# Sewer machine



## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

I have a little k-400 that has served me well for what it is. The problem is I am getting way to many calls that deal with roots for this little fella. I don't want a heavy machine something compact and light weight. I am at a loss on which way to go drum or sectional or what size. Any input would be greatly appreciated


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Drum or sectional is like Ford and Chevy....preference.

I prefer sectional and you would not want to get into roots with anything less than a K-60.

Lightweight and drums really do not belong in the same sentence. A drum machine beefy enough for rootage, will also be very heavy.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

plbgbiz said:


> Drum or sectional is like Ford and Chevy....preference. I prefer sectional and you would not want to get into roots with anything less than a K-60. Lightweight and drums really do not belong in the same sentence. A drum machine beefy enough for rootage, will also be very heavy.


 ok I have run sectional but it was years ago it was a ridgid with 1 in cable. After posting I thought a drum might get heavy. So I'm down to sectional now what size and brand.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Depends on your customers. Nothing wrong with a drum machine offering speedy root removal. Once in a while I got dinged with too much roots so I went to sectional. Unstoppable, Rodder through a baseball bat root the other day. If it's never been Rodded charge more to cover your extra drum cables.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

What's your typical cleanout situation?


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

gear junkie said:


> What's your typical cleanout situation?


 a lot of the time I end up pulling a stool. Hopefully I will change that over the next few years. People around here are open to the extra cost of digging up and adding a clean out. That is if it keeps you outside with all the mess.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Ridgid K60 or Spartan 300 are good machines to start with. Just depends on if you prefer sectional or drum.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

Will said:


> Ridgid K60 or Spartan 300 are good machines to start with. Just depends on if you prefer sectional or drum.


 I think I'm leaning towards sectional the drum almost sounds like it may get to heavy.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I've been using the K60 on most of my rodding the last year. Has open most except for the ones that I ended up replacing. I've had a few jobs where the customer didn't want to pay for a new line, even though they needed it, the K60 couldn't get them open, but my Model C did. That is rare though, the K60 has been a good machine for me. I prefer them to the drum machine, they are truly easier on the body. May not be quicker to operate, but easier for sure. HAven't used a drum in probably over a year.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I'd go with the k60 and echo exactly what will just said.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> Lightweight and drums really do not belong in the same sentence. A drum machine beefy enough for rootage, will also be very heavy.


Except they have handles & wheels so you don't lift them...

Well, an Okie might try carrying it...
But most don't... :laughing:


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Except they have handles & wheels so you don't lift them...
> 
> Well, an Okie might try carrying it...
> But most don't... :laughing:


Yup, not 'round heer. R drums have to git up on that them there rooves and down them there steps and such. Gotsta getum back outa basements too. Inta an outta the trux aint so easy neither. Thur not havn them magik drums 'round these parts that do it on thur own. Must one a them new fangle furrin made thangs.

**insert accent as you see fit :laughing: **


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Funny how a new englander goes ape $hit over slander when someone else says it, yet has his nose up to high to hear the slander out of his own mouth. Yea all us Okies are retards, go on with your stereotyping


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

How long is the sections the old machine i ran seemed to have 15. To 20 feet is this anywhere close


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

most sectionals for mainlines are 15'.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

plbgbiz said:


> Yup, not 'round heer. R drums have to git up on that them there rooves and down them there steps and such. Gotsta getum back outa basements too. Inta an outta the trux aint so easy neither. Thur not havn them magik drums 'round these parts that do it on thur own. Must one a them new fangle furrin made thangs.
> 
> **insert accent as you see fit :laughing: **


Haha. How long did you spend actually misspelling this? Good stuff, Biz.


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

You guys and your sectionals. I asked around my shop if anyone knew what a sectional machine was and no one did. I showed them pics of open wound cables and got confused looks but from the sound of it I think I should be looking into them. The lighter weight and versatility of them are intriguing. I wish I could do a trial run with one.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

If your in to Houston area, then sectional aren't there. I never saw one tell I got to oklahoma


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Will said:


> Funny how a new englander goes ape $hit over slander when someone else says it, yet has his nose up to high to hear the slander out of his own mouth. Yea all us Okies are retards, go on with your stereotyping


Will, Sometimes ya just need to kick back a little, relax, and laugh at it for what it is....

