# Tight budget



## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

I got to replace a 600,000 copper tube boiler and 3 300 gallon storage tanks ...

I got a budget of $ 40,000

What would you put in .....

It's a provincial holiday here "family day" and everything is closed ..... So can't get pricing till tomorrow..

You think I will be fine or am I going to lose my shirt ?


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## MacMech (Sep 15, 2011)

Move to Nova Scotia. Then you don't have to worry about family day


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## Tim`s Plumbing (Jan 17, 2012)

Check out the Viessmann Vitodens cascade systems I`m sure it will do what you are looking for.


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## newyorkcity (Nov 25, 2010)

3 AO Smith TMJ 350A @ $ 6,873 = $ 20,619

Triangle Tube KS 600 = $ 13,925

New piping, hangers, etc. = $ 2,000

Total equipment & piping = $ 36,544

No labor yet. That was done real quick on google.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

This why I was thinking of maybe using some type of cascading system ... The problem comes down to the venting ..

I kind of figured it might be tight ...


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## Catlin987987 (Nov 12, 2010)

Install 15 Navians and a 50 gal storage tank 


JK


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Well I got my cost for the job..

Larrs boiler 600 Mbtu 2 stage $ 4,500
Larrs 2-300 gallon 1-250 $ 13,500

$ 18,000 total equipment .... I think I will be safe

Start the job tomorrow ...


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Starting the rip out ...


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

OldSchool said:


> Starting the rip out ...


Looking good! What did you decide to go back with?


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## AlbacoreShuffle (Aug 28, 2011)

This should be your new avatar.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

johntheplumber said:


> Looking good! Why did you decide to go back with?


Switching back to equipment listed above...


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## newyorkcity (Nov 25, 2010)

The prices are very good. Much better than the other brands. I was looking for a switch from Lochinvar.


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

newyorkcity said:


> The prices are very good. Much better than the other brands. I was looking for a switch from Lochinvar.


Do you not like Lochinvar? I've always had great experience with them.


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## newyorkcity (Nov 25, 2010)

Awful. The latest being a Shield SNR200 for a building I am a partner in. $6K water heater. Ist week, the unit shuts down. The tube to the air pressure switch is too soft, and collapses/kinks under its own weight when the unit warms up. I have it tie-wired to the top cover.
Next, the motherboard dies. Standard response from company: must have been a power surge. Ok, I accept it. $650 for a replacement. A Weil McLain Ultra U2 control costs $200. That is not right.
Next, the circulator goes. This heater is 3 1/2 years old. Armstrong tech guy says that model pump was not very good, but I should be happy with a new improved model after another $500.
In order to change the anode rod, bring snips to cut the jacket because the anode nut is not in line with the hole.
The teflon tape is wrapped an inch up past the threads on the brass nipples connecting to the tank. Great workmanship.
This unit has been an embarassment to me. I am done with them.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

johntheplumber said:


> Do you not like Lochinvar? I've always had great experience with them.


Laars has been around for a long time.... They make a great copper tube boiler...

I was going to show everyone how to take apart a sectional cast iron boiler with easy ... But I went to get some grinding wheels and the boys all ready had it broken down and out of the room ..


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

OldSchool said:


> Laars has been around for a long time.... They make a great copper tube boiler...
> 
> I was going to show everyone how to take apart a sectional cast iron boiler with easy ... But I went to get some grinding wheels and the boys all ready had it broken down and out of the room ..


Would have been cool but on the flip side it's done!


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

Is that you and your sons working, you showing them what family day is all about. :laughing:


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

easttexasplumb said:


> Is that you and your sons working, you showing them what family day is all about. :laughing:


Only one in the picture is my son ... They other guy is one of my employees ...

The other guy is the head maintenance guy at the hotel..

I was the one taking pictures

I put two guys on this rip out ... I am out running service ..


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

johntheplumber said:


> Do you not like Lochinvar? I've always had great experience with them.


 Going on a Lochinvar water heater job soon, parts are expensive and they keep changing suppliers around here.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Lots of scrap here ...


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## aprilmayb (Feb 11, 2013)

OldSchool said:


> Only one in the picture is my son ... They other guy is one of my employees ...
> 
> The other guy is the head maintenance guy at the hotel..
> 
> ...


You aren't the one sticking your tongue out? I just knew that would be you.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Here is the prize piece of scrap... 

