# Caulk toilets to the floor?



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Strange as it may seem, Illinois code doesn't mandate this. Health Dep't inspectors can make you do it, but plumbing inspectors can't/don't. I do it on new industrial/commercial construction trims, if the customer wants it. But have never done it on residential. What about the rest of you?


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

jjbex said:


> Strange as it may seem, Illinois code doesn't mandate this. Health Dep't inspectors can make you do it, but plumbing inspectors can't/don't. I do it on new industrial/commercial construction trims, if the customer wants it. But have never done it on residential. What about the rest of you?


Health code supersedes plumbing code.

I never caulk toilets to the floor, I would rather people know they are leaking before it is too late and structural damage has already been done.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Code says we are to caulk them to floor, we will leave the back edge uncaulked so if the wax does fail it will be seen there.


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## 22rifle (Jun 14, 2008)

I believe the UPC requires it. I always caulk them to the floor but leave a small gap (3 to 4") in the caulk in the back so a leak can show up before it ruins a lot more.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Code says we are to caulk them to floor, we will leave the back edge uncaulked so if the wax does fail it will be seen there.


 I do the same thing Ron. Leave the back open. Lotsa folks "miss". Makes a stink under the pooper. I don't however, use caulking. I use anchoring cement. Mix some up and push it in under the bowl. Let it set a little and hit it with a sponge. It makes toilets VERY solid. If you need to take the bowl up. Undo the johnny bolts and pop it with your hands firmly and it comes right loose. Very easy to get the old cleaned off as it doesn't really super stick too the china or the floor.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

What if the floor is slightly pitched to the front of the toilet?


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## 22rifle (Jun 14, 2008)

Killertoiletspider said:


> What if the floor is slightly pitched to the front of the toilet?


If it's enough of a leak to do damage it should be enough to show up out the back too. That's my thought.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

The reason you caulk to the floor is to keep out water from getting under it, kids are notorious for this, and there is no way the remove the water that gets under it, once there, it's not that sanitary to leave toilets un-caulked, IMO


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Killertoiletspider said:


> What if the floor is slightly pitched to the front of the toilet?


The floor is always level, right
I'll make sure to have the concrete finisher slope it to the back:no:

Here's my stance. If I set a toilet with a wax ring and anchor cement it down. There is no way that seal will fail. Unless somebody goes kamikaze with the plunger. That toilet won't even think about winking. No movement = good seal. 

It's kind of a mute point on the wax. I've been using ultra-seals for about 10 years. No leaky.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Caulking is the sanitary seal which prevents water from getting under the water closet. If you leave the back uncaulked what are you going to do with the water which gets under there?

Mark


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Unless kids splash a few gallons of water on the floor and water so manages to get to the backside of the toilet, no water will get there, the chances are slim to none, now with a non caulked toilet sitting on the floor, there is high probability water will get there, via the sides or the front. Just the way I see it, I could be wrong.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Unless kids splash a few gallons of water on the floor and water so manages to get to the backside of the toilet, no water will get there, the chances are slim to none, now with a non caulked toilet sitting on the floor, there is high probability water will get there, via the sides or the front. Just the way I see it, I could be wrong.


I'm not too sure about that. I use to have better than 80% odds, leaks from upstairs to downstairs was from water splashed from a tub/shower.

Mark


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## service guy (Jun 26, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> Caulking is the sanitary seal which prevents water from getting under the water closet. If you leave the back uncaulked what are you going to do with the water which gets under there?
> 
> Mark


I agree.
IPC requires a full caulk joint all around the toilet.