Maybe try throwing a Yankee Joke back...:thumbup:

Sheesh! Lighten up and have some fun once in a while...


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm fine, just find it odd how you jump all over a liberal commit or what you think is racist, yet you say what you please and think nothing of it. Just one sided


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## Best Darn Sewer (Dec 23, 2012)

Will said:


> If your in to Houston area, then sectional aren't there. I never saw one tell I got to oklahoma


Yup. That's what I've heard. Oddly enough a girl that works at a Ferguson's here is who first told me about one. She had used a K60 before when she was still plumbing and raved about it. I've watched videos but would have to use it myself to really see its benefits.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

The k-60 sectional looks interesting. If I keep the k-400 for light work and get 100 + or- feet of cable for the k-60 that should do it.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

wyrickmech said:


> The k-60 sectional looks interesting. If I keep the k-400 for light work and get 100 + or- feet of cable for the k-60 that should do it.


 So what size mainline are you cleaning? I wouldn't put that k sissy up to 6" clay with roots/wipes 100' out.


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

KoleckeINC said:


> So what size mainline are you cleaning? I wouldn't put that k sissy up to 6" clay with roots/wipes 100' out.


 mainly from the house to the sewer main. It's an old town with a lot of large trees. It almost seems that somebody planted a tree on top of the sewer line ditch when they installed it. 100 feet would cover most of my work. I looked at the 1500 ridgid that is the machine I used to run but the is just to big and awkward.


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## KoleckeINC (Oct 22, 2011)

Hit n run with a 3" cutter? I'd still get a k7500 to CMA. At least the drum can be removed from the frame carried in separately so it's not too heavy for one guy. 4 inch main and k sissy is ok IMO


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

KoleckeINC said:


> Hit n run with a 3" cutter? I'd still get a k7500 to CMA. At least the drum can be removed from the frame carried in separately so it's not too heavy for one guy. 4 inch main and k sissy is ok IMO


 so the k7500 can be broke down hm that may change my mind. What about the self feed is it a pain when breaking it down?


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Ever thought about the eel and drill combo? Works pretty darn good.


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## redbeardplumber (Dec 4, 2012)

I just went through the same dillema wyrickmech... Need some equipment and had no idea... I scoured the drain cleaning forum... And flip flopped... I have ordered the k-60, k-50.... No turning back now... Excited and nervous.... Drain cleaning newbie. Lol...Enjoy tje decision making process..., spending that new company $.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

This won't work in every area, but in mine the K60 gives you alot of advantages over a drum for clearing building sewers. 

1. You can take the K60 onto a roof and clear a blockage through a roof vent if no cleanout is available. This works with the 7/8" for a building sewer or 5/8" for a kitchen sink clog. 

2. one machine can clear 80% of your drain cleaning calls. Only the smallest clogs in tubs or lavs will be too small(can can use a drum adapter for these situations if you wanted) or the serious clogs in say 6" sewers. For those You'd be better off with a K1500, Model C, jetter or large drum machine like 1065, K7500, or GO68HD

3. Operation of the K60 is much safer. It's easier on body and safer on the fingers, hands, wrist etc. 

The main negative on the K60 is I think there is more of a learning curve with them, but once you figure out how they work, there a hard machine to beat for the money.


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## HP plumber (Sep 4, 2013)

Great thread for me i also have been back and forth on this one i use a gorlitz drum machine but it's so big and heavy i don't like to carry it everywhere i go and sometimes use my gorlitz kitchen machine with 1/2 cable and cutter head to clear main lines. My question if anyone can help is when you hit the lever on that k 60 dose it spin the cable as well as foreword motion? That issue with the cable flipping in the main is that mainly because it is an open wound cable or can that happen with tightly wound? Hasn't happend to my drum machine yet "knock on wood".


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## yaacov (Aug 8, 2012)

HP. Spins the cable. Operator pulls out a bit of the rod with the handle released. The rod will have an arch in it, operator holds rod on top with slight downward pressure towards CO. Presses handle and the rod goes in. Ridgid has a good demo on their site if that doesn't make sense.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

One thing to consider with the k60 is muscle groups. With the k60 all you use is your arms and shoulders. I have 2 bad shoulders. I'm liking my dreel because you use your legs and back....bigger muscle group. I also believe that the dreel is safer because you're behind the drill. I'm in no way taking the k60 off the van, however if I have an outside cleanout.....the dreel will likely be getting picked first.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

Hola gear! I may need to make a trip up to yur neck of be woods and get a demo of that drill and eel technique, as you know I'm absolutely lovin' my k60 and I've got a nice spartan 2001 just sitting (having used in months cuz of k60) but been lookin at getting into some 1-1/4" sectional. How far is that setup efficient at clearing roots?


