# Plumbing Career Damage



## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Having a great deal of trouble with my hands as of late...praying it's just a passing issue.

Cortisone sounds really good right now.....not talking the cream either. I need that **** shot right into about 9 fingers right now.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

Sounds like ya got a bit O arthritis old man. It ain't easy gettin old


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

nhmaster3015 said:


> Sounds like ya got a bit O arthritis old man. It ain't easy gettin old


Or Carpal Tunnel ...


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Excess weight,poor diet and smoking WILL make any medical problems you have WORSE and will AGE you....as will not getting proper sleep. Listen to your body it might be trying to tell you somthing.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

You left off one item on your poll. The mind. My back is bad but not from work, it was messed up when I was broadsided in my van and it flipped end over end.


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## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Every one but feet, neck, and eyes.


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## tungsten plumb (Apr 15, 2010)

My knees and back are messed up but not from plumbing. I played football too many years. Add the fact I have extremely flat feet and I am pretty much screwed. And plumbing isn't helping lol


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

No problems here. :thumbsup:


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

I am approaching mid 30's and have shoulder and knee discomfort at times. I know the shoulder is tendinitis, that is what Doctor said. Knees, are inevitable, due to the way I have treated them. Knees make crunchy sound when climbing stairs, or bending them.


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## tnoisaw (Jun 16, 2009)

I use to have a lot of ankle problems but six screws and an ankle fussion took care of that.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Indie said:


> I am approaching mid 30's and have shoulder and knee discomfort at times. I know the shoulder is tendinitis, that is what Doctor said. Knees, are inevitable, due to the way I have treated them. Knees make crunchy sound when climbing stairs, or bending them.


 I see there is someone that feels like I do, except I'm about 15yrs older. You will be in trouble when you hit 50. May be time to become an inspector:laughing:. Heck sometimes, I have so many aches & pains, that I think even my hair hurts. Some days I just wonder how much longer I can do this physical stuff. And, I have no desire to take on more work load, & I'm too grumpy anyway, to hire a full time helper.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

*Plumbing career damage*

Just missed three days due to a bad back. Had back surgery in 2007 and that was caused by bi-lateral hip replacements in 2004. Part of the territory working long hours in cold temps and not giving my body consideration.Soon I could be the bionic plumber.

I would not give up plumbing and have been in involved with plumbing since I was 14. I love this job and type work and too stupid to move to something easier.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

I got an infection in my left arm right now...either came from an open would (burn) or the dry skin of the elbow.

Whole arm tightened up 2 days ago, starting taking cipro and amoxicillin. Took my last pill today praying it clears it up. Can't stop working and the show must go on!


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Why not take a day off? You have such a successful business you should be able to take a small hit like taking a few days off of work.

Right?

Unfortunately, us flat-rate "service techs" aren’t doing so well. We can't afford to take any time off because we've lost so many customers due to our un-fair pricing and salesman like tactics.

:whistling2:



DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> I got an infection in my left arm right now...either came from an open would (burn) or the dry skin of the elbow.
> 
> Whole arm tightened up 2 days ago, starting taking cipro and amoxicillin. Took my last pill today praying it clears it up. Can't stop working and the show must go on!


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Protech said:


> Why not take a day off? You have such a successful business you should be able to take a small hit like taking a few days off of work.
> 
> Right?
> 
> ...


 
I don't remember this thread topic being about flat rate against hourly, but I've seen you here during the day a lot more lately.


Anyway, 

I run 3 successful companies at this point and even though my infection almost became blood poisoning over the span of 24 hours at the time (reached the shoulder, heading towards the heart) I found 2 cipro, 2 amoxicillin and then a good friend gave me an old script of antibiotics.


I then had over 130 park benches rented at 3 events this weekend, provided misting equipment for the tristate's largest 4th of July event with an attendance of 60,000 people sunday,


where I was suffering from a raging infection crawling up my left arm, open wounds on my right arm, a right hand I can barely use at this point and got hit with heat exhaustion, bad on sunday. People cannot expect me to stand in front of my own equipment when they're paying me for it...that's not right.

