# To be employed or self-employed



## 6th Density (Nov 29, 2010)

Alright, as some of you know I passed my test and am still in the process of getting my license numbers.

My current company I work for has gotten "wind" of my new status. They gave me a raise a week ago, and yes, thanks I deserved it. 

Here's my issue, they just called me up and asked to increase my position again,as an estimator (all you procrastinators on your testing, just do it!).

SO

For all you Master Plumbers out there. If you were in my shoes and had to do it all over again would you: 
A) go out on your own and tell the company you worked for that they couldn't match the potential you could possibly make (don't forget about the stress factor).

B) go into that new avenue of "white collar/overhead" estimating which a lot of field plumbers know nothing about, get trained to do it on company risk, and set yourself up for potential to grow into a project manager and more.

If you had it all to do over again, what would you choose?

The red pill or the blue pill


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

I had 2 companies. Then I had to close the doors and go to work for someone. hate it and wish I still had my own business, but you gotta do what you gotta do.

Do it over again? Damn right, self employed all the way.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

*Given this economy*

Don't get cocky, don't burn any bridges.


You won't make money (truly) for a few years... but you'll certainly turn over a lot of cash to support the main frame.


Better test yourself as a business minded individual and see if you are of the calibur to do the task.


You can be the best hands on plumber in the world, doesn't mean you can run a profitable plumbing business.


I've seen quite a few plumbers on plumbing forums get high gear and run for the gusto, and get sloppy, unprepared for the upcoming ups and downs. If you're burning down the world with your design... don't spend like it.

Then it gets ugly and you're 100% dependent on every dollar coming through the gate. 

If you start off cheap, cheaper than your competition to steal the base, expect it to come back from those seeing it unfold.


Justifying certain expenses is a dangerous, unpredictable venue.


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## LEAD INGOT (Jul 15, 2009)

I like not having to answer to anyone, other than wholesalers, and the I.R.S. But some days, I would love to make a little less, just to have a little more. But then I wave that dream cloud from over my head, and keep on being a workaholic, and burning it at both ends.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

I would start getting my ducks in a row, for working for myself. But, would give the position some time to help hone my skills. 

There is a lot you need to open you own business. I would start thinking about it right now, no need to mention it to anyone, but the wife. 

After you have generated a list of what you think you need. Triple the amount of what you come up with, cause it takes a lot of money to get going. 

I opened my business up last September. All I have done since is reinvest the money into the business, because there seems to be a heck of a lot of stuff, I did not know I needed, or every came close to thinking of. 

At least get an idea of what it would take to do it. Then take some serious time and consider your options. 

It is the best move I made, not financially yet, but I have never been so stressed out in my life. I would do it all over again, but with a lot more planning.


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## 6th Density (Nov 29, 2010)

Bill said:


> I had 2 companies. Then I had to close the doors and go to work for someone. hate it and wish I still had my own business, but you gotta do what you gotta do.
> 
> Do it over again? Damn right, self employed all the way.


Thanks Bill.
Here's my scenario. 
The plumbing trade IMHO is dying. I believe this goes for a lot of construction trades out there. There are a major majority of licensed plumbers and electricians throughout the nation that are in their 50's and 60's, and are just waiting for the next big boom to make that buck and call it "retirement/ or downsize."

I'm still scared to death about going out on my own yet I know that I've got the resources and potential to make it work.

I'm sitting in the biggest quagmire of my life. 

Sit behind the scenes and soak up all the knowledge I can gain on the business side (that which I'm weakest in) all the while the plumbers around here retire...
Or just realize that my good name will give me plenty of business (over time) and go out fighting with the big dogs waiting for their final day of rest!!!


