# Ripped it out



## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

I did a hand wash sink for a Mexican restaurant that just opened up. The health inspector wanted the hand wash sink, even though the restaurant has been there under Bob's Big Boy for 20 years. I gave them a good price using their s.s. sink.

I finish up the job and the co-owner said that the work was wrong---that I said it was going to be this way, blah blah blah. I never met him before. 

He asked how much I charge a hour. I told him 88 and he said that the work wasn't worth 88. I looked at him and said that's why I don't eat at restaurants. I can make the same thing for less and at least it will be healthy. He walked away.

I tore everything out and left.

Sure, I'm out 200.00, but it felt sooooooooo good. :yes:


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## budders (May 19, 2013)

Good for tou


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## younger-plumber (Sep 12, 2008)

88 dollars an hour?


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## SchmitzPlumbing (May 5, 2014)

thats great. we cant order off of their menu and then argue about the price when we get the bill. :thumbsup:


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## Unclog1776 (Feb 5, 2013)

What was his reaction when you started the uninstall lol

Good for you I bet it felt great and I'll bet he feels like an idiot


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

Good for you! Bet he won't be so cocky with the next plumber. He's a guy you would want to put on that secret deadbeat customer list.


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## georgepsi (Jul 24, 2013)

I always wanted to do that good for you I wish I was there to see that the sink was gone


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

He asked me not to take it out, but you know what? Disrespect is disrespect and not tolerated. He may get away with treating his immigrant workers like that, but I'm not that.

I walked past their dining room and there was two people there at 12:30. The restaurant is doomed. 

The building maintenance manager said that the cheapest quote was for a grand just for parts.


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## Flyout95 (Apr 13, 2012)

When I was laid off I delivered pizza, the owner asked me to re-hang a sink, which I did. I didn't talk money, but asked if I could take home a pizza, he said of course. Then he took the money from my tips at the end of the night. For some reason I was so mad, I pulled that sink off the wall, removed me anchors and quit on the spot.


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## Leach713 (Nov 1, 2013)

Plumber said:


> He asked me not to take it out, but you know what? Disrespect is disrespect and not tolerated. He may get away with treating his immigrant workers like that, but I'm not that. I walked past their dining room and there was two people there at 12:30. The restaurant is doomed. The building maintenance manager said that the cheapest quote was for a grand just for parts.



How you know they were immigrants ???? Why couldn't you just say his employees


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Leach713 said:


> How you know they were immigrants ???? Why couldn't you just say his employees


Two things. 1, of course he should have just said employees. 2, assuming he meant illegal immigrants, you want to take your chances that he is guessing wrong?

David


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## Leach713 (Nov 1, 2013)

dhal22 said:


> Two things. 1, of course he should have just said employees. 2, assuming he meant illegal immigrants, you want to take your chances that he is guessing wrong? David


That not the point 
Enough said!!


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

It may be legal to remove installed equipment in your state, it may not. I'd look into that before I removed anything else.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Oh Well...

If you can't see the advantage of flat rate pricing and a signed acceptance of a quote with a "Go Ahead," I guess you never will....


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

Plumbus said:


> It may be legal to remove installed equipment in your state, it may not. I'd look into that before I removed anything else.


You'd be surprised at how little the law cares. They would have to get a lawyer or go through small claims for anything to happen.

It was all about respect. Whether he felt it was okay to **** with the plumber or the white man isn't the point. He stood there and lied about what I said and told me I wasn't worth my wage. In this county, that will get you bounced from any business. 

I did the equivalent of 86'ing a bad patron. Do I regret it? A little. Would I do it again? Absolutely.


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

I'm agree with what you did, I'm probably do the same but I'm disagree the terms and way you used about his employees. I'm American Citizen but I'm also an immigrant too and I can tell you that is more than one here like me or son's of immigrants. Out of that, you did good.


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## fhrooter72 (Apr 12, 2011)

My understanding here is, once it's installed it becomes part of the building and you are not allowed to remove it. If he approved the price ahead of time and then refused to pay you can file charges for theft of services and/or file a mechanics lien on the property.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

fhrooter72 said:


> My understanding here is, once it's installed it becomes part of the building and you are not allowed to remove it. If he approved the price ahead of time and then refused to pay you can file charges for theft of services and/or file a mechanics lien on the property.


If you are in Texas (and I think you are based on other posts) once you collect and leave its theirs. Prior to that its yours.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

Gargalaxy said:


> I'm agree with what you did, I'm probably do the same but I'm disagree the terms and way you used about his employees. I'm American Citizen but I'm also an immigrant too and I can tell you that is more than one here like me or son's of immigrants. Out of that, you did good.