There's no days off in my world, I work 7 days a week every week and my vacation is the pure excitement of moving forward in business. Save the blue water for the toilet bowl, 


I don't need it.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

And now I'm heading to replace a water heater in the middle of the night.


5 Hour Energy is my new power source.


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## rex (Jun 13, 2008)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> And now I'm heading to replace a water heater in the middle of the night.
> 
> 
> 5 Hour Energy is my new power source.


 

plumbed the place that makes 5 hour got a lifetime supply....


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

rex said:


> plumbed the place that makes 5 hour got a lifetime supply....


 
I know you got a price! COMON MAN!!!! ANTI UP THE GOOD ****!!!! 


It's my new chosen venom for being a raging workaholic.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

DUn ,,, I had MERSA in 2006 ,,, almost lost my leg to it . Don't play too much . The Doc saved my leg / career / life with HEAVY DUTY inter venous antibiotics . Good as new !!

Oh ,,, for the poll .... Lost ACL in right knee in 1992 . So that one hurts sometimes . Everything -- A+ !

GO TO THE GYM !!!


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

My point was that there is something wrong when you can't stop working when you have an illness that is a very real threat to life and limb.

I like making money too, but if I had a serious infection like that I would take some time off to recover. There is plenty of money out there and none of it is worth my health.

You only get 1 life to live. I get the impression that you don’t ever take time off. If you are amassing a huge mound of wealth so that you can soon retire (5-10 years) then I could see going on an all out assault. If you are just getting by working that hard then your business model may not be a sustainable one. Only you know just how profitable you are. If your margins are better than 20% then I would agree that you should turn and burn. If they aren’t, then you are just burying yourself.

I myself enjoy being profitable and still being able to stop and smell the roses; But to each his own.

Just my .02



DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> I don't remember this thread topic being about flat rate against hourly, but I've seen you here during the day a lot more lately.
> 
> 
> Anyway,
> ...


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Protech said:


> My point was that there is something wrong when you can't stop working when you have an illness that is a very real threat to life and limb.
> 
> I like making money too, but if I had a serious infection like that I would take some time off to recover. There is plenty of money out there and none of it is worth my health.
> 
> ...


 Health is wealth. 
Most workahalics, don't even know, or comprehend a different life exists out there. If someone can't wait a few more hours, for a new water heater, then they can call Dunbar, I don't care. I have a life & family, & want to enjoy it while I have good health, & energy. And I still have plenty enough money for mine & my family's needs.
Dunbar will just be able to afford all those medications easier, & maybe buy some fancier pill boxes too:laughing:, if he survives till retirement.
Nothing against Dunbar, & if he enjoys that life, more power to him. But I know quite a few workaholics, & their lives are not that rosy at home, so they work all the time, to avoid the home life. IMO they never slow down enough to evaluate their life. They just look the other way, avoid the real issues, & keep running off to another job at 5am, or at the slightest success of 1 business they start another, & so on.
Reminds me of a joke. Guy goes to the doctor & says, Doc., I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't boat, & I don't hunt, so how long do you think I will live? The Doctor says, live for what?:whistling2:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

*Thanks for all the Dr. Phil Analysis's*

But in my camp? 

It's all about one thing: 


Plumbing is not a challenge to me anymore. I don't have to do plumbing in different areas of the trade to say I've mastered it. I already know I've tackled the residential service side of the equation, and in my opinion...is one of the easiest aspects of plumbing as a whole. So when you have that attitude, it's not challenging anymore, it's just a utility to something else I want, and it sure in the hell isn't going to be no plumbing hero. 

I've emerged from that design completely by branching out. Unusual for a plumbing company to dart the direction I have. 

I was under contract for 2 events last weekend, meaning I was paid to perform and was paid very well. Paid out a lot in wages to 2 guys over the past couple weeks, less mistakes happen when I'm in the big picture and I'm the guy who can be level headed and not panic when the **** hits the fan. 

