# Hated jobs, customers ask me to do "While your here".



## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Just wondered what jobs you all hate to do the most, or the jobs that so many customers think is a plumbers job. And which jobs do you refuse to do, but frequently get asked to do, while at a customers house.

My #1 pet peeve, hated job, that I refuse to do, but get asked so many times, is when the customer says, "WHILE YOUR HERE, I'M GONNA HAVE YOU CAULK MY BATHTUB":furious:.

I bring this up because I got asked 2 times this week to do this. The 1st time I was installing a 2nd water meter for a lawn sprinkler system. (I wasn't even going to be in or near her bathroom, all my work was in basement). The city had to shut the water off at street, so as soon as I walked in the door, the customer says, "the city called & said they will be here in a half hour, so while your here, & waiting for city to come, I am gonna have you caulk my bathtub, & shower door:no:. Like I got nothing to do, for a half hr, waiting for city to come. Customers don't realize, I gotta bring all my tools in, run new piping from BFP & hose bibs, to 2nd meter location, prep work, & so on. And now I'm suppose to clean all this mold, & old caulking off her tub, & shower doors, & recaulk it, in what they presume, can be done professionally, & be long lasting, all in 20 min, or less.

I am seriously thinking about putting a sticker on the back of my business cards, that says, "Don't even think about asking me to caulk your bathtub or shower, unless I am installing a brand new bathtub or shower for you".

What makes this more frustrating, is most of the people asking this, think it should be able to be done cheap & quick. Then they get that deer in the headlights look, when I tell them I don't do that type of work. So I find myself feeling bad I can't, or won't do it, & having to explain my way out of it. And for the life of me, I cannot understand why so many people think this is a plumbers job.

The only 2 things I can see getting out of caulking an existing bathtub is this;
1- no profit
2- call back


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

Tell them you can squirt some caulk about if they like, but if they want it done properly they need to call for a tile man and have them strip and seal it with epoxy grout.

Epoxy grout doesn't mildew.

Oh...and yes, I agree and sympathize 100%. Absolutely a no win situation there :thumbdown:


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## beachplumber (Feb 7, 2010)

I hate d.w.s,


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## gear junkie (Jun 20, 2008)

I charge by the hour, I'll caulk all day with no issues.


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

"oh you want me caulk your tub? no problem, its $90 first half hour"


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## deerslayer (Mar 29, 2012)

gear junkie said:


> I charge by the hour, I'll caulk all day with no issues.


I just let them know upfront that it will not be gauranteed unless I replace it!


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

right after customers writes the check,for the job you just did, some customers that ask, can you take a quick look at this. (meaning i dont want to pay for this) i always say yes i'll look, and then give them a price on it. customers are shocked by this. customers say things like. but it will olny take a min. ( ii think in my head the call back will take an hour).

just put a little caulk on there.
can you look at my dryer, frig, stove top. 
can you change a light bulb. 
can you change the batts. in my smoke detector.
always followed by the statement, real quick like, or it will olny take a second. wtf 

my anserwers. call the frig guy, dont have a ladder with me. not insured for that. boss will get mad at me, and my favorite i dont know how!


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Some of this stuff is customer service. Do it, other stuff figure out what it will cost the customer and charge and collect for the work you do. You have just heard every company’s favorite words to hear and they are; by the way, while you are here, do you have time. The company makes more profit on the additional work you do than the work you are assigned to complete.
You are already here there is no need for a vehicle charge; cost to arrive, job set up time is already complete.


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*no favor goes un-punished*



piper1 said:


> right after customers writes the check,for the job you just did, some customers that ask, can you take a quick look at this. (meaning i dont want to pay for this) i always say yes i'll look, and then give them a price on it. customers are shocked by this. customers say things like. but it will olny take a min. ( ii think in my head the call back will take an hour).
> 
> just put a little caulk on there.
> can you look at my dryer, frig, stove top.
> ...


 
the back of my hair stands up when they try this little stunt on me... because the little extra that they want done after the check is written ... usually turns out to be a can of worms and is something that breaks in your hand or falls apart when you touch it....


most of them are keenley aware of this and set the trap with nice complimnets, maybe a cup of coffe, doughnuts
whatever it takes to get your guard down while you are repairing the original call that you are there for.... 


you dont see what you are stepping into till its too late........


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Some of this stuff is customer service. Do it, other stuff figure out what it will cost the customer and charge and collect for the work you do. You have just heard every company’s favorite words to hear and they are; by the way, while you are here, do you have time. The company makes more profit on the additional work you do than the work you are assigned to complete.
> You are already here there is no need for a vehicle charge; cost to arrive, job set up time is already complete.


True...but the original post about caulking the tub "real quick" is indeed a no win situation for the company _and_ the customer IMO. But best to not get irritated at the customers lack of understanding and explain it to them that it's not a quick job, and how caulks, including the "mildew resistant" caulks, don't last long before they get mildewed.

And that if you use silicone, nothing will ever stick afterward _except _silicone.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Some of this stuff is customer service. Do it, other stuff figure out what it will cost the customer and charge and collect for the work you do. You have just heard every company’s favorite words to hear and they are; by the way, while you are here, do you have time. The company makes more profit on the additional work you do than the work you are assigned to complete.
> You are already here there is no need for a vehicle charge; cost to arrive, job set up time is already complete.


I'm already here, only works if you have the time. 

This was an all day job I had scheduled, & my daughter had an event at school, that I wanted to attend. So sometimes Richard, you just have to say no, & live life a little more. Caulking a bathtub, & missing my daughters event, or anything else I had planned, aint gonna change any significant digits, in my bank account.