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## GrumpyPlumber (Jun 12, 2008)

*We don't caulk.*
*I've heard arguments to both sides, our thinking is when the seal goes the leak stays hidden under the toilet until it appears on the ceiling below.*

*There are merits to both arguments, code makes the decision.*

*As for water seeping under an uncaulked toilet creating unsanitary stagnant moisture...it dries.*
*To the contrary*
*If a seal goes, the stagnant moisture in the case of a caulked toilet is worse.*

*From a mechanical perspective, it really sucks replacing a different shaped toilet when the old larger profile was caulked.*

*Not alotta fun scraping it off the tile & grout.*


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## threaderman (Jun 17, 2008)

Code says caulk,my inspector won't pass me if it's not,so I caulk.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

I never do it. I would like for the water to escape around the toilet and alert the HO that there is a problem. As a carpenter too I can say its a pain when I have to replace a bathroom floor.


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

ILplumber,
are these the same as the Fernco rubber seals? I use them whenever possible. Especially on wall hung toilets.

Jeff


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> I'm not too sure about that. I use to have better than 80% odds, leaks from upstairs to downstairs was from water splashed from a tub/shower.
> 
> Mark



Most of the leaks I find from up to down are from trim not caulked to surround, tub shoe drain lost it's seal, or overflow gasket shot, and sometimes shower arm loose in wall. Then there is tile walls no longer sealed and or surround not sealed at the seams.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> ILplumber,
> are these the same as the Fernco rubber seals? I use them whenever possible. Especially on wall hung toilets.
> 
> Jeff


They used to be made by Predco. I think fernco might have bought em out. They seal the bottom of the toilet to the inside of the the pipe. Takes the flange completely out of the equation.


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## Song Dog (Jun 12, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> They used to be made by Predco. I think fernco might have bought em out. They seal the bottom of the toilet to the inside of the the pipe. Takes the flange completely out of the equation.


I have never used one like that style, only wax. Maybe I am brain farting and can't answer it myself, but what happens when the floor is really out of kilter. EX: sloped floor to a CI flange. 
Do they seal good to CI or lead? The flange you use is interesting me. Always up for something new to try

In Christ,

Song Dog


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

The Ferncos are rubber. They work great on wallhungs and on new toilets. The wax residue on pulled toilets won't let the adhesive stick.


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

jjbex said:


> The Ferncos are rubber. They work great on wallhungs and on new toilets. The wax residue on pulled toilets won't let the adhesive stick.


Melt it with you torch.... wipes it clean. I like the Fernco rubbers as well:thumbup:


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Song Dog,
I have never attempted to use one on a lead drain. Not sure it would work too good. I've never had trouble on an unlevel floor. Riser pipe is plumb so the flange is level. The toilet gets shimmed level and then anchor cemented. Takes an unlevel floor out of the equation.


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> Song Dog,
> I have never attempted to use one on a lead drain. Not sure it would work too good. I've never had trouble on an unlevel floor. Riser pipe is plumb so the flange is level. The toilet gets shimmed level and then anchor cemented. Takes an unlevel floor out of the equation.


Probly not.... Lead arms are hardly ever even all the way around....


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## Song Dog (Jun 12, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> Song Dog,
> I have never attempted to use one on a lead drain. Not sure it would work too good. I've never had trouble on an unlevel floor. Riser pipe is plumb so the flange is level. The toilet gets shimmed level and then anchor cemented. Takes an unlevel floor out of the equation.


After I posted about the lead, I thought, it's never round:no: What was I think'n.
One of these days I will try one. 
Might be a dumb question, is anchor cement the same as hydo cement? I am thinking it is but don't know forsure. I always have hydro cement.

In Christ,

Song Dog


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Song Dog said:


> After I posted about the lead, I thought, it's never round:no: What was I think'n.
> One of these days I will try one.
> Might be a dumb question, is anchor cement the same as hydo cement? I am thinking it is but don't know forsure. I always have hydro cement.
> 
> ...


Anchor cement dries white and sets much slower than "aqua plug" It is normally used for anchoring threaded rod to masonary products I believe.

The stuff I use is made by the same company that makes Aqua plug. But, it is in a pail with red printing. Can't remember the manufacturer.


