# Pex experts....question



## Toli (Nov 7, 2015)

I’m not an expert in the world of pex. I have always been of the opinion that I shouldn’t mix different manufacturers fittings/joining methods with different manufacturers tubing. My worry is if something would go wrong I would have two manufacturers pointing the finger at each other with me stuck in the middle. 

Which brings me today- I looked at a 3/4 compression fitting that some dipshiit put on 3/4” pex. It blew off over the weekend when no one was home and flooded the place. 

The pex is shark bite brand. I don’t have any shark bite branded pex fittings for r their crimp tool. I’m not apposed to buying it but it’s made me wonder if mixing manufacturers tubing and fitting is really that big of a deal. 

So tell me your thoughts. Am I worried about nothing? What do you all do?


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I mix pex brands fitting and pipe every day without noticing. I buy stuff at regular price and some on sale in other stores. I do stay with the popular brands though. Ipex, Bow and some other. 



As for SB brand pex I wouldn't worry about it. Imagine all the DIY buying different brands and they all leaked or popped, we'd of known by now not to mix brands.


On a side note :
I stay away from aqua dynamic balls valves. I've got 3-4 that leaked. One of them I used for a house main and I had to call the city back to be able to change it out in a difficult spot.


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## exclamation (Mar 11, 2013)

Well myself that’s the one place I will use a sharky b. I’m no pex expert either but I just recently learned there’s 3 different formulations of pex which all have their own properties regarding flexibility and stretchieness and memory - I’m paranoid to stretch pipe that wasn’t designed for it - obviously the expander tool is the one I use. It’s too rare that I run across pex needing repair for me to justify buying a crimp tool so push fitting is my answer - even though it wouldn’t be my first choice, I think it’s fine to use on those rare occasions.

To those of you who do mix fittings/pipe - which connection type are you using? All crimp or all expanded?


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## canuck92 (Apr 1, 2016)

Pex in houses wirsbo on commercial, or whatever the engineer specifies.
My old boss had me crimping a pex r-19 onto wirsbo i asked if thats alright to do( long time ago ) i wouldnt crimp wirsbo on my own jobs though. I dont want to do trial an error on my dime and reputation.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

PM will be sent to both of you. Too many diy eyes.


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Tango said:


> PM will be sent to both of you. Too many diy eyes.


Something that's probably not really apparent to the DIY community or any of the box stores.

:vs_smirk:


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## Debo22 (Feb 15, 2015)

As far as I know, you can crimp any brand, Wirsbo included. You can only expand Wirsbo/Uponor though


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

LISTEN....
you are better off to just save yourself a lot of time and misery and just admit that a sharkbite fitting is a universal repair fitting for ALL pexes except for* KI-Tech p*ipe... Duhhhh That is what a sharkbite is best used for....:surprise::surprise: There I have said it.......

We have repaired old style *grey poly *with sharkbites and gotten ourselves out of terrible jams and messes that could have literally ruined a whole day attempting to find suitable fittings for..... and of course its always in a mobile home or old house where the customer does not have a pot to piss in and cant afford a re-pipe

I would never re-pipe a house in sharkbite fittings but I have seen it done before..... 

Sharkbites are best for adapting different brands of pexes togethor
...there I have said it again.... and I am no less a man for admitting it....:vs_OMG::vs_OMG:


just say this mantra over a few times like a meditation..

their is no shame in using sharkbites, 
there is no shame in using sharkbites 
their is no shame in using sharkbites, 
there is no shame in using sharkbites 
their is no shame in using sharkbites, 
there is no shame in using sharkbites


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

canuck92 said:


> Pex in houses wirsbo on commercial, or whatever the engineer specifies.
> My old boss had me crimping a pex r-19 onto wirsbo i asked if thats alright to do( long time ago ) i wouldnt crimp wirsbo on my own jobs though. I dont want to do trial an error on my dime and reputation.



You are not supposed to crimp wirsbo... They even had a re-call on some clamp type system they tried back in about 2005...

. maybe it will last a while but I would not want the troubles that could happen when that hot line decides to pull apart in a ceiling.... WIRSBO is the best system out there ....It wont freeze and break and the compression tool made by milwaukee is the best on the market...


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## goeswiththeflow (Feb 24, 2018)

> the compression tool made by milwaukee is the best on the market...



Does anyone know when the patent expires, so that less expensive alternatives will be available?


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

I was looking at another brand of SB today looking for emergency fittings and I saw_"Push N' Connect PEX Push-Connect "_ .

I read carefully and it won't fit all kinds of pipe. So I guess it's not recommended for poly-B or wirsbo.

