# Running Gas Piping



## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

I did a gas line rework yesterday that put my torn rotator cuff to the test yesterday. Dropped about 20' of 3/4" gas line down and rerouted a new one to a gas stove.

Handed threaded about 7 pieces of pipe, making sure I utilized pieces of the pipe where at least one end was already threaded.

A little sore today but not in the upper body where I'd expect to be.


Gas line job turned out nice. No flexible gas line in my work ethic except the flex lines serving fixtures.

I don't care how easy it is to put up the latter; I've seen more plumbers hack that piping in than homeowners. What does that say about plumbers? 

A lot. And then I hear, "Well it saves me time and money." _(sighs in disgust)_


----------



## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

As long as it's not that import black iron pipe that I see so often. That junk can rust through even when it's under the house protected from the elements. I hate that stuff. Looks like it's covered in cinnamon after being installed only two or three years.


----------



## Miguel (Aug 10, 2009)

I've always prefered BI but I'll runn CSST or copper tubing if the situation warrants.
A colleague said he'd sell his 1210 oilless threader but I haven't been able to reach him yet today. Sweet little machine and you could setup and thread in granny's kitchen if you needed to.

Well, I wouldn't... but you could. I'm just sayin'.


----------



## Tankless (Jun 12, 2008)

I use a mix. But far more is CSST. 5 years ago if I had to run a 1" or even a 3/4" to the other side of the house, it was usually at least a grand just for the run. If I did it all in steel, for me, it's an all day affair from start to finish. Fine. CSST came out and I instantly saw the value. When I say value, I don't mean just cheaper. I saw something that is pretty easy to install (not run) the ends, it's a few rules you need to know about do's and don'ts. However the value I saw was that this stuff was here to stay (excluding Mass for a little bit) and if I jump on it now, it will help me land more jobs.

Look, there's something you gotta know about me. I love plumbing. I like the science behind it, I like the engineering and I even like the materials we all use to create it. BUT....BUT.....I wake up everyday and go to work to make money. I could give a shyit about anything else. I have a family to take care of, and no one else is going to do it. So if a product comes out that helps me make more money....bet your ass I'm on it. Now.....I am not a complete whore. I will not use shark bites in a perminant application....nor will use the pre tinned fittings or just about anything elst that the damn box stores sell.

The simple fact is, I need to be compeditive. I knoe I toot my own horn about how great I am in the tankless department...and I am!! but, that's because I have earned it. I didn't wake up one day and just decide to tell others how great I am, I earned every friggen bit of knowledge and experience. My point is, with all that great know how, I still lose jobs to lower bidders, and I'm cool with that. But if it's me doing iron pipe on a 5K bid and another charming good looking plumber using csst on a 4500 bid.....well there's 2500 bucks out of my pocket.

For what?

For me, it's about dollars and cents. I do the best job I can...I do things right and my former bosses would smile as they told you they were the one who trained me. I owe at least that to them. 

I hope this doesn't turn in to another CSST bashing.


----------



## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

I like black iron, and the way it looks, they let us use galvanized here in FL. and you dont have to paint the exterior pipe then. I'll run track pipe but I did have an instance where a fire started when a lightning strike arc'd off a recessed can and burnt a hole in the pipe. Homeowner caught it in time.


----------



## 1703 (Jul 21, 2009)

Mostly black iron. A little csst every once in a blue moon.

1-2 cuts is my personal limit on hand threading.

The typical resi jobs get the 700. 1 1/4" is about my limit for the porta-pony. if we're gonna be set up for a while or threading big pipe the 300 goes out.


----------



## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

I've used alot of CSST for smaller jobs, never a problem. Also I have yet to see it rust, but almost all homes have a basement here. In MA now you have to have it grounded by a licensed electrician, so it makes more sense to just use iron for most small jobs.


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

"Wuts in my pocket dawg?" Ridgid 300 

This is my lil ol tool. I like it. No more hand threading, and the machine stays in the barn. I do all my own take offs, and thread and number the **** right here, with a COLD beer in my hand.:thumbsup:


----------



## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

are those your motorcycles in the background?


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

house plumber said:


> are those your motorcycles in the background?




Why? Wanna race, huh?