The point is, most customers think caulking a tub or shower is a miniscule job, & aint gonna pay anything worthwhile. Like its another 5min job. And there aint no way in Hell they are gonna want you to schedule to come back for that.:no: I did tighten up this ladies kitchen faucet, install a soap dispenser in extra hole, on kit sink, & loaded 2 bags of top soil into her wheel barrow, so it aint like I have no compassion, or care about my customers. You just have to know where to draw the line.


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

I always ask BEFORE I write the invoice if there is anything else they need us to look at while we're there. If they're a repeat client, and they remember something after the fact ~~~ depending on what it is, I generally do it and thank them for their business. All this is depending on my available time of course.

As far as caulking the tub goes, it all depends on how the tub looks. Can't have a hard and steadfast rule.


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## BigDave (Mar 24, 2012)

You can do many different things to "close the door" on "take a quick look at this" kinda stuff. I simply ask the customer to decide if anything else needs attention *before* packing away my tools AND contacting my next customer.

I come up with suggestions like "has anyone inspected your water heater lately?"
"Has your potable water system been pressure tested for leaks"

I find that after you ask a couple of these types of questions, they know
I'm not gonna fall for any kind of manipulation.

If I go back in to collect and they ask, I simply say sorry, but my next customer is already expecting me inside the hour, perhaps you can call the office and make another appointment for another day...


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## Radium (Dec 25, 2010)

I dislike installing water heaters. Even more when they are supplied by the home owner. Even more when they don't like the price I am going to charge them for not having one of my tanks from my supplier.

Sent from my iPad using PlumbingZone


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

Master Mark said:


> the back of my hair stands up when they try this little stunt on me... because the little extra that they want done after the check is written ... usually turns out to be a can of worms and is something that breaks in your hand or falls apart when you touch it....
> 
> 
> most of them are keenley aware of this and set the trap with nice complimnets, maybe a cup of coffe, doughnuts
> ...


 
Wow that happended to me the other day. Lady kept feeding me DP and after the check was cut and ticket completed she attacked. 

She asked if could do one little thing for her, I said yes. 

1 hour later........


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## Qball415 (Nov 20, 2010)

RealCraftsMan said:


> Wow that happended to me the other day. Lady kept feeding me DP and after the check was cut and ticket completed she attacked.
> 
> She asked if could do one little thing for her, I said yes.
> 
> 1 hour later........


Dominos pizza?


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

WHILE YOUR HERE, I'M GONNA HAVE YOU CAULK MY BATHTUB" that dose not sound like a request in don's case. some customers have this thought in their head before the plumber even gets there! now what, you what to make the customer happy! and extra on site sales are good. but caulking a old tub is that a plumbers job? i'm really careful with some of these extras.as coustomers can be less then truthful when call ing back later. my tub leaks now and your guy was the last to work on it!!! (sorry i did the favor now) #1 pet pev. i get asked alot about smoke detectors batts.(while you here) i always say no to that. oh great let me go get the biggest ladder i can find and run around inside your house with it in you house.i can't wait to do that!! one favor i got burned with, was taking a lady's trash bag out 2nd floor, (can you take this on way out) it leaked on the landing and bottom 3 steps when she called the office about it. she never mentioned that it was her trash bag. just the guy made a mess! funny i feel better now lol. i guess knowing i'm not alone out there


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## RealCraftsMan (Dec 27, 2011)

Qball415 said:


> Dominos pizza?


Dr. Peppers..lol

She would not take no for an answer!



piper1 said:


> WHILE YOUR HERE, I'M GONNA HAVE YOU CAULK MY BATHTUB" that dose not sound like a request in don's case. some customers have this thought in their head before the plumber even gets there! now what, you what to make the customer happy! and extra on site sales are good. but caulking a old tub is that a plumbers job? i'm really careful with some of these extras.as coustomers can be less then truthful when call ing back later. my tub leaks now and your guy was the last to work on it!!! (sorry i did the favor now) #1 pet pev. i get asked alot about smoke detectors batts.(while you here) i always say no to that. oh great let me go get the biggest ladder i can find and run around inside your house with it in you house.i can't wait to do that!! one favor i got burned with, was taking a lady's trash bag out 2nd floor, (can you take this on way out) it leaked on the landing and bottom 3 steps when she called the office about it. she never mentioned that it was her trash bag. just the guy made a mess! funny i feel better now lol. i guess knowing i'm not alone out there


 
That's so BS, that's the kind of customer yhou want to slap in the face and let them know their a pos.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Don The Plumber said:


> I'm already here, only works if you have the time.
> 
> This was an all day job I had scheduled, & my daughter had an event at school, that I wanted to attend. So sometimes Richard, you just have to say no, & live life a little more. Caulking a bathtub, & missing my daughters event, or anything else I had planned, aint gonna change any significant digits, in my bank account.
> 
> The point is, most customers think caulking a tub or shower is a miniscule job, & aint gonna pay anything worthwhile. Like its another 5min job. And there aint no way in Hell they are gonna want you to schedule to come back for that.:no: I did tighten up this ladies kitchen faucet, install a soap dispenser in extra hole, on kit sink, & loaded 2 bags of top soil into her wheel barrow, so it aint like I have no compassion, or care about my customers. You just have to know where to draw the line.


No need to get pissy. You should have posted the real reason you did not want to do the job and the responses would have been to your liking. Asking you to do a little job was not the problem the problem was getting home in time for your daughter I understand this and agree with you, family is more important than any job at any persons home. I have certain day that I will not work late or work on call and they are wife’s birthday, children’s birthday, and our wedding anniversary. When my kids were in school any program they were in I did not work.

Why do you hold so much disdain and resentment for your customers? How would they know you have your daughters program to go to after your day is done? The same goes with us and holding back that significant piece of information. We as plumbers become upset with our customers when they do not block off enough time yet when we do not block off enough time it is still the customers fault.

