# Propress versus Sharkbite...



## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

PP vs. SB...Freeze test...place your bets....


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

solder joint at the male adaptor for a fin:laughing:


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

Airgap said:


> PP vs. SB...Freeze test...place your bets....
> 
> View attachment 5597


 
P. P. both sides

S. B. one side


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## AKdaplumba (Jan 12, 2010)

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> Pee Pee


SharkBite


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## PLUMB TIME (Feb 2, 2009)

Hey, there's that mysterious 600 WO again:whistling2::laughing:

Oh yeah, shark down.


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## user2090 (Sep 26, 2009)

Sharkbite will go.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

My prediction. ProPress will fail 1st.


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## Hyper Piper (Nov 29, 2008)

Pro Press


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

dot folder to see the results of this test


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Bayside500 said:


> dot folder to see the results of this test


wuts a dot folder??


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

thread drift for a second, airgap, your avatar is what I call bayside 500, Beeker. :laughing:
Anyway back to topic I say propress


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

house plumber said:


> thread drift for a second, airgap, your avatar is what I call bayside 500, Beeker. :laughing:
> Anyway back to topic I say propress


what ever dude :whistling2:


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Bayside500 said:


> what ever dude :whistling2:


 
Like I never have? :yes:


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

house plumber said:


> Like I never have? :yes:


ya you have, and i have called you a few things before as well, so..............


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Pro press


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## SummPlumb (Feb 19, 2010)

Pro press....Fo shizzle!


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

Definitely the fish :yes: That's a great idea for a test airgap


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

Airgap said:


> wuts a dot folder??


that just means i replied to this thread to get e-mail for when someone responds to this thread so i don't have to manually check it.


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## wudumguy (Apr 3, 2010)

Copper tubing fails first!


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Well????? It's got to be frozen by now. Let's see what you ended up with.



Airgap said:


> PP vs. SB...Freeze test...place your bets....
> 
> View attachment 5597


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## GREENPLUM (Jul 27, 2008)

This test will prove nothing. You would need to do the exact same set-up with atleast 9 more. What method are you using for freezing the pipe? What kind of water are you using (mineral,tap,lake,ocean,ect). Also I think a sweat ball valve should be used. Nevermind all that , my gut thinks the Sharkbite, but its also clouded with fat, so i dunno, I need results. :laughing:


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

I have seen one side of a shark bite fail after a freeze here, pushes and blows out the plastic insert that the pipe slips into, this was on copper pipe.

So the SB will fail first.


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

I sez SB.


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## M5Plumb (Oct 2, 2008)

And the survey says !!!


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Sharkbite


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

GREENPLUM said:


> This test will prove nothing. You would need to do the exact same set-up with atleast 9 more. What method are you using for freezing the pipe? What kind of water are you using (mineral,tap,lake,ocean,ect). Also I think a sweat ball valve should be used. Nevermind all that , my gut thinks the Sharkbite, but its also clouded with fat, so i dunno, I need results. :laughing:


 
meh....


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Sorry... I won't be back to the shop till tomorrow....For the record, my money's on the sharkbite to push first....


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

I hope the copper splits, but I still think the sharkbite will separate.

If the copper splits I might have a little more confidence in the shark,

even though I've only used about 6 of them, maybe 6 to many...


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Test is over....Sharkbite wins.....


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

wow that surprises me, i would have bet against the sharkbite.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Bayside500 said:


> wow that surprises me, i would have bet against the sharkbite.


Surprised me too...and saddens me a little...I've used a lot of PP....


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

Wow, never used pro-press but I've seen enough of it, really thought it was a better joint than sharkbite


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## ChrisConnor (Dec 31, 2009)

I think the test should be re-done with separate pieces of pipe, just to see if the sharkbite fails at all. 

I think they all would fail and the only reason the sharkbite did not is because the propress gave the ice a place to expand to and relieve the entire pipes pressure.

Also next time would you mark the pipe in the sharkbite to see if any of the pipe moves out of the fitting.
(that's if you will re-do the test, of course)


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

*I used 2 sharkbites friday*

On a delta roman tub faucet replacement. I will not make a solvent weld connection on water lines when it comes to homes where people can instantly throw a valve on and jeopardize the strength of that freshly glued connection.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> On a delta roman tub faucet replacement. I will not make a solvent weld connection on water lines when it comes to homes where people can instantly throw a valve on and jeopardize the strength of that freshly glued connection.


