# Asking for your Humble Opinion



## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

My boss and I are starting whole house sewer re-plumb tomorrow. House was built in 1978 and is located in Garland, TX. There is 145’ of tunnel and current pipe is cast iron. Today excavators finished with digging and we stopped by to look at it. During our walk thru/crawl thru we noticed that 70-80% of pipe and fittings had pretty back cracks. It was cracks along the length of the pipe and fittings. I’ve never seen this before. My question to y’all is what would cause this widespread cracking of pipe and fittings? Thank you in advance.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

High acidity from the sewer gasses going through the pipes over time..is probably the 
main reason this would happen in only 45 years....

Another cause would be a huge family living in the home and throwing highly acidic
foods down the drain... or highly acidic urine constantly flowing down the line eating up the cast pipe........ 

Long ago we had an Italian family with 18 kids tearing up their plumbing very quickly, their
disposals would only last a year before the pot metal would eat through....
..


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## Blue2 (12 mo ago)

I would second the sewer gas. I’ve heard those splits called gas splits or something like that. 

145’ of tunneling is a hell of a job. Y’all should be busy for a couple weeks lol


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

Sewer gas, on a septic for sure, but can happen on city too. One other thing to consider is the initial quality of the cast. Where did the original plumber buy the cast and what was the quality?


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

Like @Master Mark has said, the Hydrogen Sulfide gas is hanging around. The no-hub pipe need only rust ~1/2 way through before it is so thin the stress from casting pulls itself apart.

I would suggest adding a couple extra vents to the system. 145' is a long run and may not have adequate airflow to clear the built up gasses.


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## Sstratton6175 (Jan 10, 2021)

Is the house in close proximity to train tracks? We had a problem with a cast drain a few years back on a house that had a freight line that ran right behind the house twice a day and was causing a lot of vibration in the ground.


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

Blue2 said:


> I would second the sewer gas. I’ve heard those splits called gas splits or something like that.
> 
> 145’ of tunneling is a hell of a job. Y’all should be busy for a couple weeks lol


Took excavators 4 days to dig and we’re planning on 4-5 days to finish everything.


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

OpenSights said:


> Sewer gas, on a septic for sure, but can happen on city too. One other thing to consider is the initial quality of the cast. Where did the original plumber buy the cast and what was the quality?


Southeast Asia


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

skoronesa said:


> Like @Master Mark has said, the Hydrogen Sulfide gas is hanging around. The no-hub pipe need only rust ~1/2 way through before it is so thin the stress from casting pulls itself apart.
> 
> I would suggest adding a couple extra vents to the system. 145' is a long run and may not have adequate airflow to clear the built up gasses.


His house has plenty of vents. From what I saw it was vented in accordance with Uniform Plumbing Code.


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

Sstratton6175 said:


> Is the house in close proximity to train tracks? We had a problem with a cast drain a few years back on a house that had a freight line that ran right behind the house twice a day and was causing a lot of vibration in the ground.


The closest railroad is 2 miles away


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

Master Mark said:


> High acidity from the sewer gasses going through the pipes over time..is probably the
> main reason this would happen in only 45 years....
> 
> Another cause would be a huge family living in the home and throwing highly acidic
> ...


The worst thing about all this is that there is a such shortage with homes in DFW area that people are buying them as is. This means they buy a house without inspection being done and can’t come after previous owner in case there is something major that needs repair. This homeowner bought this house last year and no inspection was done😱😱😱.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

PhoenixRises said:


> The worst thing about all this is that there is a such shortage with homes in DFW area that people are buying them as is. This means they buy a house without inspection being done and can’t come after previous owner in case there is something major that needs repair. This homeowner bought this house last year and no inspection was done😱😱😱.


I have a good friend that bought a house at the beginning of covid. They got to walk through once. Had to go off last buyer’s inspector’s info…… Guess what?


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

OpenSights said:


> I have a good friend that bought a house at the beginning of covid. They got to walk through once. Had to go off last buyer’s inspector’s info…… Guess what?
> 
> View attachment 132598
> 
> ...