I say that because we had a few mechanical failures between 3 pieces of equipment and all was corrected. 

Since you want to include my personal life for demonstration...

I'm a single guy, and I'm on borrowed time. The body is failing and my time is *NOW*. Me taking off work would be selfish to those I owe money to (investors) and the quicker I get out under their thumb the better. 

Festival season is fast and furious. When I pull 100% in revenues the money I make in the summer season will afford the 12 months of bills any business creates. It's a beautiful thing now that it's in the minds of many thanks to my hardcore attitude and determination. 

My presence tonight got a request for double the equipment for 2011's event, and a tower mister that I haven't even built that will be the answer to direct heat in large parking lots. Should I stay in bed, go to a movie? Not here.

My time for not working is when I'm sleeping. I listen to no one in my business model and that's how I got this far. Pretty good, assuming I've paid off one biz (plumbing) and now I'm chipping away at number 3. #2 is paid off and out of the hole!!! 



True workaholics delve into their work because they love it. 

I love reflecting back just 6 months watching how much I've created, and that I don't have to cross that bridge twice. 

Those of you who understand the entreprenurial dream will find these words as spirited, and that you go with what you know is a dream. 


My vacation comes when I can go forward with business #4 and #5... 2 companies that I can latch right onto what I have going already, and they'll do very well, quickly given I've created so many working relationships.

^^^^

There's my next thread topic for sure.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> But in my camp?
> 
> It's all about one thing:
> 
> ...


 Your single?......... What a surprise!!!!
I'm surprised you lower yourself, to talk to all of us, who supposedly aren't as intelligent as you, & just keep plumbing away, because we haven't mastered it yet, & may still find it challenging.
But if you feel the need, keep bragging away.

This is Dr. Phil, over & out.................... Hey maybe I could start another business here, hmmmmm.:whistling2:


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Sometimes I wish I were a workaholic, but I'm not. I am still trying to master the work less, make more approach. Maybe that is why I am still in one piece? Money is just money, it comes and goes.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Don The Plumber said:


> Your single?......... What a surprise!!!!
> I'm surprised you lower yourself, to talk to all of us, who supposedly aren't as intelligent as you, & just keep plumbing away, because we haven't mastered it yet, & may still find it challenging.
> But if you feel the need, keep bragging away.
> 
> This is Dr. Phil, over & out.................... Hey maybe I could start another business here, hmmmmm.:whistling2:


 
If you're a family man,


why do you spend so much time on this forum? 


Do you know...that if I had a wife, kids...I would be a memory on these forums. I know the priorities. 

Something to consider to a great many of you...because I'm sure the wife and kids would rather you spend it with them than sitting in front of computer. 

Right? Right. 

The paragraph above wasn't bragging, it was explaining. No one wants to be in my exact position right now, trust me. It's very difficult. It's an education with real time value.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

slickrick said:


> Sometimes I wish I were a workaholic, but I'm not. I am still trying to master the work less, make more approach. Maybe that is why I am still in one piece? Money is just money, it comes and goes.


 
Money affords existence, possibility, options, comforts.

Where I need to be isn't going to work with how limited the plumbing profession provides, and I'm not about to hire 10 plumbers and grow just to make money.

Hiring plumbers is difficult, and I'm not coming on here to tell stories of how I got a bad plumber and cost me thousands in waste. 

Working more hours/taking on more work is the only method to gain more coin, shut down the next week and guess what; all your customer base disappears instantly and you have zero value in a business.

Every time I see a plumbing business go out, I'm looking at a mirror at what that possibility truly is, and that is one thing: 

No pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Just a spent physical body (see the poll) and a good hard luck story for the internet. I flat refuse to be in that equation.


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Money affords existence, possibility, options, comforts.
> 
> Where I need to be isn't going to work with how limited the plumbing profession provides, and I'm not about to hire 10 plumbers and grow just to make money.
> 
> ...