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Working for yourself means calling the shots and working on your own terms. Getting checks in the 1,000's is better than getting checks in the 100's especially since I'm essentially doing the same work; just less hours per week for more cash...:thumbsup:

So to do it all over again, I'd choose to work for myself.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

If I were you I'd do the white collar for awhile to learn all I could, save money, plan and think. When you feel it's time, put in a reasonable notice and start preparing to be skinny. 
I have had a similar experience to Indy. There is a lot you need that you don't realize. I would have planned and prepared smarter than I did, but I'm making it. It his hella stressful compared to working for a stable company, but well worth it in the long run. 
Personally, I have some real problems with the business side of things as I have always been mechanically inclined and never really working in a business setting. I can't handle going through a week without bleeding at least a little. :laughing:


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## Bill (Jun 17, 2008)

6th Density said:


> Thanks Bill.
> Here's my scenario.
> The plumbing trade IMHO is dying. I believe this goes for a lot of construction trades out there. There are a major majority of licensed plumbers and electricians throughout the nation that are in their 50's and 60's, and are just waiting for the next big boom to make that buck and call it "retirement/ or downsize."
> 
> ...


Lots of trades are dying off. Unfortunately I am not a psychic. Nor is anyone here. If we say go out on your own and you fail we are A Holes. If we say not to you will never know if you could have. I started out the hard way. I had no money what so ever. I was working a full time job as a welder and a steel fabricator. I worked small jobs on the weekends. Nothing too big. As time progressed I started working part time at a regular job and done more for myself. Finally it got to the point where I had so much I quit working for someone and done my work full time. Again I had NO money in reserve. I established house credit with the local building and plumbing stores here in town. What should you do? Hard to say. Its what YOU feel deep inside. Hows work in your area? How tough is competition (Do you see a lot of advertised price cutting?) How about labor? What is it like? remember your help can make you or break you. I wish I had a simple answer for you, but I dont and I dont think anyone here does either. try going it on the weekends and see where it leads. This way you still gain knowledge and still get a guaranteed paycheck. Just dont muscle in on your current employers customers, remember, you may not succeed and need to return to your former job.


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

I grabbed the chance to start my own business when I thought I was ready (with $50,000 in the bank as a stake) and my employer basically gave me a contract for a strip mall as a start up. The developer for the strip mall gave me a 300.000 sq. Ft. distribution center and a brew pub no bid needed before I finished the strip mall, with both jobs starting within the month, these were money making jobs, I made a good profit on the strip mall and these jobs would be the same. So I took them both and started hiring plumbers, buying tools, and renting machinery, and taking more jobs, after six months over $200,000 went through the company books and I couldn't finance the work I had, or make payroll, or pay my suppliers. I ended up sending three jobs back to my former employer, along with the profit left on them, and one job to the guy that became my employer, I sold the tools at a loss to pay small debts and walked away feeling lucky I didn't get sued and only out twenty of the fifty grand when all was said and done.


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## 6th Density (Nov 29, 2010)

Thanks, all of you!!!

IMHO (and from your responses) I feel like starting a business in this negative economy is just me jumping the gun. Plus I've got to support my wife with nursing school. SHE KNOWS SHE OWES ME SOME FAVORS:yes:.

I would love to be on my own, AND calling the shots!! But in 3 or 4 years time, I'll have all my ducks in a row and a "sugar momma!"


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## 6th Density (Nov 29, 2010)

Killertoiletspider said:


> I grabbed the chance to start my own business when I thought I was ready (with $50,000 in the bank as a stake) and my employer basically gave me a contract for a strip mall as a start up. The developer for the strip mall gave me a 300.000 sq. Ft. distribution center and a brew pub no bid needed before I finished the strip mall, with both jobs starting within the month, these were money making jobs, I made a good profit on the strip mall and these jobs would be the same. So I took them both and started hiring plumbers, buying tools, and renting machinery, and taking more jobs, after six months over $200,000 went through the company books and I couldn't finance the work I had, or make payroll, or pay my suppliers. I ended up sending three jobs back to my former employer, along with the profit left on them, and one job to the guy that became my employer, I sold the tools at a loss to pay small debts and walked away feeling lucky I didn't get sued and only out twenty of the fifty grand when all was said and done.


Great reality check!!
I've got resources but they are family only. I couldn't bear to get in such a bind with them.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

6th Density said:


> Thanks, all of you!!!
> 
> IMHO (and from your responses) I feel like starting a business in this negative economy is just me jumping the gun. Plus I've got to support my wife with nursing school. SHE KNOWS SHE OWES ME SOME FAVORS:yes:.
> 
> I would love to be on my own, AND calling the shots!! But in 3 or 4 years time, I'll have all my ducks in a row and a "sugar momma!"


