# roots



## nate75 (Aug 18, 2010)

Hey yall. I've never done much drain cleaning. I always worked in new construction. Am I assuming right that roots only grow through the old terracotta pipes? Surly roots cant penetrate PVC and cast iron right?


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## UnclogNH (Mar 28, 2009)

nate75 said:


> Hey yall. I've never done much drain cleaning. I always worked in new construction. Am I assuming right that roots only grow through the old terracotta pipes? Surly roots cant penetrate PVC and cast iron right?


Roots can grow into PVC with Fernco's seen them grow into SDR 35 Gasketed Sewer Fittings also.


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## nate75 (Aug 18, 2010)

yeah, that makes sence. I was thinking too inside the box.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Roots will grow in any pipe with a joint. That includes PVC that has been glued, cast iron with oakum and lead.


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## Plumberologist (Aug 21, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> Roots will grow in any pipe with a joint. That includes PVC that has been glued, cast iron with oakum and lead.


never seen roots in pvc that wasnt broke???


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Plumberologist said:


> never seen roots in pvc that wasnt broke???


I am subcontracted by some plumbers to power rod drains for them. So I used to rod this line every two years and remove roots in two spots in a 100' clay sewer. This plumber talked the home owner in replacing the sewer with PVC, they put in glued joints. All seemed well for about 5 years, the 6th year the sewr was clogged. The roots where worse in the PVC joints then they where in the clay.

I have hours on hours of footage showing roots coming in through perfectly good joints in PVC on VHS tapes.


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## AssTyme (May 15, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> I have hours on hours of footage showing roots coming in through perfectly good joints in PVC on VHS tapes.




Got any popcorn


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

AssTyme said:


> Got any popcorn


 I tell you one thing the LT1000 is a great tool, no more hours of footage to bore people with, just snap shots of the problem and e-mailed reports.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I don't buy it. The only time I've ever seen roots growing into pvc is when the joints were not made up or the pipe was so close to a massive tree that the roots expanded into it and cracked it. PVC ,when installed correctly, is hermetically sealed and cannot be penetrated by roots.

Period. I dare you to prove otherwise. :yes:

Edit: I was refering to cemented joints only.



SewerRatz said:


> I tell you one thing the LT1000 is a great tool, no more hours of footage to bore people with, just snap shots of the problem and e-mailed reports.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Protech said:


> I don't buy it. The only time I've ever seen roots growing into pvc is when the joints were not made up or the pipe was so close to a massive tree that the roots expanded into it a cracked it. PVC when installed correctly is hermetically sealed and cannot be penetrated by roots.
> 
> Period. I dare you to prove otherwise. :yes:


Either next dig up I do I will try to take some good pictures for you. Or I will try to locate one of the VHS tapes and get a vid capture for you. I am going to televise a line tomorrow, I know there is some PVC in the line but I think its the SDR26 push gasket.

When I first started in the drain cleaning business I thought the same, that glued joints, since a glued joint is a chemical weld. But my father corrected me in my ways of thinking. He told me if the joint is 100% perfect the roots should not get in the joint. But most joints are not 100% perfect, all it takes is a small air pocket in the joint, the roots start of finner than human hair and find their way into the joint nursing off the water and growing which in turn opens the joint up more allowing more roots in and so on.


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## 3Peasdrain (Feb 5, 2010)

*Roots*

Do the roots grow in the pipe year round?Or just in the spring and summer?


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## UnclogNH (Mar 28, 2009)

3Peasdrain said:


> Do the roots grow in the pipe year round?Or just in the spring and summer?


Here it's fall and winter Spring and Summer I get more soft clogs and sludge clogs.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

3Peasdrain said:


> Do the roots grow in the pipe year round?Or just in the spring and summer?


 
Someone once told me roots grow more in Spring. I am not an expert in that area, so I don't know. Any of you guys use Root-X?


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

Roots grow more in the winter I believe.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> I have hours on hours of footage showing roots coming in through perfectly good joints in PVC on VHS tapes.


I have no doubt that you have seen roots grow into perfectly good PVC pipe. However, it is scientifically impossible for roots to penetrate "PROPERLY" solvent welded joints. :no: There are microscopic openings in lead, gasketed, concrete, and tar joints that allow air, gas, and moisture to escape and thus temp a root to enter. This is not the case with "PROPERLY" solvent welded joints. If it was glued properly, then an outside force had to have broken the fitting or pipe.

I love learning new stuff so I am certainly prepared to be proved wrong...scientifically.


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## nate75 (Aug 18, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> Either next dig up I do I will try to take some good pictures for you. Or I will try to locate one of the VHS tapes and get a vid capture for you. I am going to televise a line tomorrow, I know there is some PVC in the line but I think its the SDR26 push gasket.
> 
> When I first started in the drain cleaning business I thought the same, that glued joints, since a glued joint is a chemical weld. But my father corrected me in my ways of thinking. He told me if the joint is 100% perfect the roots should not get in the joint. But most joints are not 100% perfect, all it takes is a small air pocket in the joint, the roots start of finner than human hair and find their way into the joint nursing off the water and growing which in turn opens the joint up more allowing more roots in and so on.


makes sense.


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## Kevan (Jul 5, 2010)

The "perfect joint" challenge is moot. When you see roots coming through a joint, how can you prove that it was or was not made perfectly? The fact remains, a drain man cleans roots out of PVC sewers five days a week.

On the other hand . . .

I got to a home in Midtown Memphis which had the normal forest of ancient and towering oak trees in the yard and the sewer was backing into the basement. The old dude living there told me, "It ain't roots. I laid that pipe myself in 1952 and it's cast iron all the way to the tap and no roots have gotten into _them_ joints."

Sez I to myself, "I'm about to teach this old know-it-all a lesson," and I proceeded to clean the line.

It was all sludge. There wasn't a root to be found in the entire run.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Kevan said:


> The "perfect joint" challenge is moot. When you see roots coming through a joint, how can you prove that it was or was not made perfectly? The fact remains, a drain man cleans roots out of PVC sewers five days a week.
> 
> On the other hand . . .
> 
> ...


I have a customer in Brookfield with a small forest preserve of trees in the front yard. The house was built in 1920 and the sewer is 6" clay 180' long. The blockage was at the 4x6" joint and it was a grease blockage due to the catch basin never been cleaned in over 10 years. Ran the rod through the whole line not a single root in this line either. So no matter the pipe as long as it was installed properly it will be root proof.


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## ap plumbing (Nov 9, 2010)

I been cleaning drains since I was a kid....my dad has is own biz and he taught me the trade and I have seen roots get in pvc and abs thru the glue joints.... after a while the glue doesn't hold up . I have pulled abs apart and pvc... I work on pvc and abs and seen joints just disconnect....so I kno 4 sure roots will get into any pipe...may be its worse out here in cali because earthquakes and that could create openings after the glue has sealed over the years....:yes:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

SewerRatz said:


> I have a customer in Brookfield with a small forest preserve of trees in the front yard. The house was built in 1920 and the sewer is 6" clay 180' long. The blockage was at the 4x6" joint and it was a grease blockage due to the catch basin never been cleaned in over 10 years. Ran the rod through the whole line not a single root in this line either. So no matter the pipe as long as it was installed properly it will be root proof.


All I can say is orangeberg. I have never seen roots in a PVC line that was primed and glued. Seen them alot at a fernco or a saddle at the main.


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

Use 4" copper pipe sewer lines, the roots will not grow in the copper. I guess K would be best, how good of a salseman are you.


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