I understand where your coming from. I am on the lookout for ways to diversify myself. There is no pot of gold in plumbing, just a means to finance other options. I really don't want to do plumbing forever.


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## brass plumbing (Jul 30, 2008)

Sounds like a sad state. Do you live like Scrooge 24/7? having everything & noone to share it with
your customer service must leave alot to be desired.


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## lpayne1234 (Sep 20, 2008)

tnoisaw said:


> I use to have a lot of ankle problems but six screws and an ankle fussion took care of that.


 
My ankles and knees are the worst parts, and of those 2 the ankles, man I could use some relief, especially if I work off a 6-8 foot ladder all day for a couple days. :no:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

brass plumbing said:


> Sounds like a sad state. Do you live like Scrooge 24/7? having everything & noone to share it with
> your customer service must leave alot to be desired.


 
Number of men happy in their marriage and do not lust over other women:



*ZERO*

*NONE
*
*NOTTA*

*ZIP*

*Have too many friends, work acquaintances that live in HORROR! of a bad ongoing, never ending marriage because of finances and children...*

*couldn't get excited about their wife if you was a gallon of blood in the right spot...*

*nope! *

*regret regret regret.*

*Now why in the hell would you want me to follow that? Comon man! I know it's bad in Michigan but COMON!!! *


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

I notice my hands hurt abit, I had tendonitis when I was a second, anti-inflammatories fixed that, they hurt abit but we will see if it gets worse.


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## retired rooter (Dec 31, 2008)

Once I had a several truck plumbing business but I was stupid and couldnt let the other trucks keep me going, so I kept working in my truck until my back gave in. Doc said to retire,I was ok had some good rentals other investments ,so I hung it up.After 3 yrs I couldnt stand it so I came back as very small 1 truck repair and drain cleaning business .Things are better than ever, I make time for grandaughter and fishing and riding my bike work a few days a week and take care of my back and family never been happier.Just turned 60 and have the carpel tunnel sugery and elbow sugery but not on my back until I am crawling Once or twice a yr I get put under and pain doc does some kind of block in my back and keep going,! slow down Dunbar I wish I had back in my 30s.


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## Herk (Jun 12, 2008)

Steve, an entrepreneur is a person who uses businesses as springboards to create other businesses. But he doesn't do the work. All my life, I've actually gotten sick whenever I pushed myself. 

And I have had a lot of problems, but they often correct themselves, or I do something to correct them. I had a lot of pain in my hands, for example, as if my thumbs were dislocated. But I've been noticing lately that they aren't really bad anymore. Right now, my worst pain is in the ligaments/tendons above my knees. I run up and down a lot of stairs and can't seem to remind myself that I no longer really NEED to take them two at a time.

It's not hard to strain my back. My throat rebels at the first hint of dust/fumes/smoke. But I'm doing pretty good. I don't push it - I take time off when I don't get it naturally for lack of calls. But then, I'm soon to be 62 and I really need to be able to keep going since I don't have something else to fall back on.

But I know better than to force myself to work when I have serious physical problems. Things start going really bad when you try working when you know you shouldn't - not only because you are not 100% mentally, but because you're doing more damage to yourself.

I'm really sorry to hear that you're doing poorly, but wish you'd take a little better care of yourself. If you don't, who will?


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

everything but neck eyes and back. Not work related but boy does work make the pain worse.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Herk said:


> Steve, an entrepreneur is a person who uses businesses as springboards to create other businesses. But he doesn't do the work. All my life, I've actually gotten sick whenever I pushed myself.
> 
> And I have had a lot of problems, but they often correct themselves, or I do something to correct them. I had a lot of pain in my hands, for example, as if my thumbs were dislocated. But I've been noticing lately that they aren't really bad anymore. Right now, my worst pain is in the ligaments/tendons above my knees. I run up and down a lot of stairs and can't seem to remind myself that I no longer really NEED to take them two at a time.
> 
> ...