What I don’t understand is that people will buy a car for $5000 and pay mechanic $200-$300 to look it over for issues. Meanwhile. They’ll buy a house for $400k-$500k and won’t pay a plumber fee hundred dollars to inspect their house??? Makes no sense


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

I pointed that out and a few other things. Fixed a number of them so far. Subfloor is going in tomorrow, so tub is early next week.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

PhoenixRises said:


> What I don’t understand is that people will buy a car for $5000 and pay mechanic $200-$300 to look it over for issues. Meanwhile. They’ll buy a house for $400k-$500k and won’t pay a plumber fee hundred dollars to inspect their house??? Makes no sense


I can’t agree more! At least the main line! I’ve made quite a few sales to renters over the years when they say they’re looking at buying a house. A new furnace is cheaper and they want that checked….


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

PhoenixRises said:


> His house has plenty of vents. From what I saw it was vented in accordance with Uniform Plumbing Code.


Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice. There are lots of track houses and modulars that meet code and are still garbage.

You could just assume it was a bad run of cast iron, or you could look for reasons it all failed so quickly. Assuming the previous owners weren't making meth or dumping other odd chemicals down the drain with consistency, the evidence points to a build up of hydrogen sulfide condensing and making sulfuric acid.


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

skoronesa said:


> Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice. There are lots of track houses and modulars that meet code and are still garbage.
> 
> You could just assume it was a bad run of cast iron, or you could look for reasons it all failed so quickly. Assuming the previous owners weren't making meth or dumping other odd chemicals down the drain with consistency, the evidence points to a build up of hydrogen sulfide condensing and making sulfuric acid.


I don’t like assuming anything that’s why I was asking for opinion from more experienced plumbers. This house definitely wasn’t built with minimum venting allowance. Build-up of hydrogen sulfide makes sense, but I’m not so sure it is due to venting issues. Could be a bad batch of cast iron that’s causing this??? I was already approached by the neighbor who has issues with the sewer system as well. House was built in the same year and by same builder. In case we end up doing their sewer system it would be interesting to see if they have same issues with their cast iron.

Either way, I’m thankful for all the feedback I’ve received from fellow plumbers on this forum.


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## chonkie (Jul 31, 2014)

PhoenixRises said:


> The worst thing about all this is that there is a such shortage with homes in DFW area


Could have fooled me. Company I work for homes are being thrown up way to quick in my opinion, all over the metroplex.



skoronesa said:


> Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice. There are lots of track houses and modulars that meet code and are still garbage.


So true. I wouldn't buy a house from any of the builders we work for, or probably any volume builder out there for that matter. A few are much better than others, and a few are complete dumbasses. And all of the trades suck in their own special way. Our subs included. I'm honestly amazed at the sh!t I have to fix most days. Makes me miss building custom homes I did for the 15 or so years.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

It might be sewer gas. It might also be bad pipe. About the time your house was built there was a brand of cast iron pipe called Tru-Spun. It started failing about 10-15 years after installation and was taken off the market.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Plumbus said:


> It might be sewer gas. It might also be bad pipe. About the time your house was built there was a brand of cast iron pipe called Tru-Spun. It started failing about 10-15 years after installation and was taken off the market.











Cast iron


Yesterdays job, cracked 3” cast iron toilet drain cut out and replaced. Also cracked 2” jetted tub drain.




www.plumbingzone.com


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

Debo22 said:


> Cast iron
> 
> 
> Yesterdays job, cracked 3” cast iron toilet drain cut out and replaced. Also cracked 2” jetted tub drain.
> ...


I saw that post yesterday and that’s not the pipe we have under this house, but cracking is similar.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

OpenSights said:


> I have a good friend that bought a house at the beginning of covid. They got to walk through once. Had to go off last buyer’s inspector’s info…… Guess what?
> 
> View attachment 132598
> 
> ...


What lies beneath.


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## goeswiththeflow (Feb 24, 2018)

> Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice. There are lots of track houses and modulars that meet code and are still garbage.


Right on. I always have to chuckle when I hear guys getting all high and mighty about something that does or does not meet code, in the context that the practice in question is somehow better or worse simply due to it's code compliance status. I like to point out that sharkbites and CPVC meet code, Qest did at one time, but ferncos do not.


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

skoronesa said:


> Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice.


