# When even a cable...



## U&I Plumber (Feb 15, 2009)

can't get the job done.

I got a call this morning about a shower drain that plugs every 3 months without fail, after chemicals or roto rooter 3 months and it plugs up.

I ask the owner the age of the house, 45 years he says, at this point I tell him 3 hours max including the 30 foot crawl, and I can guarantee the fix, no more plugs. I already know what I'm gonna find.:blink:

I load up a small box of fgts and under the house I go and crawl till I find this...



















Whomever did the remodel went the lazy road and halfazzed the job, thats a 2" X 1 1/2" fernco going the wrong way, in talking to the owner they had emphasized that the job be done right, this was done 5 years ago.

This is what I left behind me as I headed for the crawl space hatch...


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Nice job, but did the hackjob on that joist bring a tear to your eye? I woulda thought that even the assclowns who were there 5 years ago had sawzalls.


----------



## para1 (Jun 17, 2008)

i THOUGHT YOU SAID THE ho WANTED THE JOB DONE RIGHT?

JUST KIDDIN, NICE JOB....THANKS FOR THE PICS.


----------



## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

Is that a 3" x 2" fernco over the 2" cI hub? the 2" pipe should had either removed and the 2" abs installed into the hub with titeseal or left enough steel 2" to use a no hub band. the putting a fernco over the hub like that wouldn't fly here.


----------



## U&I Plumber (Feb 15, 2009)

Plumber Jim said:


> Is that a 3" x 2" fernco over the 2" cI hub? the 2" pipe should had either removed and the 2" abs installed into the hub with titeseal or left enough steel 2" to use a no hub band. the putting a fernco over the hub like that wouldn't fly here.


There was no 2" steel? galvanized to tie into to, the original drain was 1 1/2" galvanized leadded into the 2" cast, I could have just as well ran a snake thru the vent and cleared the problem for a couple years as the junction of the san-t and vent was plugged solid, but I fixed it, I probably should have just re-plumbed the house, especially in these tight economic times I'm sure the owner would have appreciated it.


----------



## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Plumber Jim said:


> Is that a 3" x 2" fernco over the 2" cI hub? the 2" pipe should had either removed and the 2" abs installed into the hub with titeseal or left enough steel 2" to use a no hub band. the putting a fernco over the hub like that wouldn't fly here.


 

I would of taken it even a step further than that, and that would be to cut the hub off that wye and mission coupling a 2" street 45 and run towards the 90. 

You can do that on that 2" by 3" wye but you have to use a diamond blade angle grinder to cut immediately behind the hub, then clean the casting marks off smooth so a mission no hub seals. If in doubt, contact cement the both the inside of the mission coupling AND the area to connect to the cast; it won't leak. 


That set up will work, and given it was in a crawl space, it will fly. As much as I dislike ferncos above ground, until you're in that boat, it's the difference of minor repair to major. My diamond blade makes me legal though almost 90% of the time. I see 2" hub close up all the time because two different metals are not agreeing with each other, thus the reason it happens.

I've cut many hubs off of cast iron fittings to make my transitions work. A 4" diamond blade angle grinder is the only solution to that kind of work.


----------



## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

OK, 1 1/2" then. same deal just 1 1/2" then you run 1 1/2" into the hub or tie with the 1 1/2" galvanized. and if the drain had to be resized you could snap out the wye and redo. but to hookup to the hub like that ick. sorry.

P.S. you can remove the 1 1/2" pipe from the 2" hub and clean the lead out pretty easy and put in 2" pipe it's pretty easy, I do it all the time.


----------



## U&I Plumber (Feb 15, 2009)

In all honesty, I did pull the lead from the joint and the 2" abs is bottomed out in the back of the hub, you don't actually think that I put that fernco on to hide an 1 1/2" stub of pipe do you ?

Not sure what your looking at but the shower drain is now 2" all the way into the cast.

You may want to study the previous pics a little closer to actually recognize what your looking at.


----------



## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

Hey, sorry to tick you off i was just giving my opinion, not trying to tick you off. I understand what I am looking at. The correct way to hook that up isn't using that fernco over a hub is all I am saying. they make a rubber seal that is used kinda looks like a donut. The tite seal goes back instead of the lead. works just like the lead did, that way water can't back into that hub and sit in there and just rott the hub out.


Plumber Jim

Here is a link of the one fernco makes. I think you can even get it the depot.

http://www.usahardware.com/inet/shop/item/81660/icn/20-984849/fernco_inc/p22u205.htm


----------



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

That is some beautiful insulation work!


----------



## U&I Plumber (Feb 15, 2009)

Maybe I am being a dick about this:yes:, but I am not seeing how a lead joint made up with oakum keeps water out of and away from the cast iron hub on that 1/8 bend or any connection for that matter. I have taken literally hundreds of lead joints apart and every one that was currently in use was wet in the hubs, just my observation.

There is now way that the oakum could be packed in such a way as to be water tight, if it could there would be no reason for the lead to finish off the connection.

As far as my attitude your first post read like you were drunk, sorry, my bad. But I did order 2 each of the tite seal gaskets 2" - 4" as I do see the advantage of a more secure connection.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

I thought what made the oakum water tight was the fact that water makes it swell and that is what seals the joint. The lead just keeps the oakum in place, so it doesn't swell out of the hub.


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

jjbex said:


> I thought what made the oakum water tight was the fact that water makes it swell and that is what seals the joint. The lead just keeps the oakum in place, so it doesn't swell out of the hub.


I believe that is correct Jeff


----------



## U&I Plumber (Feb 15, 2009)

And 40 years later there is still water in every hub I have ever disassembled, only thing keeping the joints from being gushers is the lead.


----------



## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

U&I Plumber said:


> Maybe I am being a dick about this:yes:, but I am not seeing how a lead joint made up with oakum keeps water out of and away from the cast iron hub on that 1/8 bend or any connection for that matter. I have taken literally hundreds of lead joints apart and every one that was currently in use was wet in the hubs, just my observation.
> 
> There is now way that the oakum could be packed in such a way as to be water tight, if it could there would be no reason for the lead to finish off the connection.
> 
> As far as my attitude your first post read like you were drunk, sorry, my bad. But I did order 2 each of the tite seal gaskets 2" - 4" as I do see the advantage of a more secure connection.


I'm not sure why you think my first post sounded like I was drunk. I was just stating that a fernco slapped over a hub like that looks very bad and isn't the right way to do it. anyone else here disagree? What do you other guys think?


----------



## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

I agree, a fernco used like that is wrong. But just like the first plumber 5 years ago, it's under the house, who's going to see it? lol


----------



## super plumber (Oct 19, 2008)

i'm not a fan of ferncos either. i would have cut off hub and used no-hub coupling...just my 2 cents worth


----------



## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Roast Duck said:


> I would of taken it even a step further than that, and that would be to cut the hub off that wye and mission coupling a 2" street 45 and run towards the 90.
> 
> You can do that on that 2" by 3" wye but you have to use a diamond blade angle grinder to cut immediately behind the hub, then clean the casting marks off smooth so a mission no hub seals. If in doubt, contact cement the both the inside of the mission coupling AND the area to connect to the cast; it won't leak.
> 
> ...


 I was at the supply the other day and another plumber said he uses titanium sawzall blades to cut cast iron. Anyone else try this?


----------



## Plumber Jim (Jun 19, 2008)

I have used them a couple times and it worked pretty good. the blade is junk when you are finished but it worked. I use my soil pipe cutters when i can though.


Plumber Jim


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Hand-held bandsaw is sweet for cutting cast. Just like butta:thumbup:


----------

