# International Pllumbing Code



## Ghostmaker (Jan 12, 2013)

Does anyone use that code day to day. Ohio Adopted the code a while back but I have a few questions that you all may be helpful in answering. Once I figure out how to post a drawing on this.:jester:


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

That is the model code that Florida Plumbing Code is based on. I am no expert, but I have a decent working knowledge of it.


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

OK uses it.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

most of Texas is under the IPC , still have a few city's using the UPC.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

If I may. I have a question and maybe with answers to mine it will answer you question 

What are the major differences in IPC and UPC and is there any text/book telling you those ..??

Is it true IPC is a stricter code than UPC ??? 

Thanks not trying to hyjake but I figured it fit here !!!


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Upc is a much stricter code.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Ok.


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## 3KP (Jun 19, 2008)

Our state just converted to IPC this year according to IPLA that's the new code book..

Wish they would just except 1 code book state wide and stick with it!!:yes:


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## Ghostmaker (Jan 12, 2013)

From what iI have seen the UPC has much better venting then the IPC.

I'm trying to get this drawing scanned will post soon.


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## Ghostmaker (Jan 12, 2013)

*First code drawing wet vent with a problem?*












Ran into this on inspection. Plumber was using the wet vent for 2 bathroom groups. He put in a combination drain and vent for his second lav prior to the last water closet on the wet vent. 

Ended up taking this to the head inspector of the state. Determination was we could not mix venting methods.

Just wondering what your states have been telling you.

Thank you.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

there would be nothing wrong with that here , for the simple reason that the lav would help keep the cdv vent clear.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Am I missing something ??? I only see one vent drawn with dashed lines I don't do systems like that Execpt on a floor drain What vents the wc.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

in the IPC you can put in a combination drain and vent system for bathrooms . In the UPC this system is called a CWV .In most jurisdictions it is only allowed on refrigerated case drains like in a grocery store .


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

This is what it should look like


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Ok. Cwv vent in hi end vent on low end and a circuit vent connecting them. Is circuit the rite term ??


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

The one thing to be careful about is some city's will allow WC's some won't allow them on this type of system.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Ok. Got it.


Who knows any other differences in the UPC and IPC


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## germanplumber (Sep 13, 2011)

They are not as detailed as the WI plumbing code :jester::whistling2:


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

germanplumber said:


> They are not as detailed as the WI plumbing code :jester::whistling2:


Is it because Wisconsin plumbers need the pictures and the details broke down to understand the code better . :jester::whistling2: lmao


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## germanplumber (Sep 13, 2011)

justme said:


> Is it because Wisconsin plumbers need the pictures and the details broke down to understand the code better . :jester::whistling2: lmao


that and we are really hungover when we take our J.M. test:laughing:


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Ghostmaker said:


> Ran into this on inspection. Plumber was using the wet vent for 2 bathroom groups. He put in a combination drain and vent for his second lav prior to the last water closet on the wet vent.
> 
> Ended up taking this to the head inspector of the state. Determination was we could not mix venting methods.
> 
> ...


Just spent the last half hour reading the code and thinking about this.

Section 912 deals with Combination Drain and Vent systems.
912.2.2 Connection. The combination drain and vent system shall be provided with a dry vent connected at any point within the system *or the system shall connect to a horizontal drain that is vented in accordance with one of the venting methods specified in this chapter.*

The lavatory combination drain and vent connects to the horizontal drain that is wet vented in accordance 909.2.1, so I would think that it is allowable.


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

He had no more than two like fixtures. I'd say ok. It's not acceptable to mix venting methods in a close system. But they looked like bath fixture you can wet vent two groups as one. I'd of passed it


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Plumberman911 said:


> *He had no more than two like fixtures. *I'd say ok. It's not acceptable to mix venting methods in a close system. But they looked like bath fixture you can wet vent two groups as one. I'd of passed it


Can you elaborate on the bold section?


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

phishfood said:


> Can you elaborate on the bold section?


Bold section?