Push fittings work with Copper, PEX, and CPVC Pipe
http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/pex-push-connect-value-pack-0631846p.html#srp




Now moving on to Shark Bite it states the same thing. I'm pretty sure they had a wider range to connect to different pipes. Looks like they got into problems and now only recommended for cpvc, pex and copper.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

Tango said:


> I was looking at another brand of SB today looking for emergency fittings and I saw_"Push N' Connect PEX Push-Connect "_ .
> 
> I read carefully and it won't fit all kinds of pipe. So I guess it's not recommended for poly-B or wirsbo.
> 
> ...



I have not heard anything about sharkbite not being a universal kind of connection for all the pexes..... Their are a few shark bite copy cats that are cheaper and I have found that the knock off from Barnetts is a pretty good one.... 

The sharkbites do work on Poly butuline pipe.... as long as you use the inserts that come with them
ion


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## breplum (Mar 21, 2009)

Master Mark said:


> You are not supposed to crimp wirsbo... They even had a re-call on some clamp type system they tried back in about 2005...
> 
> . maybe it will last a while but I would not want the troubles that could happen when that hot line decides to pull apart in a ceiling.... WIRSBO is the best system out there ....It wont freeze and break and the compression tool made by milwaukee is the best on the market...


Master Mark, in your last sentence, do you mean "expansion" tool and not what you wrote, "compression" tool?

I to own the Milwaukee expansion tools. and love them. I bought two so that I don't have to unscrew the different sized heads when working. Too bad the broad acceptance in our northern CA area, meant I only started using the equip. at the tail end of my career.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

breplum said:


> Master Mark, in your last sentence, do you mean "expansion" tool and not what you wrote, "compression" tool?
> 
> I to own the Milwaukee expansion tools. and love them. I bought two so that I don't have to unscrew the different sized heads when working. Too bad the broad acceptance in our northern CA area, meant I only started using the equip. at the tail end of my career.




I dont know exactly what kind of name it goes by but it is the best tool for expanding those plastic rings that goes on the wirsbo pipe .....

it is a fantastic tool https://www.tools-plus.com/milwaukee-2432-22.html


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> I dont know exactly what kind of name it goes by but it is the best tool for expanding those plastic rings that goes on the wirsbo pipe .....
> 
> it is a fantastic tool https://www.tools-plus.com/milwaukee-2432-22.html


I bought the DeWalt one. It takes a larger battery so it lasts about twice as long. I did a whole repipe and only changed the battery once. One for underneath, one for connections above. No trips back to the charger from under the house. The battery on the dewalt is also big enough and square so the tool sits more balanced when it is laying down.

The other thing I didn't like about the milwaukee batteries is the flimsy plastic tabs that lock them into the tool. The other dude I used to work with dropped a battery once just from normal height and it landed wrong and busted one of those wings. Battery didn't stay in the tool after that.

I mean yeah, obviously be careful, but $^&$ happens and durability is something to consider when factoring life expectancy of a tool.


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## 89plumbum (May 14, 2011)

Toli said:


> I’m not an expert in the world of pex. I have always been of the opinion that I shouldn’t mix different manufacturers fittings/joining methods with different manufacturers tubing. My worry is if something would go wrong I would have two manufacturers pointing the finger at each other with me stuck in the middle.


To what degree will a manufacturer actually step up and fulfill their warranty obligations? It's seems in every case of flooding I've ever herd of, liability insurance is what covers the damage. Has anyone ever had a manufacturer foot the bill?


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

89plumbum said:


> To what degree will a manufacturer actually step up and fulfill their warranty obligations? It's seems in every case of flooding I've ever herd of, liability insurance is what covers the damage. Has anyone ever had a manufacturer foot the bill?


I think the dishwasher topic is a dead horse not worth beating anymore. Those mfg won't cover anything in terms of property damage. 

The only experience i've had with major issues were these super low quality toilets my boss was buying and the fill valves (installed at factory) were snapping off at the tank connection. I'm not sure how many of those his insurance had to cover, because the mfg was into the wind.

Haven't had any issues with name brand stuff though. . . . Kinda strange right?


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## Toli (Nov 7, 2015)

89plumbum said:


> To what degree will a manufacturer actually step up and fulfill their warranty obligations? It's seems in every case of flooding I've ever herd of, liability insurance is what covers the damage. Has anyone ever had a manufacturer foot the bill?




That’s a good question that I can’t answer. I assume it would need to be a clear cut, no ifs, ands or buts case of product failure? But then lawyers get involved and all bets are off. 

I can tell you this, I don’t want to get caught in the middle.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

89plumbum said:


> To what degree will a manufacturer actually step up and fulfill their warranty obligations? It's seems in every case of flooding I've ever herd of, liability insurance is what covers the damage. Has anyone ever had a manufacturer foot the bill?