I will use sharkbites in certain situations and have been for years and never any problems. I have been back to fix leaks at houses i've used them on and they were fine, mostly cpvc that has failed once again. I will use one 100% of the time to fix cpvc, after suggesting a pex repipe


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## 422 plumber (Jul 31, 2008)

Thanks for taking the time. I would have lost my money on that one.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

OK, now let's do it with pex and copper :jester:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Protech said:


> OK, now let's do it with pex and copper :jester:


copper would lose for freezing, you need to Hook it up to water pressure with valves on both sides and then freeze it


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

plumbpro said:


> copper would lose for freezing, you need to Hook it up to water pressure with valves on both sides and then freeze it


*Now what do you think ... When the pro-press went, that would end the force on the shark/bite and for that matter on the copper fitting and the tube.*

*In my professional opinion. Each item should be tested by itself, with the same pressures and temperatures at the same times.*

*We might find different answers for all test materials ... May as well get pex in on this see what happens to pex tube & fitt's (brass, plastics and now stainless). *

*Good Job AIRGAP*


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## njoy plumbing (May 19, 2009)

We use propress mainly for hydronic heating jobs. Besides if I was going to worry about freezing I would be running heat tapes/insulation anyways. Propress is expensive, and is used only where big$$$$$ are gauranteed.:thumbup:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Ah what the heck, I'll waste some material too.


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

primer on CPVC joints ?


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Why not?


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

Bayside500 said:


> primer on CPVC joints ?


 

Wow I don't run much CPVC but what I have it was always primed. 
Bayside I am to understand you don't prime ??? 

What's proper ???


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## Plasticman (Oct 14, 2008)

ha ha ha. Now I know why all your cpvc fails. :laughing:
You not supposed to use primer on cpvc. 
I bet the pex will bust


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## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

I bet pex will not fail.


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## Bayside500 (May 16, 2009)

PLUMBER_BILL said:


> Wow I don't run much CPVC but what I have it was always primed.
> Bayside I am to understand you don't prime ???
> 
> What's proper ???


we use flowguard pipe and glue, it says not to primer as far as i know


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

I'm going with a six team parley on Protech's experiment

1. Sharkbite blows off
2. Pex fitting blows off
3. Sharkbite blows off
4. Copper pipe splits
5. CPVC splits
6. CPVC splits

All for $5


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## Optimus Primer (May 20, 2009)

Page 2 number 4.

http://www.oatey.com/apps/catalog/i..._Sheet/Oatey_CPVC_FlowGuard_Gold_With_UVI.pdf


And then:

*605.16 CPVC plastic.* Joints between CPVC plastic pipe or fittings shall comply with Sections 605.16.1 through 605.16.3. *


605.16.1 Mechanical joints.* Mechanical joints shall be installed in accordance with the manufacturer's instructions.*605.16.2 Solvent cementing.* Joint surfaces shall be clean and free from moisture, and an approved primer shall be applied. Solvent cement, orange in color and conforming to ASTM F 493, shall be applied to all joint surfaces. The joint shall be made while the cement is wet, and in accordance with ASTM D 2846 or ASTM F 493. Solvent-cement joints shall be permitted above or below ground. *

Exception:* A primer is not required where all of the following conditions apply:1. The solvent cement used is third-party certified as conforming to ASTM F 493.2. The solvent cement used is yellow in color.3. The solvent cement is used only for joining 1/2 inch (12.7 mm) through 2 inch (51 mm) diameter CPVC pipe and fittings.4. The CPVC pipe and fittings are manufactured in accordance with ASTM D 2846.


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## stillaround (Mar 11, 2009)

Thanks for the entertainment and tests ...not to get weird..its why this forum is great.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

A true accurate test involves static water pressure against the piping when the piping freezes and bust.


And nearly 8 years ago it was proven that PEX has vulnerabilities when in short sections over long when it freezes.


A plumber that I know who pex'd in a house totally froze up. 

Said it absolutely SUCKED because they couldn't determine what area in the walls were frozen, which led to tearing out the walls to get to the piping.

With copper, it busts/leaks right where the problem area is, and at least you can find it instead of just telling people "Oh just put torpedo heaters throughout your house, call us when it unfreezes. 

Sometimes the value isn't the resiliency to fail, it's the ability to diagnose and rectify the problem immediately, solving the problem.

Telling someone to heat a room up isn't exactly a technique found in the ritual of plumbing. Is now though...:no:


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

3-6 failed. The pex survived. The sharkbite on the copper failed. The cpvc pipe itself failed catastrophically. Pictures in the next hour or so.

Both pex pieces survived.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> A true accurate test involves static water pressure against the piping when the piping freezes and bust.
> 
> 
> And nearly 8 years ago it was proven that PEX has vulnerabilities when in short sections over long when it freezes.
> ...


we have had a whole house freeze up for a week with wirsbo pex, and nothing busted. The key is to keep enough space between your joints.