A bathroom group (as pictured) with AAVs and no vents is, in my opinion, a good example of what you speak, Skoro.
Under my code (UPC), the PVC-DWV set up posted (right or wrong) would not meet code.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Plumbus said:


> It might be sewer gas. It might also be bad pipe. About the time your house was built there was a brand of cast iron pipe called Tru-Spun. It started failing about 10-15 years after installation and was taken off the market.



I remember tru spun.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

PhoenixRises said:


> The worst thing about all this is that there is a such shortage with homes in DFW area that people are buying them as is. This means they buy a house without inspection being done and can’t come after previous owner in case there is something major that needs repair. This homeowner bought this house last year and no inspection was done😱😱😱.



I was talking about this yesterday. Houses are on the market for 15 minutes in the Atlanta area, with no home inspections. Imagine squeezing every penny out of your budget and savings just to get a house and then the problems show up. There are going to be some hurting people in the next few years.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

dhal22 said:


> I was talking about this yesterday. Houses are on the market for 15 minutes in the Atlanta area, with no home inspections. Imagine squeezing every penny out of your budget and savings just to get a house and then the problems show up. There are going to be some hurting people in the next few years.


I got that all last summer people buying houses without inspections because of the shortage. Guess what I was the bearer of bad news of hack works, worse flips etc. and I got crapped on a lot. I don't have sympathy anymore I get mean comments all the time.


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## PhoenixRises (Jan 27, 2021)

Tango said:


> I got that all last summer people buying houses without inspections because of the shortage. Guess what I was the bearer of bad news of hack works, worse flips etc. and I got crapped on a lot. I don't have sympathy anymore I get mean comments all the time.


Longer I work in plumbing less and less I care about people. Sometimes you run into appreciative customers but a lot of them are douchebags.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

PhoenixRises said:


> Longer I work in plumbing less and less I care about people. Sometimes you run into appreciative customers but a lot of them are douchebags.


My experience with customers is the opposite of yours. I’d say 75% are awesome and appreciate me/refer me, 15% all business, no chitchat, 8% PITA, 2% with their number stored with DNA. Of that, 40% chatty Kathy’s and 20% old ladies who consider us family.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

PhoenixRises said:


> Longer I work in plumbing less and less I care about people. Sometimes you run into appreciative customers but a lot of them are douchebags.


I replaced a water heater this morning the wires were fried, told the guy to get an electrician, his wires were aluminum. After a bit I asked so did you get one? He said no I need to call an electrician? Dumba$$ ... Yeah you need to call an electrician if you want hot water this weekend and it's Friday so call everyone you can until someone says he can do it. As I was leaving he only called one and he said no. Not my problem, pay me bye bye.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

PhoenixRises said:


> Longer I work in plumbing less and less I care about people. Sometimes you run into appreciative customers but a lot of them are douchebags.


Yep,most are tried and true penisheads


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Tango said:


> I replaced a water heater this morning the wires were fried, told the guy to get an electrician, his wires were aluminum. After a bit I asked so did you get one? He said no I need to call an electrician? Dumba$$ ... Yeah you need to call an electrician if you want hot water this weekend and it's Friday so call everyone you can until someone says he can do it. As I was leaving he only called one and he said no. Not my problem, pay me bye bye.
> 
> 
> View attachment 132614


You don't hook the wires up on any water heater you replace???or was it just this one in particular???we always hook the wires back to the new water heater every time unless a major catastrophe has happened with the electric,question for ya tango,when you run across a older mobile home water heater that has 3500 watt elements in it,do you install a regular 4500 watt element heater in its place???most times the wire is to small unless you go back with a mobile home heater 3500 watt elements but as we all know mobile home water heaters are getting harder and harder to find these days


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## smoldrn (Oct 4, 2010)

skoronesa said:


> Code compliance is not the end all be all of best practice. Code is merely a starting point. Up to code does not equal best practice. There are lots of track houses and modulars that meet code and are still garbage.
> 
> You could just assume it was a bad run of cast iron, or you could look for reasons it all failed so quickly. Assuming the previous owners weren't making meth or dumping other odd chemicals down the drain with consistency, the evidence points to a build up of hydrogen sulfide condensing and making sulfuric acid.


Code minimum = Just enough to keep you out of jail🤣


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