Weighing in somewhere between 250 to 300 lbs of pure copper


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

So the rest of the scrap steel a couple of guys wanted it ... So we turned over the clean up to them for salvage...

After going back and forward numerous times with full loads of scrap all they got was $ 200.00 .... LMAO

So I saved a ton there ... No need for disposal and labor cost of clean up...

Today we drop the venting down a 45 ft cement chimney ......

We have to wait till Monday before we can continue as I can't shut the water off they are full house till then...


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## MarkToo (Dec 17, 2011)

OldSchool said:


> Lots of scrap here ...


Your Tim Horton's cup to scrap ratio seems low.


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

MarkToo said:


> Your Tim Horton's cup to scrap ratio seems low.


I guess you don't get much for steel and cast .....


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## johntheplumber (Feb 11, 2013)

OldSchool said:


> I guess you don't get much for steel and cast .....


How much did you get for copper and brass?


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

johntheplumber said:


> How much did you get for copper and brass?


That copper heat exchanger we got $ 200 only 80 lbs of copper ... Rest was steel and brass


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

We were back on this job again today ... Lowered the tanks on to the ground ... Once we break out the concrete block we can remove the tanks ...

These are cement lined tank and are very heavy ,., I will know the weight once they get scrapped in ... But I would say each one is some where between 3,000 to 4,000 Lbs ...


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## redbeardplumber (Dec 4, 2012)

Excuse my ignorance old school. R those hot water storage tanks or indirect? I know you were putting in a boiler....

How do you get those out? Cut them out?


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

redbeardplumber said:


> Excuse my ignorance old school. R those hot water storage tanks or indirect? I know you were putting in a boiler....
> 
> How do you get those out? Cut them out?


Those are storage tanks ... Cement lined from the 1960's 

I am going to take them out in one piece ... Worst was getting them tipped over on their side so I can get them out ...

Found out today the new tanks will not arrive until the first week of April ...

I have to remove the block wall to get them out .. Then I can bring in two new tanks and new boiler into room through opening ...

You can see from the pics I used a 12 volt 7,500 lb winch tied to the bottom leg ... I had the top of the tank tied off to the block wall .. (hard to see that in pictures). Pulled bottom of tank with winch and tank slowly tipped sliding down the back tank ... Then did the same to
The back tank using the block wall to slide it down ..

Going to use two pallet jacks .. One on either end with ratchet straps .. Going to wheel those tanks out like they weight nothing.. 

Once they are outside scrap guy wants to pick them up ... This I got to see...


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## deerslayer (Mar 29, 2012)

OldSchool said:


> Those are storage tanks ... Cement lined from the 1960's
> 
> I am going to take them out in one piece ... Worst was getting them tipped over on their side so I can get them out ...
> 
> ...


Rollback


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

deerslayer said:


> Rollback


No these guys got no means to pick this up ...it's just two guys that try to collect scrap ..


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

We cut out all the existing piping today and tied it back in with new pipe and valves ...

I had to give all the 2 1/2 " scrap copper away to the maintenance guys at this place ... They were all crying ....

They were hovering around like hawks ....


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## redbeardplumber (Dec 4, 2012)

How is system working until April. Not much hot water needed? Low season?


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

redbeardplumber said:


> How is system working until April. Not much hot water needed? Low season?


This building has 4 different boiler rooms for domestic hot water ... 

There currently a bypass of 2 1/2 copper connecting one boiler room to this boiler room ..
We have been working at connecting them all together so just in case one boiler has failed it can be back up by the other ..

So far we have these two boiler rooms tied together ... Last week we ran piping 2" pipe from this boiler room to 3rd boiler room ...

Once this is all completed ... We will have 3 boiler rooms loop together ...

Future plans for 4 th boiler connection


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## redbeardplumber (Dec 4, 2012)

Next time I'm in North Bay, may have to come up and see you. Interesting stuff. 

Ha I was happy today, I got about 10 lbs of copper. Lol


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

redbeardplumber said:


> Next time I'm in North Bay, may have to come up and see you. Interesting stuff.
> 
> Ha I was happy today, I got about 10 lbs of copper. Lol


Give me a shout if your up this way .. 

I lost or should I say I gave away more than 100 lbs today of scrap copper


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## OldSchool (Jan 30, 2010)

Double post for some reason


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## redbeardplumber (Dec 4, 2012)

OldSchool said:


> Give me a shout if your up this way ..
> 
> I lost or should I say I gave away more than 100 lbs today of scrap copper


Ouch.


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