# Finally one Plumbing Code for ALL!



## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

Heads up, the IPC and UPC will be combined beginning 1/1/2014. :thumbup: Same time the new lead law goes into effect.

Even states like Maryland (who have their own unique plumbing code) have signed on. This should make the industry much stronger and stop a lot of confusion. Some states will have addenda related to their specific area.

Not to mention, those on PZ will be on the same page. :yes:


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## rocksteady (Oct 8, 2008)

This is good news and could go a long way to standardizing things. Maybe a more uniform licensing system too? Am I being too optimistic?








Paul


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

It will be nice but now each state with their addendum's or independent state codes will change the landscape. IE, a state chooses not to adopt a chapter etc...


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

PlumbCrazy said:


> Heads up, the IPC and UPC will be combined beginning 1/1/2014. :thumbup: Same time the new lead law goes into effect.
> 
> Even states like Maryland (who have their own unique plumbing code) have signed on. This should make the industry much stronger and stop a lot of confusion. Some states will have addenda related to their specific area.
> 
> Not to mention, those on PZ will be on the same page. :yes:


Happy April 1st.

Mark


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> Happy April 1st.
> 
> Mark


Yea really...

Like that would ever happen...:laughing:


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

MARK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You jumped in way too quickly. This could have been a really long, funny thread. :yes:


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Sorry about that!

I've watched the debate for way too long. It's bad enough that the plumbers can't agree but the builders complain the UPC is overburdensome and causes cost of building to go up.

Mark


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## PeckPlumbing (Mar 19, 2011)

rocksteady said:


> This is good news and could go a long way to standardizing things. Maybe a more uniform licensing system too? Am I being too optimistic?
> 
> Paul


There really should be a uniform licensing system. I think its flat out wrong to have to pay again and again to relicense in different states..


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## satelliteplumah (Jun 20, 2010)

Mass. will always be different they seem to like it that way,we recently went to 5 yr apprentice term (thanks local 12) and I think the next time houses boom we will see the effects. If a kid could spend 5 yrs with the same res. company is a longshot, so the only way to get a ticket will be big comm. shops now are those guys gonna get the lic. and want to do res. probly not. so well see but I think this state stinks.


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## Marlin (Aug 14, 2008)

PeckPlumbing said:


> There really should be a uniform licensing system. I think its flat out wrong to have to pay again and again to relicense in different states..


Differant states? Around here plumbing companies need 14 (yes 14) seperate licenses. Every town, city and village has their own license and will not recognize the neighbors. That's just to work on the 90 mile by 30 mile island I live on not including NYC which is another license. It would probably be 50 licenses to be allowed to work anywhere in NY. It's a cash grab, every town wants their $250 every two years.


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## PeckPlumbing (Mar 19, 2011)

Marlin said:


> Differant states? Around here plumbing companies need 14 (yes 14) seperate licenses. Every town, city and village has their own license and will not recognize the neighbors. That's just to work on the 90 mile by 30 mile island I live on not including NYC which is another license. It would probably be 50 licenses to be allowed to work anywhere in NY. It's a cash grab, every town wants their $250 every two years.


You must mean city business licenses?


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## Marlin (Aug 14, 2008)

PeckPlumbing said:


> You must mean city business licenses?


No. 14 seperate plumbing licenses tests and all. Though I hear some will waive the test once you have a few licenses.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

That would be cool, but never gonna happen.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Marlin said:


> No. 14 seperate plumbing licenses tests and all. Though I hear some will waive the test once you have a few licenses.


 



Are you on Long Island? (LI,NY)


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

Marlin said:


> No. 14 seperate plumbing licenses tests and all. Though I hear some will waive the test once you have a few licenses.


Which lic. Do you have? I've been looking into reciprocation and unless nyc reciprocates with them they won't reciprocate and we ain't reciprocating with no one. Now if I want to work on L.I. I need to retest and wipe lead and its all so stupid (because my lic is so stupid hard to get I think all jurisdictions should give me their lic.). There is no way even if the hole country unites under one code/lic. that N.Y. will ever have a single lic. (nor would I want that (its called job security) ) but I would love to get some L.I. work and Brooklyn is on the island of long island so I think my demands are fair.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

BROOKLYN\PLUMB said:


> Which lic. Do you have? I've been looking into reciprocation and unless nyc reciprocates with them they won't reciprocate and we ain't reciprocating with no one. Now if I want to work on L.I. I need to retest and wipe lead and its all so stupid (because my lic is so stupid hard to get I think all jurisdictions should give me their lic.). There is no way even if the hole country unites under one code/lic. that N.Y. will ever have a single lic. (nor would I want that (its called job security) ) but I would love to get some L.I. work and Brooklyn is on the island of long island so I think my demands are fair.