I have a belief that I as a plumber should be talking to the customer about preventive measures. This means I should have been talking to the customer prior to starting the job concerning preventive measures and offering suggestions and pricing to those little annoyances. Those things should not be a surprise to the plumber.

How was your daughters program?:thumbup:


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

The absolute best way to STOP doing free work is to start charging for the work performed. You give a price and they want it for free they say no and you walk.

They already have written the check ask for a second check.


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

Richard Hilliard said:


> The absolute best way to STOP doing free work is to start charging for the work performed. You give a price and they want it for free they say no and you walk.
> 
> They already have written the check ask for a second check.


This.

Richard is right on all counts, but we've all got "snuck up on" at one time or another and it bites. 

Communication is the key, it's just unfortunate that many customers "don't speak plumbing" and often get miffed anyway when one tries to explain that the "simple, quick task" often isn't actually simple and can't be done quickly.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Richard Hilliard said:


> No need to get pissy. You should have posted the real reason you did not want to do the job and the responses would have been to your liking. Asking you to do a little job was not the problem the problem was getting home in time for your daughter I understand this and agree with you, family is more important than any job at any persons home. I have certain day that I will not work late or work on call and they are wife’s birthday, children’s birthday, and our wedding anniversary. When my kids were in school any program they were in I did not work.
> 
> Why do you hold so much disdain and resentment for your customers? How would they know you have your daughters program to go to after your day is done? The same goes with us and holding back that significant piece of information. We as plumbers become upset with our customers when they do not block off enough time yet when we do not block off enough time it is still the customers fault.
> 
> ...


Didn't mean to sound pissy. But don't you always have somewhere to go? If not personal, then maybe to the next job, or just wanna get home, after long day. I keep hearing how great the extra work, "while your here" is. I just can't figure out how you allot the time to do these tasks. I do alot of these add ons too, but then I find myself rushing all day long, or missing out on things I planned on, cuz it puts me behind.

My annoyance was directed at customer, not you, but I can see how you would interpret that. No hard feelings I hope. Hard to write out all details, but I had a few conversations, with this customer, during the course of the day, & mentioned to her atleast 2 times, I had an event to get to, & that I was cutting it close. Well that went through 1 ear & out the other. She asked me to do all these extra things anyways. She also got a garden tool set delivered, that she insisted I had to see, before she let me out the door.

As I get older, I guess maybe I do get more pissy, cuz I just want to do what I planned on. We have enough problems trying to get the planned jobs done, I don't need the "while your here, caulk my bathtub job". But I just don't like even being put into that position, where I do have to get pissy. I mean I told the customer I was running late, she asked me to tighten her kit faucet, install a soap dispenser, then as I walked out she asked me to put 2 bags of top soil in her wheel barrow, then she had to show me these new tools, to boot. She did not care one bit about my schedule. So how much can I take? Just trying to tell you whole story now, cuz you were right, I left out a bit.

And since I'm a 1 man show, I just hate having to go back, for any of this small nonsense type work. This particular job was 45min away too. So no way was I going to be in that area again, anytime soon. Maybe I just need to retire.:yes: I could if not for the money problem:laughing:.


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Don oh yeah I have places to go and am a busy person. I made a commitment to treat every customer as my first customer of the day. We operate our business differently than you .I schedule 2 calls a day for our plumbers. When calls come in during the day we now can schedule the emergencies during regular hours. When I must spend 6 hours with a customer I can. You would be surprised at how often this happens.

When I do have something that is important to attend I let the office and my customer knows and make sure they understand there are time constraints. I will then mark on the invoice the next time we visit that the things I could not get to will be handled then. Frequently the customer will call to schedule other preventive measures we have talked about and want it all done.

I deal with every customer as you do and I know some can get under our skin. They do not seem to bother me as much today as when I was younger.


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## SimplePlumber (Feb 1, 2012)

Don The Plumber said:


> Didn't mean to sound pissy. But don't you always have somewhere to go? If not personal, then maybe to the next job, or just wanna get home, after long day. I keep hearing how great the extra work, "while your here" is. I just can't figure out how you allot the time to do these tasks. I do alot of these add ons too, but then I find myself rushing all day long, or missing out on things I planned on, cuz it puts me behind.
> 
> My annoyance was directed at customer, not you, but I can see how you would interpret that. No hard feelings I hope. Hard to write out all details, but I had a few conversations, with this customer, during the course of the day, & mentioned to her atleast 2 times, I had an event to get to, & that I was cutting it close. Well that went through 1 ear & out the other. She asked me to do all these extra things anyways. She also got a garden tool set delivered, that she insisted I had to see, before she let me out the door.
> 
> ...



The actual "problem" I see in your situation revolves around scheduling.

The tub caulking could have been a leaky faucet, toilet leak, or some other task that had the potential to extend the work past your *preconceived* idea of scheduled time there.

If this happens more frequently than you like, you may need to alter the way you schedule work or become less optimistic about the time tasks require. I (also was a one man shop) used to allow at least one extra hour to each job for service calls...this also allows you to do things like, get gas, supply house, lunch, bank stop, etc... if the job doesn't go the extra hour. Or, you could get that hour back on the next job by enlarging the "show up time window" of the next customer by an hour.

A lot of this can be eliminated by not rushing off the telephone during the initial call for service. Take the time to ask the customer on the initial call: Is there anything else you can think of so we can prepare better for you? An extra few minutes on the phone can save you and your customer some awkward moments and money, as well as making you seem a more thorough and responsible contractor.

IMO, customers shouldn't know anything about your life or schedule outside the scope of *their* project, since they don't care if you have ten other jobs to go to or you are getting married in three hours...they just want *their* problem fixed.

Don't agree? Just think about how you would feel if your Doctor told you we have to hurry since their child had a play they had to attend in 30 minutes. Even if they performed their service as agreed...wouldn't you feel like you weren't getting all of their attention since they were preoccupied with where they were going, and not what they are doing for you?

