# Water heater situation



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

All,

Got a situation i could use a little help with ;

75 gal/gas heater measures 27" across , basement was finished with NO REGARD of removal of heater . Biggest opening i have is 24" , furnace , door frames ,corners ,etc . 

Been a LONG time since i had to cut one out and i just CAN'T remember how is the best way ?? Cut the jacket off , remove insulation , carry the parts ???

anybody done this lately ???

Thx !!! Cal


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

I had to cut a 75 in half to get it out of an attic......it makes a mess and takes about 20 minutes from start to finish. I used a sawzall. Wear gloves da metal is sharp. The insualation was foam and made a mess.


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

You might need to split lengthwise, or cut it in 3 equal parts. We had to cut apart an abandoned 120 gallon commercial heater and an abandonded compressor, in a school basement. Very messy.


----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

Take your plug-in saw and some good blades. Cut to fit.


----------



## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*how much you chargeing???*

75 gal/gas heater measures 27" across , basement was finished with NO REGARD of removal of heater . Biggest opening i have is 24" , furnace , door frames ,corners ,etc . 

Been a LONG time since i had to cut one out and i just CAN'T remember how is the best way ?? Cut the jacket off , remove insulation , carry the parts ???

anybody done this lately ???


I am wondering how much you are going to charge for this???

and are you going to put a 75 gallon back into the home?? The bradford white is not too big, but still you got to tear something up to get one back in



a 12 pack of Lennox steel cutting sawzall blades and 
2 big dummy apprentices would be the preferred way
 to get that pig out of the basement



just wondering...what is is worth to do...


----------



## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> 75 gal/gas heater measures 27" across , basement was finished with NO REGARD of removal of heater . Biggest opening i have is 24" , furnace , door frames ,corners ,etc .
> 
> Been a LONG time since i had to cut one out and i just CAN'T remember how is the best way ?? Cut the jacket off , remove insulation , carry the parts ???
> 
> ...


With respect to what goes back in, ... tankless would be the obvious answer.


----------



## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

I would put in a pair of 50's


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

That would be one of the few times I would actually try to push tankless.



smellslike$tome said:


> With respect to what goes back in, ... tankless would be the obvious answer.


----------



## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

I would start by pealing off the jacket and insulation. That might give you your 3" to get it out. If not, you'll have to cut it up into pieces. Probably use a sawzall.


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

If it's an electric, you can pull the elements and cut around the circumference starting at the element port.

If gas, pull the thermostat and make the same cut. once you have it cut in two you can cut it lengthwise.

Use a 120V sawzall with a 18-20 tpi metal blade. The shorter the blade the better. You will go thru 3-4 blades. I've had good results using a porter cable "tiger sawzall" due to the long stoke and high torque.


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

i have done this many years ago,you can use a few different tools, sawzawl ,portable bandsaw? or how about a portable cut off saw with 15" wheel?then you can always use the maul.....sawzawl would be the way to go. to bad it isnt a ruud monel then it would be worth it's waiting gold.


----------



## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Please tell me how you would go about cutting a WH up with a portable band saw?

Sawzall gets my vote, followed closely by a body drop from the top rope to get her down to 23 7/8"


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Portable bandsaw?







Nope, I dont see how that would do it.

A portable cutt off saw? Like this, a little extreme no matter wut size wheel.







:laughing:

I think i would use a saws all, well, hold on, I KNOW i would use a saw zall, and yes fellas, a portable one.:yes:


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

how bought a plasma cutter? that would do it wouldnt it IP?


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Flyin Brian said:


> i have done this many years ago,you can use a few different tools, sawzawl ,portable bandsaw? or how about a portable cut off saw with 15" wheel?then you can always use the maul.....sawzawl would be the way to go. to bad it isnt a ruud monel then it would be worth it's waiting gold.



Wut is a ruud monel?


----------



## leak1 (Mar 25, 2009)

ruud monel :blink::blink::blink: ???


----------



## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

Similar situation, ceiling was 14' and my helper was not ....shall we say, not very smart. I did 2 of these on this job, took about 30 min for the first one and 3 blades, second one was about 20ish and only two blades. i ran through 3 batteries each...go with a corded saw. Make sure you cut it to the right sizes because you won't be able to bend or anything...1/4" cold rolled steel...tough stuff. As Master said, it's a little messy.


