# Cpvc



## 22rifle (Jun 14, 2008)

I used it on my PEX jobs for the line from the T&P if it was an "enclosed space" where it wouldn't be easily bumped. I also used it to repair existing CPVC. Otherwise, since I left home (and my dad's business) I have never used CPVC.

Is it truly as crappy as I think it is or was I just being narrow minded?


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## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

22rifle said:


> I used it on my PEX job for the line from the T&P if it was an "enclosed space" where it wouldn't be easily bumped. I also used it to repair existing CPVC. Otherwise, since I left home (and my dad's business) I have never used CPVC.
> 
> Is it truly as crappy as I think it is or was I just being narrow minded?


 I use if for reliefs and only use flowguard gold by charlotte


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

I use it like crazy. Flowgaurd.


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## PlumberDave (Jan 4, 2009)

22rifle said:


> I used it on my PEX jobs for the line from the T&P if it was an "enclosed space" where it wouldn't be easily bumped. I also used it to repair existing CPVC. Otherwise, since I left home (and my dad's business) I have never used CPVC.
> 
> Is it truly as crappy as I think it is or was I just being narrow minded?


no, it is crappier than you think. worst poo pile made, except for the work it provides.


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## Proud Plumber (Sep 15, 2008)

I use flowguard here, copper is not a viable option for us. Hence cpvc and pex are the alternative. I will say I think we are headed for problems with it though. I find it odd that the fittings brown over time. Not to mention that I have witnessed long runs trough attics with no type of expansion loop. Even worse in those same attics the plumbers used pre loaded tube talons and took there 22 oz estwing hammers and drove the nails home nice and tight to the trusses causing strange noises when the pipe expands and contracts. Either way i will be interesting to see the outcome years down the road.


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## user823 (Feb 3, 2009)

I've never used cpvc and I never will.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

It's every bit as crappy as you think and more.




22rifle said:


> I used it on my PEX jobs for the line from the T&P if it was an "enclosed space" where it wouldn't be easily bumped. I also used it to repair existing CPVC. Otherwise, since I left home (and my dad's business) I have never used CPVC.
> 
> Is it truly as crappy as I think it is or was I just being narrow minded?


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I'll post my cpvc picture collection when I get home today:jester:


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## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

seems to me overtime it gets real brittle and easy to break. I won't use it unless I have to.


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## tnoisaw (Jun 16, 2009)

Since I've been in Florida I've used a lot of it. It was not legal for me to use it in Iowa. 

A few days ago I visited a new Burger King here in Daytona Beach. I'm standing at the urinal draining my anaconda and checking out the plumbing which is not easy with my middle age eyes without my readers. I saw a 1 inch cpvc male adapter sticking out the wall and wanted so bad to see how tight it was but I had to wait until I was done with my business, because as we all know, it takes two hands to handle a whopper. Anyway, when I was done and flushed the flushometer shifted on the urinal and in the wall. I don't think it was properly secured in the wall. 

This will probably be a near future service call.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

If its as bad as everyone thinks, and Ive seen some problems, my neck of the woods will have some good service work soon.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I'm already getting tons of cpvc slab leaks:thumbup:


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

I have just one word for you son...... Plastics


Let me ask a question here. Remember CPVC before flow-guard gold? Remember how crappy it was and how the new flow-guard was so much better? Turns out it's crap also. Now let's re-visit Polybutlyne. Remember how it was the new miracle pipe? Going to replace everything else on the market. Now here we are with pex and guess what folks, its like deja' vu all over again. Sure copper gets pin holes in it from bad water. But ask yourself. Have you ever seen copper catastrophically fail? I mean blow a properly swetted fitting off or just break off? Have you ever seen copper split lengthwise for no apparent reason? Plastics Baaaaaah.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Protech said:


> I'm already getting tons of cpvc slab leaks:thumbup:


Some of those slab leaks have probably been there since the begining. I seen more slabs busted by one of my old work places from CPVC leaks. Not enough glue, in a bind, not buried deep enough. Or, TOO much glue, and the fitting is clogged, in the slab. It sucks balls. But, I still use it sometimes, just very carefully.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

nhmaster3015 said:


> I have just one word for you son...... Plastics
> 
> 
> Let me ask a question here. Remember CPVC before flow-guard gold? Remember how crappy it was and how the new flow-guard was so much better? Turns out it's crap also. Now let's re-visit Polybutlyne. Remember how it was the new miracle pipe? Going to replace everything else on the market. Now here we are with pex and guess what folks, its like deja' vu all over again. Sure copper gets pin holes in it from bad water. But ask yourself. Have you ever seen copper catastrophically fail? I mean blow a properly swetted fitting off or just break off? Have you ever seen copper split lengthwise for no apparent reason? Plastics Baaaaaah.


 Its gonna take some serious time and irrefutable evidence to move you .......I just hope ...really hope I never have to admit you were right.


