there


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Its called tipping the scale.....
> 
> I dont know if you ever heard of that...
> 
> ...


 
What if it was correct? Also how ya going to prove it's off? In Texas all public scales are cert/lic. by the State and in traffic court they are defacto assumed to always be correct. 

And how many tickets have you had? I've had one my whole life and my wifes had zero.


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> What if it was correct? Also how ya going to prove it's off? In Texas all public scales are cert/lic. by the State and in traffic court they are defacto assumed to always be correct.
> 
> And how many tickets have you had? I've had one my whole life and my wifes had zero.


You don't have to prove it's off. THEY have to prove it's accurate. In this country you're supposed to be innocent until PROVEN guilty, not sure how it's written in Canada. Without the ability of the state to prove the scale was accurate he's innocent in the eyes of the law.

That's part of what makes this country great. You have to be proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Not recently calibrated scales sounds like a reasonable doubt.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> What if it was correct? Also how ya going to prove it's off? In Texas all public scales are cert/lic. by the State and in traffic court they are defacto assumed to always be correct.
> 
> And how many tickets have you had? I've had one my whole life and my wifes had zero.


It may be correct.....

But during trial I would bring this up... not prior...

Dont have to prove it is off... 

there is a mandate that all MTO scales have to be calibrated and proof of this has to be evident...

they would be lacking evidence that the scale was calibratied...

now you got to realize that 1,000 lbs is not a lot when it comes to a gravel pit...

most trucks hold 24 tons at a time...

1 ton weights 2,200 lbs
a truck hold 24 tons

That would be 52,800 lbs

So what is the % of accuarcy

I was apparently only over 1,000 lbs


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> It may be correct.....
> 
> But during trial I would bring this up... not prior...
> 
> ...


That's my point, what if they do show it's calibrated? You're just shooting in the dark with your idea. Best go over there and weight something there and then two other places.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

RW Plumbing said:


> You don't have to prove it's off. THEY have to prove it's accurate. In this country you're supposed to be innocent until PROVEN guilty, not sure how it's written in Canada. Without the ability of the state to prove the scale was accurate he's innocent in the eyes of the law.
> 
> *That's part of what makes this country great. You have to be proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. Not recently calibrated scales sounds like a reasonable doubt*.


 
You have to have a defense correct? As a person who has spent 100's and 100's of hours in courts there is the real world and then there is the court system.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> That's my point, what if they do show it's calibrated? You're just shooting in the dark with your idea. Best go over there and weight something there and then two other places.


I watched ..... her

arrogance leads to ignorance

I don't have to prove anything.... just create doubt....

in the scheme of things 1,000 lbs over an average truck going through there of 52,000 lbs plus the truck may be 1% to 2% out of calibration....

Which we all know is less than the average of most calibration of 5% to 10%


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> That's my point, what if they do show it's calibrated? You're just shooting in the dark with your idea. Best go over there and weight something there and then two other places.


Him doing a test himself wouldn't do any good. The court doesn't consider him an authority on weights and measures. If they prove calibration he's screwed. They won't though, it's a relatively small ticket and not worth the ADA's time. Investigations cost money.

Tickets work off the shotgun principal. Just shoot and most of the shot will hit the target. In this case most people will simply pay the ticket. The one's that fight it win a high percentage of the time if they're intelligent people with a good legal understanding.


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> You have to have a defense correct? As a person who has spent 100's and 100's of hours in courts there is the real world and then there is the court system.


The defense is they can't prove the scale was accurate that's it. Call the accuracy into question and if they can't prove it case closed. Who knows if the officer doesn't show, it could be thrown out. You have a right to face your accuser.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> It may be correct.....
> 
> But during trial I would bring this up... not prior...
> 
> ...


 
I live and I worked in Texas as a Police Officer I'm now a plumber.

The way it works here is you can sit down with the judge well before the trail and show him/her proof of you guilt or not. A traffic citation is not a criminal offense, it's a civil offense. A trial for a traffic citation is almost unheard of and out of a 1k+ citations over 6 years I've only had ten go to full trial. Most of the time they will call you and the officer up to the bench and both sides say there case and show their cards and the judge states his ruling and its over. About 99% of the time its over in less then 5 minutes.

My point being is if you have proof the citation was issued in error than why would you just not show the error to the judge?


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

RW Plumbing said:


> Him doing a test himself wouldn't do any good. The court doesn't consider him an authority on weights and measures. If they prove calibration he's screwed. They won't though, it's a relatively small ticket and not worth the (1)*ADA's time*. Investigations cost money.
> 
> (2)Tickets work off the shotgun principal. Just shoot and most of the shot will hit the target. In this case most people will simply pay the ticket. The one's that fight it win a high percentage of the time if they're intelligent people with a good legal understanding.