Try not to make your problems your customers, and vice-versa.

As far as the actual tub caulking...If you keep hearing the same question over and over, develop and practice how you will handle it in advance.

When I get asked to caulk a tub...I say with a smile, "You don't want to pay me $120 an hour just to get a "plumber" quality caulked tub, when you can spend about half that much and get a tile professional to do it. Here is who we recommend or check the internet.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

SimplePlumber said:


> The actual "problem" I see in your situation revolves around scheduling.
> 
> The tub caulking could have been a leaky faucet, toilet leak, or some other task that had the potential to extend the work past your *preconceived* idea of scheduled time there.
> 
> ...


I agree with alot of what you say, & I been doin this 30 plus yrs, so I know how to schedule, but I guess this customer just pushed my buttons.

This particular job I scheduled a whole day, nothing else, because I knew I had some place to be at 4pm. I thought it would only take about 6hrs, I figured drive time too, this left me a window of 1.5 to 2 hrs. But a few minor things were a little more involved, & then she added these extra things too.

Now I'm glad you brought up the doctor issue. The doctor is only with me for a few moments, I was at this ladies house all day, so yea, I make conversation with my customers, & I know her kids, & grand kids, so thats how I brought up the subject of my daughters school function. I am personal with my customers, cuz I am a 1 man show, & alot of them appreciate that. Now one other thing I want to make crystal clear is, this customer had no idea, that I was even the least bit annoyed. I was professional, yet provided personal attention too.

But let me ask everyone this, when you go to the doctor for a particular problem, lets say its for a sore foot. Do you ask the doctor to look at your arm too, or your knee, or any other, "while your here looking at me anyway" problem that you have, that you did not inform him/ her about before hand?:no: Or hey doc, can you look at my wife too, she gets headaches every night.:laughing:

Now lets not start all the extra other stuff that may be asked other than what I stated. If a customer asks me to install a new toilet, or water heater, or faucet, thats alot different than asking me to caulk a tub. That is something that she expected me to do quick, & now. She had no intention of paying anything close to what it would be worth, if anything at all. JMHO

And one other thing I have to say to Single plumber, I was so glad to hear that you get asked to caulk tubs too. Thought I was being singled out. Like your idea of what to say, but I'm gonna make it $150 an hr.:yes:


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Don oh yeah I have places to go and am a busy person. I made a commitment to treat every customer as my first customer of the day. We operate our business differently than you .I schedule 2 calls a day for our plumbers. When calls come in during the day we now can schedule the emergencies during regular hours. When I must spend 6 hours with a customer I can. You would be surprised at how often this happens.
> 
> When I do have something that is important to attend I let the office and my customer knows and make sure they understand there are time constraints. I will then mark on the invoice the next time we visit that the things I could not get to will be handled then. Frequently the customer will call to schedule other preventive measures we have talked about and want it all done.
> 
> I deal with every customer as you do and I know some can get under our skin. They do not seem to bother me as much today as when I was younger.


 I am the opposite of you Richard, as I get older, it bothers me more not less. Don't know why. Maybe I'm not as hungry. Maybe I need to take meds?

But c'mon Richard, there has to be a job you hate to do. I wanna hear it.:laughing: Remember my motto, "Happy people pi$$ me off".:laughing:


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

Don 

 A few years ago I would have informed you I dislike digging, drain cleaning, crawl spaces and attics. Generally speaking I hate to get dirty and smelly. HOWEVER


 In 1996 my colon ruptured without reason and I was off work for 10 months. I had a colostomy bag ie a personal septic bag and lost over 75 pounds in 10 days. I did not know if the surgery could be reversed and lucky for me it was. It was at this time I realized I needed to make adjustments to the way I thought. I was lucky to be alive and luckier to be able to keep the profession that I knew. I did not know anything else. 


2004 I had both hips replaced and that stopped the digging and crawling around in small places, 2007 I had a micro disc- ectomy to buy some time and in 2011 a back fusion. When any person faces a situation where you discover you may never be able to perform the profession that you have become involved with in your lifetime you suddenly discover a new place where you do not mind doing the things that at one time made you sit up and say wtf.. 


I have one pet peeve with the job and that is with scheduling and the office personnel. They do not care if the plumber works until 8 pm as they get to go home at 4:30 and forget about you and will not do what is necessary to reschedule work. Work every call that is phoned in today, today. The plumber, the home owner, and the company will never reap the benefits each deserves in this situation. All one must do is check their books on the last call of the day especially after 3:30 and they will discover how quickly the job is performed and at a low cost or how many are lost during this time period.


Sorry to piss you off. I enjoy working with people and have always had a lot of fun with people; customers, friends, and strangers. Any person that chooses to sit next to me is out of luck as we are bound to have a conversation. I am not sure it comes off in print, I am a funny guy that loves to have fun and my life to date has had some really fantastic bounces .


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## SimplePlumber (Feb 1, 2012)

Don The Plumber said:


> I agree with alot of what you say, & I been doin this 30 plus yrs, so I know how to schedule, but I guess this customer just pushed my buttons.
> 
> This particular job I scheduled a whole day, nothing else, because I knew I had some place to be at 4pm. I thought it would only take about 6hrs, I figured drive time too, this left me a window of 1.5 to 2 hrs. But a few minor things were a little more involved, & then she added these extra things too.
> 
> ...


We all have off days my friend. I have been victim of many a bad day too...though looking back at them, nearly all of them were created in my own mind when they didn't line up with the way I thought they should have been.

To answer your original post; My least favorite work? Tub & Urinal drains are tied for top don't-like-to-do, hands down.