I know, I'm getting of the original topic. I don't care if anyone is an immigrant. However, I wonder what would happen if Western Union was forced to withhold taxes on out of country money transfers unless you provide a check stub, tax id, etc. to prove that you paid your taxes.

Think about it.

David


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## Leach713 (Nov 1, 2013)

Who cares????


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

dhal22 said:


> I know, I'm getting of the original topic. I don't care if anyone is an immigrant. However, I wonder what would happen if Western Union was forced to withhold taxes on out of country money transfers unless you provide a check stub, tax id, etc. to prove that you paid your taxes.
> 
> Think about it.
> 
> David


You do whatever take for your family and you're right about Western Union but do you think that will affect just to immigrants? Lets gonna keep the original topic and if you wanna keep talking about this, we can start a new different thread I'm sure can be long and maybe a good one.


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

dhal22 said:


> I know, I'm getting of the original topic. I don't care if anyone is an immigrant. However, I wonder what would happen if Western Union was forced to withhold taxes on out of country money transfers unless you provide a check stub, tax id, etc. to prove that you paid your taxes.
> 
> Think about it.
> 
> David


I wish our lawmakers had enough sense to think of that.


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## dhal22 (Jul 30, 2010)

It's been an idea of mine for several years.


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

I have a few ideas of my own about the welfare and prison system... :laughing:


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## Gargalaxy (Aug 14, 2013)

plumberkc said:


> I have a few ideas of my own about the welfare and prison system... :laughing:


Damn right!!!


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

To me this is all about qualifying your client. It is a prime case of this is not how you treat people you contract with and a case of management. I am not sure what the woot woot is about when it is a horrible decision made by all parties involved.

It made you feel good BS, you're still upset with it.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

88 bucks an hour? I wouldn't get out of bed for that :thumbsup: The guy should have thanked you profusely and given you a months worth of free dinners. 88 bucks :furious: Come on guys the average decent bar tender makes 88 bucks an hour....... And you wonder why we don't get respect :thumbsup:


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

Richard Hilliard said:


> To me this is all about qualifying your client. It is a prime case of this is not how you treat people you contract with and a case of management. I am not sure what the woot woot is about when it is a horrible decision made by all parties involved.
> 
> It made you feel good BS, you're still upset with it.


I 86'ed the customer like a bartender does to the rowdy drunk. Like the bartender, I lose (a little) money, but stopped a potential disaster. 

Do I worry about my rep? Nah.....my little town is full of daily dramas much worse than that. There's a mechanical business in town that has a 2 star Google rating. His reviews are horrible, okay? He employs 100 HVAC and plumbers full time all year round....:laughing:

Whatever reservations are long gone. I don't allow anyone to treat me like that.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

I wouldn't let a bum treat me like that for 88bucks an hour but then again, a lot of bums make more than that :blink:


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I wouldn't let a bum treat me like that for 88bucks an hour but then again, a lot of bums make more than that :blink:


We just need to stop referring to plumbing jobs as an hourly rate. I am asked how much I charge per hour a few times per week and it always pisses me off.


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## ibeplumber (Sep 20, 2011)

plumberkc said:


> We just need to stop referring to plumbing jobs as an hourly rate. I am asked how much I charge per hour a few times per week and it always pisses me off.


What is or how do you reply?


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## plumberkc (Jun 23, 2011)

I just tell them I don't work by the hour, I work by the job. I usually won't price anything over the phone either. I don't charge to come out but I don't do free estimates either, especially if they ask. I come out and tell them the price before starting, they either choose to do the work right then or they pass.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Plumber said:


> I 86'ed the customer like a bartender does to the rowdy drunk. Like the bartender, I lose (a little) money, but stopped a potential disaster.
> 
> Do I worry about my rep? Nah.....my little town is full of daily dramas much worse than that. There's a mechanical business in town that has a 2 star Google rating. His reviews are horrible, okay? He employs 100 HVAC and plumbers full time all year round....:laughing:
> 
> Whatever reservations are long gone. I don't allow anyone to treat me like that.




Neither do . I am not sure what that has to do with anything, not having someone treat you wrong. Still doesn't make what anyone did right. Qualify your customers better and stop putting yourself in these positions is the point. 