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## DUNBAR PLUMBING (Sep 11, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> we have had a whole house freeze up for a week with wirsbo pex, and nothing busted. *The key is to keep enough space between your joints*.


 
Correct. Years ago something showed up as some big government test, showed pex bursting in the short runs but holding good on long runs.


But, let me say that "new" piping acts totally different than piping that's years old...has to.


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

DUNBAR PLUMBING said:


> Correct. Years ago something showed up as some big government test, showed pex bursting in the short runs but holding good on long runs.
> 
> 
> But, let me say that "new" piping acts totally different than piping that's years old...has to.


Maybe, old cpvc doesn't even hold a candle to pex though. I've been to houses with 5 year old cpvc that you couldn't cut cleanly because it was too brittle. On the flip side my boss has had Pex in his house since it was code approved here in '98 and has never had problems and is still easy to tie into. Thats Wirsbo/Uponor, not sure about other brands or grades.


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## rex (Jun 13, 2008)

i didnt winterize my barn this past year its all pex underslab and above i even left the valve on inside the house all winter long ....the run from the house to the barn is well over 200' burried about 12" there is pex all under the slab feeding hose bibs and the 3 piece

the only thing that split was the trap way on the cimmaron toilet out there i pulled the stool epoxy it and reset good as new...

if i can find the pipe ill take pics of what a piece of pex looks like with 220 degree + water running thru it after it blew apart on my wood burner


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

I see Uponor has you sold on their "type a" pex. Pex "b" and "c" are not lower grades of pex, just different types. Type "a" has plenty of downsides from the others to go with it's strengths.



plumbpro said:


> Maybe, old cpvc doesn't even hold a candle to pex though. I've been to houses with 5 year old cpvc that you couldn't cut cleanly because it was too brittle. On the flip side my boss has had Pex in his house since it was code approved here in '98 and has never had problems and is still easy to tie into. Thats Wirsbo/Uponor, not sure about other brands or grades.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

And the results:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Sorry, my maybe was only in response to the following. Old cpvc deffinately acts differently, old pex may if exposed to heat. When you heat pex to unkink it, it turns clear and cannot be cut and expanded again at that point. If pex were in a room with a gas WH, I could deffinately see it affecting the pipe. I think you are supposed to keep pex a foot away from your b vent in a gas WH situation.


But, let me say that "new" piping acts totally different than piping that's years old...has to.[/quote]


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Protech said:


> I see Uponor has you sold on their "type a" pex. Pex "b" and "c" are not lower grades of pex, just different types. Type "a" has plenty of downsides from the others to go with it's strengths.


I am deffinately sold on wirsbo because some cities here will not allow other types. I've been using it to some degree ever since I started plumbing in Jan of 05. I have it in my own house now for 4 years. Very pleased with it. I had a buddy in MO that used Zurn I believe and he had some problems with it over the long haul, not sure if there was some sort of recall involved in that.

Of course Wirsbo touts theirs as the "best", but I really don't know from experience if this is true


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## KCplumber (Dec 31, 2009)

I would of thought one of the pex plugs would of blown off on the one with two plugs


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Type A pex is very susceptible to UV and chlorine breakdown because the anti-oxidants can only be added in small quantity during the Engle cross-linking. I think Uponor puts the UV exposure limit at 1 month. There are type B brands out there that have exposure times in excess of 2 years. I've seen type A dry out and split when exposed to very high temperatures and continuous recirculation. This is partly due to the fact that the municipalities around here keep the chlorine cranked up to 4ppm. You can smell it in the water it's so strong. That's part of the reason why copper doesn’t last long here.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

more pics


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

mo pics


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Protech said:


> Type A pex is very susceptible to UV and chlorine breakdown because the anti-oxidants can only be added in small quantity during the Engle cross-linking. I think Uponor puts the UV exposure limit at 1 month. There are type B brands out there that have exposure times in excess of 2 years. I've seen type A dry out and split when exposed to very high temperatures and continuous recirculation. This is partly due to the fact that the municipalities around here keep the chlorine cranked up to 4ppm. You can smell it in the water it's so strong. That's part of the reason why copper doesn’t last long here.


That's good to know, our chlorine levels here are often lower that 1 ppm. Copper will last forever if you have a softener.


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

In that case, just keep it out of the sun and it'll last forever.



plumbpro said:


> That's good to know, our chlorine levels here are often lower that 1 ppm. Copper will last forever if you have a softener.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Another one....


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

That piece of pex is to short. The copper will freeze 1sy and the ice plug will travel to the pex side and burst the pex. If you put about 2 feet of pex on the end it will be fine though.