1--ADA?? HAHAHAHA its a traffic citation not a felony! You mean a city atty? Watch to much tv have we? 

The city has people that just take tickets to court in most US cities, that what they are paid to do.

2--Where are you getting this from? If you write a ticket you better be in court to defend what you have written or you going to be written up your self. Also I know of very few cases losing that went to trial. I'm done with this thread as people are just typing stuff they have heard from the friend/public.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> I live and I worked in Texas as a Police Officer I'm now a plumber.
> 
> The way it works here is you can sit down with the judge well before the trail and show him/her proof of you guilt or not. A traffic citation is not a criminal offense, it's a civil offense. A trial for a traffic citation is almost unheard of and out of a 1k+ citations over 6 years I've only had ten go to full trial. Most of the time they will call you and the officer up to the bench and both sides say there case and show their cards and the judge states his ruling and its over. About 99% of the time its over in less then 5 minutes.
> 
> My point being is if you have proof the citation was issued in error than why would you just not show the error to the judge?


Corruption

So you have a prior meeting with the judge to go over your ticket ??

the judge is suppose to be impartial...

This is corruption...

the judge should only hear the facts at trial only... other than written statements...

Who are you kidding.... the judge wants to hear my side of the story before trial...

How can a Traffic violation be civil ????

That is a mistake on your part.....


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Corruption
> 
> So you have a prior meeting with the judge to go over your ticket ??
> 
> ...


 
We must have very very different legal systems. A traffic citation (traffic code) is only a civil charge in Texas not criminal. 

And it ends here as we can't compare apples to oranges.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> We must have very very different legal systems. A traffic citation (traffic code) is only a civil charge in Texas not criminal.
> 
> And it ends here as we can't compare apples to oranges.


I am sorry that we have a misunderstanding of the law

Which in part is what I have been saying ... that in whole police officers don't know the law or how to separtae the law .......

Therefore ... there is only criminal and civil law....

civil law is contract law between two or more parties....

Any thing else is criminal..... but some how they created Qusia criminal... which is traffic and legislation offences.. where all they want is money for a penality......

I am not trying to beat upon on you.... just trying to educate you....

if you know of any legal system that is neither ... civil... criminal... martial or admiriality then please let me know..... because I dont know what any other catorgories there could be....

Common law would fall under civil law if you though of that one...

So please enlighten me


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> I am sorry that we have a misunderstanding of the law
> 
> Which in part is what I have been saying ... that in whole police officers don't know the law or how to separtae the law .......
> 
> ...


 
 Once more I'm in Texas which is part of the US so things may not be the same. 

The State of Texas Attorney General has judged that the state traffic code can be both civil and criminal if certain aspects of case law are met. I don’t know if your arguing or what as it’s a clearly written judgment by our state attorney general. 

Nothing to educate me on, that’s why I spent four years in college and then six months in an academy. Nor do I feel that in any way you’re “beating upon me.” 
I know this very confusing to most people.* It’s considered a civil offense due to the fact you do sign a contract to receive a drivers license and you agree to certain terms. ** So it's contract! Get it now?*
But as I keep saying I lived and worked in *Texas not Canada*.


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

RealCraftsMan said:


> And how many tickets have you had? I've had one my whole life and my wifes had zero.


 
Gee, I wonder why.....................:whistling2:


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> 1--ADA?? HAHAHAHA its a traffic citation not a felony! You mean a city atty? Watch to much tv have we?
> 
> The city has people that just take tickets to court in most US cities, that what they are paid to do.
> 
> 2--Where are you getting this from? If you write a ticket you better be in court to defend what you have written or you going to be written up your self. Also I know of very few cases losing that went to trial. I'm done with this thread as people are just typing stuff they have heard from the friend/public.


Oh every city does huh? What about smaller ones. You. Know places where the cops are more than just fine generators? It makes sense that cities that are ticket mills have a department to deal with them. 

They still fall under the authority of a DA. Some towns only have one city attorney, they must not be as concerned with generating money as where your from. As for meeting with the judge beforehand I hope you're lying. That's a clear conflict of interest and against the constitutional right to a fair trial. 

I guess when you're busy writing tickets it's hard to find time to abide by the constitution.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> Once more I'm in Texas which is part of the US so things may not be the same.
> 
> The State of Texas Attorney General has judged that the state traffic code can be both civil and criminal if certain aspects of case law are met. I don&#146;t know if your arguing or what as it&#146;s a clearly written judgment by our state attorney general.
> 
> ...


Just because you signed a license does not make it civil

More or less. Everything is illegal until you acquire a license

A license in all essence is granting you permission to do some thing that with out a license would be illegal. If you breach the so called contract of the license the only thing civil would to revoke said contract of license

To do something illegal is criminal......... 

