# Tough Day



## 3/4 MIP (Dec 1, 2009)

1" Water service I installed back in October developed a leak. Got a call back for water perculating out of ground. Not good. There's 40 more houses in this neighborhood that have to connect to the city. Certainly want a good image. Had to let it go over New Years due to supply house not being open and i needed a 1" coupling to effect a proper repair. Going over and over, what did i do wrong? How could it freeze? Picked up fitting at 0630, digging by 7. backfilled at 0930. 10 degrees out when we started. had to work fast as things were freezing up.

Problem is there was no rocks near pipe (improper backfill) and measured depth was 47" to pipe (Freeze???). Our min for this area is 42". Furture insp of pipe appears to indicate thin wall possible manufacture defect. i took numerous pictures and saved the cut out piece. Called the supply house to get it on the record also. I ate this but already have a verbal that they'll help out if we get another hole.

BTW, HO never lost water preceeding leak and water came out of ground during last weeks warm up where we had temps in the 40s-50s.

Anyone seen this before???

V/R
3/4


----------



## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

You are in Illinois? I thought the min depth was 60" around here. Any way if you need fittings and supply house is closed give me a ring. Also In Addison there is a supply that is open 24/7 just have to go to the back door after hours.


----------



## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

The picture with the hole in the pipe, is that a scratch near the holes? The pic is a little blurry. I never seen something like that happen on a new install with type K copper.


----------



## Plumbducky (Jun 12, 2010)

I am just thinking out loud here. Shouldn't the water service be at least 60" deep? Is the ground aggressive or the water? Just can't believe that it was only a few months in the ground. For what it is worth, I have seen that and worse but it is somewhere around the 5 year mark before it happens.


----------



## greenscoutII (Aug 27, 2008)

Hmmm. That is bizarre....

Doesn't look like a freeze break to me and if there were no rocks or broken glass in the trench, I'm not sure what to make of it. Type K is pretty tough.


----------



## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Manufacture defect/impurity for sure. Too soon of damage.

Doesn't even look like copper but given the hole in it, I'd say yes.


----------



## 3/4 MIP (Dec 1, 2009)

Lesson learned for me since i can't be positive it did'nt freeze. go deeper. This city installed roundway way at 52". The leak area was at 47-48". Homeowner never lost water. I would think that if it froze enough to split it would have been asolid block and therefore-no water.

BTW our frost line here is 42"

v/r
Shannon


----------



## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Dosen't look like a freeze break. If it were here, I would wonder if were a lightning strike.


----------



## Lifer (Nov 23, 2010)

Frozen and broken / split , would imply that it got cold enough to make ice which expanded the pipe in a weak spot till it burst.. I don't see any signs of expansion or swelling ( mind you it is a long way from Canada lol I really can't see it from here ) when you cut the section out unless you used 2 couplings , you only cut a little piece out ( that is what i would have done ) If you were able to get the compression nuts over the rest then there was no expansion at all . 

My bet is 1 of two things 1 . rolling it into or from the van it went over something sharp , nail or the likes K is very strong but also very heavy , so some people roll it along and may have come in contact with a nail or the likes.
2. There is a manufacturing defect , we've all seen-em and hate when they happen to us..

My bet is on #1 ( from past exp .. I have done this once )
lifer..


----------



## smudge (Jan 19, 2010)

that is not a freeze break


----------



## 130 PLUMBER (Oct 22, 2009)

SewerRatz said:


> You are in Illinois? I thought the min depth was 60" around here. Any way if you need fittings and supply house is closed give me a ring. Also In Addison there is a supply that is open 24/7 just have to go to the back door after hours.


If it was me i would probable call the inspector to just confirm that if it's O.K to have it set @ 47".....Once again you just want to cover your @$$. As far as the chicagoland area goes, SewerRatz is 100% right!!!!!


----------



## hepco (Jul 29, 2008)

I've seen that before. Not sure of the cause but the install was only a few months old. We call it pvc termites.:whistling2: It was in a campground we built and really had us worried a bit because our pipes were buried deep and didn't know if we were gonna have any more hole like this. So far we havent had any more problems and the project was done in 1999.


----------



## 3/4 MIP (Dec 1, 2009)

I know, trust me, I 've called the H/O just to see how things are. Dreading him calling me. Will absolutely go deeper just so there's no chance of freeze. Trust me, when your business is called 2 Code plumbing you have to do it correctly. I take the responsilbilty for this.

V/R
Shannon


----------



## Ishmael (Dec 9, 2009)

Looks like *cold water pitting*. Google that if you have lots of time to kill and want to read a lot of different theories over what causes it. But even though that may (or may not) be a contributing factor in this case, it certainly wouldn't happen in a few months - especially to type K. I'd say there's definitely a manufacturers defect there.


----------



## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

3/4 MIP said:


> 1" Water service I installed back in October developed a leak. Got a call back for water perculating out of ground. Not good. There's 40 more houses in this neighborhood that have to connect to the city. Certainly want a good image. Had to let it go over New Years due to supply house not being open and i needed a 1" coupling to effect a proper repair. Going over and over, what did i do wrong? How could it freeze? Picked up fitting at 0630, digging by 7. backfilled at 0930. 10 degrees out when we started. had to work fast as things were freezing up.
> 
> Problem is there was no rocks near pipe (improper backfill) and measured depth was 47" to pipe (Freeze???). Our min for this area is 42". Furture insp of pipe appears to indicate thin wall possible manufacture defect. i took numerous pictures and saved the cut out piece. Called the supply house to get it on the record also. I ate this but already have a verbal that they'll help out if we get another hole.
> 
> ...


 




Did you charge? That wasn't service warranty I hope.


----------