 



What a coincidence, my wife is an RN. In fact, she's taking a few months off to rest up a bit. Having her home full time is great. When I was working for a company, my wife HAD to work, now she doesn't.


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## bartnc37 (Feb 24, 2009)

Holy crap did a business owner just admit in public that he makes a good living off his business. I think you may have just violated a secret law. From many of the posts on this site and from every small business owner I've ever talked to they live on ramen noodles in small campers near the sewage treatment plant.:whistling2:


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

bartnc37 said:


> Holy crap did a business owner just admit in public that he makes a good living off his business. I think you may have just violated a secret law. From many of the posts on this site and from every small business owner I've ever talked to *they live on ramen noodles in small campers near the sewage treatment plant.*:whistling2:


 

That actually sounds pretty darn cool. Gotta love the aroma of human digestion and bodily fluid removal.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

I have done both. I started a business and had it for 15 years before I realized I could sell it. Who knew? It was easy to start up and build the business. It was a lot of fun and the cash flow was amazing. Paid cash for automobiles paid half down on a 3500 square foot home. Life was great.

The down side was babysitting employees, dealing with the federal government, paying all the taxes, having responsibility not only for the employees but their families too. Now I had to make sure the staff was pleasing the clients and guessing did the work get completed today and what will they do tomorrow. What kind of screw-up will I have to deal with tomorrow? What if the bottom falls what will happen. I always owed tax money at the end of the year. I could not find an accountant when asked how much 2 plus 2 was and would give me the answer, anything you want it to be.

Do I get larger or do I down size. You cannot stay in business long if you do not grow year by year. If you do it seems like you are trading dollars. Somehow you get to the point where you must either grow the business or cut back. Decisions must be made that will affect others .Firing people always hurts and is depressing.

I really love what I do now. I make as much as quite a few owners make. I do not have to babysit employees. I am in essence my own boss while I am in my truck. I do not dig, carry heavy equipment or crawl under homes anymore. I problem solve and do not cause problems. I make and earn money for the company helping our clients. Plus Uncle Sam now gives me money back at the end of the eyar.

I get to go home and not have to worry about tomorrow and what it will bring. I was able to have the time to coach my son’s baseball team; my daughter’s fast pitch softball team and help coach my other daughter’s soccer team while they were growing up without having to serve my clients during my children’s time. It works like this now my family, work and then me. Owning my own company was my work, my clients, my family and then me.

Whatever you choose your personality will adapt .

PS I would do it all over again if I felt I had the energy.


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## Epox (Sep 19, 2010)

I was working at a place that I hated ever increasingly every day. I joined, tested and was waiting on the call from the union. Decided to test for contractors license while I waited, no harm right. Next thing I knew I was in business and actually doing better than ever before. Eventually bought a used utility truck, paid cash. Done every thing with cash or not at al. Worked out of back yard and still do. Still doing great actually because my OH is nill besides the taxes, fuel etc. Wife keeps uncle sam off me. I do wonder how to grow and take on things I have avoided because of lack of manpower and time. I've had others working for me just to find the work load dwindled and had to let them go but really did'nt mind that because was having to run behind and fix screw ups. So here I am, training daughter into the business and hoping in a 10 year plan or so she will be sharp enough on the biz and give the old man a rest and run a crew of her own. Still doing better than ever and never looked back, Been great for me!


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## user4 (Jun 12, 2008)

6th Density said:


> Great reality check!!
> I've got resources but they are family only. I couldn't bear to get in such a bind with them.


Keep in mind, my business was a union shop, it kept the manpower cost simple, and I usually got well trained guys.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

If I had it all to do over again I would be a Heart Surgeon first then retire at 45-years old and become a Plumbing Contractor. There is a lot less pressure when economics is not an issue.

Mark


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## tungsten plumb (Apr 15, 2010)

I say if you really want to go out on your own. Research your potential market and find your niche. Also Start buying your equipment while your on someone else's payroll. Its a lot easier getting what you need when you know when you next check is coming as opposed to not knowing:yes:


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