 



So you're saying with a NYC master plumber's license, you cannot work in Brooklyn, which is one of the (5) boroughs of NYC? 

That IS retarded.


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## BROOKLYN\PLUMB (May 21, 2010)

Tommy plumber said:


> So you're saying with a NYC master plumber's license, you cannot work in Brooklyn, which is one of the (5) boroughs of NYC?
> 
> That IS retarded.


No I'm saying I cant work on the the rest of the small island I live on


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

BROOKLYN\PLUMB said:


> No I'm saying I cant work on the the rest of the small island I live on


 



So you can't work in the eastern part of LI. Like the Hamptons, Montauk, etc.


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## Marlin (Aug 14, 2008)

BROOKLYN\PLUMB said:


> Which lic. Do you have? I've been looking into reciprocation and unless nyc reciprocates with them they won't reciprocate and we ain't reciprocating with no one. Now if I want to work on L.I. I need to retest and wipe lead and its all so stupid (because my lic is so stupid hard to get I think all jurisdictions should give me their lic.). There is no way even if the hole country unites under one code/lic. that N.Y. will ever have a single lic. (nor would I want that (its called job security) ) but I would love to get some L.I. work and Brooklyn is on the island of long island so I think my demands are fair.


I work for a licensed company, I do not have a license myself. The company I am employed by has all the local licenses. To the best of my recollection it is 14 separate licenses they have, I could be off by one or two. 
Like you said, no LI town is going to reciprocate with NYC unless NYC reciprocates with them and their is no way that's going to happen. We really need a state licensing system. First to eliminate this every town/county having its own license. Secondly because have you seen what they get away with upstate? One of my favorites was a house plumbed in pex that said "not for potable water" every 2' right on the tubing. It was put in by a licensed plumber and passed inspection.



Tommy plumber said:


> So you can't work in the eastern part of LI. Like the Hamptons, Montauk, etc.


He can't work anywhere in Nassau of Suffolk county with a NYC license. Just like the company I work for is licensed to work in Nassau and Suffolk but not NYC.


For those who are not familiar with Long Island here is a county map. Brooklyn, Queens, Manhatten, the Bronx and Staten Island (not pictured) are part of New York City and I think covered under one license. Nassau and Suffolk are not covered by a NYC license. If you want to work in all areas of Nassau and Suffolk you need about 14 completely separate plumbing licenses. The whole island is about 100 miles tip to tip.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Prolly easier to understand than the map would be...

The Hamptons out in Suffolk County...










Midtown Manhattan....










Everything in between...

And The Bronx...


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## SlickRick (Sep 3, 2009)

Heck of a parking job...


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Marlin said:


> I work for a licensed company, I do not have a license myself. The company I am employed by has all the local licenses. To the best of my recollection it is 14 separate licenses they have, I could be off by one or two.
> Like you said, no LI town is going to reciprocate with NYC unless NYC reciprocates with them and their is no way that's going to happen. We really need a state licensing system. First to eliminate this every town/county having its own license. Secondly because have you seen what they get away with upstate? One of my favorites was a house plumbed in pex that said "not for potable water" every 2' right on the tubing. It was put in by a licensed plumber and passed inspection.
> 
> 
> ...


 



So NYC is a city gov't. unto itself, but then for the rest of NY state, each individual town, village or hamlet is responsible for licensing plumbers? That is a beaurocratic quagmire for plumbing companies trying to work in different areas, sheesh.

Here in FL, a licensed plumber has to 'register' in each little town or village in which you need to pull a permit. Essentially that means just showing your credentials (state license, insurance, proof of workers' comp. ins.) maybe pay a nominal fee, and then viola! You are now good to go in their town.

FL also offers the possiblility of obtaining a county plumbing license. It's called county master's license with gas. But with 67 counties in this state, why in the world would anyone want a county license? Counties here generally do not reciprocate plumbing licenses.

