# Sewer line



## ZipZap (Nov 7, 2021)

I am running a sewer line (4" pipe) for a commercial building running 190' under a parking lot to a septic tank.
Since the septic tank is only 18 or so below grade my pipe (the lot is on a slight grade) in some areas is only a few inches beneath the parking lot. 
1. Should I use sch80 or DIP so that it doesn't get crushed, especially on hot days when the tar heats up and softens the plastic?
2. Will I have a freezing problem (especially if I use metal), and should I insulate the pipes (I'm afraid the insulation may make the parking lot crack.
Thank you


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

ZipZap said:


> I am running a sewer line (4" pipe) for a commercial building running 190' under a parking lot to a septic tank.
> Since the septic tank is only 18 or so below grade my pipe (the lot is on a slight grade) in some areas is only a few inches beneath the parking lot.
> 1. Should I use sch80 or DIP so that it doesn't get crushed, especially on hot days when the tar heats up and softens the plastic?
> 2. Will I have a freezing problem (especially if I use metal), and should I insulate the pipes (I'm afraid the insulation may make the parking lot crack.
> Thank you



Ask your Jman/Master.

This is not a problem for an apprentice to tackle alone.


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## KCPlumb (Oct 26, 2021)

At 190' it seems as though you don't have enough fall. 4" pipe as per IPC & UPC is a slope of 1/8" per foot, unless the ground falls away to your septic system. You'll need 24" of fall from the exit of the building to the septic connection. And along that run your going to have a couple of clean outs. Plastic would not be ideal. Additionally your city or location may have a minimum depth for sewer line.


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

I recommend using Orangeburg pipe


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## DogGod (Jul 7, 2021)

2. Will I have a freezing problem (especially if I use metal), and should I insulate the pipes (I'm afraid the insulation may make the parking lot crack.....


Is this serious?

If you are afraid of cracking the parking lot the run your sewer above ground obviously.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

KCPlumb said:


> .....Plastic would not be ideal........


BULL SCHIT

You can drive a bucket loader over sched 40 pvc, try that with no-hub cast iron and it will shatter. No-hub will also lose a lot more heat and at that shallow depth will much more easily freeze and break. Also no-hub cast iron is garbage that will rust to schit in no time.

Skip to 8:28 to watch him drive over the pipes.


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## KCPlumb (Oct 26, 2021)

skoronesa said:


> BULL SCHIT
> 
> You can drive a bucket loader over sched 40 pvc, try that with no-hub cast iron and it will shatter. No-hub will also lose a lot more heat and at that shallow depth will much more easily freeze and break. Also no-hub cast iron is garbage that will rust to schit in no time.
> 
> Skip to 8:28 to watch him drive over the pipes.


I’m saying plastic in his situation may not be ideal, additionally he may have issues with the depth, I don’t know what rules are in place where he lives. Also PVC clean outs in the parking lot is not ideal either because they can break, I’ve seen it. Not knowing what is required where this project is located any information he is given on this forum is moot.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

KCPlumb said:


> I’m saying plastic in his situation may not be ideal.......
> 
> ........ PVC clean outs in the parking lot is not ideal either because they can break, I’ve seen it. .................


There is no reason sched 40 pvc wouldn't be better than no-hub, not sure what other non-plastic pipe you could be referring to. Transite?

ANY exposed cleanout would be damaged from being run over. If a no-hub cleanout didn't break the connector would fail over time. All cleanouts in a parking lot should have a ring/cover to protect them.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

skoronesa said:


> There is no reason sched 40 pvc wouldn't be better than no-hub, not sure what other non-plastic pipe you could be referring to. Transite?
> 
> ANY exposed cleanout would be damaged from being run over. If a no-hub cleanout didn't break the connector would fail over time. All cleanouts in a parking lot should have a ring/cover to protect them.


Cleanouts in blacktop have to be surrounded by a 24” pad of concrete


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## DogGod (Jul 7, 2021)

sparky said:


> Cleanouts in blacktop have to be surrounded by a 24” pad of concrete


Here they are recessed and have a 6inch curb stop lid made of cast iron. 

Still his best option is to run in all above ground like the aqueducts


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## KCPlumb (Oct 26, 2021)

Correct, with some sort of Cleanout cover made of iron set in concrete. At least in my area. Additionally there is a 12” minimum to finish grade (in my area) at point of exit of the structure. Again we don’t know what the rules are where this project is located. Too many unknowns too make a call on this forum. The pipe material is insignificant at this point.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

KCPlumb said:


> ................The pipe material is insignificant at this point.


You had me up until that last part, give me one reason he can't run sched. 40 pvc?


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## KCPlumb (Oct 26, 2021)

skoronesa said:


> You had me up until that last part, give me one reason he can't run sched. 40 pvc?


Maybe his jurisdiction requires HDPE.


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## CMplumber (Jul 3, 2016)

Our jurisdiction requires any areas with traffic or under driveways have to be ductile iron, mechanical fittings and all cleanouts in comercial have to have 24" x 24" x 12" concrete square around a cast iron curb stop lid. Like said already without knowing your jurisdiction codes and if you can get the grade/slope I'm pissing in the wind on my advice to you in your area.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

KCPlumb said:


> Maybe his jurisdiction requires HDPE.


HAHAHA!

You know why sched. 40 PVC is better than HDPE? It's cheaper


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## Christan (Nov 24, 2021)

I am not an expert in sewerage installations and everything related to pipes, but I have worked in this field before, and I can say that the best thing would be for all the installations to be at a greater depth, from my own experience.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Christan said:


> I am not an expert in sewerage installations and everything related to pipes, but I have worked in this field before, and I can say that the best thing would be for all the installations to be at a greater depth, from my own experience.



Why are you here? Gtfo of here


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## karlwithak.conley (Nov 26, 2021)

A reduced diameter forced sewer may be the answer. A barometric loop on the upstream pump discharge to help keep the discharge dry between pump cycles. Keep the pump discharge deep enough to protect pipe and preclude freezing. A barometric may not be required if the far end of the line is low enough to drain by gravity. Have it empty into a tank or sump pit that the pumps to the septic tank.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

karlwithak.conley said:


> ........... may be the answer. ...........


This site is for PROFESSIONAL plumbers only, don't go giving the diy or handymen answers. Refer them to the appropriate diy site instead please.


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## OpenSights (Mar 23, 2015)

karlwithak.conley said:


> A reduced diameter forced sewer may be the answer. A barometric loop on the upstream pump discharge to help keep the discharge dry between pump cycles. Keep the pump discharge deep enough to protect pipe and preclude freezing. A barometric may not be required if the far end of the line is low enough to drain by gravity. Have it empty into a tank or sump pit that the pumps to the septic tank.


Post a proper intro, or you’re gone in the morning.


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## skoronesa (Oct 27, 2015)

OpenSights said:


> Post a proper intro, or you’re gone in the morning.


Is this not sufficient?









Retired but active and interested


I am a third generation plumber. Union trained. Taught the apprenticeship classes for nearly twenty years. Sat for and passed the Certified in Plumbing Engineering exam from ASPE. And spent 20 years as a service and construction plumber/pipe fitter. After that, twenty years as superintendent or...




www.plumbingzone.com


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## karlwithak.conley (Nov 26, 2021)

OK, that is enough. This site is too xenophobic for me. Goodbye.


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## Logtec (Jun 3, 2018)

karlwithak.conley said:


> OK, that is enough. This site is too xenophobic for me. Goodbye.


ummm ok. Bye.
Wait what happened.?.?.


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