I really have a difficult time understanding how jobs go south that drastically without confrontation. I've been doing this since 1972 and I have been in scrapes with people however it has always had confrontation whether or not I would admit it at the time. Whether it was my fault or the customer there is a minimum of at least 2 people arguing pushing someones buttons and frequently it is 2 people pushing each others buttons. Been there done that and still get caught up once in a blue moon. I get caught less in this now then I ever did. I get people like this out of my life as soon as possible.It is tough to master and grasp, we think we can handle anything then it is suddenly thrown at us and we see how much we have not matured.​


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## SchmitzPlumbing (May 5, 2014)

i dont care what the law is. usually it protects the wrong person. i fully agree with demoing the job, laughing at the jerk, and walking away with my head up. either way the jerk would have never paid him. it doesnt matter what race, gender, who his family is, who he thinks he is, etc you get the job done, you pay the bill. these guys take advantage of us and brag to their buddies about it. the next time , its their buddies taking advantage of us. if we all do the un install, eventually , maybe they will realize that we will not let this happen to us.:thumbsup:


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

prime example why this stuff happens.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

This is exactly why you need to know why people choose you. It is not about your license, insurance, how long you have been in business. Start relating to your customers when on the phone and let people know why people choose you for work. You explain the job in precise terminology, you explain how to prevent the problem from reoccurring, you give them a solution that takes care of the cause and not the symptom. People choose you because you are neat, clean, nice, easy to ask questions and give answers that make sense, you give them what is necessary due to their budget( that you set), you give them options to get rid of the problem and they get to choose instead of you choosing for them what they are doing.

When you are at their home and they ask for a price:
We will go over that
We will get to it
Let’s see what is causing this and then we can go over that
I have a set procedure I do when I am diagnosing and then we can discuss your options to get rid of this problem.
You’re in luck today if you choose to do nothing it will cost you nothing or the amount of your service charge.


No reason to make yourself a commodity and discuss money until you know exactly what is going on and how to make the problem disappear for good,.


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

Wrong thread, Richard. 

This one is about being insulted and reacting to it in a way that every tradesman has dreamed about.











My hourly rates (not yours, mine) are posted on the internet, are discussed on the phone, and are on the (very legal) work order. I have a stop watch on the Iphone that I use as a time clock. I have spaces on the work order for contract prices.


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## budders (May 19, 2013)

I was questioned the other day about my time and rate i was asked if i came in just over or under a half hour if i would cut my hourly rate in half i told the customer sorry but i charge by the hour not the half hour and if i went over an hour by a 10 15 min then i wouldn't charge another hour but I'm sorry i wont charge by the half hour and then they hung up on me. Anyone else ever have this question asked of them?


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Not since I stopped charging by the hour.


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## Ptturner91 (Oct 13, 2012)

budders said:


> I was questioned the other day about my time and rate i was asked if i came in just over or under a half hour if i would cut my hourly rate in half i told the customer sorry but i charge by the hour not the half hour and if i went over an hour by a 10 15 min then i wouldn't charge another hour but I'm sorry i wont charge by the half hour and then they hung up on me. Anyone else ever have this question asked of them?


It might be by the hour but I have never seen someone go 20 into a hour and still charge the full

You have your minimum (the company I work at is 3 hours but that includes travel) then after that by the hour 
But if I do a job in 4 and half hours I charge 4 and half not 5


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

budders said:


> I was questioned the other day about my time and rate i was asked if i came in just over or under a half hour if i would cut my hourly rate in half i told the customer sorry but i charge by the hour not the half hour and if i went over an hour by a 10 15 min then i wouldn't charge another hour but I'm sorry i wont charge by the half hour and then they hung up on me. Anyone else ever have this question asked of them?


My first hour is 132 and then it drops to 88. I charge in 15 minute increments after the first hour.

No travel time.......I can go miles without a traffic light, though. 

Free estimates on larger jobs.


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

Only slightly off-topic - We seem to have the worst luck with restaurants. I wonder if it is due to their margins being so small?


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## budders (May 19, 2013)

I also don't charge a service charge and I'm one of the cheeper ones at 85. An hour. Most of the service i do is t and m (m being marked up 30%) i don't charge to go to the suply house. And on bigger jobs or if people would like i give an estimate and i usually don't wonder off the price on the estimate provided. Nothing horrible is run in to or found during said project.


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## Plumber (Jan 18, 2009)

Phat Cat said:


> Only slightly off-topic - We seem to have the worst luck with restaurants. I wonder if it is due to their margins being so small?


That and beauty parlors............

Their profit margin is great. But, there are too many of them, they aren't that good, people don't eat out that much.



budders said:


> I also don't charge a service charge and I'm one of the cheeper ones at 85. An hour. Most of the service i do is t and m (m being marked up 30%) i don't charge to go to the suply house. And on bigger jobs or if people would like i give an estimate and i usually don't wonder off the price on the estimate provided. Nothing horrible is run in to or found during said project.


My flat rate book is based on my hourly, so I'm usually only 10% off either way.


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