# hot water problem



## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

I HAVE A 3 STORY BUILDING THAT HAS A HEATER ON THE 2nd floor. IT HAS A RECIRCULATING PUMP AND MIXER VALVE ON IT WHICH SUPPLYS THE BATHROOMS WITH 120 DEGREE WATER AND THE KITCHEN WITH 140. THE WATER IS HEATED BY A BOILER AND THEN GOES TO A STORAGE TANK. MY PROBLEM IS THAT ON THE 1ST FLOOR THE BATH ROOM IN THE KITCHEN HAS NO HW AT TIMES. IF YOU TURN IT ON IT IS COLD. IF YOU LEAVE IT ON AND TURN ON THE COLD WATER AT ANOTHER SINK IT WILL GET HOT FOR A LITTLE WHILE THEN GO COLD AGAIN. THIS IS THE ONLY SINK THAT DOES THIS. WE HAVE BATHROOMS ON ALL FLOORS. THE ONLY THING I KNOW WAS THAT SOMEONE MY HAVE TIED A COLD WATER LINE IN TO THE HOT SOMEWHERE. ANY SUGGESTION?


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

HI Plumbingitall,

Welcome to PZ do me a favor and try not to use all caps, makes it hard to read. Thanks for coming over here from CT.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

I can do that. Hope to have some extra advice. Thanks for the info on pz.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Nothing but plumbers on here, so give it time and I'm sure some will chime in. I was only able to think of a possible bleed over from a mixing shower valve or a single control faucet some where.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

What brand of faucets are in the building again?


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## Va. Plumber (Dec 8, 2008)

Welcome, I agree with Ron, More than likely it's a shower valve. Could be a cartridge or checkstops for the valve, depends on what type.


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

I am not sure either, but I do recall a restaurant that called me back for hot water to the toilets. Come to find out the pre wash sink hot and cold was always left on. It was turned off by a valve on the sprayer. This meant that when the toilets flushed, the hot water was being driven into the cold lines through the open faucet.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

It has t&p valves on it. There are no showers in this building.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Bill said:


> I am not sure either, but I do recall a restaurant that called me back for hot water to the toilets. Come to find out the pre wash sink hot and cold was always left on. It was turned off by a valve on the sprayer. This meant that when the toilets flushed, the hot water was being driven into the cold lines through the open faucet.


T&S pre-rinse is known for that problem, I was checking out why the coke machines when they called for water it was sending hot water to them, come to find out, they would leave a T&S faucet on causing hot water to flow into the cold side of the system, told them to make a sign hang it up on sink to remind them to turn it off after each use.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

PLUMBINGITALL said:


> It has t&p valves on it. There are no showers in this building.



What is t&p valves, pardon my ignorance for not know what they are.


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## Va. Plumber (Dec 8, 2008)

Bill said:


> I am not sure either, but I do recall a restaurant that called me back for hot water to the toilets. Come to find out the pre wash sink hot and cold was always left on. It was turned off by a valve on the sprayer. This meant that when the toilets flushed, the hot water was being driven into the cold lines through the open faucet.


 
I've also seen this with service sink faucets that someone attached some kind of cleaners with a valve on it. Crosses right over if there's no checkstops built in to the faucet.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

All valves or two handle, also no single lever


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## Va. Plumber (Dec 8, 2008)

Ron The Plumber said:


> T&S pre-rinse is known for that problem, I was checking out why the coke machines when they called for water it was sending hot water to them, come to find out, they would leave a T&S faucet on causing hot water to flow into the cold side of the system, told them to make a sign hang it up on sink to remind them to turn it off after each use.


I've installed spring check valves on the cold supply to fix this problem.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

T&S makes hot side stem with a check in them.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

sorry it is t&s i dont know why i kept saying t&p


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Are the T&S faucet/s left on at anytime or all the time, could be just what we have talked about.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

I am not going to rule it out but my thinking is that the kit has its on hot water supply straight from the heater,and the bathrooms fead off the 120 degree side of the mixing valve which is on the 2nd floor


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Can you do any isolation's, process of eliminations.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

Will try monday and let you know; thanks again for the advice. Just needed a few other things to think about. They always say two heads or better than one and in this case 3 or 4 is better


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Cool, do let us know, and don't be a stranger, hope to hear from you in the other topics..


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## gabby (Jan 27, 2009)

You may check to see if they have a laundry sink. Alot of building are using a soap dispensor that is hooked to the faucet. The faucet can be left on and the unit turned off this creates bleed over or a cross conection.


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## PLUMBINGITALL (Jan 24, 2009)

Good news i have found the problem after a day and half of tracing pipes. I found a hot and cold line going down a chase on the outside of the building with two gate valves on it and out of the bottom of the two gate valves they tied it together and hooked a garden hose to it. And of course there was a nozzle on the end with the hot and cold gate valves open. THANKS FOR ALL THE SUGGESTIONS


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## Dr Steevil (Jan 25, 2009)

Gotta love it when you can get paid for a job that doesn't require you to actually have to "do" anything (other than work the ol' noggin of course). Congrats on finding it. Sounds very similar to what Ron and the others were talking about with the T&S valves.


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## SPH (Nov 4, 2008)

good post!


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## Kyle181 (Sep 5, 2008)

thats sweet


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

Just came across the same problem the other day at a "24hr Mkt", same thing, bleed over from all the 3compt sinks being left on and bleeding over to the hot side of stuff.
Great post by all!!


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