----------



## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

...and don't start with me on the gas again, I paid my dues on that one.......


----------



## tooslow (Jul 17, 2009)

*water heater demo*

The prudent way is a skillsaw with a metal carborundum blade.


----------



## Double-A (Aug 17, 2008)

You might be able to just cut off the jacket and remove the insulation and squeeze the tank through. Pull the hinge pins and remove the door and also cut your new heater box carefully to use as guards on each side of the doorway to prevent scuffing if you have to carry it out. If you use a hand truck, this might not be an issue. 

Wear leather gloves and be very careful with that steel jacket. It's sharp as hell and someone is gonna get careless if not reminded often.


----------



## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

I was looking for the pic, but it may be in some file that I didn't lable correctly but you must know, after you cut the the tank the flue is also in there and that must be cut, that means you need to open up a section big enough to fit your saw in and safetly chop that too. This is of course for a gas heater, not electric. I forget if the OP stated it was electric or not.....


Edit to add: OK, it is a gas heater, when you cut all the way around that thing still ain't gonna budge. I'll dig around for what it actually looks like....bring lots of blades


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Master Mark said:


> 75 gal/gas heater measures 27" across , basement was finished with NO REGARD of removal of heater . Biggest opening i have is 24" , furnace , door frames ,corners ,etc .
> 
> Been a LONG time since i had to cut one out and i just CAN'T remember how is the best way ?? Cut the jacket off , remove insulation , carry the parts ???
> 
> ...


Thx Mark , working on the pricw and using a 65 gal Brad white !!


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Thanks all for your quick and GREAT responses !! Love this place !!!!!!!!!

Any who ,, I tried to push tankless ,,, NO GO these folks know what they want ! 65 gal Brad white ,, which is fine with me .

My plan is to cut the jacket off , remove insulation , then get to tank with appears to be 2 1/4" in side the jacket ,,, that should get me down 4 1/2" and with a helper and hand cart ,,,, OUT THE DOOR !!! Good in theory . Otherwise it's GRINDER / Sawzall time !

Thx again !!!

Cal


----------



## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Cal said:


> Thanks all for your quick and GREAT responses !! Love this place !!!!!!!!!
> 
> Any who ,, I tried to push tankless ,,, NO GO these folks know what they want ! 65 gal Brad white ,, which is fine with me .
> 
> ...



That's great for the old tank but how are you going to get the new one in? You can't cut it up in pieces so it will fit throught the doorway.


----------



## Rootster (May 21, 2009)

i think the 65 gal bradford white is 23" wide


----------



## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*the price ...*



Cal said:


> Thx Mark , working on the pricw and using a 65 gal Brad white !!


 
I would probably give them a "Not To Exceed price'' ,

cause it might not need to be cut into peices, or it might be literally as mean as hell to get out

and it depends on how busy you are .....

Normally we put in a 75 gallon for about 1400.

add for pain and suffering.... hmmmmm 700

then add a little more pain and suffering......... 500

then consider what the customer is willing 
to choke down.... 

and you got your price:laughing:


my estimate is based on "mid west " priceing..
yours could be substantially higher..


----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

New Idea!! Would it be possible to leave the old WH where its at? Drain it out and leave it there. Just a thought.


----------



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Flyin Brian said:


> i have done this many years ago,you can use a few different tools, sawzawl ,portable bandsaw? or how about a portable cut off saw with 15" wheel?then you can always use the maul.....sawzawl would be the way to go. to bad it isnt a ruud monel then it would be worth it's waiting gold.


If you're gonna use a cutoff saw indoors, you better have a good exhaust fan and some fresh air coming in. Or it's gonna be adios amigos....Not a good choice.


----------



## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

Airgap said:


> If you're gonna use a cutoff saw indoors, you better have a good exhaust fan and some fresh air coming in. Or it's gonna be adios amigos....Not a good choice.


They make electric Partner Saws.


----------



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Buddy of mine stripped the jacket and insulation off an old one. piped his cold to it, mounted it horizontal above his woodstove, now he has a preheater in the wintertime. 