 
I'm an entrepreneur that's slowly dissolving the "hands on" as it's just becoming ignorant to do the physical side of these businesses. Plumbing biz started the park bench biz, misting fan biz, now there's 2 more waiting for the last two to reach year 4, then all of them can operate off each other's work relationships.

These other 2 businesses are 2.5 years old right now and they are becoming profitable this year. Next year *year 3* will be our time to shine.

It should be young kids, carnies doing the work but everything we do right now is critical, meaning it must "count" and be right, with no error. 

We had a tremendous showing this past weekend, and this coming weekend puts us in another 2 events with all equipment.

Finding reliable help is hard in the carnie biz, really is. Very sporatic work and it's a hustle when the show is over.

I'm best served being an invisible component to this fan biz because it doesn't matter if it is 70 degrees...I'm always sweating...and it don't look right when I own a misting fan company. :laughing:

I ran service calls all day, only thing bothering me (just from running copper) is my 2 index fingers on both hands. 


My health issues started when I was a kid. Grew a foot in four years in high school and that's where all the muscular-skeletal issues came into play. Fas-grow like wood. 

But it would be ignorant of me to think I won't be wheelchair bound someday...

Actually it'll be motorized so I don't think I'll be too surprised when it happens. Lithium batteries, 10 hours drive time? I'm in it for the sticker in the window for all that close parking. YES!!!


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## affordabledrain (Nov 24, 2009)

slow down dude. You don't want to be all washed up at 45.
what would be the point of having very profitable companies. If you are not worth a damn health-wise to enjoy the fruits of all the crap you went thru to get them there?


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Cut out all potatoes...so far no matter what it is. Trying to pull away from horrible bread, pasta.

It's a process. Been taking women's vitamins and drinking some vitaminized water. 


Going to be dating again so I need to blow the cobwebs out before I take it down the runway. 

It's going to be a blast...and I should start a picture/video website of how much fun I'm about to have. All you married folk will be like deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaamm look at that! 

OMG, he didn't.

OMG HE DID! That is just, that is horrible! How did that fit, 

and did that go in...

and how come that's red...

why is she- WOW!!!


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Right now it my f***ing elbow/arm, I stopped taking the meds the were giving me a bad side effect. Not sure what I voted on.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Ron said:


> Right now it my f***ing elbow/arm, I stopped taking the meds the were giving me a bad side effect. Not sure what I voted on.


 
what a bad side effect from the percocet?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Constipation, just now getting past that, eating fiber foods right not, trying to clean my system out.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

oh yeah that happens. sometimes ill go 4 - 5 days without going. but when i do im sure glad i put a pressure assisted toilet in.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

house plumber said:


> oh yeah that happens. sometimes ill go 4 - 5 days without going. but when i do im sure glad i put a pressure assisted toilet in.


Not going and not able to pass gas the worst feeling compared to the pain I deal with in my arm, thought I was going to explode last night. It started with bad case of heart burn and progressed to the abdomen, then the pain kicked in. been 4 weeks since the injury, I'm sick of this injury right now, I can't do crap about it but let time roll on.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Ron said:


> Not going and not able to pass gas the worst feeling compared to the pain I deal with in my arm, thought I was going to explode last night. It started with bad case of heart burn and progressed to the abdomen, then the pain kicked in. been 4 weeks since the injury, I'm sick of this injury right now, I can't do crap about it but let time roll on.


yeah i know it sucks for you. but on the bright side, at least yours will eventually go away with no problems. i have mine for the rest of my life and it can only get worse.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

HP what are you doing up at 2AM in the morning. :laughing: If your worried about the hurricane it is not going to hit you. :laughing:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Ron said:


> HP what are you doing up at 2AM in the morning. :laughing: If your worried about the hurricane it is not going to hit you. :laughing:


 
you never know. :laughing: cuz i dont sleep well.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

I figger the day I wake up and something don't hurt will probably be my last :thumbsup:

God bless the guy that invented Vicoden


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I figger the day I wake up and something don't hurt will probably be my last :thumbsup:
> 
> God bless the guy that invented Vicoden


Vicoden will make you have a bad attitude when it starts to wear off. Be aware of that. :thumbsup:


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

Bad attitde? Me? :whistling2:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Not me it doesn't





TheMaster said:


> Vicoden will make you have a bad attitude when it starts to wear off. Be aware of that. :thumbsup:


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> Not me it doesn't


Quit taking it for a few days and see what kind of attitude you have. Most that take it and try to stop claim the pain is too hard to handle.....I propose that is from withdrawing from the dope....not real pain. If you constantly are numbing pain your body becomes super sensitive to any pain when you quit taking the pills.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

I do. There are days i don't take pain killers. I have gone over 2 weeks recently without taking them. Then i had a flare which was unrelated to the pills. But everyone is different. Im not saying just cuz it happened to me that it will for everyone else. I know it doesn't work like that. 






TheMaster said:


> Quit taking it for a few days and see what kind of attitude you have. Most that take it and try to stop claim the pain is too hard to handle.....I propose that is from withdrawing from the dope....not real pain. If you constantly are numbing pain your body becomes super sensitive to any pain when you quit taking the pills.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> I do. There are days i don't take pain killers. I have gone over 2 weeks recently without taking them. Then i had a flare which was unrelated to the pills. But everyone is different. Im not saying just cuz it happened to me that it will for everyone else. I know it doesn't work like that.


What do you use to substitute for not taking the painkillers? Your the only person that I have ever heard of that can take several opiates a day for months or years and not become physically addicted to to them.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

I use nothing. People that suffer from chronic pain are less likely to be addicted to pain killers than someone who takes them for a short time. As long as you take what you're supposed to take you should be fine. 





TheMaster said:


> What do you use to substitute for not taking the painkillers? Your the only person that I have ever heard of that can take several opiates a day for months or years and not become physically addicted to to them.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> I use nothing. People that suffer from chronic pain are less likely to be addicted to pain killers than someone who takes them for a short time. As long as you take what you're supposed to take you should be fine.


I have always been told no matter what the reason you take opiates,you will become physically addicted to the drug if you take them long enough. Just like a baby thats born from a drug addicted mother.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Nope not true







TheMaster said:


> I have always been told no matter what the reason you take opiates,you will become physically addicted to the drug if you take them long enough. Just like a baby thats born from a drug addicted mother.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> Nope not true


So your saying that if you have pain theres a physical response to that pain that prevents you from becoming addicted to opiates if you take 3 a day for years? Who told you that?


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

this is right from the national pain foundations website. 


*Myth * – *People who use opioids are likely to become addicted
Fact * – *Most people who are treated with opioids do not become addicted*
Addiction is a psychological and behavioral disorder. Addiction is characterized by the presence of all three of the following traits:



loss of control (ie, compulsive use),
continuation despite adverse consequences, and
obsession or preoccupation with obtaining and using the substance.
As an addiction advances, the person's life becomes progressively more constricted. The addiction becomes the addict's number one priority, and relationships with family and friends suffer. The addict's inner life becomes filled with preoccupation about the drug. Other activities are given up. Life revolves around obtaining and using the drug. This constriction is an important characteristic that distinguishes use of a drug by an addict from its appropriate use by a patient with chronic pain. Patients who take opioids for chronic pain hopefully _*expand *_their life, the opposite of what happens with addicts. Pain patients feel better and are able to increase their activities. They may begin gardening, going to movies, playing with children and grandchildren, and many are able to return to work.

A patient who is addicted to drugs may keep increasing the dose without discussing it with the doctor, might repeatedly use up the medications early, go to several physicians for opioids and lie about seeing other doctors, might inject their oral or topical drugs, or sell drugs to get money with which to buy other drugs. These behaviors are not typical of most pain patients.

