# Which Level on Sewers?



## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

So...on a job recently I caught an apprentice checking the grade on a 6" sewer line with a torpedo level. In a less than diplomatic fashion, I asked hi. To hand me the level and I proceeded to through it as far from the work area as I possibly could. I told him to either get a 4' level or take a break because the torpedo was a waste of time.

What kind of level do you use on sewers? Fat Max? Empire? Johnson? Laser? Eyeball?


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## bartnc37 (Feb 24, 2009)

Your teeth would have been right behind that level. Do you think we'd believe you got out of that fancy truck long enough to actually get your shoes dirty.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

bartnc37 said:


> Your teeth would have been right behind that level. Do you think we'd believe you got out of that fancy truck long enough to actually get your shoes dirty.


I do like to keep my wingtips clean. :laughing:


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## Pac Rim Plumber (Jun 23, 2010)

Hate to be called a tool snob, but I really like Stabila. I understand not having tact with a view of hindsight thrown in


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

A torpedo !!! A 2" craftsman I use both. I have a torpedo with gradient marks. I trust it the most. I shorter level will find the slightest sag as a 4' will go over the sag but if you have a good eye ul see a slight gap under it. 

Why trip out on a torpedo biz ??
Atleast he was checking it with a level


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## plumber101us (Feb 25, 2013)

a torpedo gradient level have checked my torpedo against other levels and found it to be right on the money. I have a Reed gradient torpedo level


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## MDPlumber1977 (Mar 4, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> So...on a job recently I caught an apprentice checking the grade on a 6" sewer line with a torpedo level. In a less than diplomatic fashion, I asked hi. To hand me the level and I proceeded to through it as far from the work area as I possibly could. I told him to either get a 4' level or take a break because the torpedo was a waste of time.
> 
> What kind of level do you use on sewers? Fat Max? Empire? Johnson? Laser? Eyeball?


Threw the kids level huh... Must have been one of those days, The GOOD news is some cranberry juice may help with those menstrual cramps :laughing: Not sure if you are referencing groundwork or hanging pipe. For GW with long runs such as schools I use a laser for ditch and gravel grading. I also use the laser for setting drains, CO's, etc. Once I know my ditch line is correct "Sorry" but I usually use a gradient torpedo. Same with hanging pipe. If the deck / floor is level then I usually just set the invert of the hangers with a tape and double check with the gradient torpedo, If the floor or ceiling is out of level then I will set invert of hangers with a laser and again double check with the gradient torpedo.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I use everything from my eye balls to a 4' foot level. I may catch heat for this, but imo pitch/fall ain't that important, unless your try to hit certain grade with out much play.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

It was a 6" building sewer in a ditch. 

Here's my beef with a torpedo on larger pipe. The only thing verified is that 6" space. There could have been a sag before or after that spot. I suppose if the level were slid along the entire length of the pipe it might be okay in the hands of the right plumber. 

I asked him to check the grade on that section of the line because it looked like there might have been a problem. One of the JP's had given him the level to use. The same JP that had installed reverse fall fittings on two different occasions that had to be cut out. He complained about me throwing his level out in the middle of the yard and I apologized but also told him we would not be having this conversation if he had given the kid the right tool to start with. 

I guess it boils down to just being a pet peeve since this has been an issue previously and I suppose it is possible that I did sacrifice a bit of my cherub-like demeanor. I'll try to be more compassionate next time. :brows:


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## newyorkcity (Nov 25, 2010)

We run service weight or XHCI pipe underground. Our pipes don't sag.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

MDPlumber1977 said:


> Threw the kids level huh... Must have been one of those days, The GOOD news is some cranberry juice may help with those menstrual cramps :laughing: Not sure if you are referencing groundwork or hanging pipe. For GW with long runs such as schools I use a laser for ditch and gravel grading. I also use the laser for setting drains, CO's, etc. Once I know my ditch line is correct "Sorry" but I usually use a gradient torpedo. Same with hanging pipe. If the deck / floor is level then I usually just set the invert of the hangers with a tape and double check with the gradient torpedo, If the floor or ceiling is out of level then I will set invert of hangers with a laser and again double check with the gradient torpedo.


What kind of lasers ?? I'd really like to see all this.


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## Gettinit (May 9, 2012)

On an overhead with a level deck I use a stick rule and double check behind with a two footer. I use various sized levels depending on the circumstances.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> What kind of lasers ?? I'd really like to see all this.


 
I use this for trenching and bedding on grades. The set it back to level for FD's and CO's. Fast fast fast....

http://www.trimble.com/gl412_gl422.shtml


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## 504Plumber (Jan 26, 2011)

Use a 2ft for any long runs and a Peter level on fittings.


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## James420 (Nov 14, 2012)

Gettinit said:


> On an overhead with a level deck I use a stick rule and double check behind with a two footer. I use various sized levels depending on the circumstances.


Same for me really, laser, 4 ft level, and a stick rule. I use a tape for any sewer over 6ft deep. I love my old stick rule.


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

I have extra level bubbles for sale ... fits all types.


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Torpedo, every 18" or so. I have had to fix extra fall and bellies from people who insisted on using a 48" lever to install sewers. IMO, the jourmeyman gave him the right level, but didn't give him the right education on it's use.


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## Cuda (Mar 16, 2009)

I use the torpedo on the fittings, a 4 foot to spot check and I use my water level the most on long runs. I almost never bust out the pipe laser but I would on certain type of projects where there where a lot of white hard hats if you know what I mean lol


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

phishfood said:


> Torpedo, every 18" or so. I have had to fix extra fall and bellies from people who insisted on using a 48" lever to install sewers. IMO, the jourmeyman gave him the right level, but didn't give him the right education on it's use.


How do you miss fall or bellies with a 4'?


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Extra fall, the end of the 4' is off of the pipe because of a bow in the pipe, with the majority of the level on the pipe reading proper fall. Bellies, both ends of the 4 footer on the pipe reading proper level, but not touching in the center because of the belly. Had this problem cause considerable rework, more than once or twice. 

I am the other way than you on this. I would be more inclined to heave the bigger level, and then teach the apprentice the right way to use the torpedo level. Long levels are for setting tubs.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

I suppose it could go either way. Missing gaps on a 4 footer sounds like a training issue as well. Hard to blame that on the level.


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## SHAUN C (Feb 16, 2011)

I grab two 2' footers and me and helper start at one end


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ILPlumber said:


> I use this for trenching and bedding on grades. The set it back to level for FD's and CO's. Fast fast fast....
> 
> http://www.trimble.com/gl412_gl422.shtml


I used that with the receiver on the boom of the excavator on a job back in December... First time in the seat on a large job in a long time...

It's the cat's azz! Saved a ton of time compared to playing with a transit and stick... Sit in the seat and dig dig dig...:thumbup:


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Redwood said:


> I used that with the receiver on the boom of the excavator on a job back in December... First time in the seat on a large job in a long time...
> 
> It's the cat's azz! Saved a ton of time compared to playing with a transit and stick... Sit in the seat and dig dig dig...:thumbup:


How did u attach it ??


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## NewSchool (Jan 8, 2012)

On a job that needs calculated fall, we've been using a transit with success. The graded laser posted above would be sweet though!


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