This does require some sort of radiant heat source tho......:whistling2:


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Bosch makes a electric cutoff/concrete saw. I own several of them. Gotta have a 20 amp circuit to plug into with NOTHING else running on that circuit. You also need a fat extension cord and even with all that it will still trip the breaker if you bear down onto the saw too hard.

The way I described earlier will cut the heater up way faster though. I've done it a few times and the right sawzall and blade combo will beet the cut off wheel hands down.

I’m speaking from direct experience not speculation.




Airgap said:


> If you're gonna use a cutoff saw indoors, you better have a good exhaust fan and some fresh air coming in. Or it's gonna be adios amigos....Not a good choice.


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

This is how I do it with a gas heater. Tool=corded sawzall with 18tpi blade. You'll go thru a few blades.

Once you've got it into 3 pieces you'll need to cut the baffle tube out of the center as well.

I don't waste my time removing the outer jacket and/or insulation ether.


----------



## Associated Plum (Nov 4, 2008)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Wut is a ruud monel?


 
Copper Nickel alloy water heater made by the Rudd Water Heater Manufacturing Co in the 40's and 50's. There are still a lot in use today.

I think I have seen only one of the leak. Most of the times teh thermostat will go bad of which there is no replacement or the flue was soot up and the jacket would have to be removed to clean it.

Oh and one other thing a 20 gallon tank was scrapping for about $60.00 a few years ago with the steel ends.

In this same era you copper lined, Aluminum lined (alumalux), Concrete (Coleman Vitrock) adn others


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Portable bandsaw?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i just threw the band saw out there....i never used it to cut a W.H. in half,athough i did use it once to cut a steele bathtub in half.


the portable cut off saw would be a bit touchy to ,i have used the sawzawhll on the one we did many moons ago.



wait i just go another idea,how about a portable hydrulic smasher? ya know like they have for 12 oz. alumnium pop cans? cAN crusher? you could call it the water heater crusher im gonna go try and get a patnent on one right now....


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

ILPlumber said:


> Please tell me how you would go about cutting a WH up with a portable band saw?
> 
> Sawzall gets my vote, followed closely by a body drop from the top rope to get her down to 23 7/8"


the portable bandsaw statement was a oxy mooron,works well on steele bathtubs though.


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

You know, i look at the stihl saw pictured, just like the one i have. Talk about a tool so beautiful, that you would hate to use it! Might get it dirty!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Steel bath tub? They weigh like what, 50lbs? why on earth would you need to take the time to cut one of those in half?


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Wut is a ruud monel?


 
ok jr. you don't know what a RUUD MONEL IS?where did you say you are the sunshine state? you will know what they are if you see one monel is a certain type of high grade metal used way back when,as a matter of fact it is used to build airplaines,they are worth $$$ at the scrap yards
of cousre you have to strip them.....


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Steel bath tub? They weigh like what, 50lbs? why on earth would you need to take the time to cut one of those in half?


very tight confines and just got the saw new it was a porter cable cut right threw it like butta.


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

Associated Plum said:


> Copper Nickel alloy water heater made by the Rudd Water Heater Manufacturing Co in the 40's and 50's. There are still a lot in use today.
> 
> I think I have seen only one of the leak. Most of the times teh thermostat will go bad of which there is no replacement or the flue was soot up and the jacket would have to be removed to clean it.
> 
> ...


i scrapped 2 ruud monel heaters in the last 3 years from supply houses where they were droped off for the scrap man,alot of people don't know about them old school plumbers do that is how i found out about them. i scrapped one that was a 75 gal. gas ruud laundry master i cut the steele ends off and i stuck a magnet to the the monel and it stuck?w.t.f.? anywho took it to the scrap yard and they put a special electronic machine on it like a geiger counter to determine what the meatl was, i belive it was zinc and nickle so i did not get the price if it was monel but i got like 2.00 a lb. maybe more i can't remember,the other was pure monel i got like 4.00 a pound for that baby.