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## Proud Plumber (Sep 15, 2008)

The only failed systems I have seen as of late have been improperly installed systems. I use CPVC because my clients as me to. No way would I even dream of installing copper with our water conditions here. Our industry needs a major overhaul and MFG needs a major ass kicking to develop better products, that withstand the our world a little better.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

Proud Plumber said:


> The only failed systems I have seen as of late have been improperly installed systems. I use CPVC because my clients as me to. No way would I even dream of installing copper with our water conditions here. Our industry needs a major overhaul and MFG needs a major ass kicking to develop better products, that withstand the our world a little better.


Why not use the technology that already exists to treat the water as opposed to expecting manufacturers develop a wonder product that may never exist?


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## Proud Plumber (Sep 15, 2008)

...


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Because the life cycle cost to own, operate and maintain said equipent
is an order of magnitude higher than the cost to install a well designed plastic system.




Killertoiletspider said:


> Why not use the technology that already exists to treat the water as opposed to expecting manufacturers develop a wonder product that may never exist?


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Someone say that again, I dont think they hear you in Maine.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Have used a bunch of it ,,,, It's ok . Still a copper guy . We'll see , we'll see ,we'll see.

I hope & PRAY that CPVC & Pex don't go the way of PolyB ,, Cause NOW there is so much installed that there are not enough of us to go around this time !!!

HAPPY 4TH !!!!!!!!!


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

Protech said:


> Because the life cycle cost to own, operate and maintain said equipent
> is an order of magnitude higher than the cost to install a well designed plastic system.


The lawsuits over failed plastic systems speak volumes on why treating the water to make it compatible with proven piping systems a more viable alternative.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Lawsuits in America are no indicator for the right or wrongness of anything--a conservative should know that. Plastics have benefitted society. Medical industry ( maybe not a good example?) ,packaging industry(maybe not a good example?), maufacturing industry(maybe not a good example?) and on and on. You cant escape plastic and all its sinister, hideous, threatening, degrading, and cost saving properties. Check out some of the benefits to society of plastic. The latest heart transplant-plastic and titanium--a little pricey for potable water--leave out the titanium.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

stillaround said:


> Lawsuits in America are no indicator for the right or wrongness of anything--a conservative should know that. Plastics have benefitted society.


I am not a conservative, and I prefer to not be pigeonholed into any political affiliation. Plastic does have it's benefits, I am of the opinion they are limited as far as plumbing is concerned, materials that do not suffer the shortcomings that plastic do are a better alternative.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I would be suprised if you were( Chicago area), nhmaster gave thanks to your comment and that part was a shot over his bow. Lawsuits found a way into the plumbing industry with the help of the media, Shell Oil being a target( probabbly deserved it)---theres got to be a conspiracy here somewhere. But on a more real tone-plastics even if they go thru several versions to get the right one have been no worse for wear than copper in many demo's. The fallout being the cost to property owners--and that being no worse than copper--the class action suit cant be realisticly entered into the equation. ....... I should correct a little here. In Florida there is as much copper damage as anything else. And I never use the word conservative as a negative characterization. In Chicago when I was there, galvanized hot lines had a useful life of 25 years and rusted closed. Nobody makes a big deal about that. A lot of high rises and buildings required to have galvy. I admit the need for structural integrity of the piping is an asset but the residential areas of the country that do well with plastic shouldnt catch the opinions that cant be proven.


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## tnoisaw (Jun 16, 2009)

Since I've been in Florida and have seen a lot of CPVC I have not had to repair a problem with it. I have had about three slab leaks with copper.

The first plumber I worked with complained about copper. He said that galvenized was the way to go.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I have galv. in my house and the well water doesnt do it harm. Some soil conditions and when city water hits seem to shorten the life of it. Im not that militant about any of this except to challenge the drone of the anti plastic lobby-and I have no personal grudge anywhere. Weve put a lot in the last 8 years. Before Flowgard it was worthy of all the plastic attacks Ive heard.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

tnoisaw said:


> Since I've been in Florida I've used a lot of it. It was not legal for me to use it in Iowa.
> 
> A few days ago I visited a new Burger King here in Daytona Beach. I'm standing at the urinal draining my anaconda and checking out the plumbing which is not easy with my middle age eyes without my readers. I saw a 1 inch cpvc male adapter sticking out the wall and wanted so bad to see how tight it was but I had to wait until I was done with my business, because as we all know, it takes two hands to handle a whopper. Anyway, when I was done and flushed the flushometer shifted on the urinal and in the wall. I don't think it was properly secured in the wall.
> 
> This will probably be a near future service call.


Your Ana what?







:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

In Florida, it appears to me that the cost of the damages due to the failure of metallic systems far exceeds the damages of plastic ones. Even as bad as cpvc is, I would install it here in a heart beat if copper was my only other alternative.


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## tnoisaw (Jun 16, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Your Ana what?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's my story so I can say what ever I want so you leave my inchworm out of this.


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Just havign fun wit cha!