----------



## SummPlumb (Feb 19, 2010)

I run TracPipe anywhere I can. I do still use BI going thru foundations, brick walls, and anywhere I think a nail may hit the pipe.

The TracPipe cost more, but it saves me a ton of labor. Plus, I can get to more jobs in the time I save that day which means I can sell more plumbing.

BTW, I love your post Tankless. I am the exact same when it comes to time and money. I will not be cheap or do anything half-azz. I will act in the best interest of the customer. But I am putting my work pants on for one reason every morning. Money!


----------



## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Why? Wanna race, huh?


Yeah I want the red one.


----------



## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

I try and use BI as much as I can. I see it as a trade off between material cost vs. my labor costs and if there's a decent amount of working space black iron is more cost effective for me. It doesn't take me very long to cut and hand thread (12-R) half a dozen pieces of steel. If there's room to work, it doesn't take me very long to put it together. A roll of CSST can be a real pain in my ass in a small crawl space or attic and for the cost of one 3/4" trac-pipe tee, I can spend half an hour putting black iron together. There are some jobs where the working room makes CSST much more desirable though. I'd say it's 80/20 for iron/CSST but I try and use iron as much as I can.







Paul


----------



## Bonafide (Feb 24, 2010)

Csst comes out just as pretty as blk iron, it justs need to be ran right with enough support, prper sized sleeves, and plates.

I too use a rigid 700 for new construction, but for additions i usually use the csst


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

My choice of pipe is not listed. coppa for me:thumbup:


----------



## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> My choice of pipe is not listed. coppa for me:thumbup:


Yup. I don't do all that much gas anymore, but when I do I usually run 2 pound copper systems. They get well marked with decals and yellow tape, or pre-painted copper, so only a total maroon would cut it to get water. Anyplace that needs it for safety gets BI.

I guess if I did more gas work I'd be using CSST, but these days I have no time for it. I can barely keep up with plumbing and hydronic. I know some good gasfitters that I refer all my gas work to.


----------



## JK949 (Mar 18, 2009)

All galvi steel for us, using Rems Amigo power threaders. If anyone local wants to buy our Ridgid tripod threader or bench mount threader, let me know. After using the Amigos, our guys won't touch the other ones anymore.


----------



## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

http://www.kamcoproducts.com/index.asp?content_id=25


----------



## leak1 (Mar 25, 2009)

Redwood said:


> http://www.kamcoproducts.com/index.asp?content_id=25


 what type of fittings do you use with this pipe?


----------



## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

leak1 said:


> what type of fittings do you use with this pipe?


Flare

What else would you use on a copper gas line?

Sharkbites?:laughing:


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

you can use regular copper fittings and braze it or use brass flare fittings.


----------



## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

Redwood said:


> Flare
> 
> What else would you use on a copper gas line?
> 
> Sharkbites?:laughing:


I haven't seen Sharkbites yet, but I have seen compression fittings used quite a few times.:no:


----------



## gladerunner (Jan 24, 2009)

I use csst only where it's going to buried. blk iron anywhere it's exposed to people. people are dumb. can't tell you how many times i've seen laundry hanging on csst in basements.


----------



## pauliplumber (Feb 9, 2009)

Here it's copper for LP and iron for natural gas. I'm not sure exactly why, I would guess there's something in one of the gases that doesn't go with one of the metals.


----------



## smellslike$tome (Jun 16, 2008)

Redwood said:


> Flare
> 
> What else would you use on a copper gas line?
> 
> Sharkbites?:laughing:


I saw some compression fittings on a 2# copper gas line I was inspecting for a tankless install the other day. The unit goes in on Wednesday and you can bet your sweet bippy that those compression fittings will be going bye bye.


----------



## CBP (Feb 5, 2010)

All black iron for me..domestic pipe and fittings! I have a Ridgid 535 in my shop that I can thread up to 4" with the 141 geared threader, and a Ridgid 1215 that goes to the jobsite with me.


----------



## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

ChrisConnor said:


> As long as it's not that import black iron pipe that I see so often. That junk can rust through even when it's under the house protected from the elements. I hate that stuff. Looks like it's covered in cinnamon after being installed only two or three years.