Gostmaker's drawing is just a wet vent system the middle lav doesn't make it a combination vent just two wet vents. Legal and floor drain is protected. Combination vent serves two vents on same floor


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

Bathroom group. IPC 2009. WC, lav, tub or shower, including or excluding a bidet and or emergency floor drain. 
You can install two like fixtures on the same floor level. And it can be still a wet vented group. 2 toilets , 2 lavs, 2 tubs or showers and its legal. You can wet vent one bathroom run down 20' and wet vent the second bathroom off the first bathroom IF NO other fixtures or fittings are installed between the two bathrooms. IPC does not limit the distance between two wet vented groups. Just that they are on the same floor level. Urinals are not a bathroom fixture and have to tie in downstream of a wet vented group. Or if you want to tie in a urinal in that group you have to individually vent each fixture.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Y would you want to vent it that way??


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

Y ? It's a legal wet vent. The down stream bath you can combination vent the lav if you follow the rules. Saves a hole in the roof. I didn't write it that's why UPC is more strict


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Plumberman911 said:


> Bold section?
> 
> Gostmaker's drawing is just a wet vent system the middle lav doesn't make it a combination vent just two wet vents. Legal and floor drain is protected. Combination vent serves two vents on same floor


lol if its not a combo drain and vent system where is the vents for the other fixtures ?


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

I believe he it is a cdv system like he labeled and he is talking about putting lavs on his 2 2" vents that are supposed to remain dry on a cdv system by code . The problem is that every inspector out there interprets the code different . Because by code your not supposed put anything but floor drains, sinks, lavatories and drinking fountains on a CDV system. It could almost be a circuit vent system but not quite done right. But would it work yes ,is it completely by code depends on who's inspecting it.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

*If he had just put a 2" vent by its self at the end between the WC and the last lav then this could be called a circuit vent.




SECTION 911 CIRCUIT VENTING** 

911.1 Circuit vent permitted. *

A maximum of eight fixtures connected to a horizontal branch drain shall be permitted to be circuit vented. Each fixture drain shall connect horizontally to the horizontal branch being circuit vented. The horizontal branch drain shall be classified as a vent from the most downstream fixture drain connection to the most upstream fixture drain connection to the horizontal branch. *911.1.1 Multiple circuit-vented branches. *

Circuit-vented horizontal branch drains are permitted to be connected together. Each group of a maximum of eight fixtures shall be considered a separate circuit vent and shall conform to the requirements of this section. * 911.2 Vent connection. *

The circuit vent connection shall be located between the two most upstream fixture drains. The vent shall connect to the horizontal branch and shall be installed in accordance with Section 905. The circuit vent pipe shall not receive the discharge of any soil or waste.* 

911.3 Slope and size of horizontal branch. *

The maximum slope of the vent section of the horizontal branch drain shall be one unit vertical in 12 units horizontal (8-percent slope). The entire length of the vent section of the horizontal branch drain shall be sized for the total drainage discharge to the branch. *911.3.1 Size of multiple circuit vent. *

Each separate circuit-vented horizontal branch that is interconnected shall be sized independently in accordance with Section 911.3. The downstream circuit-vented horizontal branch shall be sized for the total discharge into the branch, including the upstream branches and the fixtures within the branch. * 911.4 Relief vent. *

A relief vent shall be provided for circuit-vented horizontal branches receiving the discharge of four or more water closets and connecting to a drainage stack that receives the discharge of soil or waste from upper horizontal branches. *911.4.1 Connection and installation. *

The relief vent shall connect to the horizontal branch drain between the stack and the most downstream fixture drain of the circuit vent. The relief vent shall be installed in accordance with Section 905. *911.4.2 Fixture drain or branch. *

The relief vent is permitted to be a fixture drain or fixture branch for fixtures located within the same branch interval as the circuit-vented horizontal branch. The maximum discharge to a relief vent shall be four fixture units. * 911.5 Additional fixtures. *

Fixtures, other than the circuit-vented fixtures, are permitted to discharge to the horizontal branch drain. Such fixtures shall be located on the same floor as the circuit-vented fixtures and shall be either individually or common vented.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

My question is y would you use that system. Surly a old school stack vent using Santees is a better system. I guess it's just me and I do t know all the code. For it. I'm a visual learner and was never taught it nor never seen it much. But on floor drains What are the major advantages using it ?? Island sinks ?? Less holes in roof ? I re vent it all together any ways so that doesn't matter. Does any one use this a lot ??