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Protech said:


> In Florida, it appears to me that the cost of the damages due to the failure of metallic systems far exceeds the damages of plastic ones. Even as bad as cpvc is, I would install it here in a heart beat if copper was my only other alternative.


I think you are right. 

This fear of plastic has gotten deep into the psyche of dear nhmaster, in one post he'd be willing for a plumbing gestapo, and in his latest he put on the Ebenezer Scrooge mask and said plastics...baaaah. Its bringing out some deep stuff:laughing:...(just having fun..no offense)

Now I understand the Chicago mindset against plastic having lived there...they want a 10 story 70000 ton brick structure to burn and crumble and the water pipe to still be standing with the flag waving and the whole neighborhood coming out to admire the flag and say, " its another great day in america..good thing it wasnt plastic pipe":laughing:.

Yes I do have something better to do--have a nice rest of the weekend to all including the anti-plastic patriots


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

stillaround said:


> I think you are right.
> 
> This fear of plastic has gotten deep into the psyche of dear nhmaster, in one post he'd be willing for a plumbing gestapo, and in his latest he put on the Ebenezer Scrooge mask and said plastics...baaaah. Its bringing out some deep stuff:laughing:...(just having fun..no offense)
> 
> ...


I have no idea what point you are trying to make with this post, nor do I really care, it has become obvious that all you want to do is make fun of anyone that questions the wisdom of using plastic water pipe as opposed to more proven piping systems.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Relax a bit. What level of proof will ever convince you. Humor is the easier way to deal with obstinacy.

On second thought, if you are just sincerely questioning the use of a product as as your posts suggest--I respect that and would not want to ridicule or belittle that in any way. There is a risk assessment element to the plastic pipe issue missing. Chicago unions tried to site toxic gas for burning pvc and health threats to drinking water with little credible evidence while supporting lead. Totally self serving. The restrictive policy of Chicago code makers and union power brokers does limit the ability to have more affordable housing. It also I think restricts the open mindedness of plumbers absorbed in that system. Not trying to irritate you.


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

I don't see anyone being too obstinate. There are piping methods that will be around forever. There are other piping methods that, while they have their place, are probably shorter term materials. Time will tell.

I like copper where the water is not aggressive. 

You guys can use pex or cpvc. It doesn't make me a dang bit of difference. 

I don't want to argue nor do I want you guys to argue. Why don't you all celebrate the fact that over 200 years ago we bucked the system and put it to "the man" (or you could celebrate the fact that ILPlumber made uber $$ at the French Lick Casino):thumbup:

I was betting big when a guy wanted to play that had never played craps before. He got the dice and rolled for 55 minutes straight without crapping out. After it was over the pit boss gave him the dice. I would say how much I made but, the revenuers might be reading. Lets just say it was VERY satisfactory.

And now back to your regularly scheduled argument. 

Plastic sux:laughing::jester::jester:


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

stillaround said:


> Relax a bit. What level of proof will ever convince you. Humor is the easier way to deal with obstinacy.
> 
> On second thought, if you are just sincerely questioning the use of a product as as your posts suggest--I respect that and would not want to ridicule or belittle that in any way. There is a risk assessment element to the plastic pipe issue missing. Chicago unions tried to site toxic gas for burning pvc and health threats to drinking water with little credible evidence while supporting lead. Totally self serving. The restrictive policy of Chicago code makers and union power brokers does limit the ability to have more affordable housing. It also I think restricts the open mindedness of plumbers absorbed in that system. Not trying to irritate you.


Plastic waste and vent systems have proven themselves to be self destructive in tall buildings, as have plastic water pipe systems, to the point that manufactuers tried to create fittings to fix the problem, the fact that the material also burns was secondary till the MGM Grand burned to the ground. There are thousands of lead water services in the Chicago area, and the number of people that have lead related health issues can be counted in double digits, and most have nothing to do with water services and everything to do with lead based paint.

This thread has nothing to do with unions, or code, you chose to drag your agenda against them into it, to suggest that I am less than open minded says a lot.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I dont want to argue as Im sure you dont. I would bet you are an excellent plumber. I will soften any rhetoric with you as to not offend. The argument against plastic for fear of water quality issues would be a weak argument in Chicago because of the lead even if there are not casualties. The disdain for plastic because of tall buildings would be a weak argument because so much of the country isnt tall buildings. The suggestion to have water treatment would be viable if expense wasnt a factor. Each person is different and I wont try and lump you in with anyone. Sorry if that messed with you. The use of plastic has much to do with unions trying to curtail homeowner do it yourselfers. The California thing on the opposing side was unions and environmentalists. They are in the mix.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

I have used CPVC when the specs call for it. My jobs all come with plans. The plans specify what materials to use and thats what I go by. I prefer copper and cast iron, but when he who pays says to use............


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## tnoisaw (Jun 16, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Just havign fun wit cha!


I know. If post something like that I expect a hit or two. LOL


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