I have been in the glorious field of plumbing now approaching 40 years in October. Like Richard H., I have found that I am more patient with the customers than I was when I was younger. This could be in part that I took off the last year and a half to focus on spirituality and where on the globe I want to live. (Something that providence and selling my plumbing company was able to afford me). I figured I would be dead a lot longer than I would be alive...so if not now, when?

I don't want to derail this thread by getting started on the the medical industry...can get ugly. However, if I forgot to tell the Doctor about any issue I had when I went in, I would tell them about it and expect at least a referral to a specialist if required. (Which was why I use Doctors as the basis in a lot of analogies I use, as we have pretty similar processes in plumbing)

And btw...it's SimplePlumber, not SinglePlumber :laughing:

I don't want to have to visit your Doctor to get me a "wife's headache" prescription too. :jester:


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## SimplePlumber (Feb 1, 2012)

Richard Hilliard said:


> Don
> 
> A few years ago I would have informed you I dislike digging, drain cleaning, crawl spaces and attics. Generally speaking I hate to get dirty and smelly. HOWEVER
> 
> ...


Richard, I couldn't agree more about the dispatcher (i.e. scheduling).

My first experience with a dispatcher was at Mr. Rooter. It was about 5pm and the dispatcher told me she had one more "emergency" call. Of course, this particular week was my on-call week, so I was already exhausted. So I get to the home in a hurry, not even stopping to eat...since it was an emergency...and find out that it was something large (forgot what it actually was), but clearly not an emergency. The customer even stated that she asked the dispatcher if today or tomorrow would be better since she was retired and had no plans.

The next morning, I arrive early at the office, invoice in hand waiting for the dispatcher to arrive at work. As soon as she walked through the door, I let loose on her. I told her that if she ever lied to me again about anything I would quit on the spot and she could explain why to the owner.

The dispatcher/scheduler/receptionist (a lot of times one person) is one of the most overlooked, under-trained, and most important functions in a service plumbing company. They can create massive turmoil or substantially increase profitability. And yet a lot of companies simply hire a minimum wage person to this position.

Conversely, I worked for a large company in Northern New Jersey that only allowed their division managers to answer and schedule any service calls. At first, I thought, what a waste of manpower...after seeing it in action, it was actually quite smart. Who better to understand the scope of work and the approximate time required for a given call than the manager of that division? They also knew roughly how long each tech would be on the job they were on at the moment which allowed for tighter scheduling.

Either way, the dispatchers are typically following instructions directly from the owner/service-manager as to rescheduling calls and the frustration should ultimately be directed at them. I am all for treating your plumbers with respect and keeping them healthy....not like an money making *object*.


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## Pipecommandor (Apr 18, 2011)

BigDave said:


> You can do many different things to "close the door" on "take a quick look at this" kinda stuff. I simply ask the customer to decide if anything else needs attention before packing away my tools AND contacting my next customer.
> 
> I come up with suggestions like "has anyone inspected your water heater lately?"
> "Has your potable water system been pressure tested for leaks"
> ...


" Has your potable water system been pressure tested for leaks " :laughing:
Not even on my slowest day would I make that suggestion, never, that's just b.s. There might be a time & place to test a residential system, but not to up sell a job !!!
Do you work off commission ???


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

This thread got me so riled up, I thought Simple Plumber, was Single Plumber. See what happens when I try to do things fast, I had a brief moment this afternoon, & was in a hurry. Sorry SP. My mind is going.

Hmmmm............. did I solder that last joint,.............. I sort a remember.


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## Titan Plumbing (Oct 8, 2009)

Dan the mumbler, you need to work on your scheduling...Dang it man!


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## RW Plumbing (Aug 16, 2010)

Don The Plumber said:


> Didn't mean to sound pissy. But don't you always have somewhere to go? If not personal, then maybe to the next job, or just wanna get home, after long day. I keep hearing how great the extra work, "while your here" is. I just can't figure out how you allot the time to do these tasks. I do alot of these add ons too, but then I find myself rushing all day long, or missing out on things I planned on, cuz it puts me behind.
> 
> My annoyance was directed at customer, not you, but I can see how you would interpret that. No hard feelings I hope. Hard to write out all details, but I had a few conversations, with this customer, during the course of the day, & mentioned to her atleast 2 times, I had an event to get to, & that I was cutting it close. Well that went through 1 ear & out the other. She asked me to do all these extra things anyways. She also got a garden tool set delivered, that she insisted I had to see, before she let me out the door.
> 
> ...


I too have had customers that try to add things after the check is in my hands. How I handle it really depends on a few different factors. If it's crap like moving furniture I just won't do it.

I don't have a master's license so I can move couches around. The other issue is liability. What if in the process of helping the customer out you scratch her hardwood floor or something. I only do things I am professionally good at, which is Plumbing. 

Any add on plumbing task gets billed out. I write out a new invoice and wave any trip charge. I do this before I even start the additional task. I've had a few customers ask me what I was doing saying I can't believe you're charging for that. I always ask if they would mind if they did 40 hrs worth of work but the boss only paid for 30. You know since they were already there. Most people get it at that point.

As far as taking additional time, so what. You have to be extremely flexable with scheduling as a one man shop. If that bothers you working service might not be the best choice. Our work doesn't lend itself well to exact schedules. You have to move stuff around all the time.

Just look at it as part of the job.


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## MTDUNN (Oct 9, 2011)

I give an extra hour for every service call just in case. Some do overlap on busy days but it usually works out. In my experience, most jobs work out based on my experience and being prepared. But as you all know every now and then you get a call that sneaks up on you and it ends up taking longer than you planned. 

Based on the call, customer says my tub is clogged. I'll be there between 12 and 2. Should take me 20 minutes right? When I arrive she had new tile installed a few days ago. 2 hours later I am on my way to the next call and on time.