Most pain patients taking opioids are not addicted to drugs. What is true of them is that they usually become _*physically dependent*_ on the drug. Physical dependence has nothing to do with addiction. It simply means that a habituated user will experience certain symptoms if the drug is stopped abruptly. For opioids these withdrawal symptoms can include: anxiety, irritability, goose bumps, drooling, watery eyes, runny nose, sweating, nausea and vomiting, abdominal cramps, and insomnia. Withdrawal from morphine starts six to 12 hours after stopping the medication and peaks at one to three days. Longer-acting opioids, such as methadone, have a slower onset of these symptoms, and they are less severe than with shorter-acting drugs such as morphine and hydromorphone. _*Withdrawal symptoms*_ can be avoided simply by tapering the drug dose over several days.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Here is what I found......
*Abusing Vicodin: An Overview*


*Vicodin*® (*hydrocodone/APAP*) is a prescription pain medication. As a narcotic, it is a highly desired drug of abuse. However, it is important to distinguish between true abuse of Vicodin and a simple physical dependence on the drug, which will occur with any long-term use of Vicodin, legitimate or not.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

I consider dependency the same as addiction. just a nicer way of saying it.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

like i said everyone is different. like drugs for my disease, i have been on EVERY and i really mean EVERY drug there is for it. i have either failed them or had a reaction to it. i am only like 4 out of all my dr's paitence that has had nothing help either. i just got a refill on my vicoden yesterday. i get 120 of 7.5/750 a month. thats 4 a day. my last refill was on july 26. i still have 43 pills from that refill left over. i have never gone through any kind of withdrawl.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> like i said everyone is different. like drugs for my disease, i have been on EVERY and i really mean EVERY drug there is for it. i have either failed them or had a reaction to it. i am only like 4 out of all my dr's paitence that has had nothing help either. i just got a refill on my vicoden yesterday. i get 120 of 7.5/750 a month. thats 4 a day. my last refill was on july 26. i still have 43 pills from that refill left over. i have never gone through any kind of withdrawl.


Your one of the exceptions.....hey speaking of exceptions....I met a guy in vegas that ate 20 lit cigaretts all at once..chewed them up and chased them with a budweiser. never saw anything like it befo or since. 1993 world nine ball championship at the riviera hotel and casino.:laughing:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> Your one of the exceptions.....hey speaking of exceptions....I met a guy in vegas that ate 20 lit cigaretts all at once..chewed them up and chased them with a budweiser. never saw anything like it befo or since. 1993 world nine ball championship at the riviera hotel and casino.:laughing:


:laughing: what the hell would he eat 20 lit cigarettes for? Also I take 40 mg oxycontin er, er means extended release. That over 12 hour peroid the pill still releases the drug. So I take 2 a day. and the vicoden. Bayside can vouche for me that you cant tell that I take the amount I do. Im not drowsy, dopey, spacey, sleepy, high, or what ever else people get out of it. The only thing is I'm still in pain.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> :laughing: what the hell would he eat 20 lit cigarettes for? Also I take 40 mg oxycontin er, er means extended release. That over 12 hour peroid the pill still releases the drug. So I take 2 a day. and the vicoden. Bayside can vouche for me that you cant tell that I take the amount I do. Im not drowsy, dopey, spacey, sleepy, high, or what ever else people get out of it. The only thing is I'm still in pain.


We were in vegas....it was a wager placed on it. basically he had a crowd of people betting 20's and 100's that he couldn't do it and not throw up all over the place. He prolly won a couple thousand bucks. I think some people just was willing to pay to watch him do it.

