# Orangeburg pipe replacement



## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Just checking with you pipe burst and liner guys if there is anything you can do on orangeburg pipe. Customer called today wanting an estimate to do a 35' dig up and replacement of it, I'm going out next week to look at it. Thank you


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

yup....talk to CJPlumber. He's on here. Fantastic to work with.


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## theplungerman (Oct 26, 2011)

Where's Orangeburg in Orange County? I think iI saw it once when I was a little boy.


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

That stuff bursts like butter!


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Customers in Santa Ana, they said another company looked at it and bid it for dig up saying it couldn't be lined. I've never seen orangeburg before. I've only heard about it on this forum. The a/c side of my business is really backed up due to the heat we're still having that I can't take on a dig up right now so looking for alternatives


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

theplungerman said:


> Where's Orangeburg in Orange County? I think iI saw it once when I was a little boy.


Wow I see it all over up here. What type of pipe do you have in the yard? Clay?


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

Just a curious question on Orange burg:

What year was the house built? 

I'm under the impression Orange burg was only used during WWII
because of the metal shortage.

Here, I worry about it in the 1945 era. 
Most of it is replaced but who knows.

Any thoughts?


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Typically clay pipe in the yard. Santa Ana has houses built in the 1920's.


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## Hillside (Jan 22, 2010)

I've never ran into it around here either


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## theplungerman (Oct 26, 2011)

Clay clay clay, yes there is that old section of Santa Ana


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

fixitright said:


> Just a curious question on Orange burg:
> 
> What year was the house built?
> 
> ...


Nah... It was still being used in the early 70's...
Then came plastics...


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

I fight it about everyday,Damn stuff


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## cjtheplumber (Mar 9, 2012)

You can do a pipe burst or you can line it as well.

Lining:
If the pipe is flat, oval or collapsing lining will not work as the liner takes the same shape of the existing pipe. If the orange burg is round and no deformation it will work but this is not the case for old orange burg.

Pipe bursting:
This is the way to go with orange burg as deformation on pipe doesn't matter. The key is as long as you have about 1" opening pipe bursting will do the trick. The best way to figure this out is simply by running your camera. If you can go from the clean out to the end of the orange burg where it meets the clay at the 6x4 you can burst it. In most cases I only see the orange burg on the 4" going from the end of the cast iron exiting the house to the 6" by the sidewalk. 

If none or the above is possible you can use directional drilling and put a new line in place on grade. I got all of these equipment, and I can help anyone in Ventura, Los Angeles and Orange counties. 

Let me know if you need help I'm in the area pm me


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## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

If it's orangeburg and full of roots, forget lining it. You'll never clean it without destroying it.


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## LAsercut (Jul 19, 2015)

Haha orangeburg in orange county! Ive seen it twice, once as a helper with my dad luckily he knew what it was and the other time was about 5 years ago, and both were in santa ana as well, i do alot of work in santa ana, our shop is in santa ana also  i take it that your job is near downtown santa ana or around the main street area ? ? And thats cool to see a fellow plumber on this forum from orange county as well! The true plumbing community is a small world!  are you a one man shop or do you have guys working for you? And talk about the damn heat !?!?! Thought i was gonna have a heat stroke last week while i was digging all day!!


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Glad to hear from you LAsercut, we are a two man shop based out of Garden Grove, the job is downtown near Flower St. I had a great conversation with Plumbing Zoner Jerrymac yesterday and he was telling me there are pockets of orange burg all over Orange County even in Newport Beach. Just like Redwood, he said it was used until 1971 depending on the builder. New construction, low bidder gets the job. 

Thanks for the PM CJ, I'll definitely give you a call when I check out the job. The homeowner said they would wait for me if they can since I was referred to them by their son who works at supply house.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

Update- sent the camera down the line, locator said 1' 6" down where it comes out the house and transitions from cast to orangeburg and about 2' 6" down in the middle of the lawn. Camera would not go any further it was dropping into a hole in the bottom of the pipe. Homeowners said a company jetted the line. House was built in the 50s


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Here's some orangeburg from today. I think this one had rats tunneling inward.


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## 408plumber (Apr 24, 2012)

We have pockets of that crap here in the Bay Area too. Did pipe burst job through orange burg and had to redo it because the environmentalists said that most orange burg pipe contains small amounts of asbestos. We were asked to pothole and get a sample of the old orange burg for testing and it tested positive for asbestos. Therefore by leaving it in the ground, the area would have to be deemed (on property title) an asbestos disposal site. So be careful bursting this type of pipe. Most inspectors aren't hip to it yet but I'm sure things will start changing. Bursters beware......


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## fixitright (Jan 5, 2012)

:blink:


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## sierra2000 (Sep 19, 2011)

408plumber said:


> We have pockets of that crap here in the Bay Area too. Did pipe burst job through orange burg and had to redo it because the environmentalists said that most orange burg pipe contains small amounts of asbestos. We were asked to pothole and get a sample of the old orange burg for testing and it tested positive for asbestos. Therefore by leaving it in the ground, the area would have to be deemed (on property title) an asbestos disposal site. So be careful bursting this type of pipe. Most inspectors aren't hip to it yet but I'm sure things will start changing. Bursters beware......


So who'd be responsible for redoing it the contractor or homeowner? Its already in the ground and nothing's had to happen with it all these years but since you sent a pipe through it while it's still underground like it's been for decades you now are responsible for removing it even though it's still underground like it's been for all these decades. These environmentalists are ridiculous!


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## 408plumber (Apr 24, 2012)

The customer is eating the redo. The rest of the line needs to be replaced and now it's going to be an open trench kinda job.