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Hasnt been stopped yet. I asked same question on ridgid forum and everyone said it's never been stopped. The job with the picture actually beat the k60. Old couple on top of a hill....setup for the worst kind of stoppage. Plus the tree was a pine tree, imo slower growing roots but harder to cut through then ficus. K60 just couldn't do it and hearing all the stories lately about flipped cable I wanted to take no chances. I pulled the dreel setup out and was through in literally 30 seconds.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

So I got to thinking of using the drill setup with my general 7/8" inner core cable as I've got 75' of it. Would a drill setup handle heavy roots better than using the same cables in the k60? Ultimately I'd get the 1-1/4" electric eel cable but at least this would get me some practice before dropping $600 on cables. Any thoughts?


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## wyrickmech (Mar 16, 2013)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> So I got to thinking of using the drill setup with my general 7/8" inner core cable as I've got 75' of it. Would a drill setup handle heavy roots better than using the same cables in the k60? Ultimately I'd get the 1-1/4" electric eel cable but at least this would get me some practice before dropping $600 on cables. Any thoughts?


who makes this drill setup you guys are talking about?


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

gear junkie said:


> Hasnt been stopped yet. I asked same question on ridgid forum and everyone said it's never been stopped. The job with the picture actually beat the k60. Old couple on top of a hill....setup for the worst kind of stoppage. Plus the tree was a pine tree, imo slower growing roots but harder to cut through then ficus. K60 just couldn't do it and hearing all the stories lately about flipped cable I wanted to take no chances. I pulled the dreel setup out and was through in literally 30 seconds.


So you may have answered my question in his post, is cable flip a bigger concern when running the dreel setup?


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

wyrickmech said:


> who makes this drill setup you guys are talking about?


No one makes it! You need to buy the sectional machine cables, then get a good heavy duty right angle type drill and get/make chuck X cable connector adapters. But I haven't used this technique yet so I'm just goin off of what I've researched.


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

TROJAN HAS THE DRILL ADAPTER AND SECTIONAL CABLES,

http://trojanworldwide.com/index.html


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

JERRYMAC said:


> TROJAN HAS THE DRILL ADAPTER AND SECTIONAL CABLES,
> 
> http://trojanworldwide.com/index.html


WHERE? I DIDN'T SEE THEM ON YOUR SITE! WHY ARE WE YELLING? sorry, couldn't resist.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> No one makes it! You need to buy the sectional machine cables, then get a good heavy duty right angle type drill and get/make chuck X cable connector adapters. But I haven't used this technique yet so I'm just goin off of what I've researched.


Yep, you got it. I made my chuck adapter but I understand electric eel sells it? I like electric eel cable over the general cable(I have both) because the eel cable has a coarse wind and self feeds faster and is stiffer then the tighter wind general. There is a definite feel for this technique and you always have to have tension of the cable....slip up and you'll flip a cable quick. I wouldn't use the ridgid innercore because it self feeds in reverse and 15' is too long to fight a root out the cleanout.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

gear junkie said:


> Yep, you got it. I made my chuck adapter but I understand electric eel sells it? I like electric eel cable over the general cable(I have both) because the eel cable has a coarse wind and self feeds faster and is stiffer then the tighter wind general. There is a definite feel for this technique and you always have to have tension of the cable....slip up and you'll flip a cable quick. I wouldn't use the ridgid innercore because it self feeds in reverse and 15' is too long to fight a root out the cleanout.


Doesn't plumber Rick use a dreel setup as well? Damn I may need to get hooked up with him and see it first hand before diving in, I'm no stranger to drain cleaning but sounds safer to be showed a little.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Drill and Eel works great, I use also. Eel sells the adaptor. SC-10A and SC-12 is what you need I beleive. It's just the shaft in the front if the model c that you need


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Shoot'N'Plumber said:


> Doesn't plumber Rick use a dreel setup as well? Damn I may need to get hooked up with him and see it first hand before diving in, I'm no stranger to drain cleaning but sounds safer to be showed a little.