Airgap said:


> Another one....
> View attachment 5660


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## gusty60 (Oct 21, 2008)

I think the weak link on this one will be the shark.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Everything held...I thought the sharkbite would go this time...Even the short piece of pex held...Pex swelled up enough to save everyting else...


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Try it again, only this time add psi to it, say 50psi, bet you will see results.


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## PLUMBER_BILL (Oct 23, 2009)

Ron said:


> Try it again, only this time add psi to it, say 50psi, bet you will see results.


VERY INTERESTING POST ... BUT LETS NOT HURT ANYBODY.

When we speak of PSI lets define it. Hydrostatic OK.

Plastic and air is not a good mixture, cold makes it worse.


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Here we go......


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

Airgap said:


> Everything held...I thought the sharkbite would go this time...Even the short piece of pex held...Pex swelled up enough to save everyting else...
> View attachment 5662
> 
> 
> View attachment 5663


I don't think that the pex swelling saved everything else. If it was pure water, it will not push around, it freezes in place. It needs to have an additive, such as antifreeze, to make it slushy, to have it put more pressure on one spot and less on another. (Or to make a weak point fail.)


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

Pex is an elastomer and will not shatter like cpvc or pvc



PLUMBER_BILL said:


> VERY INTERESTING POST ... BUT LETS NOT HURT ANYBODY.
> 
> When we speak of PSI lets define it. Hydrostatic OK.
> 
> Plastic and air is not a good mixture, cold makes it worse.


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## Ron (Jun 12, 2008)

Airgap said:


> Here we go......
> View attachment 5664
> 
> 
> View attachment 5665


Were waiting :yes:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> I am deffinately sold on wirsbo because some cities here will not allow other types.


If that is the case I would be interested in who the government official was that was collecting the payola was...:whistling2:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

Redwood said:


> If that is the case I would be interested in who the government official was that was collecting the payola was...:whistling2:


It's not a state thing, statewide any pex is legal. Each city inspector, or water dept. has the option of expanding the code. They can make it more restrictive if they wish. As for Gobermend officials, well...
We gave ya'll Bill Clinton:laughing:


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Interesting test but not really valid...

BTW a good gauge is now toast...:laughing:

Ice forming in a pipe or tube can generate about 40,000 psi and pretty much anything in its way will fail if it cannot expand enough to absorb the expansion.

The damage in pipe is primarily when 2 separate ice plugs form then start working towards each other concentrating the force on a small area.

It doesn't matter what you throw at it for strong materials...
I doubt even General Dynamics Electric Boat Division could come up with the right stuff...:whistling2:
And they build submarines for the navy...
That kind of pressure is like diving 90,000' deep in the ocean...

If the material cannot expand to absorb the expansion it will fail...
How the water in the pipe freezes picks the failure point...

That said here is a link to the PEX Freeze study that was done.
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy06osti/39664.pdf

Some types of PEX and types of installations are vulnerable to freezing.



> Four PEX piping systems were freeze-thaw-cycled ~450 times. One brand showed no freeze tolerance, whereas two other brands appear freeze-tolerant, with no bursts in lengths greater than 7” or less than 2”. Two geometries were identified that promote nonuniform freezing and that should be avoided: 1) nonuniform insulation increasing from ends toward the middle of the pipe in longer sections; and 2) pipes of ~4” in length with metal connectors on both ends. All metallic fittings have survived, but several polymer fittings broke and should be avoided when freeze-tolerance is desired.


The PEX C or irradiated PEX had failures, and the PEX with oxygen barriers used for heating had failures such as PEX-AL-PEX...
Even Wirsbo hePEXplus was not immune with over 1/2 of it's samples 1"-5" in the test failing...


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## Protech (Sep 22, 2008)

great article :thumbup:


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

*plumbpro*

you also gave us "the huckster"(huckabee). one liked blow jobs, the other liked to early release murders to murder again. your call. breid...........:rockon:


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## plumbpro (Mar 10, 2010)

yeah, we can pick'm. can't really hold it against ole billy, who doesn't like a BJ


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## RealLivePlumber (Jun 22, 2008)

plumbpro said:


> yeah, we can pick'm. can't really hold it against ole billy, who doesn't like a BJ


:laughing::laughing:


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## ROCKSTARPLUMBER (Dec 14, 2008)

http://nosweatfittings.com/free_stuff.html


there, win some free chit somebody.:thumbup:


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## ILPlumber (Jun 17, 2008)

The January tool winner works for a school district:furious:


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

*Freeze test*

With all the frozen pipe repairs I did the last few weeks with all this cold weather got me wondering how well pipe can handle the cold before it burst. Here is my first test, It's 1/2 wirsbo pex, with a wirsbo coupling, and sharkbite coupling, crimp style coupling, with wirsbo caps. Into the freezer!