I bumped into a plumber once at Ferguson's and he had his county license only. He was asking me to pull a permit for a backflow install in another county. I was like, no I don't think so...:no:


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## Marlin (Aug 14, 2008)

Tommy plumber said:


> So NYC is a city gov't. unto itself, but then for the rest of NY state, each individual town, village or hamlet is responsible for licensing plumbers? That is a beaurocratic quagmire for plumbing companies trying to work in different areas, sheesh.


Pretty much. NYC is part of NYS and is governed by NYS laws however like any local jurisdiction they can make their own additional rules. They also regularly manage to carve out special legislation for themselves at the state level. So since their is no state plumbing license so every city, village, town, etc is free to have their own license and their own code amendments. If a state license does ever come about I can gaurantee NYC will somehow manage to exempt itself and continue to have it's own license. The whole thing is complicated and just as you call it, it's a bureaucratic nightmare. This is just one small reason that property taxes here start at 5k a year for a 2 bedroom 1 bath on a 50' lot. 

In one town the plumbing inspector owns a plumbing company and is notorious for applying the code to the tee to every company but his own. He's using his position to run a monopoly in the town since any company that works their is almost guaranteed to fail their inspection. Usually he's technically right like PVC hung at 49.5" instead of 48 because of the way the joists are laid out. Sometimes he'll just pull codes out of his hat and their is no one above his head to complain to.


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## Tommy plumber (Feb 19, 2010)

Marlin said:


> Pretty much. NYC is part of NYS and is governed by NYS laws however like any local jurisdiction they can make their own additional rules. They also regularly manage to carve out special legislation for themselves at the state level. So since their is no state plumbing license so every city, village, town, etc is free to have their own license and their own code amendments. If a state license does ever come about I can gaurantee NYC will somehow manage to exempt itself and continue to have it's own license. The whole thing is complicated and just as you call it, it's a bureaucratic nightmare. This is just one small reason that property taxes here start at 5k a year for a 2 bedroom 1 bath on a 50' lot.
> 
> In one town the plumbing inspector owns a plumbing company and is notorious for applying the code to the tee to every company but his own. He's using his position to run a monopoly in the town since any company that works their is almost guaranteed to fail their inspection. Usually he's technically right like PVC hung at 49.5" instead of 48 because of the way the joists are laid out. Sometimes he'll just pull codes out of his hat and their is no one above his head to complain to.


 



I was born and raised in Rockland county, then moved to FL. I wasn't in the plumbing trade in NY, so I had no idea of the licensing laws. My mom still lives in Orange county. When I'm up there again, I have to move some gas line in her kitchen. Legally, I am not supposed to touch it, even though I have a master's license from FL.


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## Chief Inspector (Apr 28, 2011)

*Chief Inspector*

The IPC and UPC differ in many ways: approved materials, venting, load and pipe sizes, etc. If they combine, it will be interesting to see how it resolves those conflicts.

My state of NY (minus NYC) adopted the the International Code with "enhancements" in 2002. It has been very difficult to administer because for 40 years prior the state had its own code. It was a great equalizer and everyone obeyed it. No one knew anything about the IPC and when they did find out some loved it and others hated it. There are still plumbers that use the old NYS code (they are correct).

So if NY uses the International Code I wonder how this will work.

Can anyone give me a reference for this new code alliance?


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Chief Inspector said:


> The IPC and UPC differ in many ways: approved materials, venting, load and pipe sizes, etc. If they combine, it will be interesting to see how it resolves those conflicts.
> 
> My state of NY (minus NYC) adopted the the International Code with "enhancements" in 2002. It has been very difficult to administer because for 40 years prior the state had its own code. It was a great equalizer and everyone obeyed it. No one knew anything about the IPC and when they did find out some loved it and others hated it. There are still plumbers that use the old NYS code (they are correct).
> 
> ...


It was an April Fools joke.

Mark


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## Chief Inspector (Apr 28, 2011)

*Chief Inspector*



ToUtahNow said:


> It was an April Fools joke.
> 
> Mark


As a new member ...I have just learned at my expense!!:laughing:


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Prolly easier to understand than the map would be...



A message from MizBiz (native of Brooklyn) to Mr. Wood.... !!


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plbgbiz said:


> A message from MizBiz (native of Brooklyn) to Mr. Wood.... !!


Is she mad because I didn't mention Brooklyn? 
Brooklyn is okay by me...
I didn't say anything bad about it... :laughing:


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## plbgbiz (Aug 27, 2010)

Redwood said:


> Is she mad because I didn't mention Brooklyn?
> Brooklyn is okay by me...
> I didn't say anything bad about it... :laughing:...