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

RW Plumbing said:


> I too have had customers that try to add things after the check is in my hands. How I handle it really depends on a few different factors. If it's crap like moving furniture I just won't do it.
> 
> I don't have a master's license so I can move couches around. The other issue is liability. What if in the process of helping the customer out you scratch her hardwood floor or something. I only do things I am professionally good at, which is Plumbing.
> 
> ...


wow thats good... that pretty much sums up what happens to myself on a daily basis. i think because i live in south fl. alot of our customers are elderly. i'm never been bothered by additional plumbing work. we'll find a way to schedule it. btw i just started using the invoice book that way. it seems to get rid of freebees for plumbing. i really get asked some strange non plumbing request though. 
can you program my remote..
can you move this (furniture)
can you drop my computer off at office depot lol
can you cut that bush back on the walk way
i politely say no to these requst. as you stated liability is issue


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

RW Plumbing said:


> I too have had customers that try to add things after the check is in my hands. How I handle it really depends on a few different factors. If it's crap like moving furniture I just won't do it.
> 
> I don't have a master's license so I can move couches around. The other issue is liability. What if in the process of helping the customer out you scratch her hardwood floor or something. I only do things I am professionally good at, which is Plumbing.
> 
> ...


I allowed 2 hrs flex that day. How much more do you suggest? My whole point was, I figured all the extra flex time in, & I still ran late. Alot more frustrating to plan things out, allow flex time, & then still have to rush, or be late. The actual job that I was there to do, ran about a 1/2 hr over what I planned. No big deal. The extras was what got me. And the "type" of extras, is what annoyed me. None of it was profit type work, but I still had to deal with it. Whether its dealing with doing the work, pricing the work, or turning down the work, it was still taking up time, I did not have. As I said before, you don't go to doctor, to get your foot looked at, & then ask him/her to look at your sore arm or knee too.

I'll work till midnight if I got nothin going. All I do is service work & residential remodel. I run late, or over time alot of days. I aint new to this. I aint greedy either, cuz I would rather have an hr or 2 free time, than over book, & not be able to get to a customer I promised. I don't schedule 5 or 6 or more jobs a day, like alot of guys claim. I'm happy doing 2 or 3 at most, obviously depends on how involved each one is. I only did one today. Was there all day. I gotta go back too. I don't mind, cuz the work I gotta go back for is actual profitable plumbing work. It's not caulking.

I don't care if I get in 8hrs everyday either. I worked overtime & weekends most of the time when I was younger, so I don't have to now. So I planned 6hrs on this job, & it took me 7.5hrs when ya add in all the BS. And too, even though I told her I would not caulk her tub, I had to go in there, (because I was courteous, professional the whole time), & she had to show me, & get my advice, on a job I just informed her of, I was not interested in doing...... So how do I charge her for that?:whistling2:


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

SimplePlumber said:


> When I get asked to caulk a tub...I say with a smile, "You don't want to pay me $120 an hour just to get a "plumber" quality caulked tub, when you can spend about half that much and get a tile professional to do it. Here is who we recommend or check the internet.



That's the exact speech I give, I had a small note book with numbers for guys who did everything from drywall to stonework. Only guys I knew did good work and were honest. The customers love getting the inside scoop on who is good.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

DesertOkie said:


> That's the exact speech I give, I had a small note book with numbers for guys who did everything from drywall to stonework. Only guys I knew did good work and were honest. The customers love getting the inside scoop on who is good.


 
I love your idea. I would only have given this lady who wanted her bathtub, & shower doors caulked, number of contractor who was an enemy. :laughing: None of my usual referals, would appreciate getting called to caulk a bathtub. This includes tile guys. I've asked them before, none of them wanna deal with it either.


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

Don The Plumber said:


> I love your idea. I would only have given this lady who wanted her bathtub, & shower doors caulked, number of contractor who was an enemy. :laughing: None of my usual referals, would appreciate getting called to caulk a bathtub. This includes tile guys. I've asked them before, none of them wanna deal with it either.



I guess you don't have many illegals in Michigan. :laughing:


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## piper1 (Dec 16, 2011)

Don The Plumber said:


> I allowed 2 hrs flex that day. How much more do you suggest? My whole point was, I figured all the extra flex time in, & I still ran late. Alot more frustrating to plan things out, allow flex time, & then still have to rush, or be late. The actual job that I was there to do, ran about a 1/2 hr over what I planned. No big deal. The extras was what got me. And the "type" of extras, is what annoyed me. None of it was profit type work, but I still had to deal with it. Whether its dealing with doing the work, pricing the work, or turning down the work, it was still taking up time, I did not have. As I said before, you don't go to doctor, to get your foot looked at, & then ask him/her to look at your sore arm or knee too.
> 
> I'll work till midnight if I got nothin going. All I do is service work & residential remodel. I run late, or over time alot of days. I aint new to this. I aint greedy either, cuz I would rather have an hr or 2 free time, than over book, & not be able to get to a customer I promised. I don't schedule 5 or 6 or more jobs a day, like alot of guys claim. I'm happy doing 2 or 3 at most, obviously depends on how involved each one is. I only did one today. Was there all day. I gotta go back too. I don't mind, cuz the work I gotta go back for is actual profitable plumbing work. It's not caulking.
> 
> I don't care if I get in 8hrs everyday either. I worked overtime & weekends most of the time when I was younger, so I don't have to now. So I planned 6hrs on this job, & it took me 7.5hrs when ya add in all the BS. And too, even though I told her I would not caulk her tub, I had to go in there, (because I was courteous, professional the whole time), & she had to show me, & get my advice, on a job I just informed her of, I was not interested in doing...... So how do I charge her for that?:whistling2:


 the part about because I was courteous, professional the whole time), sometimes i think thats a cruse. as most plumbers are hard workers and want to get things done. some customers want to talk, show and tell etc. and we are not turning a screwdriver. these mins. add up and before you know it the job getting away from you. and i can also relate about the part of saying no i don't do that, well look at it anyway and tell me what you think, what are they thinking, i magically change my mine. oh look another 10mins. go by and i'm still saying no. i don't know the answer for this problem. i wonder if i was rougher around the edges if that would help. but that probably has it own share of problems too! i do have a trick for the long winded ho. i can make my own phone ring.( excuse me i have to get this), sometime thats the break you need from the ho to get back to work!!