He does but he uses the 10' general sections. After trying the 10' out with him, I like the 8' section better.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I've heard the General cable is better quality for 1.25" sectional with the drill. Not sure if it is better than Eel's, I've used my eel cable on a lot of calls and it is great quality. Can't see generals better much better if it even is.


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

Forgot to mention....the general is way heavier because of the tighter wind.


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

gear junkie said:


> WHERE? I DIDN'T SEE THEM ON YOUR SITE! WHY ARE WE YELLING? sorry, couldn't resist.


Sorry to all on the zone I forgot I was on caps,

Trojan will be updating its website soon to show this


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

What are the prices Jerry?


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

Hey all you plumbers and drain cleaners who are getting hooked up on the drill and eel are teaching your customers how to do their own drains !


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

why do you say that?


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

They would still need to buy the 1.25' cable, which is about 50 bucks for every 8', then they would need to get a few cutter heads that are about 20 bucks a pop, then a drill big enough to spin it, then know what to do with it. I think are job is still save. Tim the Toolman Taylor might figure out how to clear their drain, but the average joe wont. If most plumbers can't figure out the Drill and Eel, the home owner wont either...


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I've never been so insecure with my skills or knowledge base that I worried about someone buying technology to replace me. Torch and pipe cutter cost 50ish.....you gonna worry about homeowners repiping their house?


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## MACPLUMB777 (Jun 18, 2008)

They are calling Trojan WorldWide and other companies to get prices and buying what they need because they saw their plumber doing it and 
figure it is a one time payment


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## All Pro (Nov 15, 2013)

K-7500


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

wyrickmech said:


> I think I'm leaning towards sectional the drum almost sounds like it may get to heavy.


the trick to the drum machines is to remove the drum when transporting it to the job and install it after you get the machine where it needs to be,all the weight is in the cable,remove that and it is light as a feather.


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Best Darn Sewer said:


> Haha. How long did you spend actually misspelling this? Good stuff, Biz.


to much time on his hands?????hmmmmmmm


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

gear junkie said:


> Ever thought about the eel and drill combo? Works pretty darn good.


what I hate about sectionals is having to handle that nasty ass cable,you have to handle it to get it in the pipe,( not to bad) then you have to handle it again to get it out of the pipe(nasty nasty nasty,on a hot day it will flat wear one man out,with the drum you don't have to handle it,it does it for you and you can break the drum machines down for easy transport.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

What would cause may 11/16" cable to do this?


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Will said:


> What would cause may 11/16" cable to do this?


maybe the cable got to hot and caused a weak spot in the metal?????im not the worlds most knowledgeable person about draincleaning but I have been around a few yrs now.was the cable spinning and locked into something solid maybe????


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## TheDrainGuy (Jan 1, 2014)

Will said:


> What would cause may 11/16" cable to do this?


Is that where you're cable connects to the back end cable (reel)?
If so probably tension/torque.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Yes it is where it anchors to the reel.


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## Shoot'N'Plumber (Apr 27, 2013)

Will said:


> What would cause may 11/16" cable to do this?


Hi Will, were you in a tough stoppage and needed to reverse the spin? That's usually when I've run into that on either the gorlitz 68 or mytana m81. Usually when the blades stuck and running the cable in opposite direction to back it off and over torquing that way. That's also how splicers can come out.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Went through a tuff blockage the other day, but didn't run the machine in reverse. 

Not sure what would have caused this, I'll guess I removed the cable and install a new end....maybe it is heat related as the end was welded on


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

If you torqued your cable in reverse, it can unwind like that. Cut it off, insert new end weld.


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## SewerRatz (Apr 25, 2009)

Will said:


> Went through a tuff blockage the other day, but didn't run the machine in reverse.
> 
> Not sure what would have caused this, I'll guess I removed the cable and install a new end....maybe it is heat related as the end was welded on


When you weld the new ends on how do you cool them? I always found dipping the ends in oil cooled them just right.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I don't weld them,the company I get the cable from weld them. I might just use loctite...


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## sparky (Jan 8, 2014)

Will said:


> I don't weld them,the company I get the cable from weld them. I might just use loctite...


man that stuff is good stuff,what I would use,i also use it on my teeth when part of one breaks off:thumbsup:


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