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## 408plumber (Apr 24, 2012)

Definitely need to add new verbiage to my contracts to cover my a$$ when it comes to bursting.


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## 760GWS (Mar 16, 2015)

Occasionally we run into orangeburg here in north san diego county. Never heard it could contain asbestos, but doesn't sound too whack. Now what, asbestos testing and special handling procedures; asbestos abatement sub? Money!


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

408plumber said:


> We have pockets of that crap here in the Bay Area too. Did pipe burst job through orange burg and had to redo it because the environmentalists said that most orange burg pipe contains small amounts of asbestos. We were asked to pothole and get a sample of the old orange burg for testing and it tested positive for asbestos. Therefore by leaving it in the ground, the area would have to be deemed (on property title) an asbestos disposal site. So be careful bursting this type of pipe. Most inspectors aren't hip to it yet but I'm sure things will start changing. Bursters beware......


Are you sure you aren't thinking of "Transite Pipe?"


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## bulldozer (Jan 11, 2009)

We bursted a transite sewer main and they chose bursting to leave the pipe encapsulated in the ground. They only remidiated the burst hole openings.


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## plumber joe (Oct 17, 2008)

If you don't test it, who is to say there is any asbestos there.


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## srloren (Nov 19, 2014)

fixitright said:


> Just a curious question on Orange burg:
> 
> What year was the house built?
> 
> ...


Actually it was used in So Cal during the 60s. I remember the term Orange Burg. I never installed any of it but it was available.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Here is a pretty good site with a bunch of information on Orangeburg Pipe.


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

When I worked at CB&Q Railroad in the late 70's (1978) at Louisiana, Mo Tallman Conduit was still making Orangeburg but it was being sold as Conduit. I think most of it was being used as sewer pipe as Hannibal, Mo has a LOT of homes with it. Now I am having to deal with it almost everyday. It has become a nightmare here. 
I did find one last year that had been bedded in sand and it looked in perfect shape. They still had it replaced. Luck had it it turned to clay at the curb!!!!!!!


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## cable or root (Oct 7, 2015)

I fight Orangeburg 2-3 times a week here, never seen it in a house built after 59 or before 48. I always recommend replacement. Its almost never round. Once I saw orangeburg that was flattened out in a weird direction. In stead of it being squished horrizantally it looked like it was crushed from the side for 15'-20' and it was longer from top to bottom than side to side. (Like a diamond shape) wish I had a picture. It was 2 years ago and they got a pipe burst. I miss having a camera.


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## panther (Oct 27, 2010)

fixitright said:


> Just a curious question on Orange burg:
> 
> What year was the house built?
> 
> ...


I've seen its used for houses built all the way into the early sixties, I believe. Definitely into the late 50's from my area.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Mark my words right now.....SDR 35 is way crappier then Orangeburg ever was. Both pics.....houses under 15 years old. 

SDR 35 is going to keep the bursting guys happy for years to come.


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## Roto-Rooter (Jan 31, 2015)

I have found a lot of SDR 35 in the same shape here. It is to thin to be put in very deep, but if it is shallow and in a spot that has traffic it will do the same. I still think orangeburg is worst.


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## cable or root (Oct 7, 2015)

Sdr35 is bad, but I don't see root intrusion throughout the pipe on sdr35 only see roots grow in on bad glue joints or cracks. They poke right through orangeburg. It still egg shapes and cracks. Regardless sdr35 is illegal here now so no worries. Also sdr35 can be repaired and patched. Orangeburg can only be replaced. I just feel bad for people who replaced their clay tile for sdr35 thinking that they were never going to have problems again.


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## cable or root (Oct 7, 2015)

Those lines are less than 15 years old? Here sdr35 has been illegal since 1997. Are they still using it out there in cali?


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

gear junkie said:


> Mark my words right now.....SDR 35 is way crappier then Orangeburg ever was. Both pics.....houses under 15 years old.
> 
> SDR 35 is going to keep the bursting guys happy for years to come.





Roto-Rooter said:


> I have found a lot of SDR 35 in the same shape here. It is to thin to be put in very deep, but if it is shallow and in a spot that has traffic it will do the same. I still think orangeburg is worst.





cable or root said:


> Sdr35 is bad, but I don't see root intrusion throughout the pipe on sdr35 only see roots grow in on bad glue joints or cracks. They poke right through orangeburg. It still egg shapes and cracks. Regardless sdr35 is illegal here now so no worries. Also sdr35 can be repaired and patched. Orangeburg can only be replaced. I just feel bad for people who replaced their clay tile for sdr35 thinking that they were never going to have problems again.





cable or root said:


> Those lines are less than 15 years old? Here sdr35 has been illegal since 1997. Are they still using it out there in cali?


Looks like improperly installed SDR-35 to me...
Proper bedding is essential with SDR-35...

We install it without any problems...
And since we often have sewers going out under basement floors they can be pretty damn deep...
Read Pages 17-20 Here...


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Great link right there. The issue is there's not a lot of good installers.


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## cjtheplumber (Mar 9, 2012)

I never liked pvc and sdr35 anyways. But I'm happy to know I don't use it and that it will keep me busy for years to come. I wonder what kind of warranty the companies installing these pipes are giving. :blink:


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## cable or root (Oct 7, 2015)

What is wrong with schedule 40 pvc? What are you installing instead? Cast? Clay? Interestingly enough here it is still legal to install new clay, but I have never heard of anyone doing so. Standard warranties on new pvc and polyethylene sewer lines is 40-50 years.


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