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Plumberman,
thanks for the torch info, I never heard that one before:thumbup:

Jeff


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

*Why caulk a toilet?*

I dont like to because if it leaks I want the HO to be able to see it. If you caulk it, you will never see it starting to leak untill major damage accures.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Why Even Set A Toilet, Whats Wrong With A 5 Gal Bucket?


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

I think its code in NYC , and On Long Island, That what I was always told....


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Why Even Set A Toilet, Whats Wrong With A 5 Gal Bucket?



hahaha , yea right , hell with the wax seal too.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Code requires it, so we leave back edge non-caulked.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

If Jr. or Dad has bad aim. Urine under the ****ter makes an unsanitary condition.

I use anchor cement and leave the back open.

Man! You boys are quick. I thought I was the first reply. Goes off to take typing class.........


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## service guy (Jun 26, 2008)

It is required by code in the IPC. We already have a long thread about this somewhere on PZ.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Its code in FL too, and in some counties, we have to fill our tub boxes with conrete after tubset inspections. Isn't that smart!!?


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Good points, especially with the bad aim, never crossed my mind. See, thats why we need each other!


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> If Jr. or Dad has bad aim. Urine under the ****ter makes an unsanitary condition.


That sentence is just funny , "under the ****ter"

We use that same phrase here :thumbup:


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## service guy (Jun 26, 2008)

http://www.plumbingzone.com/f2/caulk-toilets-floor-421/?highlight=caulk+toilet


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Damn, 9 responses in about 5 minutes!
What is everyone drinking tonight:laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> If Jr. or Dad has bad aim. Urine under the ****ter makes an unsanitary condition.
> 
> I use anchor cement and leave the back open.
> 
> Man! You boys are quick. I thought I was the first reply. Goes off to take typing class.........



Its all unsanitary when you pull a toilet, never seen a clean one. I don't get it. God forbid a plumber has to play in pee or poo.:laughing: Just bustin your chops.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

service guy said:


> http://www.plumbingzone.com/f2/caulk-toilets-floor-421/?highlight=caulk+toilet


Threads merged.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Bummer. Forgot to check first! ******* got things fired up!


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

Bill said:


> Bummer. Forgot to check first! ******* got things fired up!


oH HA!

blame it on me , sure sure


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Yeh, your fault *******!
BRB, need some more beer if we are going to do this!


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

Bill said:


> Yeh, your fault *******!
> BRB, need some more beer if we are going to do this!


Yea, let me gather up more heavy drugs :laughing::laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

I caulked some quarters to the floor one afternoon at the shop, it was funny watching the helpers trying to be slick and pick them up when no one was watching. took some effort, but the sob got it.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

:laughing:Betcha wont do that anymore huh


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

hehe, That rinds me of the time they told me to get the basement key


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

Start another thread about it *******, dont keep us in suspense!


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

yea, you could call it great work related pranks or somthing like that.


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## Plumboob (Dec 7, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> Song Dog,
> I have never attempted to use one on a lead drain. Not sure it would work too good. I've never had trouble on an unlevel floor. Riser pipe is plumb so the flange is level. The toilet gets shimmed level and then anchor cemented. Takes an unlevel floor out of the equation.


Works like a champ, i do this about once a week, i find allot of flanges broken off where the brass was at one time soldered to the lead. I keep tons of these and plastic shims. The key is have a short, snub sledge and beat the inside back to the origional circumfrance, then the flange will slide in nicely. Tighten it down so it's nice and tight, then screw it down with approved non corrosive screws and your all set.

On a side note my favorite response to "Why does it cost so much to replace that wax ring thingy"....my response which always gets a laugh and ends the conversation: " How much would i have to pay you to stick your head in a toilet?" LOL


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

Lets caulk this thread closed ...Mwhwhwhaaaa .......J/K


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## Kyle181 (Sep 5, 2008)

i always caulked toilets now my new boss says that caulk atracts bacteria?!?


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## Wethead (Oct 13, 2008)

Kyle181 said:


> i always caulked toilets now my new boss says that caulk atracts bacteria?!?