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## deerslayer (Mar 29, 2012)

I charge by the hour, but I rarely caulk a tub that I didn't install due to aesthetics and knowing it's to hard to warranty. Usually use the I don't have the right kind of caulk with me and the place I get it is 1/2 hr each way plus an hr to caulk excuse. If they wanna talk at plumber rates let's talk I got all day I fill out the ticket only after asking twice if there is anything else we can do for you while we are here. I've done all kinds of unplumbing work, I set ballard posts and fill with concrete at 1 commercial account we have all the time because the customer likes the way I did the 1st one. A job is a job I do shy away from stuff I know I can't do in an efficient manner IE finishing drywall etd.! I never let the customer know I am in a hurry on a personal level, we will occasionaly pull out for an emergency letting our customer know we will do the same for them in their time of need.


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## BigDave (Mar 24, 2012)

Pipecommandor said:


> " Has your potable water system been pressure tested for leaks " :laughing:
> Not even on my slowest day would I make that suggestion, never, that's just b.s. There might be a time & place to test a residential system, but not to up sell a job !!!
> Do you work off commission ???


To answer your question, no, I'm an hourly employee.
As to your b.s. comment, I think you missed the point of the thread.
Free work, if done at all, should at least have a good chance of leading
to more work done at profit. I have saved customers thousands of dollars
by catching leaks early (before major damage occurs) when pressure
testing a home. Due to the fact that in most cases the system checks
out with no leaks, I consider this a courtesy service, not an upsell.
BTW, the customers love it when you do positive unexpected things.


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## johnlewismcleod (Apr 6, 2012)

I've no idea if this applies to you, BigDave, so please don't take it as a personal attack...just an attempt to explain where Pipecommandor is coming from:

In my opinion the increasingly popular business model of making plumbers into "commissioned technicians" (i.e. salesmen) is a blight on our industry.

Admittedly I've never worked for a commission based company (and never will), so you salesmen out there can tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. 

But from talking to the plumbers that have worked for these outfits about the weekly sales training meetings and the tricks they employ to upsell once they get their "foot in the door", it's crystal clear these outfits aren't about professional service...they are about taking advantage of the customers and making as much money as possible.

Making money is a good thing...we all need it to keep the wheels turning. But pride, honorable service, and professionalism should never take a back seat to a quick buck.



P.S: 

Asking HO if they want a domestic water test: quick, inexpensive service to give if they want it :thumbsup:

Pressuring the HO for a sewer system test for no reason: kind of scummy :thumbdown:


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

SimplePlumber said:


> The actual "problem" I see in your situation revolves around scheduling.
> 
> The tub caulking could have been a leaky faucet, toilet leak, or some other task that had the potential to extend the work past your *preconceived* idea of scheduled time there.
> 
> ...



I do things a similar way. With regular customers, I know when the call comes in how to schedule them....some need more time because I may end up having to sample some chicken salad or replace a lightbulb or doorknob.....it's all billable time..I will indeed caulk a bath tub, but schedule it as a dedicated visit....If I do not want to be coming back to it in a week or two, I allow enough time to properly strip, clean, and apply....it's all billable. It also gives me a chance to check other things for potential problems, which get pointed out...."how long has the toilet been making that hiss"? "Did you ever notice that it rocks"?.....and of course, some extra time has already been allowed at the tail of this time slot....if i am done sooner, the next customer gets a call with the chance to have me come sooner, which some think is special treatment....
For self protection, I carry cards from a local REPUTABLE handy man that has all his own insurance and bonding.....give those out when they start talking about anything else.


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## pilot light (Apr 21, 2012)

For some reason they ask me to move furniture alot. Have a alot of elderly customers usually help them out.


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

pilot light said:


> For some reason they ask me to move furniture alot. Have a alot of elderly customers usually help them out.



Most of mine are elderly....but no, I don't do painting on Saturdays.


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## pilot light (Apr 21, 2012)

PinkPlumber said:


> Most of mine are elderly....but no, I don't do painting on Saturdays.


 Good call ! :laughing:


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## affordabledrain (Nov 24, 2009)

had a lady ask me if I would run her broken window down to the hardware to be repaired? Told her the hourly rate. She still wanted me to do it:furious:

I will not caulk anything That I did not install. My response. I don't have my caulk gun with me


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

affordabledrain said:


> had a lady ask me if I would run her broken window down to the hardware to be repaired? Told her the hourly rate. She still wanted me to do it:furious:
> 
> I will not caulk anything That I did not install. My response. *I don't have my caulk gun with me
> 
> *They'd offer the use of theirs... I'll caulk by appointment, and I use the best caulk money can get....never had a call back.....been lucky....spendy caulk job when done, but they don't seem to care.


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## pilot light (Apr 21, 2012)

Tell them I dont do Caulk!:thumbup:


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

pilot light said:


> Tell them I dont do Caulk!:thumbup:



For an hourly rate, I'll caulk anything plumbing related....makes an easy day.:balloon:


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## Qball415 (Nov 20, 2010)

Is that the same rate as a lady raising caulks at the massage house?


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

Qball415 said:


> Is that the same rate as a lady raising caulks at the massage house?


You just aren't good at veiled humor...

Here's what I raise...