I think it was lumping Brooklyn in with the "everything else" in between category that got the reaction. Especially when the "everything else" depicted was the projects.

It's all good, she was laughing the whole time. :thumbup:


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## Bathroomgetaway (May 18, 2011)

PlumbCrazy said:


> Heads up, the IPC and UPC will be combined beginning 1/1/2014. :thumbup: Same time the new lead law goes into effect.
> 
> Even states like Maryland (who have their own unique plumbing code) have signed on. This should make the industry much stronger and stop a lot of confusion. Some states will have addenda related to their specific area.
> 
> Not to mention, those on PZ will be on the same page. :yes:


Honestly its about time. If there was only one testing company allowed as well the fact that there are so many NRTL's coupled with some "inspectors" dont like one or the other really makes my job impossible at times. I know more about code then the actuall inspector they should have a test they have to pass every few years.


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

See this is how rumors start. It was meant as a joke and there was no truth to the original post.

Mark


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## easttexasplumb (Oct 13, 2010)

ToUtahNow said:


> See this is how rumors start. It was meant as a joke and there was no truth to the original post.
> 
> Mark


Thats why the inspector looked at me crazy when I told him about the new code. :laughing::jester:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Isn't that how Chuck Norris died? :laughing:


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

& Mark Twain.

"The rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated"

Mark


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## Bathroomgetaway (May 18, 2011)

ToUtahNow said:


> & Mark Twain.
> 
> "The rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated"
> 
> Mark


That would have made life too easy back to the drawing board


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## Phat Cat (Apr 1, 2009)

ToUtahNow said:


> See this is how rumors start. It was meant as a joke and there was no truth to the original post.
> 
> Mark


See what happens when you jump on a thread in progress. :yes:


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

PlumbCrazy said:


> MARK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> You jumped in way too quickly. This could have been a really long, funny thread. :yes:


 It's still been a very funny thread.


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

Redwood said:


> Isn't that how Chuck Norris died? :laughing:


Chuck is dead?


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## Schedule40 (Aug 5, 2010)

Plumberman said:


> Chuck is dead?


No. 
At least not according to Wikipedia...


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## Plumberman (Jul 7, 2008)

Schedule40 said:


> No.
> At least not according to Wikipedia...


He drinks tiger blood too.... Winning


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Schedule40 said:


> No.
> At least not according to Wikipedia...


well the other day when Dunbar checked Wiki was saying he was dead...:laughing:

But anybody can edit that and have it stick for a day or 2...:whistling2:


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## Plumbus (Aug 4, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> & Mark Twain.
> 
> "The rumors of my death have been greatly exaggerated"
> 
> Mark


Do you mean Sam Clemens?
http://etext.virginia.edu/railton/sc_as_mt/funrobit.html


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## ToUtahNow (Jul 19, 2008)

Plumbus said:


> Do you mean Sam Clemens?
> http://etext.virginia.edu/railton/sc_as_mt/funrobit.html


Sam Clemens was better know by his pen name "Mark Twain" I suppose you could inter mix the two without harm but generally when quoting an author you would use his pen name.

Mark


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

ToUtahNow said:


> Sam Clemens was better know by his pen name "Mark Twain" I suppose you could inter mix the two without harm but generally when quoting an author you would use his pen name.
> 
> Mark


He lived right down the road from me... :laughing:

Well before my time however...

http://www.marktwainhouse.org/


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## HSI (Jun 3, 2011)

Where did you get the information on the combining of the codes in 2014?
Ron


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## U666A (Dec 11, 2010)

HSI said:


> Where did you get the information on the combining of the codes in 2014?
> Ron


Hint: take note of the date this thread was started... Or, read it in it's entirety... :thumbup:


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## Ansel (Sep 14, 2008)

*NC blues*

Here in North Carolina we only need one license but it is $130.00 every year for the license renewal. Also you must complete 6 hours of cntinuing education, which is another $125.00 to $130.00 depending on the provider you use. But I have to admit it is easier to shell out $255.00 a year for one, than $250.00 for multiple licenses every two years. I feel sorry for you. As for the IPC/UPC link-up, good luck.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Well... It's the end of July and we are still celebrating April 1st.... :laughing:


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## Ansel (Sep 14, 2008)

I thought I was on the last page. I did not catch everything. It did at least start some interesting conversation


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