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

Will, check this thread...

http://www.plumbingzone.com/f2/propress-versus-sharkbite-8287/


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## Widdershins (Feb 5, 2011)

Will said:


> With all the frozen pipe repairs I did the last few weeks with all this cold weather got me wondering how well pipe can handle the cold before it burst. Here is my first test, It's 1/2 wirsbo pex, with a wirsbo coupling, and sharkbite coupling, crimp style coupling, with wirsbo caps. Into the freezer!



I've done something very similar to this in the past with 1" ProPex.

I also put on a high pressure gauge and pressurized it to 45psi with an air compressor to simulate a pressurized system.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Airgap said:


> Will, check this thread...
> 
> http://www.plumbingzone.com/f2/propress-versus-sharkbite-8287/


maybe a mod can put my post into that thread?


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## Master Mark (Aug 14, 2009)

*good test*



Will said:


> With all the frozen pipe repairs I did the last few weeks with all this cold weather got me wondering how well pipe can handle the cold before it burst. Here is my first test, It's 1/2 wirsbo pex, with a wirsbo coupling, and sharkbite coupling, crimp style coupling, with wirsbo caps. Into the freezer!


 

I dont think any of it will break becasue the Wirsbo pipe will swell up like a dogs penis.....:yes:

I have seen the plastic caps and couplings live through this in real world settings.....

if anything, the crimp rings might be damaged....


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## greenscoutII (Aug 27, 2008)

Ron said:


> I have seen one side of a shark bite fail after a freeze here, pushes and blows out the plastic insert that the pipe slips into, this was on copper pipe.
> 
> So the SB will fail first.


Yeah, me too... What he said....


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## breid1903 (Feb 8, 2009)

no food. i'll bet your single. that's how mine used to look. when i quit beer i just unplugged it. lol. breid....................:rockon:


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## Airgap (Dec 18, 2008)

How'd the test turn out Will? 

Let's see some pics.....:thumbsup:


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

they are all holding strong still. don't think any are going to fail.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

The wirsbo expanded alittle and no fitting failed. I don't really think Wirsbo can burst, I've seen it freeze of in new construction with no problems. I know there was a study on it 5 or so years ago, but I don't buy it.


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm gonna try it with another PEX. Darapex. Gonna try to expand it and install wirsbo fittins on it and see what happens.


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## U666A (Dec 11, 2010)

breid1903 said:


> no food. i'll bet your single. that's how mine used to look. when i quit beer i just unplugged it. lol. breid....................:rockon:


You beat me to that observation Breid! Ha.
I always bug a buddy of mine because his fridge contains nothing but molson export and mustard...


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## Will (Jun 6, 2010)

Round 2 Duro-PEX. I personally hate duro-pex. I'm thinking it will split.


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## Redwood (Sep 8, 2008)

Will, Going off the study done try making sure the pex lengths are between 2"-7" and the fittings are metal with decent exposure to the cold. Try Tees and Els vs. couplings.

You should see some action then.

The object is to get 2 ice plugs forming then freezing towards the middle. That is what causes the bursting action.


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## DesertOkie (Jul 15, 2011)

Thanks Will that answered my question. Kinda scary about the propress.


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## nhmaster3015 (Aug 5, 2008)

So now that the testing is done here is my commentary.

None of the piping systems tested were designed to handle the pressures or the temperatures they were subjected to. In the real world, we either insulate, heat tape or better yet avoid installing piping in freezing conditions. So the test doesn't really prove anything nor does it make one material or method necessarily better than the other. 

Uponor pex is the only pex I know of that does not restrict the interior opening size through the fittings unlike Viega et.al. which seriously reduce the flow through the fitting as well as present a ledge that obstructs flow.


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## plumbing ninja (Jan 15, 2012)

I'd put all these fittings up against a Swagelok brand compression tube fitting and watch them all lose! The bore size is somewhat restricted so you'd have go up a size to get the correct flow. If this was a million dollar house wouldn't you want a better quality fitting? The swagelok can be used on gas (even Oxygen (degreasing needed & velocity needs to be checked), Nitrogen, Argon etc) or hot and cold water, air...


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## Mississippiplum (Sep 30, 2011)

Ninja you should post an intro in the intro section so we know who u are

sent from the jobsite porta-potty


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## Catlin987987 (Nov 12, 2010)

Thanks for the bump. Another Sharkbite for the win? Has anyone seen( I want pictures) of one with a pin hole?


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