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## affordabledrain (Nov 24, 2009)

PinkPlumber said:


> You just aren't good at veiled humor...
> 
> Here's what I raise...


so u do raise cocks :laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

affordabledrain said:


> so u do raise cocks :laughing::laughing::laughing:



Very astute of you!!.....and when they give me trouble, I give them a swift kick.:thumbsup:


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## Richard Hilliard (Apr 10, 2010)

PinkPlumber said:


> Very astute of you!!.....and when they give me trouble, I give them a swift kick.:thumbsup:


 
or chop thier head off


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## PinkPlumber (May 20, 2012)

Richard Hilliard said:


> or chop thier head off



I could, but won't.....this particular breed of chickens aren't eaten by folks in the states anyway....they have black bones, and black skin.....and are all dark meat....only eaten in places like china...where they stir fry anything.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

Titan Plumbing said:


> I always ask BEFORE I write the invoice if there is anything else they need us to look at while we're there.


 

This solves the problem instantly, leaves it solid as a rock.


If they still ask, "While you're here" even though you asked first? If it is plumbing related, clock continues to run. 

I get asked constantly to do things non-plumbing related. Caulking as well. I just say no, "We're no good at that. Call your handyman to do that type of work, they are cheaper than us plumbers." 

And go silent. It will end the conversation 99% of the time. 


If that 1% pursues it to be insistent? I tell them I am a pipe and fittings plumber, that's why you called me, *to fix plumbing*. If someone wants to toss me as their plumber if I didn't do what they asked after the check is written? 

Call my competition, I won't know either way. 


For my loyal customers I take a different approach, especially if they've been good to me. I'll white lie that I don't have the right stuff.... or here's a great one,

"I guess we'll have to do that next time you have us over to do work." or "I already called my next customer, next time let me know before we're done."


Always point it back to the customer, because that's where it belongs.


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

affordabledrain said:


> so u do raise cocks :laughing::laughing::laughing:


I was gonna say the same thing but she forewarned me with a 24 "... sooooooo...


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## BigDave (Mar 24, 2012)

johnlewismcleod said:


> I've no idea if this applies to you, BigDave, so please don't take it as a personal attack.


I'm not offended in the least!


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## MikeS (Oct 3, 2011)

ah, the "While you are here" call. A job is a job. Sure, I can fix it, for an additional charge.


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## Don The Plumber (Feb 14, 2010)

MikeS said:


> ah, the "While you are here" call. A job is a job. Sure, I can fix it, for an additional charge.


 I will never be desperate enough to caulk bathtubs. A job is a job? Well let me see......should I stay here and scrape all the caulking and mildew off this ladies bathtub, dry it out with a heat gun, & apply caulking. Or do I go to the next job, where there is actually plumbing work, that needs to be done. Hmmm, ...... not a tough choice for me, but if a job is a job, then go ahead, & scrape, & caulk away.

You know, the whole point of this particular, "WHILE YOUR HERE" scenario, is that this lady, as does alot of people, think its a 5 min job to caulk a bathtub.:no: They"re not even remotely in the ballpark, on what it takes to do the job properly, much less how much its gonna cost.

And 1 more thing, the 1st sign of mildew again, or a little peeling of the caulk, this lady would be wanting me to come back. So no, I aint caulking bathtubs. All you guys who may be desperate, go for it. I'd rather move on to a real plumbing job.:yes:


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

PinkPlumber said:


> I could, but won't.....this particular breed of chickens aren't eaten by folks in the states anyway....they have black bones, and black skin.....and are all dark meat....only eaten in places like china...where they stir fry anything.


That's racist....


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## jc-htownplumber (Feb 29, 2012)

Do what I have done before "list charge" get to a job only call you for a toilet repair but while you are here I have a list. But yeah fck caulking bathtubs


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## east-indy (Mar 11, 2012)

PinkPlumber said:


> affordabledrain said:
> 
> 
> > had a lady ask me if I would run her broken window down to the hardware to be repaired? Told her the hourly rate. She still wanted me to do it:furious:
> ...


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## JeffHazel (Dec 16, 2016)

I agree with your replies above. It really is easy to catch when a customer always wants my team to "look at one more thing" or "just take a quick look" after the actual job is done. When the team looks, we realize it will be at least a 10 minute job, only for them to say something like "it will only be a little bit" or "please". Of course, while they are there, they want to receive as much out of it as possible, especially after the payment has been made. What tends to become even more noticeable is when the same people who want to negotiate $10 here and there are the same ones that want a plumber to do 2x and 3x as much work. First, they try to negotiate $10 on the first job, and then try to run the plumber around on all sorts of "quick tasks" than end up making the job 2x to 3x more work, all for some doughnuts or coffee or "grandma's famous cake". Eventually, the plumber may as well just live with the customer and be the personal handyman. That is one rookie mistake that has been done with a rookie. One job turned into 3x the work with all the "little fixes" here and there.

Catch guard. Make sure you charge for "extra work" if you are not going to quote on looking at the problem and assessing it.


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Do you intro yourself to new customers? Maybe you should do that here.


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## GAN (Jul 10, 2012)

As he replies to a thread from 2012......................:bangin:


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## WashingtonPlung (Jul 25, 2016)

I did water treatment for 2 years when the economy was garbage. Anyway what I hated was when the salesman would add on additional tasks to help sell the job. 

_"You want me to take your daughter to prom?" 

"You want us to run an untreated line across your finished basement while concealing the piping?"

Or when sales pulls out stupid ideas

"Can't we just support the pipe off the equipment that its connected to in the middle of the room ?_ :no::no:


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## ShtRnsdownhill (Jan 13, 2016)

well there are 2 sides here..1 if its your business and your working for the customer and 1 if your an employee....as a business owner, any extra work that will be PAID for is more than welcome and if its an employee, well many times they want to get the heck out of the job and dont like add on surprises...depending on how good a customer and how big the extra is..they may get a bone thrown in on the job as a freebee for being a good customer...


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