Rust resistant paint takes care of that. The only place I paint though is where pipe is exposed to elements. Never seen it change in basements or crawl spaces unless water leaked on it somehow.


----------



## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

pauliplumber said:


> Here it's copper for LP and iron for natural gas. I'm not sure exactly why, I would guess there's something in one of the gases that doesn't go with one of the metals.


The stuff they put in natural gas to give it an odor supposedly eats through copper is the reason I was given for it by an inspector. It will also eat through teflon tape dope which is why you are not suppose to use it. Have no way of confirming that just what I have always been told and never bothered to research it since it was code anyway.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Bollinger plumber said:


> Rust resistant paint takes care of that. The only place I paint though is where pipe is exposed to elements. Never seen it change in basements or crawl spaces unless water leaked on it somehow.


 It will rust here from the humidity alone unless its in air conditioned space. In an attic it does much better here than in a crawlspace.


----------



## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

Nothing but black iron here even though they do use copper on propane I won't use it.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Bollinger plumber said:


> Nothing but black iron here even though they do use copper on propane I won't use it.


Why not?


----------



## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

thats all the LP guys use here, soft copper flared


----------



## Bollinger plumber (Apr 3, 2009)

TheMaster said:


> Why not?


Its just a safety issue with me. I feel better running black pipe than flimsy copper.


----------



## futz (Sep 17, 2009)

Bollinger plumber said:


> The stuff they put in natural gas to give it an odor supposedly eats through copper is the reason I was given for it by an inspector. It will also eat through teflon tape dope which is why you are not suppose to use it. Have no way of confirming that just what I have always been told and never bothered to research it since it was code anyway.


I do not believe that. Unless it's some kind of really weird local thing. I still don't believe it. It's probably a lie the AHJ (local gang - the ones you pay off to work on their turf - you buy permits from them) tells you to make you run BI. They do that kind of thing sometimes.


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

Bollinger plumber said:


> Its just a safety issue with me. I feel better running black pipe than flimsy copper.


How many houses in your area have blown up from using copper for propane distribution? Here we use copper for natural gas,its approved and legal. No problems. Do you realize how many gas leaks i've repaired because the straps to hold the pipe have rusted out from all the humidity over the years its been installed and the pipe is laying on the ground and is rusted completely through? Its too wet here to use black iron almost anywhere...galvanized whould be a better choice and it still rusts through,I've found it countless times. Copper can be bought with a tin lining that will not be affected by high concentrations of methyl mercaptan...the most common oder additive to natural gas supplied through a public supplied gas system.


----------



## mselkee (Aug 13, 2009)

Exposed Black (except for a short hook up run).

Under house CSST

Sometimes we will run the main in black if it is a simple and larger size run.


----------



## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

TheMaster said:


> How many houses in your area have blown up from using copper for propane distribution? Here we use copper for natural gas,its approved and legal. No problems. Do you realize how many gas leaks i've repaired because the straps to hold the pipe have rusted out from all the humidity over the years its been installed and the pipe is laying on the ground and is rusted completely through? Its too wet here to use black iron almost anywhere...galvanized whould be a better choice and it still rusts through,I've found it countless times. Copper can be bought with a tin lining that will not be affected by high concentrations of methyl mercaptan...the most common oder additive to natural gas supplied through a public supplied gas system.



Google is TM's Friend.:laughing:


----------



## TheMaster (Jun 12, 2009)

ROCKSTARPLUMBER said:


> Google is TM's Friend.:laughing:


Thats common knowledge...well atleast for those who know their shiot.:laughing: keep trying lil tropper and you'll make it to the top one day but you'll never make it trying to step over me. Now brush my shoulders off:whistling2:


----------



## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

I've seen plenty of flex copper branches to single appliances, usually 3/8" & 1/2" but never seen natural gas mains in copper. In fact I'd have a hard time believing any exist in Mich.
One reason why copper use to be frowned upon for ng, was that it would flake, on the inside, and clog up gas valves. I've seen it happen with my own eyes, but not recently. Copper would flake off so much, it would fill up the drip leg, & then clog gas valve screen on appliance.
Black pipe is my choice, & looks more professional, IMO..But if humidity moisture was an issue here, I may think differently.


----------