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## rjbphd (Feb 5, 2010)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Y would you want to vent it that way??


Y is better than the W way or you can use the I way..


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Or you can use the F U RJ way Dam freaking no chain hooking Yankee Lmao. When you go to Mexico you stopping in Texas ??


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

The cdv system was developed for large shower area's to make it easier to rough them in . Roof penetrations have nothing to do with it because on commercial we revent everything within a bathroom group. The CWV system for the UPC is almost exactly the same thing with a few minor differences but it is mostly used for refrigerated case's and under the UPC the CWV system isn't allowed to be used on a grease system. Plus on all those showers you roughed in not to long ago the CDV system would have saved tons of labor on the top out. Alot less vents to run .


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Ok I see. Well on that shower job first it was no traps with three inch 90 and no traps. Then 3" traps and vents I did say let us put 3" trap with 3x2 bushing in it and it would be a great system. I was shot down. I'm just a plumber. But I didn't draw a system with no traps. And now. I had to adjust the thormo mixing shower valves down to100deg cuz the engineer didn't take time to size the pipe and ad fixture units !!!20 in men's and all kinda warm. But if more then 10 are on u get ice cold out of a lot if them. Dumbas. Glad it's over but. That's our tax dollars. It was a mess from the start !!!!!!
Women's has 10 showers Only 6 will operate all at once. Do you know how many airmen take pt test at once ??? And 100 or more !!!!!


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

what size is the pipe in there for the hot water?


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Enters at 1 1/2 women's. and 2" men's. way undersized I bet they had issues before the remodel. Try'd to blame me that I piped it rong. No no no. Scope said tie on to existing branches. I did that. There screwed. End if story. Water is hot as hell just not enough volume. I get 140 deg when valve is turned all the way to hot and that's still mixing it with cold a bit


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

And what's the IPC call out for this revent you reffer to as a method. Revent isn't a method


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

I guess it's a term. Not a method. Tieing all vents together and penetrate roof once !! I vent all fixtures and like to use Santees and stack all of it. I think that's the best way. And how I was taught and how most I have done was drawn. I'd like to learn did ways tho


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Plumberman911 said:


> And what's the IPC call out for this revent you reffer to as a method. Revent isn't a method


lmfao


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

Plumberman911 said:


> And what's the IPC call out for this revent you reffer to as a method. Revent isn't a method


quote me where I said reventing was a method.


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

Justme sorry to imply you called it a method. Youd be surprised how many do but can't find the call out. 

I also stand to correct myself. I said combination vent to catch two traps on same floor level. That's a common vent. Revent to me then is basically a circuit vent.


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## justme (Jul 4, 2012)

You have nothing to apologize for . This is an on going discussion we will all be wrong at some point lol.


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

justme said:


> You have nothing to apologize for . This is a on going discussion we will all be wrong at some point lol.


Not me I'm never wrong !!!!! Lmao. There's a lot to learn here. Wish I could learn it in the field tho


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## 89plumbum (May 14, 2011)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> My question is y would you use that system. Surly a old school stack vent using Santees is a better system. I guess it's just me and I do t know all the code. For it. I'm a visual learner and was never taught it nor never seen it much. But on floor drains What are the major advantages using it ?? Island sinks ?? Less holes in roof ? I re vent it all together any ways so that doesn't matter. Does any one use this a lot ??


My old employer was a CWV feind, I mean he wanted every job this way. He claimed it was easier to stock all 4" pipe and ftgs( where he lost on material he gained in labor), less vents, easier to run a fairly large company for him. On the rare ocassion we did a house... inspectors would always say... commercial plumbers huh? Lol.


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Plumberman911 said:


> Bathroom group. IPC 2009. WC, lav, tub or shower, including or excluding a bidet and or emergency floor drain.
> You can install two like fixtures on the same floor level. And it can be still a wet vented group. 2 toilets , 2 lavs, 2 tubs or showers and its legal. You can wet vent one bathroom run down 20' and wet vent the second bathroom off the first bathroom IF NO other fixtures or fittings are installed between the two bathrooms. IPC does not limit the distance between two wet vented groups. Just that they are on the same floor level. Urinals are not a bathroom fixture and have to tie in downstream of a wet vented group. Or if you want to tie in a urinal in that group you have to individually vent each fixture.