What they cover if the 3$ fitting blows and cause a major flood? Actually they will refund you 3$, says so on the package on most of them. And you have to send it in for them to determine if they feel you will get your 3$ back.


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

solder wont blow


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## Alan (Jun 18, 2008)

We had two leaks that we ended up discovering were repairs done by excavating crews in a driveway.

The first one we fixed was a piece of 1" poly heated up and shoved onto the copper mainline with hose clamps. 

The second one was 1" x sch 40 sharkbite couplings with pvc between them. The sharkbite fitting had actually deteriorated in the ground and the whole thing came apart.

I'm going to stick with exposed or accessible locations only on the sharkbites no matter who tells me they are ok to conceal.


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

Something to consider

Dealing with all sorts of materials & products any installer needs to throw "it may work well" out.

To be covered under any lawsuit or warranty work an installer "must" comply with the manufactures installation instructions period. Some are more detailed. If the install guide states you must use their brand, etc. if you don't install like that and any litigation comes up you have lost before you even speak.

For instance "house wrap" you have "Tyvek" which is brand name. They have about 4 or 5 variables of installation with different wall construction designs, new construction or retro-fit. Details on how and you must use their tape. A cheaper brand basically doesn't bring up any details on brand materials.

Failures happen, litigation comes up, they look at the installation, violate their instructions and you own your own. Does it make a difference, maybe not.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Alan said:


> We had two leaks that we ended up discovering were repairs done by excavating crews in a driveway.
> 
> The first one we fixed was a piece of 1" poly heated up and shoved onto the copper mainline with hose clamps.
> 
> ...



Obviously it has a whatever contractor... I just spoke to a guy who went to school with me to get his contractor licence.(se specializes in mold remediation and renos) He said he did illegal plumbing but was tired of it. No $hit, I think he just realized what he just said and he asked for business cards. Hopefully he calls me instead, I gave him a stack of 50 cards! As I was saying in another thread it's corrupt as hell.

As you know....SB can not be buried in the ground and only compression approved fittings for underground copper.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

Here's a repair I had to do on these 2 pex, both were cut. The house was real far in the woods outside of town.

The guy says my radiant floor is far away, don't worry. I start chipping and 4 minutes in I cut the wire!

Before the repair:


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

Sucks

Is that an auto vent partially clogged?

Never in Illinois, no mechanical vents in less in a trailer.


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

GAN said:


> Sucks
> 
> Is that an auto vent partially clogged?
> 
> Never in Illinois, no mechanical vents in less in a trailer.


Was the auto vent comment towards me?

If so it's the homeowner who put that there, nothing is glued. He has a kitchen island there... These guys do their own plumbing and only call pros when they are real stuck...and judging from what he does as a living he makes over 90-100 000$ a year.


There was a 1 1/2 abs all fubar running below the ceiling probably feeding a temporary kitchen upstairs.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Master Mark said:


> You are not supposed to crimp wirsbo... They even had a re-call on some clamp type system they tried back in about 2005...
> 
> . maybe it will last a while but I would not want the troubles that could happen when that hot line decides to pull apart in a ceiling.... WIRSBO is the best system out there ....It wont freeze and break and the compression tool made by milwaukee is the best on the market...


The cost of wirsbo is way more than regular pex,I wouldn’t trade my zurnpex for wirsbo for nothing,what makes wirsbo so good and better than all others???i don’t see it


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Tango said:


> I was looking at another brand of SB today looking for emergency fittings and I saw_"Push N' Connect PEX Push-Connect "_ .
> 
> I read carefully and it won't fit all kinds of pipe. So I guess it's not recommended for poly-B or wirsbo.
> 
> ...


If you use a sharkbite on gray poly pipe (trailer water lines)it will blow off one day down the road,I have seen it happen time after time,had one mobile home that had a working pressure regulator and good working expansion tank and someone put a sharkbite on a leak and sure enough,they called me to come out and repair a leak that was because a sharkbite fitting blew off the poly pipe,I never ever use sharkbite on poly pipe but I will use sharkbite to transition between two different brands of pex


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## JohnnieSqueeze (Mar 23, 2016)

no shark bites. I have sb caps on my truck for temporary and emergency use only. 

otherwise i have a jet swet which I keep close at hand, if water starts going i stuff that thing in and 5 mins later have a full port sweated in. 


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## Tango (Jan 13, 2018)

JohnnieSqueeze said:


> no shark bites. I have sb caps on my truck for temporary and emergency use only.
> 
> otherwise i have a jet swet which I keep close at hand, if water starts going i stuff that thing in and 5 mins later have a full port sweated in.
> 
> ...


I was lucky and waited 6 months for daily search to get a deal on the brand "Watergate" I got it new in an open kit. I used it only once and it was pretty neat.

I now carry SB slip on ball valves, couplings and caps in case I need them.


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