I'm not trying to say your a doper.....dont take stuff the wrong way:thumbsup:
Plenty of people claim to have become addicted while being prescribed the stuff by a dr. Maybe they didn't take it proper but some blame that on the reaction to the drug...or that particualr drug was too weak for the pain that person was in so they took more....when a stronger drug would have worked and would have been taken properly.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

house plumber said:


> :laughing: what the hell would he eat 20 lit cigarettes for? Also I take 40 mg oxycontin er, er means extended release. That over 12 hour peroid the pill still releases the drug. So I take 2 a day. and the vicoden. Bayside can vouche for me that you cant tell that I take the amount I do. Im not drowsy, dopey, spacey, sleepy, high, or what ever else people get out of it. The only thing is I'm still in pain.


Holly cow, 40mg, mine were only 5mg, and I used only for pain at night, was down to one a night, now stopped all together.


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

exactly. Thats how people get addicted. They think they need more. You will never take the pain away. So they take more and more. 

I wish I would have seen that. You should have video'd it and put it on you tube.





TheMaster said:


> We were in vegas....it was a wager placed on it. basically he had a crowd of people betting 20's and 100's that he couldn't do it and not throw up all over the place. He prolly won a couple thousand bucks. I think some people just was willing to pay to watch him do it.
> 
> I'm not trying to say your a doper.....dont take stuff the wrong way:thumbsup:
> Plenty of people claim to have become addicted while being prescribed the stuff by a dr. Maybe they didn't take it proper but some blame that on the reaction to the drug...or that particualr drug was too weak for the pain that person was in so they took more....when a stronger drug would have worked and would have been taken properly.


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

house plumber said:


> exactly. Thats how people get addicted. They think they need more. You will never take the pain away. So they take more and more.
> 
> I wish I would have seen that. You should have video'd it and put it on you tube.


I bet this is the guy....looked like him. Watch this crap:laughing:


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

*Sore fingers*

Here is a slick tool ... Anybody want to venture a guess as to what it does. And how it saves fingers.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> Here is a slick tool ... Anybody wasnt to venture a guess as to what it does. And how it saves fingers.



Gloves, protects the fingers from cuts. No :laughing:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

lol. i wonder how many packs he smokes a day.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Thanks Bill my guess was way out there. :laughing:


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## bigdawginc (Sep 6, 2010)

*aches &pains*



DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Having a great deal of trouble with my hands as of late...praying it's just a passing issue.
> 
> Cortisone sounds really good right now.....not talking the cream either. I need that **** shot right into about 9 fingers right now.


 hey how u doing! i go to the chiropracyor 2 times a week& i tke this suppliment every day joint response it has helped me out alot made by soursenaturals.com ! 33years beating myself up dont help either! gooluick ! bigdawg


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Ron said:


> Holly cow, 40mg, mine were only 5mg, and I used only for pain at night, was down to one a night, now stopped all together.


5mg pffft. I eat 5mg for breakfast. Good you dont need them anymore.


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## mssp (Dec 15, 2009)

house plumber said:


> like i said everyone is different. like drugs for my disease, i have been on EVERY and i really mean EVERY drug there is for it. i have either failed them or had a reaction to it. i am only like 4 out of all my dr's paitence that has had nothing help either. i just got a refill on my vicoden yesterday. i get 120 of 7.5/750 a month. thats 4 a day. my last refill was on july 26. i still have 43 pills from that refill left over. i have never gone through any kind of withdrawl.


 That is about what I get from my doctor. If people want to say I have an addiction then let them I bet they cant live with the pain I do on a daily basis. 2 back surgeries 2 knee surgeries 1 shoulder surgery and they want to fuse my back now but I wont let them. Oh and I have been diabetic for 22 years. my doctor wants me to go on dissability but I think that is for p-ssies


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## oaklandplumber (May 10, 2009)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I figger the day I wake up and something don't hurt will probably be my last :thumbsup:
> 
> God bless the guy that invented Vicoden


 morphine is the ticket!:thumbup:


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## mssp (Dec 15, 2009)

oaklandplumber said:


> morphine is the ticket!:thumbup:


When i had my last knee surgery last Sept. My doctor give me dilaudid. It is about 5 times stronger than morphine. It knocked me out for several hours. Way to strong. Doc was suprised when I asked for something not as strong


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