The part that is illegal is the statutory law or offense that you committed

This in itself is under criminal jurisdiction.......

Again you may disagree but it is fact

The state has to provide disclosure prior to trail

Sent from my portable office....yes I am at work


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

I went to court, to fight a weight limit ticket, many yrs ago. I was told to be there at 8am. When I got there, I was handed a number. It was 127. There must of been close to 200 people there that day. My case never even got called until after their 1.5hr lunch break. Then the judge asked me 1 question, but I was never allowed to talk anymore, & he was on to the next case, before I could pick up my papers off the stand.

The fine was $500, & he cut it in half to $250, & then I was charged some kind of court cost, so I ended up paying about $300.

So I would be shocked if a judge would even listen to any argument you have, whether its legitimate or not, cuz you, & your case, is just a blade of grass on a golf course to him/ or her. It would be hard for me to fathom you even being allowed to bring up any weight callibration issue, without having to go to another level, & as we all know the famous question.

How much are you willing to pay, how much work are you willing to miss, to prove your point? 

And if you succeed & prove your point, does anyone care? Will anything change? My answer is no. My advice is, write out a co.check for $400, figure it's a write off, & get your but over to that train track place, & start workin on those 168 furnaces, (or whatever the amount was), & charge an extra $2.50 for each one.:yes: Cuz IMO with overweight, & no inspection sticker violations, you got off cheap.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Don The Plumber said:


> I went to court, to fight a weight limit ticket, many yrs ago. I was told to be there at 8am. When I got there, I was handed a number. It was 127. There must of been close to 200 people there that day. My case never even got called until after their 1.5hr lunch break. Then the judge asked me 1 question, but I was never allowed to talk anymore, & he was on to the next case, before I could pick up my papers off the stand.
> 
> The fine was $500, & he cut it in half to $250, & then I was charged some kind of court cost, so I ended up paying about $300.
> 
> ...


That is weird

So your case was heard or not heard

What was the question the judge asked you?

This is how I do it..... 

It's called giving enough rope till the hang themselves

First off the state calls their witness

Which is usually the cop

The first thing is they ask the cop if he needs or wants to use his note

At that point object

The objection is the officer notes were not disclosed to you by the state. 

It's during your cross examination of their witness that you slowly question the facts you want to present

You are actually making the officer question his own facts as he or she knows it

You ask a question about the mto scales they usually use and lead the officer down the path that you want it to go

No evidence has to be presented by myself

Just have to make the officers testimony to your benefit

Sent from my portable office....yes I am at work


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Just because you signed a license does not make it civil
> 
> More or less. Everything is illegal until you acquire a license
> 
> ...


 
Yea ok...Once more I'm in Texas.


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> That is weird
> 
> So your case was heard or not heard
> 
> ...


 
In the US you have to file a pretrial motion for dicovery...they just don't hand stuff over to you.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

I think it was really rude of her to say you were over weight. Who knows the weight you are may be the best weight for you.:whistling2:

Pay the fine it will mean less money spent at McDonalds


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

OldSchool said:


> That is weird
> 
> So your case was heard or not heard
> 
> ...


Actually my fine was for passing up the scales originally. I didn't know a 12ft box van, has to stop at the weigh station. Then they made me go back & weigh the truck, & kept me there too, for about an hr, before they issued me a ticket for failing to stop at a weigh station, & over weight by about 300lbs. 

So when I got to court, the judge or magistrate, or whatever he was asked me if I was person driving, & if I thought I was guilty. I said I was driving, but didn't think I was guilty. He said ok, cut the penalty in half, & that was it. I had no chance whatsoever to say another word.

I'm not a pro at this. And frankly, I don't want this to happen enough to become a pro at it. The average Joe aint gonna win. You may have more kahunnas than me, but I just wanted out of there. They don't give a rats rectum about my individual gripe. Hell they had 50 more cases to get to, before tee time.:yes:

They can find lots more things wrong with your truck, if you try to stir up trouble. And if this is a local jurisdiction, they could pull you over alot more often too.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> In the US you have to file a pretrial motion for dicovery...they just don't hand stuff over to you.


All you have to do is request it at pretrial

A request in pretrial is considered a motion

But on another point ..... The state is considered not to with hold evidence and it is customary that disclosure be given not demanded

The thing with traffic court is they kind of do it puppy mill style pumping people through the system. Never offering disclosure to the defendant 

This has change some what up here. Because I made the prosecutor give disclosure during trail .... He though he didn't have to because he said I should have requested it at pretrial

The fact is he wanted to use the officer notes and I objected to the use of these notes as this was not disclosed prior to trial

Needless to say but the trial was adjourned and the prosecutor was ordered by the judge to give us full disclosure 

Since then now in traffic court the defendant receives disclosure at pretrial with out requesting it

Sent from my portable office....yes I am at work


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