Yea, everything seems to be changing these days, I have no idea why either


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## justin (May 14, 2010)

*Caulk under toulet*

Am i the only person thst thinks caulk around fixtures looks like dog shiit? Just hate when some builders want it after we install fixtures. It takes the whole look of the cleanness away. If i was customer i would demand they scrape that crap up before they get a check. Oh well.,,,,,


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## TallCoolOne (Dec 19, 2010)

justin said:


> Am i the only person thst thinks caulk around fixtures looks like dog shiit? Just hate when some builders want it after we install fixtures. It takes the whole look of the cleanness away. If i was customer i would demand they scrape that crap up before they get a check. Oh well.,,,,,


I agree 100%


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

justin said:


> Am i the only person thst thinks caulk around fixtures looks like dog shiit?


I guess that would depend on your caulking ability...


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

Redwood said:


> I guess that would depend on your caulking ability...


So true, when your really good it can cause others to have caulk envy. :laughing:


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

But it's code.


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## 1bddelx (Aug 18, 2012)

Just play with your caulk and you will get good at putting it in the crack:whistling2:


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## 1bddelx (Aug 18, 2012)

SlickRick said:


> But it's code.


 
Yep


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## agonzales1981 (Mar 30, 2012)

Redwood said:


> I guess that would depend on your caulking ability...


X2 a good caulk job looks so much better than nothing


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## mccmech (Jul 6, 2011)

Caulking of fixtures to surface is code-required in New Jersey. My personal preference is Phoenoseal. A damp sponge will make ya look like an artist by the time you get that pencil thin joint. Good Stuff!:thumbup:


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## bizzybeeplumbin (Jul 19, 2011)

I caulk every fixture, especially the toilet. it looks better and is sanitary. I have pulled many toilets with piss stains and other nasty sludge under the bowl. On top of that anyone who has a son potty training knos how important caulking around a toilet bowl is. :laughing:


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## patrick88 (Oct 14, 2008)

1bddelx said:


> Just play with your caulk and you will get good at putting it in the crack:whistling2:


Agreed. 

I like how it looks but if the wax leeks. The caulk hides it. Then instead of just a leak the floor rots too. 
For example I went to a house that had fat friends over. Well they shook the toilet off the flange. If the toilet bowl was caulked they might not have noticed the leak right away.


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

1bddelx said:


> Just play with your caulk and you will get good at putting it in the crack:whistling2:


Be careful with that, you may go blind.:yes:


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

patrick88 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> I like how it looks but if the wax leeks. The caulk hides it. Then instead of just a leak the floor rots too.
> For example I went to a house that had fat friends over. Well they shook the toilet off the flange. If the toilet bowl was caulked they might not have noticed the leak right away.


 
OTOH if the commode was caulked the overweight people may have not broken the flange.


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## Fullmetal Frank (Jul 11, 2012)

I use adhesive grout, small gap in the back.


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

When I use caulk around a commode, I only go from bolt to bolt, leaving the back of the commode uncaulked so water can seep out if the seal goes bad.


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## patrick88 (Oct 14, 2008)

easttexasplumb said:


> OTOH if the commode was caulked the overweight people may have not broken the flange.


Interesting. They broke two dining room chair and the toilet. I almost did the work for free just cause the story was funny.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Grout is the way to go, in my humble opinion. My code states that 'fixtures shall be sealed to the surface on which set.' So the plumber can choose the means he wants to use.

I prefer grout over caulk any day.


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## bhawk4747 (Mar 1, 2012)

Tommy plumber said:


> Grout is the way to go, in my humble opinion. My code states that 'fixtures shall be sealed to the surface on which set.' So the plumber can choose the means he wants to use.
> 
> I prefer grout over caulk any day.


So how do u remove the toilet later for reseating if sealed with grout? If I see grout around and have to reseat I tell customer I'm not responsible for damage to toilet. Just use clear silacone and leave back open


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