----------



## Flyin Brian (Aug 22, 2009)

Airgap said:


> If you're gonna use a cutoff saw indoors, you better have a good exhaust fan and some fresh air coming in. Or it's gonna be adios amigos....Not a good choice.


 
your right airgap but the cutoff saw i was reffering to was electric but i have never used one for that purpose,sawzawll is the way to go.


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

Flyin Brian said:


> ok jr. you don't know what a RUUD MONEL IS?where did you say you are the sunshine state? you will know what they are if you see one monel is a certain type of high grade metal used way back when,as a matter of fact it is used to build airplaines,they are worth $$$ at the scrap yards
> of cousre you have to strip them.....



Dont know who your refering to as JR. Lets keep the deformaties to a minimum umkay?


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Keep it on Topic,

I myself have not had to cut a water heater up to get it removed.


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> New Idea!! Would it be possible to leave the old WH where its at? Drain it out and leave it there. Just a thought.


 Nah ,, they want it out !!


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> Keep it on Topic,
> 
> I myself have not had to cut a water heater up to get it removed.


 How bout a plane ride and a new experience ? LOL I'll buy ya a steak !!

Between the two of us ,,i'm sure we could mangle something !! 

Really Ron & All ,, I'm looking forward to the challenge . Problem is ,,, I think these folks might hang over my shoulder all day and let me tell ya s ,,,, There ain't enough room in this room TO CHANGE YOUR MIND !!


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Remove some sheet rock off the wall take out a stub, 32" opening access to the area needed, not an option you say?


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

No , not an option ,,, Concrete on one wall ,,, tiled bathroom wall on the other , furnace blocking 3rd wall ,,,, then we head for the 4th & last escape ,,, the door !!


----------



## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Dang get the sawsall out, sounds like fun to me.


----------



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> You know, i look at the stihl saw pictured, just like the one i have. Talk about a tool so beautiful, that you would hate to use it! Might get it dirty!!!!!!!!!!


 Especially doing demo on a water heater...


----------



## FluidDruid (Oct 22, 2010)

*Another big old Ruud*

This was removed from a recent boiler with indirect install. Heater says "Copper Nickel" on it. I think it was a 75 gallon. Didn't bother with finding the model. _Was _going to strip it, but decided it wasn't worth it. Did I make a mistake? Of course my removal guy played his hand as it not being worth any bother. Its gone now, but curious if anyone has stripped one of these things. It was a beast, and was ~350 pounds.

Thanks


----------



## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Scrap wet dream :thumbup:


----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)




----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)




----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)




----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

that water heater was right next to this


----------



## Miguel (Aug 10, 2009)

GREENPLUM said:


> that water heater was right next to this


And that ol' "pan and cistern" is prolly younger than that ol' Rude. lol

Kinda cool finding an older than dirt water heater still in service, ain't it. 

Cool pics!

*Edit: _Hey, that Robertshaw control is '70's era (or later). wtf?_


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Flyin Brian said:


> the portable bandsaw statement was a oxy mooron,works well on steele bathtubs though.


How? A bandsaw is stationary. A portable bandsaw, aka porta-band is not.


----------



## plumberinlaw (Jan 13, 2010)

could you borrow the jaws of life from the fire dept. and crush it?


----------



## grandpa (Jul 13, 2008)

What's wrong with just leaving the old one there. Tell the HO he is on his own.


----------



## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Cal said:


> All,
> 
> Got a situation i could use a little help with ;
> 
> ...


cut the jacket with an abrasive blade in a grinder, then remove the door jam and it should go
:thumbsup:


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

grandpa said:


> What's wrong with just leaving the old one there. Tell the HO he is on his own.


Because that's what hacks do. Mechanics do a complete install, which includes removal. By the way, there isn't room to leave it.


----------



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Cal started this thread over a year ago...I would guess he's got it out of there by now....


----------



## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

I hope so, that would be a mad customer


----------



## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Airgap said:


> Cal started this thread over a year ago...I would guess he's got it out of there by now....


I guess that's what happens when you have a short memory span!


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2008)

Airgap said:


> Cal started this thread over a year ago...I would guess he's got it out of there by now....



Uh ,,,, yeah ,,, Done . They got a bigger door :whistling2:


----------



## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*FVIR water heaters...and garage stands......*

started new thread...


----------