If you don't consider the lavatory on the left of the drawing to be a combination drain and vent, then it is S trapped.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Ok. Got it.
> 
> Who knows any other differences in the UPC and IPC


It's like day and night


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

Here's my 2 cents as have had the opportunity to work with both....UPC must separate vent everything, IPC lav can wet vent everything.

UPC sucks and IPC is sweet and easy


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Michaelcookplum said:


> Here's my 2 cents as have had the opportunity to work with both....UPC must separate vent everything, IPC lav can wet vent everything.
> 
> UPC sucks and IPC is sweet and easy


Sounds to me UPC is better cuz its stricter Easy doesn't always mean better and UPC has combination waste and venting but only when structural conditions don't allow conventional venting !!!


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

If another venting system protects trap seals just as well as shown by many years of use, requires less fittings and pipe, and takes much less time to install, how is it not as good as stack venting?


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

phishfood said:


> If another venting system protects trap seals just as well as shown by many years of use, requires less fittings and pipe, and takes much less time to install, how is it not as good as stack venting?


Idk. In my opinion I like a vent on each fixture but then again it's how I learned and old habits die hard. The more vents the better the way I see it. But ur rite less labor and parts is better. Didn't mean to speak out of turn. Still young in my career and mist of what I've done is com and drawn up. Even when it's not I still stack it if I can. I would like to learn other methods tho. I learn better in the field then out of a code book.


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Not out of line at all, IMO.

I learn new ways all of the time, some are better than the way I have been doing things, some not so much. I like to learn from codes and discussions, but I always feel more comfortable with things that I have installed and know to work, so in that way I am much like you.


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

phishfood said:


> If you don't consider the lavatory on the left of the drawing to be a combination drain and vent, then it is S trapped.


And how is that a s trap??


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## Plumberman911 (Dec 23, 2012)

I can't tell is there a vent on the lady lav? I thought I saw one. Now I don't know if there's not then that lav is combination vented. Still legal.


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## phishfood (Nov 18, 2012)

Can't zoom in on my phone, but I couldn't see one. It also is noted that the left hand lav is CDV.


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Sounds to me UPC is better cuz its stricter Easy doesn't always mean better and UPC has combination waste and venting but only when structural conditions don't allow conventional venting !!!


That's not true.... At all. Combo waste and vent 99.9 percent of the time, even when you can separate vent


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## Michaelcookplum (May 1, 2011)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Sounds to me UPC is better cuz its stricter Easy doesn't always mean better and UPC has combination waste and venting but only when structural conditions don't allow conventional venting !!!


Honestly it's not about easy and hard, wet venting all toilets and tub/showers works just as well as separate venting. Why put more vents and more work, if its not necessary? Only necessary cause the UPC tells you to


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## germanplumber (Sep 13, 2011)

Michaelcookplum said:


> Honestly it's not about easy and hard, wet venting all toilets and tub/showers works just as well as separate venting. Why put more vents and more work, if its not necessary? Only necessary cause the UPC tells you to


I'm with you on that more individual vents means more time. And your still keeping trap pressures at .036

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Plumbing Zone


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

Ok ok guys I get the point. I guess it's just I know how to stack vent. It's how it's always drawn. Maybe some one will do it at new job and I can learn.


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## germanplumber (Sep 13, 2011)

TX MECH PLUMBER said:


> Ok ok guys I get the point. I guess it's just I know how to stack vent. It's how it's always drawn. Maybe some one will do it at new job and I can learn.


Its all a learning process. We all learn something new, a quicker way that's what makes us professionals

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Plumbing Zone


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## TX MECH PLUMBER (May 27, 2011)

I just need to sit down read code and draw. Draw draw then post post post them And get it down that way. I've never put in a whole system that was cdwv. Plus buy UPC it states to vent all fixtures if you can. In txs we use UPC and Ipc. And what ever the ahjd dreams up


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